Sheffield Weds 1-2 Saints - Match Thread

[Miltonaggro]

Tell you what, that first half and last ten minutes were remarkable for a side with a new manager and system a matter of weeks ago. If we retain some of our quality players and add a focal point striker who can finish into this mix we are going to have a thrilling season watching technical football. Those game but limited Sheffield Wednesday players went in at full time and half time knackered after chasing shadows, we should have been out of sight first half and they knew it.  I’ll take that over the disjointed dogshit of the last few seasons every day of the week. 

Edited 5 August, 2023 by Miltonaggro

[ant]

Well. All feels a bit odd today!

1. Having won our first game of the season;
2. Having won, full stop;
3. It essentially being the first day of the league today - but there being zero stress or pressure on us.

The Adkins-ism of "don't get too high when you win" certainly applies.

But after the last few years, allow me this temporary little buzz, please.

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, Saint_Tony said:

It looks good at the end, but would have been so disappointing to draw that. 

I was thinking that midway through the second half but I was also more than happy with the performance. Sometimes you don’t get the result your performance deserves, that’s football. Wednesday deserved nothing from that game and I’m pleased that’s how it ended. 
 

Up the Saints!

[Channons Windmill]

The 9 minutes was particularly interesting to watch as he highlighted just how much positive influence RM has already had on the the team. Their instructions were obviously crystal clear and understood - witness Aribo’s contribution; he was clearly told to stay in a specific area to spread the play and then to hold the ball, making only short passes to a team mate. If nothing else, we will be hard to score against this year solely because the opposition won’t get the ball.

[AlexLaw76]

Norwich at home will be a better measure of where we are. Sheff Weds were the 3rd best team in League 1 (albeit with a ridiculous high number of points of that placing), and have not really signed anyone after changing their manager.

If we dominate and beat Norwich, then this is something to get excited about IMO

[saintant]

38 minutes ago, Mr Saints said:

Great to get the win, impressed with the transformation in playing style that RM and the coaching staff have implemented in around a month. Exciting to think it will improve with more time on the training pitch over the next few months. A couple of observations:

- defending set pieces needs to be improved, wasn’t keen on the matchup of Smallbone marking their big centre half who brushed him aside for their goal

- no VAR is brilliant. Celebrate goals properly knowing it won’t be ruined by some lines on a screen

- Adams has to start, loads of times in the first half we got in good wide positions and Armstrong was stood on the penalty spot rather than getting across the front post. Adams does this and we’ll score a lot of goals this way with our style.

Defending set pieces is a difficult one to resolve because the stark reality is that we are a small side lacking in physicality apart from the two centre backs. I fear we will concede quite a few goals from corners/free kicks crossed into our box because we just don't have the height in numbers to combat this.  Sheff Wednesday are a big side and the advantage to them at corners was very evident and led to their only chance/goal - other sides will certainly look to exploit this weakness in our armoury.  One way to combat it would be if Baz was more aggressive in coming out and claiming/punching crosses but he doesn't appear to have that in his game and he's not the tallest or most imposing figure. Maybe the new set-piece coach will help but he has a job on his hands in this respect. 

[saintant]

43 minutes ago, eurosaint said:

Given that we will lose a few more players, probably/possibly JWP, KWP, Che, Lyanco,Tella & Sulemana (Lavia is pretty much gone already!) our absolute priority must be for a striker to finish off our good approach play !

We're reasonably well covered in defence and midfield but if we are to kill games off when on top as we were in the first half yesterday a poacher is necessary !

Jöel Piroe has been mentioned as has a loan for Danny Ings but haven't read much more speculation, just hope that our recruitment team are on the case ??

Enjoyed the game last night and as ever I start the season in confident mood 😇

 

I have no doubt that a fit Danny Ings, with his clever runs and movement, would score a shed load of goals for this team.

[Mr Brightside]

Well that was fun!

Agree with all the positives on here, was also great to see us stay on the front foot after we scored for a change.

Was crucial to get off to a good start. Fair play to Wednesday, they make a noise, can’t remember anything that loud at the start for a while. But by not giving them a kick and scoring early kept them relatively quiet. 

Should have created a few more chances with all the domination we had, but no doubt this is what they will work on. Considering where we were, we’ve come a hell of a long way in such a short time. It’s clear how we’re trying to play and at times it was sublime. Best away performance I’ve seen in a long time. 

