New manager

[Whitey Grandad]

13 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

OK, a little summary…

1. We can’t afford to offload Russ.

2. Russball has been adopted across the club…it’s a long term project therefore that the club have invested in.

3. No one of any pedigree will come to us because the season is effectively over, bar a massive up turn in squad quality and performances, which would be a big ask of even the best managers. Consequently Russ is de facto the best option to keep things stable during the transition to the Championship.

4. When we go down, Russ will be seen as the best value option to get us back up, even though we’ll likely lose our better players…(Dibling, Ramsdale, KWP and ???).

As much as I hate admitting it, everything points to Russ being here for the long haul. The club don’t give a fig that we’ll be winning all the wrong records by sticking with him - it’ll all come good in the end.

If so then that saves me the cost of a season ticket next year.

[Farmer Saint]

5 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

If so then that saves me the cost of a season ticket next year.

I'd have assumed as you knew he was here this year you would have opted out of one? 

[Saint Fan CaM]

5 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

If so then that saves me the cost of a season ticket next year.

I decided to part with mine after the last relegation purely based on not enjoying the football. I couldn’t have imagined that it could get even worse after supposedly repairing everything ready for promotion to the Prem again. Just shows how incredibly complacent the club have been in the transfer market (for some years).

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

I'd have assumed as you knew he was here this year you would have opted out of one? 

I gave it serious thought but I promised my late wife that I would keep taking my grandson.

Besides, any sensible business would have changed its chief executive for someone more suitable to the new level of operations.

Edited October 29 by Whitey Grandad

[Wade Garrett]

40 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

OK, a little summary…

1. We can’t afford to offload Russ.

2. Russball has been adopted across the club…it’s a long term project therefore that the club have invested in.

3. No one of any pedigree will come to us because the season is effectively over, bar a massive up turn in squad quality and performances, which would be a big ask of even the best managers. Consequently Russ is de facto the best option to keep things stable during the transition to the Championship.

4. When we go down, Russ will be seen as the best value option to get us back up, even though we’ll likely lose our better players…(Dibling, Ramsdale, KWP and ???).

As much as I hate admitting it, everything points to Russ being here for the long haul. The club don’t give a fig that we’ll be winning all the wrong records by sticking with him - it’ll all come good in the end.

Magnificent business plan.  Dragons Den wouldn’t give the club a fiver between them.

Good job it’s Dragan’s Den.  He’s happy to spunk hundreds of millions down the shitter.

[Farmer Saint]

28 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

I gave it serious thought but I promised my late wife that I would keep taking my grandson.

Besides, any sensible business would have changed its chief executive for someone more suitable to the new level of operations.

Sorry to hear about your wife 😔

[DT]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

OK, a little summary…

1. We can’t afford to offload Russ.

2. Russball has been adopted across the club…it’s a long term project therefore that the club have invested in.

3. No one of any pedigree will come to us because the season is effectively over, bar a massive up turn in squad quality and performances, which would be a big ask of even the best managers. Consequently Russ is de facto the best option to keep things stable during the transition to the Championship.

4. When we go down, Russ will be seen as the best value option to get us back up, even though we’ll likely lose our better players…(Dibling, Ramsdale, KWP and ???).

As much as I hate admitting it, everything points to Russ being here for the long haul. The club don’t give a fig that we’ll be winning all the wrong records by sticking with him - it’ll all come good in the end.

All of which leaves us quite staggeringly vulnerable if, when we go down, he gets a better offer and pisses off. Which is highly probable. We are being mugs. 

[Whitey Grandad]

18 minutes ago, DT said:

All of which leaves us quite staggeringly vulnerable if, when we go down, he gets a better offer and pisses off. Which is highly probable. We are being mugs. 

And we are being mugged.

[SWLondon Saint]

1 hour ago, DT said:

All of which leaves us quite staggeringly vulnerable if, when we go down, he gets a better offer and pisses off. Which is highly probable. We are being mugs. 

