The Euro 2024 Thread

[suewhistle]

29 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

 The way we play does not cater for players in the style of Foden, your sloggers and workhorses will do well in this side

Not disagreeing with you at all, but perhaps hard working players could result in more movement off the ball and more concerted pressing, neither of which we saw.

When a team is playing well and confidently at any level there will be that movement, and we didn't see it in this tournament.

Why he persisted with Kane after half time I don't know. If you'd had a vote in the pub where I watched the game it would have been unanimous!

[Whitey Grandad]

2 hours ago, david in sweden said:

were outclassed by Spain for much of the game, but tackled and defended well ........all things considered.

Last minute corner with 3 chances to score ; first header parried by the  goalie, second shot cleared off the line 

and third attempt from Rice (in the six yard box )..went over the bar . 

Sorry he doesn't impress me . How much did he cost?.... 100 plus million .!!!

Hope Arsenal are pleased with him, but he'll never become " a Gerrard or Lampard " for England.

The first header should have been nowhere near the goalie.

[Nogginsfc]

One observation from Euro 24 is that the term "armchair fan" does not apply. 

With Saints, there is a disregard for any opinion of a fan who does not go to the games, and their opinion of tactics, players or manager is not as valid as those travelling to the games.

However with England that rule does not apply. 

 

[Give it to Ron]

2 minutes ago, Nogginsfc said:

One observation from Euro 24 is that the term "armchair fan" does not apply. 

With Saints, there is a disregard for any opinion of a fan who does not go to the games, and their opinion of tactics, players or manager is not as valid as those travelling to the games.

However with England that rule does not apply. 

 

Have you ever read a match day thread on here? I often have a read later and it’s like I’m at a different game!!!

Weirdos and trolls on those. 

[skintsaint]

Decent first half, could have been 3 down 10 mins into the 2nd thats after them taking Rodri off. Not for poor finishing and some decent saves that could have been 4 or 5. Onto the 2nd goal, on one angle shown, you can see Saka looking at Cucurella unmarked in a lot of space and didn't make any effort to try and get back to track and cover his man. 

I don't think many English fans expected to win.....but it would have been nice to. Onto WC26 with Fat Frank in charge!

[tdmickey3]

Get Sarah Weigman in, she knows how to win the Euros 

[Nogginsfc]

11 minutes ago, Give it to Ron said:

Have you ever read a match day thread on here? I often have a read later and it’s like I’m at a different game!!!

Weirdos and trolls on those. 

That's my point. And all of us who have been to the game call them out on it and dismiss their opinion as being over the top, toxic, trolls etc and label them as "armchair fans".

But comes to England and we are all the same!! From what I have seen the majority of fans who follow England everywhere, whilst still being critical, have not been anywhere near the level of reactionary, irrational, toxic narrative from the "armchair fans". They have offered a bit more balance and perspective.

 

 

[saintant]

The fact that Cucurella looked so good in a Spanish shirt as opposed to a Chelsea shirt tells me our national side is going about everything in the wrong way - tactics, team selection, in game management, you name it we are getting it wrong. If Southgate goes nothing about those who will choose and appoint his successor fills me with any confidence or belief that things will improve. Their main criteria, as always, will be to bring in another yes man who will not rock the boat.

[East Kent Saint]

Cucurella was said to be the weak link by the pundits at the start of the tournament and he turned out to be a major part of Spain's success , so much for pundits !

[East Kent Saint]

3 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

 

3 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Kane is not the scapegoat you want to sacrifice , Southgate picked him and by his substitutions reconized that Kane was not fit . He needed to not pick him not keep him in the team regardless .

[Saint Billy]

All this talk I am hearing of how we should hold our heads up high and feel proud of our achievement. Balls to that, the only thing I will hold up high is two fingers.

We had a lucky draw to the final and even then we struggled along with a big does of luck.

There is only one reason why a good team on paper came no where close to expectations and that is Southgate. It started going wrong even before a ball was kicked by leaving out Grealish, and that was the big clue on how he was going to set his squad up. The flair players like Palmer and Watkins done their best in the little time they had and showed what impact those type of players have but it was too little too late.

Please go Southgate, please FA get in someone who wants to win games by attacking. Clop would be my choice but never in million years would he take on the poison chalice.

[saintant]

1 minute ago, East Kent Saint said:

 

Kane is not the scapegoat you want to sacrifice , Southgate picked him and by his substitutions reconized that Kane was not fit . He needed to not pick him not keep him in the team regardless .

