Ivan Juric

[Galway saint]

1 hour ago, benjii said:

Our midfielders are crap, obviously (Fernandes excepted), but we could set up with two deep lying ones to protect the CBs. We would potentially be pretty crap going forwards but we'd always have a chance to grab a goal from a set piece or something. 

That would work better with a back 4 than a 5, but we've got to do something. 

I know what you mean but we have scored once this season from a set piece and that was an own goal. We are sub standard in every aspect of the game..

I recall reading that the set piece coach left and I am not sure we replaced him but I might be wrong 

[Harry_SFC]

2 minutes ago, Hodgey said:

He’s turned a relegation headed team into a promotion team in the same league we will be in. He’s also done it under a complete lunatic. He’s getting a tune out of players we couldn’t (Charles and Valery). The fans love him (I know a few) and he’s been part of highly successful coaching teams at the highest level. He will also have live insight into pretty much every single team (and players) in that league.

He may not be the answer but I’m struggling to think of someone more suitable. (Ie on results you could point to Rowett but I just don’t see the fit)

He'd 100% be my choice in the summer. Whether we are still interested/whether we would actually pay the compensation required is another matter. 

[FarehamSaintJames]

The club is effectively winding down for the season now. There’s no competition of places and equally no competition to try and get a point in a match.

It might not be obvious but the transfer window should say enough, we’re preparing for next season. Sell off those that we can or need to, and start afresh in June.

[Badger]

41 minutes ago, Hodgey said:

He’s turned a relegation headed team into a promotion team in the same league we will be in. He’s also done it under a complete lunatic. He’s getting a tune out of players we couldn’t (Charles and Valery). The fans love him (I know a few) and he’s been part of highly successful coaching teams at the highest level. He will also have live insight into pretty much every single team (and players) in that league.

He may not be the answer but I’m struggling to think of someone more suitable. (Ie on results you could point to Rowett but I just don’t see the fit)

Agree that he would seem the obvious candidate. But Saints seldom go for the obvious or outstanding. And less inclined to pay compensation. 

Rowett has done well at Oxford, but he seems to be the ‘Championship go to’ option. Been at several clubs nothing of note. I suspect Eustace might be more in the SR mould. (Not suggesting that by the way, just speculating on an SR appointment). 

[FarehamSaintJames]

I didn’t want Danny Rohl this season because to take him now, get relegated and start again, is harder than him coming in at the summer where you have more opportunity to reset.

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, manji said:

Hes a pragmatic tough guy 

 

Let’s hope so. Personally, I don’t want the “he’s good in the championship” mentality to prevail. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that we could get a striker that’ll score as many as Adam Armstrong in the lower league, but be capable of stepping up a level and not looking completely useless? Same with the centre halves, Downes and Smallbone. These players are tainted and used to losing, the whole club needs toughening up and a culture change. Apart from one or two exceptions, who will leave anyway, I don’t want to see more than a handful of these wankers playing next season. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, Galway saint said:

I know what you mean but we have scored once this season from a set piece and that was an own goal.

Twice

[Lee On Solent Saint]

13 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Let’s hope so. Personally, I don’t want the “he’s good in the championship” mentality to prevail. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that we could get a striker that’ll score as many as Adam Armstrong in the lower league, but be capable of stepping up a level and not looking completely useless? Same with the centre halves, Downes and Smallbone. These players are tainted and used to losing, the whole club needs toughening up and a culture change. Apart from one or two exceptions, who will leave anyway, I don’t want to see more than a handful of these wankers playing next season. 

Am not sure I can sit through another season of Smallbone, Stephens, Aribo et al. Despite claims that they will be good enough for the Championship. 

[Harry_SFC]

10 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Am not sure I can sit through another season of Smallbone, Stephens, Aribo et al. Despite claims that they will be good enough for the Championship. 

They are players I just associate with failure tbh

[Lee On Solent Saint]

1 minute ago, Harry_SFC said:

They are players I just associate with failure tbh

Agreed. Squad needs a complete overhaul whoever is in charge next season.

[aintforever]

37 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Agreed. Squad needs a complete overhaul whoever is in charge next season.

