Global Warming?

[hamster]

My Arse

[St Landrew]

Oh dear, do you really not understand the process mate..? If you've heard of the Earth Energy Budget, and looked at other parts of the world, you'll notice, for example, that Australia is suffering record temperatures, once again.

 

Now if there is no global warming, then the EEB should be roughly the same year on year. Sadly, it's generally increasing, which means warmer global temperatures year upon year. And with this comes more extreme swings in temperature and weather patterns too. Hence our cold snap.

 

There's little escape from this. People can arse about all they like, but the truth is, unless we change our ways, or technology comes to the rescue [don't bank on it] life will get bloody uncomfortable for the global population. Maybe in our lifetime, almost certainly in our kid's lifetime. It's so serious, I can't even joke about it.

[Patrick Bateman]

Yes the point is about "global warming" is that it does NOT matter.

 

The Earth has been changing for tens of millions of years, different species have "ruled" the Earth and have been and gone. So what if the human race dies out? The Earth doesn't exclusively belong to us does it? We're just here as we've evolved with the climate and food on offer over the last 10,000 years. The Earth and other species were here a long long time before we were, and will be here a long long time after we've been here.

 

I couldn't give a stuff if the climate changes, because it will anyway in the next 10s of thousands of years, regardless of what we try to do now as humans.

 

The Earth will continue to live as long as the Sun does and there will always be a species who will "rule" it. Why does it have to be Humans for eternity more? It doesn't.

So, if we wipe out the Human, big deal. Bring on the next evolution of whatever species will cope with the warmer/colder/wetter/whatever the climate is.

[mack rill]

In view of the last few days Global Warming,(which is a misleading Fraze) has now been replaced with the fraze ( Climate change) HTH:D

[Saint George]

Oh dear, do you really not understand the process mate..? If you've heard of the Earth Energy Budget, and looked at other parts of the world, you'll notice, for example, that Australia is suffering record temperatures, once again.

 

Now if there is no global warming, then the EEB should be roughly the same year on year. Sadly, it's generally increasing, which means warmer global temperatures year upon year. And with this comes more extreme swings in temperature and weather patterns too. Hence our cold snap.

 

There's little escape from this. People can arse about all they like, but the truth is, unless we change our ways, or technology comes to the rescue [don't bank on it] life will get bloody uncomfortable for the global population. Maybe in our lifetime, almost certainly in our kid's lifetime. It's so serious, I can't even joke about it.

 

 

 

 

Dunno where you're getting your figures from, because 'Global' temperatures have been in a falling trend for the last decade.....Shame most alarmists are still to busy having screaming fits to notice.....Or are trying desperately to force fit the "inconvenient" data into their projected armagedon conclusions...Thats why its now called 'Junk Science', and more and more scientist are speaking out each week

 

heh just last week Hansens old boss rejoined the ranks of reality....even referred to Hansen as a bit of a nutter

 

And as Patrick Bateman points out...The Earth has been going through climate cycles ever since its been here......Why do some people feel it should remain constant right now?

[Franny's Tash]

 

And as Patrick Bateman points out...The Earth has been going through climate cycles ever since its been here......Why do some people feel it should remain constant right now?

They don't. They just think we might be fvcked as a species due to these changes so it might be a good idea to do something about it. And average temperatures aren't going down, that's just nonesense, whatever the cause. Still, nothing less than we've come to expect from you I guess

[Saint George]

They don't. They just think we might be fvcked as a species due to these changes so it might be a good idea to do something about it. And average temperatures aren't going down' date=' that's just nonesense, whatever the cause. Still, nothing less than we've come to expect from you I guess[/quote']

 

Nonesense?......Maybe its time for you to go check out some facts rather than just get caught up in the hysteria....Then you can come back and correct your statement.

 

And once again...If the Earth and the Sun decide its time to fry or freeze us, there aint a damned thing you or anyone else can do about it....Its not like it hasn't happened before and will definitely happen again........... The volume of miniscule 'Trace' amounts of carbon hanging around wont matter a damn.....Although a little more will go a long way to help solve the world food shortage......Thats if we can stop the loony left from using good food to burn in vehicles.

