Boycott

[John Smith]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

I am still not convinced that if SMS gets filled week in week out that Saints (that's the FC not the SLH) will benefit directly. I don't think that this club will ever reap the rewards of success on the pitch and crowds on the terraces whilst Lowe is in charge.

 

I will continue to stay away whilst Lowe is at the helm. Is this a disappointment, of course it is. As some of you know, I love talking tactics, I love to see the ball on the ground and I enjoy watching, first hand, the decisions the management make in respect to substitutions and tactical changes in order to get the best from the team on the day.

 

But I don't enjoy going whilst Lowe is in charge. I com from a very poor up bringing and I respect the money I have and ow I use it. If spending my money makes me depressed, then I won't spend it. Watching Saints lose and get relegated, wasn't so muc depressing as it was acceptance of a very poor season. I was happy to keep supporting Saints trough the hard times and hoped we could turn it round after the change of Chairmanship. It wasn't to be, Lowe is back at the helm, and I wish Saints and their supporters all the best, but I cannot throw my money away to the likes of Lowe. Is it a class thing? Don't be ridiculous, it's a selfish thing, I think Lowe is selfish, I think he is playing games and I don't trust him. If he was a bin man from the streets of Southampton, the way he acts with my money, I still wouldn't support him.

 

My life and situation is changing very rapidly and soon I doubt if I will be ale to go to games anyway (1 - 2 years) an so, no I won't be returning. Does this make me sad, no, I love football, football was my life for many many years and it is in my blood. But I also recognise character in people, and I don't like Lowes, and I choose not to support characters like Lowe. I am able to make this decision, because it is my money and my life. I have given plenty of 'my' money over the years, even whilst at secondary school, I would deliver 'Bettaware' catalogs to earn enough money to get to the games, done a milk round, a paper round and also cleaned offices. The money I gave then was much more of my PDI than I give now and it meant a lot. I gave 'all' my money in supporting Saints, so those that claim 'better fan' rubbish, you can carry on, it doesn't bother me, nor hurt me. I supported Saints or many many years, for better or worse, but if things do come through for me in these next two years, I will be just a follower and no longer a supporter, but that's life and I can live with my decisions. They are right for me and I sleep well at night, and it's also nice to hear a saints win, maybe we'll be on Match of the Day again and I can watch the live games on Sky.

 

I live my life the way I choose, not the way people on message boards expect me to. I suggest we all do this, it's your life and you get one crack at it, do what makes you happy! I do, and I am!

[NickG]

This young team are playing with a verve and elan that we, as Saints fans, have been waiting for for a long, long time.

 

Because of that they really do deserve my/our support. I said I'd near set foot in SMS again with Lowe back at the helm but these young lionhearts have done something I didn't believe possible, they've made me believe and I'll be buying tickets for my son and I for Saturday.

 

It may all end in tears but these youngsters deserve all of us geting behind them.

 

never understood that stance at all, as said before when I went at possibly age of your sons didn't know who the chairman was but wanted to support my local team and still love it - but I am please for you (meant genuinely not patronisingly) that you are all coming back as I have really enjoyed every game so far

[saintkiptanui]

This young team are playing with a verve and elan that we, as Saints fans, have been waiting for for a long, long time.

 

Because of that they really do deserve my/our support. I said I'd near set foot in SMS again with Lowe back at the helm but these young lionhearts have done something I didn't believe possible, they've made me believe and I'll be buying tickets for my son and I for Saturday.

 

It may all end in tears but these youngsters deserve all of us geting behind them.

Nice one, your son will thank you come saturday evening.

[Weston Super Saint]

You're right. I don't get the point of the 'stay away' fans.

 

Everyone's opinion is allowed, thankfully they are the minority.

 

Leaving my golf club after 40 years because I don't like the Club Captain would not be something I would do - but we are all different.

 

Lol...

[lordswoodsaints]

the 'stay aways' will return like a bad dose of untreated crabs if the team are challenging for promotion or a decent cup run.they will all come scuttling back and denying that they ever stayed away.

i have never stayed away because i dont like somebody or dont agree with a certain policy,even in the branfoot days i still attended,i may not have liked what was happening but to be a selective fan is not being a fan imo.

[View From The Top]

the 'stay aways' will return like a bad dose of untreated crabs if the team are challenging for promotion or a decent cup run.they will all come scuttling back and denying that they ever stayed away.

i have never stayed away because i dont like somebody or dont agree with a certain policy,even in the branfoot days i still attended,i may not have liked what was happening but to be a selective fan is not being a fan imo.

 

If only everyone was as perfect as you.

[Weston Super Saint]

the 'stay aways' will return like a bad dose of untreated crabs if the team are challenging for promotion or a decent cup run.they will all come scuttling back and denying that they ever stayed away.

i have never stayed away because i dont like somebody or dont agree with a certain policy,even in the branfoot days i still attended,i may not have liked what was happening but to be a selective fan is not being a fan imo.

 

Better fan, blah, blah, blah.

