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Kaiser Soze

By Kaiser Soze,
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Badger

Badger

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Cooper suffered with the Forest connection. Everyone thinks of Forest v Derby but Leicester is not a nice rivalry either. None of that would be an issue at SFC. 

Leicester fans didn’t like Enzo, didn’t like Cooper.

Saints fans of course don’t make a habit of constantly disliking managers. 

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Harry_SFC

Harry_SFC

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Mr Saints said:

Yeah Cooper would be the one for me. Knows the Champ for next season, and has done well enough in the Prem previously to give us a chance if we do come back up. 

Obviously Leicester haven't had a great start but I'd snap your hand off for 10 points ATM. Can't really say their squad is better than ours either. At least he doesn't follow a deluded philosophy at all costs like RM. 

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Mr Saints

Mr Saints

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Obviously Leicester haven't had a great start but I'd snap your hand off for 10 points ATM. Can't really say their squad is better than ours either. At least he doesn't follow a deluded philosophy at all costs like RM. 

Agreed. Actually played good football at Swansea and Forest. Good, sensible, non suicidal football.

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted
On 24/11/2024 at 19:57, Badger said:

Leicester fans didn’t like Enzo, didn’t like Cooper.

Saints fans of course don’t make a habit of constantly disliking managers. 

The Cooper appointment was massively ill-judged by Leicester. He was onto the back foot immediately due to his previous Forest connections.

They didn't read the room on that one at all. He never stood a chance.

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Saint Mikey

Saint Mikey

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, coalman said:

Lampard has gone to Coventry. RVN about to go to Leicester.

Leaving the way clear for Saints to get Potter... LOL

I've previously thought that Potter would be unrealistic, but it depends if he wants to get back into management and the PL. The only jobs realistically available at any point soon are:

1. Newcastle. Unlikely Howe is going to get the chop mid-season and you'd fancy them to want a higher profile manager.
2. West Ham. The board do tend to back managers, so Lopetegui has probably got til the end of the season as they won't get relegated.
3. Wolves. Most likely IMO if O'Neill doesn't get them properly clear. There's enough in the squad for any manager to fancy keeping them up.
4. Everton. Potentially, if Dyche gets the chop but the squad there isn't great and they're banking on the takeover to cure all ills. Still a better prospect than us.
5. Palace. See Steve Cooper, would be onto a hiding to nothing with his Brighton connections. Squad has enough though.
6. Us. He's got a sure fire relegation on his CV if he takes the job and then it's a rebuild in the Champ, so he'd need to be bought into the longish term.

I'd say it's unlikely for any other job in the PL to be available this season. So, whilst I still think it's unlikely. It's not like he's got an array of options, so it may come down to timing. Of course, he could go abroad or, end up like Alan Curbishley - turning down jobs until people forget that he's a manager and then stop getting offers.
 

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Dellyears

Dellyears

Posted
Posted

Moyes would not be my choice, he has too many disasters on his CV. Graham Potter is my choice
not because he once played for us but because he got Brighton into the force they are now
and he did it with an exciting attacking style. We've been turgid for too long, right back to Puel, we've
got over his style.

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Farmer Saint

Farmer Saint

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Dellyears said:

Moyes would not be my choice, he has too many disasters on his CV. Graham Potter is my choice
not because he once played for us but because he got Brighton into the force they are now
and he did it with an exciting attacking style. We've been turgid for too long, right back to Puel, we've
got over his style.

So, you don't know anything about Potter's football style then - it's very similar to Russ's, possession based and maybe even slightly more defensive. His team's don't score many goals, but tend to defend quite well. The football is not exciting.

By the time he left the Brighton fans were soooo happy he was out. No idea why he is rated as highly as he is tbh.

Just found this nugget online about him as well - remind you of anyone:

"Player selection

Potter prefers players who are brave, enjoy football, and aren't afraid to make mistakes."

Good article on him below, and his time at Brighton:

https://analyticsfc.co.uk/blog/2022/09/20/data-in-context-how-did-graham-potters-brighton-achieve-a-big-six-style-of-play-with-a-bottom-six-budget/

"The first and clearest difference that can be seen in Brighton’s first two PL season’s under Hughton, compared to the subsequent seasons under Potter, is their directness, featured on the bottom axis in green, measured by their total passes per sequence (PPS – a sequence defined as events from gain of possession until loss of possession, stoppage in play, or a shot). On this axis there is a very clear difference between Hughton’s very direct Brighton and Potter’s. Brighton’s early sides appear alongside the likes of Burnley, Everton, Newcastle, and Watford, all sides that looked for fast attacking transitions to exploit space behind an opposition when gaining possession in the 2021/22 season. After their managerial change Brighton transitioned incredibly quickly to their new style, becoming far more patient and less direct. In their first season under the new manager, The Seagulls put together 11.9 passes per sequence, the third highest in the dataset after possession-heavy sides Manchester City and Liverpool. "