I don't think he will get a better offer, even though he is clearly aiming to do a Kompany - ie putting his ideals and 'philosophy' above results and leverage that into a better job. Fact is a) he is doing a massive lot worse than Kompany did last season, and b) Kompany has an amazing playing record to fall back on. I think the likelihood may well be the club plans to stick with him through relegation, as Burnley planned to, and hope he actually learns enough and secures promotion again to have a better shot in 2 years.

[adrian lord]

If we are still bottom and/or winless after Everton and Wolves, and he’s not sacked at that point, then we know that they are letting him take us back down again. Think that’s the last really viable point in the season for a change that could get us out of this mire. 

[tdmickey3]

Martin is staying at Saints until either Stephens or Smallbone get the Ballon d`or  

[DT]

10 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Martin is staying at Saints until either Stephens or Smallbone get the Ballon d`or  

Ballon de merde

[Saint Fan CaM]

40 minutes ago, adrian lord said:

If we are still bottom and/or winless after Everton and Wolves, and he’s not sacked at that point, then we know that they are letting him take us back down again. Think that’s the last really viable point in the season for a change that could get us out of this mire. 

My feeling is the damage is done now and not just regarding the lack of points. Think about how difficult it will be for the players to change course mid-season and produce results. We need to face facts…the Prem has moved on…got better, because other clubs have invested better in their playing staff in the same way we did when we had Pelle, Mane etc. We allowed the impetus to fall off a cliff and here we are…significantly short of quality in key areas of the pitch and a Manager who thinks he can make a purse out of a sows ear. We are just another also ran club like Derby, Swansea, Sunderland etc etc., not able to attract or keep hold of the better players or staff in the business.

Did Dragan and SR actually think they’d turn Saints FC into a footballing giant by investing in the manner they have, both in terms of funding and competency? I don’t believe they are that stupid - hence, Russ is a long term project…come what may.

[Whitey Grandad]

11 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

My feeling is the damage is done now and not just regarding the lack of points. Think about how difficult it will be for the players to change course mid-season and produce results. We need to face facts…the Prem has moved on…got better, because other clubs have invested better in their playing staff in the same way we did when we had Pelle, Mane etc. We allowed the impetus to fall off a cliff and here we are…significantly short of quality in key areas of the pitch and a Manager who thinks he can make a purse out of a sows ear. We are just another also ran club like Derby, Swansea, Sunderland etc etc., not able to attract or keep hold of the better players or staff in the business.

Did Dragan and SR actually think they’d turn Saints FC into a footballing giant by investing in the manner they have, both in terms of funding and competency? I don’t believe they are that stupid - hence, Russ is a long term project…come what may.

The problem is that Russball will never work. He’s taking us up a dead end road with no turning spaces.

[Dellyears]

13 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The problem is that Russball will never work. He’s taking us up a dead end road with no turning spaces.

Everyone is trying to copy the Man City way but haven't got the players to achieve it. then we look ridiculous passing the ball around to no purpose other than infuriating the crowd. its a very boring style. RM still calls it 'fun' but I haven't seen the funny side yet.

[Turkish]

5 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

OK, a little summary…

1. We can’t afford to offload Russ.

2. Russball has been adopted across the club…it’s a long term project therefore that the club have invested in.

3. No one of any pedigree will come to us because the season is effectively over, bar a massive up turn in squad quality and performances, which would be a big ask of even the best managers. Consequently Russ is de facto the best option to keep things stable during the transition to the Championship.

4. When we go down, Russ will be seen as the best value option to get us back up, even though we’ll likely lose our better players…(Dibling, Ramsdale, KWP and ???).

As much as I hate admitting it, everything points to Russ being here for the long haul. The club don’t give a fig that we’ll be winning all the wrong records by sticking with him - their strategy is that it’ll all come good in the end.

We are a philosophy football club. We are a player trading football club. Results are just noise.

 

 

Edited October 29 by Turkish

[richardc]

52 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The problem is that Russball will never work. He’s taking us up a dead end road with no turning spaces.

I dont think its that Russball will never work - Its that we are so bad at it and Martin has no idea how to teach it - If you see City or anyone else the players immediately spread themselves out across the pitch to make it hard to close down and the players without the ball immediately run to make space for an option to  be passed too or the receiving midfielders turn with the ball to open up space to transition quickly - we just do the opposite which is why we are doing so badly

[Farmer Saint]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

The problem is that Russball will never work. He’s taking us up a dead end road with no turning spaces.

