Ben Brereton Diaz

[LGTL]

33 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

I think Imants Bleidelis, Calumn Davenport, Craig Maskell, Veggard Forren, Mislav Orsic, Aleddine Yahia, Guido Carrillo, Mikel Nilsson, David Speedie, Kamaldeen Sulemana, Wes Hoedt, Ali Dia, Olivier Bernard, Philip Djuricic, Mark Draper, Jos Hooiveld, Mohammed Elyounoussi, Jeremy Pied, Ainsley Maitland Niles, Kleber Chala, Danny Fox, Andrei Kanchelskis, Sekou Mara, Angus Gunn, Martin Cranie, Will Smallbone, Darren Kenton, Moussa Djenepo, Yoanne Folly, Mohammed Salisu, Uwe Rosler and Adam Armstrong might have something to say on that, but I take your point.

Jesus Christ, I don’t know if that makes me feel better or worse. 

[Mixedkebab]

45 minutes ago, Colinjb said:

Would rather watch him in his preferred position under a different manager before making a judgement. 

Agree with this, he was good for a few goals for Sheff U when playing centrally, no way in the world should he be on the wing. To come on in the second half up front, cause a bit of chaos in the box and bundle a few in he could still be of some use if we start putting some actual dangerous balls into the box, but that’s another story.

[Sheaf Saint]

7 hours ago, bpsaint said:

Fair play, that’s a pretty concise, and horrifying trip down memory lane that post!! I’d add Patrick Colleter and Juanmi to that list though.

Pretty sure Emmanuel Mayuka is worthy of inclusion as well. Although he did at least once win a penalty for us, so in that regard he contributed more in his short time with us than Diaz has so far.

[Harry_SFC]

6 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Pretty sure Emmanuel Mayuka is worthy of inclusion as well. Although he did at least once win a penalty for us, so in that regard he contributed more in his short time with us than Diaz has so far.

He scored against Barnsley in the cup too! 

[Zorba]

Bambi in a carthorse disguise.

[benali-shorts]

He's cut his locks off but I sadly suspect his new disguise will be exposed as soon as he tries to trap a ball. But let's forlornly hope for some sort of reverse-Samson transformation (Samson famously effective in his youth  as a left-sided forward for Zorah FC).

[hypochondriac]

For me, the worst signing we have made this year which is saying something when our loan signings have also been terrible. 

[Turkish]

13 minutes ago, benali-shorts said:

He's cut his locks off but I sadly suspect his new disguise will be exposed as soon as he tries to trap a ball. But let's forlornly hope for some sort of reverse-Samson transformation (Samson famously effective in his youth  as a left-sided forward for Zorah FC).

Maybe the wall could adopt Delilah as his anthem to inspire him to run a bit more 

[Whitey Grandad]

18 minutes ago, benali-shorts said:

He's cut his locks off but I sadly suspect his new disguise will be exposed as soon as he tries to trap a ball. But let's forlornly hope for some sort of reverse-Samson transformation (Samson famously effective in his youth  as a left-sided forward for Zorah FC).

He was until he joined the Sod’em Wanderers.

[disconnect]

29 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

For me, the worst signing we have made this year which is saying something when our loan signings have also been terrible. 

Scored a decent goal in his first(?) match in preseason, and has since had any good attributes rapidly coached out of him. I thought he'd be pretty good for us considering how he did in a terrible Sheffield United team, but like a good few others, has gone rapidly downhill after adapting to the Saints way...

[skintsaint]

3 minutes ago, disconnect said:

Scored a decent goal in his first(?) match in preseason

2nd game, 1st match v Millwall he was poor. Mind you the whole team performance was poor.

[david in sweden]

2 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

For me, the worst signing we have made this year which is saying something when our loan signings have also been terrible. 

Cornet and Ugochukwa  are the only senior loans so far this season, but we did win promotion thanks to those 5 loans last season.

Brereton-Diaz, and Cornet have lacked any real game and have been played out of position in other formations than they are used to. 

I won't seek to defend either of them, but am also aware of the " ketchup effect " with strikers, and the classic example was James Beattie

who, in starting  season 2002-03  failed to score until game 10, .and then went on a crazy spell scoring 23 goals in 27 games finishing

just 1 goal behind Thierry Henry (who won the Golden Boot that season) .    There are numerous other examples in club history.

 

Of course  I don't expect  Brereton-Diaz to score lots of goals, (or Cornet for that matter), but at least Archer has settled in a bit quicker.

