Russell Martin

[Harry_SFC]

  On 25/10/2023 at 21:26, West end Saints said:

We are 5th?

I am not 100% convinced but find it quite amusing how negative people are on here about him. 

I was gutted when we went behind, telling the TV we would never equalise and having a good moan then. 

But he as at least turned the bad run of 4 defeats into 5 unbeaten, and 4 points from last two away games. 

He ain't that bad! 

 

 

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Unless you're Leicester or Ipswich then I wouldn't take anything from the table at this stage. Sunderland were 4th a few games ago, now they are mid table. 

[Fabrice29]

Are you lot not bored of new managers yet? What about the last 3 new ones excite you so much that you want another one? Maybe let onr play out for a bit and come back to this next year. Have some chill time from stressing out about managers ffs 

[notnowcato]

Those moaning about the manager clearly missed the JW message that the style is here to stay, whether it be RM or someone else. 
Our performance tonight didn’t deserve a point tonight but we deserved more than 1 point from Rotherham. 

[Fabrice29]

  On 25/10/2023 at 21:45, Harry_SFC said:

Unless you're Leicester or Ipswich then I wouldn't take anything from the table at this stage. Sunderland were 4th a few games ago, now they are mid table. 

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League table at this stage is all posturing. Worry about it later. I’d include Ipswich in that too.

[Tamesaint]

  On 25/10/2023 at 20:12, AlexLaw76 said:

This season is going as expected. 

Flat track bullies. The quality of player is what is largely doing if for us, against bottom half teams. 1 win against a team in the top 10 at the time of writing

 

Oh, we have the worst defence in the division

Russell Martin's RAWA!!!

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Worst defence in the division? Blimey. If only you had told us this before.

Oh I see that you did ...quite a few times.

[West end Saints]

Just because I was interested, not to prove anything either way, 

The final top 6 teams after their first 13 games last season:

Burnley 3rd 22 points 

Sheff U 1st 24

Luton 12th 17

Middlesborough 15th 16

Coventry 13th 17

Sunderland 5th 20

 

We are 5th with 21.

So more points than any of play off teams had. 1 point off where champions were, 3 off where second were (who then lost a couple) 

 

 

[Tamesaint]

  On 25/10/2023 at 21:56, Fabrice29 said:

Are you lot not bored of new managers yet? What about the last 3 new ones excite you so much that you want another one? Maybe let onr play out for a bit and come back to this next year. Have some chill time from stressing out about managers ffs 

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Oi. Stop it. There is no need to be sensible and logical on the Saintsweb. We want our 5th manager in the last 12 months and the pitchforks are ready.

[Osvaldorama]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:17, Tamesaint said:

Oi. Stop it. There is no need to be sensible and logical on the Saintsweb. We want our 5th manager in the last 12 months and the pitchforks are ready.

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I don’t want another manager change either. It is painful for the club & players to keep swapping manager. 
 

But Martin isn’t cutting it so far. Bad performance after bad performance, being bailed out by the PL quality players that we retained. 
 

He probably still deserves a bit more time but I hope he is under some pressure internally. Performances are not good enough. 

[Fabrice29]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:29, Osvaldorama said:

I don’t want another manager change either. It is painful for the club & players to keep swapping manager. 
 

But Martin isn’t cutting it so far. Bad performance after bad performance, being bailed out by the PL quality players that we retained. 
 

He probably still deserves a bit more time but I hope he is under some pressure internally. Performances are not good enough. 

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Go on…

[JRM]

we were warned by Swansea fans about Martins inability to defend, one positive this season has been a few quid each game on both teams to score , banker 

[Maggie May]

Can anyone compare every season RM has been a manager to this point right now with us? I’m talking game games played, wins, draws, defeats, losses. 
 

Interesting that Burnley were just a point ahead of us this time last season compared to what a jizzy job everyone thinks they did to win the league last season.

[Dark Munster]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:29, Osvaldorama said:

He probably still deserves a bit more time but I hope he is under some pressure internally. Performances are not good enough. 