[St Landrew]

Dunno where you're getting your figures from, because 'Global' temperatures have been in a falling trend for the last decade.....Shame most alarmists are still to busy having screaming fits to notice.....Or are trying desperately to force fit the "inconvenient" data into their projected armagedon conclusions...Thats why its now called 'Junk Science', and more and more scientist are speaking out each week

 

heh just last week Hansens old boss rejoined the ranks of reality....even referred to Hansen as a bit of a nutter

 

And as Patrick Bateman points out...The Earth has been going through climate cycles ever since its been here......Why do some people feel it should remain constant right now?

 

Dunno whuch part of the earth you decide to stick your head in either, but there you go. I won't be debating with you StG, because you listen to nothing but what is comforting for you.

[Mole]

Man made Gloabal warming is a bit like christianity. 2000 years ago someone decided to make a martyr of a criminal to make money out of the masses, today the masonic illuminati have decided to do the same thing but use man made global warming as the excuse. That said the big con does have a benefit in the long run because the west will move away from oil to fuel sources we can provide thus breaking the hold the middle eastern states have over us. For centuries now the illuminati have been dictating how christendom (and therefore the world) functions and that's not about to change.

[hamster]

Oh dear, do you really not understand the process mate..? If you've heard of the Earth Energy Budget, and looked at other parts of the world, you'll notice, for example, that Australia is suffering record temperatures, once again.

 

Now if there is no global warming, then the EEB should be roughly the same year on year. Sadly, it's generally increasing, which means warmer global temperatures year upon year. And with this comes more extreme swings in temperature and weather patterns too. Hence our cold snap.

 

There's little escape from this. People can arse about all they like, but the truth is, unless we change our ways, or technology comes to the rescue [don't bank on it] life will get bloody uncomfortable for the global population. Maybe in our lifetime, almost certainly in our kid's lifetime. It's so serious, I can't even joke about it.

 

To be honest SL, those were not my first thoughts when I opened my curtains this morning. It was meant tongue in cheek.

 

However, I think that I do get the gist of the situation and have tried and tried to believe that I (as a single citizen of the/our palnet) can make a difference. Recently though, I am becoming convinced that those who actually could make the simple decisions to halt whatever it is that is going on, couldn't give a fiddlers fart. On that basis my stance has changed, only two weeks ago I ditched my own 'bottle recycling' scheme in favour of putting glass in the normal wheelie bin. I have heard numerous accounts that say that the glass goes to landfill anyway, I even e-mailed Soton CC with the question and they didn't even reply apart from a £Thank you for your e-mail£ standard acknowledgement. So, by driving it to the bottle bank, i am wasting my time, money and adding to the global warming/climate change in the process.

 

Sorry to not be very eloquent, but I hope you see where I am coming from?

[Thedelldays]

it is a fact, the UK (in forms of local governemt) lease out the space in landfill sites (thanks to people recycling more) to the EU states so they can dump their rubbish there..

 

if the government was so serious about this..they could make many points that wont effect anyone with them...just some of the packaging in the supermarkets for a start...like bananas in a bag ffs

[hamster]

There are so many examples of unnecessary packaging aren't there, some of it you cannot choose to ignore too. Frozen pizzas, stringy cheese and what about multi pack fruit corners?

 

And this recent 'trend' of taking your own carrier bags shopping, FFS.

[Barney Trubble]

Yes the point is about "global warming" is that it does NOT matter.

 

The Earth has been changing for tens of millions of years, different species have "ruled" the Earth and have been and gone. So what if the human race dies out? The Earth doesn't exclusively belong to us does it? We're just here as we've evolved with the climate and food on offer over the last 10,000 years. The Earth and other species were here a long long time before we were, and will be here a long long time after we've been here.

 

I couldn't give a stuff if the climate changes, because it will anyway in the next 10s of thousands of years, regardless of what we try to do now as humans.

 

The Earth will continue to live as long as the Sun does and there will always be a species who will "rule" it. Why does it have to be Humans for eternity more? It doesn't.