You say that but we got promoted last season. If that was the aim then clearly it was a successful season. If they're not overly worried about maintaining status in the Prem and are more looking to use Saints as a shop window for young players then that also works.

[Wade Garrett]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

My feeling is the damage is done now and not just regarding the lack of points. Think about how difficult it will be for the players to change course mid-season and produce results. We need to face facts…the Prem has moved on…got better, because other clubs have invested better in their playing staff in the same way we did when we had Pelle, Mane etc. We allowed the impetus to fall off a cliff and here we are…significantly short of quality in key areas of the pitch and a Manager who thinks he can make a purse out of a sows ear. We are just another also ran club like Derby, Swansea, Sunderland etc etc., not able to attract or keep hold of the better players or staff in the business.

Did Dragan and SR actually think they’d turn Saints FC into a footballing giant by investing in the manner they have, both in terms of funding and competency? I don’t believe they are that stupid - hence, Russ is a long term project…come what may.

Fair point, but Alan Ball implemented a simple style of play overnight, as did Poch and Strachan.

 

[franniesTache]

38 minutes ago, Turkish said:

We are a philosophy football club. We are a player trading football club. Results are just noise.

The new five pledges

1. We pass, therefore we are

2. If stats did not exist there would be a need to invent them

3. All that is necessary for the triumph of passing is that good players don't shoot

4. Attacking is counterrevolutionary

5. Let us ban all applause, the Northam is everywhere!

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

3 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

Fair point, but Alan Ball implemented a simple style of play overnight, as did Poch and Strachan.

 

And Hoddle, who as we all know had no qualms with changing the shape of the side early in a game if it wasn’t working.

What a shame he acted the twat and dirtied on us, would have been good to have him leading us into a brand new St Mary’s.

[franniesTache]

9 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

Fair point, but Alan Ball implemented a simple style of play overnight, as did Poch and Strachan.

 

Alan Ball had the perfect style of play for what we had at the time... 

Get. The. Ball. To. Le Tiss.

And it worked a fucking treat too.

[Weston Super Saint]

4 minutes ago, franniesTache said:

Alan Ball had the perfect style of play for what we had at the time... 

Get. The. Ball. To. Le Tiss.

And it worked a fucking treat too.

We have the same philosophy - get the ball to Janny B.

Granted it's not as effective but it's a style of play nonetheless.

[badgerx16]

If ( when ) we go down, we won't be coming straight back up if Russ remains in charge. I think we will become just another Norwich / Middlesbrough / WBA type club, living on past glories and unable to deliver on aspirations whilst constantly being referred to as "sleeping giants", flirting with the playoffs but never quite able to climb the final step.

 

[gio1saints]

2 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

My feeling is the damage is done now and not just regarding the lack of points. Think about how difficult it will be for the players to change course mid-season and produce results. We need to face facts…the Prem has moved on…got better, because other clubs have invested better in their playing staff in the same way we did when we had Pelle, Mane etc. We allowed the impetus to fall off a cliff and here we are…significantly short of quality in key areas of the pitch and a Manager who thinks he can make a purse out of a sows ear. We are just another also ran club like Derby, Swansea, Sunderland etc etc., not able to attract or keep hold of the better players or staff in the business.

Did Dragan and SR actually think they’d turn Saints FC into a footballing giant by investing in the manner they have, both in terms of funding and competency? I don’t believe they are that stupid - hence, Russ is a long term project…come what may.

I think that your conclusion is correct - that RM is for staying. 
 

I still do not get why so many people expected us to be EPL level overnight. And seem so angry that we are not. Are they all unable to just think ahead a bit and see what the likeliest scenario was for us and take some deep breathes and get on with this learning curve? 

It  took Sir Alex Ferguson 7 seasons to win the league for Man Utd, which is 6.75 years more than many here are prepared to give RM. 

