Saints 1-2 Millwall - Match Thread

[Cabrone]

I think that is that. Need to get some momentum for the playoffs, autos are looking dead now.

[aintforever]

32 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

📊 Will Smallbone vs Millwall: 

 

• Lost possession 13 times

• 0 Tackles

• 0 Interceptions

• 0/1 Aerial duals won

• 0/3 Ground duals won

• 0/1 Successful dribbles

• 0/2 Cross accuracy 

Just seen this on Twitter. Surely this can't be true 😂

Those stats don’t surprise me, he was like the invisible man today.

[sfc4prem]

What 'noise' is Taylor referring to in his post-match interview?

"Some of the noise that's going on has been ridiculous and you've just got to block it out"

[FarehamSaintJames]

The game was lost as soon as Smallbone was put at holding midfield and Stephens was shoehorned into the side.

[sfc4prem]

Just now, FarehamSaintJames said:

The game was lost as soon as Smallbone was put at holding midfield and Stephens was shoehorned into the side.

That's a silly comment, James. We won 2-0 away to West Bromwich with those two individuals starting.

[Lord Duckhunter]

First couple of mins we were ok, started quickly & win a corner. A corner where we minced around and passed it out for a goal kick. What do they do, win a free kick, knocked it in the mixer & 🤡 in nets . Goal. 
 

The lack of urgency second half was fucking criminal. 

Edited February 24 by Lord Duckhunter

[Charlie Wayman]

The invincibles have transforment into the unconvincibles. Russ has been sussed! Simple as that.

 

 

[Miltonaggro]

Sulemana should be nicknamed the Ford Capri, flatters to deceive, only fast in a straight line, and repeatedly fucked over by the professionals! 

[Charlie Wayman]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

Probably just waiting a few months for the (inevitable) play-off defeat now. 

This should be the end of the Martinball experiment. Do we get rid of him now or wait till May.

Next season likely to be horrible on a Poortvliet / Wotte scale

Look on the bright side, we get to keep Manning, Bree, Stephens and McCarthy if we stay in the Championship.

[beatlesaint]

13 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

The lack of urgency second half was fucking criminal. 

Yeah this is the trouble with RM’s style. If you are winning and just knocking the ball about with little purpose the majority accept it but when you’re losing and the team are still puddling about in the middle of the park and showing little urgency it’s bloody frustrating to say the least.

Edited February 24 by beatlesaint

[Charlie Wayman]

10 minutes ago, Miltonaggro said:

Sulemana should be nicknamed the Ford Capri, flatters to deceive, only fast in a straight line, and repeatedly fucked over by the professionals! 

That's not fair, Martin was moaning at the poor sod almost from the moment he came on, never had a chance to express his talent and as far as Martin was concerned he couldn't do anything right. Obvious that Martin doesn't rate him. One player we will lose in the summer whatever happens.

I think we are gradually seeing the real Russell Martin now, it will be the players fault not the coaches if we fail to get promoted. 

[Appy]

2 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

That's not fair, Martin was moaning at the poor sod almost from the moment he came on, never had a chance to express his talent and as far as Martin was concerned he couldn't do anything right. Obvious that Martin doesn't rate him. One player we will lose in the summer whatever happens.

I think we are gradually seeing the real Russell Martin now, it will be the players fault not the coaches if we fail to get promoted. 

He was probably moaning at him because he was absolutely shite, pretty much like he has been since he joined us. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

That was a horrific watch against a team that were more interested in kicking anything that moved apart from the ball. Couple that with a weak as piss ref who missed foul after foul. They had tactic, hoof it as far up the field as possible and chase. It was football straight out of League 2 and we got done by it. We should have the ability to rise above that level of shitness, but there was just no urgency or incisive movement. It was like a pre-season friendly. That's the worse game I've seen at St Marys this season without a doubt. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

5 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

One player we will lose in the summer whatever happens.

Not going to be a great loss.

[Lighthouse]

First half I thought we generally looked decent enough, even though we went in behind. Looked like crap keeping for their first goal, the penalty I didn’t get a good view of from the Northam/Kingsland corner. I thought Manning should have started, or at least been on for JS at half time. It’s Millwall at home, if ever there was a game for an attack minded, weaker defensively player, it’s this one. Losing Fraser was obviously a big blow, this was a game where players like Edozie and Sully just didn’t have space to run into. I wouldn’t have made the Adams - AA sub either, if anything I’d have brought on Mara for Adams and AA for Brooks, who was very quiet. Smallbone and Rothwell both looked sh*t to me too.

