hamster Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Quickie really, maybe even a poll. Taking into account recent events; banks, expenses scandal, the 'war on terror'. And this is not in support of Cameron's call for one, he imho is part of the problem as are the other party leaders. I ask this because so many people appear to be really really fed up with what and who we have right now. Do you think that this country should hold a general elction this summer? I say Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
equalizer Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 I guess I think so too because the electorate are disquieted. However, since it's a shoe-in that Cameron will win, I'm quite scared about how he will manage the recession. Big cuts in education and health, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Whoever gets in- Labour or Tory- it will be bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 I think we desperately need a period of calmness and reflection. A snap election now will play into the hands of parties like the BNP, with everyone so incensed with all the main parties at the moment. I don't think an election now is the way to go. I do think that anyone has had their fingers in the till should be deselected for the next election. I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint lard Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes. However they are all as bad as each other. Out of the frying pan and into the fire.IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes, absolutely. Complacency has set in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 What annoys me is how they are all apologising and saying it will never happen again. The problem is they wouldn't have said anything if they weren't caught out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Trubble Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes. I'm prepared to vote for a smaller party in the hope of them getting more seats. Mainstream parties have had enough time to deal with issues that directly affect us in the real world and they have all failed miserably over the last ten years, it's just lip service and then they just revert to type once they get elected or re-elected. I concede that it may be a wasted vote but if there is a knee-jerk vote by the British public and a/the smaller parties win more seats, especially in areas that the mainstream parties have took for granted for years, maybe then they will start to actively listen and realise that their decisions have a huge impact on the lives of people who are struggling to live a normal life and those very normal people are the ones who see the scum and filth of society, seemingly being rewarded for failure. 1) Deal with Immigration policies. 2) Pull out of the EU. 3) Vote no to a European army. 4) Deal with the benefits system and those that think money just grows on trees without realising people have to work hard to pay for it 5) NHS - Time to put British citizens first and i'd even go as far as to suggest there be a queue for those that work and another for those that don't or haven't worked for over twelve-months consecutive. I'd not have this queue for major operations but see no reason why the smaller operations shouldn't be prioritised to those that have to work for a living. I'm just kidding on some of those of course, well maybe not on principle but that's another issue. So, what parties would I be suited to? I've yet to analyse the literature that I keep getting through the door for the European elections but I'll make time soon. Do you think I could be a UKIP voter or closet Tory? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berkshire Saint Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Is there really much point? The Tories will win by a landslide and we'll be even worse off than before as they are comfortably more useless than Labour. We really need to change the electoral system...it's a nineteenth century throwback at the moment and something much more important to moan about than the expenses stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Doesn't matter, it's all cyclical anyway. Labour stays in, f*cks up the economy so...... Tories get in, sort out the economy at the expense of the lower earners/those that are reliant on the welfare state so......... Labour gets in, standard of life becomes more even but its unsustainable so the economy f*cks up so........ Tories get in, sort out the economy at the expense of the lower earners/those that are reliant on the welfare state so... The only certain thing is that you need a capitalist idealised party running a capitalist country. But where there are winners there are losers, thus in a democracy it will never last long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes, but vote Liberal Democrats! Both Labour and Conservative have terrible candidates, Nick Clegg is the future. Brown is just cack, Cameron is a posh tw*t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatch Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Bring back Maggie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Bring back Maggie Well, I for one 'ain't gonna work on her farm no more'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revolution saint Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes, let's have a general election as soon as possible. Personally I can't get enough of the two parties arguing over their favourite colour (surely that's the only difference these days?) I can't wait for them both to promise lower taxes and increased spending on public services. Yes, let's have a summer of petty squabbling over the presentation of vacuous slogans. I'll be spoiling my vote again unless the Greens put up a candidate in my constituency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Yes, but vote Liberal Democrats! Both Labour and Conservative have terrible candidates, Nick Clegg is the future. Brown is just cack, Cameron is a posh tw*t. Nick Clegg is a muppet. I saw him on Newsnight yesterday and uder questoning from Jeremy Paxman he got rattled and it showed the real Nick Clegg. I'd never vote Liberal but i had respect for Paddy Ashdown and this Clegg fella doesn't even come close to being a leader in his bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 There's loads of UKIP billboards up atm on the roadsides where i live. I think living in a staunch Tory constituency where Labour always comes a distant second and only mad cat women vote Liberal i may vote UKIP at the Euro elections as hopefully they'll have half a chance. Not so far away on the outskirts of Leicester the BNP are pretty strong and i think they'll do well again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, but does Daid Cameron want an election just yet, does he