Israel

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

Yeah understood that bs thanks. What are Hamas? the resistance?

 

58 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Brave freedom fighters. 

You 2 should start a comedy act.

[aintforever]

2 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

People like that know exactly what they're doing when they use that language. Just unfettered jew hate. 

What if the person saying it was Jewish?

[hypochondriac]

45 minutes ago, aintforever said:

What if the person saying it was Jewish?

Can a black person discriminate against another black person due to their skin colour? 

[aintforever]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

Can a black person discriminate against another black person due to their skin colour? 

Of course they can. What’s that got to do with it?

[hypochondriac]

16 minutes ago, aintforever said:

Of course they can. What’s that got to do with it?

So a black person can be racist against another black person even if they are the same ethnicity. 

[aintforever]

11 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

So a black person can be racist against another black person even if they are the same ethnicity. 

This is getting boring now. I thought we were talking about comparing the actions of a country to the Nazis?

I only mentioned it because I read a piece written by a Jew who did exactly that and he explained why. He was so ashamed by the actions of Israel that he made the comparison because he knew how Israelis thought about the holocaust and that the comparison would make them understand how the innocent Palestinians would be feeling.

Or maybe he just hates all Jews?

Edited 9 November, 2023 by aintforever

[whelk]

24 minutes ago, aintforever said:

This is getting boring now. I thought we were talking about comparing the actions of a country to the Nazis?

I only mentioned it because I read a piece written by a Jew who did exactly that and he explained why. He was so ashamed by the actions of Israel that he made the comparison because he knew how Israelis thought about the holocaust and that the comparison would make them understand how the innocent Palestinians would be feeling.

Or maybe he just hates all Jews?

The amount of halfwits misusing word of the moment ‘genocide’ is staggering. And also need for endless holocaust comparisons. As Hypo says just feel free to come out with that you just have a problem with Jews. Tiresome constantly hearing from people just having some super compassion for just some people. Where have their voices been when Jews aren’t involved?

 

[hypochondriac]

13 minutes ago, whelk said:

The amount of halfwits misusing word of the moment ‘genocide’ is staggering. And also need for endless holocaust comparisons. As Hypo says just feel free to come out with that you just have a problem with Jews. Tiresome constantly hearing from people just having some super compassion for just some people. Where have their voices been when Jews aren’t involved?

 

Precisely. You can name dozens of similar conflicts over the past decade and relatively not a peep. As soon as the Jews are involved in something, out come the Holocaust comparisons and thousands marching, sprinkled with veiled and overt chants and threats towards Jews. It's all so predictable and to suggest that the Jewish people aren't held to a different standard by many and that there aren't some people itching to shout about this over anything else is just incorrect. I do have some Jewish friends and I know they feel a similar way it's very sad that they woild feel unsafe in this nations capital. 

[Fan The Flames]

6 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Precisely. You can name dozens of similar conflicts over the past decade and relatively not a peep. As soon as the Jews are involved in something, out come the Holocaust comparisons and thousands marching, sprinkled with veiled and overt chants and threats towards Jews. It's all so predictable and to suggest that the Jewish people aren't held to a different standard by many and that there aren't some people itching to shout about this over anything else is just incorrect. I do have some Jewish friends and I know they feel a similar way it's very sad that they woild feel unsafe in this nations capital. 

You're talking as though jews are involved in many conflicts. There are not, they are involved in one, this one. It's being going on for years, it's very emotive, things are said about one of the perpetrators of the conflict, but not said because of their religion. So wind your neck in calling people on here antisemitic. 

[egg]

2 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

You're talking as though jews are involved in many conflicts. There are not, they are involved in one, this one. It's being going on for years, it's very emotive, things are said about one of the perpetrators of the conflict, but not said because of their religion. So wind your neck in calling people on here antisemitic. 

Thank you. This thread is about Israel, so guess what, Israel and Hamas are the subject. It ain't complicated. 

What it isn't is a thread about Jews, although we have people who laid into SoG about his inadvertent/lazy labelling of Israeli's as Jews, now deliberately labelling Israeli's as Jews in a desperate attempt to show people as anti-Semitic. Ridiculous behaviour. 