Second half we just completely ran out of ideas and the little incident down by the corner flag at the end clearly showed their heads had gone. THB managed to talk himself into an utterly pointless booking and KWP was lucky not to get a brainless sending off, smacking the ball at a player lying on the ground.

With Hull result, Leeds beating Leicester and today, that’s basically a 9 point shift in the automatic promotion race inside 4 days. Pretty s**t week all round.

[Block41 Saint]

5 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Not going to be a great loss.

Comfortably the worst signing this club has ever made.

[Vancouver Saint]

Where's the sexy nuns when we need them?

[northam soul]

Well that was appalling.

Just stopped off for a coffee on my 3 1/2 hour drive home to calm down.

No fucking urgency at all in that 2nd half.

Millwall offered absolutely nothing but we still couldn’t fashion many chances.

Rothwell should of done better and their keeper made one good save.

For a team like them to beat us their keeper should be having the game of his life but we are not creating anything.

And I agree that Smallbone is a waste of a shirt.

[6ft8saint]

14 minutes ago, Appy said:

He was probably moaning at him because he was absolutely shite, pretty much like he has been since he joined us. 

That's not true he is 10x the player smallbone is but he does kiss rm's butt. He needs to start games not come on with 20 to play. Admittedly I don't think Rm knows how to play him nor values him like onuachu who funnily is scoring goals in another league and were considering writing off 8m. I think he is our missing target for corners or set pieces at 6ft 8

[Wade Garrett]

23 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

That's not fair, Martin was moaning at the poor sod almost from the moment he came on, never had a chance to express his talent and as far as Martin was concerned he couldn't do anything right. Obvious that Martin doesn't rate him. One player we will lose in the summer whatever happens.

I think we are gradually seeing the real Russell Martin now, it will be the players fault not the coaches if we fail to get promoted. 

He doesn’t like him because he tries to take a player on instead of passing in-field.

I’m still fucked off that Stephens was playing in midfield for most of the game.  Russ has lost the fucking plot.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

4 minutes ago, 6ft8saint said:

That's not true he is 10x the player smallbone is but he does kiss rm's butt. He needs to start games not come on with 20 to play. Admittedly I don't think Rm knows how to play him nor values him like onuachu who funnily is scoring goals in another league and were considering writing off 8m. I think he is our missing target for corners or set pieces at 6ft 8

He's shite. A player like him should be tearing up this league. Look at what the two Leeds wingers are doing. For the fee we paid, he's been an absolute waste. 

[Lighthouse]

Just now, Wade Garrett said:

He doesn’t like him because he tries to take a player on instead of passing in-field.

I’m still fucked off that Stephens was playing in midfield for most of the game.  Russ has lost the fucking plot.

I think we were trying to play in field more because sticking crosses in to their 6ft 14in CB, Cooper, was never going to yield much fruit.

[Chewy]

FWIW - that was sh1t. 
In their own way 2 kind of freakish goals which happen from time to time. Starting set up was fine but we ended up with Brooks wide right not being used, and everything going down the left with - at times - KWP, Aribo, Will, Stu and Stephen’s all basically playing in the same part of the pitch. Really lopsided and Weird.

Second half we attempted more balance, but rarely threatened. Poor finish from Rothwell and one decent save was pretty much it.

What I really struggled to understand is why RM didn’t try and change the shape - we had so much of the ball and only ever one striker in the middle of the box. We pushed Jan up in injury fucking time. What about sticking on 2 strikers in a must win game with 20 minutes to go? 
RM bangs on about being brave but he’s never brave enough to change his beloved formation. Much better to change the full back. Or swap in the pointless Rothwell.

Weak as p1ss ref but he’s not why we lost. Rms tactics and our lack of a) cover for Downes and b) a striker are why we lost.
Players don’t look like they’re enjoying it - the introduction of Brooks and Rothwell into the squad hasn’t improved the team and doesn’t appear to have improved the squad dynamic. In fact I’d suggest it’s made it a fair bit worse.

