Communication between JP and RL

[alpine_saint]

Is there a problem ?

 

We had Saturday's comments about Davies and Sunday's hasty "clarification"

 

Now there seems to be confusion about Surman's wanted-or-not status.

 

Has JP got the full picture, or is situation very fluid and he is not being kept in the loop as well as he should be ?

 

Knowing our chairman as we do, I am somewhat surprised JPs comments to the press are not going over his desk first.

[JohnnyFartPants]

I think Rupert's knee has popped.

[paris]

You've got too much time on your hands .....

[JustMike]

You've got too much time on your hands .....

 

but he does have a point

[alpine_saint]

but he does have a point

 

I reckon I have every time the usual suspects respond to a point about the club with personal abuse...

[itchen]

There seem to be two conflicting paranoias going on now.

 

a) JP is Ruperts yes man and Rupert is in charge.

 

b) JP isn't communicating with Rupert and doesn't know what's going on.

 

 

I'd say a) is certainly true - well the bit about Rupert being in charge anyway. Like any other club - even Chelsea's manager can only move with the consent of slippery Pete Kenyon and Abramovich. And Jan was Rupert's preferred appointment despite the wide support for keeping Pearson so I doubt b) is true. They both know the score (2-1 generally) and realise that anyone is for sale if the right offer comes in. 'Twas ever thus.

[alpine_saint]

There seem to be two conflicting paranoias going on now.

 

a) JP is Ruperts yes man and Rupert is in charge.

 

b) JP isn't communicating with Rupert and doesn't know what's going on.

 

In reality, JP is Rupert's choice, no doubt they speak a lot and anyone listening to JP realises he fully understands the situation. He might say we don't have to sell any more of the first team squad, but as with any club in the league, and many in the premiership, if a good offer comes in, it'll be considered. If someone offers 3m for Surman he'll be gone.

 

Rupert can't control what JP says in an interview, but I don't think he's said anything that would annoy him anyway. I don't know why there's anything to read into the davies situation anyway. He never played under JP, he knew he'd likely leave, we knew there'd be sales, he wanted to leave, he left. Shame, but there we go. This suggests to me we're poor and reducing wages, rather than any problems with the chairman and his manager. Jan IMO is a refreshing change primarily because he never moans about anything, he just wants to get on with it and do the best he can, getting the very best out of whatever resources remains at the club. He's the anti-Burley, if you will.

 

But surely the plan was to get rid of the likes of Skacel, and keep the likes of Surman, and although JP may be accepting of the situation, how is he supposed to react when he sees the real (not planned) transfer activity and starts to doubt the viability of the original plans for the team ?

 

If say, Skacel doesnt go and Surman has to so that the bank plan is compensated, he doesnt get to play Surman because he's gone OR Skacel because he's not interested and MIGHT get sold too.

 

It's a mess. Feel sorry for JP, because the goalposts have clearly moved already.

[saintkiptanui]

What is the point of you Alpine?? Another rubbish thread trying to find problems.

[alpine_saint]

So, every thread should just be 50 repetions of variations of "COYR" and "We will walk this league", should it ?

[Master Bates]

So, every thread should just be 50 repetions of variations of "COYR" and "We will walk this league", should it ?

 

Now you've got it

[OldNick]

So, every thread should just be 50 repetions of variations of "COYR" and "We will walk this league", should it ?

No but you try to make divisions when there are patently not any.

As LC and now RL have assured the bank,if a fair offer omes in the player must go.

Nothing is sacred in the current situation, until you accept the fact you are either going to get abuse from people who face up to the facts or you will get high blood pressure working yourself up.

[itchen]

So, every thread should just be 50 repetions of variations of "COYR" and "We will walk this league", should it ?

 

No. But does every thread have to be "what way can I find now to criticise the club, Rupert Lowe, George Burley, JP, the stewards, the ticket office...?"

[benjii]

This is really rather banal.

[Wopper]

Looks like JP is being encouraged to spout bullsh*t to the fans.

[Red and White Army]

Another alwine thread full of pointless and non-disprovable supposition.

[Legod Second Coming]

Man who speaks English as second language makes blunder shocker... (and that's just Alpine)...

