Saints 0-3 Man Utd - Match Thread

[Wiggles31]

Interesting test this. Playing them when they’re under immense pressure. 
 

International break will have suited both teams. Any ideas if Hojlund will be back for them?

My team:

Ramsdale

Sugawara Bednarek THB KWP

Downes Lallana Fernandes

Armstrong Archer Fraser 

Could put Lesley in for Fernandes. Cameo from Dibling. 

It will be interesting to see what Martin does in our first big 6 game. Will be difficult to win the possession battle. 
 

 

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Somewhere in the stands... Jason Wilcox has a meltdown... Wants his new team to win...yet wants them to get hammered by a possession focused team he had a hand in shaping. Wants Ten Haag to implement his ideas, yet wants him thumped to be replaced by someone very much like Martin.

This indecision filters through their club, as they also realise they were nothing without McTominay. A team caught between two systems, while caring for only themselves.

Fraser and AA show the work rate required, driving at a shaky United defence, that leaves us plenty of space.

Archer comes on to get a third for Saints, who mistakenly think all sides are going to give them that much room to pass through.

[ErwinK1961]

46 minutes ago, Wiggles31 said:

Interesting test this. Playing them when they’re under immense pressure. 
 

International break will have suited both teams. Any ideas if Hojlund will be back for them?

My team:

Ramsdale

Sugawara Bednarek THB KWP

Downes Lallana Fernandes

Armstrong Archer Fraser 

Could put Lesley in for Fernandes. Cameo from Dibling. 

It will be interesting to see what Martin does in our first big 6 game. Will be difficult to win the possession battle. 
 

 

Fraser hasn’t really played any meaningful football for a while, can’t see him starting.

It’s Man Utd at home, so we’ll probably play quite well, but absolutely won’t win. 

12/13 - lost 3-2 in stoppage time, played well

13/14 - 1-1 end of season nothing game

14/15 - lost 2-1, seem to remember De Gea having a great game and us giving them a goal

15/16 - lost 3-2 and gave them an identical goal to the previous game

16/17 - 0-0 and Gabbiadini missed a pen

17/18 - lost 1-0, played ok

18/19 - drew 2-2 - went 2-0 and threw it away

19/20 - drew 1-1 played ok and Danso got sent off

20/21 - lost 3-2, 2-0 and threw it away in stoppage time 

21/22 - drew 1-1 - don’t remember much of this tbh

22/23 - lost 1-0 - should have had about 47 penalties, Mctominay playing volleyball in the penalty area 

Also special mention to the 10/11 cup game, where we played really well and go our noses in front, but lost 2-1.

Edited September 8 by ErwinK1961

[saintant]

Ramsdale

Sugawara THB Bednarek Taylor

Big Les Downes

KWP Fernandes Cornet

Archer

Decent minutes off the bench for Dibling and Lallana.

Edited September 9 by saintant

[AlexLaw76]

Thought we played fairly well against the last time they came to SMS.

laughable bias for them with the Mctomminay handball decision 

Edited September 8 by AlexLaw76

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Ramsdale

KWP THB Bedders Taylor

Downes Fernandes Dibling

Armstrong  BBD, Fraser

Mins for Lallana, Sugawara, Aribo, Les, Archer

[Lighthouse]

I think they're the only team we didn't beat at St Mary's last time we were up. Not including one season jobbies like Wigan.

[Toadhall Saint]

Loss but not due to fucking about at the back.

[Forester]

Amongst all the doom and gloom, there are some interesting and good selection dilemmas:

- which two from three good full backs/wing backs, with Suga looking good, but Taylor offering the chance for KWP to revert to right hand side?

- stick with back three, where we have actually looked defensively solid (the third goal at Brentford was rank bad defending but we had back four by then), or try back four?  Which of three centre backs to drop?

- dependent on formation, how to get our likely most creative players on pitch in Lallana, Dibbling, Fernandez, Cornet and Fraser without overdoing it?

- play BBD as central striker, most likely to hold up the ball and play back to goal, or go for Archer?

 

Everyone will have their own answers, but it isn't clear and easy, and Martin will himself need to work through these to understand his best team and that may take more than one game since the signings all arrived.  But time is ticking away 

[Oldandtired]

Ordinarily I would really look forward to this fixture. But this time I have to admit to a certain degree of trepidation which will only be alleviated an hour before kickoff if I don't see the three initials S+A+S in the starting lineup.

[Tommy Mulgrew]

 

34 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

three initials S+A+S in the starting lineup.