Im worried after today. I hope it’s a blip in form and we recover in time for the playoffs (automatic has gone). But I sense it’s a bit more than that. Hope I’m wrong 

[Stu Man Do]

1 minute ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

He's shite. A player like him should be tearing up this league. Look at what the two Leeds wingers are doing. For the fee we paid, he's been an absolute waste. 

End of the day he has no actual pedigree in the game prior to joining us. He’s been a hugely expensive punt taken in order to hopefully make some quick money. If you took away the Liverpool game no one would be able to recognise him as a 20m + signing.

Couple this with signing a crocked striker and spaffing 10 million of our budget on a CM project who the manager doesn’t trust … well we are truly in bother.

[Harry_SFC]

1 minute ago, Lighthouse said:

I think we were trying to play in field more because sticking crosses in to their 6ft 14in CB, Cooper, was never going to yield much fruit.

There was no space to play through the middle either. This is where you need some individual brilliance or a change of plan. Sadly we had neither. 

[Wade Garrett]

2 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

I think we were trying to play in field more because sticking crosses in to their 6ft 14in CB, Cooper, was never going to yield much fruit.

Well playing infield worked fucking well.  They didn’t even have to break a sweat to keep us out.  If you get to the line and cross, even Lurch at the back is struggling facing his own goal.

[Badger]

55 minutes ago, sfc4prem said:

What 'noise' is Taylor referring to in his post-match interview?

"Some of the noise that's going on has been ridiculous and you've just got to block it out"

Anyone offer any explanation on this, or where it has come from ?

“noise”, nothing to do with dissatisfaction over two piss poor results and performances you’d hope.  

[saintant]

2 minutes ago, Badger said:

Anyone offer any explanation on this, or where it has come from ?

“noise”, nothing to do with dissatisfaction over two piss poor results and performances you’d hope.  

Maybe to do with Jason Wilcox.

[HarvSFC]

That was abysmal. A Millwall side who had come into the fixture winless in 7 and losing 6 of those 7.

Millwall's gameplan was to put some early challenges in, put some fear into our players, hope one of ours picks up a knock from the challenges and go for a scrappy game. It worked. Fraser, the victim of their rough play and his replacement Edozie didn't take his man on again after the first heavy tackle he received.

Our play was summed up by one of our corners going straight out for a goal kick before it reached the box.

The frontline today looked good on paper, but Adams was too isolated upfront, every time he got the ball nobody was playing off him and he had to come backwards every time. The same for A. Armstrong when he replaced him. Why we didn't play a two up top today at any point during today's game, I don't know. Brooks didn't do anything, just recycled the ball and as said, Edozie was too passive today, never committed his full-back. S. Armstrong made one run at the start, but anonymous after that. Really think this needs to be his last season here when his contract's up at the end of the season. Isn't suited to the English game anymore, but we'll probably give out one of those charitable contracts.

The whole team were just really poor. Every time they just opted for the easy pass and usually that was to one of Bednarek, or Harwood-Bellis, rather than going forwards. Not one player tried to make something happen today, which is pathetic against 20th in the league. Even Walker-Peters was bad today, but again he's getting shoe horned all over the place.

I know Alcaraz wasn't a key player in the unbeaten run, but he was a member of each and every match squad. But, he scored a cracking, decisive goal against Plymouth a month before his departure and a goal against Blackburn in the 4-0 win two weeks beforehand off the bench after missing the penalty. Letting a player who was contributing in the side go was just pure arrogance by the decision makers. Neither Leicester, Leeds nor Ipswich let first team players go in January. But, we'd have probably sold KWP if the right offer came in such is the lack of backbone at this club. Then replacing Alcaraz with Rothwell was moronic.

But, then we spent money on two players this season. All of the season's budget on two players who have contributed nothing for us. Not really blaming Charles, he plays well for Northern Ireland and should be growing into his position with Downes out. But, we shouldn't be spending £10m+ on a player that the manager doesn't want to use.

[dellboysaint]

Neither Suleimana or Alcarez fit Martin’s style. They are attacking players and Sule likes the ball over the top to run onto. Alcarez moved it forward looking for openings and also a shot. Thoth players clearly unsettle Martin. Both players over Smallbone any day.

