Alderman and sheriffs to save Southampton's identity

[Stripey McStripe Shirt]

If Portsmouth can change the Spinnaker Tower from red to blue, surely this isn't too much to ask. This is an issue that has caused huge embarrassment to the club and city for far too long. We are a laughing stock!

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/oct/02/ancient-tribunal-to-consider-why-lights-on-southampton-bridge-are-blue

[LGTL]

Fuck me it's just been on the main news at 6 😂

[Badger]

A council spokesperson said blue lights were installed on the bridge as red had been considered potentially problematic for mariners and pilots. Photograph: Katharina Brandt/Alam

 

Isn't the red light on the building on the left also problematic for pilots ?

 

[Ted Bates Statue]

The campaigner was on Colin Murray's Five Live show last night. Got the impression that it's going to be a slam dunk to change it to red and white, but I liked that he would potentially settle for 1976 Cup Final colours of blue and yellow. So I reckon it's going to be a win-win either way.

It's quite interesting to hear about the Court Leet thing, but did this issue actually bother more than one person? And has anyone else suffered mockery from Portsmouth supporters about this? If for whatever reason it can't get changed, I'm sure we'll get over this sort of thing, just like we got over the annual celebrations of David Norris Day.

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:40, Badger said:

Isn't the red light on the building on the left also problematic for pilots ?

 

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Can any of our aviation experts on here shed any light (red and white only, please) on this?

 

 

[SotonianWill]

Go blue, go broke. 

Edited 3 October, 2023 by SotonianWill
ignore the fact it's been blue since 2011

[derry]

I've got over 18000 hours as a pilot including thirteen years flying into southampton and it wouldn't be a problem for pilots. 

[Lighthouse]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:40, Badger said:

A council spokesperson said blue lights were installed on the bridge as red had been considered potentially problematic for mariners and pilots. Photograph: Katharina Brandt/Alam

 

Isn't the red light on the building on the left also problematic for pilots ?

 

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That’s actually the reason it’s there, so planes don’t smack into it. I think the rule is a red light every 150ft for buildings above a certain height but I can’t be sure on that.

[Bad Wolf]

Them down the road have a complex about us. They're more bothered about us than their own team. If we'd played a regular league game and won on the day they won the FA Cup, I honestly think it would have put a downer on it for them.

[Stripey McStripe Shirt]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:57, Bad Wolf said:

Them down the road have a complex about us. They're more bothered about us than their own team. If we'd played a regular league game and won on the day they won the FA Cup, I honestly think it would have put a downer on it for them.

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Erm, bit awkward but isn't this more about us having a complex about them?

[Lighthouse]

  On 03/10/2023 at 18:13, Stripey McStripe Shirt said:

Erm, bit awkward but isn't this more about us having a complex about them?

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Is it? I've never heard a single Saints fan mention the lightbulbs on the Itchen Bridge before. I guess we can add it to our problem list, along with disabled parking badges and the Nationwide on Above Bar St.

[so22saint]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:53, derry said:

I've got over 18000 hours as a pilot including thirteen years flying into southampton and it wouldn't be a problem for pilots. 

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What about if the underwater volcano under Southampton went up derry 😉

[Master Bates]

Purple would look nice in the summer, nice magical twinkly ones at Christmas, Yellow for Spring OH GOD I WANT TO SKIP ABOUT AND DANCE LIKE A FAIRY! OH THE POSSIBILITIES! And Red and White for match days. OOOOHHH, and there it is, I....

Edited 3 October, 2023 by Master Bates

[The Cat]

  On 03/10/2023 at 18:20, Lighthouse said:

Is it? I've never heard a single Saints fan mention the lightbulbs on the Itchen Bridge before. I guess we can add it to our problem list, along with disabled parking badges and the Nationwide on Above Bar St.

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Me neither. I also work in Portsmouth, guess what? Never been mentioned.

It's just Perry trying to get himself in the news again.