Easier said than done. When a team goes down it’s not as easy as picking and choosing who stays and who goes, finances are tight and if there are players here who are under contract and can do a decent job it probably makes sense to keep them and get the best out of them.

 

[lambtiss]

19 hours ago, Matthew Le God said:

Textbook example of an argumentum ad populum fallacy. Just because they don't, does not mean it wouldn't be effective for another manager/club. 

Pretentious, moi?

[stknowle]

1 hour ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Am not sure I can sit through another season of Smallbone, Stephens, Aribo et al. Despite claims that they will be good enough for the Championship. 

Plus 1. We need a complete sea change. They may well be good enough for the Championship and even get us out of it again but just imagine them having a crack at beating their own record low the following season. 😬

Edited yesterday at 16:10 by stknowle

[Lee On Solent Saint]

19 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Easier said than done. When a team goes down it’s not as easy as picking and choosing who stays and who goes, finances are tight and if there are players here who are under contract and can do a decent job it probably makes sense to keep them and get the best out of them.

 

I understand that, but mentally this team is so weak and utterly deviod of any leaders, I would seriously look to move on what we can.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

11 minutes ago, stknowle said:

Plus 1. We need a complete sea change. They may well be good enough for the Championship and even get us out of it again but just imagine them having a crack at beating their own record low the following season. 😬

We were far too loyal to the these players, I get squad cohesion and that, but there is no way that Armstrong should be playing in the PL, let alone the other shite we signed in the summer. 

[stknowle]

4 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

We were far too loyal to the these players, I get squad cohesion and that, but there is no way that Armstrong should be playing in the PL, let alone the other shite we signed in the summer. 

Cash comes into it too. We’ve spent what we’ve spent pretty badly but thanks to the laughably misnamed FFP (which with VAR is the main reason I’m getting utterly disillusioned with top level football) we aren’t allowed to spend what it would really take to make us competitive.  

[Lord Duckhunter]

46 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I understand that, but mentally this team is so weak and utterly deviod of any leaders, I would seriously look to move on what we can.

Agreed. 
 

I keep reading posts praising Adam Armstrong as a someone who will get goals in the Championship, therefore he should be easy to ship out to a Championship side. I’m sick to death of watching him run around, I’d quite happily fuck him off and get someone in who offers more physicality and potential. Same with most of them. I honestly can’t think of one player who will stay, that I’ll particularly want to stay. 

[Harry_SFC]

4 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Agreed. 
 

I keep reading posts praising Adam Armstrong as a someone who will get goals in the Championship, therefore he should be easy to ship out to a Championship side. I’m sick to death of watching him run around, I’d quite happily fuck him off and get someone in who offers more physicality and potential. Same with most of them. I honestly can’t think of one player who will stay, that I’ll particularly want to stay. 

Fernandes is genuinely the only one I'd be disappointed to lose. The rest (including Dibling) I'm not fussed about. 

[Saint_clark]

5 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Fernandes is genuinely the only one I'd be disappointed to lose. The rest (including Dibling) I'm not fussed about. 

We won't be overhauling the entire squad and it would be silly to try and do so. 

[hypochondriac]

7 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

We won't be overhauling the entire squad and it would be silly to try and do so. 

I'm not sure he was suggested NG that, simply that he doesn't care which of them leave. 

[Saint_clark]

3 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I'm not sure he was suggested NG that, simply that he doesn't care which of them leave. 

Yeah fair enough, I did type out a different response but changed it so maybe I should have removed the quote. 

[Maggie May]

On 27/12/2024 at 18:40, Maggie May said:

Sadly, he’s going to finish on the same win, lose and draw ratio as Russell Martin. 
 

Palace are going to hammer us. 

We’re regressing further than I thought we would. We would have surpassed the 12 points if we’d stuck with RM. 
 

[Lord Duckhunter]

36 minutes ago, Maggie May said:

We’re regressing further than I thought we would. We would have surpassed the 12 points if we’d stuck with RM. 
 

So which games since he left would Lego have got results from then? 
 

Bearing in mind a really out of form spurs side put 5 past us in the first half in his last game, it’s bizarre to think results would have been any different. The atmosphere would be incredibly toxic by now had the cock remained. 