[CB Fry]

But surely the plan was to get rid of the likes of Skacel, and keep the likes of Surman, and although JP may be accepting of the situation, how is he supposed to react when he sees the real (not planned) transfer activity and starts to doubt the viability of the original plans for the team ?

 

If say, Skacel doesnt go and Surman has to so that the bank plan is compensated, he doesnt get to play Surman because he's gone OR Skacel because he's not interested and MIGHT get sold too.

 

It's a mess. Feel sorry for JP, because the goalposts have clearly moved already.

 

 

Obviously that was the plan. Stated by all involved, and understood by anyone with half a brain.

 

However, no-one wants Skacel because he is on far too much of a cushy number here so his current contract is pricing himself out of a move. We. can't. seem. to. shift. him.

 

If someone comes in with £3m for Surman then he'll go. It doesn't mean "selling Surman was in the plan all along and evil evil Rupert didn't tell us" it just means we can't afford to turn down £3m for a player.

 

It's exactly the same as when Leeds said they needed to sell players, and Leeds fans happily predicted that Michael Duberry and Seth Johnson would be flogged off to balance the books. Happy days.

 

But no-one wanted Duberry and Seth Johnson. They wanted Rio Ferdinand and Woodgate and that's who got sold. It's the same priciple here.

 

The fact we want rid doesn't mean other clubs are obliged to pick up our overpaid wasters. (The same overpaid wasters you were slating day in day out last season, only to become your all time favourite ever players once it looks Lowe was going to sell them)

 

 

Once again, this is primary school football business basics that you misunderstand for (no great) effect Alpine.

 

Just more of your usual garbage.

[alpine_saint]

Obviously that was the plan. Stated by all involved, and understood by anyone with half a brain.

 

However, no-one wants Skacel because he is on far too much of a cushy number here so his current contract is pricing himself out of a move. We. can't. seem. to. shift. him.

 

If someone comes in with £3m for Surman then he'll go. It doesn't mean "selling Surman was in the plan all along and evil evil Rupert didn't tell us" it just means we can't afford to turn down £3m for a player.

 

It's exactly the same as when Leeds said they needed to sell players, and Leeds fans happily predicted that Michael Duberry and Seth Johnson would be flogged off to balance the books. Happy days.

 

But no-one wanted Duberry and Seth Johnson. They wanted Rio Ferdinand and Woodgate and that's who got sold. It's the same priciple here.

 

The fact we want rid doesn't mean other clubs are obliged to pick up our overpaid wasters. (The same overpaid wasters you were slating day in day out last season, only to become your all time favourite ever players once it looks Lowe was going to sell them)

 

 

Once again, this is primary school football business basics that you misunderstand for (no great) effect Alpine.

 

Just more of your usual garbage.

 

 

Why dont you put aside all of your abuse, sneering, sarcasm and petty playground points-scoring and ask yourself the question as to whether the change in plans regarding transfers affects not only the task JP feels he has ahead, but also JPs ability to do the job he thought he was brought here to do ?

 

Or have you already forgotten that Burley gave up on his responsibilites for similar reasons ???

 

It's not hard to discuss things sensibly, you know...

[Legod Second Coming]

Is there a football manager in the world who is in control of his selection policy?

 

What if Surman had fallen into a hole?

 

Player availability is the reason managers exist and have to have a squad at their disposal.

 

Losing good players is never easy but they can be unavailable for all manner of reasons.

 

And Alpine there is no 'change of plan' over transfers.

 

What part of Rupert explaining to you that the bank now decides our team do you not comprehend?

 

EVERY player in our squad is for sale.

[Verbal Kint]

No but you try to make divisions when there are patently not any.

As LC and now RL have assured the bank,if a fair offer omes in the player must go.

Nothing is sacred in the current situation, until you accept the fact you are either going to get abuse from people who face up to the facts or you will get high blood pressure working yourself up.

 

Why should people just accept it? If that is the plan then it is fundamentally flawed. This company is in trouble because it's product is not good enough, and as a result the revenue from customers has fallen drastically. The solution is therefore not to weaken the product but to improve it, do what you can to get customer revenue up and that means getting this club back to the premiership. We won't get there selling our best players. By all means get rid of the deadwood, but selling our best players gets us nowhere, except backwards, with less money coming in and therefore greater financial problems.

 

Shame on Rupert Lowe if he doesn't have the business acumen and ability to convince the bank of this. There was someone in place before Rupe's came in who was able to persuade the bank of this.