[hypochondriac]

8 minutes ago, egg said:

Thank you. This thread is about Israel, so guess what, Israel and Hamas are the subject. It ain't complicated. 

What it isn't is a thread about Jews, although we have people who laid into SoG about his inadvertent/lazy labelling of Israeli's as Jews, now deliberately labelling Israeli's as Jews in a desperate attempt to show people as anti-Semitic. Ridiculous behaviour. 

I'm comfortable with the claim that evoking the Holocaust and concentration camps when discussing Jews or Israelis and not using this language during the discussion of other conflicts is antisemitic. You can wail about it all you want and call it ridiculous but it's transparent behaviour and it's not just confined to this forum. Most of the time these comparisons are accompanied with a knowing smile or a smug laugh. They know what they're doing. You had an MP doing it I nthe radio the other week and getting called out for their odious behaviour and it's over a lot of social media. In some cases they've described Israelis as worse than the Nazis where again the comparison is being made for obvious reasons. 

Edited 10 November, 2023 by hypochondriac

[egg]

4 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I'm comfortable with the claim that evoking the Holocaust and concentration camps when discussing Jews or Israelis and not using this language during the discussion of other conflicts is antisemitic. You can wail about it all you want and call it ridiculous but it's transparent behaviour and it's not just confined to this forum. Most of the time these comparisons are accompanied with a knowing smile or a smug laugh. They know what they're doing. You had an MP doing it I nthe radio the other week and getting called out for their odious behaviour and it's over a lot of social media. In some cases they've described Israelis as worse than the Nazis where again the comparison is being made for obvious reasons. 

Little tip, when replying to people on the forum, don't be tarring with them the anti semitic label if your issue is with an MP or someone on the radio. I suspect that you're bright enough to do that. 

[hypochondriac]

27 minutes ago, egg said:

Little tip, when replying to people on the forum, don't be tarring with them the anti semitic label if your issue is with an MP or someone on the radio. I suspect that you're bright enough to do that. 

Little tip- don't provide unwarranted and patronising "advice" to someone else on a Web forum when you've spent the last few pages calling them naive and ridiculous. 

[sadoldgit]

No surprise. No surprise who will support him on here either.

It has been made very clear that the march will go nowhere near the cenotaph yet these brave boys will be there anyway to defend something that doesn’t need defending.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/far-right-groups-palestine-march-london-b2445029.html

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, sadoldgit said:

No surprise. No surprise who will support him on here either.

It has been made very clear that the march will go nowhere near the cenotaph yet these brave boys will be there anyway to defend something that doesn’t need defending.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/far-right-groups-palestine-march-london-b2445029.html

That is fine. If the far-left march is not going anywhere near the cenotaph, nothing to worry about then

[aintforever]

10 hours ago, whelk said:

The amount of halfwits misusing word of the moment ‘genocide’ is staggering. And also need for endless holocaust comparisons. As Hypo says just feel free to come out with that you just have a problem with Jews. Tiresome constantly hearing from people just having some super compassion for just some people. Where have their voices been when Jews aren’t involved?

 

More people marched to stop the Iraq war and that was nothing to do with Jews, fact is the Israel/Palestine situation has always been a controversial issue here because we helped create it. Plus our government has pledged our support for whatever Israel does so it's bound to encourage protests from people who do not agree. When other Arabs see their people getting killed they see us as partly responsible so if effects us all.

I don't have a problem with any race or religion. All religions are a bunch of fucked up fairy-tales anyway but as long as it doesn't harm me I couldn't give a monkeys what people believe. If you want to label someone as anti-semitic you are barking up the wrong tree with me. My parents brought me up to despise anti-semitism as my Nan only survived the blitz in London because of the kindness of a Jewish family. One of my first jobs was with a Jewish family run business in North London and they were fantastic people. The grandfather was actually a holocaust survivor so I have a good idea of what they have to put up with.

The only problem I have is with what Israel is doing, not everyone in Israel is Jewish and what the government is doing is not even supported by everyone there so it's lazy to just cry anti-semitism.  

