Gavin Bazunu

[Lord Duckhunter]

9 minutes ago, The Cat said:

 

All keepers make them, even Ederson and Allisson who are seen as the gold standard for passing out from the back.

The difference is Allisson & Ederson make world class saves that win their sides points and they rarely let soft goals in like the Watford equaliser. They are “great” keepers, Baz is an average one at the moment. We have the ridiculous situation where he performs adequately and some want to over hype it. Still I guess adequate is an improvement on last year. 
 

 

[BARCELONASAINT]

7 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

The difference is Allisson & Ederson make world class saves that win their sides points and they rarely let soft goals in like the Watford equaliser. They are “great” keepers, Baz is an average one at the moment. We have the ridiculous situation where he performs adequately and some want to over hype it. Still I guess adequate is an improvement on last year. 
 

 

We also get the ridiculous situation where a very young goalkeeper learning his trade is regarded as crap by posters like yourself that will only highlight his errors and find it hard to give any praise at all.

He is a very good goalkeeper and we are very fortunate to have him. Certain clubs in the Premiership would not be looking at him if he was crap, they can see the lad has the making of a top goalkeeper.

Get behind him like the crowd did at St Mary's last night after he made that mistake.

There is not a player in our squad that you cannot say at some point has cost us points because of terrible defensive errors or woeful finishing when it was easier to score!

[The Cat]

12 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

The difference is Allisson & Ederson make world class saves that win their sides points and they rarely let soft goals in like the Watford equaliser. They are “great” keepers, Baz is an average one at the moment. We have the ridiculous situation where he performs adequately and some want to over hype it. Still I guess adequate is an improvement on last year. 
 

 

And there's also people who are far too quick to jump on his back when he makes a mistake and do the opposite.

He's a very good young keeper. He will make mistakes, as he improves as a player these will happen less often.

Also, because he's young, he hasn't had as much time as Ederson, Allisson, Pickford or whoever to make these match winning saves, although this season he has definitely contributed to us winning points with his performances.

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 minute ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

 

He is a very good goalkeeper and we are very fortunate to have him. 

 

More hype. 
 

I doubt more than a handful of opposition supporters have come away from the 60 odd games he’s played wishing he was their keeper. The fortunate one is him, because most clubs would have given up on him by now. 

[Harry_SFC]

Not sure he's the best keeper in the league but he's sure as hell not the worst. From what I've seen he's probably still in the top 6 best but until he sorts out the flaw with diving to his left there will be question marks over him. 

Talking about keepers at this level though - Just from our last 3 home games the Plymouth, Swansea and Blackburn ones all looked terrible to me. 

[Lighthouse]

20 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

More hype. 
 

I doubt more than a handful of opposition supporters have come away from the 60 odd games he’s played wishing he was their keeper. The fortunate one is him, because most clubs would have given up on him by now. 

That would depend entirely on whether they were really seeing the big picture of how we play or just want to clap like seals for Hollywood saves. I think some people would prefer to have a keeper who faced eight shots on target last night and threw himself heroically in front of six, rather than Baz.

[Galway saint]

53 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

We also get the ridiculous situation where a very young goalkeeper learning his trade is regarded as crap by posters like yourself that will only highlight his errors and find it hard to give any praise at all.

He is a very good goalkeeper and we are very fortunate to have him. Certain clubs in the Premiership would not be looking at him if he was crap, they can see the lad has the making of a top goalkeeper.

Get behind him like the crowd did at St Mary's last night after he made that mistake.

There is not a player in our squad that you cannot say at some point has cost us points because of terrible defensive errors or woeful finishing when it was easier to score!

i have some difficulty seeing anyone from the premiership is seriously scouting him.

since Huddersfield they would be reporting back that saints have only conceded 4 goals but of those two were his fault and one was arguably where he should have done better. 

mistakes like last night happen to the best keepers so we move on from that but again anyone scouting him over the past 18 months would need their heads examining if they reported back that the club should be signing him.

i don’t see we are very fortunate to have him. the converse really. He’s very fortunate to have a club who have stuck by him and continue to do so.

we’re doing great at the moment and we are far superior to most teams we play so he doesn’t have much to do but if we do go up Baz would be back centre stage with the ball flying at him from all angles and i have my doubts it would be much different to last time 

 

[Saint_clark]

7 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Nobody complained on Tuesday when their keeper missed a kick and let Edozie in.

We've got ourselves into the ridiculous situation where we try to involve our own keeper in more touches of the ball that the opposition’s. This is going to go wrong far too often.