 

Rupert Lowe is a moron.

[alpine_saint]

Is there a football manager in the world who is in control of his selection policy?

 

What if Surman had fallen into a hole?

 

Player availability is the reason managers exist and have to have a squad at their disposal.

 

Losing good players is never easy but they can be unavailable for all manner of reasons.

 

And Alpine there is no 'change of plan' over transfers.

 

What part of Rupert explaining to you that the bank now decides our team do you not comprehend?

 

EVERY player in our squad is for sale.

 

Fines, so let's fire JP and RL, and put the bloke in charge of special accounts at Barclays in charge of team selection, and save the club an even bigger fortune, if its such a clear-cut issue.

[Baj]

NOTE TO ALL

We (the admins) are getting tired of the same old boring fights between the same members, particularly tired of receiving a dozen "Reported Post" alerts a day from the same old people about the same posters. (you know who you are).

 

This thread is a case in point. We received 2 reports from people accusing Alpine of "trolling" and referring to his first post in this thread. Could you please read his first post again and I'm sure you'll agree there's nothing wrong. Theres nothing wrong with what Alpine has posted but as usual this thread decends into a slanging match.

 

Can you all at least try to stay civilised in your posts to each other, and if you have something more direct to say, use the PM system

[Torres]

Why dont you put aside all of your abuse, sneering, sarcasm and petty playground points-scoring and ask yourself the question as to whether the change in plans regarding transfers affects not only the task JP feels he has ahead, but also JPs ability to do the job he thought he was brought here to do ?

 

Or have you already forgotten that Burley gave up on his responsibilites for similar reasons ???

 

It's not hard to discuss things sensibly, you know...

 

Trouble is Alpine, he hit the nail fairly and squarely on the head. The reality of the situation is that we have to sell players because we're broke and sadly we can't pick and chose those who we sell.

 

JP was undoubtedly aware of the situation before he came here as are most of us - although apparently not you, for some unexplained reason...

[alpine_saint]

Why should people just accept it? If that is the plan then it is fundamentally flawed. This company is in trouble because it's product is not good enough, and as a result the revenue from customers has fallen drastically. The solution is therefore not to weaken the product but to improve it, do what you can to get customer revenue up and that means getting this club back to the premiership. We won't get there selling our best players. By all means get rid of the deadwood, but selling our best players gets us nowhere, except backwards, with less money coming in and therefore greater financial problems.

 

Shame on Rupert Lowe if he doesn't have the business acumen and ability to convince the bank of this. There was someone in place before Rupe's came in who was able to persuade the bank of this.

 

Rupert Lowe is a moron.

 

Agree completely.

 

The very people who sneer "what dont you get about the situation ?" seem to be having massive problems understanding this. Proabably because most of them would go to matches still even if Lowe had smear dog poo all over their seat and put out 11 toddlers on the pitch, all in the cause of proving what hard-core fans they are..

[alpine_saint]

NOTE TO ALL

We (the admins) are getting tired of the same old boring fights between the same members, particularly tired of receiving a dozen "Reported Post" alerts a day from the same old people about the same posters. (you know who you are).

 

This thread is a case in point. We received 2 reports from people accusing Alpine of "trolling" and referring to his first post in this thread. Could you please read his first post again and I'm sure you'll agree there's nothing wrong. Theres nothing wrong with what Alpine has posted but as usual this thread decends into a slanging match.

 

Can you all at least try to stay civilised in your posts to each other, and if you have something more direct to say, use the PM system

 

Thankyou, Baj.

[Scummer]

Thankyou, Baj.

 

Agreed. I'd be the first to say that Alpine has come out with some right rubbish in the past, but people are just jumping on his back for no reason nowadays.

 

Yes he's still being a bit negative, but nothing Alpine is saying is that ridiculous, and it certainly doesn't warrant the abuse he's getting.

[Legod Second Coming]

Agreed. I'd be the first to say that Alpine has come out with some right rubbish in the past, but people are just jumping on his back for no reason nowadays.

 

Yes he's still being a bit negative, but nothing Alpine is saying is that ridiculous, and it certainly doesn't warrant the abuse he's getting.

 

Give him time....

