Gavin Bazunu

[Polegategavin243]

7 hours ago, chiknsmack said:

1. Unsighted, could've done better but would've been a great save.

2. Free header at the back post, again could've done better/stayed bigger but not his fault.

3. Great shot across him into the side of the net. Not an expert on positioning, but looks borderline unsaveable regardless.

4. Free header loops in just inside the post. My criticism would be what's he doing pushing the opposition player around instead of getting ready to make a save (you're a keeper and there's no VAR; "accidentally" run your studs down his achilles one time and you'll have your six yard box to yourself for the rest of the game), and why does he take a second little hop after the header but before he dives for it? He looks to have slow reactions at times, but I'm not sure if it's actual slow reactions or these extra little hops leaving him too late to make the save.

5. Manning howler leaves a free shot.

6. Manning slips, untracked near post run leaves a tap in.

7. Unsighted, in off the post. Again it looks like slow reactions but I give the benefit of the doubt to the fact he was shifting his weight to the right to try to see around players in front of him.

8. Untracked run back post, great header downwards. Maybe could've done better (save with his foot or rush the player to cut down the angle once he sees there's a free header incoming)?

9. Thick deflection, which is then curling away from him along the ground. Maybe could've done better.

10. Should've saved it; his first and only howler for a goal this season. The presence of a couple of players in his eyeline didn't help, and you can lay the primary blame with Holgate for turning the ball over and then charging out of position (with a dishonourable mention for Downes' defending afterwards) but not good from Bazunu.

11. Great first save after Holgate gifts his man a free header (pushed wide and well away from goal) but can't save a tap in after Holgate has an airswing on the low ball back in. Arguably, after covering the near post in case the ball back in is a shot, he should be quicker to move back across goal when he sees it's not. But that's harsh.

12. Unmarked man (/kid) back post has a largely free header (token effort from a late-arriving Downes, though arguable KWP should've handed off his man) and heads down well. Could've done better, maybe should've been a little more central.

I'd like to see him stay bigger and be more aggressive, and his slow reactions/extra hops before diving don't help him, AND there have been a few poor saves from him which haven't resulted in goals, but there's also been plenty of terrible play in front of him to put him under pressure.

He's not a very good shot stopper, but he's very good in possession. For the way the manager wants to play, that's better than being a good shot stopper who can't pass to save his life. In an ideal world you'd have both, and mixed in with the dross there have been some great saves from Bazunu so maybe in time he'll provide both (certainly for the price paid for him he should do). He's clearly the best keeper on the books and "YHGTI", so while I get the exact opposite feeling when a shot comes in ("Oh no, this is a goal") to the one I used to get before a JWP free kick ("Oh yes, this is a goal") I'll support him because he's the best and only option right now. (Whether he should be or not is another matter.)

This sums it up for me. Even the goal being claimed to be a howler, actually wasn’t. It was a very well hit shot, and he managed to get a hand too, in a very similar way to Onana yesterday against Rice. Sometimes the goalie can get in the way of a shot and it still go in. Look at Patterson’s flukey ricochet in the second half. If this has been Bazunu it would have been called terrible keeping. The modern approach, especially using social media/ forums is to be extremely harsh as the other person cannot see you, when in real life you’d be a little more sensitive to the body language (reaction from the other party). Bazunu is certainly not deliberately making mistakes but is being exposed to far more clear cut chances than most other keepers over the last 15 months. Let’s have a bit of patience and sort out the teams defensive approach and then judge.

[trousers]

7 hours ago, chiknsmack said:

He's not a very good shot stopper, but he's very good in possession. For the way the manager wants to play, that's better than being a good shot stopper who can't pass to save his life. In an ideal world you'd have both

Great overall post @chiknsmack but I'm inclined to disagree with the point you make above...

To me, it's essential, not just "ideal" that a keeper in a team the way we play needs to be a good shot-stopper too. Possession football is naturally high risk and it's therefore inevitable that we'll give the ball away in our final third much more than our opponents... as such, we will have much more 1-on-1s with our keeper than other less possession-obsessed teams will, in addition to more speculative shots from outside the box. It's therefore imperitive that our keeper is a good shot-stopper, otherwise the goals against tally ends up outweighing the benefits of keeping possession of the ball in the first place.

