Saints 0-3 Villa - Match Thread

[Oh no Mick Mills]

4 hours ago, Galway saint said:

I quite like Tessem and prefer him to Merrington but each to their own 

Tessem's OK , but for me , Dave just has that X factor.   

[Whitey Grandad]

20 minutes ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

For what it’s worth I think rusks approach is the closest to right approach  we have had this season .. he’s basically saying we have to defend first and try and make games tight .. when you are at a obvious disadvantage quality wise this seems to make a lot of sense .. result didn’t go to plan today but at least he gets it 

The right approach? You have to be joking. Five at the back at home? Sit back inside our own area and pack the box? We were set up to fail right from the start. It was the most negative approach to a game that I’ve ever seen. We were like a lower league team playing at home in the Cup against a team several leagues above us and hoping to play for a replay.

Rusk had a free shot today. At the very least he could have tried to give us long-suffering fans some entertainment. Instead we go down with not even a whimper.

What was the effing point of it all?

[Micky]

57 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Seriously, you need to stop floating this shit. Charles and Edoize were bit part players last season. BBD is struggling in a Sheffield United team that have imploded in recent weeks. Manning hardly got a game toward the end of last season, Bree I wouldn't have near the starting 11, he is so limited. Armstrong has been dropped in a pretty shit West Brom team. Smalbone is a nothing player. 

If BBD is the answer, then by fuck we're in deep poo right from the off. If ever there was a fraud off a footballer, he's the man.  If that's what we've got to look forwards to... depressing. In the extreme. 

[OttawaSaint]

6 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Bree - Bednarek - Stephens - Manning

Charles - Downes - Smallbone

Armstrong - BBD - Edozie

Oh fuck! Now I'm depressed. That is a Saints whipping boy ten, add Bazunu and you have the full set.

A team full of ball watching, slow to react, no vision, no hopers. Fuck!

[LGTL]

8 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Bree - Bednarek - Stephens - Manning

Charles - Downes - Smallbone

Armstrong - BBD - Edozie

Is a perfectly ‘decent’ Championship team, even after all the expected departures and without signing anyone (I’m not going into GKs again on another thread) We’d still have McC, Archer, Edwards, Aribo and a couple of others on the bench.

Fucking hell.

[pimpin4rizeal]

7 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The right approach? You have to be joking. Five at the back at home? Sit back inside our own area and pack the box? We were set up to fail right from the start. It was the most negative approach to a game that I’ve ever seen. We were like a lower league team playing at home in the Cup against a team several leagues above us and hoping to play for a replay.

Rusk had a free shot today. At the very least he could have tried to give us long-suffering fans some entertainment. Instead we go down with not even a whimper.

What was the effing point of it all?

I think it’s exactly the right approach .. our team are shit so you play to keep it tight and hope to nick a goal.. Greece won a euros like it with a crap Squad so it evens the playing field .. unfortunately we can’t even defend so it might not work either but at least he managed to not concede for a decent portion of the game 

 

[Harry_SFC]

14 minutes ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I think it’s exactly the right approach .. our team are shit so you play to keep it tight and hope to nick a goal.. Greece won a euros like it with a crap Squad so it evens the playing field .. unfortunately we can’t even defend so it might not work either but at least he managed to not concede for a decent portion of the game 

 

Villa are a very good side, probably would've turned us over 5-0 if we'd left them more space. Lets be honest, Rusk is on a hiding to nothing here. 

[chivvy]

Ounacho was embarrassingly bad yesterday .. he was like the kid you pick last who wants to play football.

His technique on the floor is awful.

Its a sad state of recruitment when he is first and only choice to lead the line.  

We don't even sling it in the box to make him look good.

He has poor stamina and can't close down and compete for 70mins.

He is our leading scorer FFS!

I've liked him for comedy value but he was truly clumsy and dreadful yesterday.

Edited 13 hours ago by chivvy

[Fitzhugh Fella]

8 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The right approach? You have to be joking. Five at the back at home? Sit back inside our own area and pack the box? We were set up to fail right from the start. It was the most negative approach to a game that I’ve ever seen. We were like a lower league team playing at home in the Cup against a team several leagues above us and hoping to play for a replay.