[John B]

agreed. I'd be the first to say that alpine has come out with some right rubbish in the past, but people are just jumping on his back for no reason nowadays.

 

Yes he's still being a bit negative, but nothing alpine is saying is that ridiculous, and it certainly doesn't warrant the abuse he's getting.

 

oh dear

Edited 22 August, 2008 by John B

[ottery st mary]

I am led to believe that due to the cut backs all form of telecommunications at Saints has now ceased and all parties have been given flags.

RL from his Boy Scouts has had no problem but JP is still trying to get to grips with this semaphore thing.

[dubai_phil]

I'll take issue with Alpine on his opinion re communication about "the squad" simply based on my analysis of things that were said right at the beginning of the appointment and my own business experience.

 

First of all, JP himself stated his desire in an early interview to have a basic first team squad of 24 players. "The most you could hope to keep motivated" and then to have cover from the likes of the reserves/better youth players. (Wish I could find it BTW)

 

Secondly, from my gut feeling, I am willing to actually believe that when RL & JP originally spoke at no time would it have been about the "players" but spoke more in terms of "budgets"

 

The meetings with the Bank were held very early on, and a Bank Manager really doesn't care if Skacel may one day have more than two good games in a row. He only wants to know what the BUDGET is for the football side in the same way as the planned income and non-football budgets.

 

IF you take the basic concept that JP was told his budget then the whole decision making and comments from SMS lose much of the conspiracy theory. The budget is x then JP would know on day one how much OVER budget he was and what he would have to do to bring it into target. He knows full well what keeping the likes of Euell et al means and he then has an understanding of the impact when players actually CHOOSE to leave.

 

My only bug with most of the "same" arguments is that 1) 90% of them assume that the people at the club have no common sense or brains and 2) they are actually about the same thing.

 

It then comes down to whether personally you believe that RL or JP have an IQ of 10 or 110 as to how you reply on posts or view what goes on.

 

We are ALL very worried by the mess we are in and the squad we have. We all agree there is not much else that can be done until "outside influences" come in to play. BUT at the same time, we are all actually excited by having the players wanting to play for us. That is not (as Alp's sometimes indicates) because we have lost our collective marbles, more that we are in a state of SHOCK to finally see players WANTING to play for us.

[up and away]

Originally Posted by alpine_saint

Thankyou, Baj.

Agreed. I'd be the first to say that Alpine has come out with some right rubbish in the past, but people are just jumping on his back for no reason nowadays.

 

Yes he's still being a bit negative, but nothing Alpine is saying is that ridiculous, and it certainly doesn't warrant the abuse he's getting.

 

Well you must be working on the principle that limited intelligence is an excuse for short comings.

 

A very clear situation where all our high earning players are known to be for sale. Failure to obtain fees or move on those players means that becomes extended to other players we don't wish to sell. JP has stated several times he understands the conditions imposed upon him by our financial position, so where exactly is the misunderstanding?

[Bourno]

Everyone has their right to an opinion, some will agree and some will disagree (debate). If you don't like the subject, move on to another thread, don't criticise the poster for posting the subject.

[notnowcato]

Is there a problem ?

 

We had Saturday's comments about Davies and Sunday's hasty "clarification"

 

Now there seems to be confusion about Surman's wanted-or-not status.

 

Has JP got the full picture, or is situation very fluid and he is not being kept in the loop as well as he should be ?

 

Knowing our chairman as we do, I am somewhat surprised JPs comments to the press are not going over his desk first.

 

Of course both Rupes and Jan would prefer to keep Surman, unfortunately the window is closing rapidly and the bank manager is drumming his fingers on his desk.

 

In my opinion there is no communication issue here.

 

It's all spin spin, sugar.

[Long Shot]

I don't suppose Nigel Pearson would have sat back and let the rug be pulled from under him quite as willingly as JP appears to have done. There has to be a bit of mutual respect in a Chairman/manager relationship but here, right now I am afraid we have a PLC Chairman doing whatever he pleases. Now some might say that is what we need right now because of our financial situation, and I accept that to a point, but eventaully JP is going to have to say to Rupert "enough is enough, do you want to see this side go down" or words to that effect.