IF RM and Saints learning curve is too slow and too shallow for sure we are relegated. We may already be. But if anyone thought this was an unlikely scenario whichever manager whichever formation we played- well I think they may  have been overconfident -and unaware of the reality of statistics on the survival chances of newly promoted teams. 
 

Is he trying to do something spectacular? I think yes. Is he just trying to survive- I think no. Is that inspirational or is it stupid? I prefer to consider it extremely daring- and yes, courageous because he knows it’s odds against and still refuses to give up. but foolish? Yeah foolish at same time especially the amount pathetic and disgusting abuse he has to endure from some of you.,
 

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way so it may be closer than people suppose at the end. 
 

If we change manages, style, personnel- my opinion is we will just go down and it’s a toss up if we keep the new guy in the championship- and wether we can regroup to come back up.
 

Whereas I’d like to think if RM took us down with what he and team have learned in two seasons we’d be hot favourites to get promoted and have a better stab at the EPL next time. 
Thats what I think. Wail away moaning Millie’s. 

Edited October 29 by gio1saints

[Dark Munster]

2 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Did Dragan and SR actually think they’d turn Saints FC into a footballing giant by investing in the manner they have, both in terms of funding and competency? I don’t believe they are that stupid - hence, Russ is a long term project…come what may.

Trust me, they are. 

[Midfield_General]

2 hours ago, tdmickey3 said:

Martin is staying at Saints until either Stephens or Smallbone get the Ballon d`or  

Bellen d'or more like

[Lee On Solent Saint]

16 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

I think that your conclusion is correct - that RM is for staying. 
 

I still do not get why so many people expected us to be EPL level overnight. And seem so angry that we are not. Are they all unable to just think ahead a bit and see what the likeliest scenario was for us and take some deep breathes and get on with this learning curve? 

It  took Sir Alex Ferguson 7 seasons to win the league for Man Utd, which is 6.75 years more than many here are prepared to give RM. 

IF RM and Saints learning curve is too slow and too shallow for sure we are relegated. We may already be. But if anyone thought this was an unlikely scenario whichever manager whichever formation we played- well I think they may  have been overconfident -and unaware of the reality of statistics on the survival chances of newly promoted teams. 
 

Is he trying to do something spectacular? I think yes. Is he just trying to survive- I think no. Is that inspirational or is it stupid? I prefer to consider it extremely daring- and yes, courageous because he knows it’s odds against and still refuses to give up. but foolish? Yeah foolish at same time especially the amount pathetic and disgusting abuse he has to endure from some of you.,
 

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way so it may be closer than people suppose at the end. 
 

If we change manages, style, personnel- my opinion is we will just go down and it’s a toss up if we keep the new guy in the championship- and wether we can regroup to come back up.
 

Whereas I’d like to think if RM took us down with what he and team have learned in two seasons we’d be hot favourites to get promoted and have a better stab at the EPL next time. 
Thats what I think. Wail away moaning Millie’s. 

I've said this on many other threads, if we go down and Martin is still in charge next season, St Mary's is going to be half empty from the get go. 

[Farmer Saint]

53 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

If ( when ) we go down, we won't be coming straight back up if Russ remains in charge. I think we will become just another Norwich / Middlesbrough / WBA type club, living on past glories and unable to deliver on aspirations whilst constantly being referred to as "sleeping giants", flirting with the playoffs but never quite able to climb the final step.

 

Just out of interest, why do you think we wouldn't come back up? We got promoted off the back of a new Manager playing a completely new style of football last season. Arguably we'd also have a better team as well as can't see many of our players moving on.

[tdmickey3]

23 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

I think that your conclusion is correct - that RM is for staying. 
 

I still do not get why so many people expected us to be EPL level overnight. And seem so angry that we are not. Are they all unable to just think ahead a bit and see what the likeliest scenario was for us and take some deep breathes and get on with this learning curve? 

It  took Sir Alex Ferguson 7 seasons to win the league for Man Utd, which is 6.75 years more than many here are prepared to give RM. 

IF RM and Saints learning curve is too slow and too shallow for sure we are relegated. We may already be. But if anyone thought this was an unlikely scenario whichever manager whichever formation we played- well I think they may  have been overconfident -and unaware of the reality of statistics on the survival chances of newly promoted teams. 
 