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That would be nice, but I doubt it. Lego's tippy tap, crab, propaganda football is exactly what RA and JW love. Those deluded morons honestly think that with that crap they are creating a new Man City. 

Ankersen after watching RM's Powerpoint presentation a few days ago.

[Dark Munster]

  On 25/10/2023 at 21:37, Winnersaint said:

Is it Martin out again? Wasn’t Martin out on Saturday was it?

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No, it was Martin out since Sunderland, or certainly Leicester. Do keep up.

Apart from the first half against Leeds, when tippy tappy crab Martinball was temporarily abandoned due to 4 successive appalling performances, it's gone back to his normal hopeless tactics and style, with last minute goals papering over the cracks.

Imagine this season if we had Ipswich's manager and they had Lego. Do you think Ipswich would be 10 points clear of us, with a game in hand? A very good chance it would be the other way around.

[Saint_clark]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:05, West end Saints said:

Just because I was interested, not to prove anything either way, 

The final top 6 teams after their first 13 games last season:

Burnley 3rd 22 points 

Sheff U 1st 24

Luton 12th 17

Middlesborough 15th 16

Coventry 13th 17

Sunderland 5th 20

 

We are 5th with 21.

So more points than any of play off teams had. 1 point off where champions were, 3 off where second were (who then lost a couple) 

 

 

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This sounds good until you realise there are 9 teams this season with 20 or more points and the top two both have more than 30. 

We're not competing with last season's teams, we're competing with this season's who are clearly at a higher level. 

[Pilchards]

Can’t understand why we didn’t try to win last nights game which on paper is much harder than Birmingham.

Those 5 players came in were mostly fucking shit. I know he said injuries but if you’re on the bench then you are fit to play.

Should have gone all out against a frail team lacking confidence with no points in the last 4 and then shut the shop up and put these squad players on to defend what you had.

[CB Fry]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:05, West end Saints said:

Just because I was interested, not to prove anything either way, 

The final top 6 teams after their first 13 games last season:

Burnley 3rd 22 points 

Sheff U 1st 24

Luton 12th 17

Middlesborough 15th 16

Coventry 13th 17

Sunderland 5th 20

 

We are 5th with 21.

So more points than any of play off teams had. 1 point off where champions were, 3 off where second were (who then lost a couple) 

 

 

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I notice you skillfully avoided mentioning the team that was 5th with 21 points after 13 games last season - Queens Park Rangers.

I don't think anyone us saying we can't make the play offs. It's highly likely, but any team from about 17th up can go on a run to the play offs, big deal.

After 13 games Burnley had lost once. Once. We've already lost four in a fucking row. After 13 games Burnley had conceded 12. We've conceded double. We conceded 12 in September alone.

Give it up on the "we're just like Burnley" routine. We're not. The foundations are don't concede and don't lose. Martin is pretty incapable of sending a team out to achieve the first, which is why we've lost more than Burnley did all season already.

 

Edited 26 October, 2023 by CB Fry

[West end Saints]

  On 25/10/2023 at 22:05, West end Saints said:

Just because I was interested, not to prove anything either way, 

The final top 6 teams after their first 13 games last season:

Burnley 3rd 22 points 

Sheff U 1st 24

Luton 12th 17

Middlesborough 15th 16

Coventry 13th 17

Sunderland 5th 20

 

We are 5th with 21.

So more points than any of play off teams had. 1 point off where champions were, 3 off where second were (who then lost a couple) 

 

 

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  On 26/10/2023 at 05:56, CB Fry said:

I notice you skillfully avoided mentioning the team that was 5th with 21 points after 13 games last season - Queens Park Rangers.

I don't think anyone us saying we can't make the play offs. It's highly likely, but any team from about 17th up can go on a run to the play offs, big deal.

After 13 games Burnley had lost once. Once. We've already lost four in a fucking row. After 13 games Burnley had conceded 12. We've conceded double. We conceded 12 in September alone.