Nobody? I bet their fans did. As we would if our keeper did that.

[derry]

Of all the goalkeepers I've seen in this league he is easily the best when it comes to fitting in to the way we play especially sweeping behind the back four. As our defensive record has improved the better he has been. Manning is a much bigger weakness and McCarthy is totally unsuited to the way we play. For me it was a stupid mistake. Personally I'd put some of the responsibility on the manager because there is a reluctance with all the players to accept that sometimes putting a foot through the ball is the real solution.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, Saint_clark said:

Nobody? I bet their fans did. As we would if our keeper did that.

We all know that opposition fans count for nothing.

[Wade Garrett]

That was a horrible back-pass by Jack Stephens to be fair.

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

That was a horrible back-pass by Jack Stephens to be fair.

True. It explains but doesn’t excuse the error.

It was a symptom of the mindset that in order to keep the ball away from your enemy you have to pass it back to your goalkeeper all the time. Hoofing it downfield is less dangerous.

[Lord Duckhunter]

10 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

That was a horrible back-pass by Jack Stephens to be fair.

I wondered when this nonsense was going to start. He controlled the back pass to his left, he could of then knocked it to Manning (or even banged it up  the left). He turned back onto his right foot, that was the error, dragging it back onto his right & delaying gave the forward the chance, not the back pass. 100% down to him. 

Edited 30 December, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[Saint_clark]

16 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

That was a horrible back-pass by Jack Stephens to be fair.

Nothing wrong with the back pass at all. Bazunu had the ball under control and still had time after that to get rid, so it wasn't a dodgy pass that he struggled to deal with. 

[Wade Garrett]

Just to elaborate on my earlier point, for clarification.  I wasn’t excusing Bazunu, just stating that it was a horrible back pass.

It was a lazy bobbling ball back to the keeper with a forward a few yards away from him.

It was also a fuck-up by the keeper, who should have just got his laces through it and given Stephens a bollocking.

[Convict Colony]

Compared to last season the bro has improved massively especially since he receives the ball way more.  Some of his "saves" have been weak but he is a young keeper and will improve, i think people underestimate how much his passing gives our CBs and wing backs freedom and quickly they forget him forcing last minute goal and saves in some recent games.

Stats so far - not sure how they sort this but he looks like the 5th best keeper so far.

 

[Wade Garrett]

10 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I wondered when this nonsense was going to start. He controlled the back pass to his left, he could of then knocked it to Manning (or even banged it up  the left). He turned back onto his right foot, that was the error, dragging it back onto his right & delaying gave the forward the chance, not the back pass. 100% down to him. 

I’m not disagreeing, but it was a shit ball back to him.

[Weston Super Saint]

13 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

Stats so far - not sure how they sort this but he looks like the 5th best keeper so far.

 

Alphabetically

He's fifth, alphabetically, of all Championship keepers. What a marvellous stat to hold!

Although, arguably, he should be promoted to the heady heights of fourth as Runar Alex Runarsson should technically be in the 'R' section.

Edited 31 December, 2023 by Weston Super Saint

[Holmes_and_Watson]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Alphabetically

He's fifth, alphabetically, of all Championship keepers. What a marvellous stat to hold!

Although, arguably, he should be promoted to the heady heights of fourth as Runar Alex Runarsson should technically be in the 'R' section.

We'll miss him when he develops into Gavin Aardvark, and the big clubs pinch him.

[Convict Colony]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Alphabetically

He's fifth, alphabetically, of all Championship keepers. What a marvellous stat to hold!

Although, arguably, he should be promoted to the heady heights of fourth as Runar Alex Runarsson should technically be in the 'R' section.

hahahaha didnt notice that but the stats look pretty valid

[gio1saints]

Most of SMS have a different pov to some of his long standing critics on here. Most of SMS are chanting his name every game during before and after match end. They recognise his ability & courage and recognise playing this way FDuk ups will occur. They know he is a big talent but also he is effing brave to play this way and that confidence is critical - so our support vital. 
 

I share that view. overreacting to that mistake would be a worse mistake imo.
 

Most of our PB play was very good indeed. Some not so good and 1% bad. That’s life. We are lucky ( should say grateful actually, to players like Baz for having the courage to persist in the face of all the wailing and abuse at SMS early season) we get so much very good almost every match nowadays it’s a privilege to watch and high value for the ticket price - unlike many previous seasons. 
 