S. Sam Amo A  😩

A. Aaron Ramsdale  😬         Aah💡  Adam Armstrong  👍

S. erm -who?  🫵

[Football Special]

 

We must be due another grey kit 3-1 or a 6-3, come on Russ give us another day like these..

 

 

[Charlie Wayman]

1 hour ago, Oldandtired said:

Ordinarily I would really look forward to this fixture. But this time I have to admit to a certain degree of trepidation which will only be alleviated an hour before kickoff if I don't see the three initials S+A+S in the starting lineup.

Stevens + Aribo + Smallbone?

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Stephens, Aribo, Sulemana?

Edited September 8 by Holmes_and_Watson

[Oldandtired]

Yep. The first lot….Didn’t give Sulemana a thought tbh.

Edited September 8 by Oldandtired

[Holmes_and_Watson]

4 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

Yep. The first lot….Didn’t give Sulemana a thought tbh.

Just glad that SR's signing of free agents Shearer and Sutton away from the BBC, wasn't in vain. 🙂

[Green]

6 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

I think they're the only team we didn't beat at St Mary's last time we were up. Not including one season jobbies like Wigan.

Yes, I think it’s Man Utd, Wigan, Cardiff and Nottingham Forest since we were promoted in 2012 that we haven’t beaten at SMS in the PL.

[Saint Matty 76]

Would be the time to try pairing Downes/Ugochukwu for me. THB lucky to keep his space but ultimately I do still think he is better than Stephens. BBD a bit fortunate as well, although hopefully he operates a bit better with a striker on the pitch.

Wouldn't be opposed to a Lallana start as well.

Ramsdale
Sugawara - THB - Bednarek - KWP
Downes - Ugochukwu
Dibling - Fernandes - BBD
Archer

[captainchris]

9 hours ago, Wiggles31 said:

Interesting test this. Playing them when they’re under immense pressure. 
 

International break will have suited both teams. Any ideas if Hojlund will be back for them?

My team:

Ramsdale

Sugawara Bednarek THB KWP

Downes Lallana Fernandes

Armstrong Archer Fraser 

Could put Lesley in for Fernandes. Cameo from Dibling. 

It will be interesting to see what Martin does in our first big 6 game. Will be difficult to win the possession battle. 
 

 

Armstrong is clearly not good enough for this league

[SNSUN]

I'd like to think Russ would stop too much of the tippy tappy stuff at the back but...

 

[Football Special]

Anyone back late from international duty might miss out, Sugawara had long trips, u19s have 3 matches so Dibling won't start , are Aribo and Tall Paul away with Nigeria? The latter could have used this as a last opportunity to impress Martin on the training pitch 

[Jack]

Saints to lose on goals scored and conceded but win on possession and short pass completion. Russ delighted. 

[Zorba]

2-0 Saints.

Russ changes the system to face the mighty United. They have all the possession and we hit them twice on the counter with some fast flowing direct passing football finished off with an Archer brace. Everyone's elated!

Next week we revert to the same old Dickball and get pumped by Everton, Ipswich and Bournemouth.. but we beat Man U so everything's ok.

 

[ally_uk]

3-0 United sorry but I don't think our team has enough quality we are going to get battered... 

[trousers]

Ramsdale

Suga - THB - Bednarek - KWP

Downes - BL

Lallana - Fernandes - Dibling

Archer

 

Ross Stewart with a 10 minute cameo from the bench now that he's been in full training for 2 weeks...

[SNSUN]

26 minutes ago, trousers said:

Ramsdale

Suga - THB - Bednarek - KWP

Downes - BL

Lallana - Fernandes - Dibling

Archer

 

Ross Stewart with a 10 minute cameo from the bench now that he's been in full training for 2 weeks...

I've just woken up but BL was confusing me until I eventually worked it out. 

[BarberSaint]

They're crud, aka crap.

 

1-1 with them scraping a lucky equaliser in the last minutes.

[east-stand-nic]

Can't see us winning this, but we might get a point if we are well up for it and RM changes things. Could well be an entertaining kind of 2-2 affair. But as many others have said, if JS starts, we are wasting our time. He just does not warrant a start and we can do much better than him in any position RM wants to shoe horn him into. I would like to see starts for Fernandes, Cornet and Archer.

[pimpin4rizeal]

13 hours ago, captainchris said:

Armstrong is clearly not good enough for this league

Shocking your willing to give up on him already 3 games into the season 

if you want to moan about someone why not BBD? who has been way worse at least AA has got into positions to threaten. Our fanbase is so fickle if he scored his Miskick  which he usually would have then everyone’s happy 

[Pamplemousse]

23 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

I think they're the only team we didn't beat at St Mary's last time we were up. Not including one season jobbies like Wigan.