[St_Tel49]

I don't suppose Nigel Pearson would have sat back and let the rug be pulled from under him quite as willingly as JP appears to have done. There has to be a bit of mutual respect in a Chairman/manager relationship but here, right now I am afraid we have a PLC Chairman doing whatever he pleases. Now some might say that is what we need right now because of our financial situation, and I accept that to a point, but eventaully JP is going to have to say to Rupert "enough is enough, do you want to see this side go down" or words to that effect.

 

What do you suppose he would have done?

[itchen]

What do you suppose he would have done?

 

I expect he'd have waved his arms and shouted.

[gjphilsaint]

Everyone has their right to an opinion, some will agree and some will disagree (debate). If you don't like the subject, move on to another thread, don't criticise the poster for posting the subject.

 

Yes! This should be a disclaimer put at the start of every thread. I am fed up with people continually going off the point and slagging others off!!

[Thedelldays]

indeed...no matter what alpine puts...valid point or not, he will get stick...and for what? being right about burley before most woke up to his ineptness???

[Chez]

But surely the plan was to get rid of the likes of Skacel, and keep the likes of Surman,

It's a mess. Feel sorry for JP, because the goalposts have clearly moved already.

 

that was the plan, but sadly no one thinks Skacel is worth what we pay him (and they'd be spot there) so what choice does the club now have other than to listen to offers for the likes of Davis and Surman?

 

The decision to place players like Skacel out in the cold (on the off chance we might find a club stupid enough to take them off our hands) was a very dubious one IMO and I don't think it takes too many guesses to know who came up with that plan.

[Micky]

Rarely do I leap to the defence of AS and his somewhat negative opinions - and I'm not about to start now. (I'll take the points Baj..!)

 

However, if you actually read the post all AS has done is pose two questions based on his interpretation of certain situations - no more no less.

 

He has not actually given his own opinion - simply asked for other peoples thoughts on the the questions that he raised, therefore stimulating debate and discussion about relevant issues.

 

I have crossed swords with him before, I will again no doubt - but I see little to berate him for over this thread. (Supporting AS - I need to lie down..!!)

 

For my own part - I'm in agreement with Phil - I think that at the start of the RL JP negotiations the 'bottom line' would have been clearly discussed. Budget, stick to it, get on with the job - difficult I know - but we are in difficult times

[notnowcato]

indeed...no matter what alpine puts...valid point or not, he will get stick...and for what? being right about burley before most woke up to his ineptness???

 

Oh dear... go on, stoke the fire.

 

Move on.

[Charlie Wayman]

I blame it all on the post-war baby boomers who didn't bring up their kids properly. Had they done so we might have been spared much of the tosh that gets bantered about on here.

[Long Shot]

What do you suppose he would have done?

 

If the Chairman had gone behind his back and sold players he was not aware of - resigned.

Not saying that is what Lowe has done but it is clear that there is a big gap between what JP wants to happen and what actually does happen. Sooner or later he will feel hacked off I should imagine.

Edited 22 August, 2008 by Long Shot
spelling

[Verbal Kint]

Agree completely.

 

The very people who sneer "what dont you get about the situation ?" seem to be having massive problems understanding this. Proabably because most of them would go to matches still even if Lowe had smear dog poo all over their seat and put out 11 toddlers on the pitch, all in the cause of proving what hard-core fans they are..

 

Fair play to the hardcore fans, a lot of which post on here, who will support the club through thick and thin. Unfortunately, a huge section of fans will not go if the team continues to lose its best players. There HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. To say "every player will be sold if a suitable bid comes in" is utterly ludicrous. It's bad for the team, and ultimately it's bad for the company.

 

Then again, I shouldn't expect anything other than this from a man who has shown in the last five years he is a complete imbecile when it comes to business. Anyone who thinks we are better off with him than the previous regime is seriously deluded

[Long Shot]

Fair play to the hardcore fans, a lot of which post on here, who will support the club through thick and thin. Unfortunately, a huge section of fans will not go if the team continues to lose its best players. There HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. To say "every player will be sold if a suitable bid comes in" is utterly ludicrous. It's bad for the team, and ultimately it's bad for the company.

 

Then again, I shouldn't expect anything other than this from a man who has shown in the last five years he is a complete imbecile when it comes to business. Anyone who thinks we are better off with him than the previous regime is seriously deluded

 

Takes a brave man to say that on here

[Legod Second Coming]

Fair play to the hardcore fans, a lot of which post on here, who will support the club through thick and thin. Unfortunately, a huge section of fans will not go if the team continues to lose its best players. There HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. To say "every player will be sold if a suitable bid comes in" is utterly ludicrous. It's bad for the team, and ultimately it's bad for the company.

