The Euro 2024 Thread

[OttawaSaint]

Spain look really panicky now!

[SNSUN]

10 minutes ago, Behind Enemy Lines said:

I know the feeling. I had an inkling it would be Portugal! 

On paper Portugal's squad looks excellent. They need to stop relying on a 39 year old  Ronaldo and 41 year old Pepe. I've also never particularly rated Martinez after wasting the Belgian golden generation 

 

Edited June 30 by SNSUN

[OttawaSaint]

So Swiss next, then Turkey, then Georgia in the final. Easy!

[Jimmy_D]

Not sure they’ll have enough to see this out, but Georgia are actually giving themselves a chance here.

They get a second with one of these breaks and Spain might be in a spot of trouble.

[sfc4prem]

Some of Georgia's players have performed like world beaters. Ridiculous control, vision and confidence from some of them. Expected from the likes of Kvaratskhelia, but the rest are so impressive

[Holmes_and_Watson]

1 minute ago, sfc4prem said:

Some of Georgia's players have performed like world beaters. Ridiculous control, vision and confidence from some of them. Expected from the likes of Kvaratskhelia, but the rest are so impressive

After watching the England and Scotland performances, any side able to string 3 passes together looks impressive. 🙂

[SNSUN]

This Georgian keeper has to be in with a shout for Team of the tournament...

Ah... 1-1

[kevdoh]

On 27/06/2024 at 10:40, Saint Billy said:

I don't have much knowledge of players outside of the prem. Not surprised he has high value.

Yeah fair play I get that. But he deserves to be well known. This tournament will do that I guess but he's way above what we are looking at. We need to hope to get someone like him when Napoli signed him for peanuts 

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

Our guys need to watch Spain. They never seem to do these 'floaty' crosses that come to nothing. The ball is whipped in from corners and crosses and that's always going to cause problems.

[tdmickey3]

We won in spite of that negative, bearded, big toothed twat………boring tactics.

Hideous performance overall 

Saved by one piece of quality

[SNSUN]

Georgia starting to look a bit knackered here. Looks like Spain's second goal has killed the game.

[Elmore Saint]

Hope England are watching this.... attack the defender 1 on 1. Classy goal.

[SNSUN]

To be fair to Georgia they've been good on the counter attack but Spain are just too good. Potential winners here IMO. OK their striking option could be better than Morata but Williams and Lamal have been excellent and then there's Rodri and Pedri.

[whelk]

Just imagine what Southgate would do with this Spanish team. Imagine 33 attempts at goal - he’d do his nut at such entertaining 

[Osvaldorama]

Spain are nailed on to win if they can keep these levels up. Unbelievable team. Their attacking players are different gravy

[gallaghert366@yahoo.com]

You'll all be screaming next Saturday when Southgate announces no changes.

[sadoldgit]

10 minutes ago, Osvaldorama said:

Spain are nailed on to win if they can keep these levels up. Unbelievable team. Their attacking players are different gravy

They make us look like a Sunday pub side. You just know that he will start with the same team against Switzerland, baring injuries.

Edited June 30 by sadoldgit

[The Kraken]

4 minutes ago, gallaghert366@yahoo.com said:

You'll all be screaming next Saturday when Southgate announces no changes.

Guehi is suspended so there’s the one change per game sorted already. Gareth be all 😎 with that.

[Cabrone]

Good teams at this level either have players that attack with pace or players that can get round the defence or both. The England starting 11 appear to have neither.

Also when we got the 2nd goal it was instant retreat - no thoughts of trying for the third to kill the game off. A better team than Slovakia would have made us pay for this. So so boring to watch.

Unless there is a U turn in attitude we will be deservedly dumped out on Saturday.

[saintant]

30 minutes ago, Cabrone said:

Good teams at this level either have players that attack with pace or players that can get round the defence or both. The England starting 11 appear to have neither.

Also when we got the 2nd goal it was instant retreat - no thoughts of trying for the third to kill the game off. A better team than Slovakia would have made us pay for this. So so boring to watch.

Unless there is a U turn in attitude we will be deservedly dumped out on Saturday.

Southgate just can't help himself. We'd managed to get on top then equalised at the death. We then came out of the blocks in extra time and went ahead. Rather than keeping our foot to the pedal Southgate orders a complete retreat and hands the initiative back to Slovakia. What is wrong with the man, he could easily have cost us a victory which we scarcely deserved.