 

Two weeks ago everyone was trying to persuade the stay aways to come back, your club needs you [and your money].

 

Are you saying these fans [like a bad dose of crabs] are not wanted anymore??

[saintkiptanui]

the 'stay aways' will return like a bad dose of untreated crabs if the team are challenging for promotion or a decent cup run.they will all come scuttling back and denying that they ever stayed away.

i have never stayed away because i dont like somebody or dont agree with a certain policy,even in the branfoot days i still attended,i may not have liked what was happening but to be a selective fan is not being a fan imo.

what a horrid little paragraph.

[CB Fry]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

 

What a pointless, scattergun paragraph.

 

In the Prem days (and actually, even today) Lowe was slated for spending money on "facilities" - ie the stadium, the training ground, the academy, etc etc.

 

You'll often get the line "if we'd never wasted money on SMS we'd still be in the Prem" churned out on here.

 

If there is one thing Lowe did spend money on it was bloody "facilities".

 

He was crowned "Mr Facilities 2002" I believe.

 

And once again, you show yourself off as one of those people that really believes we could have bought nine or ten world class players with the gazillions we spent on setting up a licensing deal on the SFC branded credit card. All of those silly little things were set up to try and bring money into the club, ie into the team.

 

They didn't really work, but it is just nonsense to suggest boatloads of salt-of-the-earth fans money was wasted bringing them about. I bet the cost of the whole lot of them wouldn't have covered Beattie's Prem wages for six months.

 

 

And, err, as for the "conveyor belt of youth we'd never get to see play"....well, words fail me. Have you been living in a cave for the last two months?

 

And the "constant journeymen" all arrived under the previous regime and led us to near relegation, but at least you were happy

 

You can be consistently relied upon to come out with a right load of old steaming horses plop time and again. This time, you've surpassed yourself. Well done.

 

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Weston Super Saint]

 

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

Oi!!!

 

Hands off my smiley

[lordswoodsaints]

If only everyone was as perfect as you.

 

touched a raw nerve it seems.

far from perfect just realistic and i tell it like it is.

[lordswoodsaints]

Better fan, blah, blah, blah.

 

Two weeks ago everyone was trying to persuade the stay aways to come back, your club needs you [and your money].

 

Are you saying these fans [like a bad dose of crabs] are not wanted anymore??

 

im certainly a better fan than you wss.

i couldnt give a rats arse if the fans come back or not,it is their loss.i support my local team and i am proud of that,i dont support my local team on a part time basis.

[lordswoodsaints]

what a horrid little paragraph.

 

just ignore it and jog on then big fella.

[Weston Super Saint]

im certainly a better fan than you wss.

i couldnt give a rats arse if the fans come back or not,it is their loss.i support my local team and i am proud of that,i dont support my local team on a part time basis.

 

Some might take offence at your claims.

 

Others [like me] are happy to laugh at you.

[John Smith]

 

And once again, you show yourself off as one of those people that really believes we could have bought nine or ten world class players with the gazillions we spent on setting up a licensing deal on the SFC branded credit card. All of those silly little things were set up to try and bring money into the club, ie into the team.

 

 

Are you really worth my time and effort? I've ignored you for a long time CB because, well you know why, but I thought I would respond this once, just to show you what tosh you actually speak.

 

Your paragraph above, I have never said it, never mentioned it, never believed it to be true.

 

You make things up just to dramatise your posts because you seem to think that nobody will read them unless you exaggerate to the extreme and insult someone at least 3 times in any one thread.

 

Just once more, for you and for anybody else that thinks this type of infantile tosh has any effect on me whatsoever -

 

I will never run my life or make decisions that effect my life based upon the thoughts and opinions of a fans forum.

 

If you think you are they type of person that does run your life by what other people think of you, that is your decision. And if you think that exaggeration and insults are the best way to gain attention, carry on, I'm afraid they don't have any impact on me. And I will continue to ignore you because it's just not worth my effort trying to enter into a debate with someone that can't communicate without trying to be some sort of cyber warrior.

 

You, CB, are not able to change my mind and I guess this is obvious because you can't debate the issue without being childish.

[lordswoodsaints]

Some might take offence at your claims.

 

Others [like me] are happy to laugh at you.

 

i laugh at you being very brave sat in front of a computer screen.please feel free to take offence,nothing would please me more.

very funny.

[Legod Second Coming]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

I am still not convinced that if SMS gets filled week in week out that Saints (that's the FC not the SLH) will benefit directly. I don't think that this club will ever reap the rewards of success on the pitch and crowds on the terraces whilst Lowe is in charge.

 

I will continue to stay away whilst Lowe is at the helm. Is this a disappointment, of course it is. As some of you know, I love talking tactics, I love to see the ball on the ground and I enjoy watching, first hand, the decisions the management make in respect to substitutions and tactical changes in order to get the best from the team on the day.