Adam Armstrong has had a nightmare start for a player who scored so many last season.  Strikers are very dependent on their suppliers

and if their midfield / full back support isn't there they are down to taking snap chances,  Who could deny that Onuachu wouldn't score

IF.. he had  a good wing supply of crosses from the wings....IF ..we had proper wingers.?. 

 

The adjustment to Prem. standard football has been difficult for all  3 promoted sides, and with a bit more luck, VAR calls and decent

refereeing we might have had a few more points on the board.  Our greatest achievement this season will be to survive, and short of 

spending another 50- 60 million in January, we are unlikely to get any real " game-changers " on board this time around. 

We have seldom had such a big squad to call upon, and so we can hope that in the remaining 29?  games, some of them find form that

will help move us up the table ASAP.  

 

Edited 1 November, 2024 by david in sweden

[beatlesaint]

This is the most disappointing signing we've made this season. After he scored a few for an awful Sheff Utd side I really expected him to bang in a few for us. Wether its due to Russball or the position he plays out wide I dont know but he looks like a Sunday morning player who suffered the night before.  

[Saint Fan CaM]

I see BBD in the same light as all our strikers tbh - no consistency in playing time, often played on a wing and so isolated, no consistent strike partnership to form a firm understanding of play style, lack of service from a slow predictable midfield. Lastly, all of our strikers are proven Championship players with little or no Prem experience/ success and although BBD could claim some modest success in the Prem, he’s not shown any sign of being able to repeat that for Saints with Russball. The team and indeed the fans have been badly let down by 4-5 years of awful recruitment when it comes to strikers.

Edited 1 November, 2024 by Saint Fan CaM
Typo

[benali-shorts]

He seems an odd signing in so much as he's neither a hold up forward; nor a ball carrier; nor has the pace to counter. I've no idea what attributes our esteemed recruitment team saw in him to fit him into our structure. Odd that he hasn't played through the middle at any stage, not that he's shown any particular signs of potentially being effective in that role. Maybe his new haircut and the earnest backing of Delilah from the Northam Wall will invigorate him to new heights. 

The Cornet / Lesley use of our Prem loans is another bizarre piece of recruitment strategy. But maybe if the Wall start a rendition of "Just one Cornetto", Maxwell will start banging them in too. 

[Osvaldorama]

Not even joking, I genuinely have seen better players at Sunday league. 
 

Im not even sure how he got goals in the championship based on his performances so far. I don’t recall a worse first touch from a professional footballer
 

Is he out of shape/unfit compared to his Blackburn days? Did anyone watch him before? 

[danjosaint]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

The team and indeed the fans have been badly let down by 4-5 years of awful recruitment when it comes to strikers.

And managers

[Pamplemousse]

He'll be brilliant for us next season in the Championship.

[westmidlandsaint]

Genuinely don't know that answer to this, hence the question. Did Sheff Utd & Blackburn play BBD out wide like we are or did they play him through the middle? when we signed him I thought it would be as a number 9 type forward. He certainly doesnt look like a natural wide player.

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, david in sweden said:

Adam Armstrong has had a nightmare start for a player who scored so many last season. 

Did our promotion pass you by? 

[derry]

BBD has been signed as a goalscorer which to be fair he has done consistently as has Onuachu, Archer and Armstrong. Personally I think it's the idiot manager's obsession with possession that is not only making us impotent and porous but is the most boring, slow negative counterproductive waste of game time. I think the players get this and are directionless. It really is an unwatchable mess.

[Colinjb]

14 minutes ago, derry said:

BBD has been signed as a goalscorer which to be fair he has done consistently as has Onuachu, Archer and Armstrong. Personally I think it's the idiot manager's obsession with possession that is not only making us impotent and porous but is the most boring, slow negative counterproductive waste of game time. I think the players get this and are directionless. It really is an unwatchable mess.

This

He is forcing able players into a system that kills them.

[suewhistle]

4 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

He was until he joined the Sod’em Wanderers.

Not bad at Onan 1sts either..

Like others I'm prepared to give him and a few other players the benefit of the doubt of our playing system being an issue. But his touch does seem poor..

 

[Hamwic]

He, like others, cannot benefit from a system that tells them to pass the ball backwards once they are level with the 18yd box. When I was a lad, a very long time ago, we were always told to get the ball in the box and one or more players would have a chance to convert. Simple really. 

[HKsaint]

Even C Ronaldo couldn’t score any goal in our system. Don’t blame them.  To score, you need to release the ball. 

