Saintsarmy Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) 3 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Sound like delap would be a lot cheaper? If so I'd probably get him which leaves us more for other areas. What other areas are you saving money for? I’d argue striker is our most important position to target outside of getting Downes in Edited June 30 by Saintsarmy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusic Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 2 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: All clubs have this cycle though. We had a golden period of our own when we were selling for profit, reinvesting, and then selling that for a profit etc. What Brighton are doing well at the moment will hit the stoppers at some point, it's absolutley inevitable. The fat lady started signing as soon as they lauded around the media about their profits last season. They're still light years ahead of us, but they'll be coming down a peg or two rather quickly in the next few years once their recruitment success starts drying up. (it's already started to) Of course it might, but its still obvious what they are doing better and doesnt show too much sign of stopping. For example right now in Rushworth they have a GK who they could probably sell for £20m who has barely played a single game for them, if at all. He is probably better than all our GKs. They also know they can probably get way over £50m for Mitoma, Ferguson, Joao Perdo, Verbruggen, etc and haven't spend much of the cash rhey got for Caicedo as yet. And all clubs certainly don't have this cycle. A lot never really have and it doesnt happen by accident - its having strong and experienced leadership (like Paul Barber), an excellent recruitment team and a long term view rather than for example wasting £20m on a targetman for a manager you sack about 3 weeks later. Good signs we have learned and are adapting - recruitment (in and out) really is the no1 key for a club of our size. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Billy Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said: I'm concerned that we are constantly being linked with 30 years plus players and would prefer bringing in younguns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Just now, Saintsarmy said: What others are you saving money for? I’d argue striker is our most important position to target outside of getting downed in I'd like two strikers ideally. Bin off Mara and Adams to accommodate them. Spend a load on an attacking midfielder like oriley, get a half decent winger and someone who can do a job across the back as well as the kwp replacement. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouSaint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Sound like delap would be a lot cheaper? If so I'd probably get him which leaves us more for other areas. Delap is a bang average Championship standard player. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Göztepe Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 12 minutes ago, Badger said: Interesting possibility. Although it’ll give him good experience in a better league, will it help Saints secure a work permit the following year ? Turkish league in band 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Just now, SouSaint said: Delap is a bang average Championship standard player. Which as someone already pointed out was the exact thing said about Harry Kane. We will be taking gambles on some of our signings it's an inevitability. The bloke is 21 which is basically a baby in football and has decent potential. One half decent season in the prem and his value would probably treble. Much better chance of a return on investment than someone like broja who is both a risk and way overpriced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 7 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Which as someone already pointed out was the exact thing said about Harry Kane. We will be taking gambles on some of our signings it's an inevitability. The bloke is 21 which is basically a baby in football and has decent potential. One half decent season in the prem and his value would probably treble. Much better chance of a return on investment than someone like broja who is both a risk and way overpriced. You can’t just use that as an argument for any substandard player though. Liam Delap IS a bang average Championship player, nothing a complete stranger did 10-12 years ago has any bearing on that. I’m not normally a negative poster but Christ, if we did start this transfer window by signing Lallana, McCarthy and Delap, I’d be off to watch the women’s squash league instead. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Lighthouse said: You can’t just use that as an argument for any substandard player though. Liam Delap IS a bang average Championship player, nothing a complete stranger did 10-12 years ago has any bearing on that. I’m not normally a negative poster but Christ, if we did start this transfer window by signing Lallana, McCarthy and Delap, I’d be off to watch the women’s squash league instead. My point was not that anyone average could turn into Harry Kane but that young players with potential often have a higher ceiling and a greater potential for improvement than others. We've been linked with a lot of decent players, the fact we might sign some solid but unspectacular signings at the start of the window doesn't mean we won't end up with some quality. Edited June 30 by hypochondriac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee On Solent Saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 54 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: The only way that happens is if Morgan