thorpie the sinner Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I thought bid situation meant we had a bid! not looking for offers
St Matty Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 If 10,000 fans invest £2,500 each we have 25million towards the debt? Count me in even if I have to borrow the money and keep it quiet from my wife. In return I get a cheaper season ticket for 10 years and 1 vote for the chairman - the way Barca are run I believe.? Any takers?
saint_stevo Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 After admin, are we debt free? Have Lowe and Wilde actually gone from the FC now? Why do i keep reading Ken Bates being mentioned? Tripe? Have tried reading through the 10pages but failed miserably to get and good answers....
derry Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 If 10,000 fans invest £2,500 each we have 25million towards the debt? Count me in even if I have to borrow the money and keep it quiet from my wife. In return I get a cheaper season ticket for 10 years and 1 vote for the chairman - the way Barca are run I believe.? Any takers? Need to set up a trust, bring in the media, open a bank account, set out an appeal. For that sort of money the club could easily be bought, the debts settled and the mortgage serviced together with £15 to £20 million working capital. The 10000 could elect the board and hold the club to account. Another way would be a variable share starting at £100 then at multiples of £100. 25 shares for £2500. It would bring a lot more people into the equation. I would put in £2500.
Doctoroncall Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 Need to set up a trust, bring in the media, open a bank account, set out an appeal. For that sort of money the club could easily be bought, the debts settled and the mortgage serviced together with £15 to £20 million working capital. The 10000 could elect the board and hold the club to account. Another way would be a variable share starting at £100 then at multiples of £100. 25 shares for £2500. It would bring a lot more people into the equation. I would put in £2500. Maybe a bit late unless you can get things organised in 23 days, but count me in.
um pahars Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 Need to set up a trust, bring in the media, open a bank account, set out an appeal. For that sort of money the club could easily be bought, the debts settled and the mortgage serviced together with £15 to £20 million working capital. The 10000 could elect the board and hold the club to account. Another way would be a variable share starting at £100 then at multiples of £100. 25 shares for £2500. It would bring a lot more people into the equation. I would put in £2500. The vehicle is already there in The Saints Trust. If anyone was really serious about it then I'm sure this vehicle could be used for an initiative like this. I'm not talking about those individuals currently or previously involved (they would surely step aside), but if a shell company was needed then it's ideal in the first instance.
badgerx16 Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 Norwich Union to shed jobs: http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/banking_and_finance/article6022520.ece
Shrek Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I've posted this elsewhere, but heh we're in the s@:t, let's make a difference. There's already some "Save our Saints" offers going on in the Megastore, with signed footballs and shirts etc. up for grabs. We've already sold over 20,000 tickets for Saturday's match, with most of the Itchen already sold out, and decent seats hard to come by elsewhere. Come on, let's sell this game out!
thorpie the sinner Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I HAVE TRYING TO KEEP THE FAITH ALL DAY! TONIGHT it is ebbing away!!
Viking Warrior Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I think what Dubai Phil was trying to say in his drunken stuper last night was Pop goes the weasel send three and fourpence Hic
Viking Warrior Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 Steve says the vehicle is in place the Saints Trust! I wouldnt trust the saints trust. A good mouth peice but nothing else. Also I take it the Saints Fans' Parliment has now been blown to smithereens
dubai_phil Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I think what Dubai Phil was trying to say in his drunken stuper last night was Pop goes the weasel send three and fourpence Hic Phil wasn't drunk last night. That was Tuesday (and it wasn't a stupOr) FWIW all tomorrow's another day. Who knows? I'll sleep well tonight though after that - well - who can say.
um pahars Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I wouldnt trust the saints trust. A good mouth peice but nothing else. I'm on about using it as the shell vehicle to perhaps try and do something positive given that we don't have much time. I'm not about personalities, egos or being a mouth piece, merely using it as something that people can use to get something moving.
