Global Warming.....

[Weston Super Saint]

It was 15 degrees [celcius] today, peeing with rain and I had to wear a coat.

 

Unless someone's been messing with my calendar today is the 18th of August.

 

When does this whole global warming malarky start to work?

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

It was 15 degrees [celcius] today, peeing with rain and I had to wear a coat.

 

Unless someone's been messing with my calendar today is the 18th of August.

 

When does this whole global warming malarky start to work?

 

Didn't you follow what John Nada was saying?

 

Apparently the CIA have managed to switch the Earth's magnetic poles around and it is now officially winter in the Northern Hemisphere.

 

They plan to switch them back in November.

[mack rill]

Didn't you follow what John Nada was saying?

 

Apparently the CIA have managed to switch the Earth's magnetic poles around and it is now officially winter in the Northern Hemisphere.

 

They plan to switch them back in November.

 

Wow we gets to have two winters....Bit greedy relay:rolleyes:

[Scummer]

Why do you think they've stopped using the term global warming and replaced it with climate change?

[Weston Super Saint]

Why do you think they've stopped using the term global warming and replaced it with climate change?

 

You mean we're not going to get long hot summers?

 

I feel lied to

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

Wow we gets to have two winters....Bit greedy relay:rolleyes:

 

Not just two, they're gonna change them again next April. It's a plan to keep the Russians in deep freeze so they can't launch any more spy satellites to eavesdrop on Area 51. Or something.

[Saint Martini]

I thought the British Isles where one of the areas where temperatures were supposed to go down due to global warming or is that a urban myth?

[Weston Super Saint]

I thought the British Isles where one of the areas where temperatures were supposed to go down due to global warming or is that a urban myth?

 

It can hardly be called 'global' warming if some of the 'globe' is actually cooling can it?

[St Landrew]

Why do you think they've stopped using the term global warming and replaced it with climate change?

 

Because Climate Change is a more accurate nomemclature than Global Warming, which is being mistakenly believed to be something to do with having hotter local temperatures. However, Climate Change is inaccurate as well. Human Influenced Climate Change would be a bit better, but that's a bit of a mouthful. Climate change occurs whether mankind is on the planet or not, so we need a better name for the process we are experiencing.

 

Unfortunately, you can have Global Warming, and yet have locally cooler or unseasonal temperatures. Sorry.

 

Believe me, I'm as p!ssed off about it as the next person.

[Weston Super Saint]

Rain forecast for Monday, Tuesday Wednesday Thursday and Friday.

 

No forecast available for Saturday yet - from the BBC - but as that's the start of the bank holiday weekend, I'm not holding my breath for barbeque weather!!

[benjii]

I was quite enthusiastic about global warming.

 

I think I need to stop being so Anglo-centric.

 

I am becoming more and more enthused about emigrating somewhere with a proper summer.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Because Climate Change is a more accurate nomemclature than Global Warming, which is being mistakenly believed to be something to do with having hotter local temperatures. However, Climate Change is inaccurate as well. Human Influenced Climate Change would be a bit better, but that's a bit of a mouthful. Climate change occurs whether mankind is on the planet or not, so we need a better name for the process we are experiencing.

 

Unfortunately, you can have Global Warming, and yet have locally cooler or unseasonal temperatures. Sorry.

 

Believe me, I'm as p!ssed off about it as the next person.

 

I like your first line! Does that also mean that 'Recession' is a more apt nomenclature than 'Credit Crunch' ?

[St Landrew]

Rain forecast for Monday, Tuesday Wednesday Thursday and Friday.

 

No forecast available for Saturday yet - from the BBC - but as that's the start of the bank holiday weekend, I'm not holding my breath for barbeque weather!!

 

The rest of the summer will be a wash out as the weather patterns that should be around at this stage of the summer are simply not in place. There will be the odd day of good weather, here and there, but if anyone is looking for a good spell of hot weather, with no interruptions of rain, that they can plan something with - forget it.

 

Honestly, if there was any potential really good weather around the corner, I'd be optimistic. I'm more optimistic with Saints and their promotion prospects. Sorry, once again.

[saintkiptanui]

I started a thread a few months ago about this, we are currently in a spell of global cooling that will last for around 20 years, which I am delighted about.

[St Landrew]

I like your first line! Does that also mean that 'Recession' is a more apt nomenclature than 'Credit Crunch' ?