Edited 1 November, 2024 by HKsaint

[derry]

33 minutes ago, Hamwic said:

He, like others, cannot benefit from a system that tells them to pass the ball backwards once they are level with the 18yd box. When I was a lad, a very long time ago, we were always told to get the ball in the box and one or more players would have a chance to convert. Simple really. 

Strikers should play on the 45 with the goal in front on the opposite side to the ball always onside and timing the run to arrive with the ball in the box/area. Take the defenders away to create the space then cut back in. Most of all be two footed. Not as you say passing backwards. Passing the ball behind the players causes most of the attackers to have to come back. If Onuachu at 6'-8" is playing he does try to play in on the 45 from the back post to get a run at the ball he needs good crosses not recycling the ball.

We never see any variation, In the dying seconds v MC a free kick with Onuachu waiting for the Hail Mary ball in it's passed sideways and the referee blows time. It needed the two centre backs plus Onuachu in there. I don't know what they are trying to achieve but whatever it is is over my head and it isn't working. God only knows what the strikers feel about the whole debacle. Against Leicester, get to the byeline twice and pass across the goal two goals. 

Edited 1 November, 2024 by derry

[pimpin4rizeal]

I’m guessing the reason he flopped at villareal was because in a technical passing side he doesn’t have the technical ability and kinda sucks ., probably why villareal where open to giving him up dirt cheap ..

looks like he’s more the type for a direct shit house team like sheff utd .. we didn’t really do our homework on this one 

[gecko]

5 hours ago, david in sweden said:

I won't seek to defend either of them, but am also aware of the " ketchup effect " with strikers, and the classic example was James Beattie

who, in starting  season 2002-03  failed to score until game 10, .and then went on a crazy spell scoring 23 goals in 27 games finishing

just 1 goal behind Thierry Henry (who won the Golden Boot that season)

So what you're saying is that BBD will start scoring next game, and therefore is definitely going to (almost) win the Golden Boot this year. Guess we'll be staying up after all.

[obelisk]

I'm banking on the new haircut being the change in fortune required. Pretty desperate I know.

[Dark Munster]

1 hour ago, obelisk said:

I'm banking on the new haircut being the change in fortune required. Pretty desperate I know.

Actually I think it's definitely worth a go. It worked a treat for Joe Aribo, a changed player (for the better) after he shaved off his locks!

[Holmes_and_Watson]

5 hours ago, westmidlandsaint said:

Genuinely don't know that answer to this, hence the question. Did Sheff Utd & Blackburn play BBD out wide like we are or did they play him through the middle? when we signed him I thought it would be as a number 9 type forward. He certainly doesnt look like a natural wide player.

Derry's pretty much nailed this.

BBD gets goals in teams with a far more open game. He's further up, and running at defenders in a little bit of space. He can come in from a little wider, but has not been spending his career hugging a touchline.

In a passing system, allowing opponents to reset and moves to be generated from deep, he is utterly wasted.

Archer, BBD, TP and AA all offer different things. None of them best suit Martin's system, and all suffer in it as strikers.

 

Edited 1 November, 2024 by Holmes_and_Watson

[FarehamSaintJames]

7 hours ago, beatlesaint said:

This is the most disappointing signing we've made this season. After he scored a few for an awful Sheff Utd side I really expected him to bang in a few for us. Wether its due to Russball or the position he plays out wide I dont know but he looks like a Sunday morning player who suffered the night before.  

That’s actually pretty accurate.

His centre of gravity is terrible, permanently looks out of it, or confused.

[Gloucester Saint]

41 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

 or confused.

Hardly surprising given the manager’s tactics….

[Lighthouse]

6 hours ago, derry said:

BBD has been signed as a goalscorer which to be fair he has done consistently as has Onuachu, Archer and Armstrong. Personally I think it's the idiot manager's obsession with possession that is not only making us impotent and porous but is the most boring, slow negative counterproductive waste of game time. I think the players get this and are directionless. It really is an unwatchable mess.

BBD was a consistent goal scorer in the Championship.

Armstrong was a consistent goal scorer in the Championship.

Archer scored 4 goals in 29 games last season, he’s halfway there after 9 games.

Onuachu has never scored in the Premier League.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people are so determined to pretend this isn’t a thing. There is a reason Real Madrid never signed Rasiak, Akinbiyi, Altidore and Rob Earnshaw, even though they have all, "done it consistently."

[derry]

2 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

BBD was a consistent goal scorer in the Championship.