have everything in order? Or does he expect, as I do, Gordon Brown to continue on for another year and then use it against him that he is going against the will of the British people of some crap like that. It gives him the oppurtunity to say Brown is clinging to power. I really dislike David Cameron. Mr. I am green riding a bike to work with my car driving behind me. Yea... because that works... I'm not saying don't call an election, just not Cameron please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, but does Daid Cameron want an election just yet, does he have everything in order? Or does he expect, as I do, Gordon Brown to continue on for another year and then use it against him that he is going against the will of the British people of some crap like that. It gives him the oppurtunity to say Brown is clinging to power. I really dislike David Cameron. Mr. I am green riding a bike to work with my car driving behind me. Yea... because that works... I'm not saying don't call an election, just not Cameron please. I think David Cameron would be a better leader than Gordon Brown. Well anyone could do a better job than Brown who IMO has no mandate to be PM in the first place. Cameron is without a doubt an actor and i just hope that once in power he moves the Tories to the right and starts asserting Britains authority on a european and global level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 There's loads of UKIP billboards up atm on the roadsides where i live. I think living in a staunch Tory constituency where Labour always comes a distant second and only mad cat women vote Liberal i may vote UKIP at the Euro elections as hopefully they'll have half a chance. Not so far away on the outskirts of Leicester the BNP are pretty strong and i think they'll do well again. I really hope people use their sense at these elections and don't vote BNP in some sort of protest vote. What also worries me is the effect of people not voting making their share seem bigger and with proportional representation we could have 1 or 2 of them fascists bastards(I've read their manifesto on their website, not just spouting media views) 'representing us' in brussels. Please, I'm too young to vote but the day we let them into a real position of power is the day that the U.K dies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 I think David Cameron would be a better leader than Gordon Brown. Well anyone could do a better job than Brown who IMO has no mandate to be PM in the first place. Cameron is without a doubt an actor and i just hope that once in power he moves the Tories to the right and starts asserting Britains authority on a european and global level. Well, Brown hasn't been that great compared to what he could be though I think alot of it is down to media perception, but at least I think he would take some sort of action(whether you agree with it or not). I think Cameron would be out of his depth unable to know what to do. He seems to have all this style, but behind all the words of bull**** is little actual ideas or policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 (edited) I really hope people use their sense at these elections and don't vote BNP in some sort of protest vote. What also worries me is the effect of people not voting making their share seem bigger and with proportional representation we could have 1 or 2 of them fascists bastards(I've read their manifesto on their website, not just spouting media views) 'representing us' in brussels. Please, I'm too young to vote but the day we let them into a real position of power is the day that the U.K dies. deleted. Edited 19 May, 2009 by Mole went of topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamster Posted 19 May, 2009 Author Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Mods, poll please. I opened with a very simplistic suggestion, but can we have a sticky poll please. Lots of people have lots to say I reckon and I for one changed my mind more than once reading through this. I still think we should have a general election, but, who to vote for???? 2 weeks ago? I would have spoiled my paper (bring back Guy Fawkes). 1 week ago? I would have not voted at all. Today? Well, the BNP scare the **** out of me, but let's have it out with them, let's see what people are really made of. Do I really want to give up my vote and allow some bigotted fools to introduce laws that treat someone like a **** because their skin is a different colour to mine? Do I want to allow them to shun a man who simply wants a better life for himself and his family? Do I ****! Bring it on and let's see what the people of this country are made of. If you don't want to vote, then I say you do not care, and as my old Grandad used to say to me at election time, "People get, EXACTLY what people deserve" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bungle Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 No. There are too many political opportunists floating about at the moment, we'd be better waiting until May 2010. Also, Cameron is about to make an incredibly embarrassing error of judgment after the Euro elections and it's going to be funny to watch him fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 How do the European elections work - is it proportional representation? I ask this because i've just been reading the BNP euro elections update and apparently they only need 11% of the vote to get a euro MP in my region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revolution saint Posted 19 May, 2009 Share Posted 19 May, 2009 Mods, poll please. I opened with a very simplistic suggestion, but can we have a sticky poll please. Lots of people have lots to say I reckon and I for one changed my mind more than once reading through this. I still think we should have a general election, but, who to vote for???? 2 weeks ago? I would have spoiled my paper (bring back Guy Fawkes). 