Good goalie is Baz, could be great continues this line of progress. 😇

[Colinjb]

15 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

Compared to last season the bro has improved massively especially since he receives the ball way more.  Some of his "saves" have been weak but he is a young keeper and will improve, i think people underestimate how much his passing gives our CBs and wing backs freedom and quickly they forget him forcing last minute goal and saves in some recent games.

Stats so far - not sure how they sort this but he looks like the 5th best keeper so far.

 

The youngest first choice keeper in the league and 5th place amongst his peers. 

In that basis he is doing alright. 

[VectisSaint]

3 minutes ago, Colinjb said:

The youngest first choice keeper in the league and 5th place amongst his peers.

Good job his name isn't Young, he'd be ranked much lower. 😉

[Turkish]

We’ve conceded 3 goals in our last 7 games two of them were Bazunu cock ups. One of them cost us 2 points. He has fuck all to do Friday night aside from collect a few crosses. Same with Swansea, Blackburn and Cardiff games. He’s not the new Mary Earps yet. 

[Huffton]

On 29/12/2023 at 21:36, Whitey Grandad said:

Oh dear.

Too cocky by half. We can only hope that lessons are learnt by everyone involved. At that stage of the game anywhere but there would have been the better choice.

100% this. The whole team were getting far too laid back and cocky at that point, and we got punished for it. Baz will likely shoulder the blame but did he even need to recieve the pass in the first pace? Did we need to put him under that much pressure? Whilst he won't say it publically you can bet RM is fuming about it and put a rocket up the whole team in the dressing room afterwards.

[rallyboy]

The best players are those with the skill and confidence to play out from the back - and the judgement to know when to hoof it into the car park.

Hopefully lessons were learned.

[AlexLaw76]

54 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Most of SMS have a different pov to some of his long standing critics on here. Most of SMS are chanting his name every game during before and after match end. They recognise his ability & courage and recognise playing this way FDuk ups will occur. They know he is a big talent but also he is effing brave to play this way and that confidence is critical - so our support vital. 
 

I share that view. overreacting to that mistake would be a worse mistake imo.
 

Most of our PB play was very good indeed. Some not so good and 1% bad. That’s life. We are lucky ( should say grateful actually, to players like Baz for having the courage to persist in the face of all the wailing and abuse at SMS early season) we get so much very good almost every match nowadays it’s a privilege to watch and high value for the ticket price - unlike many previous seasons. 
 

Good goalie is Baz, could be great continues this line of progress. 😇

As we have established, football fans are horrendously biased for the own team/players.

[Highfield Saint]

6 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

As we have established, football fans are horrendously biased for the own team/players.

Not on here though 

[gio1saints]

1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

As we have established, football fans are horrendously biased for the own team/players.

@AlexLaw76 I don’t think calling baz a good goalie who could be a great goalie if he continues his current trajectory is horrendously biased. Maybe biased but horrendously so. Nah. 🤣. 

If you dont think he’s a good goalie that’s fine but to suggest that having that opinion one must be horrendously biased is a bit ott and suggests you have a very different view of his ability but choose not to say it. Fair enough. 

Im not going to do the research ( unless I really must..) but my gut tells me there are not too many current International goalkeepers of his age. ✅That alone already unbiased and objectively praiseworthy fact. 

Nor are there many starting goalkeepers in this league or the one above of his tender age. again unbiased objective fact  ✅

Let alone keepers asked to play in a style hitherto the domain of outfielders. Ie almost like a sweeper and with plenty more ball touches per match. Again, unbiased objective fact. ✅

Add that he’s been in goal for every minute of the unbeaten run in which he had already made many significant saves ( and scored a last minute equaliser - almost!) and I think suggesting it’s horrendously biased to say he is a good goalie - and could be great - is unwarranted. 

Im sure plenty teams would want Gav as their goalie so let’s enjoy him while he is here ( ok brain fart silly goals aside!) 🤣

Edited 31 December, 2023 by gio1saints

[VectisSaint]

1 hour ago, Huffton said:

100% this. The whole team were getting far too laid back and cocky at that point, and we got punished for it. Baz will likely shoulder the blame but did he even need to recieve the pass in the first pace? Did we need to put him under that much pressure? Whilst he won't say it publically you can bet RM is fuming about it and put a rocket up the whole team in the dressing room afterwards.

But he did say it publicly. He said we lost our positivity and played too many back passses (or words to that effect) post match, but that he wouldn't blame Gav in any way. We do still have a tendency to go defensive at times when we don't need to. Not sure if it's fatigue (mental) that sets in, but it is something we need to cut out. There was also nothing wrong with Jack's pass, Gav had loads of time to deal with it, but we all saw what happened, just one of those moments every player has from time.to time. As it turned out no harm was done, except to GD, but it made forma nervous end to what was otherwise a complete walk in the park.