Away from home we’ll have the freedom to play how Martin wants us to, I just hope everyone buys into it at St Mary’s. We’re not the most patient of fans, and there are plenty of Kermit’s out there who’ll be shouting “get it forward” if it’s still 0-0 after 10 minutes. 

Anyway, was well worth getting home at 02:30 for!

 

 

Edited 5 August, 2023 by Mr Brightside
Typo

[manji]

Can’t add much to any of the previous comments. This is just the start of the Wilcox / Martin era. Can only see us getting better. Yeah we are going to lose Lavia probably JWP. The two players I think we need to keep are Tella and KWP. I reckon Bazuna will settle in when the defensive line up is finally sorted. I genuinely apologise for repeating this but let’s not forget we have been told we have at least 4 or 5 incomings on the way . We have a fair bit of dosh already. The backstage boys havnt put a foot wrong. 
I cannot see anyway we will not get at least one good striker in.

[derry]

I have a favourite coach, Pep Guardiola. I love the way his teams play. They use the ball, manoeuvre it around, keep possession, probe and probe again, run the legs off the opposition and strike decisively when the opportunity is made. That is what Russell Martin is trying to do. After years of schizophrenic crap it's a breath of fresh air. We are nowhere near yet, which in itself is brilliant. I like what Russell Martin has done and is working on.

Yesterday several things stood out for me. We need a lethal finisher, preferably a dominant centre back, plus a replacement for Liveramento. Provided we keep Tella and Sulemana that could give us an irresistable cutting edge. Edozie is raw, he can beat a man, is trying to provide an end product but isn't there yet and his two shots into the stand demonstrated a lack of composure. He is a young player that could in time be devastating but still needs nurturing and plenty of brief exposure to build up his experience. Of the existing, Adam Armstrong isn't the answer but could play wide, Adams was better and took his goal well, he's better at reacting than being given time because then he usually misses. Personally I think Adams will go and maybe Piroe will come in, Stuart of Sunderland subject to fitness would give us good options up front. If Sulemana goes we need a like for like replacement. I think Stuart Armstrong offers a good alternative both wide and in the hole if Alcaraz is not available.

 

 

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, Highfield Saint said:

Hopefully we can build on this and make the most of our August fixtures as September seems like it will be pivotal for our season with games against 5 teams fancied for a promotion or playoff spot 

Sunderland

Leicester

Ipswich

Middlesborough

Leeds

we’ll have a pretty good idea of how the season will go after that 

 

 

One game at a time 😉

[Maggie May]

The Burnley fans have a very high opinion of themselves, suggesting they would beat us on last night’s showing. I think a lot are cloaking their view of us with a touch of arrogance and envy. I personally think they’ll be torn apart in the Prem. 

https://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboard/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=70994&start=50

I think we were fantastic last night. It was only the lack of finishing that stopped it being a drubbing. I don’t know if that’s solved by playing Che from the start or bringing someone new in. We will punish a lot of teams as the players become more accustomed with the style and they buy into further. Starting off the season with a win was vitally important. Could some of the players linked with moves away be swayed by how well we played last night? We shall see.

I was very encouraged by the newfound zip in our play in the games against Goztepe and AZ, and it was great to see us take it up a notch in a league game.

Edited 5 August, 2023 by Maggie May

[saintant]

1 minute ago, Maggie May said:

The Burnley fans have a very high opinion of themselves, suggesting they would beat us on last night’s showing. I think a lot are cloaking their view of us with a touch of arrogance and envy. I personally think they’ll be torn apart in the Prem. 

https://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboard/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=70994&start=50

I think we were fantastic last night. It was only the lack of finishing that stopped it being a drubbing. I don’t know if that’s solved by playing Che from the start or bringing someone new in. We will punish a lot of teams as the players become more accustomed with the style and the players buy into it. Starting off the season with a win was vitally important. Could some of the players linked with moves away be swayed by how well we played last night? We shall see.

 

They need to think back to how a, less than full strength, Man City side absolutely destroyed them in a cup game last season.