1 week ago? I would have not voted at all. Today? Well, the BNP scare the **** out of me, but let's have it out with them, let's see what people are really made of. Do I really want to give up my vote and allow some bigotted fools to introduce laws that treat someone like a **** because their skin is a different colour to mine? Do I want to allow them to shun a man who simply wants a better life for himself and his family? Do I ****! Bring it on and let's see what the people of this country are made of. If you don't want to vote, then I say you do not care, and as my old Grandad used to say to me at election time, "People get, EXACTLY what people deserve" Maybe a bigger turnout for the BNP would wake people up? Anyway, I'm spoiling my vote in the general election because quite simply there is no one who represents what I believe and until we get proportional representation there is no chance that my vote will count for anything anyway. I'd like a return to conviction politics and to ideology where politicians are unafraid to stand up for what they believe in instead of pretending to be all things to all people and pandering to focus groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmm Donuts Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Hey an election, what a great idea to actually vote for the person who leads our Country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bungle Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Hey an election, what a great idea to actually vote for the person who leads our Country I love this argument. We have a parliamentary democracy, therefore no-one gets to vote for Prime Minister, you get to vote for your local representative in parliament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 I'd like a return to conviction politics . There might well be a few current MPs getting close to this already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 I love this argument. We have a parliamentary democracy, therefore no-one gets to vote for Prime Minister, you get to vote for your local representative in parliament. In principle yes, but in practice no. Voters vote for the party in general and the leader of the party is huge factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Big cuts in education and health, I suppose.In principle Im very much in favour of both but throwing lots of money at both doesntr neccessarily mean it is spent correctly.The wastage appals me, and there will always be people who want yuou to pay more in to it as it becomes inefficient.Look at our football club if you dont spend money wisely Yes, but getting power is a poisined chalice at present Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jillyanne Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Is there any point? They all say what 'we' want to hear anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Is there any point? They all say what 'we' want to hear anyway. The three main parties have positioned themselves in the middle ground so there is little to pick and choose between them. Look to the smaller parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 The three main parties have positioned themselves in the middle ground so there is little to pick and choose between them. Look to the smaller parties. To do what exactly ? Form a BNP / UKIP / Greens coalition ? When it comes down to it, of the 35% of the total electorate who will bother to vote :30% will vote for the donkey with the blue ribbon, 30% for the donkey with the red ribbon, 20% for the donkey with the yellow ribbon, 10% for a minority donkey of their choice, and the result will be decided by the remaining 10% of lower middle-class, self interested, swing voters. Me, I'm thinking of the 'none of the above' option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 To do what exactly ? Form a BNP / UKIP / Greens coalition ? When it comes down to it, of the 35% of the total electorate who will bother to vote :30% will vote for the donkey with the blue ribbon, 30% for the donkey with the red ribbon, 20% for the donkey with the yellow ribbon, 10% for a minority donkey of their choice, and the result will be decided by the remaining 10% of lower middle-class, self interested, swing voters. Me, I'm thinking of the 'none of the above' option. In a general election i agree with you, but in these european elections we have an opportunity to get some fringe MEP's as it's proportional representation. between 10% and 15% of the vote (depending on the region) will see a small party win a seat. Therefore it's NOT a wasted vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Yes, but vote Liberal Democrats! Both Labour and Conservative have terrible candidates, Nick Clegg is the future. Brown is just cack, Cameron is a posh tw*t. And since when has being a posh tw*t made someone dislikeable or unelectable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 In principle Im very much in favour of both but throwing lots of money at both doesntr neccessarily mean it is spent correctly.The wastage appals me, and there will always be people who want yuou to pay more in to it as it becomes inefficient.Look at our football club if you dont spend money wisely Yes, but getting power is a poisined chalice at present Do you have any REAL examples of this wastage? I ask because, a few years ago, the Gershon Report was published. Google it and read it. Simply put, all local and national governments were set targets to achieve percentage savings year on year. Every year, Best Value Performance Indicators are published for these councils and departments. You can find the reports on the councils' websites. Most councils achieve these savings. If they don't, they are penalised. So real efforts are being implemented to achieve savings. When I worked for the NHS as a Procurement Manager, I had to achieve 6% savings year on year on non-pay expenditure and I did and I wasn't unique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 The UKIP put a leaflet through my door this week. On the front was a picture of Winston Churchill. It made me want to vote Conservative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 In a general election i agree with you, but in these european elections we have an opportunity to get some fringe MEP's as it's proportional representation. between 10% and 15% of the vote (depending on the region) will see a small party win a seat. Therefore it's NOT a wasted vote. But surely I should only vote if I support and believe in the party and it's policies. And that assumes that such a party has a candidate in my constituency. Voting simply for the sheer hell of it, or God forbid because it becomes compulsory, is worse than saying 'none of you lot are fit to get my vote'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 In principle Im very much in favour of both but throwing lots of money at both doesntr neccessarily mean it is spent correctly.The wastage appals me, and there will always be people who want yuou to pay more in to it as it becomes inefficient. There would be less 'wastage' if the politicians could resist interfering just because they need to be seen to be doing something. The number of policy changes, initiatives, and guidelines issued in the Health and Education sectors is mind-boggling, and much of this involves contradictions and corrections being introduced in attempt to put right last year's big plans, which have not been given enough time or attention to bed in and show a benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 But surely I should only vote if I support and believe in the party and it's policies. And that assumes that such a party has a candidate in my constituency. Voting simply