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tdmickey3

tdmickey3

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, OldNick said:

For those advocating Moyes

On 22 May 2017, Moyes resigned as Sunderland manager after the club finished bottom of the Premier League

You are losing it, Moyes won a European trophy with West Ham recently 

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted
Just now, tdmickey3 said:

You are losing it, Moyes won a European trophy with West Ham recently 

So he did the Hammers fans wanted him gone still. He got relegated with a club in a similar position to us, and so thats a better example if he could help us

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tdmickey3

tdmickey3

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, OldNick said:

So he did the Hammers fans wanted him gone still. He got relegated with a club in a similar position to us, and so thats a better example if he could help us

We have a manager who has one nothing except be big contender for most goals conceded wherever he goe

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benali-shorts

benali-shorts

Posted
Posted

Who are the realistic options?

Potter - waiting for bigger/better option? West Ham / Wolves more attractive for him.

Moyes - squad totally unsuited to his methods (although quite what they are suited for is anyone's guess)

Cooper - has Championship experience and is obtainable.

O'Neill - will need a break, awkward Skate connection

Martin - rinse and repeat, to some sort of fantastical end game of becoming the best possession-based team to have graced mid-table Championship levels.

Are there any others? If that's the list (plus keeping RM), I'd go for Cooper. Or Rohl if SR think they can persuade him we're a better option that Sheff Weds, but (and I can't believe I'm saying this), I imagine he'd think taking Wednesday to the top 6 would be better for his CV than getting this lot to 11 points. 

 

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Gloucester Saint

Gloucester Saint

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, benali-shorts said:

Who are the realistic options?

Potter - waiting for bigger/better option? West Ham / Wolves more attractive for him.

Moyes - squad totally unsuited to his methods (although quite what they are suited for is anyone's guess)

Cooper - has Championship experience and is obtainable.

O'Neill - will need a break, awkward Skate connection

Martin - rinse and repeat, to some sort of fantastical end game of becoming the best possession-based team to have graced mid-table Championship levels.

Are there any others? If that's the list (plus keeping RM), I'd go for Cooper. Or Rohl if SR think they can persuade him we're a better option that Sheff Weds, but (and I can't believe I'm saying this), I imagine he'd think taking Wednesday to the top 6 would be better for his CV than getting this lot to 11 points. 

 

Cooper is the obvious choice.

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Holmes_and_Watson

Holmes_and_Watson

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, benali-shorts said:

Who are the realistic options?

Potter - waiting for bigger/better option? West Ham / Wolves more attractive for him.

Moyes - squad totally unsuited to his methods (although quite what they are suited for is anyone's guess)

Cooper - has Championship experience and is obtainable.

O'Neill - will need a break, awkward Skate connection

Martin - rinse and repeat, to some sort of fantastical end game of becoming the best possession-based team to have graced mid-table Championship levels.

Are there any others? If that's the list (plus keeping RM), I'd go for Cooper. Or Rohl if SR think they can persuade him we're a better option that Sheff Weds, but (and I can't believe I'm saying this), I imagine he'd think taking Wednesday to the top 6 would be better for his CV than getting this lot to 11 points. 

 

A realistic option is any manager who has ever got 3 wins from 24 games, with a struggling/ bottom half side in this league.

The downside for them is having a large squad of players who are capable of more. The successful candidate will also  receive premier league wages.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

Posted
Posted

Moyes is the best option and I don't agree the squad are unsuited to his methods. We have Onuachu, BBD and Cornet who have all proven to be aerial threats in the past, we have pace in the side in Armstrong, Sulemana and Archer, we have creative midfielders in Fernandes and Dibling (and Lallana). 

Moyes could get this squad competing I have no doubt about it. 

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Chewy

Chewy

Posted
Posted

I’d like Rohl personally. I mean, I’d really like Potter but don’t see it happening. I’d be happy with Cooper. I’d be ok with Moyes (no one is saving this season so not sure I see the point in an arch pragmatist now).

But I think Rohl is equipping himself really well, has a connection, no baggage and is attainable.

On the face of it his current clubs predicament is far more attractive to ours, but Sheff Weds are skint, have a bonkers owner (yes yes, I know…) and he’s probably getting them as far as he possibly can. Whereas whatever happens between now and August we’re still likely to be one of the favourites and biggest clubs in next years championship, with one of the biggest budgets.

We will be an attractive proposition for someone like him offering a very realistic chance of being a premier league manager the following season.

 

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Sergei Gotsmanov

Sergei Gotsmanov

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

Moyes is the best option and I don't agree the squad are unsuited to his methods. We have Onuachu, BBD and Cornet who have all proven to be aerial threats in the past, we have pace in the side in Armstrong, Sulemana and Archer, we have creative midfielders in Fernandes and Dibling (and Lallana). 

