Jack Stephens

[Tommy Mulgrew]

But Bree or Stephens would be an upgrade on Manning.  Arguably, Meghoma would, too.  (We have seen the truth of those statements earlier this season when those three players played at LB instead of Manning.).  We could play either of those replacements depending on the strengths of the opposition.  And I bet we would do better than if we did not.  But, regrettably, I doubt that RM would agree.  Unless RM sees sense, our promotion hopes will remain unfulfilled.

IMO, of course.

[VectisSaint]

11 hours ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

But Bree or Stephens would be an upgrade on Manning.  Arguably, Meghoma would, too.  (We have seen the truth of those statements earlier this season when those three players played at LB instead of Manning.).  We could play either of those replacements depending on the strengths of the opposition.  And I bet we would do better than if we did not.  But, regrettably, I doubt that RM would agree.  Unless RM sees sense, our promotion hopes will remain unfulfilled.

IMO, of course.

Your opinion and many others.

[beatlesaint]

We didnt miss Jack when we were on our 25 game run, I fail to see why RM cant admit or see that. Put him on the bench, use him if one of JB or THB gets injured and thats it, end of.

[AlexLaw76]

2 hours ago, beatlesaint said:

We didnt miss Jack when we were on our 25 game run, I fail to see why RM cant admit or see that. Put him on the bench, use him if one of JB or THB gets injured and thats it, end of.

yeah, but...it is all about getting people on the pitch who deserve to be there....etc etc etc

[Miltonaggro]

On 16/03/2024 at 12:53, AlexLaw76 said:

yeah, but...it is all about getting people on the pitch who deserve to be there....etc etc etc

It is indeed.  Russ should alternate between Jack and Ryan to do the post match trio fist pump to the Saints kop win lose or draw until the end of the season.

[VectisSaint]

On 16/03/2024 at 10:51, beatlesaint said:

We didnt miss Jack when we were on our 25 game run, I fail to see why RM cant admit or see that. Put him on the bench, use him if one of JB or THB gets injured and thats it, end of.

Didn't we? How do you know that we wouldn't have won more than we did, or scored more goals if Stephens had been available. You don't, nor do I. But there were a lot of people on here moaning (unrealistically imho) that we drew too many during the 25 game run. Having Stephens as an option during the run may well have helped, we will never know, but having to rely on two CBs and with only Holgate as backup was a big risk, fortunately we got through it. 

[david in sweden]

I go along with Vectis' rational.  Clearly THB and Jan B.  are the first choice CB's , but aside from Jack there are no other established CB's in the squad.

There are advantages to having Jack on the pitch (whether starting or as a sub). He is the longest serving player at the club, and is a voice on the pitch.

As a former player himself, RM clearly recognises the influence that such a player has on a side that is still without a cast iron starting line-up, and Jack

has shown that he can play in either FB roles  in emergencies, and is important for that reason alone and rarely give less than 100%.

  

I see " a sort of parallel " with Gareth Southgate's continued insistence in having Jordan Henderson in the England squad - another contentious choice

to many of us - and even though JH seldom got much match time, his influence in the dressing room and especially around the newer players coming

into national squad was seen as invaluable.    At 30,  Jack is hardly likely to get a long extension to his contract, but he has been with Saints since age 16

and has been good captain / role model at all levels since then, and although he may never rank with a Fonte or VvD - right now Jack is invaluable.

[beatlesaint]

6 hours ago, VectisSaint said:

Didn't we? How do you know that we wouldn't have won more than we did, or scored more goals if Stephens had been available. You don't, nor do I. But there were a lot of people on here moaning (unrealistically imho) that we drew too many during the 25 game run. Having Stephens as an option during the run may well have helped, we will never know, but having to rely on two CBs and with only Holgate as backup was a big risk, fortunately we got through it. 

No we didn’t in my opinion. I don’t believe we would have won more or scored more but I do believe we would have conceded more and that the run wouldn’t have lasted that long. My reasoning is this - as soon as Stephens was fully fit and up to speed RM was itching to play him, quite happy to move two or three people around to accommodate the player. He couldn’t help himself with his tinkering which as you well know cost us dear in those two home games against Hull and Millwall. During that run, and I take your point about available options, the team virtually picked itself. The understanding was superb as everyone knew their job and their position. As soon as that was disrupted the wheels began to fall off, not totally of course, but significantly. 
 

So that’s my yin to your yang 🙃

[The Cat]

1 hour ago, beatlesaint said:

No we didn’t in my opinion. I don’t believe we would have won more or scored more but I do believe we would have conceded more and that the run wouldn’t have lasted that long. My reasoning is this - as soon as Stephens was fully fit and up to speed RM was itching to play him, quite happy to move two or three people around to accommodate the player. He couldn’t help himself with his tinkering which as you well know cost us dear in those two home games against Hull and Millwall. During that run, and I take your point about available options, the team virtually picked itself. The understanding was superb as everyone knew their job and their position. As soon as that was disrupted the wheels began to fall off, not totally of course, but significantly. 
 