[Lighthouse]

9 minutes ago, HarvSFC said:

I know Alcaraz wasn't a key player in the unbeaten run, but he was a member of each and every match squad. But, he scored a cracking, decisive goal against Plymouth a month before his departure and a goal against Blackburn in the 4-0 win two weeks beforehand off the bench after missing the penalty. Letting a player who was contributing in the side go was just pure arrogance by the decision makers. Neither Leicester, Leeds nor Ipswich let first team players go in January. But, we'd have probably sold KWP if the right offer came in such is the lack of backbone at this club. Then replacing Alcaraz with Rothwell was moronic.

Alcaraz has been consistently poor this season and Rothwell has already matched his contribution with the two goals against udders. I don't know where you're dreaming up that stuff about selling KWP. We didn't in summer, we didn't in January and the only two players we did let go were contributing very little.

[CB Fry]

3 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Alcaraz has been consistently poor this season and Rothwell has already matched his contribution with the two goals against udders. I don't know where you're dreaming up that stuff about selling KWP. We didn't in summer, we didn't in January and the only two players we did let go were contributing very little.

"Let's slag off the club for selling players that have only been sold in my imagination" is a new one.

[S-Clarke]

Not sure where the re-writing of history is coming from re: Charly. I was frustrated to see him go as I liked him, but you cannot sit there and honestly say he contributed to us this season. He was bit-part at best, certainly not one of our key players. Whether he should have been is up for debate, but he wasn't important for us because he wasn't playing.

[Appy]

1 hour ago, 6ft8saint said:

That's not true he is 10x the player smallbone is but he does kiss rm's butt. He needs to start games not come on with 20 to play. Admittedly I don't think Rm knows how to play him nor values him like onuachu who funnily is scoring goals in another league and were considering writing off 8m. I think he is our missing target for corners or set pieces at 6ft 8

What sort of weirdo compares Smallbone to Sulemana?

[saint francis]

When Sulemana came on I was looking forward to him getting on the ball and seeing what he could create.  He made some decent runs which were ignored by Manning in favour of sideways passing.  When we're a goal down with 15 to go we surely need be a bit more proactive and take some chances in the last third.  

[Roger]

18 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Not sure where the re-writing of history is coming from re: Charly. I was frustrated to see him go as I liked him, but you cannot sit there and honestly say he contributed to us this season. He was bit-part at best, certainly not one of our key players. Whether he should have been is up for debate, but he wasn't important for us because he wasn't playing.

Damn sight better player than rothwell. 

[saint francis]

Their first goal, to me it looked like there was 2 Millwall forwards clearly offside.  Will wait for the highlights to appear to confirm or deny. 

[Toussaint]

25 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Not sure where the re-writing of history is coming from re: Charly. I was frustrated to see him go as I liked him, but you cannot sit there and honestly say he contributed to us this season. He was bit-part at best, certainly not one of our key players. Whether he should have been is up for debate, but he wasn't important for us because he wasn't playing.

What I would say in his defence, the away game at Millwall was very tight, he completely ran the show in the second half that day. All things being equal we’d have been better if had kept him, he did possess the X factor. 

[Harry_SFC]

22 minutes ago, saint francis said:

Their first goal, to me it looked like there was 2 Millwall forwards clearly offside.  Will wait for the highlights to appear to confirm or deny. 

Just seen the highlights..they were offside but they didn't go for the ball and weren't interfering. The guy who scored just about looked level but it was very tight. 

[ErwinK1961]

31 minutes ago, Appy said:

What sort of weirdo compares Smallbone to Sulemana?

A really tall one by the looks of it.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

2 hours ago, Pamplemousse said:

I have to get a train back to London with these neanderthals 

Fuck you Saints

Did you get on the platform? Seemed like half Hampshire's constabulary was heading that way when we left the ground.

Can't think of anyone who had a good game today. As some have said, the transfer window doesn't seem to have done us any favours. Even Brooks was largely anonymous. That ball needs to go in to the penalty area and there needs to be our players in there to do something with it.

[gio1saints]

i think team including RM are believing our own hype. It started about five matches ago. 

We seem to have lost our humility and willingness to chase every ball and instead rely upon our way so superior skill way so superior talented players and our state of the art pB based football. 

The only thing relentless about these last matches has been how lacking we have been in working for each other. Too often players isolated too often only backwards passes available. 

We are going into matches as the big favourites and crumbling mentally. The only match that looked like it could be our “ level”  funny enough they showed up for 25 mins v WBA. Just cannot cope with being overdogs.