[kevdoh]

We will probably scrape past Switzerland then beat a bang average Holland on pens and get smashed by Spain in the final. Southgate will be lauded by the media as usual for getting to another final and and anyone that questions him wil be told about his record of semi finals/ finals even though anybody could blindly pick 11 players from this squad and have no tactics or team talk and perform better. He's had the luckiest path to the latter stages in every tournament he's been in charge and done fuck all with it

[AlexLaw76]

Bellingham talks shite at times.

having another pop at fans, saying England played well bar their goal, and did not want to listen to all the rubbish had we gone out. 

Edited July 1 by AlexLaw76

[Give it to Ron]

38 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bellingham talks shite at times.

having another pop at fans, saying England played well bar their goal, and did not want to listen to all the rubbish had we gone out. 

There is noise because the tactics and team selection are shite !

We had used 2 of the 5 subs going into injury time needing a goal had Watkins and Toney sat on arse.

[Gingeletiss]

What an arrogant twat that Bellingham boy is. Also, seen a saints flag on the BBC news just now.

[S-Clarke]

There's nothing wrong with arrogance or having an ego per-say, but there's a line you can cross.

Ronaldo/Zlatan etc did it on the pitch, so they can have as big an ego as they want - their careers are littered with wins.

Then you have the other angle - Balotelli, Richarlison, Pogba etc. They had the ego, the arrogance, but never backed it up on the pitch so they were seen as a prick.

Bellingham is on that line at the moment. He's still very, very young and will have some maturing to do. I hope he follows the Ronaldo/Zlatan direction rather than the others.

[Sheaf Saint]

52 minutes ago, Gingeletiss said:

What an arrogant twat that Bellingham boy is. Also, seen a saints flag on the BBC news just now.

Shouting "who else!" after scoring was classless IMO. Shows he believes himself to be the star in the team. This is backed up by his getting frustrated when other players don't pass to him.

He's an exciting talent, no doubt. But he's got a long way to go before he's earned the right to be that arrogant. And the team can do without that kind of bell-endery. 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Shouting "who else!" after scoring was classless IMO. Shows he believes himself to be the star in the team. This is backed up by his getting frustrated when other players don't pass to him.

He's an exciting talent, no doubt. But he's got a long way to go before he's earned the right to be that arrogant. And the team can do without that kind of bell-endery. 

He's a 21 year old lad who has been told he's a demi god since he was little. I'd be surprised if he wasn't a bit of an arrogant bellend tbh but if he ends up winning England the tournament I don't think anyone will care much. 

[badgerx16]

12 hours ago, tdmickey3 said:

We won in spite of that negative, bearded, big toothed twat………boring tactics.

Hideous performance overall

Is this England or Saints ?

[saintant]

Time to ditch the tried and failed formation and try something radical although, with Southgate in charge, we know it won't happen. I'd play 3 at the back with fast attacking wing-backs either side. Also, when the time is right allow Stones to move into midfield. Play three midfielders with two attackers given licence to roam.

Pickford

Walker Dunk Stones Konza Saka

Palmer Bellingham Foden

Kane Watkins

Play to our strengths just for once and let the opposition worry about us. Get the wing backs out wide and encourage them to get forward at every opportunity. Play Foden and Palmer in inverted roles to give the wide space to the wing-backs and let Bellingham play off the cuff. We are far too rigid and predictable. Time to do something different.

 

Edited July 1 by saintant

[Patches O Houlihan]

10 minutes ago, saintant said:

Time to ditch the tried and failed formation and try something radical although, with Southgate in charge, we know it won't happen. I'd play 3 at the back with fast attacking wing-backs either side. Also, when the time is right allow Stones to move into midfield. Play three midfielders with two attackers given licence to roam.

Pickford

Walker Dunk Stones Konza Saka

Palmer Bellingham Foden

Kane Watkins

Play to our strengths just for once and let the opposition worry about us. Get the wing backs out wide and encourage them to get forward at every opportunity. Play Foden and Palmer in inverted roles to give the wide space to the wing-backs and let Bellingham play off the cuff. We are far too rigid and predictable. Time to do something different.

 

Are you smoking crack?! That midfield!

[LeBizzier69]

12 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

They make us look like a Sunday pub side. You just know that he will start with the same team against Switzerland, baring injuries.

I think every team has made us look like that. The attitide after the game (and straight after Bellingham scored) has left me feeling completely disinterested in how we get on.

Seen the odds for the Swiss game....I've seen England 21/20 and Swiss are 14/5. Nice.

[saintant]

2 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

Are you smoking crack?! That midfield!