So that’s my yin to your yang 🙃

He didn't play against Hull. Maybe he should have done, we might not have lost.

Basically all the people blathering on about shoehorning and tinkering have in relation to Stephens is one defeat to Millwall.

Seems like a massive overreaction to one game.

[beatlesaint]

4 minutes ago, The Cat said:

He didn't play against Hull. Maybe he should have done, we might not have lost.

Basically all the people blathering on about shoehorning and tinkering have in relation to Stephens is one defeat to Millwall.

Seems like a massive overreaction to one game.

The tinkering isn’t just related to Jack Stephens.

[Dusic]

After tonight he will be starting the remaining games of the season. Be interesting to see in what position.

[SambaMaverick]

Fucking centre-back please!

[Patches O Houlihan]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0hsp54w 

Jack is going to be really important for the team this week

[davefizzy14]

Jack will definitely be back in the team to rally the troops. A proper leader 😊

[Whitey Grandad]

1 minute ago, davefizzy14 said:

Jack will definitely be back in the team to rally the troops. A proper leader 😊

That’s what scares me.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

3 minutes ago, davefizzy14 said:

Jack will definitely be back in the team to rally the troops. A proper leader 😊

Not sure I would agree he's a leader. 

[obelisk]

At least Stephens might actually give a toss.

[Whitey Grandad]

2 minutes ago, obelisk said:

At least Stephens might actually give a toss.

Do you think that’s all that matters?

[FarehamSaintJames]

Stick him up top. He’ll win a header.

[obelisk]

7 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Do you think that’s all that matters?

Nope but it could make a difference. Just as I liked to see Franny stepping out to play for Saints.

[AlexLaw76]

Who will drop out for Stephen’s?

 

[saintstowin]

Any defender who doesn't play in a thrashing immediately looks better. 

But JS would have played his part in the debacle last night and I don't think the result would have been different.

Some of of the things JS does that limit him are a lack of focus and being too laid back on the pitch, lacking urgency. Unless a situation presents itself like v Middlesbrough.

All the usual JS stuff would not have helped. 

[Patrick Bateman]

1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Who will drop out for Stephen’s?

 

You know he'll be right back ... or centre midfield ... 🤨

[Give it to Ron]

How can a manager or his coaching staff over the course of a season not see one of our biggest problems?

We give wingers so much space, time, never stop crosses or close down opponents. I can think of loads of goals this season yet still we do nothing to stop this.

Look at the second and third goals last night classic examples , Boro at home Cardiff first goal Birmingham 3rd etc etc

Edited April 24 by Give it to Ron

[Whitey Grandad]

8 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

You know he'll be right back ... or centre midfield ... 🤨

Or both.

[Galway saint]

4 minutes ago, Give it to Ron said:

How can a manager or his coaching staff over the course of a season not see one of our biggest problems?

We give wingers so much space, time, never stop crosses or close down opponents. I can think of loads of goals this season yet still we do nothing to stop this.

Look at the second and third goals last night classic examples , Boro at home Cardiff first goal Birmingham 3rd etc etc

I’m not sure if it’s the players or direction from the coaches but it was very apparent last night for a couple of the goals that the defenders were standing off. 

[JRM]

9 hours ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0hsp54w 

Jack is going to be really important for the team this week

Fair play to him, he says the right things there. 

[stknowle]

19 minutes ago, JRM said:

Fair play to him, he says the right things there. 

Agree. Good to hear some honesty and no bullshit about playing well and being brave.

[Lighthouse]

Say what you like about him, we played a thousand times better at West Brom and Ipswich with Stephens as the inverted fullback, than we did with Manning on the pitch last night.

[Give it to Ron]

9 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Say what you like about him, we played a thousand times better at West Brom and Ipswich with Stephens as the inverted fullback, than we did with Manning on the pitch last night.

But why was Manning brought onto the pitch it was 1 nil we weren’t getting battered then. Bree was for me our best player at that time

[warsash saint]

The only player that appears to give a f***

 

He had to drag near the whole team over to the away fans at the final whistle to acknowledge our great support last night!

Edited April 24 by warsash saint

[Wade Garrett]

1 hour ago, Lighthouse said:

Say what you like about him, we played a thousand times better at West Brom and Ipswich with Stephens as the inverted fullback, than we did with Manning on the pitch last night.

We play better without inverted full-backs at all.  Crazy tactic for a Championship side.

