Russell Martin

[Lord Duckhunter]

11 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

The vibe at the ground yesterday when he was clapped down the tunnel by the Itchen?

Fucking hell, some of our nods would clap Kim Jong Un down the tunnel if he was our manager. 
 

 

[Fabrice29]

13 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Ok, an opinion then. You're entitled to it, as are others who believe that Martin’s approach and the player recruitment set-up we have will never be effective.

Except for last season but yeah.

[Wade Garrett]

21 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Himself? The vibe at the ground yesterday when he was clapped down the tunnel by the Itchen? The fact that he's clearly got the support of the players, especially important ones? The fact that nobody would want to take over before City anyway? The fact that every decision taken at the club right now seems to be a long term plan and doing something so rash at the very top of that would send a completely different message out across the club? Maybe I'm wrong though, maybe there is a magic man out there who can fit in nicely and deliver immediate results for on paper the worst team in the league last time we were in it and the worst team that got promoted last season too. Maybe we should ask BBC sport website, MOTD, the Saintsweb forum and the papers for their recommendations on who that is like someone else suggested earlier.

I’m in the Itchen and nobody around me clapped the fucking idiot.

Great long term plan as well.  Make us easy to beat , don’t change a thing, and get relegated.

Fucking hell.  You’re defending the indefensible.

Edited October 20 by Wade Garrett

[Oldandtired]

14 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

The one managerial appointment that has worked under SR has been Martin.

 

I’d have a different take on that. It worked when we had that unbeaten run, not winning run but unbeaten run, granted. Then other managers did what they are paid to do and worked out how easy it was to play against us, changed tactics against us,and so the unbeaten run came to an end. 

Martin did not, would not change anything, mediocrity resumed and so we stumbled into the playoffs on the back of that run where we won the lottery. since then he has been found out in pretty much every way possible, ineptitude, arrogance when questioned, tactical naivety, no understanding of when and what substitutions to bring on, etc.

I don’t think even an RM fanboy such as yourself can deny that, they are facts, not opinions. One point from eight games proves the point in my opinion. He has been found out fair and square.
 

If you call that a working managerial appointment you must come from a different planet to me.

Edited October 20 by Oldandtired

[Fabrice29]

9 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

I’d have a different take on that. It worked when we had that unbeaten run, not winning run but unbeaten run, granted. Then other managers did what they are paid to do and worked out how easy it was to play against us, changed tactics against us,and so the unbeaten run came to an end. 

Martin did not, would not change anything, mediocrity resumed and so we stumbled into the playoffs where we won the lottery. since then he has been found out in pretty much every way possible, ineptitude, arrogance when questioned, tactical naivety, no understanding of when and what substitutions to bring on, etc.

I don’t think even an RM fanboy such as yourself can deny that, they are facts, not opinions. One point from eight games proves the point in my opinion. He has been found out fair and square.
 

If you call that a working managerial appointment you must come from a different planet to me.

He literally delivered the minimum objective he was asked to last season. So yeah, I call that a working managerial appointment. 

As for this season, the PL is the toughest league in the world and he's had 8 games as a manager in it. I don't think it's fair to judge him on that alone (just as I didn't for Jones btw so I'm not a RM fan boy). I don't mind the mistakes, I'd much rather our experienced PL players took some of the brunt rather than a manager who has earnt some credit in the bank and is finding his way under intense pressure, a squad that he has tried to improve but is new and at a club which has been poor in the PL for a long time before he came along. I said before this season, you 100% can start badly in this league and still stay up. We are 3 points off Ipswich who also haven't won a game and level with them if we had closed down a ball on the edge of the box properly, those are the fine margins. They also have a new manager finding their way but presumably doesn't have a weird online fan base after his head. Maybe they do, maybe they and you are right. Or maybe not everything you are feeling right now has to be so definitive and final.