 

Edited 4 September, 2023 by trousers

[FarehamSaintJames]

Bazunu doesn’t fill me with confidence currently but then again not many of the defence do. 
Then I remember it’s a choice between him and Alex McCarthy and suddenly I feel full of confidence. 😁

[Chez]

14 minutes ago, Polegategavin243 said:

This sums it up for me. Even the goal being claimed to be a howler, actually wasn’t. It was a very well hit shot, and he managed to get a hand too, in a very similar way to Onana yesterday against Rice. Sometimes the goalie can get in the way of a shot and it still go in. Look at Patterson’s flukey ricochet in the second half. If this has been Bazunu it would have been called terrible keeping. The modern approach, especially using social media/ forums is to be extremely harsh as the other person cannot see you, when in real life you’d be a little more sensitive to the body language (reaction from the other party). Bazunu is certainly not deliberately making mistakes but is being exposed to far more clear cut chances than most other keepers over the last 15 months. Let’s have a bit of patience and sort out the teams defensive approach and then judge.

I'm with you. I've watched that video several times and I don't see errors or think he could/should have `done better'. For most of them I find myself saying out loud "no chance". Perhaps the third against Sunderland is an error and he could/should have saved it, but I don't see that as some sort of calamitous error - he just doesn't get there. I understand that is the point some are making though - he just doesn't seem to save those shots and that's his job saving stuff. 

That's not to say he hasn't made errors or let shots go in that he should have done a lot better with in the past. I just don't see them in that Championship goals conceded so far video - which is why it annoyed me that much of the focus after the Sunderland defeat was on his performance when it should have been on other players and the manager IMO.

 

[saintant]

1 hour ago, sydney_saint said:

The thing about the resale is that it just don't work for keepers. I understand the model with kids in attacking positions. Tella has one good season in the Championship and he's worth 20m. Lavia a dozen excellent prem matches and he's worth over 50m. If Edozie bags 15 goals this season he will probably be worth 30-40m. People can disagree with the approach (I do to a certain extent, the club should be more than how much we can sell players for) but I can at least see the logic behind it.

With Baz, I don't see the logic. The math isn't mathing. Keepers just don't sell for that much.

I just had a look on Transfermarkt. He is already the 43rd most expensive goalkeeper in history, and would have been in the top 40 when we signed him! To double in value, he would have to be in the top 10 most expensive goalkeepers of all time! The amount we paid isn't a 'project'. That's how much you pay for an established and experienced prem goalkeeper, not some kid who is statistically one of the worst in Europe who has never paid above League One level. The clubs needs to admit it has totally fucked this up. Even IF he turns out good, the reward isn't going to be some massive transfer cheque. It could be decent, but we aren't going to see Lavia type money. And right now he has contributed to us losing premier league status, and could cost us promotion. It's just not worth the perseverance. 

Whichever way you cut it City saw us coming and mugged us off. Not sure who were the ones involved from our club but it was one horrendous piece of business. We should never have paid anything over 5 million at most and that's being generous.

[saintant]

24 minutes ago, Chez said:

I'm with you. I've watched that video several times and I don't see errors or think he could/should have `done better'. For most of them I find myself saying out loud "no chance". Perhaps the third against Sunderland is an error and he could/should have saved it, but I don't see that as some sort of calamitous error - he just doesn't get there. I understand that is the point some are making though - he just doesn't seem to save those shots and that's his job saving stuff. 

That's not to say he hasn't made errors or let shots go in that he should have done a lot better with in the past. I just don't see them in that Championship goals conceded so far video - which is why it annoyed me that much of the focus after the Sunderland defeat was on his performance when it should have been on other players and the manager IMO.

 

We've been having these arguments for over a year now and nothing changes. Therefore those defending Baz must believe zero is being done to bolster the defence in front of him. If and when that happens then presumably the goals against will reduce and errors attributable to Baz will reduce considerably. Currently he is paying the price of playing behind such a crap defence. It's a theory but I'm not convinced.

[OldNick]

I have been very critical of Baz but I think he is being unfairly criticised this time. I would suggest 'untouchables' aka KWP should be looked at, watch again he's nowhere to be seen in some of the goals and as for the fourth he's hardly trotting back into position

[Toussaint]

2 minutes ago, OldNick said:

I have been very critical of Baz but I think he is being unfairly criticised this time. I would suggest 'untouchables' aka KWP should be looked at, watch again he's nowhere to be seen in some of the goals and as for the fourth he's hardly trotting back into position

Had a shocker, defensively. Strolling around throughout. 