dubai_phil Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I'm on about using it as the shell vehicle to perhaps try and do something positive given that we don't have much time. I'm not about personalities, egos or being a mouth piece, merely using it as something that people can use to get something moving. It is a good idea. There is one other one Season tickets. IF they can organise it, then fans that want to help even if they cannot go could buy an ST. Sure we know many have financial worries and worries about the quality of entertaiment, but 10,000 ST's would sure help solve a lot of the shorter term problems
Viking Warrior Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I will buy a season ticket. I will not get to many games but quite happy to lend it to people for a small fee. maybe 50 0r 75% of the cost of a match ticket. I would go more often but with over £350 for an airfare from orkney to Southampton it is a tad expensive to keep coming down. So yes I will buy a season ticket if it will help the club
saintalan Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 ... Season tickets. IF they can organise it, then fans that want to help even if they cannot go could buy an ST. Sure we know many have financial worries and worries about the quality of entertaiment, but 10,000 ST's would sure help solve a lot of the shorter term problems Like the sound of this one, presumably the Administrators could have a holding a/c for those pledging prior to our safety being secured.
dubai_phil Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 I will buy a season ticket. I will not get to many games but quite happy to lend it to people for a small fee. maybe 50 0r 75% of the cost of a match ticket. I would go more often but with over £350 for an airfare from orkney to Southampton it is a tad expensive to keep coming down. So yes I will buy a season ticket if it will help the club WIth you on this even if I get to only about two or three games. My lad can then use it or my mates but if we could really get this moving 10,000+ would be more than anyone could have expected with the previous regime, if we know it is truly staying in the club now for WISE leaders people who care about the club can't see it being an issue.. Maybe a new thread..? But not from me it's nearly 1am again & I've burnt too many hours worrying about this day of late need zzzzz
Whitey Grandad Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 WIth you on this even if I get to only about two or three games. My lad can then use it or my mates but if we could really get this moving 10,000+ would be more than anyone could have expected with the previous regime, if we know it is truly staying in the club now for WISE leaders people who care about the club can't see it being an issue.. Maybe a new thread..? But not from me it's nearly 1am again & I've burnt too many hours worrying about this day of late need zzzzz Sleep well, dear friend, tomorrrow is a bright new day. :)
dubai_phil Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 Sleep well, dear friend, tomorrrow is a bright new day. :) oh yes
Forester Posted 2 April, 2009 Posted 2 April, 2009 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=11753
SaintBobby Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=11753 Right...and you're the same bloke who said with "absolute confidence" that we would go into admin in the first week of February. And then said you were proven right! Please just go away. Nothing to see her, people....
stinhk Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 I guess that, if we were to finish inside the bottom three much of the potential complications for the FL surrounding the points deduction issue would disappear.
SaintBobby Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 I guess that, if we were to finish inside the bottom three much of the potential complications for the FL surrounding the points deduction issue would disappear. Not sure that's right - Leeds were hit by a 15 point deduction after having suffered a ten point deduction in the previous season. Having passed the deadline, the issue becomes whether the (possible) ten point penalty is meaningful. From what I can gather (and putting aside the fact that we might well not get a deduction anyway....assuming we do): 1. If it turns out that the penalty was "meaningful" (e.g. we stay up by six points on the pitch, but therefore get relegated by four points because of the penalty), then we have served our sentence and start next season in League One with a blank sheet. 2. If the penalty was not "meaningful" (e.g. we get relegated by 4 points anyway, but it's now 14), we may get a further ten point deduction next season. 3. If we were to suffer and ride out the penalty (e.g. we are safe by 11 points, but thanks to the penalty, we only survive by one point), we would also be considered to have suffered and served our sentence (THIS SCENARIO IS THE LEAST LIKELY). 4. We may be penalised if we are seen to have attempted to cheat the rules.