[Daft Kerplunk]

  On 03/10/2023 at 18:20, Lighthouse said:

Is it? I've never heard a single Saints fan mention the lightbulbs on the Itchen Bridge before. I guess we can add it to our problem list, along with disabled parking badges and the Nationwide on Above Bar St.

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Plenty of Saints fans mention it but none I’ve spoken to are particularly bothered. We have bigger fish to fry.

[Master Bates]

  On 03/10/2023 at 18:35, Daft Kerplunk said:

Plenty of Saints fans mention it but none I’ve spoken to are particularly bothered. We have bigger fish to fry.

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Pompey fans can't cope with the bigger fish, just Skates.

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

I'd feel more irked if the lights were pink, the skates traditional colours. We had blue first (should be the colour of our shorts imo...claim it back!) but while I have heard plenty of comments over the colour I can't say I'm aware of too many getting irate.

Didn't they turn blue when the Tories got hold of Southampton city council one year, probably to mock the traditional Labour stronghold...anyway, there's 27-storey highrise blocks with big red lights on top either side of the Itchen Bridge, so any wayward aircraft would probably take them out before the bridge!

[Roo1976]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:40, Badger said:

A council spokesperson said blue lights were installed on the bridge as red had been considered potentially problematic for mariners and pilots. Photograph: Katharina Brandt/Alam

 

Isn't the red light on the building on the left also problematic for pilots ?

 

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No thats for high tide..................................................

[Ted Bates Statue]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:25, Stripey McStripe Shirt said:

This is an issue that has caused huge embarrassment to the club and city for far too long. We are a laughing stock!

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  On 03/10/2023 at 18:13, Stripey McStripe Shirt said:

Erm, bit awkward but isn't this more about us having a complex about them?

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I'm getting vibes of "There are literally dozens of us"

How did you get on today Perry? Don't leave us all in suspense 😂

[Fabrice Fernandes no.1 fan]

Also now a bid to rename it after Lawrie Mac

[derry]

Just a bit of information. Southampton Airport doesn't have much in the way of light aircraft traffic so virtually 100% of pilots operating are professionals. Secondly it is one of the most rigidly controlled airports in the country. It's approach control is still I believe carried out by NATS. Nearly all aircraft landing from the South route overhead at 6 to 8 thousand feet and descend turning in just north of the South coast under strict radar control descending to about 1500 to 2000ft over Hythe descending either on an instrument approach or visual on a three and a half degree glideslope on indicator lights beside the touchdown point on the runway. The only real obstacle is the hill and trees at Bitterne Park/Townhill Park.

Either way the pilots don't even look at the bridge as they are focused on the instruments or runway lights therefore the colour of the lights are irrelevant.

[Lighthouse]

  On 04/10/2023 at 08:43, Fabrice Fernandes no.1 fan said:

Also now a bid to rename it after Lawrie Mac

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Really? Come on guys, 'Wayne' FFS! It practically writes itself.

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

  On 04/10/2023 at 09:23, Lighthouse said:

Really? Come on guys, 'Wayne' FFS! It practically writes itself.

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…or ‘Rupert Lowe’, there’s even a song about it!

Anyway, back to changing colours 

“A landmark is to be painted blue and gold following an outcry over the use of red in the previous plan.

The city council announced a £3.5m deal with airline Emirates to rebrand the Spinnaker Tower earlier this month.

The decision upset 10,000 people who signed a petition against a branding plan as red and white are the colours of football rivals Southampton.

Liberal Democrat opposition said the saga had made the city the "laughing stock of the country"

[John Boy Saint]

When I saw the summary of the stories to be told in the 6 o’clock news - blimey this has escalated.

I thought it was well reported and far from making us a laughing stock - The Court Leet stuff actually gave the story some weight, then the vox pop round the city centre gave Sophie Raworth her Trevor McDonald “and finally” moment.

Don’t think anyone is laughing at us - honk it’s raised more of a smile than outright humility.

A Southampton light question for @derry seeing as he is an aviator - do you know if there is any truth in something I heard years ago, that the underwater landing lights for the seaplanes are still under the surface of the Solent - obviously they will be in a sorry state now.