[OldNick]

33 minutes ago, saintant said:

We've been having these arguments for over a year now and nothing changes. Therefore those defending Baz must believe zero is being done to bolster the defence in front of him. If and when that happens then presumably the goals against will reduce and errors attributable to Baz will reduce considerably. Currently he is paying the price of playing behind such a crap defence. It's a theory but I'm not convinced.

Well it seems to me hes facing a lot more attempts on goal that he should do. Not closing down crosses is a problem. We just dont have that rugged no nonsense centre half who just gets the ball away. I tire at the opinion a centre half should be silky, no he should get the ball away and let the midfield find the way to get it back, the same goes for keepers, save the ball not worry about the ability to play the perfect pass

[notnowcato]

8 hours ago, chiknsmack said:

1. Unsighted, could've done better but would've been a great save.

2. Free header at the back post, again could've done better/stayed bigger but not his fault.

3. Great shot across him into the side of the net. Not an expert on positioning, but looks borderline unsaveable regardless.

4. Free header loops in just inside the post. My criticism would be what's he doing pushing the opposition player around instead of getting ready to make a save (you're a keeper and there's no VAR; "accidentally" run your studs down his achilles one time and you'll have your six yard box to yourself for the rest of the game), and why does he take a second little hop after the header but before he dives for it? He looks to have slow reactions at times, but I'm not sure if it's actual slow reactions or these extra little hops leaving him too late to make the save.

5. Manning howler leaves a free shot.

6. Manning slips, untracked near post run leaves a tap in.

7. Unsighted, in off the post. Again it looks like slow reactions but I give the benefit of the doubt to the fact he was shifting his weight to the right to try to see around players in front of him.

8. Untracked run back post, great header downwards. Maybe could've done better (save with his foot or rush the player to cut down the angle once he sees there's a free header incoming)?

9. Thick deflection, which is then curling away from him along the ground. Maybe could've done better.

10. Should've saved it; his first and only howler for a goal this season. The presence of a couple of players in his eyeline didn't help, and you can lay the primary blame with Holgate for turning the ball over and then charging out of position (with a dishonourable mention for Downes' defending afterwards) but not good from Bazunu.

11. Great first save after Holgate gifts his man a free header (pushed wide and well away from goal) but can't save a tap in after Holgate has an airswing on the low ball back in. Arguably, after covering the near post in case the ball back in is a shot, he should be quicker to move back across goal when he sees it's not. But that's harsh.

12. Unmarked man (/kid) back post has a largely free header (token effort from a late-arriving Downes, though arguable KWP should've handed off his man) and heads down well. Could've done better, maybe should've been a little more central.

I'd like to see him stay bigger and be more aggressive, and his slow reactions/extra hops before diving don't help him, AND there have been a few poor saves from him which haven't resulted in goals, but there's also been plenty of terrible play in front of him to put him under pressure.

He's not a very good shot stopper, but he's very good in possession. For the way the manager wants to play, that's better than being a good shot stopper who can't pass to save his life. In an ideal world you'd have both, and mixed in with the dross there have been some great saves from Bazunu so maybe in time he'll provide both (certainly for the price paid for him he should do). He's clearly the best keeper on the books and "YHGTI", so while I get the exact opposite feeling when a shot comes in ("Oh no, this is a goal") to the one I used to get before a JWP free kick ("Oh yes, this is a goal") I'll support him because he's the best and only option right now. (Whether he should be or not is another matter.)

I went through every goal conceded this season so far before I saw your post and I have 3 goals conceded where I think he should've done better, 1 where he could've done better.  There were zero goals scored that were his making, he hasn't gifted a goal this season.

I've not seen Lumley play but if it was a choice between Baz and Macca then it's Baz all day long.

Our fucking defending on the other hand is ridiculously bad.  So fucking passive it's a joke.  As a defender you have to be willing to put your body on the line, far too many of our defenders are seemingly incapable of doing this.