 

Don't know, is it..? I thought 3 months of economic reduction was recession behaviour. I understand Germany and France might be in recession, but the UK and Spanish economies are still just about growing. Credit Crunch is a buzz phrase, but it describes the hardening up of financial institutions attitudes towards giving credit and loans.

[Weston Super Saint]

Don't know, is it..? I thought 3 months of economic reduction was recession behaviour. I understand Germany and France might be in recession, but the UK and Spanish economies are still just about growing. Credit Crunch is a buzz phrase, but it describes the hardening up of financial institutions attitudes towards giving credit and loans.

 

Officially it is two full quarters of economic decline.

 

As gloomy as the bloody weather!!

Edited 18 August, 2008 by St Landrew
Edited when I should have quoted. Sorry.

[St Landrew]

I was quite enthusiastic about global warming.

 

I think I need to stop being so Anglo-centric.

 

I am becoming more and more enthused about emigrating somewhere with a proper summer.

 

Me too. My living-on-a-sailing-boat-off-the-Greek-Islands idea gets better and better.

[St Landrew]

Officially it is two full quarters of economic decline.

 

As gloomy as the bloody weather!!

 

Ah, I stand corrected. Tbh, I think the weather is a lot gloomier. I don't think next year is going to be any better based on some recent serious cross reading and what I already know about weather and climactic systems. Hope I'm wrong. Don't think so though.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Don't know, is it..? I thought 3 months of economic reduction was recession behaviour. I understand Germany and France might be in recession, but the UK and Spanish economies are still just about growing. Credit Crunch is a buzz phrase, but it describes the hardening up of financial institutions attitudes towards giving credit and loans.

 

I think that recession is the operative word. One large Auto manufacturer, with a host of plants in Europe, recently declared a total embargo on overtime working. I have not had an increase in salary for 18 months now.

 

Food seems to be rising in cost on an almost daily basis.

 

What would happen if all the supermarket chains dropped their offers and sold their food at the price on the packet (you know what I mean here)? That would bring it home pretty quickly as to how much in the mire we are!

[Saint Martini]

It can hardly be called 'global' warming if some of the 'globe' is actually cooling can it?

 

Well, if on average the globe was warming then I suppose you could still call it global warming.

[saintkiptanui]

Well, if on average the globe was warming then I suppose you could still call it global warming.

It's not it's cooling, has been for 10 years and will continue to do so.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

It was 15 degrees [celcius] today, peeing with rain and I had to wear a coat.

 

Unless someone's been messing with my calendar today is the 18th of August.

 

When does this whole global warming malarky start to work?

 

My well meaning but very mis-guided father said the same thing too me last night.

 

With global warming you can EXPECT MORE ****ty weather like this, not vice-versa. HTH.

[Weston Super Saint]

FFS I got home from work tonight and Mrs WSS wants to turn the f*cking heating on!

 

It's AUGUST FFS!

[saints-cris]

I know England doesn't get the best summers.. but this year has been absoloutely crap.

I can remember very few days where there has been sun... not to be followed shortly by lots of rain.

[saint boggy]

FFS I got home from work tonight and Mrs WSS wants to turn the f*cking heating on!

 

It's AUGUST FFS!

i put mine on for 10 mins last night, just to take the chill off.......

what a fabulous Summer this is...........NOT :mad:

[Saint Martini]

i put mine on for 10 mins last night, just to take the chill off.......

what a fabulous Summer this is...........NOT :mad:

 

My football match tonight was called off due to a waterlogged pitch and the temperature hasn't been above 15 or something in ages. I can honestly say my first Swedish summer is not the best.

[Weston Super Saint]

My football match tonight was called off due to a waterlogged pitch and the temperature hasn't been above 15 or something in ages. I can honestly say my first Swedish summer is not the best.

 

Bet you're looking forward to winter then!

[Saint Martini]

Bet you're looking forward to winter then!

 

At least then I can ski. Its not that I really mind the weather, its just that I like to have four different seasons and not a spring and a very long fall without a proper summer. Besides that, there's a million lakes to swim in here and since uni isn't starting yet I was hoping to get to the beach a few times.

[St Landrew]

Well, if on average the globe was warming then I suppose you could still call it global warming.