Edited October 20 by Fabrice29

[StrangelyBrown]

8 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Ralph was sacked because he'd lost the dressing room completely and quite rightly so like you said. Jones had seemingly pissed almost everyone off in the ground and Selles was very much told he wasn't going to be our manager for any significant time after a short period. None of them worked. The one managerial appointment that has worked under SR has been Martin.

Anyway, we have different approaches on how we would do things, which is fine. I'd much rather we tried to make this work than change in hope. The guy who delivered success with this club last year feels like a good option to me but then again maybe I'm wrong and there's someone who can deliver success out there and maybe we'll find them and maybe they'll turn our defence which includes players who have played under 4 different managers now but still barely keep clean sheets into quality players at this level. Who knows.

I'm genuinely interested in what you think is going to change that is going to make it worth persisting with RM?

[saintant]

20 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Ralph was sacked because he'd lost the dressing room completely and quite rightly so like you said. Jones had seemingly pissed almost everyone off in the ground and Selles was very much told he wasn't going to be our manager for any significant time after a short period. None of them worked. The one managerial appointment that has worked under SR has been Martin.

Anyway, we have different approaches on how we would do things, which is fine. I'd much rather we tried to make this work than change in hope. The guy who delivered success with this club last year feels like a good option to me but then again maybe I'm wrong and there's someone who can deliver success out there and maybe we'll find them and maybe they'll turn our defence which includes players who have played under 4 different managers now but still barely keep clean sheets into quality players at this level. Who knows.

You're comparing apples with oranges - the guy who had some success last season was operating in the Championship which is clearly the ceiling for his ability.

[Saint Gifford]

2 hours ago, Morse said:

Does anyone really trust SR to get a new managerial appointment right even if they do sack RM? Bevcause their track record of managerial appointments is beyond bad, and their pool to choose from gets smaller with every defeat. 

Correct. I am struggling to think of a realistic alternative. Not the talk of Potter ect, just a genuine replacement.

 I’m guessing it would be someone that Dragan would have more of a say in.

So are we going experienced unknown European. Probably now our best bet. 

[Galway saint]

We score .75 goals a game and concede 2.25 goals game 

I wonder if there is any team in the football league where the gap is as wide as this. 

I think our forward recruitment was poor but he is a terrible defensive coach and on these numbers we are on to concede nearly 100 goals this season.

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, Galway saint said:

We score .75 goals a game and concede 2.25 goals game 

I wonder if there is any team in the football league where the gap is as wide as this. 

I think our forward recruitment was poor but he is a terrible defensive coach and on these numbers we are on to concede nearly 100 goals this season.

Have also given away possession in our own 3rd (or Defensive 3rd) considerably more than anyone else in the league. 

[Saint NL]

I refreshed the page and there were 20+ new posts in a short space of time, so I think it must be happening..... Sadly not 

[Fabrice29]

2 minutes ago, StrangelyBrown said:

I'm genuinely interested in what you think is going to change that is going to make it worth persisting with RM?

The same stuff I saw last season, a team that is invested in it's manager and the way of playing. Our most exciting players are Fernandes and Dibling and are excelling because of the manager rather than despite him. Yes, there are things that could be done better but I'm not into judging the manager by the results this season, I guess this is where we all differ. We are fully expected to finish bottom, we did last time we were here and we came up from the play offs so the results were always going to be bad. I don't think there is a magic way of doing things that guarantees us safety so as long as I see a team of players invested in what they are being asked to do then I think that's a good thing. It was the complete opposite at the end under Ralph for example.

1 minute ago, saintant said:

You're comparing apples with oranges - the guy who had some success last season was operating in the Championship which is clearly the ceiling for his ability.

 This time last year his ceiling was the mid table in the Championship. It's almost as if that's not a thing. Managing a football team is about managing people and getting the best out of them. It's my opinion that aside from Lallana and Ramsdale we have a squad of players who have yet to prove themselves capable of winning games in the PL on a regular basis, so I'm not really expecting that to happen tbh.