My guess is that Kane was far from the fitness levels required for a major tournament. As such he would have known that himself and had a duty to make Southgate aware. Between them they should have made the call not to start Kane in any games.....unless he was fully fit in which case he's just way below the required standard so should have been dropped/left out for that reason alone. Either way it is clear to most that he should not have played as many minutes as he did and this was at the expense of others in the squad who may have done better. These sort of poor decisions must have impacted on the moral of the squad and their trust in the manager.

[derry]

Personally watching that game last night there was only one TEAM on the pitch and that was Spain. We had a collection of individuals trying to play a negative, reactive framework that did the opposite. A good team is better than the sum of its parts, we were the opposite. We had a decent squad that was grossly misused by the manager. The selected teams had no blend or balance, stayed in the competition clinging on by it's fingernails. We were relegated last year in the Nation's cup.

This result disapointed me as I hoped we might scramble another unlikely result but it wasn't to be. It didn't take long for reality to kick in though. This could mean that maybe we could get rid of the millstone.  These players need a top manager not a journeyman that is liked by the FA because he is politically astute and doesn't rock the boat. Promotion from the junior teams isn't the answer especially given the salary available.

These players need a manager that sets up the team to get the best out of the players and believes completely in blend and balance. Hopefully he'll go now because the suits won't push him. If he doesn't go we are going to get more of the same dross in the future.

[david in sweden]

15 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

It's nonsense to say  that about the late goal, a goal any time in the 90 is valid. A late goal is a difficult thing to pull off and deserves credit.

....and Saints were very grateful for all those late goals last season, otherwise we might still be in the Championship.

It shows a " never say die spirit " and playing hard right up to the final whistle. 

[S-Clarke]

2 hours ago, Saint Billy said:

All this talk I am hearing of how we should hold our heads up high and feel proud of our achievement. Balls to that, the only thing I will hold up high is two fingers.

We had a lucky draw to the final and even then we struggled along with a big does of luck.

There is only one reason why a good team on paper came no where close to expectations and that is Southgate. It started going wrong even before a ball was kicked by leaving out Grealish, and that was the big clue on how he was going to set his squad up. The flair players like Palmer and Watkins done their best in the little time they had and showed what impact those type of players have but it was too little too late.

Please go Southgate, please FA get in someone who wants to win games by attacking. Clop would be my choice but never in million years would he take on the poison chalice.

I'm in the same boat. You hear that from a lot of people who don't generally follow football, but have tagged along at the end as it seemed to get exciting. To them they have no idea of the context of which we reached the final, but we fluked it - on the lucky side of the draw too.

If we'd have come through the lucky side of the draw and beat Slovaka 4-0 and Switzerland in normal time quite comfortably I'd be more content I think - but we staggered to the final against some pretty weak sides.

We only won 2 games in 90mins - Serbia and Holland.

Spain won 6 in normal time.

Turkey or Austria were more deserving of a final place than us in my opinion.

Edited July 15 by S-Clarke

[skintsaint]

17 hours ago, Saint Gifford said:

Sorry how Bellingham has kept his place is a mystery. The petulant 5 year old at the end.

Sorry he isn’t the inly one but kept imo some good players out of the starting 11.

 

Got the assist. Should have had two if Watkins controlled his great through ball.

Plus he sent Carvajol to give Olmo a midgame blowie which was an amusing moment after some great skill.

 

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

18 hours ago, Badger said:

For who to take over ? 

Wouldn't be surprised to see Graham Potter as the next England manager. In fact, we were 86 seconds from looking for a new manager with the Slovakia game.

I'll echo most of what's been said on here. We weren't resilient, we weren't brave. We were bloody lucky and with the technical talent in the team, we're capable of so much more. At least it's a relatively young team so there's plenty of potential.

[Saint Billy]

Not sure if I heard correctly but Talk Sport said that the FA want Southgate to stay but think he will leave.

Wtf!!!. What planet are these idiots on. These suited old farts seem more interested in having a yes man than someone that can bring success and win something.

Exactly the same reason why Brian Clough was never appointed England manager.

[Jimmy_D]

Thought it was going to go our way for a few minutes after we scored! It very nearly did… and can’t help but wonder how it might have gone if it’d gone to extra time with the close offside or that late header cleared off the line, but at the same time it was similar late goals in our favour that even got us there.

At least we don’t have to sit and watch any more games in the tournament without England still in it… straight back to Saints’ football.

[East Kent Saint]

29 minutes ago, Saint Billy said:

Not sure if I heard correctly but Talk Sport said that the FA want Southgate to stay but think he will leave.

Wtf!!!. What planet are these idiots on. These suited old farts seem more interested in having a yes man than someone that can bring success and win something.

Exactly the same reason why Brian Clough was never appointed England manager.

I think Clough was well known as an alcoholic and liable to say the wrong thing. 