 

There is such a thing as the Earth Energy [or Heat] Budget. If more sunlight is not reflected or radiated back into space, then that budget increases. Increased pollutents, as in particulates and chemicals, dust and clouds contain the heat by impeding absorbed radiated heat from mainly land masses. Ice, oceans and seas reflect that sunlight back into space. Ice is the major reflector, having a high Albedo score:

 

http://www.carbon-info.org/carboninfo_029.htm

 

But due to several climactic, Earth driven, human influenced, factors, polar and land based ice is melting at increasing rates. This means sea level rises and lower altitudes for the remaining ice. Therefore it melts even quicker. Therefore there is less ice to reflect the sunlight back. Therefore..., well you get the idea. This is working as an isolated positive feedback system, and positive feedback systems don't keep themselves in check. Thankfully, this system isn't isolated; it relates and interacts with other Earth systems, that help to power it and keep it in check as well.

 

Which brings me to our lousy weather. Usually, the weather patterns we are currently experiencing are much further to the north. But we are getting the weather of north of the Shetland Isles. Why is this..? Well, try as I might, I can find no information that nails this down. Last year's lousy summer was blamed on the Jetstream being situated at a much lower latitude than it should be, and this would hold good for this year too as the weather patterns are near identical. But why is the Jetstream so low..? Well this is what I'm trying to track real evidence for and I can't find it. There is a bit of evidence for La Nina [not El Nino], but I don't buy it at present for various reasons. So at the moment I'm falling back on my old knowledge, but it is very fragmented, and the theories are getting on a bit, and I can't piece the interactions of the systems together, let alone explain them.

 

Polar ice is flowing into the polar seas and IMO could be majorly influencing the weather patterns, and indirectly, possibly causing both the Jetstreams that circle the planet to move from their accustomed latitudes. At the moment I can't quite see the connection. But it could be why the weather is so lousy. My weak subject was always global meteorology. Perhaps someone else can look it up. Here's an easy guide that might give an understanding:

 

http://ww2010.atmos.uiuc.edu/(Gh)/guides/mtr/home.rxml

 

Anyway, what it all means is... that if it is locally colder than normal here, then it's locally hotter than normal elsewhere. The Heat Budget has to be settled somehow.

[Weston Super Saint]

There is such a thing as the Earth Energy [or Heat] Budget. If more sunlight is not reflected or radiated back into space, then that budget increases. Increased pollutents, as in particulates and chemicals, dust and clouds contain the heat by impeding absorbed radiated heat from mainly land masses. Ice, oceans and seas reflect that sunlight back into space. Ice is the major reflector, having a high Albedo score:

 

http://www.carbon-info.org/carboninfo_029.htm

 

But due to several climactic, Earth driven, human influenced, factors, polar and land based ice is melting at increasing rates. This means sea level rises and lower altitudes for the remaining ice. Therefore it melts even quicker. Therefore there is less ice to reflect the sunlight back. Therefore..., well you get the idea. This is working as an isolated positive feedback system, and positive feedback systems don't keep themselves in check. Thankfully, this system isn't isolated; it relates and interacts with other Earth systems, that help to power it and keep it in check as well.

 

Which brings me to our lousy weather. Usually, the weather patterns we are currently experiencing are much further to the north. But we are getting the weather of north of the Shetland Isles. Why is this..? Well, try as I might, I can find no information that nails this down. Last year's lousy summer was blamed on the Jetstream being situated at a much lower latitude than it should be, and this would hold good for this year too as the weather patterns are near identical. But why is the Jetstream so low..? Well this is what I'm trying to track real evidence for and I can't find it. There is a bit of evidence for La Nina [not El Nino], but I don't buy it at present for various reasons. So at the moment I'm falling back on my old knowledge, but it is very fragmented, and the theories are getting on a bit, and I can't piece the interactions of the systems together, let alone explain them.

 

Polar ice is flowing into the polar seas and IMO could be majorly influencing the weather patterns, and indirectly, possibly causing both the Jetstreams that circle the planet to move from their accustomed latitudes. At the moment I can't quite see the connection. But it could be why the weather is so lousy. My weak subject was always global meteorology. Perhaps someone else can look it up. Here's an easy guide that might give an understanding:

 

http://ww2010.atmos.uiuc.edu/(Gh)/guides/mtr/home.rxml

 

Anyway, what it all means is... that if it is locally colder than normal here, then it's locally hotter than normal elsewhere. The Heat Budget has to be settled somehow.

 

Where?

 

And, do you think they'll do a house swap?

[St Landrew]

Where?

 

And, do you think they'll do a house swap?

 

Well thank you for that considered response WSS.