[Wade Garrett]

Good club captain but shouldn’t be near the first XI.

[saintant]

Fine words from Jack but talk is cheap. Let's wait and see if his comments are backed up by the performance on Saturday. Last night we were clearly not at it from minute one and RM should have sensed that early and got into the players. Instead he sat on his hands and allowed that car crash to unfold. For the second time this season the Leicester manager completely schooled him by setting up to hit us on the break and not worry about how much possession Leicester had as backed up by the stats. 

[Lighthouse]

1 hour ago, Wade Garrett said:

We play better without inverted full-backs at all.  Crazy tactic for a Championship side.

Horses for courses. There’s not one universal tactic that’s going to work for every match.

[trousers]

Feel so happy for Jack today... The emotion on his face is palpable. Southampton through and through. 

[Saint_clark]

11 minutes ago, trousers said:

Feel so happy for Jack today... The emotion on his face is palpable. Southampton through and through. 

Agreed. Shouldn't allow sentiment to dictate our transfer policy however. That's all I'll say in this day of celebration. 

One of only three players to lift a trophy at wembley as Saints captain!

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Really chuffed for him today. You could see how much it meant to him, and how proud he was to be doing that for his and our club.

It was practically the first ball, and he misplaced a pass. I half chuckled/  half groaned. Knowing when to take a riskier pass and when to keep it safe is just something to work on. Elsewher, he was got a shot blocked after a cutback. Then I noticed, I wasn't noticing him. He did a load of work helping to keep that front four quiet, and the players behind them. With him in the side, Will got more forward, and Aribo more flexible, and Stephens did a lot of covering. Whether the gaps on the flanks or helping Bedders and THB. He had a very good game today.

We chuckle at him being shoe horned in, but it's a sign of how versatile he can be. As he shifted positions today, that was all paying off.

So credit to Martin who develops the players that way, as he's done for Will, AA, Aribo too.

[S-Clarke]

I was really emotional watching him celebrate at the end, it was really authentic.

[kjurwi]

Is it time to reeducate Stephens to a DM? Would prefer a THB-Bednarek central defence, but would like to se Stephens play.

 

Know it will not happen, but would like to see it.

[woodsaint1]

He may have been 'shoehorned' in, but when it mattered in the last 4 games - including Leeds away which was crucial for confidence, he helped contribute to our defensive solidity. In recent years we've also bemoaned our lack of leaders, Jack is a great leader and was doing that even when he wasnt playing. 

Hes in the same bracket as McCarthy for me, very good Championship player and has proven he is more than capable of doing it in the PL, but most likely as a backup

[Lord Duckhunter]

12 hours ago, kjurwi said:

Is it time to reeducate Stephens to a DM?

No, no no. Absolutely fucking no. I like Jack, always have. He’s got something about him, bit of spirit & leadership, but it never works even when you’re talking about proper top players like Gareth Southgate or John Stones.
 

Decent centre half on the ball, and supporters start thinking about CDM. It’s one thing a centre half drifting into midfield, or doing it when you’ve got 70% of the ball, like City do. But it’s a totally different role & he’ll get found out.

 

Being able to play centre half, either full back or in a 3, together with his leadership & spirit gets him a squad place, but midfielder..no thanks.

Edited May 27 by Lord Duckhunter

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

Stephens should not be a first team starter in the Prem. In the final he showed just how many careless mistakes he makes with two suicide balls gifted straight to the opposition. 

I like the guy but he's not up to the task in hand. 

[VectisSaint]

3 hours ago, Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd said:

Stephens should not be a first team starter in the Prem. In the final he showed just how many careless mistakes he makes with two suicide balls gifted straight to the opposition. 

I like the guy but he's not up to the task in hand. 

He did get off to an awful start yesterday, I counted (at least) 4 misplaced passes before he got one to a teammate. Still he did have a good game after that. He will be OK in the PL, he has been before and he has more to his game now than he did. If we're going to play 3/5 at the back then we will need at least 2 more CBs to be in mix. I think THB and JS are key to the way we play now, not the tippy-tappy sideways stuff, but the penetrating balls through the middle, either on the ground or over the top that open up defences and make chances for the likes of AA. People think that we played the same form of Russball all season (at least until the last few games) but overlook completely the changes that started just before Christmas with these long incisive balls that turn defence into attack at high speed. I don't think Bednarek gives us this option too often, but makes up for it by being a better defender. 

[Lighthouse]

Jack and Jan are a decent level of third and fourth choice CBs for a club like ours, hoping to be stable in the PL. Would I want either starting in August, assuming everyone is fit? No. I’d like to hope we can get ABK fit and in the right mindset, then we just need to keep KWP, find a LB with a double barrelled surname and our defence might look alright.