So, if we wipe out the Human, big deal. Bring on the next evolution of whatever species will cope with the warmer/colder/wetter/whatever the climate is.

 

Hit the nail right on the head there PB, an excellent post.

 

I'm sick to death of all the panic merchants thinking we're doomed unless we madly recycle everything or don't turn the TV off when we go for a ****.

 

The climate has always been volatile since the year dot and when the human race is wiped out, the next species will inherit the earth and encounter the same weather cycles.

[hamster]

Hit the nail right on the head there PB, an excellent post.

 

I'm sick to death of all the panic merchants thinking we're doomed unless we madly recycle everything or don't turn the TV off when we go for a ****.

 

In fact I would recommend people have a TV installed in they're bogs so that they don't miss anything, or get Sky+. Seriously.

[St Landrew]

To be honest SL, those were not my first thoughts when I opened my curtains this morning. It was meant tongue in cheek.

 

However, I think that I do get the gist of the situation and have tried and tried to believe that I (as a single citizen of the/our palnet) can make a difference. Recently though, I am becoming convinced that those who actually could make the simple decisions to halt whatever it is that is going on, couldn't give a fiddlers fart. On that basis my stance has changed, only two weeks ago I ditched my own 'bottle recycling' scheme in favour of putting glass in the normal wheelie bin. I have heard numerous accounts that say that the glass goes to landfill anyway, I even e-mailed Soton CC with the question and they didn't even reply apart from a £Thank you for your e-mail£ standard acknowledgement. So, by driving it to the bottle bank, i am wasting my time, money and adding to the global warming/climate change in the process.

 

Sorry to not be very eloquent, but I hope you see where I am coming from?

 

I have a lot of sympathy for your stance Hamster. I, too get really p!ssed off with local and national authorities lack lustre attempts at getting the everyday public to get their consumption and refuge in check. The first celebrity or royal who clearly shows an I-don't-give-a-sh!t attitude, or bit of fly-tipping we see, our first or second reaction is... why the hell am I trying...? The thing is, all this new responsible consumption is in its infancy. Like it or not, we are turning the Earth into a big hole in the ground, so to speak. We are running out of resources, and we cannot continue to consume the way we do. And we can't let the next generation pay the cost, because they will just have a much harder time, having grown up with the values and attitudes we are teaching them.

 

I don't even have young kids, yet I realise that when our lot [that's you and me] are old, the next generation will have enough world tasks to be getting on with, without bothering with us. Don't expect them to be grateful, that we left the mess of irresponsible consumption for them to clear up, either.

[TheCholulaKid]

it is a fact, the UK (in forms of local governemt) lease out the space in landfill sites (thanks to people recycling more) to the EU states so they can dump their rubbish there..

 

Wow, that's quite interesting. Where did you see this?

[benjii]

Yes the point is about "global warming" is that it does NOT matter.

 

The Earth has been changing for tens of millions of years, different species have "ruled" the Earth and have been and gone. So what if the human race dies out? The Earth doesn't exclusively belong to us does it? We're just here as we've evolved with the climate and food on offer over the last 10,000 years. The Earth and other species were here a long long time before we were, and will be here a long long time after we've been here.

 

I couldn't give a stuff if the climate changes, because it will anyway in the next 10s of thousands of years, regardless of what we try to do now as humans.

 

The Earth will continue to live as long as the Sun does and there will always be a species who will "rule" it. Why does it have to be Humans for eternity more? It doesn't.

So, if we wipe out the Human, big deal. Bring on the next evolution of whatever species will cope with the warmer/colder/wetter/whatever the climate is.

 

This is correct.

 

I could no more give a rats ass about humanity in 5 generations' time than I could about the dinosaurs.

[TopGun]

it is a fact, the UK (in forms of local governemt) lease out the space in landfill sites (thanks to people recycling more) to the EU states so they can dump their rubbish there..

if the government was so serious about this..they could make many points that wont effect anyone with them...just some of the packaging in the supermarkets for a start...like bananas in a bag ffs

 

Absolute poppy****. And I work in energy and environment. The Landfill Directive and various pieces of EU legislation mean that countries across the EU are reducing landfill because thay now have to pay to pollute and more stringent targets are being put in place year on year.