[derry]

16 minutes ago, saintant said:

Defending set pieces is a difficult one to resolve because the stark reality is that we are a small side lacking in physicality apart from the two centre backs. I fear we will concede quite a few goals from corners/free kicks crossed into our box because we just don't have the height in numbers to combat this.  Sheff Wednesday are a big side and the advantage to them at corners was very evident and led to their only chance/goal - other sides will certainly look to exploit this weakness in our armoury.  One way to combat it would be if Baz was more aggressive in coming out and claiming/punching crosses but he doesn't appear to have that in his game and he's not the tallest or most imposing figure. Maybe the new set-piece coach will help but he has a job on his hands in this respect. 

I think one area we could easily improve our defending. At the corner a SW player was outside the back post. Smallbone was the back marker but did it all wrong. He faced  the ball, that mean't he had to win the header which he didn't do. What he should have done was to turn sideways so that he could see both the ball and the back post header. So he couldn't outjump the SW player he could however move into a blocking position and stop the SW player moving forward to get a good jump probably ending up that neither of them could reach the ball. I've noticed over the years we have lost a lot of goals because the marker couldn't see the mark mainly through ball watching.

[saintant]

Just now, derry said:

I think one area we could easily improve our defending. At the corner a SW player was outside the back post. Smallbone was the back marker but did it all wrong. He faced  the ball, that mean't he had to win the header which he didn't do. What he should have done was to turn sideways so that he could see both the ball and the back post header. So he couldn't outjump the SW player he could however move into a blocking position and stop the SW player moving forward to get a good jump probably ending up that neither of them could reach the ball. I've noticed over the years we have lost a lot of goals because the marker couldn't see the mark mainly through ball watching.

Maybe the new set-piece coach will rectify this and other defensive failings against corners/set-pieces. What I don't want to see is bloody zonal marking!

[Saint_clark]

9 minutes ago, Maggie May said:

The Burnley fans have a very high opinion of themselves, suggesting they would beat us on last night’s showing. I think a lot are cloaking their view of us with a touch of arrogance and envy. I personally think they’ll be torn apart in the Prem. 

https://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboard/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=70994&start=50

I think we were fantastic last night. It was only the lack of finishing that stopped it being a drubbing. I don’t know if that’s solved by playing Che from the start or bringing someone new in. We will punish a lot of teams as the players become more accustomed with the style and they buy into further. Starting off the season with a win was vitally important. Could some of the players linked with moves away be swayed by how well we played last night? We shall see.

I was very encouraged by the newfound zip in our play in the games against Goztepe and AZ, and it was great to see us take it up a notch in a league game.

"other than the shot for the goal Tella has been pretty anonymous, I still think their valuation is high for him."

Then why do you want him!?

[Wurzel]

3 minutes ago, saintant said:

Maybe the new set-piece coach will rectify this and other defensive failings against corners/set-pieces. What I don't want to see is bloody zonal marking!

Indeed. Has any team been successful with zonal marking?. Forwards simply attack an empty zone, and defenders can't jump because they are starting from a standing start.

[Whitey Grandad]

18 minutes ago, Maggie May said:

The Burnley fans have a very high opinion of themselves, suggesting they would beat us on last night’s showing. I think a lot are cloaking their view of us with a touch of arrogance and envy. I personally think they’ll be torn apart in the Prem. 

https://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboard/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=70994&start=50

I think we were fantastic last night. It was only the lack of finishing that stopped it being a drubbing. I don’t know if that’s solved by playing Che from the start or bringing someone new in. We will punish a lot of teams as the players become more accustomed with the style and they buy into further. Starting off the season with a win was vitally important. Could some of the players linked with moves away be swayed by how well we played last night? We shall see.

I was very encouraged by the newfound zip in our play in the games against Goztepe and AZ, and it was great to see us take it up a notch in a league game.

But we weren’t playing Burnley 🙄

[The Curse of St Mary's]

Some of the negativity on here is ridiculously overboard. RM has already said we won't look like the finished product yet as it takes time to fully adjust to a whole new style of play. Let's not kid ourselves the identity RM has already implemented is miles ahead of both Jones and Selles. The moving triangles was refreshing to watch last night.  Once the team is fully tuned I will certainly expect more big chances to be created. Hopefully the new set pieces coach will drill in some improvements but we are a small team so it will always be our potential weak spot but we just need to make sure we dont concede needless set pieces. All in all loads to be really positive about. I'm sure RM and Wilcox will have replacement players lined up who are able to play the way we want should we lose key players which is obviously probable.