Is he trying to do something spectacular? I think yes. Is he just trying to survive- I think no. Is that inspirational or is it stupid? I prefer to consider it extremely daring- and yes, courageous because he knows it’s odds against and still refuses to give up. but foolish? Yeah foolish at same time especially the amount pathetic and disgusting abuse he has to endure from some of you.,
 

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way so it may be closer than people suppose at the end. 
 

If we change manages, style, personnel- my opinion is we will just go down and it’s a toss up if we keep the new guy in the championship- and wether we can regroup to come back up.
 

Whereas I’d like to think if RM took us down with what he and team have learned in two seasons we’d be hot favourites to get promoted and have a better stab at the EPL next time. 
Thats what I think. Wail away moaning Millie’s. 

The depth of bullshit you post gets ever deeper, my favourite bit of crap was comparing Martin to Alex Ferguson, hilarious🤣

Will Martin have "wail" about scar tissue 🙄 when we are relegated with record low points tally and an equally bad goals conceded tally......... 

Of course he wont, (ridiculous excuse anyway) and if we have this mythical scar tissue next season he will have to take responsibly for it, fat chance

Do you think fans will just accept this fiasco and be happy next season to let him carry on with the nonsense... and i dont include you and the other cheerleaders

[Give it to Ron]

39 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

I think that your conclusion is correct - that RM is for staying. 
 

I still do not get why so many people expected us to be EPL level overnight. And seem so angry that we are not. Are they all unable to just think ahead a bit and see what the likeliest scenario was for us and take some deep breathes and get on with this learning curve? 

It  took Sir Alex Ferguson 7 seasons to win the league for Man Utd, which is 6.75 years more than many here are prepared to give RM. 

IF RM and Saints learning curve is too slow and too shallow for sure we are relegated. We may already be. But if anyone thought this was an unlikely scenario whichever manager whichever formation we played- well I think they may  have been overconfident -and unaware of the reality of statistics on the survival chances of newly promoted teams. 
 

Is he trying to do something spectacular? I think yes. Is he just trying to survive- I think no. Is that inspirational or is it stupid? I prefer to consider it extremely daring- and yes, courageous because he knows it’s odds against and still refuses to give up. but foolish? Yeah foolish at same time especially the amount pathetic and disgusting abuse he has to endure from some of you.,
 

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way so it may be closer than people suppose at the end. 
 

If we change manages, style, personnel- my opinion is we will just go down and it’s a toss up if we keep the new guy in the championship- and wether we can regroup to come back up.
 

Whereas I’d like to think if RM took us down with what he and team have learned in two seasons we’d be hot favourites to get promoted and have a better stab at the EPL next time. 
Thats what I think. Wail away moaning Millie’s. 

Why would we be hot favourites last time we finished 4th? So your theory is we get better at a system that doesn’t work . We only got promotion because we abandoned that or are you ignoring that fact?

[obelisk]

56 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way

Not a chance. Even opponents in the Championship had worked out how to counter Russball in the end. It took EPL opponents a few seconds. There's no evidence at all that Martin's style will ever be successful. None. Zilch. It's just not possible to score enough to counter the number of goals conceded by his teams. There really are no sunlit uplands.

[gio1saints]

10 minutes ago, Give it to Ron said:

Why would we be hot favourites last time we finished 4th? So your theory is we get better at a system that doesn’t work . We only got promotion because we abandoned that or are you ignoring that fact?

Sry mate I know you are a massive long term fan but your argument does not work on multiple levels for me. 

1. relegated teams are always amongst the favourites to get promoted. With a Manager who knows how to get up from that league we’d be even more favoured. Without the instability of managerial/ personnel and style overhaul even more favoured. Not rocket science. 
2. the system RM uses DID work in the championship and were it not for ridiculously once in many many moons form from the other three we’d have walked the league. A record unbeaten run and if you think it was because the rest of the teams were poor - well it’s the championship - that’s the standard we have to be able to beat. And we did enough. 