[Thedelldays]

Absolute poppy****. And I work in energy and environment. The Landfill Directive and various pieces of EU legislation mean that countries across the EU are reducing landfill because thay now have to pay to pollute and more stringent targets are being put in place year on year.

 

ok.

[TopGun]

ok.

 

The EU has been totally hypocritical about letting recyclers palm all their crap off on China and other developing nations however.

[Viking Warrior]

Topgun are you feeling the pinch seeing the recyling intiatives have been badly damaged by the recession and credit crunch. Seems there is still a market for landfil sites.

[Calvin]

Climate Change

[santo_michele]

The EU has been totally hypocritical about letting recyclers palm all their crap off on China and other developing nations however.

 

Us palming crap off to China? They've been doing it to us for years...

[santo_michele]

Climate Change

 

Yep, they're called seasons, and have been around since year dot...

[Mole]

This article explains the real reason for the natural climatic cycles on earth:

 

17th Century Solar Oddity Believed Linked To Global Cooling Is Rare Among Nearby Stars

 

A mysterious 17th century solar funk that some have linked to Europe's Little Ice Age and to global climate change, becomes even more of an enigma as a result of new observations by University of California, Berkeley, astronomers.

 

For 70 years, from 1645 until 1714, early astronomers reported almost no sunspot activity. The number of sunspots - cooler areas on the sun that appear dark against the brighter surroundings - dropped a thousandfold, according to some estimates. Though activity on the sun ebbs and flows today in an 11-year cycle, it has not been that quiet since.

 

Since 1976, when it was pointed out that this lengthy period of low sunspot activity, the so-called Maunder minimum, coincided with the coldest part of the Little Ice Age in Europe and North America, astronomers have been searching nearby sun-like stars for examples of stellar minima. They have hoped to determine how common such minima are and to predict the next solar minimum - and perhaps the next period of global cooling.

 

Now, data from a group of UC Berkeley astronomers cast doubt on the hundreds of stars thought to be examples of stellar minima analogous to the quiet period the sun experienced 300 years ago.

 

In a poster to be presented Monday, May 31, at the Denver meeting of the American Astronomical Society, UC Berkeley graduate student Jason Wright shows that nearly all the supposedly sun-like stars displaying minimal activity are, in fact, much brighter than and significantly different from the sun and therefore not examples of Maunder minima. The findings throw into question all studies using these stars to make inferences about the sun's own activity and future minima, Wright said.

 

"Star surveys typically find that 10 to 15 percent of all sun-like stars are in an inactive state like the Maunder minimum, which would indicate that the sun spends about 10 percent of its time in this state," Wright said. "But our study shows that the vast majority of stars identified as Maunder minimum stars are well above the main sequence, which means they're not sun-like at all, but are either evolved stars or stars rich in metals like iron and nickel. To date, we've found no star that is unambiguously a Maunder minimum star."

 

"We thought we knew how to detect Maunder minimum stars, but we don't," he said.

 

The main sequence is a region where normal, steady-burning stars cluster when plotted on a chart of color versus brightness. As stars age, however, they get redder and brighter - becoming what are called subgiant stars - and move upward off the main sequence. The sun has been on the main sequence for about 5 billion years, ever since it settled down after igniting hydrogen fusion in its core, and will remain there for another 5 billion years until it starts to swell and become a subgiant.

 

"The fact is, we still don't understand what's going on in our sun, how magnetic fields generate the 11-year solar cycle, or what caused the magnetic Maunder minimum," said Wright's advisor, Geoffrey Marcy, professor of astronomy at UC Berkeley. "In particular, we don't know how often a sun-like star falls into a Maunder minimum, or when the next minimum will occur. It could be tomorrow."