 

But I don't enjoy going whilst Lowe is in charge. I com from a very poor up bringing and I respect the money I have and ow I use it. If spending my money makes me depressed, then I won't spend it. Watching Saints lose and get relegated, wasn't so muc depressing as it was acceptance of a very poor season. I was happy to keep supporting Saints trough the hard times and hoped we could turn it round after the change of Chairmanship. It wasn't to be, Lowe is back at the helm, and I wish Saints and their supporters all the best, but I cannot throw my money away to the likes of Lowe. Is it a class thing? Don't be ridiculous, it's a selfish thing, I think Lowe is selfish, I think he is playing games and I don't trust him. If he was a bin man from the streets of Southampton, the way he acts with my money, I still wouldn't support him.

 

My life and situation is changing very rapidly and soon I doubt if I will be ale to go to games anyway (1 - 2 years) an so, no I won't be returning. Does this make me sad, no, I love football, football was my life for many many years and it is in my blood. But I also recognise character in people, and I don't like Lowes, and I choose not to support characters like Lowe. I am able to make this decision, because it is my money and my life. I have given plenty of 'my' money over the years, even whilst at secondary school, I would deliver 'Bettaware' catalogs to earn enough money to get to the games, done a milk round, a paper round and also cleaned offices. The money I gave then was much more of my PDI than I give now and it meant a lot. I gave 'all' my money in supporting Saints, so those that claim 'better fan' rubbish, you can carry on, it doesn't bother me, nor hurt me. I supported Saints or many many years, for better or worse, but if things do come through for me in these next two years, I will be just a follower and no longer a supporter, but that's life and I can live with my decisions. They are right for me and I sleep well at night, and it's also nice to hear a saints win, maybe we'll be on Match of the Day again and I can watch the live games on Sky.

 

I live my life the way I choose, not the way people on message boards expect me to. I suggest we all do this, it's your life and you get one crack at it, do what makes you happy! I do, and I am!

 

 

I have a simple question for you John. Did you go to Cardiff in May 2003?

[Weston Super Saint]

i laugh at you being very brave sat in front of a computer screen.please feel free to take offence,nothing would please me more.

very funny.

 

: roll :

[Professor]

The claim by a few people to be 'boycotting' the SMS may well be a false. Gates dropped by about 10,000 after relegation, and dropped by another 6-7000 as the club became settled in the CCC. There are fluctuations, but there were roughly as many people at the Birmingham league game as there were at the matches in September last year (about 18-19000). Its likely that success on the field will increase gates, although this week, the gate may be affected by the match being on TV. If the team are doing well, 23-25,000 is quite probable as the season goes on, which is about what gates were in the season we reached the playoffs.

People have all sorts of reasons to do something else on a Saturday afternoon, instead of going to watch the Saints and for a few it is easier to claim a 'boycott' than to admit that for them, life has moved on, and watching live football is not as important to them as it once was, especially compared to when the team were competing against the strongest sides in the country, and with all the media attention that went with it.

As for those who are quite genuine in saying they are not attending because of who runs the club, does it actually matter what they give as their reason? If the club was heading towards administration with an expensive but failing team and no prospect of things improving, there would be even less people attending matches, so we may be better off as things are.

[yorkie]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

I am still not convinced that if SMS gets filled week in week out that Saints (that's the FC not the SLH) will benefit directly. I don't think that this club will ever reap the rewards of success on the pitch and crowds on the terraces whilst Lowe is in charge. QUOTE]

 

 

And this is where I'm coming from too...why are some people blinkered by this fill the stadium blah, blah, blah?

 

I have stated elsewhere it will be a cold day in hell before I set foot back in the stadium, but I have been seriously thinking about it and come to the following comclusion.

 

If the team does obtain some success thenfurther investment required - this has to be brought in from another place and not by selling the best players and breaking that team up. Squad could replace team...

 

However history under Rupert has demonstrated as soon as money is needed we sell the family silver.

 

IF (and this is a very big IF) we manage to achieve anything this season, and need to move to the next level - and we do not sell the family silver again, I may consider my stance as Rupert may have learnt from previous mistakes.

 

There is no accounting for ambition, and players if successful will demand more money - but what about bonus related pay rather than big fat non performance related salaries? After all that's what the management team are now on - I bet Rupert is sh1tting himself at the thought of having to pay the Dutch duo...who will he have to sell?

 

A leopard never changes it spots - and after almost convincing myself I will go back to SMS, my arguement has completely highlighted a MEGA U-turn. Rupert will never change (unless he comes out publically and makes a positive statement about investment without selling the family silver) - so basically I'm sha99ed.

 

SMS never again whilst Rupert pulls the strings at SFC (SLH) - you wait and see it will all end in tears. All those of you who go in the belief it really makes a difference are in for a nasty shock. Filling SMS will make not make any difference to the finances of the club - players will still ahve to be sold.

 

I bet not one of you true fans can confirm this will not happen (again)...may be the Trust should be doing something positive to oust this cancer. No manifesto, no aims for the future but still they ask for my money...

 

Swing Lowe

Swing Rupert Lowe

Swing him from The Itchen Bridge!