What is wrong with it? I guess you'd want Rice in there to continually give the ball away or pass backward. We need to utilise our skillful players, ones who are good on the ball and can create space. Spain have it right, pack your team with attacking players and create angles, runs, dribbles, players between the lines and make chances. Had enough of the water carriers who offer nothing. Carry on with Southgate's attitude and we'll continue to create little and look poor. Let's at least try something different and go down attacking rather than the turgid stuff being served up.

[sadoldgit]

25 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

He's a 21 year old lad who has been told he's a demi god since he was little. I'd be surprised if he wasn't a bit of an arrogant bellend tbh but if he ends up winning England the tournament I don't think anyone will care much. 

To be fair hypo, it wouldn’t be the first time you have given a bellend your support.

[Patches O Houlihan]

Just now, saintant said:

What is wrong with it? I guess you'd want Rice in there to continually give the ball away or pass backward. We need to utilise our skillful players, ones who are good on the ball and can create space. Spain have it right, pack your team with attacking players and create angles, runs, dribbles, players between the lines and make chances. Had enough of the water carriers who offer nothing. Carry on with Southgate's attitude and we'll continue to create little and look poor. Let's at least try something different and go down attacking rather than the turgid stuff being served up.

So Palmer & Bellingham who have had free roles up to now are suddenly going to offer you the discipline of the Spanish midfield three. Bellingham is going to play as a 6 and not a 10? 

As an attacking right wing back you'd chose Walker, rather than have Walker play as RCB and have TAA outside him? 

Who's playing as the target man and who is the support striker in your team?

Dunk and Saka are first choice defenders in your plan.

[The Kraken]

2 minutes ago, saintant said:

What is wrong with it? I guess you'd want Rice in there to continually give the ball away or pass backward. We need to utilise our skillful players, ones who are good on the ball and can create space. Spain have it right, pack your team with attacking players and create angles, runs, dribbles, players between the lines and make chances. Had enough of the water carriers who offer nothing. Carry on with Southgate's attitude and we'll continue to create little and look poor. Let's at least try something different and go down attacking rather than the turgid stuff being served up.

What's right with it?  You've basically shoehorned in 5 attacking players with 5 defenders and literally no midfield cover.  The centre of the pitch would be overrun against any side, let alone Switzerland who are actually pretty decent.

Nothing wrong with wing backs per se, and I think it's what's will happen.   But not in that formation, we'd get dicked.

[sadoldgit]

3 minutes ago, saintant said:

What is wrong with it? I guess you'd want Rice in there to continually give the ball away or pass backward. We need to utilise our skillful players, ones who are good on the ball and can create space. Spain have it right, pack your team with attacking players and create angles, runs, dribbles, players between the lines and make chances. Had enough of the water carriers who offer nothing. Carry on with Southgate's attitude and we'll continue to create little and look poor. Let's at least try something different and go down attacking rather than the turgid stuff being served up.

The words “try something different” do not exist in Southgate’s vocabulary. The fact that he left the Toney substitution so late shows how he agonises against changing anything. He has always been risk averse, but I actually think he is getting worse.

 

[Turkish]

4 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

To be fair hypo, it wouldn’t be the first time you have given a bellend your support.

ah so you were friends once?

[saintant]

1 minute ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

So Palmer & Bellingham who have had free roles up to now are suddenly going to offer you the discipline of the Spanish midfield three. Bellingham is going to play as a 6 and not a 10? 

As an attacking right wing back you'd chose Walker, rather than have Walker play as RCB and have TAA outside him? 

Who's playing as the target man and who is the support striker in your team?

Dunk and Saka are first choice defenders in your plan.

The Spanish midfield are a joy - they are not disciplined rather they are encouraged to express themselves. Disciplined is a word I'd associate with a Southgate team and look at the insipid dross that produces. There's no target man or support striker just two good players given licence to use their nous and make clever runs.

Walker is always best when he is allowed to overlap and bomb down the wing.

Guehi is suspended, Dunk is a decent player - if not why is he in the squad?

We need to take some risks and give our opponents something to worry about. If Southgate plays the same style against Switzerland I can't see anything other than a defeat. 

[saintant]

8 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

What's right with it?  You've basically shoehorned in 5 attacking players with 5 defenders and literally no midfield cover.  The centre of the pitch would be overrun against any side, let alone Switzerland who are actually pretty decent.

Nothing wrong with wing backs per se, and I think it's what's will happen.   But not in that formation, we'd get dicked.

We are currently getting overrun in the centre of the pitch even when playing Rice because we give the ball away far too much. Stones can move into midfield when appropriate as I've already suggested. We have too much emphasis on ball winners and water carriers - let's play with some freedom and not put all the planning on stopping goals, it's negative and means we create nothing.