 

The drop in solar activity in the late 17th and early 18th centuries was drawn to the world's attention in 1893 by English astronomer Edward Walter Maunder, who also noted a dip during the same period in the intensity and frequency of the northern lights, which are caused by storms on the sun. Again, in 1976, astronomer John Eddy reviewed various pieces of evidence for the Maunder minimum and concluded not only that it was real, but cited a 1961 paper linking the minimum with a contemporaneous period of cooling throughout Europe, perhaps due to decreased energy output from the sun. The sun, and stars like the sun, are dimmer when inactive.

 

The idea of a Maunder minimum is controversial, however, because no one really knows how closely people were observing the sun in the mid-1600s, a mere 40 years after the invention of the telescope. No record of solar activity exists before the Maunder minimum, though a surge in activity signaled its end in 1714.

 

Uncertainty also surrounds the cause of the Little Ice Age, which began around 1300 A.D. and lasted for several hundred years. Characterized by colder than normal winters and cool summers throughout the Northern Hemisphere, it may have been caused by greenhouse gases and particulates spewed into the atmosphere by volcanoes, or by fluctuations in the sun's output.

 

Many climate experts take the Maunder minimum seriously, however, and astronomers have put together a long list of stars supposedly exhibiting the same dip in activity, as evidenced by decreased emission from the element calcium in the star's atmosphere. Solar activity is characterized by strong magnetic fields that heat the sun's upper atmosphere, or chromosphere, to some 8,000 to 10,000 degrees Kelvin, exciting calcium to emit blue light.

 

The question, Wright said, is whether the cause of decreased calcium emission is a stellar Maunder minimum or something else, like age - stars spin more slowly as they age, lose their magnetic dynamo and no longer produce magnetic fields or spots - or high metal content. "We've now found that it's not from Maunder minima," he said.

 

"What astronomers have assumed is that sun-like stars going through a stellar funk are actually very, very old stars whose magnetic fields have turned off forever. They are not in a temporary Maunder minimum, but a permanent one. They're dead," Marcy said. "The sun will be in that state in 4 billion years or so."

 

"This implies that if other stars do undergo Maunder minima of their own, then it is either a rare occurrence nearly undetected in activity surveys or it is not necessarily indicated by low calcium ... emission levels," Wright wrote. Therefore, he added, some other criterion is needed to discern those stars in a stellar downturn.

 

The problem with stars thought to be in a Maunder minimum went unnoticed because it wasn't until 1998 that the Hipparcos satellite was launched and began determining the precise distances to many nearby stars. It then became possible to calculate the absolute brightness of these stars, and to place them precisely on a color-brightness plot, known as a Hertzsprung-Russell diagram.

 

Wright decided to look systematically at Maunder minimum stars after he and Marcy noticed that many seemingly inactive nearby stars were actually brighter than main sequence stars. They have collected spectra of more than 1,000 nearby stars to look for evidence of planets.

 

In his analysis, Wright used Hipparcos data on distance to determine the absolute brightness of several thousand nearby stars surveyed not only by Marcy's California and Carnegie Planet Search Program but also by other projects, such as the Mount Wilson H-K Project and Project Phoenix. He noted that some of the stars previously identified as Maunder minimum stars may be metal-rich stars, which also burn brighter than our sun and show less activity. Further analysis of nearby stars is needed to characterize these quiet stars.

 

The findings, which have been submitted to Astrophysical Journal, resulted from work supported by Sun Microsystems, the National Aeronautics and Space Administration, and the National Science Foundation.

[Wade Garrett]

I agree with the OP.

 

Global warming my arse.

[hamster]

I was driving down the A34 on Sunday and noticed how much crap people had thrown out of they're cars at the roadside, in trees and bushes. I really do despair at some peoples selfishness but am starting to feel that resistance is futile.

 

I will never litter streets but what I really want to see from the government is a scheme whereby ALL rubbish is sorted by machine or hand and is paid for by companies who produce it. There was a report only two weeks ago about all the fast food rubbish, why the hell am I paying for it to be cleaned up!

 

Then again, the manufacturers would only add the cost to the products so you and I would pay either way.

I give up, maybe we are all as bad as each other?

[St Landrew]

I was driving down the A34 on Sunday and noticed how much crap people had thrown out of they're cars at the roadside, in trees and bushes. I really do despair at some peoples selfishness but am starting to feel that resistance is futile.