[NickG]

long paragraph which seems to say if they are more successful I will go but not until?

[Red and White Army]

I will continue to stay away whilst Lowe is at the helm. Is this a disappointment, of course it is. As some of you know, I love talking tactics, I love to see the ball on the ground and I enjoy watching, first hand, the decisions the management make in respect to substitutions and tactical changes in order to get the best from the team on the day.

 

But I don't enjoy going whilst Lowe is in charge. I com from a very poor up bringing and I respect the money I have and ow I use it. If spending my money makes me depressed, then I won't spend it. Watching Saints lose and get relegated, wasn't so muc depressing as it was acceptance of a very poor season. I was happy to keep supporting Saints trough the hard times and hoped we could turn it round after the change of Chairmanship. It wasn't to be, Lowe is back at the helm, and I wish Saints and their supporters all the best, but I cannot throw my money away to the likes of Lowe. Is it a class thing? Don't be ridiculous, it's a selfish thing, I think Lowe is selfish, I think he is playing games and I don't trust him. If he was a bin man from the streets of Southampton, the way he acts with my money, I still wouldn't support him.

 

 

Ultimately this just shows you are trying to play the "I'm a great fan" card and you show how petty and small minded you really are with your anti-Lowe rant, You do have every right to hold this opinion but equally we have every right to judge you on it.

 

Lowe spent money trying to expand the number of sources Saints derived money from, which were ultimately unsuccessful. The logic behind this is impeccable though - by diversifying earnings you get a more stable income stream and this is extremely positive for any company or football team.

 

Did you go to the FA Cup final under Lowe?

[Red and White Army]

However history under Rupert has demonstrated as soon as money is needed we sell the family silver.

 

IF (and this is a very big IF) we manage to achieve anything this season, and need to move to the next level - and we do not sell the family silver again, I may consider my stance as Rupert may have learnt from previous mistakes.

 

There is no accounting for ambition, and players if successful will demand more money - but what about bonus related pay rather than big fat non performance related salaries? After all that's what the management team are now on - I bet Rupert is sh1tting himself at the thought of having to pay the Dutch duo...who will he have to sell?

 

What do you think Lowe should have sold then? If not players - should he have sold the stadium? The fans? What? Easy to criticise if you have no alternatives.

 

As for performance-related pay - RL has been big on that for a long long term, lng before you mentioned it. That's why our players took a salary cut on relegation, and have win bonuses in their contracts. That's why the Dutch Duo will get well paid if we do well.

[stevegrant]

As for performance-related pay - RL has been big on that for a long long term, lng before you mentioned it. That's why our players took a salary cut on relegation, and have win bonuses in their contracts. That's why the Dutch Duo will get well paid if we do well.

It's also why Kevin Phillips signed for us despite his basic salary being cut in half.

[Daren W]

There does seem to be a lot of posturing on both sides here but I think it was Weston Saint who hit the nail firmly on the head by saying "Why should the fans be responsible for bailing the club out?"

Why should we?

I don't notice the major shareholders going without, I don't notice prices going down that much but I do see staff being sacked left right and centre

Now for the record I wouldn't boycot St Marys. I'll go game by game as I personally feel the club doesn't deserve my money in one lump sum, but I'll still go as at the end of the day it's the players I go to watch not the board. But I respect those people for whom their principles dictate that the Chairman ruins their support of the club and they resent paying money towards his wage.

It's one aspect of the PLC set up that makes me sick to my stomach. When times are good, they all get money, draw a wage and hop on the gravy train. When times are harsh, do you see them putting money into the club or taking a wage reduction? No you don't but you do see the kitman losing his job and loads of other lower paid staff being fired.

There's no easy solution but a firm step forward is for Lowe and Wilde to apologise. Lowe was in charge during our relegation and his meddling and conveyour belt of managers were very much a part of our fall from grace. Wilde is equaly responsible for upsetting the applecart when he had no plan A let alone a plan B and then jumped ship leaving us with a team of absolute jokers.

When that is done perhaps the fans can take some responsibility by going to thegames, putting money in the coffers and thus ensuring these billiant young lads and their ever increasingly admirable manager, stay here at St Marys.

Apportioning blames, slagging off fans that choose to stay away and infighting amongst ourselves is going to solve nothing... but hey, it looks good on an internet forum ...

[miserableoldgit]

And I think you've missed the point of a lot of 'stay away' fans.

 

For them it's not so much about the financial cost, more the 'moral' cost. If people can't accept who is running the club, who am I, you or anyone else to tell them how they should or shouldn't show their support [or otherwise] for THEIR club??

 

Everyone is allowed an opinion on who should play right back, so why deny people their opinion on who is in 'chair'??

How many "fans" boycott games because they don`t like the right back?:confused:

[Wes Tender]

Well said, Daren. If anybody wishes to make a stance on a matter of principle, it is entirely up to them and I suspect that their detractors wouldn't know what a principle was if it bit them on the arse, otherwise they would have respect for that stance, even if they did not agree with it.

