Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Yeah because the fall of our club is just due to fans infighting, rollyeye thingy. People are rightly angry that the **** might be swanning around at Forest. It means he is interferring, getting involved again or just making a nuisance of himself. Either way its not wanted, the majority of sane people just want him to **** off and not come back A classic example of mock (or should I say ****) outrage. Where did I say it was just due to fans? The ****ing contest starts in the boardroom and washes through the directors boxes, down over the fans and onto this forum. If you can't see that a club divided stands less chance than a club united, then you're deluded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daren W Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 A classic example of mock (or should I say ****) outrage. Where did I say it was just due to fans? The ****ing contest starts in the boardroom and washes through the directors boxes, down over the fans and onto this forum. If you can't see that a club divided stands less chance than a club united, then you're deluded. Obvious the division in the fanbase isn't helping matters, but then neither is Lowe's unwelcome appearance on a freebie at the last game, possibly, that the club might ever play... I think that is what Fan The Flames is getting at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan The Flames Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 A classic example of mock (or should I say ****) outrage. Where did I say it was just due to fans? The ****ing contest starts in the boardroom and washes through the directors boxes, down over the fans and onto this forum. If you can't see that a club divided stands less chance than a club united, then you're deluded. Clearly the lack of division in the board room has in part resulted in our position today but it is far too late for the old warring parties to unite for the sake of SFC. So with that in mind the presence of the most divisive man in SFC history is not welcomed by many people for the reasons I outlined in my post. Just because you don't agree doesn't make it mock outrage. Your way of dealing with the Lowe issue is to just draw a line under things and move on and for others it requires Lowe to get out and stay out. They are both equally valid. I am clearly in the get out and stay out camp because like you I believe a club divided is half defeated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Obvious the division in the fanbase isn't helping matters, but then neither is Lowe's unwelcome appearance on a freebie at the last game, possibly, that the club might ever play... I think that is what Fan The Flames is getting at... Would you rather RL had bought a ticket in the away end? God knows what some of the knuckle draggers would have done... Like him or not, I cannot see how you can be intimately involved in a club for as long as Lowe has without becoming a fan. Lowe will lose more money than he's made on Saints. And that equates to probably more than I'll ever spend in season tickets. Disagree with his methods, but no one can say that relegation/administration is good for anyone, least of all Lowe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daren W Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Would you rather RL had bought a ticket in the away end? God knows what some of the knuckle draggers would have done... Like him or not, I cannot see how you can be intimately involved in a club for as long as Lowe has without becoming a fan. Lowe will lose more money than he's made on Saints. And that equates to probably more than I'll ever spend in season tickets. Disagree with his methods, but no one can say that relegation/administration is good for anyone, least of all Lowe. I see, so a supposed love of dsomething means you can trample over people's feelings then? Surely only someone devoid of any common sense would think it would be a good idea to turn up at a game, on a freebie when tensions are so high. Now you do raise a good point when it comes to administration. It is bad for Lowe. Now might that be the reason why he held off the inevitable in terms of administration? Had we gone to the wall earlier we'd be bottom of the league and relegated but at least next season would be a fresh start. Did Lowe hold on too long because he didn't want to lose his investment rather than doing the right thing for the club? It's a possibility... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan The Flames Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Would you rather RL had bought a ticket in the away end? God knows what some of the knuckle draggers would have done... Like him or not, I cannot see how you can be intimately involved in a club for as long as Lowe has without becoming a fan. Lowe will lose more money than he's made on Saints. And that equates to probably more than I'll ever spend in season tickets. Disagree with his methods, but no one can say that relegation/administration is good for anyone, least of all Lowe. Out of interest how much did Lowe buy his shares for, is it more than the £3m he got in wages and dividends. He is not there today because he is a fan he is there because he knows his presence is troublesom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Obvious the division in the fanbase isn't helping matters, but then neither is Lowe's unwelcome appearance on a freebie at the last game, possibly, that the club might ever play... I think that is what Fan The Flames is getting at... Just because you don't agree doesn't make it mock outrage. The mock outrage related to the all to common approach of twisting what someone says to favour your point of view (I.e. Wheeling out the "fans fault" argument). Both sides are guilty of this hyperbole, but it's just a bit tiresome. I've been to the City ground and there's about as much chance of me winning euromillions than anyone (other than Lee Majors) seeing Rupert Lowe from the away end. Therefore, at the end of the day, it doesn't matter if he was there or wasn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Out of interest how much did Lowe buy his shares for, is it more than the £3m he got in wages and dividends. He is not there today because he is a fan he is there because he knows his presence is troublesom. I don't know precisely, lies damn lies etc. But he'd have lost roughly 40% of the 3million to the taxman, so what he actually took out was a lot less than the headline figure. That's not to say he didn't take anything out of Saints, just that the perception he's sitting on bag of illgotten gains is a myth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan The Flames Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 The mock outrage related to the all to common approach of twisting what someone says to favour your point of view (I.e. Wheeling out the "fans fault" argument). Both sides are guilty of this hyperbole, but it's just a bit tiresome. I've