stinhk Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Not sure that's right - Leeds were hit by a 15 point deduction after having suffered a ten point deduction in the previous season. Having passed the deadline, the issue becomes whether the (possible) ten point penalty is meaningful. From what I can gather (and putting aside the fact that we might well not get a deduction anyway....assuming we do): 1. If it turns out that the penalty was "meaningful" (e.g. we stay up by six points on the pitch, but therefore get relegated by four points because of the penalty), then we have served our sentence and start next season in League One with a blank sheet. 2. If the penalty was not "meaningful" (e.g. we get relegated by 4 points anyway, but it's now 14), we may get a further ten point deduction next season. 3. If we were to suffer and ride out the penalty (e.g. we are safe by 11 points, but thanks to the penalty, we only survive by one point), we would also be considered to have suffered and served our sentence (THIS SCENARIO IS THE LEAST LIKELY). 4. We may be penalised if we are seen to have attempted to cheat the rules. Agree with that but, my point is that if we were to finish in the bottom three under our own steam, the result of the decision whether to deduct points or not is less critical. I'm suggesting it would be neater for FL if we relegated ourselves.
hamster Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Agree with that but, my point is that if we were to finish in the bottom three under our own steam, the result of the decision whether to deduct points or not is less critical. I'm suggesting it would be neater for FL if we relegated ourselves. If that were the case I would expect the FL will feel that they have to punish us next season too. In the eyes of the football world they must be seen to be punishing us whether it be this season or next.
Rational Rich Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Lowe's quoted in the FT attacking Barclays: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/67f4d396-1f80-11de-a7a5-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1
eelpie Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Lowe's quoted in the FT attacking Barclays: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/67f4d396-1f80-11de-a7a5-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1 Lowe knew in November that with £1 million less overdraft facility from Barclays that we were doomed, but chose to wait until after 26th March to take us to administration. We all know the consequences of this error in judgement.
dubai_phil Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Lowe knew in November that with £1 million less overdraft facility from Barclays that we were doomed, but chose to wait until after 26th March to take us to administration. We all know the consequences of this error in judgement. Yep It gave them longer to try and find a buyer for the club. Not a PC opinion on here I know. But a slight chance of survival vs certain death? Guess we won't find out if it was the right decision for another 23 days
Weston Saint Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Yep It gave them longer to try and find a buyer for the club. Not a PC opinion on here I know. But a slight chance of survival vs certain death? Guess we won't find out if it was the right decision for another 23 days Have to agree with you there Phil.
Pancake Posted 3 April, 2009 Author Posted 3 April, 2009 Are the players paid by SFC Ltd or by SLH PLC?
SaintDonkey Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Is it better for the club to open season ticket sales sooner so that it can have the cash injection now, or is it better for them so hold off until after a rescue package when the debt has been restructured in some way (or indeed written off)? Like most fans I want to do what I can to help the club - and that will include buying a season ticket for next season even though I won't be able to go to many games. However I don't want any money that I or any one else puts into the club to just be hoovered up by Barclays.
saintalan Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 I think Dubai Phil's idea was that we could pledge/pay our money in to some form of holding a/c that would commit to purchasing tickets to a proespective bidder. If there is a buyer the ST are bought if not money is returned. Apologies Phil if you did not mean this but still it might be a way forward in conjunction with Derry's initiative on ownership. Alan
Ken Tone Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 After admin, are we debt free? Have Lowe and Wilde actually gone from the FC now? Why do i keep reading Ken Bates being mentioned? Tripe? Have tried reading through the 10pages but failed miserably to get and good answers.... 1. No. Administrator's job is to do the best for the creditors. Often that means some of the debt is wiped off by agreement so that the credoitors get at least something, but all is up for negotiation, and creditors can get nasty and insist on getting as much money as they legally can, regardless of what that means for the business. In our case we need to keep Aviva as mortgage holders and Barclays as overdraft holders happy somehow. 2. Yes, but there's nothing to stop them buying back in if they want to and manage to convince the administrator that will give the creditors the best deal, which is why ..... 3. Bates is mentioned because that's what he did at Leeds, and someone claims to have seen him around with Lowe as if advising ... yet another ITK rumour. Clear enough? K.
solentstars Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Are you even allowed to sell season tickets for a club that might not be there?? Would people buy them? It's dodgy ground as I don't see anyway we'll be in League 1. IMO it's stay up in the CCC or we'll be out the football league. i agree and to think we had all those people who thought admin was the answer to all our problems,its gonna be hard to find a buyer in the current climate where even the rich are being hit.