 

I will never litter streets but what I really want to see from the government is a scheme whereby ALL rubbish is sorted by machine or hand and is paid for by companies who produce it. There was a report only two weeks ago about all the fast food rubbish, why the hell am I paying for it to be cleaned up!

 

Then again, the manufacturers would only add the cost to the products so you and I would pay either way.

I give up, maybe we are all as bad as each other?

 

I know that frustration, Hamster. The fact is, we've been underpaying for our presence since the Victorians came up with the word progress, and attributed it to better living standards. I'm not knocking the Industrial Revolution in any way. The Victorians didn't know, and we wouldn't be here with our relatively high living standards if it weren't for Victorian progress. But we've never paid the full bill for being better off, and we've known the damage we've done, and do, for a long time. The fact that some people deny it is just hot air, because the argument has already been won, and governments are gearing the general populations up to start paying the bill. The fact that it p!sses you and me off is that we would like everybody else to be as responsible, as quickly as ourselves. People are people, and they move at different speeds, even if it is made law. Which it probably will have to be so eventually.

[hamster]

Would anyone vote for a 'rubbish tax' (I know that they are all rubbish already)?

A scheme whereby your bin is weighed at the kerbside would be fair IMHO, they then DEDUCT the weight of the recycling bin/s and hey presto! Could even have a cashback scheme?

I know that this would be open to abuse, but a majority I believe would be okay with it.

 

Hamster for PM.

[TopGun]

Would anyone vote for a 'rubbish tax' (I know that they are all rubbish already)?

A scheme whereby your bin is weighed at the kerbside would be fair IMHO, they then DEDUCT the weight of the recycling bin/s and hey presto! Could even have a cashback scheme?

I know that this would be open to abuse, but a majority I believe would be okay with it.

 

Hamster for PM.

 

It's a system that needs more experimenting and more political backing although it could work with the right technologies. The big concern is nasty neighbours filling up your own bin instead of theirs but there have been limited trials using simple padlocks as well as variations of RF tagging to try and get something that technically beats the potential abuse.

[TopGun]

Topgun are you feeling the pinch seeing the recyling intiatives have been badly damaged by the recession and credit crunch. Seems there is still a market for landfil sites.

 

I'm doing fine tbh as a lot of my work is with power stations and wind farms and they're doing fine because the need for new power is so great. A marginal danger exists that banks could start pulling money from projects but by and large they are seen as safe as they have political backing. Also there is plenty of R&D funding from the UK government and EU. For example, last week the EU committed €5bn to new energy projects, mainly new gas interconnectors (eg. plan to link Ireland with Wales)and expanded electricity grids (plan for North Sea grid involving UK, Scandinavia, Holland & Germany to pass wind derived power about). Carbon capture also got €1,250m for 11 EU demo projects, four of which are here in the UK - Kingsnorth, Longannet, Tilbury & Hatfield power stations. Also big growth in biomass power stations, for example Drax which owns the Drax coal fired power station in Yorkshire that is the country's biggest carbon emitter has plans to build at least two biomass power stations. I am working on one of them currently. So plenty going on.

 

Waste is suffering in some areas like recycling where unsorted plastic has dropped from £100/tonne to £50/tonne which means that more investment is required in better waste streaming facilities, so that will go on. There is also a growth in integrated waste management facilities where the stuff that can not be recycled on site will be incinerated for energy.

[Wade Garrett]

Would anyone vote for a 'rubbish tax' (I know that they are all rubbish already)?

A scheme whereby your bin is weighed at the kerbside would be fair IMHO, they then DEDUCT the weight of the recycling bin/s and hey presto! Could even have a cashback scheme?

I know that this would be open to abuse, but a majority I believe would be okay with it.

 

Hamster for PM.

 

You're dreaming if you think people would be happy to pay more tax. I certainly wouldn't. It would also open the floodgates for more fly-tipping. Ludicrous idea, totally unworkable, and one which no governing political party would ever implement.

