Wade Garrett Posted February 2 Posted February 2 He’s never available. Like the wanker at work that takes the piss by being on the sick all the time. Shame, because he would have done a job for us next season in the Championship.
Badger Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Is he just having a sulk because his mate Lego has got the push ? 2 1
Farmer Saint Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Downes is a good kid. Not Prem quality though, and doesn't work well in anything but a Russell system (as you can see through his career).
Mr Saints Posted February 2 Posted February 2 He’ll be one the best players in the Champ again next season. Would prefer to keep him. 3
trousers Posted February 2 Posted February 2 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Mr Saints said: He’ll be one the best players in the Champ again next season. Would prefer to keep him. I'm inclined to agree although, as one or two others have pointed out recently, there's going to be an 'elephant in the room' next season for all those players who are "great in the Championship but not good enough for the Premier League". That is, the likes of Downes and Adam Armstrong had a significant incentive to perform out of their skin last season: they had the 'prize' of playing in the Premier League the following season. However, next season, that prize won't exist as it's now clear they would need to be jettisoned if/when we get promoted. As such, there's a fair chance they won't have the heightened levels of motivation they had last season... (Yeah, I know.... they're professional footballers and will naturally want to play their best regardless of the circumstances, but a lot of the game is played in the mind and these guys are only human...) Edited February 2 by trousers 3
Pamplemousse Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Hard to take anything the Sun says seriously so let's see if a more reliable source backs that up. It would be ludicrous though to sell him unless it's more than what we paid.
beatlesaint Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Hasn't been anywhere near that uncooked chicken again has he ? 😁
SWLondon Saint Posted February 2 Posted February 2 As was said, could literally be anything but if he has kids my money would be on the norovirus. Been through school and pretty much all families like 🔥💩. 1
Holmes_and_Watson Posted February 2 Posted February 2 1 hour ago, trousers said: I'm inclined to agree although, as one or two others have pointed out recently, there's going to be an 'elephant in the room' next season for all those players who are "great in the Championship but not good enough for the Premier League". That is, the likes of Downes and Adam Armstrong had a significant incentive to perform out of their skin last season: they had the 'prize' of playing in the Premier League the following season. However, next season, that prize won't exist as it's now clear they would need to be jettisoned if/when we get promoted. As such, there's a fair chance they won't have the heightened levels of motivation they had last season... (Yeah, I know.... they're professional footballers and will naturally want to play their best regardless of the circumstances, but a lot of the game is played in the mind and these guys are only human...) If anyone needs any details of this, just DM me. Every moment of my direct involvement in PL games, is entirely in my mind. 🙂 1
Baird of the land Posted February 2 Posted February 2 If we got our money back I’d be fine with him leaving. He was central to the Martin system, but seems much less impressive once we’ve gone away from that.
Football Special Posted February 2 Posted February 2 2 hours ago, Lighthouse said: 'Problems' could cover a wide range of scenarios, including private family matters. Hopefully it's nothing too serious and we see him back soon. Probably his indigestion again that delayed his arrival
Saint86 Posted February 2 Posted February 2 3 hours ago, Dusic said: Interesting exchange here: Surely no chance we would let him go to Ipswich as will be competing with them again next season but certainly something not quite right with him. Recall his partner being pregnant, perhaps just generally unsettled? Charlie Wyat sounds liike a right bell end has to be said. Literally twisted what Juric said to an entirely different meaning just to create a very negative angle and get some bites. Need to lose people like this from around the club tbh. 2
Matthew Le God Posted February 2 Posted February 2 10 minutes ago, Saint86 said: Charlie Wyat sounds liike a right bell end has to be said. Literally twisted what Juric said to an entirely different meaning just to create a very negative angle and get some bites. Need to lose people like this from around the club tbh. How would you lose him from being 'around the club'? He is 'Football editor at The Sun'! A Cortese-style ban?
Harry_SFC Posted February 2 Posted February 2 (edited) Well he isn't leaving imminently - Just seen him walking along Bournemouth beach with his girlfriend and daughter. Edited February 2 by Harry_SFC 1
Saint86 Posted February 2 Posted February 2 (edited) 3 hours ago, Matthew Le God said: How would you lose him from being 'around the club'? He is 'Football editor at The Sun'! A Cortese-style ban? I don't know, that isn't up to me - but we don't need people like that putting their own negative spin on things for a wider audience. Rumour spreading like that finds its way into wider circulation over time. I also find it hard to believe you're okay with this particular example given you're usual exacting standards. Edited February 2 by Saint86
Badger Posted February 2 Posted February 2 1 minute ago, Saint86 said: I don't know, that isn't up to me - but we don't need people like that putting their own negative spin on things for a wider audience. Rumour spreading like that finds its way into wider circulation over time. I also find it hard to believe you're okay with this particular example given you're usual exacting standards. That's part of his job though - the club can't control is how the media portray it.