Armstrong was a consistent goal scorer in the Championship.

Archer scored 4 goals in 29 games last season, he’s halfway there after 9 games.

Onuachu has never scored in the Premier League.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people are so determined to pretend this isn’t a thing. There is a reason Real Madrid never signed Rasiak, Akinbiyi, Altidore and Rob Earnshaw, even though they have all, "done it consistently."

The back four have been recycling the ball long before Martin arrived. It was easier for Armstrong and the team to score in the Championship. If we had Harry Kane he wouldn't get a sniff in the Premier League with the stupid way we play. Most passes we make come from behind and are behind the target so they mostly play the next pass back. Really only Fernandez and Dibling play the ball into the space in front of the attacker or behind the defender. Players for years have been making run after run but the ball is never played through. So they stop doing it. Even if a ball is played through it is so delayed and too late so there are only two choices keep going offside or stop and stay onside.

[david in sweden]

15 hours ago, gecko said:

So what you're saying is that BBD will start scoring next game, and therefore is definitely going to (almost) win the Golden Boot this year. Guess we'll be staying up after all.

Nonsense . I didn't write that.   Clearly neither BBD, or Armstrong have found any sort of form so far but that is typical of a strikers life..

Most strikers (with rare exception) have spells when they don't score and the longer it goes on, the worse they feel and the more criticism from fans.

The James Beattie storyline was meant as an extreme example, but others exist.   Regardless of the final result,  strikers only want to score.

 

As for BBD, on the basis of  3  dubious starts, and a couple of sub. apps  he doesn't look the part yet, but he is a proven striker with a goalscoring record, 

although if he is anywhere near double figures by May I will be pleasantly surprised.  Strikers succeed best when they have a formation that favours them. 

I doubt we will see BBD  getting much game time, until  "whatever issue that is keeping him on the bench"  is sorted. He will play eventually  - and likely 

score , but unless he can quickly adapt to the "Russball" formation, and learn to play another role, he will struggle.  Same goes for Unuachu. 

 

My mention of Armstrong is on similar lines. Top scorer last season, but without the creativity and service he got then, he won't improve at the higher level.

Sad to say our midfield is as poor as it has been for several years past.  Smallbone and Downes both DAJFU last season, but neither has shown up so far.

We've dropped one MF to bring in Tyler Dibling (not a bad move), but TD has an attacking role and is not a creative midfield player (like Stu Armstrong)

and  he is already showing the strain of playing at this highest level.  At best Adam Lallana is only a 60 minute player, and  Aribo lacks consistency. 

RM has tried both Manning and KWP in some sort of midfield role, but they are not creative players, merely full backs who have a bit of pace. 

Few people have admitted it, but we do miss JWP, who had good creativity all over the pitch in various roles and goals in him. 

[Sunglasses Ron]

His nightmare run ends!

[gecko]

On 02/11/2024 at 08:19, david in sweden said:

Nonsense . I didn't write that.   Clearly neither BBD, or Armstrong have found any sort of form so far but that is typical of a strikers life..

Most strikers (with rare exception) have spells when they don't score and the longer it goes on, the worse they feel and the more criticism from fans.

The James Beattie storyline was meant as an extreme example, but others exist.   Regardless of the final result,  strikers only want to score.

 

As for BBD, on the basis of  3  dubious starts, and a couple of sub. apps  he doesn't look the part yet, but he is a proven striker with a goalscoring record, 

although if he is anywhere near double figures by May I will be pleasantly surprised.  Strikers succeed best when they have a formation that favours them. 

I doubt we will see BBD  getting much game time, until  "whatever issue that is keeping him on the bench"  is sorted. He will play eventually  - and likely 

score , but unless he can quickly adapt to the "Russball" formation, and learn to play another role, he will struggle.  Same goes for Unuachu. 

 

My mention of Armstrong is on similar lines. Top scorer last season, but without the creativity and service he got then, he won't improve at the higher level.

Sad to say our midfield is as poor as it has been for several years past.  Smallbone and Downes both DAJFU last season, but neither has shown up so far.

We've dropped one MF to bring in Tyler Dibling (not a bad move), but TD has an attacking role and is not a creative midfield player (like Stu Armstrong)

and  he is already showing the strain of playing at this highest level.  At best Adam Lallana is only a 60 minute player, and  Aribo lacks consistency. 

RM has tried both Manning and KWP in some sort of midfield role, but they are not creative players, merely full backs who have a bit of pace. 