[AlexLaw76]

2 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

T

 This time last year his ceiling was the mid table in the Championship. It's almost as if that's not a thing. Managing a football team is about managing people and getting the best out of them. It's my opinion that aside from Lallana and Ramsdale we have a squad of players who have yet to prove themselves capable of winning games in the PL on a regular basis, so I'm not really expecting that to happen tbh.

Mate, the man is a very average manager

Edited October 20 by AlexLaw76

[Fabrice29]

3 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Mate, this is just pure horse shit

  Okay.

On 30/10/2023 at 16:33, AlexLaw76 said:

what about floating around the bottom half of the championship?

 

[Graffito]

56 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Fucking hell, some of our nods would clap Kim Jong Un down the tunnel if he was our manager. 
 

 

I can think of a few posters I’d like to clap down a tunnel.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

24 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Our most exciting players are Fernandes and Dibling and are excelling because of the manager rather than despite him.

These exiciting players won't be here next season if we get relegated. Or do you think they are going to stay in the Championship because of Martin? 

[Fabrice29]

Just now, Lee On Solent Saint said:

These exiciting players won't be here next season if we get relegated. Or do you think they are going to stay in the Championship because of Martin? 

No, obviously not. They wont stay here long even if we stay up and neither will Martin tbh.

[coalman]

18 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

This time last year his ceiling was the mid table in the Championship. It's almost as if that's not a thing. Managing a football team is about managing people and getting the best out of them. It's my opinion that aside from Lallana and Ramsdale we have a squad of players who have yet to prove themselves capable of winning games in the PL on a regular basis, so I'm not really expecting that to happen tbh.

How is he getting the best out of players? What have you seen or heard him do that has made our players better?

If he inherited a squad that was recently in the Premier League I don't get why his ceiling was mid table in the Championship. Getting to the playoffs should've been a bare minimum - at which point it's a bit of a crapshoot.

[derry]

3 hours ago, Miltonaggro said:

When he is sacked it will be telling when and where he gets picked back up. Anticipate a similar situation with Martin as Jones. Start back in league 1 with three million in the bank, maybe MK Dons fancy a reunion. 

Don't sack him! Just do everybody a favour send him on gardening leave and pay him and his staff weekly/monthly for the contracted term or until he gives up and moves somewhere else.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

Just now, Fabrice29 said:

No, obviously not. They wont stay here long even if we stay up and neither will Martin tbh.

But if your saying Martin is making them better players, why would they want to leave? If the players love Martin so much, why would anyone of them want to leave? Your painting Martin to look like some kind of footballing god/genius. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

1 hour ago, Fabrice29 said:

I think if the players want to stop looking bad they should probably stop throwing points away in the last minute of games first especially before blaming the guy that led them to the PL last season, which some of this squad completely ballsed up the year before that as well.

The only reason we throw points away in the last seconds of injury time is because tactially we aren't set up right. Defending set pieces, especially corners this season as been pathetic. The blame lies squarely with Martin when it comes to tactial set up. You have to be on the wind up if you think any differently.

[Fabrice29]

5 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

The only reason we throw points away in the last seconds of injury time is because tactially we aren't set up right. Defending set pieces, especially corners this season as been pathetic. The blame lies squarely with Martin when it comes to tactial set up. You have to be on the wind up if you think any differently.

You have to be on the wind up if you think that leaving 3 guys on the edge of the box in the last minute yesterday is because that is how the manager has set them up. 6 corners yesterday they had, don't remember that happening until the last one and it doesn't happen because Martin sees the first 5 and barks orders at them to leave them free. So yeah, I think differently. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

51 minutes ago, saintant said:

You're comparing apples with oranges - the guy who had some success last season was operating in the Championship which is clearly the ceiling for his ability.

Nathan Jones got Luton to the play offs, so getting Southampton into them, is hardly managerial miracle of the decade. 
 