Gibbs White moves in the other direction (Newcastle have been linked with him tbf). It'll be cost neutral at that point. Forest cannot spend a penny without sales. Guess the point I was trying to make was how over inflated transfer fees have become. Not sure if its because of FFP/PSR but when you are paying 35m for a bang average midfielder who can't even get a game for his club, something has gone very wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee On Solent Saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 minute ago, hypochondriac said: By point was not that anyone average could turn into Harry Kane but that young players with potentially often have a higher ceiling and a greater potential for improvement than others. We've been linked with a lot of decent players, the fact we might sign some solid but unspectacular signings at the start of the window doesn't mean we won't end up with some quality. I'd be massively underwhelmed by Delap. We have to find better than just these City players. If he is the best our recruitment team can come up with, we might as well just give up now. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 minute ago, Lee On Solent Saint said: I'd be massively underwhelmed by Delap. We have to find better than just these City players. If he is the best our recruitment team can come up with, we might as well just give up now. If he was the replacement for Mara I'd be absolutely fine with that. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Just now, hypochondriac said: If he was the replacement for Mara I'd be absolutely fine with that. What would be the point in that? All you’d be doing is replacing one player who’s not good enough with another. Adam Armstrong is consistently one of the Championship’s best forwards, he’ll probably struggle to get five goals next season. Liam Delap has 12 goals in two seasons at Championship level. He can have another season down there with someone else as far as I’m concerned. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Convict Colony Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Ok finally checked out O'Reilly and was impressed he was a taller midfielder than I thought, I like his desire to get into the box and seems to have good technique. I assume he is a smallbone upgrade at 8 unless we are gonna change system and make him a 10 behind the main striker. Like the delap shout as well, cheap, has scored goals, was rated and ROI could be massive especially since he's English. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 hours ago, Suhari said: Looks a player with noodles of class. He’s got a lot of Seoul 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danbert Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 37 minutes ago, SouSaint said: Delap is a bang average Championship standard player. In the top two percentiles for progressive carries and successful take-ons. He clearly has something about him. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 minutes ago, Danbert said: In the top two percentiles for progressive carries and successful take-ons. He clearly has something about him. What the f does that mean? Is that even English? 🤣🤣 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 21 minutes ago, Lighthouse said: What would be the point in that? All you’d be doing is replacing one player who’s not good enough with another. Adam Armstrong is consistently one of the Championship’s best forwards, he’ll probably struggle to get five goals next season. Liam Delap has 12 goals in two seasons at Championship level. He can have another season down there with someone else as far as I’m concerned. So young players with high potential have never had average seasons that show some measure of promise in a lower league before improving and being an asset in a higher league? If delap had torn it up last year, it's very likely we wouldn't have been able to afford him hence why it's prudent to take a gamble on someone who might come good. I'm not saying sign delap and no one else but surely you can see the logic in that approach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 19 minutes ago, Danbert said: In the top two percentiles for progressive carries and successful take-ons. He clearly has something about him. 14 minutes ago, Chewy said: What the f does that mean? Is that even English? 🤣🤣 But what’s his Xg rating, and is he in the upper quartile, or better ? Let’s get serious about this ffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 I’m indifferent to signing Delap, on the game I saw at Hull he didn’t display much to write home about (although did score for them). But that’s only one game and reading about him over last couple of seasons he does seem to have something about him, so hopefully our scouting have the full measure of him. Should do, as we’ve been linked for about three seasons now. Worrying though, that reports last summer is that our dickhead recruitment under the Guru Wilcox were reported to be prepared to pay c£20m. Now suggested as available for £10m. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 hour ago, Saint Billy said: I'm concerned that we are constantly being linked with 30 years plus players and would prefer bringing in younguns. Isn’t that the Semmens policy that helped us being relegated, when they don’t immediately live up to our hopes of them ? Has to be a mixture of the two as far as I’m concerned. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 39 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said: Guess the point I was trying to make was how over inflated transfer fees have become. Not sure if its because of FFP/PSR but when you are paying 35m for a bang average midfielder who can't even get a game for his club, something has gone very wrong. I see what you mean, but yeah that's where we are at now. The 10-15m Mane's, Tadic's, VVD's we found in 2014/15 now start at around £30m. By all accounts the resale value on them will be much higher, but that's where the market has gone. If we're not able or prepared to enter that £30m market then we'll never be able to compete. I guess we are still a bit fearful given our clusterfuck Sulemana £22m signing, but that just boils down to utter shit scouting. We need to play in that £30m market once we're properly back and established (i.e. survive this year), otherwise it's pointless even being here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) Still wonder if Miovski will feature, given the Mowbray link. On watching some clips of him, he looks useful scoring with both feet, and some headers. The other name that has gone ‘cold’ is Brerton- Diaz, might be useful especially if a loan with an option to buy. Edited June 30 by Badger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 13 minutes ago, Badger said: I’m indifferent to signing Delap, on the game I saw at Hull he didn’t display much to write home about (although did score for them). But that’s only one game and reading about him over last couple of seasons he does seem to have something about him, so hopefully our scouting have the full measure of him. Should do, as we’ve been linked for about three seasons now. Worrying though, that reports last summer is that our dickhead recruitment under the Guru Wilcox were reported to be prepared to pay c£20m. Now suggested as available for £10m. I was speaking to a Hull fan a couple of weeks ago - Seemed to think Delap was the bees knees. I wasn't impressed with that performance against us either or his stats from last season but this guy seemed to think he'd be an excellent signing for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suewhistle Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 25 minutes ago, Badger said: I’m indifferent to signing Delap, on the game I saw at Hull he didn’t display much to write home about (although did score for them). Surely it's a virtue when a player scores when playing indifferently? Story of Ted McDougall's career! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 minute ago, suewhistle said: Surely it's a virtue when a player scores when playing indifferently? Story of Ted McDougall's career! Good point, but he was a bit more prolific than Liam Delap was last season or so far in his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 39 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: So young players with high potential have never had average seasons that show some measure of promise in a lower league before improving and being an asset in a higher league? If delap had torn it up last year, it's very likely we wouldn't have been able to afford him hence why it's prudent to take a gamble on someone who might come good. I'm not saying sign delap and no one else but surely you can see the logic in that approach? The Premier League is a huge step up. Even players who’ve hit 20 in the Championship like Earnshaw, Vydra, Rasiak and Armstrong have come up and struggled to get three goals. I don’t want young players with average Championship seasons, the minimum I’d be asking for is someone like Jay Rod, who scored in the twenties for Burnley and still only got about five goals in his first PL season. As of right now, Delap is a midtable, average Championship striker. If he has a decent season and proves himself too good for that league, then I’d start being interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 16 minutes ago, Lighthouse said: The Premier League is a huge step up. Even players who’ve hit 20 in the Championship like Earnshaw, Vydra, Rasiak and Armstrong have come up and struggled to get three goals. I don’t want young players with average Championship seasons, the minimum I’d be asking for is someone like Jay Rod, who scored in the twenties for Burnley and still only got about five goals in his first PL season. As of right now, Delap is a midtable, average Championship striker. If he has a decent season and proves himself too good for that league, then I’d start being interested. But at that point, you just have to ask what is attainable for us? We're not in a position to buy proven PL strikers, we probably never will be (that's why I wouldn't turn my nose up at Ings). Our best bet is taking a gamble on a young player from abroad, taking a gamble on a young player from this country, or taking a gamble on experience who is someone on their way down rather than up. All transfers are a gamble, but when you have $$$ you can have a safer gamble on someone like Haaland, Isak, Solanke etc - we don't have that, so we have to be much cuter. I wouldn't turn my nose up to either Ings or Delap as options on both ends of that spectrum. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stknowle Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 3 hours ago, HKsaint said: So we take Broja or Delap? Who is better and less risky? Tough call HK my old pal. The worry with Broja is his injury and the fact he failed to a/establish himself at Chelsea after he started playing again despite being basically their only fit striker and b/then hardly got a kick at Fulham. The worry with Delap is he’s never really succeeded anywhere though a couple of Hull fans I know tell me he was starting to come good there last season before he got injured. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 2 hours ago, Lighthouse said: You can’t just use that as an argument for any substandard player though. Liam Delap IS a bang average Championship player, nothing a complete stranger did 10-12 years ago has any bearing on that. I’m not normally a negative poster but Christ, if we did start this transfer window by signing Lallana, McCarthy and Delap, I’d be off to watch the women’s squash league instead. Pervert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) 1 hour ago, Danbert said: In the top two percentiles for progressive carries and successful take-ons. He clearly has something about him. 6 goals in 2 seasons is the only stat I’m interested in. Edited June 30 by Wade Garrett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waylander Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Broja has offers from 3 European leagues according to SSN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verlaine1979 Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 42 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: But at that point, you just have to ask what is attainable for us? We're not in a position to buy proven PL strikers, we probably never will be (that's why I wouldn't turn my nose up at Ings). Our best bet is taking a gamble on a young player from abroad, taking a gamble on a young player from this country, or taking a gamble on experience who is someone on their way down rather than up. All transfers are a gamble, but when you have $$$ you can have a safer gamble on someone like Haaland, Isak, Solanke etc - we don't have that, so we have to be much cuter. I wouldn't turn my nose up to either Ings or Delap as options on both ends of that spectrum. Solanke is a good example of someone who looked like a failed experiment at PL level until he didn't. Averaged 3 per season from his first three attempts at the PL, interspersed with decent promotion winning performances in the champ. Now, with 19 in the PL last season he's probably a 60-70m striker for anyone that wants him. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintant Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 hours ago, Greedyfly said: Could you please elaborate? Because my thoughts are that we don't have a decent CB pairing. I have never felt Bednarek was prem quality, and I don't think Stephens is Championship quality let alone a worthy backup. Midfield creativity is also an issue for me. Where do you think it's coming from? Genuine questions, not argument baiting. Bednarek may not be one of the top centre backs in the Prem but I think he is good enough to more than hold his own and, of course has plenty of experience. He also played well for Poland in the Euros. Ok, we may need to bring in one more but Bednarek and THB are a good enough pairing in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Kent Saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Broja wouldn't be a good signing not enough results from his runs coming back from injury and Euros display confirming that . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obstacle1 Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 19 minutes ago, saintant said: Bednarek may not be one of the top centre backs in the Prem but I think he is good enough to more than hold his own and, of course has plenty of experience. He also played well for Poland in the Euros. Ok, we may need to bring in one more but Bednarek and THB are a good enough pairing in my book. He looked at sea a lot in his last premier league outing, though who knows if that's also to do with coaching and style of play. Ideally I'd rather he was our third choice centre back though and we had an upgrade to partner THB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 hour ago, S-Clarke said: But at that point, you just have to ask what is attainable for us? We're not in a position to buy proven PL strikers, we probably never will be (that's why I wouldn't turn my nose up at Ings). Our best bet is taking a gamble on a young player from abroad, taking a gamble on a young player from this country, or taking a gamble on experience who is someone on their way down rather than up. All transfers are a gamble, but when you have $$$ you can have a safer gamble on someone like Haaland, Isak, Solanke etc - we don't have that, so we have to be much cuter. I wouldn't turn my nose up to either Ings or Delap as options on both ends of that spectrum. The best players in the Championship and hopefully we’ve done our homework on some shrewd talent from overseas. Ings and Delap…. Jeez. 3 PL goals in 18 months and 8 goals in the Championship, I’m astonished at just how low some people’s expectations have fallen. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 2 minutes ago, Lighthouse said: The best players in the Championship and hopefully we’ve done our homework on some shrewd talent from overseas. Ings and Delap…. Jeez. 3 PL goals in 18 months and 8 goals in the Championship, I’m astonished at just how low some people’s expectations have fallen. So someone like Szmodics? I wouldn't include Crysensio Summerville as he's already beyond us price wise for this window. Szmodics could be attainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revolution saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 11 minutes ago, Lighthouse said: The best players in the Championship and hopefully we’ve done our homework on some shrewd talent from overseas. Ings and Delap…. Jeez. 3 PL goals in 18 months and 8 goals in the Championship, I’m astonished at just how low some people’s expectations have fallen. And who are the best players in the championship and shrewd talent from overseas? I mean we can all play that game. I think we should only sign players who will be right good in the premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 1 hour ago, waylander said: Broja has offers