As well as the squad tinkering this is an obvious psychological hang up. Playing  as overdogs is a special skill - and there’s research out there for those interested in sports Pyschology - and we do not have it, yet. 

There’s still tIme to resolve the issues is the only good news. A lot of what they did today was ok but the critical bit in last third they just chickened out. Oh for a greedy goal scorer who shoots on sight! 
 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

3 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

A lot of what they did today was ok

Not sure I would agree with that. We were awful. Worst performance of the season at home. Too many players didn't fancy it. 

[hypochondriac]

16 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

i think team including RM are believing our own hype. It started about five matches ago. 

We seem to have lost our humility and willingness to chase every ball and instead rely upon our way so superior skill way so superior talented players and our state of the art pB based football. 

The only thing relentless about these last matches has been how lacking we have been in working for each other. Too often players isolated too often only backwards passes available. 

We are going into matches as the big favourites and crumbling mentally. The only match that looked like it could be our “ level”  funny enough they showed up for 25 mins v WBA. Just cannot cope with being overdogs.

As well as the squad tinkering this is an obvious psychological hang up. Playing  as overdogs is a special skill - and there’s research out there for those interested in sports Pyschology - and we do not have it, yet. 

There’s still tIme to resolve the issues is the only good news. A lot of what they did today was ok but the critical bit in last third they just chickened out. Oh for a greedy goal scorer who shoots on sight! 
 

That comment about enjoying our record breaking unbeaten record seems like a very long time ago. As I said, means jackshit if we don't go up. Otherwise this season is just going to be remembered as one where we missed an opportunity. 

[James G]

It's the absence of Downes that has changed the dynamic, pure and simple. It's about keeping the team as it was, and finding a suitable replacement. Russ has tinkered with all the other positions and we're back to square one again. It needs to be someone who intercepts and recycles, Smallbone is not that person neither is Rothwell who came with poor interception stats. 

Also, too much faffing in the box today, play in behind and shoot. Pinball the ball and pursue outcomes. Get the goal, then spaces appear. 

Lastly, there needs to be more work on set pieces, corners etc. 

[S-Clarke]

2 minutes ago, James G said:

It's the absence of Downes that has changed the dynamic, pure and simple. It's about keeping the team as it was, and finding a suitable replacement. Russ has tinkered with all the other positions and we're back to square one again.

That's it in a nutshell really, whilst Downes is a huge miss, we've made it worse because we've tried to tweak everyone else to accommodate for it.

We were without Downes for a few games over Christmas if I remember right, we just stuck Charles in there and carried on the same way. Why has his latest absence triggered the coaches to redesigning the entire system? Today was a mess, no matter what Martin says about it. There was no structure and no continuity because our team has been tweaked and pissed around with to accommodate the loss of 1 player.

[James G]

I think, crunch some numbers, who can tackle and do a simple pass to recycle the attack. Is it Charles, Aribo, Armstrong, one of the defenders. Just anyone, put them in, then keep the team who played well before it all went pear shaped. It can't be that hard. The new players need time to learn Russball, neither of them should be starting. 

[6ft8saint]

1 hour ago, S-Clarke said:

Not sure where the re-writing of history is coming from re: Charly. I was frustrated to see him go as I liked him, but you cannot sit there and honestly say he contributed to us this season. He was bit-part at best, certainly not one of our key players. Whether he should have been is up for debate, but he wasn't important for us because he wasn't playing.

He may not have been playing constantly but he was a talisman for the club a target for hope some magic. He epitomised everything southampton do buying lesser known talent and molding them into win machines. It sucks that someone decided us benefiting other than financially was the right thing to do. I know my 7yr old with his alcaraz hair cut is still gutted about this

[6ft8saint]

1 hour ago, Appy said:

What sort of weirdo compares Smallbone to Sulemana?

A proper supporter who voices an opinion and doesn't make things personal or attacks other fans

[davefizzy14]

Really disappointing today. Second half there was little urgency and we created very little asides from the Rothwell shot and Arma's header. Really need Downes back as he's pivotal in our team. I agree with some of the posts above, that ref today was a disgrace, weak as anything. Allowed them to be overly physical with challenges on Fraser and Edozie, which went unpunished. Really hope Fraser is ok after he had to come off in 1st half. And he allowed them to constantly waste time. 

Edited February 24 by davefizzy14