[egg]

1 hour ago, Saint Billy said:

Not sure if I heard correctly but Talk Sport said that the FA want Southgate to stay but think he will leave.

Wtf!!!. What planet are these idiots on. These suited old farts seem more interested in having a yes man than someone that can bring success and win something.

Exactly the same reason why Brian Clough was never appointed England manager.

That's exactly why they like him. 

[Hayling Saint]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

That's exactly why they like him. 

So who do you recommend?

[suewhistle]

1 hour ago, East Kent Saint said:

I think Clough was well known as an alcoholic and liable to say the wrong thing. 

Didn't stop Scotland appointing George Burley..

[suewhistle]

Interesting analysis in this article:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jul/15/turning-point-england-kyle-walker-throw-in-euro-2024-final-spain

The throw was certainly met with a despairing groan in my pub.

 

[Ted Bates Statue]

19 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Under Southgate we've had really, really fortunate draws to get through to the latter stages of tournaments. I don't think anyone can deny that when you compare the teams Sven had to face early on in the quarters for example.

I see where you're coming from but our group stage performances were pretty poor back then.

In 2002 we faced Brazil too early because we played for a draw against Nigeria and let Sweden win the group. 2004, we came second to France in the group as we fell to pieces in our match against them. Under Sven we only won the group stage in 2006 but in the knock-outs we fluffed it on the penalties again. When you see it was players like Gerrard and Lampard who missed their efforts it's not a stretch to suggest that we didn't prepare as thoroughly as Southgate has in more recent times.

[skintsaint]

18 minutes ago, suewhistle said:

Interesting analysis in this article:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jul/15/turning-point-england-kyle-walker-throw-in-euro-2024-final-spain

The throw was certainly met with a despairing groan in my pub.

 

I never know why we didn't continue with the long throws into the box when in those areas. I mean we only scored from one.

[SNSUN]

Overall across the tournament it was a poor England showing but with a few individual moments of brilliance. The Semi was probably our best performance but even that relied on a moment of brilliance from Watkins to win it at the death. For me Southgate leaving is the right decision, as a bloke he's OK but as a manager he's negative and reactive. With this team we should be dominating teams not sitting back and hoping for a magical goal from somewhere. Hopefully the new manager is more adventurous.

[East Kent Saint]

1 hour ago, suewhistle said:

Didn't stop Scotland appointing George Burley..

Different standards !

[derry]

1 hour ago, suewhistle said:

Didn't stop Scotland appointing George Burley..

The Scottish FA had a poll for fans on which thousands of Saints fans desperate to get shot of him multiple voted for him. He won the poll and was selected if my memory serves me correctly.

[egg]

1 hour ago, Hayling Saint said:

So who do you recommend?

?

I said that the FA like Southgate because he's a yes man. That much I know. Who could replace him is a separate issue. 

[Sheaf Saint]

9 minutes ago, derry said:

The Scottish FA had a poll for fans on which thousands of Saints fans desperate to get shot of him multiple voted for him. He won the poll and was selected if my memory serves me correctly.

In which case they might have been better off hiring Boaty McBoatface.

[S-Clarke]

2 hours ago, Ted Bates Statue said:

I see where you're coming from but our group stage performances were pretty poor back then.

In 2002 we faced Brazil too early because we played for a draw against Nigeria and let Sweden win the group. 2004, we came second to France in the group as we fell to pieces in our match against them. Under Sven we only won the group stage in 2006 but in the knock-outs we fluffed it on the penalties again. When you see it was players like Gerrard and Lampard who missed their efforts it's not a stretch to suggest that we didn't prepare as thoroughly as Southgate has in more recent times.

There is an element of that for sure, but it's still incredibly luck based. Sometimes you can finish top and still face a pretty shocking route, the way it pans out doesn't always correlate to how the groups finish. For example in 2022 we finished Top, but still had to face France in the quarters (who inevitably beat us).

I think I'd certainly label Southgate as a very lucky manager, things have fallen for him that haven't fallen for other English managers. And he's still not grasped that opportunity - the home final against Italy in 2021 will forever be the one that got away for me, terribly game-managed after that early goal. We were the home team, we should have stomped our way over a pretty average and aging Italian team at that point, but we did what we always do - retreat and try to soak it up.

Edited July 15 by S-Clarke

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

45 minutes ago, egg said:

?

I said that the FA like Southgate because he's a yes man. That much I know. Who could replace him is a separate issue. 

They’ll prefer someone nice like Eddie Howe or Graham Potter, the press will champion Pep or Klopp, probably end up with Weigman……….

[The Kraken]

25 minutes ago, TheAlehouseBrawlers said:

They’ll prefer someone nice like Eddie Howe or Graham Potter, the press will champion Pep or Klopp, probably end up with Weigman……….