[hamster]

You're dreaming if you think people would be happy to pay more tax. I certainly wouldn't. It would also open the floodgates for more fly-tipping. Ludicrous idea, totally unworkable, and one which no governing political party would ever implement.

Fly tipping is illegal, police it better and execute fines. Just because some people will break the law, is no reason to ignore this suggestion out of hand.

 

Am I being stupid, ignorant or naive?

[TopGun]

Fly tipping is illegal, police it better and execute fines. Just because some people will break the law, is no reason to ignore this suggestion out of hand.

 

Am I being stupid, ignorant or naive?

 

Most flytipping is fairly easy to trace because the material tends to give the source away.

[mynameisthehulk]

[Ponty]

You should've seen the V10 monster I had in 325,000 BC.

[TopGun]

 

Excellent graph Hulk. Clearly shows manmade CO2 emissions increases. No one is denying over the long term there are fluctuations but that graph shows the extreme recent rise since the industrial revolution..

[Ponty]

Excellent graph Hulk. Clearly shows manmade CO2 emissions increases. No one is denying over the long term there are fluctuations but that graph shows the extreme recent rise since the industrial revolution..

 

The temperature curve seems to peak at the same point (or thereabouts) as previously though.

[mynameisthehulk]

The temperature curve seems to peak at the same point (or thereabouts) as previously though.

 

Which was my actual point:rolleyes:

[TopGun]

The graph shows that temperature follows CO2 over time so it is fair to assume temperatures will increase over this century.

[Ponty]

The graph shows that temperature follows CO2 over time so it is fair to assume temperatures will increase over this century.

Let's hope so, it's bloody freezing this morning.

[Wade Garrett]

Fly tipping is illegal, police it better and execute fines. Just because some people will break the law, is no reason to ignore this suggestion out of hand.

 

Am I being stupid, ignorant or naive?

 

That is fair comment. FWIW I recycle as much as I can, and wouldn't dream of dropping as much as a sweet wrapper on the street. Reason for this is nothing to do with my stance on global warming, I just hate waste.

 

I am one of many, some eminent scientists included, who think global warming (sorry, they've changed it to climate change now) is just another of the Earth's natural cycles.

[sydney_saint]

It is interesting to hear all these people that believe that climate change is not occuring despite strong scientific proof (just one piece is that excellent graph from I belive An Inconvenient Truth, for those that havn't seen it I recommend it as it is the only movie I've ever been scared of). Those that say global warming is a natural progression of the planet would be absolutely correct however, this process does not generally fluctuate as high as it is currently from, i suppose equilibrium, and generally takes millions of years, not one hundred as that is currently occuring.

[badgerx16]

The problem with the graph above is that what is most relevant is the last 2-300 years, and the axis / scale is far too broad to show that. Try this page for some more definitive, and more scary, information ;

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2008/.

 

Whilst those that say the earth is going through a geological cycle are correct, and we are currently in the midst of a spate of 'ice ages', the impact of pollution and and the emissions from the use of carbon based fuels over the last 200 year is accelerating any underlying upward trend. You also need to consider how small an increase in CO2 as a percentage of the atmosphere is calculated to trigger the 'greenhouse effect'.

[Saint George]

The problem with the graph above is that what is most relevant is the last 2-300 years, and the axis / scale is far too broad to show that. Try this page for some more definitive, and more scary, information ;

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2008/.

 

Whilst those that say the earth is going through a geological cycle are correct, and we are currently in the midst of a spate of 'ice ages', the impact of pollution and and the emissions from the use of carbon based fuels over the last 200 year is accelerating any underlying upward trend. You also need to consider how small an increase in CO2 as a percentage of the atmosphere is calculated to trigger the 'greenhouse effect'.

 

 

That GISS data comes from none other than the headbanger James Hansen himself...He's been caught twice in only the last 3 months altering historic data to paint a more extreme picture....Hell, he even tried to slip Russia's September temps into the month of October in a bid to make up for the lack of warming.....Junk science at its best

 

Hansen and his GISS have been so out of order it even prompted his old boss Dr John Theon, (Hansens old Boss) to write to the US Senate warning them about what was going on within the GISS http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&ContentRecord_id=1a5e6e32-802a-23ad-40ed-ecd53cd3d320....With comments like.....