[Patches O Houlihan]

11 minutes ago, saintant said:

The Spanish midfield are a joy - they are not disciplined rather they are encouraged to express themselves. Disciplined is a word I'd associate with a Southgate team and look at the insipid dross that produces.

BBC iPlayer Link to last night's highlights. Watch from 38m30s - Analysis of how the disciplined Spanish midfield trio operate. Rodri sits, but when he comes forward one of Pedri or Ruis covers for him. Rodri is playing the 'water carrier' Rice role. You remember - the crucial 6 role in most teams. The one played by Lavia and Flynn Downes - and notably when they didn't play we would usually get humped.

[saintant]

1 minute ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

BBC iPlayer Link to last night's highlights. Watch from 38m30s - Analysis of how the disciplined Spanish midfield trio operate. Rodri sits, but when he comes forward one of Pedri or Ruis covers for him. Rodri is playing the 'water carrier' Rice role. You remember - the crucial 6 role in most teams. The one played by Lavia and Flynn Downes - and notably when they didn't play we would usually get humped.

I don't think anyone could describe Rodri as a water-carrier.

[The Kraken]

Just now, saintant said:

We are currently getting overrun in the centre of the pitch even when playing Rice because we give the ball away far too much. Stones can move into midfield when appropriate as I've already suggested. We have too much emphasis on ball winners and water carriers - let's play with some freedom and not put all the planning on stopping goals, it's negative and means we create nothing.

Couldn't possibly agree less.

We do not have an emphasis on ball winners.  Kobbie Mainoo was our most destructive attacking player yesterday, he often got the ball to his feet and ran at defenders, he was always looking to play forwards.  You want John Stones to do that job instead?  Good grief.  If Mainoo doesn't start next time out then Southgate's lost it even more than I thought, Mainoo was our only consistent bright spark.

I see our shape as a big problem.  Full backs far too risk averse, Trippier cutting back onto his right every time, Walker not a good overlapping full back, it means Saka and Foden keep coming back to look for it each time rather than breaking the lines.  All very boring and predictable and easily fixable without changing the shape massively (although I'd bring in TAA and Shaw if fit to play as attacking full backs).

[Patches O Houlihan]

It was you who used it. 

Road sweepers and violinists was what Lawrie Mac used to refer to. You need both.

[CylonKing]

This is all well and good but doesn't answer the burning question, is Brooks cup tied or not?

[SNSUN]

Ironically my team wouldn't be much different to the current starting line up despite everything but I would drop Foden who I think has been largely ineffective all tournament. Toney made a case for there to be a second striker alongside Kane but personally I think Gordon, Eze or Palmer should be in. Of those three it's a tough call but possibly Palmer on the right and switch Saka to the left (or have them fluidly switching sides). Dunk in for Guehi. Shaw in for Tripper IF fit. I saw enough of Mainoo to keep playing him although I think after he was booked he lost some of his effectiveness but I did like his direct runs.

Pickford

Walker

Stones

Dunk

Trippier/Shaw

Mainoo

Rice

Palmer

Bellingham!

Kane

Saka

 

 

 

 

Edited July 1 by SNSUN

[CWD]

9 minutes ago, SNSUN said:

Ironically my team wouldn't be much different to the current starting line up despite everything but I would drop Foden who I think has been largely ineffective all tournament. Toney made a case for there to be a second striker alongside Kane but personally I think Gordon, Eze or Palmer should be in. Of those three it's a tough call but possibly Palmer on the right and switch Saka to the left (or have them fluidly switching sides). Dunk in for Guehi. Shaw in for Tripper IF fit. I saw enough of Mainoo to keep playing him although I think after he was booked he lost some of his effectiveness but I did like his direct runs.

Pickford

Walker

Stones

Dunk

Trippier/Shaw

Mainoo

Rice

Palmer

Kane

Saka

 

 

 

 

Only playing 10 players is just the sort of tactical wizardry we can expect from Southgate tbf 

[S-Clarke]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

Time to ditch the tried and failed formation and try something radical although, with Southgate in charge, we know it won't happen. I'd play 3 at the back with fast attacking wing-backs either side. Also, when the time is right allow Stones to move into midfield. Play three midfielders with two attackers given licence to roam.

Pickford

Walker Dunk Stones Konza Saka

Palmer Bellingham Foden

Kane Watkins

Play to our strengths just for once and let the opposition worry about us. Get the wing backs out wide and encourage them to get forward at every opportunity. Play Foden and Palmer in inverted roles to give the wide space to the wing-backs and let Bellingham play off the cuff. We are far too rigid and predictable. Time to do something different.