 

 

[AlexLaw76]

8 minutes ago, aintforever said:

More people marched to stop the Iraq war and that was nothing to do with Jews, fact is the Israel/Palestine situation has always been a controversial issue here because we helped create it. Plus our government has pledged our support for whatever Israel does so it's bound to encourage protests from people who do not agree. When other Arabs see their people getting killed they see us as partly responsible so if effects us all.

I don't have a problem with any race or religion. All religions are a bunch of fucked up fairy-tales anyway but as long as it doesn't harm me I couldn't give a monkeys what people believe. If you want to label someone as anti-semitic you are barking up the wrong tree with me. My parents brought me up to despise anti-semitism as my Nan only survived the blitz in London because of the kindness of a Jewish family. One of my first jobs was with a Jewish family run business in North London and they were fantastic people. The grandfather was actually a holocaust survivor so I have a good idea of what they have to put up with.

The only problem I have is with what Israel is doing, not everyone in Israel is Jewish and what the government is doing is not even supported by everyone there so it's lazy to just cry anti-semitism.  

 

 

The UK helped do a lot of things around the world that have no relevance to the vast majority of the country. Why does central london need to come to a routine stand-still, with politicians eating themselves over what to say, for something we have no control over.

utter madness, and just shows are a virtuous empty vessel as a nation

Edited 10 November, 2023 by AlexLaw76

[Weston Super Saint]

7 minutes ago, aintforever said:

More people marched to stop the Iraq war

 

 

How did they get on?

[egg]

1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

we helped do a lot of things around the world that have no relevance to the vast majority of the country. Why does central london need to come to a routine stand-still, with politicians eating themselves over what to say, for something we have no control over.

utter madness, and just shows are a virtuous empty vessel as a nation

You ask the wrong (rhetorical) question. The fact is that people are allowed to protest. It doesn't matter if they can't directly control the cause they are protesting for/against. 

[AlexLaw76]

1 minute ago, egg said:

You ask the wrong (rhetorical) question. The fact is that people are allowed to protest. It doesn't matter if they can't directly control the cause they are protesting for/against. 

People are allowed to protest? Who knew!

Constant protesting, causing constant disruption, politicians eating themselves to say what they think is the right thing to win votes..to what end....there is none as we have absolutely no control over it.

[egg]

8 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

People are allowed to protest? Who knew!

Constant protesting, causing constant disruption, politicians eating themselves to say what they think is the right thing to win votes..to what end....there is none as we have absolutely no control over it.

Then why whine about it? 

The purpose is obvious.

The people complaining about the protests seem to be the people quite content to see Israel carry on. People don't have to protest to support that cos it's happening. 

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, egg said:

Then why whine about it? 

The purpose is obvious.

The people complaining about the protests seem to be the people quite content to see Israel carry on. People don't have to protest to support that cos it's happening. 

Not really whining. Just making a pretty valid point that the selective causes to bring central london to a halt, is quite interesting to see, given there is no influence to be had with it. Similarly, watching politicians tie themselves up in knots with words, again over something they have absolutely no influence over, is equally interesting/amusing to watch.

 

[badgerx16]

7 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Not really whining. Just making a pretty valid point that the selective causes to bring central london to a halt, is quite interesting to see, given there is no influence to be had with it. Similarly, watching politicians tie themselves up in knots with words, again over something they have absolutely no influence over, is equally interesting/amusing to watch.

 

As a general point, you can hardly march on Parliament in Leicester or Berwick-on-Tweed. It is central London's problem because that is where the Seat of Power lies.

 

[egg]

Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

Not really whining. Just making a pretty valid point that the selective causes to bring central london to a halt, is quite interesting to see, given there is no influence to be had with it. Similarly, watching politicians tie themselves up in knots with words, again over something they have absolutely no influence over, is equally interesting/amusing to watch.

 

No other cause in recent memory has seen a country (if you can call Gaza that) that carved in two, and the half (where the majority of homes, businesses, schools, university, etc are based) all but completely destroyed. There's also the small fact that the Palestinians have been living under occupation and oppression with the support of the west for years. Lots of people find all of that objectionable. 

Sure, there are loads of other people who are treated appalling in this world, but the protests in support of Palestine/Gaza are legitimate.