 

The Greek Islands would be my choice. But can you get a Greek family to move..? Not if they are sane..!

[Saintandy666]

Global warming doesn't just mean warming. I prefer the term 'climate change'. That way you can factor in alot of other effects like global dimming, warming, rainfall changes and so on. And actually although it might not seem like it, it is getting hotter, 2007 was the warmest year worldwide ever. Whether this can be attributed to natural processes or us is another issue though. Another factor you need to consider at the present time is the la nina current. When this is prominent as it is now you would usually get a drop in temperatures, but because of current climatic conditions, scientists expect the temperature to stay where it is while this current is strong before temperatures resume rising later on.

 

I would say most of the stuff you hear about global warming is 50% fact, 50% overexaggeration. We're not all going to die but we are going to seriously screw ourselves if we aren't careful.

 

End of random and boring lecture. :S

[St Landrew]

Global warming doesn't just mean warming.

 

Don't like to disagree, but yes it does..!

[Saintandy666]

Don't like to disagree, but yes it does..!

 

 

Well, yer What I meant was people always concentrate on the warming effects of climate change when it isn't the only thing going on.

[St Landrew]

Well, yer What I meant was people always concentrate on the warming effects of climate change when it isn't the only thing going on.

 

Yep. I was only being pedantic anyway. I knew what you meant. It's a general misconception that Global Warming means everywhere should be a bit warmer seasonally. One effect of a warming World is that local weather patterns can become more active and extreme. Hence it can be colder and wetter than usual somewhere, whilst elsewhere it is hotter and drier than usual.

[Weston Super Saint]

Global warming doesn't just mean warming. I prefer the term 'climate change'. That way you can factor in alot of other effects like global dimming, warming, rainfall changes and so on. And actually although it might not seem like it, it is getting hotter, 2007 was the warmest year worldwide ever. Whether this can be attributed to natural processes or us is another issue though. Another factor you need to consider at the present time is the la nina current. When this is prominent as it is now you would usually get a drop in temperatures, but because of current climatic conditions, scientists expect the temperature to stay where it is while this current is strong before temperatures resume rising later on.

 

I would say most of the stuff you hear about global warming is 50% fact, 50% overexaggeration. We're not all going to die but we are going to seriously screw ourselves if we aren't careful.

 

End of random and boring lecture. :S

 

Are you sure?

 

Warmest year EVER seems like one of those random made up FACTs!!!

 

What about the last time the polar ice caps were completely melted, I'm gonna put a fiver on that being warmer than 2007

[Saint Martini]

Are you sure?

 

Warmest year EVER seems like one of those random made up FACTs!!!

 

What about the last time the polar ice caps were completely melted, I'm gonna put a fiver on that being warmer than 2007

 

I'd say it was probably the warmest ever measured, so in the last 100 years or so.

[Saintandy666]

Are you sure?

 

Warmest year EVER seems like one of those random made up FACTs!!!

 

What about the last time the polar ice caps were completely melted, I'm gonna put a fiver on that being warmer than 2007

 

ok, on record... warmest on record!

 

Did you that when the dinosaurs were around, the average temperature on earth was 7 degrees hotter than todays standard.

[Weston Super Saint]

ok, on record... warmest on record!

 

Did you that when the dinosaurs were around, the average temperature on earth was 7 degrees hotter than todays standard.

 

And what wiped them out???

 

It is suggested that a large meteor hit the Earth, and the resulting dust cloud sealed out the sunlight for many years, triggering an ice age - we are currently still in it, although it is warming up - eventually we will warm up enough that the Earth resumes it's natural state - that is a state where there is no ice on the polar caps

[Scummer]

And what wiped them out???

 

It is suggested that a large meteor hit the Earth, and the resulting dust cloud sealed out the sunlight for many years, triggering an ice age - we are currently still in it, although it is warming up - eventually we will warm up enough that the Earth resumes it's natural state - that is a state where there is no ice on the polar caps

 

No, it's because they used to leave their TV's on standby at night.

[St Landrew]

And what wiped them out???

 

It is suggested that a large meteor hit the Earth, and the resulting dust cloud sealed out the sunlight for many years, triggering an ice age - we are currently still in it, although it is warming up - eventually we will warm up enough that the Earth resumes it's natural state - that is a state where there is no ice on the polar caps

 

No, there have been several ice ages since then. The last one finished around 10,000 years ago.