SaintRichmond Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Lowe only got back into power courtesy of Michael Wilde Michael Wilde MUST have been sold a good story by Lowe, otherwise he would not have switched allegiance. They were/are therefore BOTH expecting to make some sort of killing ( a Business killing) So, now that they have both "Left The Building", what happens now I just do not believe that the timing of Leisure Holdings crying broke was just a few days after the cut off date for the Football League To go to the wall for a (comparitively) small circa £150K, seems daft .... we have we lasted most of the season, and unless I'm wrong, I seem to remember being told that we were OK for ALL of this season To my mind, Michael Wilde seems to be the one to lose the most, as he paid a decent whack for his shares ............ on that basis alone, why has he not jumped off the roof yet ........... Lowe & Wilde have not left ..... they are just having a breather, IMHO
Pancake Posted 3 April, 2009 Author Posted 3 April, 2009 Does anyone know how many shares existed in SLH?
JustMike Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Yes he was but it was a rumour and nothing more came of it - just another tyre kicker I think. Worked for Banque de Luxembourg- Investment Bankers and was a players agent; works as a property broker and a law firm in London have heard whispers that he is sniffing around again, as part of a consortium
solentstars Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Lowe only got back into power courtesy of Michael Wilde Michael Wilde MUST have been sold a good story by Lowe, otherwise he would not have switched allegiance. They were/are therefore BOTH expecting to make some sort of killing ( a Business killing) So, now that they have both "Left The Building", what happens now I just do not believe that the timing of Leisure Holdings crying broke was just a few days after the cut off date for the Football League To go to the wall for a (comparitively) small circa £150K, seems daft .... we have we lasted most of the season, and unless I'm wrong, I seem to remember being told that we were OK for ALL of this season To my mind, Michael Wilde seems to be the one to lose the most, as he paid a decent whack for his shares ............ on that basis alone, why has he not jumped off the roof yet ........... Lowe & Wilde have not left ..... they are just having a breather, IMHO rubbish they could see from the company accounts we were heading for disaster last season gambling on promotion and tried to put it right on the money side,
derry Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Does anyone know how many shares existed in SLH? Close to 28.1m. The new director of the football club is Kenneth Toynton, does any body know his background. Only him and Jones on the football club board at the moment.
COMEONYOUREDS Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Does anyone know how many shares existed in SLH? about 28 million. http://www.londonstockexchange.com/LSECWS/IFSPages/MarketNewsPopup.aspx?id=2128017&source=RNS In accordance with Rule 2.10 of the City Code on Takeovers and Mergers, SLH confirms that it currently has in issue 28,090,896 ordinary shares of 5p each, (no shares are held in treasury) and admitted to trading on AIM, a market operated by the London Stock Exchange to be precise
Pancake Posted 3 April, 2009 Author Posted 3 April, 2009 Close to 28.1m. The new director of the football club is Kenneth Toynton, does any body know his background. Only him and Jones on the football club board at the moment. http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=11783
SaintBobby Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Does anyone know how many shares existed in SLH? and are they now all totally worthless? Save Southampton Football Club: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=76035014328&ref=mf
Pancake Posted 3 April, 2009 Author Posted 3 April, 2009 about 28 million. http://www.londonstockexchange.com/LSECWS/IFSPages/MarketNewsPopup.aspx?id=2128017&source=RNS In accordance with Rule 2.10 of the City Code on Takeovers and Mergers, SLH confirms that it currently has in issue 28,090,896 ordinary shares of 5p each, (no shares are held in treasury) and admitted to trading on AIM, a market operated by the London Stock Exchange to be precise So what we need is for every single share holder to cough up £1 for each share they own...