[trousers]

38 minutes ago, OldNick said:

Well it seems to me hes facing a lot more attempts on goal that he should do. Not closing down crosses is a problem. We just dont have that rugged no nonsense centre half who just gets the ball away. I tire at the opinion a centre half should be silky, no he should get the ball away and let the midfield find the way to get it back, the same goes for keepers, save the ball not worry about the ability to play the perfect pass

You'll need to get used to it because that's the way we'll be playing for the foreseeable future. Hoofing the ball clear isn't an option (under the SR/Wilcox/Martin philosophy)

[Miltonaggro]

5 hours ago, Turkish said:

Koeman though had an experienced keeper, an experienced Centre back and then brought in quality to play alongside them, Alderwierld and Van Dijk. We've relied on a kid on goal who had never played above league one level and obsession with youth and resale value, rather than bringing in quality and experience in key positions. Attacks win games, defences win titles i believe a great man once said.

Spot on! 

[OldNick]

4 minutes ago, trousers said:

You'll need to get used to it because that's the way we'll be playing for the foreseeable future. Hoofing the ball clear isn't an option (under the SR/Wilcox/Martin philosophy)

I dont want to hoof the ball per say but needs must. A commanding centre half is so important, look at Brighton Dunk and Webster are not what i see as silky centre backs, they fight and win the ball and the rest of the team play the beautiful stuff

[Convict Colony]

I look forward to seeing how Martin addresses this, the defence and more directness in attack, he's got a lot of work on.

[John B]

10 hours ago, chiknsmack said:

1. Unsighted, could've done better but would've been a great save.

2. Free header at the back post, again could've done better/stayed bigger but not his fault.

3. Great shot across him into the side of the net. Not an expert on positioning, but looks borderline unsaveable regardless.

4. Free header loops in just inside the post. My criticism would be what's he doing pushing the opposition player around instead of getting ready to make a save (you're a keeper and there's no VAR; "accidentally" run your studs down his achilles one time and you'll have your six yard box to yourself for the rest of the game), and why does he take a second little hop after the header but before he dives for it? He looks to have slow reactions at times, but I'm not sure if it's actual slow reactions or these extra little hops leaving him too late to make the save.

5. Manning howler leaves a free shot.

6. Manning slips, untracked near post run leaves a tap in.

7. Unsighted, in off the post. Again it looks like slow reactions but I give the benefit of the doubt to the fact he was shifting his weight to the right to try to see around players in front of him.

8. Untracked run back post, great header downwards. Maybe could've done better (save with his foot or rush the player to cut down the angle once he sees there's a free header incoming)?

9. Thick deflection, which is then curling away from him along the ground. Maybe could've done better.

10. Should've saved it; his first and only howler for a goal this season. The presence of a couple of players in his eyeline didn't help, and you can lay the primary blame with Holgate for turning the ball over and then charging out of position (with a dishonourable mention for Downes' defending afterwards) but not good from Bazunu.

11. Great first save after Holgate gifts his man a free header (pushed wide and well away from goal) but can't save a tap in after Holgate has an airswing on the low ball back in. Arguably, after covering the near post in case the ball back in is a shot, he should be quicker to move back across goal when he sees it's not. But that's harsh.

12. Unmarked man (/kid) back post has a largely free header (token effort from a late-arriving Downes, though arguable KWP should've handed off his man) and heads down well. Could've done better, maybe should've been a little more central.

I'd like to see him stay bigger and be more aggressive, and his slow reactions/extra hops before diving don't help him, AND there have been a few poor saves from him which haven't resulted in goals, but there's also been plenty of terrible play in front of him to put him under pressure.

He's not a very good shot stopper, but he's very good in possession. For the way the manager wants to play, that's better than being a good shot stopper who can't pass to save his life. In an ideal world you'd have both, and mixed in with the dross there have been some great saves from Bazunu so maybe in time he'll provide both (certainly for the price paid for him he should do). He's clearly the best keeper on the books and "YHGTI", so while I get the exact opposite feeling when a shot comes in ("Oh no, this is a goal") to the one I used to get before a JWP free kick ("Oh yes, this is a goal") I'll support him because he's the best and only option right now. (Whether he should be or not is another matter.)

So how many points lost by Saints this season been the fault of GB three wins so zero in those games he may have been at fault for one of the goals on Saturday but I am not sure he lost us any points as we were well and truly thumped.

 

So was he directly responsible for any of the goals against Norwich when we dropped two points not sure he was.