What the protests are not is a protest against Jews. The fact that the outrageous behaviour of the Israeli regime is perpetrated by (I'm guessing) exclusively Jewish people, does not remove the Jewish/Israeli distinction.

The protests won't make any difference though, but if people want to, that's up to them.

[hypochondriac]

8 minutes ago, egg said:

No other cause in recent memory has seen a country (if you can call Gaza that) that carved in two, and the half (where the majority of homes, businesses, schools, university, etc are based) all but completely destroyed. There's also the small fact that the Palestinians have been living under occupation and oppression with the support of the west for years. Lots of people find all of that objectionable. 

Sure, there are loads of other people who are treated appalling in this world, but the protests in support of Palestine/Gaza are legitimate.

What the protests are not is a protest against Jews. The fact that the outrageous behaviour of the Israeli regime is perpetrated by (I'm guessing) exclusively Jewish people, does not remove the Jewish/Israeli distinction.

The protests won't make any difference though, but if people want to, that's up to them.

Why is one of the main organisers a former head of Hamas? Why do over half of the organisers have links to Hamas? 

[AlexLaw76]

13 minutes ago, egg said:

No other cause in recent memory has seen a country (if you can call Gaza that) that carved in two, and the half (where the majority of homes, businesses, schools, university, etc are based) all but completely destroyed. There's also the small fact that the Palestinians have been living under occupation and oppression with the support of the west for years. Lots of people find all of that objectionable. 

Sure, there are loads of other people who are treated appalling in this world, but the protests in support of Palestine/Gaza are legitimate.

What the protests are not is a protest against Jews. The fact that the outrageous behaviour of the Israeli regime is perpetrated by (I'm guessing) exclusively Jewish people, does not remove the Jewish/Israeli distinction.

The protests won't make any difference though, but if people want to, that's up to them.

lots of bad things around the world....well, nearly all bad things, happen because of, or in support of, the West.

but Palestine MUST be free...most other causes can get in the bin, it seems

[sadoldgit]

Yesterday Channel 4 news ran a filmed report about a Palestinian guy with special needs. He was with a crowd of people throwing stones at some armed Israelis who were about 70 metres away. They fired a couple of warning shots and the crowd dispersed, apart from this guy. He was now on his own and threw two more stones. You could tell by the way he threw them that he was physically impaired. The stones fell well short of their target. One of the Israelis dropped to his knee and shot him through the neck. He died on the spot.

Yet another senseless killing of a perfectly innocent civilian of which there now have been tens of thousands over the last month, including those killed by Hamas.

People, including many Jewish people, are marching tomorrow, as they have been for the last three weeks, to say enough is enough and are calling to end these atrocities. Why anybody would have a problem with that is down to them but sadly a bunch of far right thugs will see it as an opportunity to give some “snowflakes” a kicking and to prove Braverman (who has been stoking up the hate temperature all week) right.

The vast majority of the marchers are not Hamas supporters nor are they antisemites, they just want the killing to stop on both sides of the conflict and moves to be made to find a peaceful solution to the problem that has been festering for decades.

Suella Braverman doesn’t want that and has been using her position of Home Secretary to stoke up division. Tommy Robinson doesn’t want that and has been using his recently reinstated X account to drum up hate again.

These people clearly want violence to break out on the march on Saturday as it suits their purposes. As has been said several times elsewhere this week, if you can’t march in support of an armistice on Armistice Day, when can you?

The only people who have a problem with this are hate filled far right thugs who hate peace almost as much as they hate Muslims. The same people who say that the march should be banned because Jewish people are afraid to leave their homes, completely ignoring the fact that Muslims have been having the same problems too.

Why is it so difficult for some people to get their head around the concept that it is entirely possible to be sickened by the Hamas atrocities as it is by the constant bombing of Palestinian civilians and not be antisemitic? Well we know why don’t we. When you are losing an argument the default position is to label the other an antisemite and, all of a sudden, you win. As has been said right from the start, there are no people in white hats here. Hamas are the bad guys. Netanyahu and his cronies are the bad guys and the people paying the price are the innocent Israelis and Palestinians who just want to get on with their lives in peace.
 