Smirking_Saint Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 Hmmm, seeing as each share is now worth 5p ?? Thats a bit of a loss. But i am sure lowe and wilde will do it for the club.............:smt017
the wedge Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 The Daily Mail has published a view from Barnsley and Luton hierarchies, apologies if this has already been posted somewhere... 'The fact they may not be docked points is unlikely to sit well with the other teams in the relegation scrap, while the League's bottom club Luton - themselves deducted 30 points relating to their own fall into administration - have been quick to voice their disapproval. "This makes a mockery of the Football League's attempt to uphold the integrity of the competition," said their managing director Gary Sweet. "If this sails through I see no reason why any football club should not set up a holding company that carries the entire debt of the club which is periodically put into administration in order to cleanse debt while attracting no sanctions." Barnsley, only four points above Saints and one above the drop zone, were also predictably unimpressed. Director Don Rowing told PA Sport: "When clubs in any division start a season, they hope to retain their status by their performance on the field. "However, there are regulations that we all have to adhere to and Southampton were aware, as all other clubs are, that should they go into administration, they would face a points deduction. "The fact that they have not done is because they have found a loophole which gives them an advantage over their competitors in the Championship and goes against the spirit of the competition." '
Weston Saint Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 A view from an old friend Saintlee http://plasticsaints.myfreeforum.org/about8549.html
up and away Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 A view from an old friend Saintlee http://plasticsaints.myfreeforum.org/about8549.html A very good and balanced article overall, worth printing out in full. One small point would be, But this never needed to be the disaster it eventually became. We never invested in our best opportunity to jump straight back out of the trap door and instead chose to “cut our cloth accordingly” Chants from the Northam of “You’ll never play here again” and “we’re only here for a season” would soon come back to haunt us… I feel we ploughed everything into supporting Redknapp and as such paid the price for the that the following season, whilst trying to adjust to the CCC and sorting the finances. You can argue either way whether extending ourselves under Redknapp whilst still in the Premier was correct, or saving it all for the following season in the CCC? I still feel Redknapp let us down badly and should have got out of the mess with the lowest points total on record required.
John D Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 From the Evening Standard - including quotes from Lowe Barclays is at the centre of an embarrassing row today as the bank, sponsor of the English Premiership, was accused of "sentencing to death" Southampton Football Club. Championship side Southampton, one of the few clubs listed on the stock market, saw parent company Southampton Leisure fall into administration yesterday. Its shares had been suspended a day earlier after it admitted it was unable to get its half-year accounts signed off by its auditors by the 31 March deadline. Southampton's financial crisis has been an open secret in football circles for months, but chairman Rupert Lowe today launched an extraordinary attack blaming the club's troubles on its bankers Barclays. Lowe - who is also chairman of broker WH Ireland, recently embroiled in controversy over the takeover of a rival - said: "This a bizarre situation and should have been avoided. I am frankly amazed that Barclays have done what they have done." He accused the bank of effectively foreclosing on a £4 million overdraft facility with the club. "I don't consider £4 million to be a very substantial figure in terms of salaries paid to people like Bob Diamond," he said, referring to the head of Barclays Capital who has for years routinely been paid more than £20 million a year. Lowe claimed Barclays had agreed to relax overdraft arrangements to enable Southampton to pay its player wages of £1 million a month, but then bounced three cheques. Barclays said it was making "ongoing efforts to find a suitable solution" but the club required "substantial further investment". Southampton, currently in the Championship relegation zone, has had a roller-coaster ride in the past two years. It had been hoped the sales of Theo Walcott to Arsenal and Gareth Bale to Tottenham Hotspur would stabilise the club financially. But debts are now reckoned to have topped £30 million, and a string of suitors offering to bail out and buy the club were rebuffed by the board.
Ivan Katalinic's 'tache Posted 3 April, 2009 Posted 3 April, 2009 a string of suitors offering to bail out and buy the club were rebuffed by the board. This part can't be true, surely? If it is, then it doesn't matter whether Lowe throws his toys out of the pram at Barclays, this whole episode could have been avoidable.
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