[kitch]

I know it's risky to say it, but I really enjoyed that last night! Can't remember the last time I enjoyed watching us.

[West end Saints]

1 hour ago, derry said:

I have a favourite coach, Pep Guardiola. I love the way his teams play. They use the ball, manoeuvre it around, keep possession, probe and probe again, run the legs off the opposition and strike decisively when the opportunity is made. That is what Russell Martin is trying to do. After years of schizophrenic crap it's a breath of fresh air. We are nowhere near yet, which in itself is brilliant. I like what Russell Martin has done and is working on.

Yesterday several things stood out for me. We need a lethal finisher, preferably a dominant centre back, plus a replacement for Liveramento. Provided we keep Tella and Sulemana that could give us an irresistable cutting edge. Edozie is raw, he can beat a man, is trying to provide an end product but isn't there yet and his two shots into the stand demonstrated a lack of composure. He is a young player that could in time be devastating but still needs nurturing and plenty of brief exposure to build up his experience. Of the existing, Adam Armstrong isn't the answer but could play wide, Adams was better and took his goal well, he's better at reacting than being given time because then he usually misses. Personally I think Adams will go and maybe Piroe will come in, Stuart of Sunderland subject to fitness would give us good options up front. If Sulemana goes we need a like for like replacement. I think Stuart Armstrong offers a good alternative both wide and in the hole if Alcaraz is not available.

 

 

Good post. 

 

Only point I'm not sure I agree with is needing a replacement for Tino. 

If (hoping) we keep KWP, him and Manning will be pretty close to the best in this division. 

We then have Bree, Perraud, Larios, Meghoma, even likes of JWP and Djenepo. 

Isn't this an opportunity to trim the squad? 

 

[Miltonaggro]

3 hours ago, Stud mark of doom said:

Just watched the 9 minutes of injury time again. That’s Entertainment. 

Agree, and last few seasons a horror film! 

[BERMUDASAINT]

6 hours ago, Kermitzasaint said:

Excruciating game to watch. Even the pundits said the style is set to aggravate the opposing team. Well it worked. Massive possession at a snails pace meant a very ponderous attack, having to beat 11 players around their box.

If this is what they're aiming for then we will not be coming straight back up again. Wednesday were awful yet still posed a threat once we lost possession. 

 

Result was positive but that was it. Meaningless passing for the sake of it.

3 fucking points!! Whoohoo. We are TOP OF THE LEAGUE!!!!!

this is not a well liked post, but i agree!

600 useless passes at back. SLOW build up, we get down the wings to pass all the way back? If we had drawn or lost, 900+ record breaking passes would mean fuck all. We almost threw that away with that passive passing.

What i saw in the first 10 min should have gave us confidence to go at that L1 team, we are a PL team with PL players and the difference in class was there to see. That was a team who stood off us, Why practice 1000 passes to bordom. We should have attacked them and scored more. We have single players worth more than their entire team!

I think we have enough talent to go at most of these teams agressively, outscore them, rather than slow build up, contain and retain. But thats not going to happen, so i hope confidence grows and we start attacking more with intent to score more than one goal over the opponent.

 

Edited 5 August, 2023 by BERMUDASAINT

[The Juice]

All I know is that I feel excited to see us at home next week and it has been a very very long time since I said that with any sincerity. 

I hear all the cautionary messages but, as a saints fan, I think you have to enjoy any good things that come our way (my God do we not suffer enough when times are bad) So I, for one, am greatly looking forward to some possession football, no pressure in relation to a drubbing every week and (hopefully not) circling the relegation drain for a year or two.

Lots of development and progress to be made but I'm very much here for it!  

Edited 5 August, 2023 by The Juice

[BERMUDASAINT]

2 hours ago, Channons Windmill said:

The 9 minutes was particularly interesting to watch as he highlighted just how much positive influence RM has already had on the the team. Their instructions were obviously crystal clear and understood - witness Aribo’s contribution; he was clearly told to stay in a specific area to spread the play and then to hold the ball, making only short passes to a team mate. If nothing else, we will be hard to score against this year solely because the opposition won’t get the ball.