[pimpin4rizeal]

I think we will cook in the championship next season tbh .. if say the only losses are the likes of ramsdale/ dibling fernandes kwp etc we would still be left an elite squad for the championship., the fact that bbd and AA are 20 goal strikers in this league tells you how big the difference is .. and onuachu and archer are better if we was to pretty much keep this squad together bar the ones mentioned above ..

add to that juric seems better attacking wise then Martin I can see us cooking 

[spyinthesky]

2 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I think we will cook in the championship next season tbh .. if say the only losses are the likes of ramsdale/ dibling fernandes kwp etc we would still be left an elite squad for the championship., the fact that bbd and AA are 20 goal strikers in this league tells you how big the difference is .. and onuachu and archer are better if we was to pretty much keep this squad together bar the ones mentioned above ..

add to that juric seems better attacking wise then Martin I can see us cooking 

I think we will find out against Burnley although they may ring the changes as they will see promotion as their main objective this year.

[Saint_clark]

2 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I think we will cook in the championship next season tbh .. if say the only losses are the likes of ramsdale/ dibling fernandes kwp etc we would still be left an elite squad for the championship., the fact that bbd and AA are 20 goal strikers in this league tells you how big the difference is .. and onuachu and archer are better if we was to pretty much keep this squad together bar the ones mentioned above ..

add to that juric seems better attacking wise then Martin I can see us cooking 

The key is being more ruthless when we DO go up. The likes of Armstrong and BBD we KNOW can't do it in the Prem, so when they bang in 20 each next season, sell them on for £15million each to a promotion chasing championship side and put that £30million towards a proper striker in the Prem for £40million.

[Matthew Le God]

9 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

The key is being more ruthless when we DO go up. The likes of Armstrong and BBD we KNOW can't do it in the Prem, so when they bang in 20 each next season, sell them on for £15million each to a promotion chasing championship side and put that £30million towards a proper striker in the Prem for £40million.

Exactly! That needs to be the thinking after any new promotion. 

Russell Martin openly admitted he felt loyal to the players that got the promotion. But most simply aren't good enough for the PL. Next time, use them to get promotion, then upgrade. It may cause short term gelling issues to have a big turnover of players, but we will need a big change in player quality if we ever want to stay up after a promotion. 

Edited 19 hours ago by Matthew Le God

[Saint_clark]

21 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Exactly! That needs to be the thinking after any new promotion. 

Russell Martin openly admitted he felt loyal to the players that got the promotion. But most simply aren't good enough for the PL. Next time, use them to get promotion, then upgrade. It may cause short term gelling issues to have a big turnover of players, but we will need a big change in player quality if we ever want to stay up after a promotion. 

We had no such problem under Adkins last time. He even tried being a bit TOO ruthless and dropped Lambert for Rodriguez first game of the season.

[tdmickey3]

3 hours ago, Maggie May said:

We’re regressing further than I thought we would. We would have surpassed the 12 points if we’d stuck with RM. 
 

Wum

[Maggie May]

1 minute ago, tdmickey3 said:

Wum

We’re under motivated? Completely agree. 

[Roo1976]

5 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

We won't be overhauling the entire squad and it would be silly to try and do so. 

but on the other hand, who would have thought our inept recruitment would leave us in such a bloody awful position.

[HKsaint]

SR is excellent in finding manager. How could SR find someone who is worse than Russell Martin? Has Juric got us any point?

[Barsiem]

Don't think we should be writing off Juric yet.  I'm clinging (somewhat forlornly perhaps) to the fact we could and should have beaten West Ham & Man U as signs of progress.  The teams morale will be on the floor, so just to get them being competitive in games is a decent return atm. 

Needs to translate into some decent results before the end of the season if we're going to stick with him longer term though

[Matthew Le God]

10 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

We had no such problem under Adkins last time. He even tried being a bit TOO ruthless and dropped Lambert for Rodriguez first game of the season.

The gap in quality between the leagues is bigger than it was 13 years ago.

[Whitey Grandad]

He’s still learning about his players although why Smallbone got more than a few minutes at the end of a game baffles me.

We are nowhere near having a settled team. They all play like they’re strangers.

[Sarnia Cherie]

1 hour ago, Barsiem said:

Don't think we should be writing off Juric yet.  I'm clinging (somewhat forlornly perhaps) to the fact we could and should have beaten West Ham & Man U as signs of progress.  The teams morale will be on the floor, so just to get them being competitive in games is a decent return atm. 