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, Convict Colony said:

hahahaha didnt notice that but the stats look pretty valid

Sort the table by save% and the landscape changes dramatically...

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

3 hours ago, gio1saints said:

Good goalie is Baz, could be great continues this line of progress. 😇

He's a dodgy keeper and does not inspire confidence. At Watford, the last minute goal. When the guy shot I though 'phew' that's not going in, only to be surprised by the home crowd roar as Bazza proceeded to dive over the ball and let it in. He is slow getting down, especially to his left. 

[Saint_clark]

I will admit and have in the past that I have no doubt Bazunu will be a top keeper, in fact I think he'll reach a level that we wouldn't be able to sign him if we hadn't signed him young. 

But once he gets to that point he'll be off to another side anyway, so why the hell should we spend years developing a keeper, putting up with poor performances and tons of mistakes for the first year or two at least, just to ship him off elsewhere for another club to reap the rewards once he actually reaches that level? 

And then probably start the process all over again with another young keeper who we need to accept will make mistakes consistently for 2-3 seasons.

Edited 31 December, 2023 by Saint_clark

[gio1saints]

1 hour ago, Saint_clark said:

But once he gets to that point he'll be off to another side anyway, so why the hell should we spend years developing a keeper, putting up with poor performances and tons of mistakes for the first year or two at least, just to ship him off elsewhere for another club to reap the rewards once he actually reaches that level? 

And then probably start the process all over again with another young keeper who we need to accept will make mistakes consistently for 2-3 seasons.

Probably, Because we can’t afford a finished article top class goalkeeper with that profile.

And even if we did find a goalie of that calibre would they be prepared to come to SFC?

And even if somehow they fancied it and we were able to afford him they would likely be in their prime or post prime and losing value each year- unlike a young keeper like Baz who ( assuming continues his trajectory of improvement ) gets more valuable each year and especially when and if back in EPL.  
 

Buy and play young talent mix with some experience then sell them after a few years development has pretty much been our model since we been in the EPL. Prefer it was not so I agree with your feeling- but don’t think there’s much we can do about it..

[Saint_clark]

23 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Probably, Because we can’t afford a finished article top class goalkeeper with that profile.

And even if we did find a goalie of that calibre would they be prepared to come to SFC?

And even if somehow they fancied it and we were able to afford him they would likely be in their prime or post prime and losing value each year- unlike a young keeper like Baz who ( assuming continues his trajectory of improvement ) gets more valuable each year and especially when and if back in EPL.  
 

Buy and play young talent mix with some experience then sell them after a few years development has pretty much been our model since we been in the EPL. Prefer it was not so I agree with your feeling- but don’t think there’s much we can do about it..

Young talent mixed with experience is the way to go no doubt, but keeper should always be one of the experienced ones. 

[Patches O Houlihan]

4 hours ago, Huffton said:

100% this. The whole team were getting far too laid back and cocky at that point, and we got punished for it. Baz will likely shoulder the blame but did he even need to recieve the pass in the first pace? Did we need to put him under that much pressure? Whilst he won't say it publically you can bet RM is fuming about it and put a rocket up the whole team in the dressing room afterwards.

RM did publicly give the defence a rocket for having passed to Baz too many times in the last 10 minutes of the match - speaking to Adam Blackmore (BBC)

Here's the link to Convict's table

I'm sure Whitey will be unsurprised to learn that Baz is 5th from last at PSxG+/- 

Edited 31 December, 2023 by Patches O Houlihan
link

[Saint_clark]

20 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

RM did publicly give the defence a rocket for having passed to Baz too many times in the last 10 minutes of the match - speaking to Adam Blackmore (BBC)

Here's the link to Convict's table

I'm sure Whitey will be unsurprised to learn that Baz is 5th from last at PSxG+/- 

He didn't, surely? We've picked a goalkeeper based on his ability to control and pass the ball especially under pressure and he doesn't want his defenders passing to him? 

[Whitey Grandad]

37 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

RM did publicly give the defence a rocket for having passed to Baz too many times in the last 10 minutes of the match - speaking to Adam Blackmore (BBC)

Here's the link to Convict's table

I'm sure Whitey will be unsurprised to learn that Baz is 5th from last at PSxG+/- 

You will also be unsurprised to learn that such figures are total bollocks.