Our record against them at St Mary's is absolutely terrible. Only one win and that was in 2003!

[Turkish]

which player is going to be the one to give the ball away this week to gift Man U a goal? I'm going to go with one of the new boys, Suga or Ramsdale.

[Disco Stu]

23 minutes ago, Turkish said:

which player is going to be the one to give the ball away this week to gift Man U a goal? I'm going to go with one of the new boys, Suga or Ramsdale.

I'll go with ol' reliable, Jack Stephens.

[VectisSaint]

Minor (trivial) matter, assume they will allocate squad numbers for Fraser and Cornet before the weekend. I'm sure they already have, seems odd not to have it on the OS already. 

[AlexLaw76]

1 hour ago, Turkish said:

which player is going to be the one to give the ball away this week to gift Man U a goal? I'm going to go with one of the new boys, Suga or Ramsdale.

TrUst ThE prOcEsS

[BarberSaint]

55 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

TrUst ThE prOcEsS

You alright fella?

Keyboard broken?

[saintant]

It's well worth watching the video on AnfieldIndex.com entitled Tactical Masterclass; How Liverpool Overpowered Manchester United. It demonstrates the way Liverpool set traps for Man Utd and the fine detail that Arne Slot went into to produce such an emphatic victory. It makes RM's one-trick pony approach to every game where he says this is how we play and we're not changing look very lightweight.  It's this attitude that will eventually see the owners lose patience with him. Clearly someone like Arne Slot is light years ahead of him and it must be a real buzz to have a coach in charge who delves so deeply into each and every game. I get that Liverpool have far better players than we do but it also reinforces the benefit of having a progressive manager who understands the game so well.

[Dark Munster]

6 minutes ago, saintant said:

It's well worth watching the video on AnfieldIndex.com entitled Tactical Masterclass; How Liverpool Overpowered Manchester United. It demonstrates the way Liverpool set traps for Man Utd and the fine detail that Arne Slot went into to produce such an emphatic victory. It makes RM's one-trick pony approach to every game where he says this is how we play and we're not changing look very lightweight.  It's this attitude that will eventually see the owners lose patience with him. Clearly someone like Arne Slot is light years ahead of him and it must be a real buzz to have a coach in charge who delves so deeply into each and every game. I get that Liverpool have far better players than we do but it also reinforces the benefit of having a progressive manager who understands the game so well.

You can say that again!

[Holmes_and_Watson]

6 hours ago, SNSUN said:

I've just woken up but BL was confusing me until I eventually worked it out. 

I know. I'd have put Bixente Lizarazu at left back too.

[Pamplemousse]

43 minutes ago, saintant said:

It's well worth watching the video on AnfieldIndex.com entitled Tactical Masterclass; How Liverpool Overpowered Manchester United. It demonstrates the way Liverpool set traps for Man Utd and the fine detail that Arne Slot went into to produce such an emphatic victory. It makes RM's one-trick pony approach to every game where he says this is how we play and we're not changing look very lightweight.  It's this attitude that will eventually see the owners lose patience with him. Clearly someone like Arne Slot is light years ahead of him and it must be a real buzz to have a coach in charge who delves so deeply into each and every game. I get that Liverpool have far better players than we do but it also reinforces the benefit of having a progressive manager who understands the game so well.

If you look at how we played against Leeds for example last season, tactically we set up differently to usual, as the possession stats show (Leeds had more possession in every game).

So what you've said about RM not changing at all is complete nonsense.

[jamesfp1]

We're saints and we've been shit, so we are guaranteed to beat united. You should know how this works by now. 

[AlexLaw76]

22 minutes ago, Pamplemousse said:

If you look at how we played against Leeds for example last season, tactically we set up differently to usual, as the possession stats show (Leeds had more possession in every game).

So what you've said about RM not changing at all is complete nonsense.

He made a few tweaks… so what?

he needs to made fundamental changes to a system he has used most, if not all, of pre season

awful 

[Wade Garrett]

Ramsdale

Suga THB Bednarek KWP

      Downes  Big Les

Dibling   Fernandes   Diaz

                  Archer

That team would destroy the Dutch Steptoe and his team of overrated lazy cunts.

Come on you fucking Saints.  No pissing around at the back.