 

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, sadoldgit said:

Yesterday Channel 4 news ran a filmed report about a Palestinian guy with special needs. He was with a crowd of people throwing stones at some armed Israelis who were about 70 metres away. They fired a couple of warning shots and the crowd dispersed, apart from this guy. He was now on his own and threw two more stones. You could tell by the way he threw them that he was physically impaired. The stones fell well short of their target. One of the Israelis dropped to his knee and shot him through the neck. He died on the spot.

Yet another senseless killing of a perfectly innocent civilian of which there now have been tens of thousands over the last month, including those killed by Hamas.

People, including many Jewish people, are marching tomorrow, as they have been for the last three weeks, to say enough is enough and are calling to end these atrocities. Why anybody would have a problem with that is down to them but sadly a bunch of far right thugs will see it as an opportunity to give some “snowflakes” a kicking and to prove Braverman (who has been stoking up the hate temperature all week) right.

The vast majority of the marchers are not Hamas supporters nor are they antisemites, they just want the killing to stop on both sides of the conflict and moves to be made to find a peaceful solution to the problem that has been festering for decades.

Suella Braverman doesn’t want that and has been using her position of Home Secretary to stoke up division. Tommy Robinson doesn’t want that and has been using his recently reinstated X account to drum up hate again.

These people clearly want violence to break out on the march on Saturday as it suits their purposes. As has been said several times elsewhere this week, if you can’t march in support of an armistice on Armistice Day, when can you?

The only people who have a problem with this are hate filled far right thugs who hate peace almost as much as they hate Muslims. The same people who say that the march should be banned because Jewish people are afraid to leave their homes, completely ignoring the fact that Muslims have been having the same problems too.

Why is it so difficult for some people to get their head around the concept that it is entirely possible to be sickened by the Hamas atrocities as it is by the constant bombing of Palestinian civilians and not be antisemitic? Well we know why don’t we. When you are losing an argument the default position is to label the other an antisemite and, all of a sudden, you win. As has been said right from the start, there are no people in white hats here. Hamas are the bad guys. Netanyahu and his cronies are the bad guys and the people paying the price are the innocent Israelis and Palestinians who just want to get on with their lives in peace.
 

 

A march organised by someone who was (or still is) linked to Hamas is purely peaceful (whilst demanding jihad in large numbers)

Anyone else who turns up, is there for a ruck...

 

righto

[egg]

4 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

lots of bad things around the world....well, nearly all bad things, happen because of, or in support of, the West.

but Palestine MUST be free...most other causes can get in the bin, it seems

Whataboutery. Other causes deserve attention/action. That they're not doesn't prevent attention/action for this one. 

[egg]

2 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

A march organised by someone who was (or still is) linked to Hamas is purely peaceful (whilst demanding jihad in large numbers)

Anyone else who turns up, is there for a ruck...

 

righto

But presumably you agree with everything else SoG typed? 

[egg]

15 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Why is one of the main organisers a former head of Hamas? Why do over half of the organisers have links to Hamas? 

How the fuck do I know. Anyways, there's no point trying to discuss anything with someone who gets confused by anything he doesn't agree with. 

[AlexLaw76]

22 minutes ago, egg said:

Whataboutery. Other causes deserve attention/action. That they're not doesn't prevent attention/action for this one. 

Not whataboutery at all. Clearly, some lives are worth more protesting about.

[AlexLaw76]

20 minutes ago, egg said:

But presumably you agree with everything else SoG typed? 

Not particularly. I rarely agree with anything he says, as his masked as slipped many times on here with evident xenophobia and racism, and is not the sort of person I want to side with.

[egg]

1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Not whataboutery at all. Clearly, some lives are worth more protesting about.

I think it's the sheer scale of this in the context of the size of Gaza, the wider Israel/Palestine issue, and the extent of the media coverage. 

Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

Not particularly. I rarely agree with anything he says, as his masked as slipped many times on here with evident xenophobia and racism, and is not the sort of person I want to side with.

There's been too much focus on posters, not the posts. That doesn't make for healthy discussion. 