Lighthouse Posted February 2 Posted February 2 3 minutes ago, Saint86 said: I don't know, that isn't up to me - but we don't need people like that putting their own negative spin on things for a wider audience. Rumour spreading like that finds its way into wider circulation over time. I also find it hard to believe you're okay with this particular example given you're usual exacting standards. Are you new to the Sun's particular concept of journalism? 1
Matthew Le God Posted February 2 Posted February 2 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Saint86 said: I don't know, that isn't up to me - but we don't need people like that putting their own negative spin on things for a wider audience. Rumour spreading like that finds its way into wider circulation over time. I also find it hard to believe you're okay with this particular example given you're usual exacting standards. You want to silence the free press? Is this 1933 Germany or 2025 America? Edited February 2 by Matthew Le God 8
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 17 hours ago, Saint86 said: Charlie Wyat sounds liike a right bell end has to be said. Literally twisted what Juric said to an entirely different meaning just to create a very negative angle and get some bites. Need to lose people like this from around the club tbh. Has he twisted it? Seems reasonable to draw the conclusion all is not well. 1
austsaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 I haven’t given up on Downes, and the idea that he can only play in a Russball side seems crazy. There is a midfielder in the squad who appears to be a possession/ recycler only, but it’s not FD. I think he has suffered from not having a defensive minded midfield partner, last season and this. Charles wasn’t ready; and Smallbone and Aribo don’t fit that role, particularly WS. Although Les Ugo has been inconsistent - Downes and he in partnership looks the best central midfield pairing we have for the rest of the season. I hope he stays, with Shea Charles and a newbie to help him out. 5
OldNick Posted February 3 Posted February 3 I did hear a couple of weeks ago from someone close to Staplewood that Juric has ruffled some feathers. I think I did post that at the time. I do hope FD is not one one of them but in time he may come around to the fact that IJ is ok
Dman Posted February 3 Posted February 3 5 minutes ago, OldNick said: I did hear a couple of weeks ago from someone close to Staplewood that Juric has ruffled some feathers. I think I did post that at the time. I do hope FD is not one one of them but in time he may come around to the fact that IJ is ok The problem is, he's ruffled feathers and is getting more out of those who are genuine PL players. Unfortunatley, he's pissing off those who'll be key to us coming back up next season (ironically those who aren't good enough for the PL). 4
OldNick Posted February 3 Posted February 3 6 minutes ago, Dman said: The problem is, he's ruffled feathers and is getting more out of those who are genuine PL players. Unfortunatley, he's pissing off those who'll be key to us coming back up next season (ironically those who aren't good enough for the PL). fair point although, i think he will get a few in
Dman Posted February 3 Posted February 3 45 minutes ago, OldNick said: fair point although, i think he will get a few in Its a huge risk though. We know downes is a top, top player in the championship. He knows the leauge and the demands of it. The same as Adam Armstrong, Archer etc. Brining in some unknown from france, turkey or denmark is a massive risk. One which I think will cause us big problems. 1
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 Potentially losing Armstrong Archer Downes SAA Could be disastrous for our promotion hopes next year. 1 1
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 28 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Potentially losing Armstrong Archer Downes SAA Could be disastrous for our promotion hopes next year. Not if we replace them with equal or better players. 1
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 22 minutes ago, Toussaint said: Not if we replace them with equal or better players. Some of them were the best players in their positions last year. The last thing we want in the summer is loads of new players and even more upheaval than necessary. I just don't see the logic in getting rid of proven championship performers and gambling that we will find better. 3
saintant Posted February 3 Posted February 3 3 hours ago, OldNick said: I did hear a couple of weeks ago from someone close to Staplewood that Juric has ruffled some feathers. I think I did post that at the time. I do hope FD is not one one of them but in time he may come around to the fact that IJ is ok Well let's face it those feathers were long overdue for a bloody good ruffle which was never going to come from their best mate Russell. Any that didn't like it can go elsewhere and good riddance. It's been too easy in training for far too long and we've paid a heavy price for RM treating it like a sunday morning kick about amongst friends. 4