Yes what a useless sub. Went from Edozie who was dribbiling, tricking and sprinting past his man......to Airbo, never taking on his man (who Tella had rinsed and worn him down) and making the simple pass of 5 yrds back to saftey with no pressure on him????

REALLY? were you watching the opponent? Were you not salivating to get on the field against that shite? I was begging for him to take on his man as an attacking winger that is fresh, just once! So dissapointed, hope to see more from him.

 

[Fan The Flames]

2 hours ago, manji said:

Can’t add much to any of the previous comments. This is just the start of the Wilcox / Martin era. Can only see us getting better. Yeah we are going to lose Lavia probably JWP. The two players I think we need to keep are Tella and KWP. I reckon Bazuna will settle in when the defensive line up is finally sorted. I genuinely apologise for repeating this but let’s not forget we have been told we have at least 4 or 5 incomings on the way . We have a fair bit of dosh already. The backstage boys havnt put a foot wrong. 
I cannot see anyway we will not get at least one good striker in.

Martin said last night we aren't buying anyone until players leave.

[Midfield_General]

1 hour ago, BERMUDASAINT said:

Yes what a useless sub. Went from Edozie who was dribbiling, tricking and sprinting past his man......to Airbo, never taking on his man (who Tella had rinsed and worn him down) and making the simple pass of 5 yrds back to saftey with no pressure on him????

REALLY? were you watching the opponent? Were you not salivating to get on the field against that shite? I was begging for him to take on his man as an attacking winger that is fresh, just once! So dissapointed, hope to see more from him.

 

He wasn't brought on to run at people and take risks, he was brought on to help keep the ball and close out the game. Which he did. 

[Saint_clark]

11 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

He wasn't brought on to run at people and take risks, he was brought on to help keep the ball and close out the game. Which he did. 

Agreed, I was actually glad he came on and DIDN'T try to take it round half the Sheffield Wednesday team - that would have been selfish and not at all what the team needed.

[Patches O Houlihan]

5 hours ago, Stud mark of doom said:

Just watched the 9 minutes of injury time again. That’s Entertainment. 

I watched it back too and 4 proper touches is all that SW got in that 9 mins of injury time; and each time we won it straight back.

[jasonb]

Ok watched the full match now. As others have noted, definite style of play. Comfortable most of the game but Wednesday helped with that. They got a bit closer to Saints second half but you always felt their best bet was set pieces as was proven. 

The big thing I noticed was the passing, whilst pleasing and of course seeing Saints in control is most welcome, I feel is one of the areas we can improve as the season goes on. 

Man City pass with pace as well as precision. It's the speed of play that catches up with the opposition as well as the relentlessness of it all. If RM can get them moving the ball next with pace we'll be even more potent. Some of the training videos put out by the club showed some really fast play. I get that it takes time to develop that and it was only the first game. 

Those last 9 mins of the game were superb. As noted in commentary "that's how you see a game out". 

Great start. 

[Charlie Wayman]

I thought we played extremely well last night and bearing in mind how little time the players have had to adapt to this new style of football and recalling how slow and ponderous was our passing in the friendly matches only a week ago, the slickness of our game last night was a revelation. Surely things can only get better given stability and practice.

By far our outstanding player was Kyle Walker Peters who was here, there and everywhere giving and taking passes and instinctively being in the right place at the right time to keep things moving. He was instrumental in setting up both our goals and I'm surprised nobody else has mentioned this. A beautiful lay-off to Tella for the first and a highly perceptive defence splitting pass to the running JWP for the second. His partnership with Nathan Tella looks far more than promising on the right. Of the three players most likely to leave from our starting XI it is he KWP that we can least afford to lose on this showing. 

We have quality on the bench and quality in recuperation. Sulemana and ABK are certain starters when fully fit and up to speed and Perraud if he stays is at least as good as Manning and probably a far better left side partner for Edozie. Manning was not effective in working with the young lad last night and often left his left side partner isolated. The idea of Stuart Armstrong & Charley Alcaraz vying for one position is a bit worrying, good luck to Martin on keeping both of them sweet.

Norwich will be a much sterner test. We will have much less time on the ball simply because they will be far less naive about pressing the opposition and closing down their options. 