for the sheer hell of it, or God forbid because it becomes compulsory, is worse than saying 'none of you lot are fit to get my vote'. There is a party for everybody. In my region there's: As well as the Conservatives, Labour and the Liberal Democrats, other parties fighting for votes include the British National Party, the English Democrats Party, the Christian Party, No2EU: Yes to Democracy, the Socialist Labour Party, The Green Party, Jury Team, United Kingdom First and the United Kingdom Independence Party. I'll vote for a certain party many don't like in this noddy election because they have a real chance of getting the 11% needed to win a seat, but in the general election i won't even bother because the Conservatives have never come close to losing in my constituency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 There is a party for everybody. In my region there's: As well as the Conservatives, Labour and the Liberal Democrats, other parties fighting for votes include the British National Party, the English Democrats Party, the Christian Party, No2EU: Yes to Democracy, the Socialist Labour Party, The Green Party, Jury Team, United Kingdom First and the United Kingdom Independence Party. Of the 13 ( ! ) party affiliations stated for my region, at least 8 are immediately discounted due to some fairly obvious core policy disagreements, so it may have to come down to where I can most effectively place a 'protest' vote to block one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamster Posted 20 May, 2009 Author Share Posted 20 May, 2009 There is a party for everybody.... .... but in the general election i won't even bother because the Conservatives have never come close to losing in my constituency. No offence intended Stanley but.. ..there may be a clue to why the conservatives keep winning it within your post there Stanley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Secret Site Agent Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 As the dog says OOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHH Yesssssssssssss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 No offence intended Stanley but.. ..there may be a clue to why the conservatives keep winning it within your post there Stanley. The Tories cannot lose. Going back as far as i can research (1945) they've never come close to losing. It's impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 Do you have any REAL examples of this wastage? I ask because, a few years ago, the Gershon Report was published. Google it and read it. Simply put, all local and national governments were set targets to achieve percentage savings year on year. Every year, Best Value Performance Indicators are published for these councils and departments. You can find the reports on the councils' websites. Most councils achieve these savings. If they don't, they are penalised. So real efforts are being implemented to achieve savings. When I worked for the NHS as a Procurement Manager, I had to achieve 6% savings year on year on non-pay expenditure and I did and I wasn't unique. I go away and a thread like this is started. Gutted I've missed out on all the fun. With regards to Labour Govt waste, books have been written about it - when I get back (and can be arsed) I will provide some links. A very close example is the millions spent on merging the St Richards and Worthing hospitals, which are now to be left alone. Great use of taxpayers money. The cuts you refer to were after years of leftie wastage - I doubt these savings could have been found without years of preceding waste, and thus they are not that hard to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 20 May, 2009 Share Posted 20 May, 2009 I go away and a thread like this is started. Gutted I've missed out on all the fun. With regards to Labour Govt waste, books have been written about it - when I get back (and can be arsed) I will provide some links. A very close example is the millions spent on merging the St Richards and Worthing hospitals, which are now to be left alone. Great use of taxpayers money. The cuts you refer to were after years of leftie wastage - I doubt these savings could have been found without years of preceding waste, and thus they are not that hard to find. Not another hijack...I'm sure that there are just as many examples of Tory financial mis-management. Can't we all just agree that the concentration of power at Westminster, with an overwhelming majority for the ruling party, ( the last 7 elections have yielded this, more or less ), tends to engender in MPs of all persuasions an attitude of indifference to public opinion, and a tendency to feel untouchable and unaccountable for their actions, ( until the damage is done ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 21 May, 2009 Share Posted 21 May, 2009 I go away and a thread like this is started. Gutted I've missed out on all the fun. With regards to Labour Govt waste, books have been written about it - when I get back (and can be arsed) I will provide some links. A very close example is the millions spent on merging the St Richards and Worthing hospitals, which are now to be left alone. Great use of taxpayers money. The cuts you refer to were after years of leftie wastage - I doubt these savings could have been found without years of preceding waste, and thus they are not that hard to find. The cuts I refer to were in late 1997 - 1999, shortly after the end of 13 years of a Conservative government. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 21 May, 2009 Share Posted 21 May, 2009 Not another hijack...I'm sure that there are just as many examples of Tory financial mis-management. Can't we all just agree that the concentration of power at Westminster, with an overwhelming majority for the ruling party, ( the last 7 elections have yielded this, more or less ), tends to engender in MPs of all persuasions an attitude of indifference to public opinion, and a tendency to feel untouchable and unaccountable for their actions, ( until the damage is done ). The Guardian is running an insert today 'A New Politics'. Makes for interesting reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopGun Posted 21 May, 2009 Share Posted 21 May, 2009 I think we desperately need a period of calmness and reflection. A snap election now will play into the hands of parties like the BNP, with everyone so incensed with all the main parties at the moment. I don't think an election now is the way to go. I do think that anyone has had their fingers in the till should be deselected for the next election. I I agree. A snap election will mean a load of unsuitable people being selected to stand at short notice to replace coming deselections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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