S-Clarke Posted February 3 Posted February 3 (edited) 5 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Some of them were the best players in their positions last year. The last thing we want in the summer is loads of new players and even more upheaval than necessary. I just don't see the logic in getting rid of proven championship performers and gambling that we will find better. And with our recruitment you have to worry... I don't have an issue with some of these guys leaving on loan and getting game time per-say, like Charles, but it's our insistence on adding 'obligations to buy' which is confusing me. Like you say, they'd be assets next year but we seem prepared to give them up. Maybe we're a bit up the creek financially? Edited February 3 by S-Clarke 2
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 15 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: And with our recruitment you have to worry... I don't have an issue with some of these guys leaving on loan and getting game time per-say, like Charles, but it's our insistence on adding 'obligations to buy' which is confusing me. Like you say, they'd be assets next year but we seem prepared to give them up. Maybe we're a bit up the creek financially? If that is the case then you think we would be selling the likes of Fernandes, THB, Sulemana, Onuachu etc. Downes Charles Armstrong Archer Are all proven championship performers. Selling them now just makes our rebuilding job in the summer that much harder. Potentially we could then lose: Downes Charles Armstrong Archer Aribo Sulemana KWP SAA Onuachu Ugochukwu Fernandes Dibling Which will leave us with virtually no midfielders or attackers at all. We will have to rebuild the entire team in one window which is incredibly risky. I'd be very tempted to keep quite a few of those players for next year even if some of them aren't keen purely because it's going to be too difficult to replace everyone and we would potentially be left with Smallbone, Bree and Bazunu...)
Saint Billy Posted February 3 Posted February 3 2 hours ago, Dman said: Its a huge risk though. We know downes is a top, top player in the championship. He knows the leauge and the demands of it. The same as Adam Armstrong, Archer etc. Brining in some unknown from france, turkey or denmark is a massive risk. One which I think will cause us big problems. The problem is, having a squad good enough to get us out of the championship does not mean that squad is good enough to survive in the premiership as this season has proven.
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 9 minutes ago, Saint Billy said: The problem is, having a squad good enough to get us out of the championship does not mean that squad is good enough to survive in the premiership as this season has proven. Of course but what are the chances of binning off so many decent championship players now and replacing them with great players for the championship who are also good enough in the prem?
Dman Posted February 3 Posted February 3 12 minutes ago, Saint Billy said: The problem is, having a squad good enough to get us out of the championship does not mean that squad is good enough to survive in the premiership as this season has proven. Then you look to move them on, the summer after the get us promoted. Not the summer you're going down to the championship. 3
S-Clarke Posted February 3 Posted February 3 21 minutes ago, Saint Billy said: The problem is, having a squad good enough to get us out of the championship does not mean that squad is good enough to survive in the premiership as this season has proven. This is true, but then you just have to be ruthless upon promotion. We bought Billy Sharp to get us promoted in the Champ, then almost immediately discarded him in the Prem. Same went for guys like Hammond, Harding, Richardson, Barnard, Connolly etc - mainstays from our promotion teams but with a realisation that they weren't good enough, so we evolved from them. Building a Championship team full of players who can make the step up is impossible and financially irresponsible I'd say. They wouldn't be cheap and would want $$$. Build a team for where you are today, with an eye on players who could evolve. 2
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 1 hour ago, hypochondriac said: Some of them were the best players in their positions last year. The last thing we want in the summer is loads of new players and even more upheaval than necessary. I just don't see the logic in getting rid of proven championship performers and gambling that we will find better. That is true, but we finished a distant 4th with that team. I think we will need to be stronger this time, we will have Leicester and Ipswich to overcome, plus some strong sides who will lose out this year. The only one I remotely care about is Archer, as he hasn't really had a much of chance under Ivan, and to me he seems to have something about him. I am one of those who would like to see a comprehensive clear out of the players who took us down last time. We need a good refresh IMO, which has already started with the new manager, the incoming DoF, SR changes and so on. 1
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 1 hour ago, S-Clarke said: And with our recruitment you have to worry... I don't have an issue with some of these guys leaving on loan and getting game time per-say, like Charles, but it's our insistence on adding 'obligations to buy' which is confusing me. Like you say, they'd be assets next year but we seem prepared to give them up. Maybe we're a bit up the creek financially? Do you not think we maybe turning a corner on that one?