Edited 4 October, 2023 by John Boy Saint

[SaintsLoyal]

I dont think changing the name of the bridge is a very good idea and think a road near St Marys stadium would be better.

 

 

[Saint Fan CaM]

  On 04/10/2023 at 11:41, SaintsLoyal said:

I dont think changing the name of the bridge is a very good idea and think a road near St Marys stadium would be better.

 

 

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Yeah agree. Like the sound of McMenemy Way. With the stadium having the address 19-76 McMenemy Way. 😘

Edited 4 October, 2023 by Saint Fan CaM

[Patches O Houlihan]

  On 03/10/2023 at 17:46, Ted Bates Statue said:

The campaigner was on Colin Murray's Five Live show last night. Got the impression that it's going to be a slam dunk to change it to red and white, but I liked that he would potentially settle for 1976 Cup Final colours of blue and yellow. So I reckon it's going to be a win-win either way.

It's quite interesting to hear about the Court Leet thing, but did this issue actually bother more than one person? And has anyone else suffered mockery from Portsmouth supporters about this? If for whatever reason it can't get changed, I'm sure we'll get over this sort of thing, just like we got over the annual celebrations of David Norris Day.

Can any of our aviation experts on here shed any light (red and white only, please) on this?

 

 

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With my professional seafarer hat on:

All structures over 30m tall are required to have a red light; whether that's radio aerials, buildings, yacht masts, whatever.

The lighting on the Itchen bridge wouldn't really affect pilots, but it crosses a commercial waterway that is in use at all times of day. When you are entering port as a mariner you keep the red navigation lights on your left (to port) and the green light on your right (to starboard). The yanks do it the other way around because they are awkward buggers. 

It is not uncommon in an urban marine context to have navigation lights on shore based structures, so there might be an argument that red lights on the bridge could cause confusion. British Waterways or the Marine Coastguard Agency would be the bodies that would have to decide that. 

It might be a case of red bulbs are ok as long as they are partially shaded, or maybe the wattage of the bulbs isn't too strong. Alternate blue and yellow might be easier & cheaper to organise.

 

[swannymere]

The lights were red but the conservative city council at the time changed them for blue bulbs.

[SaintsLoyal]

Just this on twitter

[SaintsLoyal]

  On 04/10/2023 at 13:16, swannymere said:

The lights were red but the conservative city council at the time changed them for blue bulbs.

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According to the original article ten or so years back, the airport didnt want red lights. 

[Ivan Katalinic's 'tache]

Red lights on the bridge could generate a whole different income stream for some? I can see the sign now: Southampton twinned with Amsterdam

Edited 4 October, 2023 by Ivan Katalinic's 'tache

[Wade Garrett]

Absolute load of bollocks that’s got some wannabe his 5 minutes of fame.

[eurosaint]

Why can't they just be white like most other streetlamps in the country ??

[Charlie Wayman]

  On 04/10/2023 at 11:53, Saint Fan CaM said:

Yeah agree. Like the sound of McMenemy Way. With the stadium having the address 19-76 McMenemy Way. 😘

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Are you serious? Why draw attention to how long ago it was that we last won a senior trophy.

Besides which 90% of the City's under 30's will never have heard of him.

[Charlie Wayman]

  On 05/10/2023 at 07:49, eurosaint said:

Why can't they just be white like most other streetlamps in the country ??

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Most will soon be rainbow stripes.

[Zorba]

  On 04/10/2023 at 11:53, Saint Fan CaM said:

Yeah agree. Like the sound of McMenemy Way. With the stadium having the address 19-76 McMenemy Way. 😘

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As long as it’s not renamed “The Southampton Way”. No-one would know which way to go. There’d be mass congestion at the start of the road and if you did get halfway along, you’d have to turn around and start again! 🚗🚗🚗

 

[derry]

  On 04/10/2023 at 10:50, John Boy Saint said:

When I saw the summary of the stories to be told in the 6 o’clock news - blimey this has escalated.