Needs to translate into some decent results before the end of the season if we're going to stick with him longer term though

There's a faint glimmer of hope in the games played since Juric arrived. Bednarek and Fernandes scored a good goal apiece against Newcastle. He's on a hiding to nothing, really. Taking over a team with zero morale and in a dire position at the foot of the table. If anyone departs before next season I would prefer it to be SR. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

11 hours ago, Matthew Le God said:

Exactly! That needs to be the thinking after any new promotion. 

Russell Martin openly admitted he felt loyal to the players that got the promotion. But most simply aren't good enough for the PL. Next time, use them to get promotion, then upgrade. It may cause short term gelling issues to have a big turnover of players, but we will need a big change in player quality if we ever want to stay up after a promotion. 

Which is what Forest did when they first came up. Sure, everyone laughed at them, but they stayed up and now seem to be reaping the benefits 

[austsaint]

30 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

He’s still learning about his players although why Smallbone got more than a few minutes at the end of a game baffles me.

We are nowhere near having a settled team. They all play like they’re strangers.

I like Juric, and as you say, he’s still learning about an oversized squad. Just the same, I’m hoping he’s seen enough of Smallbone and Armstrong by now.   Think he could do better than Bree as well.  

[hypochondriac]

Agree with what others are saying. Next year we need to go for promotion and then if we are successful we need to essentially buy a whole new team to have any chance of survival. 

[manji]

20 hours ago, benjii said:

Calm down, dear.

Apologies for being passionate . Maybe too many comments in there that conflict with your dumb narrative.

[SaintLondon]

I'm convinced he won't be here next year and I think his roll was to come in and instil some discipline and fitness into the squad ready for next year. I think there would have been some chat about *IF* you keep the team up then of course crack on next season but very much IF and if not, you can walk away richer with a bit of PL experience. 

Whether it's Rohl or not, who knows but I heard some chatter that Sheff United offered more money than Wednesday for Shea loan - could that be because the powers that be knew that Rohl would be managing Shea here next season? Who knows and I'm most likely talking shite anyway. 

[gio1saints]

Hollywood is full of men and women who were the prettiest / most handsome in their town. Encouraged by winning the local pageant they got on the bus hoping to become a star. 

Mostly they wait tables and wash cars and never make it. 

The players who got us promoted were amongst the best players of there position in the Championship. The prettiest and most handsome if you like to continue the analogy. But they found out there’s prettier and more handsome in Hollywood( the EPL).  
Martins style was super impressive and exotic for the locals in the championship - and ultimately did the trick - but one level up with these players who were 95% under average for epl quality ( at start of season I’d have only considered KWP as a better than average epl player) it clearly did not work.

 
Now it seems clear that there must be a plan to get out the Championship next season- but it does not follow it needs be under Juric in this more aggressive front foot style.
 

IF the players to get us up are very likely to be upgraded when we get promoted why is that not so for the Manager?  
 

Indeed, is there a specialist manager who could get us out the championship but might not be good enough for EPL?
 

With the benefit of hindsight RM got us up but if he’d been sacked and replaced by a specialist epl manager ( like Moyes) who then chucked out the players he thought inadequate and reconstructed an epl surviving team using his experience - that would have worked better. 
I don’t know if juric is right for the championship or if indeed he truly is invested in the idea were we to get relegated. What I sense is that he will get paid more than he would virtually anywhere else by staying At Saints in championship ( considering his CV) and that might be the key factor. So I’d expect him to be leading us v Hull etc next year. 

[BARCELONASAINT]

6 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Hollywood is full of men and women who were the prettiest / most handsome in their town. Encouraged by winning the local pageant they got on the bus hoping to become a star. 

Mostly they wait tables and wash cars and never make it. 

The players who got us promoted were amongst the best players of there position in the Championship. The prettiest and most handsome if you like to continue the analogy. But they found out there’s prettier and more handsome in Hollywood( the EPL).  
Martins style was super impressive and exotic for the locals in the championship - and ultimately did the trick - but one level up with these players who were 95% under average for epl quality ( at start of season I’d have only considered KWP as a better than average epl player) it clearly did not work.