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 1 minute ago, Toussaint said: That is true, but we finished a distant 4th with that team. I think we will need to be stronger this time, we will have Leicester and Ipswich to overcome, plus some strong sides who will lose out this year. The only one I remotely care about is Archer, as he hasn't really had a much of chance under Ivan, and to me he seems to have something about him. I am one of those who would like to see a comprehensive clear out of the players who took us down last time. We need a good refresh IMO, which has already started with the new manager, the incoming DoF, SR changes and so on. I agree that we need to be stronger but Downes THB Armstrong Aribo Archer (Adams replacement) Are not the players I would be getting rid of. If we want to be stronger then keep those and get better replacements for: Fraser Smallbone Charles Edozie Stewart Maybe when we've got rid of them we can start thinking about maybe upgrading some of the others.
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 2 minutes ago, Toussaint said: Do you not think we maybe turning a corner on that one? Where's the evidence for that?
S-Clarke Posted February 3 Posted February 3 1 minute ago, Toussaint said: Do you not think we maybe turning a corner on that one? I did hope so, but this summer was a mess. Fernandes was a good pick, but they've let themselves down with the likes of BBD, Suguwara, Lallana, Taylor, Cornet etc. It seems for every good addition there is another 3 or 4 crap ones.
OldNick Posted February 3 Posted February 3 2 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: I agree that we need to be stronger but Downes THB Armstrong Aribo Archer (Adams replacement) Are not the players I would be getting rid of. If we want to be stronger then keep those and get better replacements for: Fraser Smallbone Charles Edozie Stewart Maybe when we've got rid of them we can start thinking about maybe upgrading some of the others. Crikey, replace Charles, Edozie !! I would have thought both being older and more experienced would make them ideal next season, even Small bone.
hypochondriac Posted February 3 Posted February 3 (edited) 1 minute ago, OldNick said: Crikey, replace Charles, Edozie !! I would have thought both being older and more experienced would make them ideal next season, even Small bone. I'd personally keep Charles and Edozie but if we're looking to upgrade people then I'd be replacing them for the championship before the likes of Downes and Armstrong. I'd personally get rid of Smallbone. Edited February 3 by hypochondriac
OldNick Posted February 3 Posted February 3 4 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: I'd personally keep Charles and Edozie but if we're looking to upgrade people then I'd be replacing them for the championship before the likes of Downes and Armstrong. I'd personally get rid of Smallbone. seems Downes doe not have the heart for us now. He really has been a disappointment this season 2
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 24 minutes ago, S-Clarke said: I did hope so, but this summer was a mess. Fernandes was a good pick, but they've let themselves down with the likes of BBD, Suguwara, Lallana, Taylor, Cornet etc. It seems for every good addition there is another 3 or 4 crap ones. I really liked the two new boys that started Saturday and I think Juric is an infinitely more experienced than the succession of second rate managers that preceded him, so personally I’m feeling a bit more optimistic. 3
Farmer Saint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 4 hours ago, Dman said: Its a huge risk though. We know downes is a top, top player in the championship. He knows the leauge and the demands of it. The same as Adam Armstrong, Archer etc. Brining in some unknown from france, turkey or denmark is a massive risk. One which I think will cause us big problems. No, we know Downes is a top, top Championship player when he plays for Russell Martin. 3
Saint86 Posted February 3 Posted February 3 JWP recalled from Forest - do we have a loan spot free still? 1
Pamplemousse Posted February 3 Posted February 3 5 hours ago, OldNick said: I did hear a couple of weeks ago from someone close to Staplewood that Juric has ruffled some feathers. I think I did post that at the time. I do hope FD is not one one of them but in time he may come around to the fact that IJ is ok Think we're going to be in for a very interesting, and ultimately very beneficial, summer if IJ stays. We need a mass clearout. But I'd like Downes to stay as he can improve. 4
23rdSaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 Just now, Saint86 said: JWP recalled from Forest - do we have a loan spot free still? He's not allowed to go anywhere else on loan this season. Think there's a rule that you can only pay for a maximum of two clubs per season...
Dman Posted February 3 Posted February 3 11 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said: No, we know Downes is a top, top Championship player when he plays for Russell Martin. If a pretty limited manager in Martin can get him to that level, I have confidence that most others can as well.
Farmer Saint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 7 minutes ago, Dman said: If a pretty limited manager in Martin can get him to that level, I have confidence that most others can as well. It's the system, not the Manager. 1
Toussaint Posted February 3 Posted February 3 1 minute ago, Farmer Saint said: It's the system, not the Manager. Agreed, he is nowhere near dynamic enough for Juric.
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