 

I do not think it is a good idea to have such a young goalkeeper unless he was exceptional which he is clearly not but he must have something about him to get into the Man City academy.

 

During our other promotions to Div 1 we had in 1966 Campbell Forsyth experienced Scottish International Peter Wells a 22 year old Goalkeeper from Nottm Forest in 1978 and the latest was experienced Kelvin Davies

[saintant]

1 hour ago, OldNick said:

I dont want to hoof the ball per say but needs must. A commanding centre half is so important, look at Brighton Dunk and Webster are not what i see as silky centre backs, they fight and win the ball and the rest of the team play the beautiful stuff

You clearly don't watch Brighton much. Yes Dunk and Webster are no nonsense strong centre backs but they can play or De Zerbi wouldn't be picking them. A lot of Brighton's attacks start with either centre back pinging low, hard and accurate passes into their midfielders who then get on the turn and fore into opposition territory.

[The Cat]

Had sketchy internet while at a festival so could only sporadically load pages to see what was going on.

From what I read I expected to see some horrendous goalkeeping in the highlights when I watched them, but there really wasn't. 

Keepers routinely palm shots back into the penalty area. I've not seen much from this weekend but noticed Ramsdale did it against Man Utd who probably should have scored. When the ball is flying towards you at pace the reaction is to save it in any way. When there's more time it can be palmed more safely to the side.

As posted above, Onana who is a world class keeper, let one in at the near post (another myth that has been busted in an Instagram message I have previously posted by Kasper Schmeichel) he was also made to look silly last week in the 1v1 against Forest.

Largely the goals this season have come about through a few great shots, poor defensive team set up, a lack of midfield covering breaks and some laughable defending.

[Baird of the land]

The way i saw it the 2nd and 3rd goals are the slightly concerning ones that make me query his reaction/movement/positioning. I think other keepers would put themselves in better positions and therefore save them.

The 2nd is standing flat footed for a long distance shot and then can't react when the ball deflects. If the ball is being hit left to right, surely if he was moving that direction he'd have been better placed to react to the deflection.

The 3rd he seems to be unbalanced , meaning he is struggles to shift his weight and get down to his left.

He's certainly not the reason we lost but i don't think the stats are completely lying either. He's going to be our keeper(because he's the only 1 we've got who can play way martin wants with the ball), so hopefully coaching staff can work with him and develop.

[Chez]

It would be interesting to look at (and analyse) an `all the goals conceded' video of a few championship teams just to get an idea of the kind of errors, poor positioning, and instances of could do better etc. for other keepers. I wonder how Baz compares to them.

 

[AlexLaw76]

 

[Dark Munster]

2 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

I look forward to seeing how Martin addresses this, the defence and more directness in attack, he's got a lot of work on.

From his managerial career so far I'm very much doubting that he's capable of addressing it.

[Convict Colony]

9 minutes ago, Dark Munster said:

From his managerial career so far I'm very much doubting that he's capable of addressing it.

Let's not damn the man after 5 games, we have 10 points and something that needs to be worked on during the next 2 weeks, also hopefully some better set pieces to be developed.

Aside from the defending one thing that I still don't like is the walk the ball.around in the final 3rd giving the oppo time to reset, that needs to change either faster passing or execute better in the transition.

 

[Yorkshire Saint]

Andrew Madley was on the treadmill next to me in the gym 30 minutes ago, I praised his brothers performance at Hillsborough 1st game of the season which he seemed pleased to hear. Taking my chance tongue in cheek I asked if he or more likely his brother could give Gavin or Holgate a straight red the next time they officiated a game of ours to give us a 3 game break. He gave me a rather confused look and didn't laugh... the kind of face he knew he couldn't comment. 😅

Edited 4 September, 2023 by Yorkshire Saint

[sledger]

to small,defective positioning,doesnt talk to defenders and making a poor defence into a desperate defence positively the worst keeper in the league and will f+ck us over

[Saint_clark]

10 hours ago, Osvaldorama said:

Just seen on Twitter that he’s statistically second worst this season so far for expected shots conceded. 
 

At least that’s an improvement from last season I guess 

Excellent, only another 19 relegations and we'll have the best keeper in the league. 

[Miltonaggro]

20 hours ago, Osvaldorama said:

Just seen on Twitter that he’s statistically second worst this season so far for expected shots conceded. 
 

