NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 If we had a decent manager (leave name for other threads!) your choice whether its young up and coming, Wotte, Dowie etc. With both board and manager having a 5 year plan to reach premiership (not necessarily to stay there!). How much money would the club need to get the return on their investment and get that pot of gold (was it quoted that Derby got £60m for one season). You would hope that we could (assuming above structure in place) attract better players more easily than other league sides. Would £5-6m thrown at revamping our squad and balance it out give a team for promotion? And the same again when in CCC?
buctootim Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 If we had a decent manager (leave name for other threads!) your choice whether its young up and coming, Wotte, Dowie etc. With both board and manager having a 5 year plan to reach premiership (not necessarily to stay there!). How much money would the club need to get the return on their investment and get that pot of gold (was it quoted that Derby got £60m for one season). You would hope that we could (assuming above structure in place) attract better players more easily than other league sides. Would £5-6m thrown at revamping our squad and balance it out give a team for promotion? And the same again when in CCC? £5-6m might get you promoted from L1, but more like £20m to get promoted from CCC and another £40m to stay in the prem. How many people with that kind of money are going to be interssted in buying us for £15m. There are lots of easier options around. We'd need someone who is stacked, a passionate fan and wreckless.
Colinjb Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 It's not as simple as saying how much. You can throw tens of millions at the team and fail if it is spent badly, or have a shrewd football manager who can assemble a good team for limited funds and get them playing well. We need to get the organisation of the club right before we can push on.
RobM Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 £5-6m might get you promoted from L1, but more like £20m to get promoted from CCC and another £40m to stay in the prem. How many people with that kind of money are going to be interssted in buying us for £15m. There are lots of easier options around. We'd need someone who is stacked, a passionate fan and wreckless. That sort of money would cover transfers, but not necessarily wages, bonuses etc that players would expect. We would need to spend at least £10m to get out of L1 in one season. The only other option is to build with a long-term plan of just getting out of L1, so we can bring in cheaper, younger players and develop them in-house. This could take years though.
NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Author Posted 27 April, 2009 bit of stability, decent management and think you can do it cheaper than £20m, off top of my head can't remember Wolves spending more than odd million
NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Author Posted 27 April, 2009 It's not as simple as saying how much. You can throw tens of millions at the team and fail if it is spent badly, or have a shrewd football manager who can assemble a good team for limited funds and get them playing well. We need to get the organisation of the club right before we can push on. agree, thats why we need clean break and new board totally to start again with long plan
RobM Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 bit of stability, decent management and think you can do it cheaper than £20m, off top of my head can't remember Wolves spending more than odd million It would be interesting to see how long the core of their squad had remained together though. Bearing in mind we will lose some key players this close season, we either need to start building for the future again (will take time) or buy our way out of trouble. I would bet, and this isn't based on any more than a little knowledge, that Wolves had the core of their squad assembled and together for quite some time.
NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Author Posted 27 April, 2009 think you are right, stuck with manager as well
Cabrone Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 Depends on how quickly you want to do it. I'd rather have a decent board who genuinely care for the club but have less cash than a cash rich trinket collector who just wants a toy. This club desperately needs to stabilize and rally behind one manager. If we had that then I'd be happy to be patient about a prem return (10 years+).
RobM Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 think you are right, stuck with manager as well This is the key to everything IMO. We need a decent manager who knows the game at all levels well, somebody who can motivate players and bring the best out of them. But also somebody who isn't going to jump ship and go running to their 'spiritual home' if it comes calling. We then need a solid spine of a team to build from. Experienced players, with a decent amount of years left in them yet. Add to that a little passion from somebody with a love of the club, some good luck and some patience and we could be out of L1 within two seasons. I live in a dream world, don't I?
Nineteen Canteen Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 £5-6m might get you promoted from L1, but more like £20m to get promoted from CCC and another £40m to stay in the prem. How many people with that kind of money are going to be interssted in buying us for £15m. There are lots of easier options around. We'd need someone who is stacked, a passionate fan and wreckless. I'd agee with that. So many variables especially with regard to managerial and player ability but to get to the Premiership not come straight back down as Wolves did under Jones as they had no money the figure has to be between £50m - £100m. Look how much Sunderland have spent and still not guaranteed for a third season. We need a Peter Coates character a wealthy successful businessman with a soft spot for his beloved Stoke City. Some interesting parallels as he of course was forced to sell due to fan hostility. Didn't stop him coming back and through 'luck or skill' this time he has fared a bit better.