from 3 European leagues according to SSN Turkey, Holland and Portugal...He's just not good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 5 hours ago, Nolan said: Disagree completely. The Sport Republic Network of scouts serves all three teams and if you see where Valenciennes and Göztepe have been getting their players it's not such a stretch to think we'll get players who are still to peak for South Korea, similar to how he had 5 Jamaica players for Swansea. They may have been players qualified for Jamaica, but were born in England (as far as I can tell). Fact is Martin clearly prefers players from 'Britain', in the broadest sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarehamSaintJames Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Leicester buying a Chelsea teenager who’s played no more than five matches for £30M. Sorry but this is absolute madness. FFP is fucked. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 32 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: So someone like Szmodics? I wouldn't include Crysensio Summerville as he's already beyond us price wise for this window. Szmodics could be attainable. Szmodics seems like a plausible option for a club like ours. I haven’t seen enough of him to know if he can make the step up but he has at least beaten the level below us. 24 minutes ago, revolution saint said: And who are the best players in the championship and shrewd talent from overseas? I mean we can all play that game. I think we should only sign players who will be right good in the premier league. I don’t know, I’m just some bloke on an internet forum. If the millions of pounds we spend on player research and recruitment, with an entire team of professional scouts, can’t find some better players than I can, sat watching YouTube with five cans of lager, then there’s no point in having them. What I don’t want are players proven to be nothing better than average in a much worse league. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) 7 hours ago, HKsaint said: So we take Broja or Delap? Who is better and less risky? No contest - Broja. Delap has proved that he can't do it in the championship. Broja has proved that he can do it in the PL. I can't fathom anyone saying that they'd take Delap out of the two. Delap cannot have done anything to persuade them that he's the man. Edited June 30 by egg Shit typing 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloucester Saint Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 50 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: So someone like Szmodics? I wouldn't include Crysensio Summerville as he's already beyond us price wise for this window. Szmodics could be attainable. He could for £15m, but had one prolific season or so, and 29 soon. Not like say Rickie who was prolific at other levels, and more of a risk than AA was. Can’t see him as an SR buy. This is the fella we want https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/sheffield-united-facing-ben-brereton-diaz-blow-as-ipswich-town-southampton-keen-on-transfer/ but the club needs to be more nimble to fend off Ipswich. The manager seems to be more involved with the DoF gap so if he makes BBD a priority, there’s a chance. In terms of raising the bar, within FFP limits, the club will have to break its record a couple of times. Under Semmens and Reed before that we got stuck at the £12-15m level which worked so well in 2014-15 but quickly became left behind by peers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 37 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said: Leicester buying a Chelsea teenager who’s played no more than five matches for £30M. Sorry but this is absolute madness. FFP is fucked. Not as clear cut as that, books being fluffed again - it's basically a player swap deal, but on the books it looks as if both clubs have pocketed a decent sum on pure profit for a homeegrown. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmes_and_Watson Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Matrix ripples again... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barsiem Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 2 hours ago, verlaine1979 said: Solanke is a good example of someone who looked like a failed experiment at PL level until he didn't. Averaged 3 per season from his first three attempts at the PL, interspersed with decent promotion winning performances in the champ. Now, with 19 in the PL last season he's probably a 60-70m striker for anyone that wants him. Agreed. I'm not sure Delap is the answer, but at 21 he's far too young to be writing off as a potential PL striker, and potential appears to be all we can realistically afford. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Fan CaM Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 4 minutes ago, Barsiem said: Agreed. I'm not sure Delap is the answer, but at 21 he's far too young to be writing off as a potential PL striker, and potential appears to be all we can realistically afford. I doubt we can even afford him, unless it’s a loan to buy deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW5 SAINT Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 5 hours ago, Lighthouse said: You can’t just use that as an argument for any substandard player though. Liam Delap IS a bang average Championship player, nothing a complete stranger did 10-12 years ago has any bearing on that. I’m not normally a negative poster but Christ, if we did start this transfer window by signing Lallana, McCarthy and Delap, I’d be off to watch the women’s squash league instead. Don’t forget THB…..! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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