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Saints 1-4 Leicester - Match Thread


AlexLaw76
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Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

Edited by AlexLaw76
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1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

Replace Arma by Sule and i agree

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7 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

On paper this is our strongest (fit) side and a no brainer. If Sulemana IS here and is Ok to play then yes you could include him instead of AA or Charly but AA is undropable right now and I'd really like to see Charly get up to speed. Also while this is my team too it is a tad harsh on Edozie who I think has done little wrong so far.

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25 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

That 100% should be the team. 

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30 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

I'd be ok with that, but Alcaraz has been really disappointing this season so I'd have AA behind Adams, and Sully (if he's here and committed) wide right instead. 

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17 minutes ago, egg said:

I'd be ok with that, but Alcaraz has been really disappointing this season so I'd have AA behind Adams, and Sully (if he's here and committed) wide right instead. 

Agree with Alcatraz. What’s happening with him, he looked so aggressive and dangerous last season, and apart from a few long shots which drifted wide he hasn’t really done anything of note yet

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We play on the Friday night, some of the international players won't return until the Wednesday, not ideal preparation at all. Hopefully most back before then 

Is there a summary of which call ups we've had and where / when the games are? 

Would also be interesting to see which Leicester players are away on duty 

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The line up shown above is close to being optimal, but (a) I would give Lumley a try…”this is your chance lad” as Baz is shot and (b) it is essential that Martin re-thinks his tactics and messaging to the team in terms of pressing out of possession and not allowing both FB’s to be in advanced positions at the same time to counter turn-around breaks.

Whatever, still think we’ll lose the game by two goals.

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1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

Can't disagree with much of that. I'd maybe give Lumley a try in goal because, what is there to lose and perhaps switch KWP to left back and see how Bree does at right back.  I get that Bree is not popular with most but he had a good season at Luton in this division. Again it's just to try something different because Manning looks a defensive liability to me which we were warned about.

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1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

I'd say that is pretty much spot on. KS won't be ready by then but if he's fit enough, stick him on the bench to run riot in the last 20 minutes. Vestergaard is currently playing CB for Leicester; Sulemana would have a field day!

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30 minutes ago, InvictaSaint said:

I'd say that is pretty much spot on. KS won't be ready by then but if he's fit enough, stick him on the bench to run riot in the last 20 minutes. Vestergaard is currently playing CB for Leicester; Sulemana would have a field day!

Good point on JV, RM needs to be looking at ways of ensuring AA is left one on one with JV as often as possible. That could happen if Che is up for it and occupies the other CB

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Martin's not likely to change much tactically, so...

Bazunu

KWP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Downes, Charles, AA

Fraser, Adams, Edozie

Downes and AA to get through a lot helping to cover the fullbacks, and give support. AA and Manning to support Edozie, to give the kid more options than just tricky runs. Stu did this well earlier in the season. Need AA to cover Edozie defensively too.

No starting Alcaraz or Stu or Smallbone to give us a bit more defensive cover centrally to start with. Ideally Alcaraz on later to cause some havoc.

KWP and Manning pushing inside should still give us posession and attacking options, especially KWP.

Adams is the best focal point available, and has started well enough (ignoring deadline aftermath blip).

Let the Martin mantra roar: PASS! PASS! PASS! 🙂

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3 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

Exactly the team I would play. Charles was the biggest miss yesterday, we need him covering the centre allowing the wing backs and Alcaraz to get forward.

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Bazunu; KWP; Bednarek, THB, Manning; Charles, Downes, A.Armstrong; Fraser, Sulemena, Adams.

Subs: McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, S.Armstrong, Alcaraz, SAA, Edozie, Mara

If Sulemena isn't ready for whatever reason then switch Armstrong out wide and bring in Alcaraz.

Edited by Harry_SFC
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22 hours ago, SNSUN said:

On paper this is our strongest (fit) side and a no brainer. If Sulemana IS here and is Ok to play then yes you could include him instead of AA or Charly but AA is undropable right now and I'd really like to see Charly get up to speed. Also while this is my team too it is a tad harsh on Edozie who I think has done little wrong so far.

Edozie is too poor/lazy defensively.

Needs to work harder on that part of his game.

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There is no way that there is time for silly little training exercises hopping over broken chairs….

The whole time there is between players arriving back from internationals and the game on the Friday needs to be spent on defensive midfield and fullback defensive drills and duties - No excuses for not completely being focused on the current defensive shambles.

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Agree with your line up. 
 

We need to stick with a starting 11 and let them learn to play together. Sick of all the chopping and changing. 
 

In previous seasons when we have been our best, the line up basically picks itself. I think we have a clear best 9 or 10 at least. Would love to see RM pick them and stop messing about. 

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1 hour ago, Dman said:

If Larios is fit I'd start him. 

Probably the strongest side we'll play this season. I think they'll have too much for us. 

Bazunu

KWP THB Bednerak Larios

Downes Charles AA

Sulamana Adams Fraser

That'll be the team that lost 1-0 at home to Hull on Saturday, with Jannik Vestergaard at centre back. 