been to the City ground and there's about as much chance of me winning euromillions than anyone (other than Lee Majors) seeing Rupert Lowe from the away end. Therefore, at the end of the day, it doesn't matter if he was there or wasn't. I read your term 'people' to mean fans not board members. So I wasn't twisting your post to fit my agrument, maybe transfer your thought's a bit more clearly next time. You havn't got a problem with Lowe, you never did. Clearly a lot of people have and will have for a long time so just accept it. Have you put the tenner in the post yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan The Flames Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 I don't know precisely, lies damn lies etc. But he'd have lost roughly 40% of the 3million to the taxman, so what he actually took out was a lot less than the headline figure. That's not to say he didn't take anything out of Saints, just that the perception he's sitting on bag of illgotten gains is a myth Only if you call paying for a health service, pension, education, defence etc 'lost' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenwilkins Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Those who overdose on smileys and cartoons to try and emphasise a point need not apply. Its all about perception mate and it maybe time for you to manage how you are perceived. Jesus that's a bit harsh on UP - you've probably spoilt his evening now. LMAO :cool::p:smt117:smt117:smt117:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Only if you call paying for a health service, pension, education, defence etc 'lost' see first paragraph, post #460 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 I read your term 'people' to mean fans not board members. So I wasn't twisting your post to fit my agrument, maybe transfer your thought's a bit more clearly next time. You havn't got a problem with Lowe, you never did. Clearly a lot of people have and will have for a long time so just accept it. Have you put the tenner in the post yet. Completely disagree. I have always had a problem with Rupert Lowe, primarily because he divides the fanbase, but also because of some of the decisions he made. The difference is that I don't think that everything he did was wrong. The same goes for most of the key players - I genuinely believe they all want what's good for Saints. The trouble is, at the time Lowe was first ousted, I didn't think much of the opposition, so was taking what I saw to be the least risky option (opposed Wilde - thought his bandwagon approach was pandering and thought that although Leon's heart is in the right place, his head wasn't). Lowe's return was a different matter. We were clearly (even then) up financial **** street and a tight bastard like him was exactly what we needed. I didn't agree with letting Pearson go though, and was very surprised when he did it. That said I'm not of the belief that Pearson would have made a huge difference given the cuts to the playing staff, but 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing. Regarding the tenner, no one has posted a picture yet. Although I expect Stanley is hard at work on Photoshop as we speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 I read your term 'people' to mean fans not board members. So I wasn't twisting your post to fit my agrument, maybe transfer your thought's a bit more clearly next time. You havn't got a problem with Lowe, you never did. Clearly a lot of people have and will have for a long time so just accept it. Have you put the tenner in the post yet. Completely disagree. I have always had a problem with Rupert Lowe, primarily because he divides the fanbase, but also because of some of the decisions he made. The difference is that I don't think that everything he did was wrong. The same goes for most of the key players - I genuinely believe they all want what's good for Saints. The trouble is, at the time Lowe was first ousted, I didn't think much of the opposition. I was taking what I saw to be the least risky option (opposed Wilde - I thought his bandwagon approach was pandering and thought that although Leon's heart is in the right place, his head wasn't). Lowe's return was a different matter. We were clearly (even then) up financial **** street and a tight bastard like him was exactly what we needed. I didn't agree with letting Pearson go though, and was very surprised when he did it. That said I'm not of the belief that Pearson would have made a huge difference given the cuts to the playing staff, but 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing. Regarding the tenner, no one has posted a picture yet. Although I expect Stanley is hard at work on Photoshop as we speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 I don't know precisely, lies damn lies etc. But he'd have lost roughly 40% of the 3million to the taxman, so what he actually took out was a lot less than the headline figure. That's not to say he didn't take anything out of Saints, just that the perception he's sitting on bag of illgotten gains is a myth Indeed it's a myth that they're illgotten, but... it's downright nonsense to suggest he's lost more than he has received from Saints, which is what you have just done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 Indeed it's a myth that they're illgotten, but... it's downright nonsense to suggest he's lost more than he has received from Saints, which is what you have just done. Not sure I agree, but then I don't have the figures. No doubt someone will come on here with their street-car economics and explain exactly what happened. When the reverse takeover happened Lowe and Co had assets in Secure Retirement Ltd. These assets are now worthless. If you net off the salary/dividends against those what is the result? All I know is that Lowe invested in a Premiership team and will end up getting back (best case) 20p in the pound, worst case nothing. At one point his 'investment' was worth 6% of £50m - coincidentally £3m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 strange thing is , imo , the only place rupert has divided the fan base is on here where a few keyboard thumpers like hom. in the real world at sms the fans have united in their utter comptempt for the man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 3 May, 2009 Share Posted 3 May, 2009 strange thing is , imo , the only place rupert has divided the fan base is on here where a few keyboard thumpers like hom. in the real world at sms the fans have united in their utter comptempt for the man Correct in Pubs and at games, I find people either hate Lowe or aren't too bothered either way. It's only on Forums he seems to have reached hero worship levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exit2 Posted 3 May, 2009 Author Share Posted 3 May, 2009 right as this thread has turned in to a slagging match again, and the topic in question is past CLOSED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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