 
Now it seems clear that there must be a plan to get out the Championship next season- but it does not follow it needs be under Juric in this more aggressive front foot style.
 

IF the players to get us up are very likely to be upgraded when we get promoted why is that not so for the Manager?  
 

Indeed, is there a specialist manager who could get us out the championship but might not be good enough for EPL?
 

With the benefit of hindsight RM got us up but if he’d been sacked and replaced by a specialist epl manager ( like Moyes) who then chucked out the players he thought inadequate and reconstructed an epl surviving team using his experience - that would have worked better. 
I don’t know if juric is right for the championship or if indeed he truly is invested in the idea were we to get relegated. What I sense is that he will get paid more than he would virtually anywhere else by staying At Saints in championship ( considering his CV) and that might be the key factor. So I’d expect him to be leading us v Hull etc next year. 

You could be right, of course it is all subjective.

However if you look at what Nigel Adtkins did for us with promotions only to be replaced rather quickly into our return to the Premier League. Was Adtkins harshly sacked at the time. I remember much of the fanbase being shocked the man that had delivered promotion was treated the way he was. However one might say it was ultimately the correct decision because some managers are like some players and their ceiling is the Championship. 

All i really know for definite is i'm well past caring anymore!

[Midfield_General]

2 hours ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Which is what Forest did when they first came up. Sure, everyone laughed at them, but they stayed up and now seem to be reaping the benefits 

To be fair, they largely did that because a lot of the squad that got them promoted were loans who had to go back to their parent clubs, so they didn't have a lot of choice. What they didn't do though was replace them with cheap, sub-standard squad fillers. They had no choice but to replace them, but they spent PL money on the replacements and look at them now.  

[Whitey Grandad]

16 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

You could be right, of course it is all subjective.

However if you look at what Nigel Adtkins did for us with promotions only to be replaced rather quickly into our return to the Premier League. Was Adtkins harshly sacked at the time. I remember much of the fanbase being shocked the man that had delivered promotion was treated the way he was. However one might say it was ultimately the correct decision because some managers are like some players and their ceiling is the Championship. 

All i really know for definite is i'm well past caring anymore!

You’re apathetic you are. And you don’t even care about it.

[Whitey Grandad]

30 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Hollywood is full of men and women who were the prettiest / most handsome in their town. Encouraged by winning the local pageant they got on the bus hoping to become a star. 

Mostly they wait tables and wash cars and never make it. 

The players who got us promoted were amongst the best players of there position in the Championship. The prettiest and most handsome if you like to continue the analogy. But they found out there’s prettier and more handsome in Hollywood( the EPL).  
Martins style was super impressive and exotic for the locals in the championship - and ultimately did the trick - but one level up with these players who were 95% under average for epl quality ( at start of season I’d have only considered KWP as a better than average epl player) it clearly did not work.

 
Now it seems clear that there must be a plan to get out the Championship next season- but it does not follow it needs be under Juric in this more aggressive front foot style.
 

IF the players to get us up are very likely to be upgraded when we get promoted why is that not so for the Manager?  
 

Indeed, is there a specialist manager who could get us out the championship but might not be good enough for EPL?
 

With the benefit of hindsight RM got us up but if he’d been sacked and replaced by a specialist epl manager ( like Moyes) who then chucked out the players he thought inadequate and reconstructed an epl surviving team using his experience - that would have worked better. 
I don’t know if juric is right for the championship or if indeed he truly is invested in the idea were we to get relegated. What I sense is that he will get paid more than he would virtually anywhere else by staying At Saints in championship ( considering his CV) and that might be the key factor. So I’d expect him to be leading us v Hull etc next year. 

Promotion next season or not I would much rather watch a more aggressive front foot style than tactical walking football.

That’s academic really since we are unlikely to renew our season tickets. We will probably just get memberships and cherry pick our attendances.

[gio1saints]

Leeds lost all their good players last year but are still top of the championship this year. 
We will lose all our good players at season end ( or this window!) but given the massive gap between EPL and Championship I’m still more than confident we will be good enough to be amongst the best six again next year - whatever style we play under whatever manager. 

Thats not the issue for me. I’m just so confused by it all. 