Edited September 9 by Wade Garrett

[saintant]

1 hour ago, Pamplemousse said:

If you look at how we played against Leeds for example last season, tactically we set up differently to usual, as the possession stats show (Leeds had more possession in every game).

So what you've said about RM not changing at all is complete nonsense.

I don't deny he makes the odd tweaks but fundamentally he changes very little from game to game. A master tactician he aint. He could try learning from those better at it than he is and will if he has any sense.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

8 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

Can't see us winning this, but we might get a point if we are well up for it and RM changes things. Could well be an entertaining kind of 2-2 affair. But as many others have said, if JS starts, we are wasting our time. He just does not warrant a start and we can do much better than him in any position RM wants to shoe horn him into. I would like to see starts for Fernandes, Cornet and Archer.

So would I and I genuinely think with KWP/Suguwara (if he plays) and Fraser bombing down the wing and putting in telling crosses, we can do this and it'll be the 'Dutch Steptoe's' last game in charge of Man U.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

9 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

Shocking your willing to give up on him already 3 games into the season 

if you want to moan about someone why not BBD? who has been way worse at least AA has got into positions to threaten. Our fanbase is so fickle if he scored his Miskick  which he usually would have then everyone’s happy 

He hardly set the world alight when we were last in the PL. 

[Lighthouse]

9 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

Shocking your willing to give up on him already 3 games into the season 

if you want to moan about someone why not BBD? who has been way worse at least AA has got into positions to threaten. Our fanbase is so fickle if he scored his Miskick  which he usually would have then everyone’s happy 

I gave up on him as a PL player around 18 months ago, FWIW.

[CB Fry]

9 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

Shocking your willing to give up on him already 3 games into the season 

if you want to moan about someone why not BBD? who has been way worse at least AA has got into positions to threaten. Our fanbase is so fickle if he scored his Miskick  which he usually would have then everyone’s happy 

Please can you let us know when you are finally satisfied that Adam Armstrong has been given a "chance" to play in the Premier League.

50 plus Premier League appearances over two seasons (returning 2 whole goals each one) was not according to you "a chance".

Now this season three starts and zero goals.

How many more games does he have to play before you accept he has had "a chance"?

Does he need to start all 38 without fail?

Funny how Ben Brereton Diaz doesn't get the same "chance" before you start slagging him off. Why doesn't he get 50 games grace from you?

Edited September 9 by CB Fry

[Ted Bates Statue]

2 hours ago, jamesfp1 said:

We're saints and we've been shit, so we are guaranteed to beat united. You should know how this works by now. 

Could well be a plucky draw, before we get our arses handed to us by the next midtable side we face.

[austsaint]

2 hours ago, CB Fry said:

Please can you let us know when you are finally satisfied that Adam Armstrong has been given a "chance" to play in the Premier League.

50 plus Premier League appearances over two seasons (returning 2 whole goals each one) was not according to you "a chance".

Now this season three starts and zero goals.

How many more games does he have to play before you accept he has had "a chance"?

Does he need to start all 38 without fail?

Funny how Ben Brereton Diaz doesn't get the same "chance" before you start slagging him off. Why doesn't he get 50 games grace from you?

Yes, the sample size of Prem appearances (56 with 4 goals) by AA provides a strong case to believe that he's an outstanding Championship player who just can't compete at this level.  Better defences, less time on the ball to make decisions and get his feet organised leave him looking shell-shocked and uncomfortably out of his depth.     At 27, it's hard to see him turning things around.

There's some hope for Brereton-Diaz though.  He's two years younger than AA; has scored 7 goals from 33 appearances for Chile - appears to have scored most of them when played as an inside right attacker.   Six goals from 14 appearances for the Blades last season was a good haul.   If he's played alongside someone like Archer in a 4-4-2, rather than that weird isolated left wing role, things might improve.    Neither Armstrong or BBD were helped by the threadbare attacking midfield of Smallbone and Airibo.   Fernandes, Dibling, Cornet and Les Ugo, along with Downes appeal as more likely to deliver the better service BBD and Archer will need.

[SaintNewForest]

21 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

Can't see us winning this, but we might get a point if we are well up for it and RM changes things. Could well be an entertaining kind of 2-2 affair. But as many others have said, if JS starts, we are wasting our time. He just does not warrant a start and we can do much better than him in any position RM wants to shoe horn him into. I would like to see starts for Fernandes, Cornet and Archer.

Good to see the narrative about JS carrying on; I'd argue that THB is more deserving to be dropped so far as he's been our worst CB, to be honest but that doesn't suit the narrative that saints fans seem to have.