Rusk had a free shot today. At the very least he could have tried to give us long-suffering fans some entertainment. Instead we go down with not even a whimper.

What was the effing point of it all?

Tend to agree with this. I thought the same. We were like a lower league team in the FA Cup. It was utterly futile and painful to watch. We had one decent player on the pitch - Fernandes, the rest were awful (although Captain Jack put a shift in and looked like he cared) and I thought Rusk was adapting some of Russell Martin's tactics. In the first half Ramsdale takes a goal kick sideways to Bednarek who then over hit a long ball towards the touchline about 10 yards over the head of Walker-Peters to give them a throw-in and possesion. Utterly stupid. A long kick into their half would have been preferable.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

53 minutes ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I think it’s exactly the right approach .. our team are shit so you play to keep it tight and hope to nick a goal.. Greece won a euros like it with a crap Squad so it evens the playing field .. unfortunately we can’t even defend so it might not work either but at least he managed to not concede for a decent portion of the game 

 

But we are relegated so what's the point or are yousaying in the context of beating Derby's total?

[CB Fry]

9 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

For what it’s worth I think rusks approach is the closest to right approach  we have had this season .. he’s basically saying we have to defend first and try and make games tight .. when you are at a obvious disadvantage quality wise this seems to make a lot of sense .. result didn’t go to plan today but at least he gets it 

Especially for away games this is exactly it. If you can keep it to nil for 75 mins then at least you're in with a shout of a point or a smash-and-grab.

[Lighthouse]

28 minutes ago, chivvy said:

Ounacho was embarrassingly bad yesterday .. he was like the kid you pick last who wants to play football.

His technique on the floor is awful.

I watched a compilation video of his goals in Belgium a while ago and it struck me just how similar all of his goals were. Pretty much all of his goals were first time shots or headers on the edge of the six yard box with very poor marking. He basically never scored when he had to take a couple of touches or dribble with the ball and set himself up. A proper Bambi on ice striker.

[Whitey Grandad]

6 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Especially for away games this is exactly it. If you can keep it to nil for 75 mins then at least you're in with a shout of a point or a smash-and-grab.

In any other situation I would agree with you but yesterday was simply pathetic.

[Thripp87]

10 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Bree - Bednarek - Stephens - Manning

Charles - Downes - Smallbone

Armstrong - BBD - Edozie

Is a perfectly ‘decent’ Championship team, even after all the expected departures and without signing anyone (I’m not going into GKs again on another thread) We’d still have McC, Archer, Edwards, Aribo and a couple of others on the bench.

You must be on the wind up? 

That side is a mid table Championship side at best. Armstrong already being benched by West Brom is a case in point.

What exactly are you basing this assumption on? 

Birmingham who have just been promoted into the Chanpionship would have a better starting 11 by the time they have spent their funds.

[Whitey Grandad]

56 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Villa are a very good side, probably would've turned us over 5-0 if we'd left them more space. Lets be honest, Rusk is on a hiding to nothing here. 

We gave them plenty of space. Most of the pitch to be exact. You get nothing by packing your own box with eleven players and nothing is way at we got. We were lucky to restrict them to three goals and had Ramsdale not saved that penalty it would have been four.

A hiding and nothing is exactly what we got.

[Harry_SFC]

1 minute ago, Whitey Grandad said:

We gave them plenty of space. Most of the pitch to be exact. You get nothing by packing your own box with eleven players and nothing is way at we got. We were lucky to restrict them to three goals and had Ramsdale not saved that penalty it would have been four.

A hiding and nothing is exactly what we got.

3 different managers this season, all with different styles and the results are the same. Ok if we'd have gone for it we might've nicked a goal but either way the end result is the same. These players are the common denominator. 

[Lighthouse]

1 minute ago, Thripp87 said:

You must be on the wind up? 

That side is a mid table Championship side at best. Armstrong already being benched by West Brom is a case in point.

What exactly are you basing this assumption on? 