3. We did not abandon PB football and get promoted accordingly. Russball put us in the position to get promoted. It’s the other way around but not for diehard RM out people I guess. We put more defenders on the pitch for Leeds and WBA - 5 at the back - but if you were at Wembley ( I’m sure you were) you might have noticed a I think 15 pass move for our goal from defence to attack before AA scores. That is exhibit 1.01 classic totally recognisable Russball. And THAT is a fact. We still passed the ball around them like they weren’t there and when it works - as per AA in the Final Playoff- it’s a thing of great beauty that we are all proud of. 

[CB Fry]

1 hour ago, gio1saints said:

I think that your conclusion is correct - that RM is for staying. 
 

I still do not get why so many people expected us to be EPL level overnight. And seem so angry that we are not. Are they all unable to just think ahead a bit and see what the likeliest scenario was for us and take some deep breathes and get on with this learning curve? 

It  took Sir Alex Ferguson 7 seasons to win the league for Man Utd, which is 6.75 years more than many here are prepared to give RM. 

IF RM and Saints learning curve is too slow and too shallow for sure we are relegated. We may already be. But if anyone thought this was an unlikely scenario whichever manager whichever formation we played- well I think they may  have been overconfident -and unaware of the reality of statistics on the survival chances of newly promoted teams. 
 

Is he trying to do something spectacular? I think yes. Is he just trying to survive- I think no. Is that inspirational or is it stupid? I prefer to consider it extremely daring- and yes, courageous because he knows it’s odds against and still refuses to give up. but foolish? Yeah foolish at same time especially the amount pathetic and disgusting abuse he has to endure from some of you.,
 

 I think the likeliest outcome is we will go down - but get better and better at playing this way so it may be closer than people suppose at the end. 
 

If we change manages, style, personnel- my opinion is we will just go down and it’s a toss up if we keep the new guy in the championship- and wether we can regroup to come back up.
 

Whereas I’d like to think if RM took us down with what he and team have learned in two seasons we’d be hot favourites to get promoted and have a better stab at the EPL next time. 
Thats what I think. Wail away moaning Millie’s. 

Jesus wept.

He's only gone and pressed the "He's just like Alex Ferguson" button.

Every single post this guy makes is based on the premise that Russell Martin is the greatest football manager alive today and everything else is simply waiting for the rest of the world to realise his genius.

It's absolutely insane.

 

In 18 months time Russell Martin will be just another nothing manager who got one team promoted once, just like Aidy Boothroyd or Chris Wilder or Chris Hughton or Scott Parker or Steve Cooper or whoever you like. Just a ten a penny mediocrity. Nothing special.

He's not the second coming of Alex Ferguson FFS.

[Midfield_General]

54 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Just out of interest, why do you think we wouldn't come back up? We got promoted off the back of a new Manager playing a completely new style of football last season. Arguably we'd also have a better team as well as can't see many of our players moving on.

The Champ is littered with clubs who have got stuck down there though. 

Luton were in the Prem last year and by this point last season they had 5 times the number of points we've currently got. After 12 games back in the Championship they are currently in the relegation zone. 

Leeds probably thought they'd stroll back up. 

Sheffield United, West Brom, Watford, Norwich, Middlesbrough, Stoke - all comparable clubs to us, all had decent stints in the Prem, now having to scrap it out to try and get into the play-offs. Most of them will fail. 

This idea that it's not that big a deal to get relegated because we'll just get promoted again is madness. The Championship is a horrible league to get out of, and some might say we were bloody lucky to do it last time. There are absolutely no guarantees we'd do it again at the first time of asking, or indeed at all, especially when our recruitment is so hit-and-miss. Once you're down there, it can be permanent. 

Edited October 29 by Midfield_General

[badgerx16]

29 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Just out of interest, why do you think we wouldn't come back up? We got promoted off the back of a new Manager playing a completely new style of football last season. Arguably we'd also have a better team as well as can't see many of our players moving on.

1) I disagree that the team will be better next time. I think that, as well as the obvious departures - Ramsdale, KWP, Dibling,  etc, that several others that we retained last time won't want to stay for another slog in the Championship.