 

EDIT: The natural state of the Earth is surely whatever it actually is at the present time. Depending on whether you factor in our influence as natural or not.

Edited 19 August, 2008 by St Landrew

[Special K]

Global Warming doesn't stack up, so all the tree huggers decided to call it Climate Change instead, to scare us all into thinking that floods, colder summers, rain, etc, was all down to us not turning our standby's off at night.

 

So now every weather event that is above the most benign of weather patterns is due to climate change and every time you press that deodorant can you contribute to the apocalypse that will envelope the earth in about 100 years time.

 

So turn off your computer now, before a lightning bolt strikes that tree outside your house and the thing falls into your house killing your granny.

[St Landrew]

Global Warming doesn't stack up, so all the tree huggers decided to call it Climate Change instead, to scare us all into thinking that floods, colder summers, rain, etc, was all down to us not turning our standby's off at night.

 

So now every weather event that is above the most benign of weather patterns is due to climate change and every time you press that deodorant can you contribute to the apocalypse that will envelope the earth in about 100 years time.

 

So turn off your computer now, before a lightning bolt strikes that tree outside your house and the thing falls into your house killing your granny.

 

Err... yes it does.

[Weston Super Saint]

No, there have been several ice ages since then. The last one finished around 10,000 years ago.

 

EDIT: The natural state of the Earth is surely whatever it actually is at the present time. Depending on whether you factor in our influence as natural or not.

 

Nope...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_age

ice age is often used to mean a period of ice sheets in the northern and southern hemispheres; by this definition we are still in an ice age (because the Greenland and Antarctic ice sheets still exist).

[Saintandy666]

This is where you have to decide,

 

Global warming, is it?

 

A. Earths natural cycle

B. Caused by humans

C. Farting animals

 

But whatever the answer to that is, one thing is sure, we aren't going to benefit from any substantial temperature rise so it's something we have to pay attention to.

 

Another interesting factor that could help us is that if it does get hot enough the gulf stream could weaken and stop meaning it gets colder here cancelling out the warming.

[Weston Super Saint]

This is where you have to decide,

 

Global warming, is it?

 

A. Earths natural cycle

B. Caused by humans

C. Farting animals

 

But whatever the answer to that is, one thing is sure, we aren't going to benefit from any substantial temperature rise so it's something we have to pay attention to.

 

Another interesting factor that could help us is that if it does get hot enough the gulf stream could weaken and stop meaning it gets colder here cancelling out the warming.

 

A.....

[St Landrew]

Nope...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_age

 

Sorry, WSS. I didn't get that info from Wikipedia. I got it from my degree text books. An ice age is determined by certain temperatures, conditions, amount of ice as a percentage over the Earth's surface, and the advance and retreat of ice. We are not in an ice age.

[Saintandy666]

A.....

 

My answer would be a mixture of the two, earths natural cycle being spread up and exaggerated by our actions.

 

There was an interesting report I saw somewhere about cows in california. Because of the amount of them there, and the amount of methene farts they produce, it was deduced by this report that these farts were producing more global warming than cars in that region(remember that methene is a much more powerful greenhouse gas than C02). I think though that what we are doing could be possibly sending the earth over it's natural limit for the greenhouse effect.

 

You have to remember that the greenhouse effect is a natural event, infact without it, the earths average temperature would be -18 and we wouldn't even be here now.

[Weston Super Saint]

Sorry, WSS. I didn't get that info from Wikipedia. I got it from my degree text books. An ice age is determined by certain temperatures, conditions, amount of ice as a percentage over the Earth's surface, and the advance and retreat of ice. We are not in an ice age.

 

To be fair, the various articles seem to suggest a 50 fifty split between the definitions.....

[Weston Super Saint]

My answer would be a mixture of the two, earths natural cycle being spread up and exaggerated by our actions.

 

There was an interesting report I saw somewhere about cows in california. Because of the amount of them there, and the amount of methene farts they produce, it was deduced by this report that these farts were producing more global warming than cars in that region(remember that methene is a much more powerful greenhouse gas than C02). I think though that what we are doing could be possibly sending the earth over it's natural limit for the greenhouse effect.

 

You have to remember that the greenhouse effect is a natural event, infact without it, the earths average temperature would be -18 and we wouldn't even be here now.

 

So just like the fridges were destroying the ozone layer and we were all going to die....

 

Ooooppppssss the ozone layer seems to be repairing itself...