Birmingham who have just been promoted into the Championship would have a better starting 11 by the time they have spent their funds.

All of those players were regulars when we got promoted last year, it’s a decent Championship side and like I said, that’s before we make any signings, which we obviously will if we lose the majority of players who aren’t listed above.

Given that we’ve only got about four players currently who are an improvement to that team, I’m even more bemused as to why Juric, Martin and Rusk get any kind of criticism. Apparently they’ve been trying to play PL football with a bottom half Championship squad, plus four okay PL players. I’m amazed we’ve scored any points at all.

[Harry_SFC]

Having watched match of the day back the lack of intensity in midfield is our main downfall. We know the CB's are crap but we don't do enough to protect them. Ugochuckwu and then Smallbone when he came on are so lethargic. Fernandes should be playing further forward but we've got no one else to go in CM. 

It's an area (along with many others) that needs a huge overhaul next season. 

[Whitey Grandad]

12 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

3 different managers this season, all with different styles and the results are the same. Ok if we'd have gone for it we might've nicked a goal but either way the end result is the same. These players are the common denominator. 

I don’t agree that they were different styles. Meet the new boss same as the old boss.
 

Playing three at the back or around at the back is just stupidly defeatist especially at home. It just weakens our midfield and shifts the centre of mass of our team back towards our own goal and invites the opposition to come and have a go at us.

Countless times one of our players will receive the ball out on the wing and then find that the easiest and most open pass for them is to play it back towards our own goal  because that’s where most of our players are.

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Having watched match of the day back the lack of intensity in midfield is our main downfall. We know the CB's are crap but we don't do enough to protect them. Ugochuckwu and then Smallbone when he came on are so lethargic. Fernandes should be playing further forward but we've got no one else to go in CM. 

It's an area (along with many others) that needs a huge overhaul next season. 

Exactly. We have been conceding the centre ground for longer than I care to remember.  What makes it worse of course is playing with three centre backs who simply get in each other’s way.

Edited 12 hours ago by Whitey Grandad

[StrangelyBrown]

10 hours ago, beatlesaint said:

A low point today for me was after Stephens made a successful and decent tackle to be fair a guy two rows in front of me started singing “Super, Super Jack……” 🤦🏻

Give me strength 

Its worse than that - he gave away a penalty, was ball watching on the 2nd and 3rd goals and in both cases lost his man who scored. He's an absolute clown and shouldn't be anywhere near our team let alone the fucking captain.

[Ralph Fastenbüttl]

5 hours ago, OttawaSaint said:

Oh fuck! Now I'm depressed. That is a Saints whipping boy ten, add Bazunu and you have the full set.

A team full of ball watching, slow to react, no vision, no hopers. Fuck!

Oh fuck me, I'd forgotten about the living nightmare that is Baz. Something else to look forward to. God, will the horrors ever cease?

[davefizzy14]

Having watched motd last night, two of them should never of counted. For the first there was no advantage for us when Fernandes was brought down, if that had been the other way,around the ref definitely would have stopped the game and awarded them a free kick, but not to us. The third one, Jack definitely makes contact with the ball so don't see how that can be given as a penalty. That ref yesterday had an absolute shocker, didn't give us anything and I didn't expect anything different. He was the idiot we had in charge when we played wolves away and we all know what happened in that one. We were pretty solid for the first seventy mins but when we made a few changes I think it affected our rhythm and we only created a couple of chances through Fernandes and Smallbone. I thought Jack was really good, made so many tackles and interceptions, a proper captains performance. Ramsdale (for saving two penalties) KWP and Fernandes as always both being class.

Edited 8 hours ago by davefizzy14

[Lord Duckhunter]

3 minutes ago, davefizzy14 said:

Having watched motd last night, two of them should never of counted. For the first there was no advantage for us when Fernandes was brought down, if that had been the other way,around the ref definitely would have stopped the game and awarded them a free kick

Don’t talk rubbish man. It was an advantage every day of the fucking week, for every fucking team……

[Oldandtired]

56 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Don’t talk rubbish man. It was an advantage every day of the fucking week, for every fucking team……

You do understand this is a forum where everybody is entitled to an opinion. Just because someone has a different version to you doesn't make it rubbish.