With the fixtures we’ve had & the way they played out a half decent top flight manager would probably be sat on 7 points now. 1 was bare minimum against 10 men Newcastle, 2 nil up home to Leicester should have bagged 3 points & Ipswich home. Being kind, maybe the Leicester could have been 2-2, but a decent manager may have pinched a point off forest or Utd. So we’re looking at 5 or 6 points as being par imo. Not insurmountable on paper, but the manner of the defeats, the tactics and team selections, together with an unwillingness to even accept his “process” is wrong, means we need to give someone else the chance before it’s too late. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

2 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

You have to be on the wind up if you think that leaving 3 guys on the edge of the box in the last minute yesterday is because that is how the manager has set them up. 6 corners yesterday they had, don't remember that happening until the last one and it doesn't happen because Martin sees the first 5 and barks orders at them to leave them free. So yeah, I think differently. 

So, you can hear what Martin says can you? From the touchline? 

[saintant]

3 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

You have to be on the wind up if you think that leaving 3 guys on the edge of the box in the last minute yesterday is because that is how the manager has set them up. 6 corners yesterday they had, don't remember that happening until the last one and it doesn't happen because Martin sees the first 5 and barks orders at them to leave them free. So yeah, I think differently. 

It has happened before so,on that basis, you can't possibly exonerate the manager. Yes, players take some blame but they have clearly not been drilled enough or they wouldn't repeat the mistake.

[AlexLaw76]

2 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Nathan Jones got Luton to the play offs, so getting Southampton into them, is hardly managerial miracle of the decade. 
 

With the fixtures we’ve had & the way they played out a half decent top flight manager would probably be sat on 7 points now. 1 was bare minimum against 10 men Newcastle, 2 nil up home to Leicester should have bagged 3 points & Ipswich home. Being kind, maybe the Leicester could have been 2-2, but a decent manager may have pinched a point off forest or Utd. So we’re looking at 5 or 6 points as being par imo. Not insurmountable on paper, but the manner of the defeats, the tactics and team selections, together with an unwillingness to even accept his “process” is wrong, means we need to give someone else the chance before it’s too late. 

Do you remember when he set us up with our 2x forwards 60 yards apart on each wing. Or when we went to Bournemouth with Dibbling as our CF

😂

Edited October 20 by AlexLaw76

[Saint Gifford]

I hate to say it, I really do. But time to move on from British coaches. 

Not the individuals fault just the corrupt FA making a fortune from their Pro licence badges. 

That’s unfortunately why we have ended up with a German in charge of the National team. 
 

Without exception all English managers can not adapt these days, precisely what the FA DNA and pathway are teaching them. 
 

It’s 10s of thousands of pounds to get a pro licence with the FA, and about a decent weekend away on the IOW with pretty much every other European nation. 
 

I am a very proud Englishman, but when it comes to football management and coaching we are F?!’ed. 
 

 

 

 

[Wade Garrett]

1 hour ago, Fabrice29 said:

The same stuff I saw last season, a team that is invested in it's manager and the way of playing. Our most exciting players are Fernandes and Dibling and are excelling because of the manager rather than despite him. Yes, there are things that could be done better but I'm not into judging the manager by the results this season, I guess this is where we all differ. We are fully expected to finish bottom, we did last time we were here and we came up from the play offs so the results were always going to be bad. I don't think there is a magic way of doing things that guarantees us safety so as long as I see a team of players invested in what they are being asked to do then I think that's a good thing. It was the complete opposite at the end under Ralph for example.

 This time last year his ceiling was the mid table in the Championship. It's almost as if that's not a thing. Managing a football team is about managing people and getting the best out of them. It's my opinion that aside from Lallana and Ramsdale we have a squad of players who have yet to prove themselves capable of winning games in the PL on a regular basis, so I'm not really expecting that to happen tbh.