 

Then again, I shouldn't expect anything other than this from a man who has shown in the last five years he is a complete imbecile when it comes to business. Anyone who thinks we are better off with him than the previous regime is seriously deluded

 

But this is to completely disregard the modern economics of football with or without Rupert Lowe.

 

There are now perhaps three clubs in the world who can genuinely say that their players are not for sale.

 

And even then, it is those players who dictate whether they do or do not stay at the club.

 

People on here are acting as if Lowe WANTS to sell Surman and wanted to sell Davies???

 

Where is the evidence of that?

 

The reality is more likely that he would have wanted to keep both! As they are young and fit the style and pattern he wishes to create.

 

WHY we are in this financial position is now irrelevant.

 

We are in it.

 

And as a result EVERY player is for sale. EVERY PLAYER.

 

What is so complex to understand.

 

Look at it this way. You love your old Persian Rug. Adore it.

 

But the choice is feed your kids or keep the rug...

 

It's a frigging no-brainer.

[paris]

Alpine had a personel vendetta gainst Burley fact....

indeed...no matter what alpine puts...valid point or not, he will get stick...and for what? being right about burley before most woke up to his ineptness???

[aintforever]

But this is to completely disregard the modern economics of football with or without Rupert Lowe.

 

There are now perhaps three clubs in the world who can genuinely say that their players are not for sale.

 

And even then, it is those players who dictate whether they do or do not stay at the club.

 

People on here are acting as if Lowe WANTS to sell Surman and wanted to sell Davies???

 

Where is the evidence of that?

 

The reality is more likely that he would have wanted to keep both! As they are young and fit the style and pattern he wishes to create.

 

WHY we are in this financial position is now irrelevant.

 

We are in it.

 

And as a result EVERY player is for sale. EVERY PLAYER.

 

What is so complex to understand.

 

Look at it this way. You love your old Persian Rug. Adore it.

 

But the choice is feed your kids or keep the rug...

 

It's a frigging no-brainer.

 

But there still HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. We obviously have to cut our cloth but there will be a point where it becomes a false economy to sell a player if it means inevitable relegation because the amount lost by going down would be far more than that gained by selling.

 

The question is do we trust Lowe to get the balancing act right?

[John B]

But there still HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. We obviously have to cut our cloth but there will be a point where it becomes a false economy to sell a player if it means inevitable relegation because the amount lost by going down would be far more than that gained by selling.

 

The question is do we trust Lowe to get the balancing act right?

 

I have no complaints at the moment

 

Got rid of

 

Safri Licka Powell Wright Ostlund Viafara no problem replaced with

 

Wooton, Mogan Sch, Perry, Holmes, James and Gillett

 

Loaned Saga Rasiak No Problem looking for one replacement striker

 

Sold Davies slight problem but replaced by Jack Cork who maybe better

Edited 22 August, 2008 by John B

[Legod Second Coming]

But there still HAS to be a balance between cutting costs and maintaining a competitive side. We obviously have to cut our cloth but there will be a point where it becomes a false economy to sell a player if it means inevitable relegation because the amount lost by going down would be far more than that gained by selling.

 

The question is do we trust Lowe to get the balancing act right?

 

Again, you MISS the point.

 

EVERY PLAYER is for sale.

 

We have NO CHOICE.

 

If we cannot sell the players we want to, we sell the players we HAVE to.

 

I don't like it. You don't like. But it's a commercial reality. Look at Ford. Do you think they wanted to sell Jaguar/Land Rover and Aston?? No. Why did they sell them. To stay afloat!!!

 

This is not a football discussion, this is basic economics.

 

Our only hope is that the management team (including Lowe) can find cheaper players who are as good, if not better than those we are having to sell. It's a fecking tough ask but not impossible.

 

I HATE it. Ask CB Fry, I would blow my last dollar on good players.

 

But there is aboslutely no guarantee that the players we are now being forced to sell would necessarily ensure our Championship status. For a start, all the players we have thus far sold were only good enough to avoid relegation by the inability of Coventry and Leicester to score...