Few people have admitted it, but we do miss JWP, who had good creativity all over the pitch in various roles and goals in him. 

Wow, I was only going for a little bit of light hearted sarcasm... but if it helps, I too believe that BBD will get nowhere near the Golden Boot for a lot of reasons, some of which you've called out above.

[Roo1976]

On 01/11/2024 at 09:15, Turkish said:

Maybe the wall could adopt Delilah as his anthem to inspire him to run a bit more 

hes not there to run,what were you thinking...! hes there to pass sideways and backwards.......

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

On 01/11/2024 at 16:25, obelisk said:

I'm banking on the new haircut being the change in fortune required. Pretty desperate I know.

Does anyone else think his haircut makes him look like Adam Armstrong? Both equally clueless.

[bpsaint]

My brother in law is a Blackburn fan so BBD was on my radar years ago and he was something else when he played for them.

This guy we’ve got though, ive never seen such a drop off in a player. Even allowing for the jump from Championship to Prem he just looks like an absolute imposter. Was really excited when we signed him too. Has he got Dele Alli syndrome or something?

Edited 12 November, 2024 by bpsaint

[derry]

4 minutes ago, bpsaint said:

My brother in law is a Blackburn fan so BBD was on my radar years ago and he was something else when he played for them.

This guy we’ve got though, he just never seen such a drop off in a player. Even allowing for the jump from Championship to Prem he just looks like an absolute imposter. Was really excited when we signed him too. Has he got Dele Alli syndrome or something?

No he's got Russell Martin syndrome, playing in a garbage style and out of position. What's the point of buying players and playing them inappropriately. 

[Midfield_General]

Here's all 47 goals he scored in 145 games for Blackburn, in the only real spell of consistent goalscoring form he's had in his career. He's never been the most cultured, but here he does at least look like a decent, hardworking forward with an eye for goal. Most of his goals were scored playing down the middle and attacking the six yard area, with a fair few coming from runs down the left channel. From this evidence, albeit against weaker opposition, create a chance for him in a decent goalscoring position and he's capable of taking it. He doesn't exactly scream Premier League quality though, and what he absolutely doesn't look like is a player suited in any way to tiki taka, or playing as a winger hugging the touchline. He's been poor whenever I've seen him play, but you have to wonder what the hell we were thinking signing a player so blindlingly obviously unsuited to how this manager wants to play. Poor as he's been, I think he has the right to feel a bit stitched up by how he's been so mis-used and not played to his basic strengths. 

 

[FarehamSaintJames]

He’s a fraud. Drop the Diaz and go back to being Ben Brereton and he’ll be prolific again. 😂

[david in sweden]

as we will eventually lose Onuachu,  we need to give BBD some game time he will surely score ..sooner or later.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

On 12/11/2024 at 21:20, derry said:

No he's got Russell Martin syndrome, playing in a garbage style and out of position. What's the point of buying players and playing them inappropriately. 

Some of the summer signings were good, but this must go in the crap pile. Totally one footed (more so than Che); liked his antics at Newcastle but soon realised that was a disguise for his crapness, and while some were saying for £7m he was worth a punt, I don't want to see him in a Saints shirt again.

[Badger]

On 12/11/2024 at 21:11, bpsaint said:

Even allowing for the jump from Championship to Prem he just looks like an absolute imposter. Was really excited when we signed him too. Has he got Dele Alli syndrome or something?

Dele Alli or Ali Dia ? 

[Badger]

53 minutes ago, OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint said:

Some of the summer signings were good, but this must go in the crap pile. Totally one footed (more so than Che); liked his antics at Newcastle but soon realised that was a disguise for his crapness, and while some were saying for £7m he was worth a punt, I don't want to see him in a Saints shirt again.

I can see why we bought him for £7m given his scoring for Sheff Utd in half a season. ( Archer was the bigger question mark for me, but he had settled better).

As for BBD I’m not going to trot out ‘there’s a player in there’ bollocks as I’m not convinced there is. But I do think he’s capable of more than we’ve seen. 

[benali-shorts]

Probably fine for the Championship. Odd not to have seen him through the middle. Looks totally bereft of Premier League quality. 

[Harry_SFC]

On 19/11/2024 at 22:00, benali-shorts said:

Probably fine for the Championship. Odd not to have seen him through the middle. Looks totally bereft of Premier League quality. 

Another appearance off the bench and another diabolical showing. Must've given it away with every touch. One of the worst players I've ever seen at this level.