[Lord Duckhunter]

39 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

You do understand this is a forum where everybody is entitled to an opinion. Just because someone has a different version to you doesn't make it rubbish.

It depends on what they write, if they write a load of old pony than that’s what it is. It’s one eyed rubbish to suggest the ref would have given every other side a free kick. You’ll see the same situation hundreds of times a season and 99% of the time the ref will wave play on. The error was TB’s mincing around, not the ref. And it certainly wasn’t an anti saints decision 

[Whitey Grandad]

3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

It depends on what they write, if they write a load of old pony than that’s what it is. It’s one eyed rubbish to suggest the ref would have given every other side a free kick. You’ll see the same situation hundreds of times a season and 99% of the time the ref will wave play on. The error was TB’s mincing around, not the ref. And it certainly wasn’t an anti saints decision 

Yep. All down to Dibling farting about.

[Wade Garrett]

4 hours ago, Harry_SFC said:

Having watched match of the day back the lack of intensity in midfield is our main downfall. We know the CB's are crap but we don't do enough to protect them. Ugochuckwu and then Smallbone when he came on are so lethargic. Fernandes should be playing further forward but we've got no one else to go in CM. 

It's an area (along with many others) that needs a huge overhaul next season. 

We thought Big Les was ok yesterday.

Smallbone, Manning, Archer, Stewart and Dibling mind you….

[East Kent Saint]

2 hours ago, davefizzy14 said:

Having watched motd last night, two of them should never of counted. For the first there was no advantage for us when Fernandes was brought down, if that had been the other way,around the ref definitely would have stopped the game and awarded them a free kick, but not to us. The third one, Jack definitely makes contact with the ball so don't see how that can be given as a penalty. That ref yesterday had an absolute shocker, didn't give us anything and I didn't expect anything different. He was the idiot we had in charge when we played wolves away and we all know what happened in that one. We were pretty solid for the first seventy mins but when we made a few changes I think it affected our rhythm and we only created a couple of chances through Fernandes and Smallbone. I thought Jack was really good, made so many tackles and interceptions, a proper captains performance. Ramsdale (for saving two penalties) KWP and Fernandes as always both being class.

With penalties the modern interpretation of the rule is that if there is contact then it is likely to be given.  It won't be overruled if the ref has given it and there is any sort of contact.

Not sure if Jack's effort was a pen looking at it on Motd.

[Tamesaint]

The officials  yesterday were appalling. Manning made a good tackle yesterday right in front of me. Foul given to Villa. Rogers screamed at the lino that he was fouled and five seconds later the lino flagged. Early in the first half Ramsdale collected a deflection off Stephens well over the line. Should have been a Villa corner but instead we got a goal kick. 

No wonder the Northam celebrated when we were awarded a free kick and no surprise that he gave Villa 2 penalties. 

Edited 7 hours ago by Tamesaint

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

With penalties the modern interpretation of the rule is that if there is contact then it is likely to be given.  It won't be overruled if the ref has given it and there is any sort of contact.

Not sure if Jack's effort was a pen looking at it on Motd.

It looked a clear penalty tome at the time and it was right under the referee’s nose. I’ve just had a look at the incident again and Stephens doesn’t reach the ball. It was clumsy and stupid but that’s what you get with him.

[Whitey Grandad]

Just now, Tamesaint said:

The officials  yesterday were appalling. Manning made a good tackle yesterday right in front of me. Foul given to Villa. Rogers screamed at the lino that he was fouled and five seconds later the lino flagged. Early in the first half Ramsdale collected a deflection off Stephens well over the line. Should have been a Villa corner but instead we got a goal kick. 

No wonder the Northam celebrated when we were awarded a free kick. 

Yeah, always blame the referees if all else fails. I assume that you had a much better view than any of them?

[Tamesaint]

Just now, Whitey Grandad said:

Yeah, always blame the referees if all else fails. I assume that you had a much better view than any of them?

Yes. Those 3 incidents were just in front of me.... And also right in front of the lino. 