Edited by LaptopSaint
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Just now, LaptopSaint said:

That'll be the team that lost 1-0 at home to Hull on Saturday, with Jannik Vestergaard at centre back. 

Player for player Leicester and Leeds have the strongest sides in the division, us probably 3rd. 

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I think people are disrespecting many of the sides in the Championship and assuming us Leicester and Leeds are a cut above. We learned the hard way on Saturday that we underestimate teams at our peril. Preston have been under the radar, not mentioned by anyone and sit top of the pile. Will they stay there? - who knows but I think we should discard thoughts that we are somehow guaranteed at least a play-off spot because this is going to be a tough season.

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On 03/09/2023 at 11:34, AlexLaw76 said:

Bit of a way off but the game at Sunderland is food for thought. This is first of 2 big home games in a few days, and against one of the follow 'big heads' in the league. If we remain ridiculously open, we will ship goals against this lot (and ipswich). No more excuses about players having their minds elsewhere, it is the same for most other clubs (including Leicester).

My team...

Bazunu 

KwP, THB, Bednarek, Manning

Charles, Downes

A.Armstrong, Alcaraz, Fraser

Adams

Subs - Lumley/McCarthy, Holgate, Bree, Smallbone, Edozie, SAA, S.Armstrong, Aribo, Sully (if they are all still here, which will probably not be the case)

Yes, I would have A.Armstrong wide. He is decent there and works extremely hard forwards and back and has an eye for goal. We have to inject much more tempo into our build up and old choco-wrists has to stop letting in soft goals.

Replace Bazunu with Kaspar Schmiechel. Jut bite the bullet. Also, no Smallbone?

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1 hour ago, saintant said:

I think people are disrespecting many of the sides in the Championship and assuming us Leicester and Leeds are a cut above. We learned the hard way on Saturday that we underestimate teams at our peril. Preston have been under the radar, not mentioned by anyone and sit top of the pile. Will they stay there? - who knows but I think we should discard thoughts that we are somehow guaranteed at least a play-off spot because this is going to be a tough season.

Player for player, in terms of ability, all 3 relegated sides are a cut above. That doesn't mean all 3 will finish first, second and third though. 

You always tend to get a side who work hard and play a system really well at the top. Last season Luton / Cov, this season looks to be someone like Ipswich. 

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                                                Baz

KWP                        THB                          Bednarek               Manning

                                              Charles

                 Downes                                           Smallbone

A Armstrong                                                                       Fraser

                                            Adams

It's a bit defensive for a home game but Alcaraz hasn't done enough recently to justify a starting position.  If Sulemana had a few games under his belt then he'd be a starter but hasn't played in months so he's on the bench.  I think after the Sunderland game it's important to look defensively sound.  Think Leicester play with three at the back so Fraser and A Armstrong both have the pace to get in behind their wingbacks.  Also think Smallbone is best equipped at the moment to pick a pass out in the final third.

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44 minutes ago, Dman said:

Player for player, in terms of ability, all 3 relegated sides are a cut above. That doesn't mean all 3 will finish first, second and third though. 

You always tend to get a side who work hard and play a system really well at the top. Last season Luton / Cov, this season looks to be someone like Ipswich. 

We think player for player we are better but how much do most of us really know about any of the teams in the Championship? Sunderland outplayed us all over the pitch and their players looked the equal or, in many cases, better than ours. The danger is we have been sucked into thinking we are actually better than we are.

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Leicester having a very similar start to us by all accounts. A few wins by a one-goal margin followed by a embarrassing (okay not quite as much) result in their last one prior to the international break. 

A really interesting one to see where both teams are at -

                   Bazunu 😔
KWP - Bednarek - THB - Manning
     Downes - Charles - Alcaraz
Sulemana - Adams - A. Armstrong

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1 hour ago, saintant said:

We think player for player we are better but how much do most of us really know about any of the teams in the Championship? Sunderland outplayed us all over the pitch and their players looked the equal or, in many cases, better than ours. The danger is we have been sucked into thinking we are actually better than we are.

Which why we should be hoping that RM’s knowledge of the league can help us

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                           Scarecrow

KWP          Bednarek       THB       LTC

                             Charles

                  Alcaraz          Downes

   A Armstrong      Adams         Fraser

 

I just feel that a scarecrow would offer us a lot more presence in goal than Bazunu, and the arms could be reenforced with broomsticks, which might have more chance of keeping the ball out of our net than Gav's crisp packets.

At Left Back, my thinking is that by replacing Manning with a Large Traffic Cone, we could be confident it would not keep diving in, and would at least hold its position and be where it is supposed to be on the pitch. 

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7 minutes ago, Dusic said:

Personally would be starting Edozie. He has been our biggest attacking threat this season so far.

As Lady Trousers will testify to, there's lots of things that I threaten to do on a daily basis but never get around to doing.....

(sorry, that's the best analogy you're going to get from me!)