Give it up on the "we're just like Burnley" routine. We're not. The foundations are don't concede and don't lose. Martin is pretty incapable of sending a team out to achieve the first, which is why we've lost more than Burnley did all season already.

 

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Strange post. 

Ignored qpr not due to skill but they were irrelevant to what I was curious about. 

We are not, and I would be very surprised if we improve this season into a team close to Burnley of last season. So I don't need to give anything up. Although if did hold that view doubt a Victor meldew rant would change my view! 

We aren't doing great. We had a terrible run of 4 games but before/after that we are doing OK. RM will be here all season, relax and enjoy the ride of good football mixed with some silly weak defensive play! 

[CB Fry]

  On 26/10/2023 at 06:24, West end Saints said:

 

Strange post. 

Ignored qpr not due to skill but they were irrelevant to what I was curious about. 

We are not, and I would be very surprised if we improve this season into a team close to Burnley of last season. So I don't need to give anything up. Although if did hold that view doubt a Victor meldew rant would change my view! 

We aren't doing great. We had a terrible run of 4 games but before/after that we are doing OK. RM will be here all season, relax and enjoy the ride of good football mixed with some silly weak defensive play! 

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Let me know when the "good football" starts, cheers 👍

[Sunglasses Ron]

Not sure if posted already, but we’d be eight points worse off and in 21st place in the league without the last ditch goals against Sheffield Wednesday, Norwich, Plymouth, Hull and Preston.

Great resilience, but worrying that so many of our points have been salvaged this way.

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 26/10/2023 at 06:58, Sunglasses Ron said:

Not sure if posted already, but we’d be eight points worse off and in 21st place in the league without the last ditch goals against Sheffield Wednesday, Norwich, Plymouth, Hull and Preston.

Great resilience, but worrying that so many of our points have been salvaged this way.

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Play to the whistle...

[Sunglasses Ron]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:03, Weston Super Saint said:

Play to the whistle...

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Indeed.

It’s a great quality, one that serves all the best teams well, but it would be nice to win a game comfortably for once (we haven’t won a league game by a two goal margin in nearly two years).

[Weston Super Saint]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:06, Sunglasses Ron said:

Indeed.

It’s a great quality, one that serves all the best teams well, but it would be nice to win a game comfortably for once (we haven’t won a league game by a two goal margin in nearly two years).

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At one point we hadn't won a league game at all for nearly a year....

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 06:58, Sunglasses Ron said:

Not sure if posted already, but we’d be eight points worse off and in 21st place in the league without the last ditch goals against Sheffield Wednesday, Norwich, Plymouth, Hull and Preston.

Great resilience, but worrying that so many of our points have been salvaged this way.

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6 points. 
 

The Wednesday game we played keep ball for the 10 minutes of injury time. 

Edited 26 October, 2023 by notnowcato

[Fabrice29]

  On 26/10/2023 at 04:08, Pilchards said:

Can’t understand why we didn’t try to win last nights game which on paper is much harder than Birmingham.

Those 5 players came in were mostly fucking shit. I know he said injuries but if you’re on the bench then you are fit to play.

Should have gone all out against a frail team lacking confidence with no points in the last 4 and then shut the shop up and put these squad players on to defend what you had.

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Football is so easy when you know how. This lad on the internet has cracked it. 

[Sunglasses Ron]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:25, notnowcato said:

6 points. 
 

The Wednesday game we played keep ball for the 10 minutes of injury time. 

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Fair point. That was a very enjoyable 10 minutes.

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 06:42, CB Fry said:

Let me know when the "good football" starts, cheers 👍

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Leeds.  

It's a matter of opinion.  I like the passing, keep possession game, others don't.  Whatever floats your boat

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:33, Fabrice29 said:

Football is so easy when you know how. This lad on the internet has cracked it. 

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Disagree.  Football is easy when you can time travel and adjust something which will obviously (I'm being facetious) make things better.