He rates Fernandes that much, he subbed him for Will fucking Smallbone yesterday.

Genius move, fucking wanker.

[Roo1976]

1 hour ago, StrangelyBrown said:

I'm genuinely interested in what you think is going to change that is going to make it worth persisting with RM?

cause we certainly cant bloody defend...................68 odd goals against us in the championship last season ,Christ knows how many this with the inept coaching of the team to do the basics right and fucking defend,that's down to RM who it has to be said was himself a defender albeit in a Norwich team that was bang average.

[Miltonaggro]

4 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

I cannot wait to see how the next manager handles the scar tissue left over from a Martin team...!

Moyes would likely sort it out in three morning sessions to be honest. 

[Costa del Solent]

36 minutes ago, Saint Gifford said:

 

That’s unfortunately why we have ended up with a German in charge of the National team. 
 

Wait until you find out about the royal family 

[CB Fry]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

I think if the players want to stop looking bad they should probably stop throwing points away in the last minute of games first especially before blaming the guy that led them to the PL last season, which some of this squad completely ballsed up the year before that as well.

Good things happen: all thanks to Russell Martin.

Bad things happen: Russell Martin is blameless.

[Bad Wolf]

15 minutes ago, Costa del Solent said:

Wait until you find out about the royal family 

Don't really get this attitude. I don't care one way or the other but The King's great great great grandad was German? Isn't that it?

[Give it to Ron]

1 hour ago, Fabrice29 said:

You have to be on the wind up if you think that leaving 3 guys on the edge of the box in the last minute yesterday is because that is how the manager has set them up. 6 corners yesterday they had, don't remember that happening until the last one and it doesn't happen because Martin sees the first 5 and barks orders at them to leave them free. So yeah, I think differently. 

There were 3 occasions that Leicester had player on the D unmarked from a corner in first half right in front of me.
After the game he called out a player not doing his job so either they have stopped listening or he hasn’t coached that enough but guess poor Russ is blameless again.

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

I think if the players want to stop looking bad they should probably stop throwing points away in the last minute of games first especially before blaming the guy that led them to the PL last season, which some of this squad completely ballsed up the year before that as well.

Are the players following orders or ignoring Russ's tactical coaching when defending corners ? Did the players demand that Fraser be brought on as left back ahead of Taylor, or did Russ make that call ? Do the players feel happier with Smallbone on the pitch or is it Russell that said that ?

[Wade Garrett]

6 minutes ago, Give it to Ron said:

There were 3 occasions that Leicester had player on the D unmarked from a corner in first half right in front of me.
After the game he called out a player not doing his job so either they have stopped listening or he hasn’t coached that enough but guess poor Russ is blameless again.

He’s full of shit.  Noticed that as well.

[Miltonaggro]

1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Do you remember when he set us up with our 2x forwards 60 yards apart on each wing. Or when we went to Bournemouth with Dibbling as our CF

😂

No good reminiscing about the good times now! 

[badgerx16]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

Except for last season but yeah.

Finishing fourth with the third best squad.

[badgerx16]

28 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

Don't really get this attitude. I don't care one way or the other but The King's great great great grandad was German? Isn't that it?

The King's father was half Greek, of German extraction ( House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glucksburg ) on his father's side, and half German. The Royal family had to change their family name to Windsor during WW1 because 'Battenburg" was too German, which is also why his uncle was called Mountbatten.

Going back to 'German' George the First, there are more Germans than any other nationality in the King's lineage.

 

Edited October 20 by badgerx16

[Mr X]

Place your bets Will they announce he's gone tonight?

Or will he get the vote of confidence from our football expert owners? 😂

On a side note Lucy pinder is clearly to blame for all of this 😉

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Do you remember when he set us up with our 2x forwards 60 yards apart on each wing. Or when we went to Bournemouth with Dibbling as our CF

😂

nothing wrong with the tactics, they were perfect it was the players not doing their jobs again.