The irony of last night was that there was only one new recruit in the team from the side that were relegated last month. They weren't then good enough for the PL so if nobody leaves and they get us promoted will they be good enough for the PL next time?

[Charlie Wayman]

6 minutes ago, jasonb said:

 Those last 9 mins of the game were superb. As noted in commentary "that's how you see a game out". 

Great start. 

A neutral might say that the nine minutes added on for time wasting led to nine minutes of time wasting by Saints to use up the time, so why bother?

Edited 5 August, 2023 by Charlie Wayman

[West end Saints]

7 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

I thought we played extremely well last night and bearing in mind how little time the players have had to adapt to this new style of football and recalling how slow and ponderous was our passing in the friendly matches only a week ago, the slickness of our game last night was a revelation. Surely things can only get better given stability and practice.

By far our outstanding player was Kyle Walker Peters who was here, there and everywhere giving and taking passes and instinctively being in the right place at the right time to keep things moving. He was instrumental in setting up both our goals and I'm surprised nobody else has mentioned this. A beautiful lay-off to Tella for the first and a highly perceptive defence splitting pass to the running JWP for the second. His partnership with Nathan Tella looks far more than promising on the right. Of the three players most likely to leave from our starting XI it is he KWP that we can least afford to lose on this showing. 

We have quality on the bench and quality in recuperation. Sulemana and ABK are certain starters when fully fit and up to speed and Perraud if he stays is at least as good as Manning and probably a far better left side partner for Edozie. Manning was not effective in working with the young lad last night and often left his left side partner isolated. The idea of Stuart Armstrong & Charley Alcaraz vying for one position is a bit worrying, good luck to Martin on keeping both of them sweet.

Norwich will be a much sterner test. We will have much less time on the ball simply because they will be far less naive about pressing the opposition and closing down their options. 

The irony of last night was that there was only one new recruit in the team from the side that were relegated last month. They weren't then good enough for the PL so if nobody leaves and they get us promoted will they be good enough for the PL next time?

Easy winner - Charlie - for me, offers so much more. 

Stu is good to bring on for a surge of energy with his direct runs when we need a goal. But, for me, his overall play is too weak and risky to start (unless play a lot further forward). Even last night he gave the ball away needlessly which led to one of their few attacks. 

 

Having said that in the last Friendlies, and last night he looked quality when he came on

[Chez]

I missed the game (Graceland tour took longer than expected). How did AA play? Did the ball get stuck under his feet or did he look confident?

[The Kraken]

5 minutes ago, Chez said:

I missed the game (Graceland tour took longer than expected). How did AA play? Did the ball get stuck under his feet or did he look confident?

We’ll put it this way, he has zero votes in the MOTM poll. It was his goal, but he was trying to get out of the way of Tella’s shot and got a brush on it.

Personally I thought he was fairly anonymous, didn’t give enough of a focal point up front, didn’t really get the ball in dangerous areas. Thankfully Adams came on to get the winning goal. Not sure that Armstrong’s best role is up top on his own, on that showing he’s certainly not the answer to our striking woes.

[SaintBobby]

9 hours ago, Stripey McStripe Shirt said:

Does seem very odd that it has been credited to Armstrong. Surely, it it touched him, it should only be classed as a deflection given that I'm pretty sure Tella's shot was on target.

If it really was AA's goal, then I am intrigued to know if Tella gets credited with the 'official' assist and, far more importantly, whether it can be classified as a successful pass. From what I can see, it doesn't appear on the pass map above for some reason (i.e. assuming there should be another gold star to denote a goal?).

Certainly, watching in real time, it seems like a Tella goal. In painful slow motion, it clearly deflects off Armstrong. Tella can't claim the goal because it "was on target". If player A takes a shot that's on target, but player B gets the last touch, player B is credited with the goal.

It's hardly fair, but it is technically correct. (actually a case can be made that Dawson would have saved it without the deflection)

[SaintBobby]

18 hours ago, SaintBobby said:

The way we played out the 9 minutes of stoppage time was just fantastic.

Pretty pleased, all in all.

But if we are going to play 433 in this style, I think the CF needs to be a strong player who can hold up the ball and bring others in. They don’t need to be prolific, but they need that strength. AA definitely isn’t that player.