Moyes could get this squad competing I have no doubt about it. 

It is a good team. We have demonstrated that recently. You cannot though just gift goals away and expect to win.

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Miltonaggro

Miltonaggro

Posted
Posted

Would take almost anyone to escape this turgid death by a thousand cuts.  Truly awful last night regardless of the quality gap of the opposition, Martin completely out-thought by the man who turned us down to gift him the job.  Board need to give the fans some fucking hope for next season. 

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Badger

Badger

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Chewy said:

I’d like Rohl personally. I mean, I’d really like Potter but don’t see it happening. I’d be happy with Cooper. I’d be ok with Moyes (no one is saving this season so not sure I see the point in an arch pragmatist now).

But I think Rohl is equipping himself really well, has a connection, no baggage and is attainable.

On the face of it his current clubs predicament is far more attractive to ours, but Sheff Weds are skint, have a bonkers owner (yes yes, I know…) and he’s probably getting them as far as he possibly can. Whereas whatever happens between now and August we’re still likely to be one of the favourites and biggest clubs in next years championship, with one of the biggest budgets.

We will be an attractive proposition for someone like him offering a very realistic chance of being a premier league manager the following season.

 

I think you might be overplaying the 'connection' with the club' to be honest, and we don't really know how the relationship here really ended.

As a longer term option rather than 'quick fix' , I agree with you, but would see that kind of appointment more likely at the end of season rather than now.

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Farmer Saint

Farmer Saint

Posted
Posted
37 minutes ago, Chewy said:

I’d like Rohl personally. I mean, I’d really like Potter but don’t see it happening. I’d be happy with Cooper. I’d be ok with Moyes (no one is saving this season so not sure I see the point in an arch pragmatist now).

But I think Rohl is equipping himself really well, has a connection, no baggage and is attainable.

On the face of it his current clubs predicament is far more attractive to ours, but Sheff Weds are skint, have a bonkers owner (yes yes, I know…) and he’s probably getting them as far as he possibly can. Whereas whatever happens between now and August we’re still likely to be one of the favourites and biggest clubs in next years championship, with one of the biggest budgets.

We will be an attractive proposition for someone like him offering a very realistic chance of being a premier league manager the following season.

 

I'd give Danny Rohl a try tbh.

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Farmer Saint

Farmer Saint

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

Moyes is the best option and I don't agree the squad are unsuited to his methods. We have Onuachu, BBD and Cornet who have all proven to be aerial threats in the past, we have pace in the side in Armstrong, Sulemana and Archer, we have creative midfielders in Fernandes and Dibling (and Lallana). 

Moyes could get this squad competing I have no doubt about it. 

But he's not interested.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

Posted
Posted
54 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

But he's not interested.

Then make him interested. Contract till the end of the season only with a huge bonus if we stay up. Even if we do stay up he's not tied into anything, if we go down everyone will know the damage was done before he came in. 

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Farmer Saint

Farmer Saint

Posted
Posted
35 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

Then make him interested. Contract till the end of the season only with a huge bonus if we stay up. Even if we do stay up he's not tied into anything, if we go down everyone will know the damage was done before he came in. 

Well why don't we try to bring in Klopp then. Make him interested as you say.

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

Moyes is the best option and I don't agree the squad are unsuited to his methods. We have Onuachu, BBD and Cornet who have all proven to be aerial threats in the past, we have pace in the side in Armstrong, Sulemana and Archer, we have creative midfielders in Fernandes and Dibling (and Lallana). 

Moyes could get this squad competing I have no doubt about it. 

I think those are good points, but the fans have to accept he plays a turgid style. I also point out he was relegated at Sunderland

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franniesTache

franniesTache

Posted
Posted

He now has officially the worst top flight record of any saints manager at this stage of the season, "beating" Steve WIgley who had 9 points after 14 games.

What gets me is how much Martin reminds me of Branfoot.

Not for style of play obviously, but the fact that he's got "his system", he refuses to change "his system" even when it's clear it doesn't work, he also has "his favourites" who no matter how badly they do won't be removed, and he has a level of extreme arrogance that simply doesn't map to the results.

The only difference is that so far he's not gone after the fans, but given it a few weeks and i don't think it's out of the question that happens.

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DrunkenSaint

DrunkenSaint

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Sevvy said:

I'd expect it will be someone from Europe we have never heard of, 

That would be fine with me if they play a good style of football like the high press. The Bournemouth manager was pretty unknown and they play a good pressing style of football. I do wonder why we didnt keep following up by getting in high pressing managers, we bought it to the premier league when Poch came to us, Koeman played the pressing style slightly different and Ralph brought it back after a few disasters, that style of football is becoming pretty popular over in Germany. It's certainly a better style than the style we currently play now. Maybe there is a hidden gem abroad that would be willing to rebuild a team in the Championship, Leeds managed to get Bielsa so why not.

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