 

That midfield is a bit mental, you have 3 players there who all like to go forward and don't have a disciplined bone in their body.

As soon as we are broken on there will be zero cover and you've got everyone and their gran running at a pretty slow back 3 there.

When you look at Spain you have two disciplined CM's, water carrier is probably a bit disrespectful to their role, but they hold their positions well and know how to play CM. Rodri and Fabian have been excellent at it. Rodri is one of the best 6's in the entire planet, I don't see any better tbh.

There is nothing wrong with Rice as a player, you have to play him to provide a bit of discipline in there. The biggest positive change you could make would be some left footers down the left hand side, it's unbelievable how unbalanced we are and that slows the game down massively. 

Edited July 1 by S-Clarke

[SNSUN]

 

5 minutes ago, CWD said:

Only playing 10 players is just the sort of tactical wizardry we can expect from Southgate tbf 

I figured Bellingham's inclusion was such a no-brainer I didn't even need to include it. 😁

Ok I got distracted when writing that and effed up...

[The Kraken]

9 minutes ago, SNSUN said:

Ironically my team wouldn't be much different to the current starting line up despite everything but I would drop Foden who I think has been largely ineffective all tournament. Toney made a case for there to be a second striker alongside Kane but personally I think Gordon, Eze or Palmer should be in. Of those three it's a tough call but possibly Palmer on the right and switch Saka to the left (or have them fluidly switching sides). Dunk in for Guehi. Shaw in for Tripper IF fit. I saw enough of Mainoo to keep playing him although I think after he was booked he lost some of his effectiveness but I did like his direct runs.

Pickford

Walker

Stones

Dunk

Trippier/Shaw

Mainoo

Rice

Palmer

Kane

Saka

I don't think many would argue too much with the actual personnel Southage has picked (TAA at CM aside), I very much see our problem as a symptom of how they're being asked to play.  Too ponderous, too slow, too careful, too negative all over the pitch.  It's Southgate all over.

As I previously said I'd definitely have TAA at full back instead of Walker, especially if we go 3 at the back and Walker will go more central.  Walker had an abomination of a game yesterday defensively and going forwards has never been the strongest part of his game.  There's been no dynamic between RB/Saka and LB/Foden whereby the full back supports and overlaps and it creates spaces for the "winger" and pushes the other team back.  We had phases of a minute or two throughout the game where we sort of did it but not for anywhere near long enough or well enough.  Marauding full backs should have had an absolute field day against some of our opposition so far yet I can't remember in this tournament before yesterday when Trippier overlapped and got a ball in from the line.  Tripper especially has just been so entirely predictable, he obviously has no left foot that he's willing to trust and goes safety first each time.  Walker is entirely a safety first full back, he may get forward for City but he's not exactly great at it., though he does at least provided the numbers further up the pitch when he does it.

[Patches O Houlihan]

10 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

I don't think many would argue too much with the actual personnel Southage has picked (TAA at CM aside), I very much see our problem as a symptom of how they're being asked to play.  Too ponderous, too slow, too careful, too negative all over the pitch.  It's Southgate all over.

As I previously said I'd definitely have TAA at full back instead of Walker, especially if we go 3 at the back and Walker will go more central.  Walker had an abomination of a game yesterday defensively and going forwards has never been the strongest part of his game.  There's been no dynamic between RB/Saka and LB/Foden whereby the full back supports and overlaps and it creates spaces for the "winger" and pushes the other team back.  We had phases of a minute or two throughout the game where we sort of did it but not for anywhere near long enough or well enough.  Marauding full backs should have had an absolute field day against some of our opposition so far yet I can't remember in this tournament before yesterday when Trippier overlapped and got a ball in from the line.  Tripper especially has just been so entirely predictable, he obviously has no left foot that he's willing to trust and goes safety first each time.  Walker is entirely a safety first full back, he may get forward for City but he's not exactly great at it., though he does at least provided the numbers further up the pitch when he does it.

⬆️ This

We really need a left footer on the left. 

1) Shaw & Foden

2) Shaw & Gordon

3) Trippier & Gordon

4) Saka LWB & Foden (Maybe?)

5) Saka on left & Palmer or Foden on the right?

 

1) is what Southgate wants but is dependant on Shaw's fitness

2) Would probably be really effective, but politically difficult because you'd not be starting Palmer & Foden. (Is Gordon fit?)

3) If Trippier's not seriously injured this is what a brave Southgate might do. But he's shown little bravery since the tournament started.

4) If Trippier is injured and Shaw not fit this is what I think Southgate will do.

Edited July 1 by Patches O Houlihan