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28 minutes ago, trousers said:

As Lady Trousers will testify to, there's lots of things that I threaten to do on a daily basis but never get around to doing.....

(sorry, that's the best analogy you're going to get from me!)

If she expected you to do everything every day then she probably has unrealistic expectations of you.

Aside from the Sunderland game he has had his defender on toast every game. Influential in the winner at Sheff Weds, excellent versus Plymouth, scored vs QPR.

Its him and Fraser out wide for me until Sulemana is an option.

Pretty sure Fraser played wide right for Bournemouth a lot, although we seem to see him as a left sided player based on the two apps so far.

Don't think Arma is suited to wide right as he always wants to be cutting in as well.

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1 hour ago, Rivers said:

 

                           Scarecrow

KWP          Bednarek       THB       LTC

                             Charles

                  Alcaraz          Downes

   A Armstrong      Adams         Fraser

 

I just feel that a scarecrow would offer us a lot more presence in goal than Bazunu, and the arms could be reenforced with broomsticks, which might have more chance of keeping the ball out of our net than Gav's crisp packets.

At Left Back, my thinking is that by replacing Manning with a Large Traffic Cone, we could be confident it would not keep diving in, and would at least hold its position and be where it is supposed to be on the pitch. 

Tub of lard for Bednarek would be my only other suggestion. TOL.

Edited by DT
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If we could approach the game a little more professionally, settle into the game without conceding, not concede right after scoring, just before half time, just after the break and right at the end, add in a little defending and the keeper engages brain to hand, or foot or any part of the body to stop the ball going into that net thing, it would be a good idea. If we can do this we might get a draw. Building from the back springs to mind for training maybe? 🤷🏽 

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Priority 1 - clean sheet

Objective 1 - Select Charles and Downes as automatic CM selections, Alcaraz or Smallbone as the more offensively minded midfielder but still helping the other two out when we are under the pump.

Objective 2 - Russell Martin to meet with Dean Hammond to watch through and discuss some of the games from 2011/12 where the CMs were Hammond, Morgan, Cork (thank you S Clarke!) and a wide midfielder in Chaplow who also worked very hard both ways. Lallana was the only genuine free spirit but produced the assists and goals. Actually, he did help out Fox tbf but was often freed up if Nigel was chasing a game eg Burnley away. It’ll help him understand the types of characters and level of solidity needed at this level. Yet to be convinced that he understands that yet.

Objective 3 - the two wide players/forwards need clear instructions to cut in and run at Leicester’s glacial centre backs at every opportunity, Che needs to start as a focal point to feed off. 

Priority 1000 - possession stats and being nice to watch. Set up dry and if it is a pig ugly 1-0 win as per the spring, I’ll be happy and so will 30k others, Sunderland forgotten. Same again for next two games. Footballing Imodium to stop the diarrhoea.

Edited by Gloucester Saint
Cork, of course
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4 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

 

Objective 2 - Russell Martin to meet with Dean Hammond to watch through and discuss some of the games from 2011/12 where the CMs were Hammond, Morgan and a wide midfielder in Chaplow who also worked very hard both ways. Lallana was the only genuine free spirit but produced the assists and goals. Actually, he did help out Fox tbf but was often freed up if Nigel was chasing a game eg Burnley away. It’ll help him understand the types of characters and level of solidity needed at this level. Yet to be convinced that he understands that yet.

Yeah the 2011-2012 midfield was bang on it, don't forget Cork as well - he was a hard worker. Arguably the likes of Charly, Smallbone, Downes may be better 'technically' than some of the 2012 lot, but they need to work a hell of a lot harder to be as influential. I'm not sure if it's in their makeup though and it's the midfield which is giving me nightmares at the mo.

Edited by S-Clarke
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9 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Yeah the 2011-2012 midfield was bang on it, don't forget Cork as well - he was a hard worker. Arguably the likes of Charly, Smallbone, Downes may be better 'technically' than some of the 2012 lot, but they need to work a hell of a lot harder to be as influential. I'm not sure if it's in their makeup though and it's the midfield which is giving me nightmares at the mo.

I think Downes will get his foot in, just suffering a bit physically after the food incident. Two weeks now to pack in the protein to restore what was lost and get some of his stamina back. Steak for lunch at Staplewood and lots of protein shakes. Smallbone needs to go on a similar regime but for the whole season. Looks like the club feed him on millet. If he does play in the PL in the future again, Rodri or Rice will only need to fart to shrug him off. A gust of wind off the Itchen even. Alcaraz is developing the stocky build to compete a bit more but learning the positional awareness, expectation to track runners (if he wants to play for City/Man U/Arsenal/Chelsea that’s what will expected there) is a work in progress. Good attitude though and a potential diamond. 

The best build for this level is Charles, and he will mix it. Back to relying on a talented 19 year old DMC which is a huge risk over a 46 game season. The thought gives me chills but hasn’t Holgate played in DMC for Everton? Might keep him away from CB positions! 

Edited by Gloucester Saint
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