The BIG issue for me is that there’s no sure fire way of knowing who will or will not make it up a level. I thought THB would look a natural and look at least average at EPL - but he’s not been outstanding has he? James Bree looked terrible last year but Saturday his crossing was excellent and I thought he looked the part. I mean, wtf is going on? Downes looks shite but Manning is now a bright spark? Joe Aribo was a bench player but now he is a first name in MF? Sulemana is duff but is now not duff! Armstrong is a goalscorer now he’s a waste of space ? What’re alga’s TP been? Where the hell has our other centre forward gone- and Larios? What is Adam Lallana doing playing 4 minutes every week? I thought he was our genuine quality player? Tyler Dibling has to dribble past three players to give himself a chance to shoot. Wtf are the rest of the team doing watching him? Why not help him? How can Archer touch the ball only 6 times in a match - he makes invisible man look conspicuous. And what happened to Ryan Fraser? It’s all so very confusing and a mystery. Should make a good whodunnit. 
 

[Maggie May]

11 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Leeds lost all their good players last year but are still top of the championship this year. 
We will lose all our good players at season end ( or this window!) but given the massive gap between EPL and Championship I’m still more than confident we will be good enough to be amongst the best six again next year - whatever style we play under whatever manager. 

Thats not the issue for me. I’m just so confused by it all. 

The BIG issue for me is that there’s no sure fire way of knowing who will or will not make it up a level. I thought THB would look a natural and look at least average at EPL - but he’s not been outstanding has he? James Bree looked terrible last year but Saturday his crossing was excellent and I thought he looked the part. I mean, wtf is going on? Downes looks shite but Manning is now a bright spark? Joe Aribo was a bench player but now he is a first name in MF? Sulemana is duff but is now not duff! Armstrong is a goalscorer now he’s a waste of space ? What’re alga’s TP been? Where the hell has our other centre forward gone- and Larios? What is Adam Lallana doing playing 4 minutes every week? I thought he was our genuine quality player? Tyler Dibling has to dribble past three players to give himself a chance to shoot. Wtf are the rest of the team doing watching him? Why not help him? How can Archer touch the ball only 6 times in a match - he makes invisible man look conspicuous. And what happened to Ryan Fraser? It’s all so very confusing and a mystery. Should make a good whodunnit. 
 

Those 'good' players have only mustered six points and on course to be the worst Premier League team of all time.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

14 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Leeds lost all their good players last year but are still top of the championship this year. 
We will lose all our good players at season end ( or this window!) but given the massive gap between EPL and Championship I’m still more than confident we will be good enough to be amongst the best six again next year - whatever style we play under whatever manager. 

Thats not the issue for me. I’m just so confused by it all. 

The BIG issue for me is that there’s no sure fire way of knowing who will or will not make it up a level. I thought THB would look a natural and look at least average at EPL - but he’s not been outstanding has he? James Bree looked terrible last year but Saturday his crossing was excellent and I thought he looked the part. I mean, wtf is going on? Downes looks shite but Manning is now a bright spark? Joe Aribo was a bench player but now he is a first name in MF? Sulemana is duff but is now not duff! Armstrong is a goalscorer now he’s a waste of space ? What’re alga’s TP been? Where the hell has our other centre forward gone- and Larios? What is Adam Lallana doing playing 4 minutes every week? I thought he was our genuine quality player? Tyler Dibling has to dribble past three players to give himself a chance to shoot. Wtf are the rest of the team doing watching him? Why not help him? How can Archer touch the ball only 6 times in a match - he makes invisible man look conspicuous. And what happened to Ryan Fraser? It’s all so very confusing and a mystery. Should make a good whodunnit. 
 

It doesn't take a football genius to work out that Armstrong wasn't going to step up. He struggled painfully the last time we graced this league. Aribo is also shit at this level, just shows how far we have fallen that fans think he is any good. Bree also is absolutely shocking at this level. Bottom line is that we were far too loyal to the players that got us up. Whether that's on the board or RM, I doubt we will ever know. 

[Whitey Grandad]

7 minutes ago, Maggie May said:

Those 'good' players have only mustered six points and on course to be the worst Premier League team of all time.

Eleven ‘good’ players don’t necessarily make a good team.