Whatever they are supposed to mean. We are playing football here, not Top Trumps.

[Whitey Grandad]

18 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

He didn't, surely? We've picked a goalkeeper based on his ability to control and pass the ball especially under pressure and he doesn't want his defenders passing to him? 

If he wants passes like that then he’s an idiot. There’s a very old maxim that goes “never pass across your own goal area”

[Saint_clark]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

If he wants passes like that then he’s an idiot. There’s a very old maxim that goes “never pass across your own goal area”

That pass wasn't across the goal area, it was directly to the keeper. 

And if we're going to avoid passing it around the box because of the dangers that presents well then that makes a fucking mockery of carrying on with a keeper who is weak at the traditional basics of keeping but good with his feet.

[Tom & Gerry]

I realise Bazuna is  a marmite keeper, but surely we've heard all the arguments by now. We've conceded a goal, at last, get over it

[pingpong]

On 30/12/2023 at 10:20, Lord Duckhunter said:

The difference is Allisson & Ederson make world class saves that win their sides points and they rarely let soft goals in like the Watford equaliser. They are “great” keepers, Baz is an average one at the moment. We have the ridiculous situation where he performs adequately and some want to over hype it. Still I guess adequate is an improvement on last year. 
 

 

Bazunu save percentage 65.1%

Ederson save percentage 64.7%

 

https://youtube.com/shorts/BLrED-RYGRg?si=ThS9E0HINWECRIjH

 

 

 

[Saint_clark]

4 minutes ago, pingpong said:

Bazunu save percentage 65.1%

Ederson save percentage 64.7%

 

https://youtube.com/shorts/BLrED-RYGRg?si=ThS9E0HINWECRIjH

 

 

 

Bazunu save percentage 65.1% in a league where Adam Armstrong is a prolific goalscorer.

Ederson similar in a league where Kane and Haaland are prolific.

[CanadaSaint]

3 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

Young talent mixed with experience is the way to go no doubt, but keeper should always be one of the experienced ones. 

Can you suggest an "experienced" keeper who is anywhere close to Bazunu for the fundamental element of our (currently very successful) style of playing out from the back?

Sure, it was a big clanger and it could have cost us, but these things happen when the keeper's role is so pivotal in the team's set up.

You might want to stay close to a defibrillator while you're watching because, sooner or later, Bazunu will let one in over his head from forty yards. That's another risk we willingly and knowingly take with out style. The league table, and our unbeaten run, show that we gain far more than we lose from it.

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, CanadaSaint said:

Can you suggest an "experienced" keeper who is anywhere close to Bazunu for the fundamental element of our (currently very successful) style of playing out from the back?

Sure, it was a big clanger and it could have cost us, but these things happen when the keeper's role is so pivotal in the team's set up.

You might want to stay close to a defibrillator while you're watching because, sooner or later, Bazunu will let one in over his head from forty yards. That's another risk we willingly and knowingly take with out style. The league table, and our unbeaten run, show that we gain far more than we lose from it.

We never signed Bazunu with this style though...

[pingpong]

30 minutes ago, Saint_clark said:

Bazunu save percentage 65.1% in a league where Adam Armstrong is a prolific goalscorer.

Ederson similar in a league where Kane and Haaland are prolific.

Ederson plays for the same side as Haaland, and kane plays in the bundesliga. Apart from that, good point.

 

 

[Whitey Grandad]

3 hours ago, Saint_clark said:

That pass wasn't across the goal area, it was directly to the keeper. 

And if we're going to avoid passing it around the box because of the dangers that presents well then that makes a fucking mockery of carrying on with a keeper who is weak at the traditional basics of keeping but good with his feet.

I watched the replay again.

Don’t be such a pedant. 

[Oldandtired]

Ok, question to those waiting to pounce on GB. Name one keeper, now and in the past, average or great,who hasn't made the occasional howler. I'll wait....

 

 

Waiting....

 

 

 

 

 

No,I thought not.

[Bad Wolf]

45 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

Ok, question to those waiting to pounce on GB. Name one keeper, now and in the past, average or great,who hasn't made the occasional howler. I'll wait....

 

 

Waiting....

 

 

 

 

 

No,I thought not.

Tommy Forecast.

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

4 hours ago, Oldandtired said:

Ok, question to those waiting to pounce on GB. Name one keeper, now and in the past, average or great,who hasn't made the occasional howler. I'll wait....

 

 

Waiting....

 

 

 

 

 

No,I thought not.

Occasional is one or twice a season, not one or twice every 5 or 6 games