[Turkish]

5 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Place your bets Will they announce he's gone tonight?

Or will he get the vote of confidence from our football expert owners? 😂

On a side note Lucy pinder is clearly to blame for all of this 😉

after last season success Ramus will be loving the fact he's failed this season as this will mean he's more likely to be a success in the future.

[Forester]

I haven’t changed my mind from the last post I made on this after the Bournemouth game.  He did a good job getting us up, the style of play is attractive, but in my opinion we are nailed on to go down if we stick with him.

My argument for pulling the trigger back then was that a new manager could have had the international break and been in place to manage these three crucial games against Leicester, Everton and Wolves.  We didn’t do that, and we have now wasted another winnable game.  Leave it much longer and the list of possible replacements will shrink by the week.

Incredible as it seems, we are still only one win away from being outside of the drop zone, and there are three other teams yet to win a game.  So it literally cannot be “hopeless” if we make a change, while still remaining tough.  Last season was the first that it was possible mathematically to stay up on 30 points and it may be that low this season.  We may need to win eight game along with half a dozen draws.  Let’s not give up.

[Farmer Saint]

33 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Finishing fourth with the third best squad.

But beating the best squad when it mattered most.

[Farmer Saint]

Looks like Steve Cooper will be relieved of his job soon regardless of yesterday's win - I know he was very high on a lot of your lists before the season/at the end of last season - should we be looking at him when Martin gets sacked?

Edited October 20 by Farmer Saint

[stknowle]

5 hours ago, Harry_SFC said:

Tbf we made a better start under Ralph than we have this season. In fact a much better start. It really would be near on impossible not to improve us this season. 

Well……..if anyone is capable of finding someone to do that its Ras and co.

Edited October 20 by stknowle

[BotleySaint]

15 minutes ago, Forester said:

I haven’t changed my mind from the last post I made on this after the Bournemouth game.  He did a good job getting us up, the style of play is attractive, but in my opinion we are nailed on to go down if we stick with him.

I'd love to be wrong but that's the issue for me. His recent tactics and subs have actually caused us to lose games we could have got points from. If that keeps going we've got no hope.

Needs a new manager to come in and flush out picking of favourites and restart relationships with any out of favour players.

Edited October 20 by BotleySaint

[derry]

For Leicester's third goal we had 9 outfield players in the goal area marking 6 Leicester players. Two Leicester players were unmarked on the edge of the area. A repeat of the Ipswich game except we had 10 players then. The ball was just passed to the free players ond one of them shot the goal. Possibly Ramsdale didn't even see it until late. 

That defending was hopeless. Our backing off passively in the second half where we are leading is a joke. Smallbone came on and didn't lay a boot on the ball or the opposition just backed off and floated around. Our lack of physical pressing was a disgrace. Onuachu battled well when he came on. Fraser had no idea he had to get close and Manning just didn't bother trying to get to the line and cut the winger off inside Fraser. Only Taylor tried to do that. Martin is obviously incapable of coaching disciplined defence or organise physical pressing. The obsessive passing is an excuse to do neither. He's been well and truly found wanting. The management lacking decisiveness and just sitting on their hands hoping isn't helping. Just stand him down on gardening leave and honour his three year contract.

[Saint Marky]

7 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Looks like Steve Cooper will be relieved of his job soon regardless of yesterday's win - I know he was very high on a lot of your lists before the season/at the end of last season - should we be looking at him when Martin gets sacked?

Don’t know, why don’t you ask your Brighton season- ticket holding farm hands’ opinions ? I know you hold them in such high regard.

[benali-shorts]

9 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Looks like Steve Cooper will be relieved of his job soon regardless of yesterday's win - I know he was very high on a lot of your lists before the season/at the end of last season - should we be looking at him when Martin gets sacked?

What’s the criteria? If it’s pragmatism; developing young players; decent Prem record; would realistically join us - then yes I would. The pool won’t be large.