 

Like you, my stance is to pay match by match, not giving Lowe the satisfaction of having my money in a lump sum, but also as an indicator through falling ST sales that he is unpopular with a large section of fans.

 

As for the couple of posters who asked John whether he had gone to the FA Cup match at Cardiff, seeking to make some point that John might be hypocritical in his stance, that was over 5 years ago. Did it not occur that John's stance might have followed events after that? Far more pertinent to enquire whether hypothetically he would go to an FA Cup final next year if Lowe was still here and the incredible came to pass.

[pedg]

Like you, my stance is to pay match by match, not giving Lowe the satisfaction of having my money in a lump sum, but also as an indicator through falling ST sales that he is unpopular with a large section of fans.

 

And how exactly is he supposed to figure out that your lack of season ticket is due to him and not the teams performance. After all, as has been pointed out elsewhere, the number of season tickets sold did not exactly sky rocket after he left so there is no evidence to link his position at the club with the number of season tickets sold?

[OldNick]

This young team are playing with a verve and elan that we, as Saints fans, have been waiting for for a long, long time.

 

Because of that they really do deserve my/our support. I said I'd near set foot in SMS again with Lowe back at the helm but these young lionhearts have done something I didn't believe possible, they've made me believe and I'll be buying tickets for my son and I for Saturday.

 

It may all end in tears but these youngsters deserve all of us geting behind them.

Hac, brilliant news. Lets hope others let the penny drop and get back to supporting the team who pull on our shirt, and for the first time in years I believe in pride and a real determination to win for us

[washsaint]

Well if you are calling for Lowe and Wilde to apologise Darren......

 

 

How about the fans apologise for mutinying against Hoddle? Or for anyone but Lowe?

 

Jeez......what's done is done. People can carry on living in the past and holding grudges forever or they can forget all the politics and enjoy (yes, enjoy!) the football being played by a really young siode with heart, apssion and a commitment (for now) to the club.

 

At the end of the day, what else matters? Football is meant to be about entertainment - something lacking from St Marys for many years. The crowds will retrun (I'm sure) once people hear/see that the entertainment is top notch. I stopped going regularly about 3 years ago....not because of any board room shenanigans but because there was zero entertainment value and we had a team of over the hill has beens who could not care less about Saints.

 

Not any more and for the first time in years I feel pride in the club, what we are trying to do and feel royally entertained after watching the lads play. JP is also a breath of fresh air!

[miserableoldgit]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

I am still not convinced that if SMS gets filled week in week out that Saints (that's the FC not the SLH) will benefit directly. I don't think that this club will ever reap the rewards of success on the pitch and crowds on the terraces whilst Lowe is in charge. QUOTE]

 

 

And this is where I'm coming from too...why are some people blinkered by this fill the stadium blah, blah, blah?

 

I have stated elsewhere it will be a cold day in hell before I set foot back in the stadium, but I have been seriously thinking about it and come to the following comclusion.

 

If the team does obtain some success thenfurther investment required - this has to be brought in from another place and not by selling the best players and breaking that team up. Squad could replace team...

 

However history under Rupert has demonstrated as soon as money is needed we sell the family silver.

 

IF (and this is a very big IF) we manage to achieve anything this season, and need to move to the next level - and we do not sell the family silver again, I may consider my stance as Rupert may have learnt from previous mistakes.

 

There is no accounting for ambition, and players if successful will demand more money - but what about bonus related pay rather than big fat non performance related salaries? After all that's what the management team are now on - I bet Rupert is sh1tting himself at the thought of having to pay the Dutch duo...who will he have to sell?

 

A leopard never changes it spots - and after almost convincing myself I will go back to SMS, my arguement has completely highlighted a MEGA U-turn. Rupert will never change (unless he comes out publically and makes a positive statement about investment without selling the family silver) - so basically I'm sha99ed.

 

SMS never again whilst Rupert pulls the strings at SFC (SLH) - you wait and see it will all end in tears. All those of you who go in the belief it really makes a difference are in for a nasty shock. Filling SMS will make not make any difference to the finances of the club - players will still ahve to be sold.

 

I bet not one of you true fans can confirm this will not happen (again)...may be the Trust should be doing something positive to oust this cancer. No manifesto, no aims for the future but still they ask for my money...

 

Swing Lowe

Swing Rupert Lowe

Swing him from The Itchen Bridge!

 

Just as they ALWAYS have been in the 50 years that I have been supporting the club.

[pedg]

When times are harsh, do you see them putting money into the club or taking a wage reduction? No you don't

 

So the cut in wages that the board took on relegation was a mirage then?

[OldNick]

There does seem to be a lot of posturing on both sides here but I think it was Weston Saint who hit the nail firmly on the head by saying "Why should the fans be responsible for bailing the club out?"

Why should we?