Nineteen Canteen Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 Who knows. Hull did it on next to nothing, we crippled ourselves spending 10m. It depends on your manager. Hull though were fortunate to be granted a stadium paid for (I think) by their local authority and shared with Hull KR. Means they have to spend less on financing their infrastructure and can spend more on the team and perhaps that's a future model for more clubs.
SaintDonkey Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 First priority is to get the debt down to a reasonable level. 5 Million to Barclays, say 10 million to Aviva to bring the mortgage payments down to a more sustainable level. Then you can either throw money at the team or work on a longer term plan. I think the longer term plan is more realistic, and with the ten point penalty is somewhat forced on us. So 3 million on players next season to build the base and a upper mid table finish. 4 million more the following season to go up as champions with a settled squad ready to compete in the Championship. I suspect that then we'll need around 5 million more to be around the play offs but it'll need more like 10 million to be competing with the terms on Premiership parachutes. The key thing is building a team and keeping it together. If we want to get back up we have to avoid being a selling club, if we sell our best players at the end of every season we're not going to progress.
krissyboy31 Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 One of the advantages of losing the majority of the players we have, is that a new manager can come in and assemble a team to do a job for us in League 1. Some of our younger academy players will thrive at a slightly lower level, like they have shown when being loaned out. But some of the billy big boots, who think they should be in the prem, and "too good" for league 1, will have gone and will be replaced with players that we have probably never heard of. I personally don't think that is necessarily an expensive option, as long as we back the manager and do not get too impatient. Building and not trying to do things too quickly is the key, for me.
RobM Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 One thing we have to bear in mind, is that anything above a bottom half finish for next year will be considered a massive success. Starting from -10 means we are effectively four game behind everyone else, in that a minimum of three wins and a draw would put us on 0, by which time even the worst teams in the league will be ahead of us. Next season is about planning and survival, IMO. Let's just hope that the sort of players willing to come to a club on -10 are the sort with the commitment and determined mentality we need.
NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Author Posted 27 April, 2009 looking at league table (league 1) and consider effect -10 would have; Leicester would still be automatic places next 4 teams would all still be around play off places but -all teams in bottom half would be in relegation battle if they lost 10.
krissyboy31 Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 Hull though were fortunate to be granted a stadium paid for (I think) by their local authority and shared with Hull KR. Means they have to spend less on financing their infrastructure and can spend more on the team and perhaps that's a future model for more clubs. Grrrr wrong team!!! Hull City lease the KC Stadium from the stadium management company, of which they are a shareholder. It was built by money donated by the city council after the floatation of Kingston Communications. The City Council are the other major share holder of SMC, with Hull FC (the Black and Whites) also holding a lesser share.
Flyer Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 Arent Saints losing about £8m a season? Best case scenario is 3 years to Prem. Thats 24m in losses without improving the team, plus the 6m debt, £30m before you touch the squad. I think it would cost over £50m to get Saints back in the Prem. Which is the reason why I dont see anyone but a Saints fan buying the club, no business man in their right mind would do that.
NickG Posted 27 April, 2009 Author Posted 27 April, 2009 that loss includes paying likes of Euell, Skacel, BWP - possibly even Rasiak, John - the outgoings are likely to be a lot smaller
Flyer Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 So are the incomings in ticket sales and future player sales. They offset each other. The only way I see Saints becoming viable is if the PL2 happens and Saints are invited into that or a billionaire gets involved. Otherwise I just see them lurching from one disaster to the next if a group of local businessmen take over.
sandwichsaint Posted 27 April, 2009 Posted 27 April, 2009 Agree about Prem 2. Looks increasingly like it will happen; if Saints can get themselves stabilised/sorted very quickly there is no reason why they couldn't be invited in, if presumably it's going to be done by invitation. If for any reason we ever fall below that cut-off line we would be condemned to a life as a permanent Millwall or Gillingham.
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