I’m fully expecting Potter to get the job. Not exactly inspiring.

[S-Clarke]

1 minute ago, The Kraken said:

I’m fully expecting Potter to get the job. Not exactly inspiring.

I'm kinda expecting Lee Carsley, might be wrong.

[The Kraken]

Just now, S-Clarke said:

I'm kinda expecting Lee Carsley, might be wrong.

Hope not.  Decent coach by all accounts but he’s got an absolutely phenomenal wealth of talent at his disposal, much like Southgate.  Genuinely think the FA need to be headhunting the very best managers in world football.

[Dr. Kucho]

If anyone is interested in the tactics and why Spain beat us last night, this bloke explains exactly why Spain are so good and how they outsmarted us. 

 

[Lighthouse]

18 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

I’m fully expecting Potter to get the job. Not exactly inspiring.

At least he once did a decent job in the PL, unlike Southgate who’s only experience is taking Middlesbrough from the UEFA Cup final to relegation in three years.

[The Kraken]

3 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

At least he once did a decent job in the PL, unlike Southgate who’s only experience is taking Middlesbrough from the UEFA Cup final to relegation in three years.

Potter did well at Brighton but finishing ninth in the PL and then failing badly at Chelsea isn’t the resume I’d want for the next England manager, personally.

[saintant]

2 hours ago, Dr. Kucho said:

If anyone is interested in the tactics and why Spain beat us last night, this bloke explains exactly why Spain are so good and how they outsmarted us. 

 

This guy really knows his stuff. Well worth watching.

[East Kent Saint]

What we have been saying about Kane not playing his usual game explained , this is what the England setup should of acted on during the qualifying stages and either changed the players up front with him or selected someone instead of him .

[sadoldgit]

Spot on. The point at which all of the energy and lift the equaliser gave us disappeared.

https://amp.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jul/15/turning-point-england-kyle-walker-throw-in-euro-2024-final-spain

Gary Lineker summed it up perfectly. Spain’s win was a triumph for attacking football over negative, defensive football.

Edited July 16 by sadoldgit
Apologies Sue. Didn’t realise that you had already posted the article.

[skintsaint]

11 hours ago, The Kraken said:

Potter did well at Brighton but finishing ninth in the PL and then failing badly at Chelsea isn’t the resume I’d want for the next England manager, personally.

Be best to get an interim manager for a year, throw 10m a year at Guardiola when he leaves City and say you won everything at club level, now do it at international level.

Or wait till City get docked 30+ points or demoted a few leagues, he resigns and can start straight away.....yeah right.

[notnowcato]

11 hours ago, The Kraken said:

Potter did well at Brighton but finishing ninth in the PL and then failing badly at Chelsea isn’t the resume I’d want for the next England manager, personally.

Think it’s safe not to judge Potter on a basket case club…. and as for his time at Chelsea…well

Badum-tsch here all week

[Badger]

On 14/07/2024 at 22:52, The Kraken said:

 I think if we had a genuinely brilliant manager at the helm we’d see different things. And I think the three managers you mention were not top notch appointments (although we paid top price for them).

They didn’t turn out to be, but Sven was considered one of the best coaches in Europe at the time of his appointment and a bit of a coup to get him.

Cappello not so much, and McLaren was only mentioned tongue in cheek.

From the names mentioned in the press and BBC Gossip column today  ( Potter, Howe, and worse still in the Guardian, Gerrrard and Lampard) prepare for disappointment as we won’t be getting the outstanding coach you want. 
 

[Dr. Kucho]

12 hours ago, The Kraken said:

Potter did well at Brighton but finishing ninth in the PL and then failing badly at Chelsea isn’t the resume I’d want for the next England manager, personally.

Talking of Chelsea, would Poch be an option? Plays attacking football, out of work, knows the PL and quite a few of the England players. 

[Graffito]

12 hours ago, Dr. Kucho said:

If anyone is interested in the tactics and why Spain beat us last night, this bloke explains exactly why Spain are so good and how they outsmarted us. 

 

Really good that. Thanks for posting.

[CSA96]

 

[CSA96]

[Graffito]

8 hours ago, East Kent Saint said:

What we have been saying about Kane not playing his usual game explained , this is what the England setup should of acted on during the qualifying stages and either changed the players up front with him or selected someone instead of him .

If your referring to the fourfoorTwo analysis, that’s not what I took from it. What I think it’s saying is that a combination of selection and tactics did not suit how Kane plays. In other words, no rashford or sterling who like to go beyond kane when he drops deep and who stretch play and create space, rather we had Bellingham, saka, foden who like ball to feet. In which case, play Watkins who runs in behind and creates space (England’s goal).