I don't notice the major shareholders going without, I don't notice prices going down that much but I do see staff being sacked left right and centre

Now for the record I wouldn't boycot St Marys. I'll go game by game as I personally feel the club doesn't deserve my money in one lump sum, but I'll still go as at the end of the day it's the players I go to watch not the board. But I respect those people for whom their principles dictate that the Chairman ruins their support of the club and they resent paying money towards his wage.

It's one aspect of the PLC set up that makes me sick to my stomach. When times are good, they all get money, draw a wage and hop on the gravy train. When times are harsh, do you see them putting money into the club or taking a wage reduction? No you don't but you do see the kitman losing his job and loads of other lower paid staff being fired.

There's no easy solution but a firm step forward is for Lowe and Wilde to apologise. Lowe was in charge during our relegation and his meddling and conveyour belt of managers were very much a part of our fall from grace. Wilde is equaly responsible for upsetting the applecart when he had no plan A let alone a plan B and then jumped ship leaving us with a team of absolute jokers.

When that is done perhaps the fans can take some responsibility by going to thegames, putting money in the coffers and thus ensuring these billiant young lads and their ever increasingly admirable manager, stay here at St Marys.

Apportioning blames, slagging off fans that choose to stay away and infighting amongst ourselves is going to solve nothing... but hey, it looks good on an internet forum ...

As usual well put, I cant agree with some of it but understand some of your gripes.

I feel chastened to see staff cut, but the fringe staff are always likely to go first as there are others who can double up the work.It really is a case of cutting where you can.I dont know if RL etc have taken a pay cut, but I suispect they have been prudent and after relegation he did take a cut in his wages.

As for an apology, Im informed that he did apologise, I didnt hear it and dont worry about it.To me the players let us down, they were the ones who had no backbone and threw away so many chances of escape and in that particular season the 3 teams up were the poorest

there had been. We should have been comfortably safe well before the end of the season.With that squad and taking into account the change of managers, there are no excuses to mess up.HR was given over half the season. RL was in part responsible for not replacing Wigley sooner (of course he already had been tagged a sacking chairman, and so this may have been why he was loathe to do quickly) but til my dying day I will recall the stupidity of Crouch sent off in a 6 pointer, not taking the ball into the corner, Prutton sent off , banned for months and his miss from 5 yards at WBA, losing the 2 goal leads etc etc.

[pele]

I dislike Lowe and his cronies and cannot understand this posturing from people regarding Pro or Anti this or that. Just except that the team at the moment are playing great football and go along and support them!

[Wade Garrett]

So the cut in wages that the board took on relegation was a mirage then?

 

 

Probably offset by the pay-offs they got when they were kicked out. I don't suppose they have repaid that money, now that they are drawing wages from the club again?

 

Parasites.

[miserableoldgit]

Well said, Daren. If anybody wishes to make a stance on a matter of principle, it is entirely up to them and I suspect that their detractors wouldn't know what a principle was if it bit them on the arse, otherwise they would have respect for that stance, even if they did not agree with it.

 

Like you, my stance is to pay match by match, not giving Lowe the satisfaction of having my money in a lump sum, but also as an indicator through falling ST sales that he is unpopular with a large section of fans.

 

As for the couple of posters who asked John whether he had gone to the FA Cup match at Cardiff, seeking to make some point that John might be hypocritical in his stance, that was over 5 years ago. Did it not occur that John's stance might have followed events after that? Far more pertinent to enquire whether hypothetically he would go to an FA Cup final next year if Lowe was still here and the incredible came to pass.

So the falling ST sales are down to Lowes return and nothing to do with the teams dire performances over the last couple of seasons when, incidently, Lowe was not there ?:confused:If you, or anyone else thinks that the majority of people who go to SMS actually give a rats ass who is running the club you are deluded. Most fans are influenced by what they see on the pitch and not what they read on an internet forum.

Considering that Lowe (who I am NOT a fan of) is supposed to be the Devil incarnate the gates didn`t exactly boom after he left did they. What happened to all those who were supposed to flock into SMS after "We Got Our Club Back"?

[OldNick]

Probably offset by the pay-offs they got when they were kicked out. I don't suppose they have repaid that money, now that they are drawing wages from the club again?

 

Parasites.

If people are sacked they get a financial remuneration.Managers whoever they have performed get payoffs and so why shouldn't the chairman?Afterall it was the fans who wanted him gone and so we knew there would be money in compensation paid out.Generally the majority I feel realise that the Wilde bunch was a mistake.MW realise it and so do others.

We will never know if we would have gone this way if the finances were not so dire, but in a happy way it may have been a good thing.

[stevegrant]

I'll go game by game as I personally feel the club doesn't deserve my money in one lump sum, but I'll still go as at the end of the day it's the players I go to watch not the board.

Isn't that a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face, though?

 

You won't buy a season ticket (which saves YOU money) which I guess you've had for many years because of the board, and yet you'll go anyway because you don't go to watch the board...

 

The word "principles" continues to be thrown around on here, with people claiming they have "principles" because they won't support the club financially so long as Lowe is chairman and blame him for people losing their jobs, and yet the very thing that would probably keep those people in their jobs is the paying support of the fans!