[Whitey Grandad]

  On 26/10/2023 at 08:06, notnowcato said:

Leeds.  

It's a matter of opinion.  I like the passing, keep possession game, others don't.  Whatever floats your boat

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That’s not what I call football. That’s just kicking the ball around. There’s no purpose in it.

[SambaMaverick]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:06, Sunglasses Ron said:

Indeed.

It’s a great quality, one that serves all the best teams well, but it would be nice to win a game comfortably for once (we haven’t won a league game by a two goal margin in nearly two years).

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We did beat Leeds 3-1 tbf, but I definitely take your point

[ErwinK1961]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:06, Sunglasses Ron said:

Indeed.

It’s a great quality, one that serves all the best teams well, but it would be nice to win a game comfortably for once (we haven’t won a league game by a two goal margin in nearly two years).

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Did you miss the Leeds game?

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 08:33, Whitey Grandad said:

That’s not what I call football. That’s just kicking the ball around. There’s no purpose in it.

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As I said, it's a matter of opinion

[saintant]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:33, Fabrice29 said:

Football is so easy when you know how. This lad on the internet has cracked it. 

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It's certainly easier than RM is making it look.

[egg]

  On 26/10/2023 at 08:08, notnowcato said:

Disagree.  Football is easy when you can time travel and adjust something which will obviously (I'm being facetious) make things better.

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How about learning from the previous game, then making tweaks and improving? 

[saintant]

RM continues to hide behind the excuse that his system is very difficult to learn. My view is that he doesn't know how to teach it. He's like a maths tutor trying to teach art - he doesn't know what he's doing. If not why is progress so slow as to be almost non-existent? I see no signs that we are playing possession football other than the simple sideways and backwards passing which boosts the stats.  Anyone can teach that. What I don't see is all the finer points that together are the drivers for well-drilled possession football making it effective and entertaining. The knock-on effect of not having these components in place is what we are witnessing - a clumsy attempt to keep the ball which leads to frequent loss of possession in dangerous areas and hence the high number of goals we are conceding.  

[Fabrice29]

  On 26/10/2023 at 09:18, saintant said:

It's certainly easier than RM is making it look.

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I’m yet to see any evidence to suggest this squad can make football be easy but hey, if everyone keeps saying it then it’s probably true.

[saintant]

  On 26/10/2023 at 09:54, Fabrice29 said:

I’m yet to see any evidence to suggest this squad can make football be easy but hey, if everyone keeps saying it then it’s probably true.

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I didn't say easy I said easier - two different meanings.

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 09:26, egg said:

How about learning from the previous game, then making tweaks and improving? 

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Are we not doing this?

Last night was not as good a performance as Hull or Rotherham or Stoke or Leeds but overall October has been significantly better than September, there's also a good chance November will be better than October.

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 09:37, saintant said:

RM continues to hide behind the excuse that his system is very difficult to learn.

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I've not seen any post match stuff from RM so not sure if he "continues to hide behind the excuse" as you put it.  I could be wrong but I also don't remember it being said in any pre match stuff.

[egg]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:12, notnowcato said:

Are we not doing this?

Last night was not as good a performance as Hull or Rotherham or Stoke or Leeds but overall October has been significantly better than September, there's also a good chance November will be better than October.

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It was a response to your "we ain't got a time machine" comment. We have hindsight after games, and the opportunity to fix it. What improvement did you see last night? 

[trousers]

  On 26/10/2023 at 06:42, CB Fry said:

Let me know when the "good football" starts, cheers 👍

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  On 26/10/2023 at 08:06, notnowcato said:

Leeds.  

 

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Not sure if I can wait until the last game of the season

[saintant]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:15, notnowcato said:

I've not seen any post match stuff from RM so not sure if he "continues to hide behind the excuse" as you put it.  I could be wrong but I also don't remember it being said in any pre match stuff.

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Nor do I but in the absence of hearing anything different my point stands.