At least that’s an improvement from last season I guess 

I think it’s unfair to write him off so early in the season, give him time and he’ll get back to the top spot, three weeks should do it.  #scapegoat 

[Bakovnetski]

23 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

This is the sort of posts i like on here, someone has gone and looked at each of the goals and given a fair reflection of what went wrong rather than building a narrative on 1 player.

Teams concede goals together and from the forwards backwards they all carry blame from not tracking back, missing tackles, giving the ball away etc etc before the ball is even near the goalie.

Its like we expect the goalie to be an un-defeatable robot, they make mistakes.

People keep lauding kasper schemical but he conceded 6 v spurs, 4 v bournemouth etc etc, its never just the goalie.

 

True indeed.  But he does have a Premier League winners medal. Must have been some good performances there over 38 games.

[Jack]

Defences operate far better with a trusted and commanding presence behind them. We haven’t got that. 
 

But he’s not helped by the fact that the defence are full of mistakes too. 

[Midfield_General]

The thing I don’t get about Bazunu is that he’s become this mainstay despite basically never proving himself with us. He’s been at best questionable ever since he joined, yet has become this automatic pick who not only plays every game but also apparently doesn’t need any real competition within the squad. No other player gets that sort of leniency with so little to back it up by way of performances to fall back on - so why does he get a pass? It surely can’t just be because he can knock a competent pass to a full back standing ten yards away. It’s so weird. 

[saintant]

29 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

The thing I don’t get about Bazunu is that he’s become this mainstay despite basically never proving himself with us. He’s been at best questionable ever since he joined, yet has become this automatic pick who not only plays every game but also apparently doesn’t need any real competition within the squad. No other player gets that sort of leniency with so little to back it up by way of performances to fall back on - so why does he get a pass? It surely can’t just be because he can knock a competent pass to a full back standing ten yards away. It’s so weird. 

I think the fact that we paid 12 million for Baz rising to a potential 15 million has a lot to do with why he continues to be our number one.  I'd be inclined to give Lumley a chance - he doesn't fill me with confidence but nor do any of our keepers. Don't think he could do much worse.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, Jack said:

Defences operate far better with a trusted and commanding presence behind them. We haven’t got that. 
 

But he’s not helped by the fact that the defence are full of mistakes too. 

Nothing to do with it. The defence should operate as a cohesive unit no matter who is in goal. 

[petermcpete]

9 minutes ago, saintant said:

I think the fact that we paid 12 million for Baz rising to a potential 15 million has a lot to do with why he continues to be our number one.  I'd be inclined to give Lumley a chance - he doesn't fill me with confidence but nor do any of our keepers. Don't think he could do much worse.

You say that but we've bought a lot of shite in the £10m-£15m range that we've dropped pretty rapidly - Gunn, Hoedt, Boufal, Djenepo, Carillo, Onauchu come to mind. Most of whom had a few games here and there but certainly weren't automatic picks and spent the majority of the time on the bench.

The whole situation is very odd.

[derry]

If I'd have been the keeper behind that walkabout back four I'd have probably laid all four out,  plus at least a couple of our midfielders for just standing and watching. The back four is terrible. Both full backs are 7 & 11 that never get back in time. Bednerek is a dummy that is always looking for excuses. Holgate needs to be cut a little slack playing without acclimatisation. Smallbone, Downes and S Armstrong were self indulgent and only interested in their passing and attacking bits. Where was the get stuck in and covering that was required. We need to get ruthless all over the pitch, we are a team of pussies at the moment.

[Lighthouse]

43 minutes ago, saintant said:

I think the fact that we paid 12 million for Baz rising to a potential 15 million has a lot to do with why he continues to be our number one.  I'd be inclined to give Lumley a chance - he doesn't fill me with confidence but nor do any of our keepers. Don't think he could do much worse.

He continues to be our number one because he is comfortably our best keeper and not the main reason we are conceding so many goals. As for not getting much worse, people said exactly the same about replacing Ralph with Jones. We also said the same about playing McC at the end of last season and he was worse, much worse. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

15 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

He continues to be our number one because he is comfortably our best keeper and not the main reason we are conceding so many goals. As for not getting much worse, people said exactly the same about replacing Ralph with Jones. We also said the same about playing McC at the end of last season and he was worse, much worse. 