 

It's just a vicious circle.

 

For the record, if people can't go anymore because of financial pressures, work, distance or things like that, fine by me, not a problem. If people are choosing not to go because they don't want to watch Championship football, also fine, as long as you actually state as much rather than hiding behind feeble excuses. If people are seriously choosing not to go because of who is chairman (despite having continued to go under his chairmanship when we were in the top 10 in the Premier League), I think that's quite sad. Entirely up to you, of course, but I won't be at all surprised to see those "principles" go flying straight out of the window if we end up having a successful season.

[miserableoldgit]

Isn't that a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face, though?

 

You won't buy a season ticket (which saves YOU money) which I guess you've had for many years because of the board, and yet you'll go anyway because you don't go to watch the board...

 

The word "principles" continues to be thrown around on here, with people claiming they have "principles" because they won't support the club financially so long as Lowe is chairman and blame him for people losing their jobs, and yet the very thing that would probably keep those people in their jobs is the paying support of the fans!

 

It's just a vicious circle.

 

For the record, if people can't go anymore because of financial pressures, work, distance or things like that, fine by me, not a problem. If people are choosing not to go because they don't want to watch Championship football, also fine, as long as you actually state as much rather than hiding behind feeble excuses. If people are seriously choosing not to go because of who is chairman (despite having continued to go under his chairmanship when we were in the top 10 in the Premier League), I think that's quite sad. Entirely up to you, of course, but I won't be at all surprised to see those "principles" go flying straight out of the window if we end up having a successful season.

 

Very well put Steve.

[Guided Missile]

If people are choosing not to go because they don't want to watch Championship football, also fine, as long as you actually state as much rather than hiding behind feeble excuses. If people are seriously choosing not to go because of who is chairman (despite having continued to go under his chairmanship when we were in the top 10 in the Premier League), I think that's quite sad. Entirely up to you, of course, but I won't be at all surprised to see those "principles" go flying straight out of the window if we end up having a successful season.

That pretty much sums up how I feel Steve. What I hate is the total bullsh!t people give for not going, trying to justify their stance on a point of principle, when the real reason is far more mundane and pathetic.

[Wade Garrett]

Isn't that a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face, though?

 

You won't buy a season ticket (which saves YOU money) which I guess you've had for many years because of the board, and yet you'll go anyway because you don't go to watch the board...

 

The word "principles" continues to be thrown around on here, with people claiming they have "principles" because they won't support the club financially so long as Lowe is chairman and blame him for people losing their jobs, and yet the very thing that would probably keep those people in their jobs is the paying support of the fans!

 

It's just a vicious circle.

 

For the record, if people can't go anymore because of financial pressures, work, distance or things like that, fine by me, not a problem. If people are choosing not to go because they don't want to watch Championship football, also fine, as long as you actually state as much rather than hiding behind feeble excuses. If people are seriously choosing not to go because of who is chairman (despite having continued to go under his chairmanship when we were in the top 10 in the Premier League), I think that's quite sad. Entirely up to you, of course, but I won't be at all surprised to see those "principles" go flying straight out of the window if we end up having a successful season.

 

Fair point Steve.

 

To be honest, whatever anyone does is OK by me. It's their choice, and as far as I'm concerned there is no right or wrong.

Edited 28 August, 2008 by Wade Garrett

[Alucard]

However history under Rupert has demonstrated as soon as money is needed we sell the family silver.

 

IF (and this is a very big IF) we manage to achieve anything this season, and need to move to the next level - and we do not sell the family silver again, I may consider my stance as Rupert may have learnt from previous mistakes.

 

There is no accounting for ambition, and players if successful will demand more money - but what about bonus related pay rather than big fat non performance related salaries? After all that's what the management team are now on - I bet Rupert is sh1tting himself at the thought of having to pay the Dutch duo...who will he have to sell?

 

A leopard never changes it spots - and after almost convincing myself I will go back to SMS, my arguement has completely highlighted a MEGA U-turn. Rupert will never change (unless he comes out publically and makes a positive statement about investment without selling the family silver) - so basically I'm sha99ed.

 

Well who sold £16.5M of the family silver when Rupert Lowe wasn't here last summer. Who put that money in their pocket? Did you boycott SMS then or did you just put it down to the fact every football club in the world sells players and we needed the money to meet the bills. When players are sold under Lowe it's selling off the family silver under anybody else it's OK.

[slickmick]

If paying to watch what we have recently, then I couldn't give a **** who the manager/chairman is. For the first time in years everyone I know is talking about going to watch the KIDS. Rupert Lowe barely gets mentioned these days.

 

Rupert Lowe has either got very lucky so far, or he has pulled off a masterstroke, but either way, I believe he deserves a chance to make amends.

 

I would rather pay to watch our current team, other than the one that struggled to string two passes together back in the premiership days.

[Toomer]

As I said in my other post on this thread, I don't like or trust Lowe but he won't stop going to watch the team that my dad first took me to see way back in 1959.