[Sheaf Saint]

2 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

I'm comfortable with the claim that evoking the Holocaust and concentration camps when discussing Jews or Israelis and not using this language during the discussion of other conflicts is antisemitic. You can wail about it all you want and call it ridiculous but it's transparent behaviour and it's not just confined to this forum. Most of the time these comparisons are accompanied with a knowing smile or a smug laugh. They know what they're doing. You had an MP doing it I nthe radio the other week and getting called out for their odious behaviour and it's over a lot of social media. In some cases they've described Israelis as worse than the Nazis where again the comparison is being made for obvious reasons. 

Hypo - for as many years as I can remember, you've been posting dog-whistle Islamophobia on here and vehemently denying it when challenged. And yet, in your mind, anybody who doesn't share your view on this issue must by default be a Jew hating antisemite, and you flat out refuse to retract that when presented with clear explanations why that isn't the case.

Spectacular double standards on your part, I must say.

[whelk]

36 minutes ago, egg said:

How the fuck do I know. Anyways, there's no point trying to discuss anything with someone who gets confused by anything he doesn't agree with. 

The point is you want to make it about a march for peace. The deputy of the march organiser has since deleted a tweet that basically said he supported 7/10 and Israel got what they deserved. Screaming abuse at kids going to McDonald’s shows exactly what many on the march will be about and it ain’t  love peace and harmony and living side by side

 

Edited 10 November, 2023 by whelk

[egg]

Just now, whelk said:

The point is you want to make it about a march for peace. The deputy of the march organiser has since deleted a tweet that basically said supported 7/10 and Israel got what they deserved. Screaming abuse at kids going to McDonald’s shows exactly what many on the march will be about and it ain’t about love peace and harmony and living side by side

 

There'll be a loon fringe for sure with their own warped agenda's,but that doesn't alter the motivation of the vast majority of people going. The met have assessed it properly and come up with what I think is the right decision. Hopefully the idiots are kept in check. 

[whelk]

46 minutes ago, egg said:

But presumably you agree with everything else SoG typed? 

On these matters SOG just takes a naive view of how peace is achieved. Even his comment about an innocent civilian throwing stones at soldiers. If one of the stones knocked a soldier unconscious what do you think the mob would do if he was captured? War is always horrendous and enemies get de-humanised. Just wishing it wouldn’t happen is probably everyone’s view but not any sort of solution.

Bit of a trite analogy but…..if your neighbour decided to kill one of your family sadistically, boast about it and say he will do it again when he next gets the chance what would your reaction be? As said everyone knows Israeli reactions are normally disproportionate so stretching that analogy further, what would your neighbour think will happen to his family if he knew you were a Mafia godfather?

Edited 10 November, 2023 by whelk

[harvey]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

There'll be a loon fringe for sure with their own warped agenda's,but that doesn't alter the motivation of the vast majority of people going. The met have assessed it properly and come up with what I think is the right decision. Hopefully the idiots are kept in check. 

This weekend could change the whole fabric of society in this country if the met are wrong.

[whelk]

1 minute ago, harvey said:

This weekend could change the whole fabric of society in this country if the met are wrong.

I think people are getting a bit worked up and doesn’t look like the march has any sort of agenda to cause trouble. Timing is very insensitive IMO but getting too much publicity and comment. Actually agree with SOG that some will be hop8ng for trouble to suit their cause.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

Why is one of the main organisers a former head of Hamas? Why do over half of the organisers have links to Hamas? 

Certainly brings more clarity to the chant of "from the river to the sea"....

[whelk]

55 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

The only people who have a problem with this are hate filled far right thugs who hate peace almost as much as they hate Muslims.

Here you go again. Only people who disagree with your opinion are as above. Seeing through the pompous verbosity,  this is basically your argument on most subjects 

[egg]

9 minutes ago, whelk said:

I think people are getting a bit worked up and doesn’t look like the march has any sort of agenda to cause trouble. Timing is very insensitive IMO but getting too much publicity and comment. Actually agree with SOG that some will be hop8ng for trouble to suit their cause.