[Whitey Grandad]

3 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

Yes. Those 3 incidents were just in front of me.... And also right in front of the lino. 

But you were still a further away that they were?

[aintforever]

5 hours ago, Harry_SFC said:

Having watched match of the day back the lack of intensity in midfield is our main downfall. We know the CB's are crap but we don't do enough to protect them. Ugochuckwu and then Smallbone when he came on are so lethargic. Fernandes should be playing further forward but we've got no one else to go in CM. 

It's an area (along with many others) that needs a huge overhaul next season. 

Agree with this, Fernandes is our only midfielder anywhere near Premier League standard. The lack of intensity and any sort of defensive minded midfielder leaves our defence just so exposed. I would sign a Wanyama type and a box to box central midfielder in the summer. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

37 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I would sign a Wanyama type and a box to box central midfielder in the summer. 

😂😂😂

I would sign a Pelle type centre forward to knock them in, and a VvD type centre half to keep them out. Piece of piss, get it done Saints…

[StrangelyBrown]

1 hour ago, Tamesaint said:

The officials  yesterday were appalling. Manning made a good tackle yesterday right in front of me. Foul given to Villa. Rogers screamed at the lino that he was fouled and five seconds later the lino flagged. Early in the first half Ramsdale collected a deflection off Stephens well over the line. Should have been a Villa corner but instead we got a goal kick. 

No wonder the Northam celebrated when we were awarded a free kick and no surprise that he gave Villa 2 penalties. 

The penalties were both nailed on IMO - just shocking defending.

The only things I had a problem with were every 50:50 going to villa and the "advantage" before villa's first goal, which took our players completely by suprise. 

The officials should have done something about the diving early on, but sadly this just seems to be an accepted part of football these days.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, StrangelyBrown said:

The penalties were both nailed on IMO - just shocking defending.

The only things I had a problem with were every 50:50 going to villa and the "advantage" before villa's first goal, which took our players completely by suprise. 

The officials should have done something about the diving early on, but sadly this just seems to be an accepted part of football these days.

The “advantage” shouldn’t have come as a surprise to anyone given that the referee gave a clear signal that he was applying it.

[Eric The Red]

3 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

It looked a clear penalty tome at the time and it was right under the referee’s nose. I’ve just had a look at the incident again and Stephens doesn’t reach the ball. It was clumsy and stupid but that’s what you get with him.

Actually I thought Stephens does get the ball first, although he obviously catches the man on the follow through.  Can definitely see why VAR wouldn't overturn but not a 'clumsy and stupid' tackle

[OneMrsWallace]

18 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The right approach? You have to be joking. Five at the back at home? Sit back inside our own area and pack the box? We were set up to fail right from the start. It was the most negative approach to a game that I’ve ever seen. We were like a lower league team playing at home in the Cup against a team several leagues above us and hoping to play for a replay.

Rusk had a free shot today. At the very least he could have tried to give us long-suffering fans some entertainment. Instead we go down with not even a whimper.

What was the effing point of it all?

Exactly this. And after the match he seemed to be really happy that we didn't concede until the 73rd minute (Apologies if that's not the actual time of the goal, I couldn't be arsed to check) WTF! The whole club is absolutely as soaked in negativity. It's going to take the turn around of the century to get us back up next season. 

[Harry_SFC]

1 hour ago, Eric The Red said:

Actually I thought Stephens does get the ball first, although he obviously catches the man on the follow through.  Can definitely see why VAR wouldn't overturn but not a 'clumsy and stupid' tackle

Yeah he got the slightest touch on the ball but was quite high with the follow through. Wouldn't say it's a poor decision, just debatable. 

[Whitey Grandad]

2 hours ago, Eric The Red said:

Actually I thought Stephens does get the ball first, although he obviously catches the man on the follow through.  Can definitely see why VAR wouldn't overturn but not a 'clumsy and stupid' tackle

It was stupid because he was guaranteed to give away a penalty and it was clumsy because he actually did give away a penalty. There was no need for him to go flying in like that. Even getting a solid touch on the ball is no good if he touches the other player first.