I thought it was well reported and far from making us a laughing stock - The Court Leet stuff actually gave the story some weight, then the vox pop round the city centre gave Sophie Raworth her Trevor McDonald “and finally” moment.

Don’t think anyone is laughing at us - honk it’s raised more of a smile than outright humility.

A Southampton light question for @derry seeing as he is an aviator - do you know if there is any truth in something I heard years ago, that the underwater landing lights for the seaplanes are still under the surface of the Solent - obviously they will be in a sorry state now.

Expand  

It is very dangerous due to difficulty in judging height over water. I've never heard of underwater lights or night flying boat operations. I've flown with ex RAF and Aquila Airways Captains and it was never mentioned. I was under the impression the takeoffs and landings were done in daylight. There was even a recommendation I saw somewhere that in an emergency it was better to try a landing on an airfield.

[suewhistle]

  On 04/10/2023 at 09:09, derry said:

The only real obstacle is the hill and trees at Bitterne Park/Townhill Park.

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What about South Stoneham House? From my time at uni I recall being told that at 16 storeys it was actually 4 storeys over what it should be based on its position near the approach.

 

  On 04/10/2023 at 13:10, Patches O Houlihan said:

It is not uncommon in an urban marine context to have navigation lights on shore based structures, so there might be an argument that red lights on the bridge could cause confusion.

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With my yachty cap on I can say that the Double Diamond advert ashore at Torquay was quite confusing when we drifted in there once after the engine had seized and there was no wind.. This was in the days before GPS and chart plotters..

[derry]

  On 05/10/2023 at 15:34, suewhistle said:

What about South Stoneham House? From my time at uni I recall being told that at 16 storeys it was actually 4 storeys over what it should be based on its position near the approach.

 

With my yachty cap on I can say that the Double Diamond advert ashore at Torquay was quite confusing when we drifted in there once after the engine had seized and there was no wind.. This was in the days before GPS and chart plotters..

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It's well off the centre line or instrument approach to R/W 02. I've made hundreds of approaches and its mostly up the Itchen to Bitterne Manor then over the hill at Townhill and virtually over the White Swan at Mansbridge. I came back from Amsterdam one winter night in the late seventies, it had fogged in but the visibility was enough to do a radar approach. I saw the lights and landed. All the ground crew were in the White Swan when I went overhead. They hadn't expected me to get in and had to race back to the airfield.

[John Boy Saint]

  On 05/10/2023 at 13:59, derry said:

It is very dangerous due to difficulty in judging height over water. I've never heard of underwater lights or night flying boat operations. I've flown with ex RAF and Aquila Airways Captains and it was never mentioned. I was under the impression the takeoffs and landings were done in daylight. There was even a recommendation I saw somewhere that in an emergency it was better to try a landing on an airfield.

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I would imagine that when flying boat operations were operating from Town Quay, (you can still see the brick supports for the boarding jetty if you look just across from where the Red Jet departs), to keep the planes and boats apart in the Solent, a set of submerged lights to mark out the runway was far safer than floating buoys that could be hit.

[LuckyNumber7]

  On 05/10/2023 at 15:34, suewhistle said:

What about South Stoneham House? From my time at uni I recall being told that at 16 storeys it was actually 4 storeys over what it should be based on its position near the approach.

 

 

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South Stoneham House was demolished a year or two ago anyway.

[derry]

  On 06/10/2023 at 09:46, John Boy Saint said:

I would imagine that when flying boat operations were operating from Town Quay, (you can still see the brick supports for the boarding jetty if you look just across from where the Red Jet departs), to keep the planes and boats apart in the Solent, a set of submerged lights to mark out the runway was far safer than floating buoys that could be hit.

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During wartime Coastal Command put out flares but I think that might have been take offs. 

[Noodles34]

  On 03/10/2023 at 18:33, The Cat said:

Me neither. I also work in Portsmouth, guess what? Never been mentioned.

It's just Perry trying to get himself in the news again.

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Left wing Perry trying to get in the news again? Surely not!