Does anyone think Aribo might fit such a role. Just running this up the flagpole to see if anyone salutes....

[Stud mark of doom]

1 minute ago, SaintBobby said:

Certainly, watching in real time, it seems like a Tella goal. In painful slow motion, it clearly deflects off Armstrong. Tella can't claim the goal because it "was on target". If player A takes a shot that's on target, but player B gets the last touch, player B is credited with the goal.

It's hardly fair, but it is technically correct. (actually a case can be made that Dawson would have saved it without the deflection)

I think people have been confusing the rule for an own goal (was it on target before the defender got a touch) with the general rule (who was the last player to touch it). 
 

A lot of great strikers scored a lot of goals that were going in anyway! 

[Charlie Wayman]

		Team	P	GD	Pts
1		Watford	1	4	3
2		Stoke	1	3	3
3		Plymouth	1	2	3
4		Southampton	1	1	3
5		Blackburn	1	1	3
6		Norwich	1	1	3

[Chez]

21 minutes ago, SaintBobby said:

Does anyone think Aribo might fit such a role. Just running this up the flagpole to see if anyone salutes....

He played up front in the Palace game near the end of the season. He moved about a bit, which was unusual. Never found mind you. Biggest gripe from me was he didn't bust a gut to get on the end of great breakaway. He's not a striker. It's a no from me.

[The Cat]

40 minutes ago, Chez said:

I missed the game (Graceland tour took longer than expected). How did AA play? Did the ball get stuck under his feet or did he look confident?

He tried but a game when the opposition is focused on defending deep isn't going to be one which suits him. 

Would rather have Adams (or someone with a similar style) for those types of game.

[Harry_SFC]

33 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

We’ll put it this way, he has zero votes in the MOTM poll. It was his goal, but he was trying to get out of the way of Tella’s shot and got a brush on it.

Personally I thought he was fairly anonymous, didn’t give enough of a focal point up front, didn’t really get the ball in dangerous areas. Thankfully Adams came on to get the winning goal. Not sure that Armstrong’s best role is up top on his own, on that showing he’s certainly not the answer to our striking woes.

He just doesn't offer enough of a presence to play up top on his own. Constantly dropping deep and never in the six yard box when it's needed. 

Just look at Che's goal. He's in the right place after a little bit of good movement.

[RobJones1971]

3 hours ago, BERMUDASAINT said:

3 fucking points!! Whoohoo. We are TOP OF THE LEAGUE!!!!!

this is not a well liked post, but i agree!

600 useless passes at back. SLOW build up, we get down the wings to pass all the way back? If we had drawn or lost, 900+ record breaking passes would mean fuck all. We almost threw that away with that passive passing.

What i saw in the first 10 min should have gave us confidence to go at that L1 team, we are a PL team with PL players and the difference in class was there to see. That was a team who stood off us, Why practice 1000 passes to bordom. We should have attacked them and scored more. We have single players worth more than their entire team!

I think we have enough talent to go at most of these teams agressively, outscore them, rather than slow build up, contain and retain. But thats not going to happen, so i hope confidence grows and we start attacking more with intent to score more than one goal over the opponent.

 

I am sorry but I really don’t understand this. Did you enjoy the football of the last few years over the style last night? As a new team / style, the players did brilliantly IMO. 
The reason we walked around for the 9 minutes of stoppage time was they were completely shattered from chasing us while we had all the possession and simply could not press us to get the ball back. Recent seasons when we took a narrow lead into stoppage time we all expected to either draw or even lose the game.
While we have possession they can’t lump it forward and get corners / free kicks, where we all recognise is our weakness. 
Only my opinion of course, but I would take this style of football over any of the dross we have served up in recent seasons, albeit in a lower division where we can hopefully use this style of play to be successful. 

[Chez]

28 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

He just doesn't offer enough of a presence to play up top on his own. Constantly dropping deep and never in the six yard box when it's needed. 

Just look at Che's goal. He's in the right place after a little bit of good movement.

That has been a problem. He just does get 'in there'. He doesn't give himself a chance of scoring, especially once he stopped shooting on sight from range. He has to do one or the other. 

So no sign that his confidence has been restored? Without that, he isn't valuable.