[andrew0101]

Geoffrey Boycott? Is he our new manager?

[Alucard]

But I don't enjoy going whilst Lowe is in charge. I com from a very poor up bringing and I respect the money I have and ow I use it. If spending my money makes me depressed, then I won't spend it. Watching Saints lose and get relegated, wasn't so muc depressing as it was acceptance of a very poor season. I was happy to keep supporting Saints trough the hard times and hoped we could turn it round after the change of Chairmanship. It wasn't to be, Lowe is back at the helm, and I wish Saints and their supporters all the best, but I cannot throw my money away to the likes of Lowe. Is it a class thing? Don't be ridiculous, it's a selfish thing, I think Lowe is selfish, I think he is playing games and I don't trust him. If he was a bin man from the streets of Southampton, the way he acts with my money, I still wouldn't support him.

 

I will be just a follower and no longer a supporter, but that's life and I can live with my decisions. They are right for me and I sleep well at night, and it's also nice to hear a saints win, maybe we'll be on Match of the Day again and I can watch the live games on Sky.

 

!

I find it difficult to understand that your principles won't allow you support somebody like Lowe but you're quite happy to support someone like Rupert Murdoch

[miserableoldgit]

When all is said and done and we contemplate the pro's and cons, IF SMS was filled to capacity every week, where would that money go? Would it be on investment in the team, on the stadium, on the facilities, or would we see an insurance company pop up, a credit card drive, the conveyor belt of youth that we never get to see play and the constant journey men and temporary managers going in and out of this club like there's a revolving door on the managers office.

 

I am still not convinced that if SMS gets filled week in week out that Saints (that's the FC not the SLH) will benefit directly. I don't think that this club will ever reap the rewards of success on the pitch and crowds on the terraces whilst Lowe is in charge.

 

I will continue to stay away whilst Lowe is at the helm. Is this a disappointment, of course it is. As some of you know, I love talking tactics, I love to see the ball on the ground and I enjoy watching, first hand, the decisions the management make in respect to substitutions and tactical changes in order to get the best from the team on the day.

 

But I don't enjoy going whilst Lowe is in charge. I com from a very poor up bringing and I respect the money I have and ow I use it. If spending my money makes me depressed, then I won't spend it. Watching Saints lose and get relegated, wasn't so muc depressing as it was acceptance of a very poor season. I was happy to keep supporting Saints trough the hard times and hoped we could turn it round after the change of Chairmanship. It wasn't to be, Lowe is back at the helm, and I wish Saints and their supporters all the best, but I cannot throw my money away to the likes of Lowe. Is it a class thing? Don't be ridiculous, it's a selfish thing, I think Lowe is selfish, I think he is playing games and I don't trust him. If he was a bin man from the streets of Southampton, the way he acts with my money, I still wouldn't support him.

 

My life and situation is changing very rapidly and soon I doubt if I will be ale to go to games anyway (1 - 2 years) an so, no I won't be returning. Does this make me sad, no, I love football, football was my life for many many years and it is in my blood. But I also recognise character in people, and I don't like Lowes, and I choose not to support characters like Lowe. I am able to make this decision, because it is my money and my life. I have given plenty of 'my' money over the years, even whilst at secondary school, I would deliver 'Bettaware' catalogs to earn enough money to get to the games, done a milk round, a paper round and also cleaned offices. The money I gave then was much more of my PDI than I give now and it meant a lot. I gave 'all' my money in supporting Saints, so those that claim 'better fan' rubbish, you can carry on, it doesn't bother me, nor hurt me. I supported Saints or many many years, for better or worse, but if things do come through for me in these next two years, I will be just a follower and no longer a supporter, but that's life and I can live with my decisions. They are right for me and I sleep well at night, and it's also nice to hear a saints win, maybe we'll be on Match of the Day again and I can watch the live games on Sky.

 

I live my life the way I choose, not the way people on message boards expect me to. I suggest we all do this, it's your life and you get one crack at it, do what makes you happy! I do, and I am!

 

Who of course don`t give any of your Sky bill to the club, for Rupert to put straight in his pocket!:confused:

[broncoboy]

Peopel can chose to attend or not as is their wish nad do not need to justify their actions to anyone.

[leehoudini]

How bizarre that people refuse to go whilst Lowe is chairman of the PLC board. Presumably this is partly due to the perverse logic of "I'm not giving my money to Rupert Lowe", which is flawed by the fact that we are a PLC and not privately owned. I've got an idea, why not buy some shares, then when you spend your money, by virtue of your dividend you'll be paying yourself!

[70's Mike]

As I said in my other post on this thread, I don't like or trust Lowe but he won't stop going to watch the team that my dad first took me to see way back in 1959.

 

Same here Toomer.

 

What winds me up is people saying did you go to Cardiff in 2003/ i went and to Wembley in 76.

Its this approach that nothing happen to SFC before 1997 and that it will disappear once Lowe pops his clogs ,

yes Crouch and Wilde were crap at running the club But IT IS THIS only Lowe could do it approach