He wasn’t “much worse”, thats pretty much impossible.

I keep reading this pony over & over again, as if the back ups being as shite is a defence of him. Nobody will be saying “give Janny B a break because Holgates even worse”will they?  No, they’ll be saying he’s fucking pony.

You mention Jones and one thing that’s 100% certain is,  had Jones brought Baz with him from Luton, you and everyone sticking up for him would have been agreeing how fucking useless he’s been since. 

[Saint Garrett]

If we'd signed him this summer I don't think anyone would be questioning him (yet). But he was pretty awful last season, and he hasn't suddenly got miles better. Watching the goals we've conceded this season so far, a lot of them seem to be a bigger tactical problem with the fullbacks tucking inside, and the wide players not covering fullbacks. The midfield is also not thinking about defending, apart from Charles.  Downes was shocking against Sunderland.  

I don't think anyone would argue with the fact that we needed to get rid of Macca and replace him with someone who can give Baz competition at a minimum, but we seem to have gone and brought in a donkey of a keeper in Lumley, and we know Macca is not the answer, certainly with this way of playing.

My hope is that once we sort out a settled side and sorted the tactical element his performances should improve. He made some decent saves at the weekend. 

We also need to think about how we defend and personnel.  We have this obsession with trying to be the lower league Man City, but we need to learn how to defend like them, i.e. breaking up the play at the other end of the pitch, and note they have Walker who bails them out because of his pace. We have no-one that can do that which is a concern.

Ultimately, I don't think he's had a great start to the season by any means, but IMO the issues are far bigger than having a shit keeper, and not sure a different keeper makes much of a difference if we carry on defending like we do.

[Whitey Grandad]

41 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

He wasn’t “much worse”, thats pretty much impossible.

I keep reading this pony over & over again, as if the back ups being as shite is a defence of him. Nobody will be saying “give Janny B a break because Holgates even worse”will they?  No, they’ll be saying he’s fucking pony.

You mention Jones and one thing that’s 100% certain is,  had Jones brought Baz with him from Luton, you and everyone sticking up for him would have been agreeing how fucking useless he’s been since. 

That's all irrelevant. It wouldn't have mattered who you stuck in goal on Saturday the result would have been very similar. Fix the structure before you start worrying about the cracks.

[Convict Colony]

Deleted as I should of known 2 northerners would not be able to use the correct English to describe a tweet.

Edited 5 September, 2023 by Convict Colony

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

That's all irrelevant. It wouldn't have mattered who you stuck in goal on Saturday the result would have been very similar. 

Don’t be daft. A decent keeper saves the 3rd & the 5th. 
 

That 3rd goal just before half-time killed us stone dead. It changed the course of the second half. Minutes before half time, the talk was all about how important it was for Sunderland to go in with a 2 goal advantage, that they had struggled to hold onto leads & 2-0 is a nervous score line. All of a sudden Baz Ball made it irrelevant & pretty much killed the game. 
 

It’s beyond belief that anybody rates this bloke. He clearly wasn’t good enough last year, and doesn’t look anything other than bang average this. 
 

 

[sledger]

6 hours ago, Bakovnetski said:

True indeed.  But he does have a Premier League winners medal. Must have been some good performances there over 38 games.

yes so good they flogged him,kerching,another average mug sold.Man city must be laughing there heads off,use us to see if there any good,good money if there cra+ and a buy back should they want them back,good business for them

[Lighthouse]

A top level keeper could have saved goals 3 and 5 at Sunderland but they weren’t exactly howlers which trickled between his legs. I would have reasonably expected him to save one of those two, so I guess you could say he held us back from the awe-inspiring 4-0 defeat we were capable of. Or you could say he robbed us of a 3-0 defeat, if you weirdly expect him to make no mistakes whilst those in front of him are dreadful.

The defence was awful, the attackers didn’t trouble their goal and yet it seems to be Baz getting all the flack. It’s just weird, compared to someone like Alcaraz who’s been crap this season, as he was for many games last season, but gets off Scot-free and is hailed as being a class above.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Don’t be daft. A decent keeper saves the 3rd & the 5th. 
 