"we did not know enough to forecast climate change or mankind's effect on it). Hansen thus embarrassed NASA by coming out with his claims of global warming in 1988 in his testimony before Congress,”

 

and .......Furthermore, some scientists have manipulated the observed data to justify their model results. In doing so, they neither explain what they have modified in the observations, nor explain how they did it. They have resisted making their work transparent so that it can be replicated independently by other scientists. This is clearly contrary to how science should be done. Thus there is no rational justification for using climate model forecasts to determine public policy,”

 

Of course there'll be plenty of peeps who will just ignore Hansens wrong doings because his 'forced' results reflect their beliefs and/or agenda and will continue to 'believe' as if his department were reporting on fact......Kinda like a religion

 

Ignore Hansens work along with Al Gore and then peeps can start to have a proper debate on the subject

 

And anyone thinking Gore's Movie was based on any kind of fact needs to do some research ...That movie was nothing more than "Independence Day" type Hollywood drama dressed up as a documentary and may well end up landing him in Court......Just about every thing in there presented as fact has been disproved, debunked and discredited...But most peeps wont get to hear about that .....or even want to know

[Saint George]

They don't. They just think we might be fvcked as a species due to these changes so it might be a good idea to do something about it. And average temperatures aren't going down' date=' that's just nonesense, [/b']whatever the cause. Still, nothing less than we've come to expect from you I guess

 

So did you get a chance to check out the Global temps for the last decade?.....Its been a few days now.....At least if you can accept the facts, you may have a clearer understanding of what's really going on...

 

Starting from a basis of 'fact' rather than 'misconception' is a good foundation from which to form an opinion.....And theres nothing wrong with admitting your were hoodwinked into believing that Global temps were spiraling out of control year upon year ...Its certainly the picture the media, your Government and Councils and anyone else who wants a few bob from you are painting.

[JohnnyFartPants]

Man made Gloabal warming is a bit like christianity. 2000 years ago someone decided to make a martyr of a criminal to make money out of the masses, today the masonic illuminati have decided to do the same thing but use man made global warming as the excuse. That said the big con does have a benefit in the long run because the west will move away from oil to fuel sources we can provide thus breaking the hold the middle eastern states have over us. For centuries now the illuminati have been dictating how christendom (and therefore the world) functions and that's not about to change.

 

Christ. Take him away from football and I actually can agree with some things he says.

[Window Cleaner]

I was driving down the A34 on Sunday and noticed how much crap people had thrown out of they're cars at the roadside, in trees and bushes. I really do despair at some peoples selfishness but am starting to feel that resistance is futile.

 

I will never litter streets but what I really want to see from the government is a scheme whereby ALL rubbish is sorted by machine or hand and is paid for by companies who produce it. There was a report only two weeks ago about all the fast food rubbish, why the hell am I paying for it to be cleaned up!

 

Then again, the manufacturers would only add the cost to the products so you and I would pay either way.

I give up, maybe we are all as bad as each other?

 

 

Has not the "eco-tax", popular in mainline EU countries, reached the UK yet then.

New tyres are taxed to recycle old ones, electronic gadgetry is taxed to recycle last year's model which is now a dinosaur and worth f**k all.

You buy new light bulb, there's a tax to recycle the old one that you're going to throw in the dustbin even though you know you shouldn't do that.

You chuck a battery in the trash in Germany, a couple of months later some

inspector is going to come round and bite your ass over it. I've heard that there's a town in Germany that even tracks dog shît.DNA tests are mandatory on all dogs and they analyse the crap on the pavement.

[jawillwill]

The graph shows that temperature follows CO2 over time so it is fair to assume temperatures will increase over this century.

 

Indeed it does. But a more accurate graph might show CO2 following temperature. Explain that one...

[Saint George]

Indeed it does. But a more accurate graph might show CO2 following temperature. Explain that one...

 

AGW Alarmist's don't like to talk about possibilities like that.....Its not in their bible