2) We will go down as by far the weakest of the three relegated teams, and will probably be inferior to teams such as Leeds, so at best 4th or 5th strongest in the division, but I think we would fall short in a highly competitive fight for the payoff places.

3) Russ was pretty much found out last season, the unbeaten run hid a number of flaws and weaknesses that will be open to exploitation again. We will continue to fanny about at the back and teams will simply press high and early and overrun our midfield. Another season of over 60 goals conceded, par for the course with Russ.

[aintforever]

5 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

1) I disagree that the team will be better next time. I think that, as well as the obvious departures - Ramsdale, KWP, Dibling,  etc, that several others that we retained last time won't want to stay for another slog in the Championship.

2) We will go down as by far the weakest of the three relegated teams, and will probably be inferior to teams such as Leeds, so at best 4th or 5th strongest in the division, but I think we would fall short in a highly competitive fight for the payoff places.

3) Russ was pretty much found out last season, the unbeaten run hid a number of flaws and weaknesses that will be open to exploitation again. We will continue to fanny about at the back and teams will simply press high and early and overrun our midfield. Another season of over 60 goals conceded, par for the course with Russ.

I can't agree with that, we have a large squad loaded with Championship quality players most of whom no Premier League side would want. I would say we would be much better equipped than last time.

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I've said this on many other threads, if we go down and Martin is still in charge next season, St Mary's is going to be half empty from the get go. 

Repeating an opinion doesn’t make it anymore likely to be true. 

[notnowcato]

20 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Jesus wept.

He's only gone and pressed the "He's just like Alex Ferguson" button.

Every single post this guy makes is based on the premise that Russell Martin is the greatest football manager alive today and everything else is simply waiting for the rest of the world to realise his genius.

It's absolutely insane.

 

In 18 months time Russell Martin will be just another nothing manager who got one team promoted once, just like Aidy Boothroyd or Chris Wilder or Chris Hughton or Scott Parker or Steve Cooper or whoever you like. Just a ten a penny mediocrity. Nothing special.

He's not the second coming of Alex Ferguson FFS.

Classic deliberate misread, congratulations 

[Oldandtired]

2 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Repeating an opinion doesn’t make it anymore likely to be true. 

Says you...

[Suhari]

1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

If ( when ) we go down, we won't be coming straight back up if Russ remains in charge. I think we will become just another Norwich / Middlesbrough / WBA type club, living on past glories and unable to deliver on aspirations whilst constantly being referred to as "sleeping giants", flirting with the playoffs but never quite able to climb the final step.

 

I don't believe RM would stick around if/when we go down. He'll be off to his next club like a shot.

The risk of becoming another Stoke/WBA etc is massive. I can't believe the club can think 'yoyo' is a strategy. Surely noone is that stupid?

Jesus. I really want RM replaced. And SR for that matter.

 

[Badger]

30 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Just out of interest, why do you think we wouldn't come back up? We got promoted off the back of a new Manager playing a completely new style of football last season. Arguably we'd also have a better team as well as can't see many of our players moving on.

There may not be many in number moving, but I’d expect to see Ramsdale, Dibling and Fernandes eyeing the exit door.

Guardian we’ll have plenty no one else wants and we can’t get rid of. Doesn’t seem the basis of assembling an exciting squad. 

[badgerx16]

17 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I can't agree with that, we have a large squad loaded with Championship quality players most of whom no Premier League side would want. I would say we would be much better equipped than las

"Championship quality" can mean pushing for the playoffs, just about keeping clear of the relegation battle, or somewhere in between. I am not sure we have a squad packed with the former, rather the latter.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

15 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Repeating an opinion doesn’t make it anymore likely to be true. 

In this case it will. The only fans inside St Mary's will be the Martin fan boys like you.

[CB Fry]

9 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Classic deliberate misread, congratulations 

My reading of it is accurate. He's drooling over him in every post he writes. I still think he's a troll on a wind-up anyway, so hats off to him for the bites.

I guarantee Russell Martin's career will be more Aidy Boothroyd than Alex Ferguson. Alex Ferguson had already won a European Trophy before Man United not finished 10th with Swansea.