That 3rd goal just before half-time killed us stone dead. It changed the course of the second half. Minutes before half time, the talk was all about how important it was for Sunderland to go in with a 2 goal advantage, that they had struggled to hold onto leads & 2-0 is a nervous score line. All of a sudden Baz Ball made it irrelevant & pretty much killed the game. 
 

It’s beyond belief that anybody rates this bloke. He clearly wasn’t good enough last year, and doesn’t look anything other than bang average this. 
 

 

Nope. You have unrealistic expectations. 

We all know that you don't like him but he wasn't responsible for that scoreline.

[Lord Duckhunter]

9 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Nope. You have unrealistic expectations. 

We all know that you don't like him but he wasn't responsible for that scoreline.

Unrealistic? If expecting the keeper to make important saves at important moments during a game is unrealistic, then I must be. 
 

Nobody has said he was responsible for the scoreline that’s just a straw man (or straw hands) argument. What people are saying is he’s not good enough and unless he shows significant improvement he will cost us points & he won’t win us any. Saturday was  proof of what some of us have been saying for months. He’s fucking pony, he lets too many goals in & doesn’t make anything other than routine saves. Whether we’re stuck with him or not, that is the case. There really isn’t a debate about his capabilities, he’s bang average  at best. I think we could and should do better. 

Edited 5 September, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[Whitey Grandad]

18 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Unrealistic? If expecting the keeper to make important saves at important moments during a game is unrealistic, then I must be. 
 

Nobody has said he was responsible for the scoreline that’s just a straw man (or straw hands) argument. What people are saying is he’s not good enough and unless he shows significant improvement he will cost us points & he won’t win us any. Saturday was  proof of what some of us have been saying for months. He’s fucking pony, he lets too many goals in & doesn’t make anything other than routine saves. Whether we’re stuck with him or not, that is the case. There really isn’t a debate about his capabilities, he’s bang average  at best. I think we could and should do better. 

But not based on Saturday. Nor the previous games. 

Far more important to sort out the midfield and defence. 

[The Kraken]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

But not based on Saturday. Nor the previous games. 

Far more important to sort out the midfield and defence. 

I don’t think doing one precludes doing the other.

[Crab Lungs]

We will still concede from regulation shots even if we became Tony Pulis miserly.
 

Whilst he’s not been at fault for much so far this season (our chaotic lack of organisation is the main culprit) he’s definitely  not got this imagined ceiling everyone keeps talking about. He’s just bad. That’s it. 

[trousers]

5 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

Deleted as I should of known 2 northerners would not be able to use the correct English to describe a tweet.

*Should have

[Galway saint]

5 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

A top level keeper could have saved goals 3 and 5 at Sunderland but they weren’t exactly howlers which trickled between his legs. I would have reasonably expected him to save one of those two, so I guess you could say he held us back from the awe-inspiring 4-0 defeat we were capable of. Or you could say he robbed us of a 3-0 defeat, if you weirdly expect him to make no mistakes whilst those in front of him are dreadful.

The defence was awful, the attackers didn’t trouble their goal and yet it seems to be Baz getting all the flack. It’s just weird, compared to someone like Alcaraz who’s been crap this season, as he was for many games last season, but gets off Scot-free and is hailed as being a class above.

The thing about Bazanu is he doesn’t make many absolute howlers. It’s more that you’re left with the impression that he often should have done better and sometimes a lot better. Goals 3 and 5 on Saturday are what I would say are classic examples. Even the first goal you question should he have come and cleared out the ball. Away at Leeds and West Ham last year are another two good examples. 

I agree on alcaraz who to my mind flatters to deceive and his Argentine heritage buys him some slack. I’d rather have Armstrong in that 8 role on current form.

[Bakovnetski]

6 hours ago, sledger said:

yes so good they flogged him,kerching,another average mug sold.Man city must be laughing there heads off,use us to see if there any good,good money if there cra+ and a buy back should they want them back,good business for them

And sorry I don’t get your point. I’m not a fan of Bazunu . Anything we can do to get a better GK atm.

Edited 5 September, 2023 by Bakovnetski

[Block41 Saint]

He got very lucky on Saturday when he parried a weak free kick straight to a Sunderland player, the Sunderland player missed the ball on the follow up. This has been a common trait during his time here, he rarely pushes the ball away from danger when he makes a save. Got away with one vs Norwich too for their debatable offside goal in the second half.