On the insensitive part, I was speaking with someone this week. Ex forces and suffering acute PTSD from horrific events in Afghanistan. This time of year is horrendous for him - loud noises from fireworks evoke awful memories , and trigger his PTSD. Remembrance is massive for him as it's a time for him to recall (and to some extent re-live) the impact of his military service on his life and family, the loss of his friends and comrade, as well as those gone before whilst serving their nation.

Understandably he considers remembrance a special day, and that it's disrespectful for it to be diluted.

Listening to him, and feeling his pain, has changed my perspective on the sensitivity issue. 

 

Edited 10 November, 2023 by egg

[hypochondriac]

57 minutes ago, egg said:

How the fuck do I know. Anyways, there's no point trying to discuss anything with someone who gets confused by anything he doesn't agree with. 

It's just that you made a very bold claim about what the protests were about. I'd be concerned that a majority of those organising the march would have different views to yours about what these marches are about given their links to Hamas. 

[egg]

5 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It's just that you made a very bold claim about what the protests were about. I'd be concerned that a majority of those organising the march would have different views to yours about what these marches are about given their links to Hamas. 

You're getting confused by the motivation of the majority, and of the loon element. As Whelk says "I think people are getting a bit worked up and doesn’t look like the march has any sort of agenda to cause trouble". 

Edited 10 November, 2023 by egg

[hypochondriac]

31 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Hypo - for as many years as I can remember, you've been posting dog-whistle Islamophobia on here and vehemently denying it when challenged. And yet, in your mind, anybody who doesn't share your view on this issue must by default be a Jew hating antisemite, and you flat out refuse to retract that when presented with clear explanations why that isn't the case.

Spectacular double standards on your part, I must say.

That's a complete misrepresentation of my view. I don't think that people who don't share my view are jew hating antisemites. I disagree with almost everything egg has said on this thread but I don't consider him to be antisemitic and I have never said so. Why would I retract something that I have never claimed or said? 

I don't actually know what dog whistle islamaphobia is, that's the kind of nonsense term you'd hear on Owen Jones' social media pages. If you've got some examples of something you consider to be islamaphobic then we can discuss it. Otherwise you're just attempting to baselessly smear me because you disagree with my opinion. 

[hypochondriac]

Just now, egg said:

You're getting confused by the motivation of the majority, and of the loon element. As Whelk says "I think people are getting a bit worked up and doesn’t look like the march has any sort of agenda to cause trouble". 

So the majority of organisers with links to Hamas are the loon element? Interesting. 

[egg]

Just now, hypochondriac said:

That's a complete misrepresentation of my view. I don't think that people who don't share my view are jew hating antisemites. I disagree with almost everything egg has said on this thread but I don't consider him to be antisemitic and I have never said so. Why would I retract something that I have never claimed or said? 

I don't actually know what dog whistle islamaphobia is, that's the kind of nonsense term you'd hear on Owen Jones' social media pages. If you've got some examples of something you consider to be islamaphobic then we can discuss it. Otherwise you're just attempting to baselessly smear me because you disagree with my opinion. 

You cannot possibly try to argue that you've chosen to substitute the word Jews with Israelis to support arguments, and at best implied that people are anti semitic.

Using your own test for anti semitism, it's easy to see how you could attract the islamaphobic tag. For clarity, I'm not labelling you islamaphobic, but I can see why others may do so, particularly given the standards that you use to assess anti semitism. 

In short, if you don't want to be slapped, stop swinging. 

[egg]

9 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

So the majority of organisers with links to Hamas are the loon element? Interesting. 

Hypo, you're being a bit daft, or thick, or obtuse. I'm not wasting my day going round in ever decreasing circles with you.

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, egg said:

You cannot possibly try to argue that you've chosen to substitute the word Jews with Israelis to support arguments, and at best implied that people are anti semitic.

Using your own test for anti semitism, it's easy to see how you could attract the islamaphobic tag. For clarity, I'm not labelling you islamaphobic, but I can see why others may do so, particularly given the standards that you use to assess anti semitism. 

In short, if you don't want to be slapped, stop swinging. 

It's quite simple what I believe. If you erroneously invoke words like holocaust or concentration camp to conflicts involving Israel or Jews and you don't do that for other conflicts then you're at best looking to be provocative and in my view you're antisemitic. Simple really.