An important reminder ahead of Saturday - if we win, then four points from 10 games remains utterly fucking dreadful.

[Whitey Grandad]

3 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

You say that but we got promoted last season. If that was the aim then clearly it was a successful season. If they're not overly worried about maintaining status in the Prem and are more looking to use Saints as a shop window for young players then that also works.

There you go again.

That was in a different league and even there it wasn't Russball that got us promoted. There were three teams that finished above us in the table without playing it.

Had we achieved automatic promotion then we would have had a longer summer to get prepared. 

[franniesTache]

8 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

My reading of it is accurate. He's drooling over him in every post he writes. I still think he's a troll on a wind-up anyway, so hats off to him for the bites.

I guarantee Russell Martin's career will be more Aidy Boothroyd than Alex Ferguson. Alex Ferguson had already won a European Trophy before Man United not finished 10th with Swansea.

An important reminder ahead of Saturday - if we win, then four points from 10 games remains utterly fucking dreadful.

If we win on Saturday we'll still be behind Derby's worst ever points total season (11) and Sunderland's second worst ever points total season (15) since both of them had 5 points by the 9th game of the season.

Also relegation is going to be a financial disaster for saints, i don't think people realised how close to the sun we were flying last season, and how important it was to come back up first time round.

As for Martin staying if we do go down with him in charge, and make no mistake if we do it'll be on the worst points total ever, I think season ticket sales will drop off a cliff. People are really underestimating just how much most saints fans are putting up with Martin based on him banking favours from last season.

The majority i know (young, old and middle aged) find his style of football boring as fuck and his stubbornness and arrogance annoying. The small cult on here and social media who seemingly idolise him are absolutely in the minority, and keeping him on if we go down will see a hell of a reaction, both against him and the owners.

 

[saintant]

20 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

My reading of it is accurate. He's drooling over him in every post he writes. I still think he's a troll on a wind-up anyway, so hats off to him for the bites.

I guarantee Russell Martin's career will be more Aidy Boothroyd than Alex Ferguson. Alex Ferguson had already won a European Trophy before Man United not finished 10th with Swansea.

An important reminder ahead of Saturday - if we win, then four points from 10 games remains utterly fucking dreadful.

If we lose to Everton you have to wonder whether 1 point from a possible 30 will force SR to give Martin the bullet - some how I don't think it will even though it's an absolutely pathetic return if it happens.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, gio1saints said:

Sry mate I know you are a massive long term fan but your argument does not work on multiple levels for me. 

1. relegated teams are always amongst the favourites to get promoted. With a Manager who knows how to get up from that league we’d be even more favoured. Without the instability of managerial/ personnel and style overhaul even more favoured. Not rocket science. 
2. the system RM uses DID work in the championship and were it not for ridiculously once in many many moons form from the other three we’d have walked the league. A record unbeaten run and if you think it was because the rest of the teams were poor - well it’s the championship - that’s the standard we have to be able to beat. And we did enough. 

3. We did not abandon PB football and get promoted accordingly. Russball put us in the position to get promoted. It’s the other way around but not for diehard RM out people I guess. We put more defenders on the pitch for Leeds and WBA - 5 at the back - but if you were at Wembley ( I’m sure you were) you might have noticed a I think 15 pass move for our goal from defence to attack before AA scores. That is exhibit 1.01 classic totally recognisable Russball. And THAT is a fact. We still passed the ball around them like they weren’t there and when it works - as per AA in the Final Playoff- it’s a thing of great beauty that we are all proud of. 

One goal. It was enough but only just. If you base your whole footballing style on scoring just the one then you'd better make sure that you've got a rock solid defence.

Oops.

I think your adoration for Martin has elevated that goal to the transcendental. In the circumstances it was a good goal but one that could and easily should have been snuffed out. Just like all the other goals that we didn't score.

[Football Special]

9 minutes ago, saintant said:

If we lose to Everton you have to wonder whether 1 point from a possible 30 will force SR to give Martin the bullet - some how I don't think it will even though it's an absolutely pathetic return if it happens.

What about if we lose at home tonight v Stoke reserves ?