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:17, egg said:

It was a response to your "we ain't got a time machine" comment. We have hindsight after games, and the opportunity to fix it. What improvement did you see last night? 

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You've talked about hindsight and tweaks.  What hindsight did you garner from Hull?  What tweaks should we have made for PNE?  What tweaks should we have made that weren't implemented?  

Are you expecting improvement to be a straight line graph to perfection?  

[egg]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:25, notnowcato said:

You've talked about hindsight and tweaks.  What hindsight did you garner from Hull?  What tweaks should we have made for PNE?  What tweaks should we have made that weren't implemented?  

Are you expecting improvement to be a straight line graph to perfection?  

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So you swerve a question that addresses your own point. Not terribly helpful if you want a discussion, or expect people to listen to your point.

I'll ask again. What improvements in our performance and / or tactics did you see last night? 

[trousers]

  On 26/10/2023 at 07:06, Sunglasses Ron said:

We haven’t won a league game by a two goal margin in nearly two years

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  On 26/10/2023 at 09:01, ErwinK1961 said:

Did you miss the Leeds game?

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The one game this season where RM ditched the 'keep ball' philosophy and played more direct tactics, in particular in the first half...? Maybe it was just a coincidence that that was our best winning margin of the season so far...

Edited 26 October, 2023 by trousers

[notnowcato]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:44, egg said:

So you swerve a question that addresses your own point. Not terribly helpful if you want a discussion, or expect people to listen to your point.

I'll ask again. What improvements in our performance and / or tactics did you see last night? 

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For the record, m'lud, you swerve straight forward questions like: "Are we not doing this?" and "Do you expect improvement to be a straight line graph to perfection?" but yeah preach away whilst avoiding questions thrown back at your points, on us not using hindsight and tweaks blah blah - like you have some inner knowledge of the workings of the manager and the backroom staff.  I've acknowledged we've had better performances in October than last night.  Give your Dimbleby-like questioning a rest or enlighten me with your deep knowledge of the game.

 

[Toussaint]

  On 26/10/2023 at 10:44, egg said:

So you swerve a question that addresses your own point. Not terribly helpful if you want a discussion, or expect people to listen to your point.

I'll ask again. What improvements in our performance and / or tactics did you see last night? 

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The full pitch pivot, where the GK became the CF, Russ is a tactical genius. 

[Toussaint]

  On 25/10/2023 at 21:57, notnowcato said:

Those moaning about the manager clearly missed the JW message that the style is here to stay, whether it be RM or someone else. 
Our performance tonight didn’t deserve a point tonight but we deserved more than 1 point from Rotherham. 

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If it helps the situation I am more than happy to say bye bye to JW and Rasmus.  

[egg]

  On 26/10/2023 at 11:04, notnowcato said:

For the record, m'lud, you swerve straight forward questions like: "Are we not doing this?" and "Do you expect improvement to be a straight line graph to perfection?" but yeah preach away whilst avoiding questions thrown back at your points, on us not using hindsight and tweaks blah blah - like you have some inner knowledge of the workings of the manager and the backroom staff.  I've acknowledged we've had better performances in October than last night.  Give your Dimbleby-like questioning a rest or enlighten me with your deep knowledge of the game.

 

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That's a long winded way of saying that you didn't see any improvements either. Thanks. 

[bangkoksaint]

We've some talented players which are being wasted IMHO. I've been to numerous games this season and it's dire. We're currently in the PO positions inspite of and not because of RM. Two moments of 'magic' last night, the rest of it was awful. Look at where Stoke are in the league, I think may be us in a couple of seasons - bereft of any decent players and just a mid table Championship side. It's this season or not at all and I am not sure that RM is the man to take us back to the promiosed land.

[Dark Munster]

  On 26/10/2023 at 11:27, Toussaint said:

If it helps the situation I am more than happy to say bye bye to JW and Rasmus.  

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I’d be more than happy. Unfortunately Dragan seems incapable of seeing through their bullshit.