[davefizzy14]

Really enjoyed our new style of play last night. Total domination of the ball. Great to start with a victory

[Chez]

23 minutes ago, RobJones1971 said:

I am sorry but I really don’t understand this. Did you enjoy the football of the last few years over the style last night? As a new team / style, the players did brilliantly IMO. 
The reason we walked around for the 9 minutes of stoppage time was they were completely shattered from chasing us while we had all the possession and simply could not press us to get the ball back. Recent seasons when we took a narrow lead into stoppage time we all expected to either draw or even lose the game.
While we have possession they can’t lump it forward and get corners / free kicks, where we all recognise is our weakness. 
Only my opinion of course, but I would take this style of football over any of the dross we have served up in recent seasons, albeit in a lower division where we can hopefully use this style of play to be successful. 

If we had conceded a late goal last night instead of scoring it, and going when we inevitably lose games in the future do you think you will still be content with the style? 

For me, when we have controlled the game, that's when we have given ourselves the best chance of winning games. The press has been effective at times, but we very rarely win on the break. We have to have the ball. The midfield need to be totally on top.

[Dr Who?]

5 hours ago, kitch said:

I know it's risky to say it, but I really enjoyed that last night! Can't remember the last time I enjoyed watching us.

This. I bloody hate watching us on the box, and normally avoid it, but at matches I fine. Last night being the first game of the season and my boy wanting to watch it, so we did. Man it was enjoyable to watch us play like that. We played them last season and were pretty ordinary, but last night we controlled the game, but still nearly only got a point, which would have left many scratching their heads. 

if we can keep hold of the majority and even add a couple, we should have a great season and in the main an enjoyable one. Just need to stick with them if we hit a bad patch. 

[Dr Who?]

1 hour ago, West end Saints said:

Easy winner - Charlie - for me, offers so much more. 

Stu is good to bring on for a surge of energy with his direct runs when we need a goal. But, for me, his overall play is too weak and risky to start (unless play a lot further forward). Even last night he gave the ball away needlessly which led to one of their few attacks. 

 

Having said that in the last Friendlies, and last night he looked quality when he came on

The game was screaming out for Stu to come on, as we were knocking it around, but looked much better in the first half when we were running at them and more direct. Stu came on and we went for it again and nicked the winner. I really like Stu one of my favourite players who will have a storming season if he stays. 

[Streaky]

1 hour ago, Charlie Wayman said:

I thought we played extremely well last night and bearing in mind how little time the players have had to adapt to this new style of football and recalling how slow and ponderous was our passing in the friendly matches only a week ago, the slickness of our game last night was a revelation. Surely things can only get better given stability and practice.

By far our outstanding player was Kyle Walker Peters who was here, there and everywhere giving and taking passes and instinctively being in the right place at the right time to keep things moving. He was instrumental in setting up both our goals and I'm surprised nobody else has mentioned this. A beautiful lay-off to Tella for the first and a highly perceptive defence splitting pass to the running JWP for the second. His partnership with Nathan Tella looks far more than promising on the right. Of the three players most likely to leave from our starting XI it is he KWP that we can least afford to lose on this showing. 

We have quality on the bench and quality in recuperation. Sulemana and ABK are certain starters when fully fit and up to speed and Perraud if he stays is at least as good as Manning and probably a far better left side partner for Edozie. Manning was not effective in working with the young lad last night and often left his left side partner isolated. The idea of Stuart Armstrong & Charley Alcaraz vying for one position is a bit worrying, good luck to Martin on keeping both of them sweet.

Norwich will be a much sterner test. We will have much less time on the ball simply because they will be far less naive about pressing the opposition and closing down their options. 

The irony of last night was that there was only one new recruit in the team from the side that were relegated last month. They weren't then good enough for the PL so if nobody leaves and they get us promoted will they be good enough for the PL next time?

Well no they'll get relegated again lol

[Chez]

4 minutes ago, Dr Who? said:

The game was screaming out for Stu to come on, as we were knocking it around, but looked much better in the first half when we were running at them and more direct. Stu came on and we went for it again and nicked the winner. I really like Stu one of my favourite players who will have a storming season if he stays. 

Would be good to see him back at his best in his final season with us (I presume). Needs to be fully fit and making those lung busting runs breaking between the lines. Like to see him making more third man runs into the box. We need runners without the ball to hurt opponents and he could do that.