Russell Martin

[Turkish]

1 minute ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

10 goals in our last 10 games is another way of looking at it. Only Leicester, West Brom and Cardiff have conceded less

We’ve conceded less than second place Ipswich and the same as Leeds in our last 1 game

[Ex Lion Tamer]

We remain top of the form table over the past 6 games

[Block41 Saint]

Just now, Ex Lion Tamer said:

10 goals in our last 10 games is another way of looking at it. Only Leicester, West Brom and Cardiff have conceded less

Only two clean sheets though. 

[Galway saint]

I thought the defence looked good to be fair. it looked less assured once we brought edozie and manning on

given the shit show at sunderland that’s significant progress.

you will always concede goals but the problem was more at the other end today 

[Ex Lion Tamer]

15 minutes ago, Block41 Saint said:

Only two clean sheets though. 

Yeah i don't think we're the finished article but it seems silly to take stats over a 17 game timeframe when we're clearly a better team now than in the first part of the season 

[Dark Munster]

2 hours ago, SaintsLoyal said:

Crikey some fans are expecting way too much and need to get in the real world

We have one of the best squads in the division, and certainly one of the most expensive. So I don't think expecting us to be pushing for the top two is "needing to get in the real world".

[HKsaint]

7 hours ago, Dusic said:

That obviously isnt the strategy. He was clearly annoyed with the performance too.

Please can we move on from it being his fault everytime we don't win a game?

I am sure that has happened many many times. Having good attacking football in the first half, we came out as another team in the second half. I thought they were told by RM during the half time to restore his famous possession football, not to attack, and to minimize any risk of goal conceded. That is his core value, his strategy but that doesn’t work in my view. 

[Weston Super Saint]

10 hours ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

Yeah i don't think we're the finished article but it seems silly to take stats over a 17 game timeframe when we're clearly a better team now than in the first part of the season 

Although that's exactly how the stats in the league table work....

[Ex Lion Tamer]

23 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Although that's exactly how the stats in the league table work....

We have another 20+ games to go this season that are more likely to be like the last 10 than the first 7. So the league table should look increasingly better for us.

That may still mean playoffs of course

[Lord Duckhunter]

12 hours ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

We remain top of the form table over the past 6 games

We should have beaten Huddersfield yesterday. They were on their arse, down to the bare bones & are shite. I reckon every single Town fan, player & manager would have taken a point if offered before the game. Dropping 4 points against Rotherham & them is fucking criminal. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

We should have beaten Huddersfield yesterday. They were on their arse, down to the bare bones & are shite. I reckon every single Town fan, player & manager would have taken a point if offered before the game. Dropping 4 points against Rotherham & them is fucking criminal. 

Results like yesterday happen. Leeds and Ipswich also failed to beat Rotherham. Am not Martin's biggest fan, and I think he would have failed if he doesn't take us up this year, but at the moment we are still pretty much well placed to push on. Two wins this week at home, and the atomosphere suddenly changes again. 

[CB Fry]

13 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Results like yesterday happen. Leeds and Ipswich also failed to beat Rotherham. Am not Martin's biggest fan, and I think he would have failed if he doesn't take us up this year, but at the moment we are still pretty much well placed to push on. Two wins this week at home, and the atomosphere suddenly changes again. 

The sheer volume of "results like that happen" that we seem to be having is the reason we won't be top two. We will be in the play offs but not top two.

[S-Clarke]

1 minute ago, CB Fry said:

The sheer volume of "results like that happen" that we seem to be having is the reason we won't be top two. We will be in the play offs but not top two.

Does very much feel like that. We look like a pretty comfortable playoff-bound team to me, who may still have an outside chance mathematically of the top 2 going into the last month or whatever - but we won't get it because of 'results like that' as you put it.

The playoffs scare the shit out of me. I can't see us going up via them, I don't feel as if we have the right mentality to deal with the emotions of the situation.

[stknowle]

13 hours ago, HKsaint said:

I am sure that has happened many many times. Having good attacking football in the first half, we came out as another team in the second half. I thought they were told by RM during the half time to restore his famous possession football, not to attack, and to minimize any risk of goal conceded. That is his core value, his strategy but that doesn’t work in my view. 

Agreed HK my old pal.

[Galway saint]

2 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Does very much feel like that. We look like a pretty comfortable playoff-bound team to me, who may still have an outside chance mathematically of the top 2 going into the last month or whatever - but we won't get it because of 'results like that' as you put it.

The playoffs scare the shit out of me. I can't see us going up via them, I don't feel as if we have the right mentality to deal with the emotions of the situation.

think we have the squad to do well but play off games tend to be up and down and you generally see the winner building momentum and making the most of their periods of dominance.

we don’t do ‘Momentum’ football and certainly don’t go for the jugular at the moment. 

 

[Dark Munster]

3 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

The playoffs scare the shit out of me. I can't see us going up via them, I don't feel as if we have the right mentality to deal with the emotions of the situation.

Me too. I wouldn’t fancy our chances against WBA for example, especially over 2 legs, with their much better manager. 

[AlexLaw76]

3 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

 

The playoffs scare the shit out of me. I can't see us going up via them, I don't feel as if we have the right mentality to deal with the emotions of the situation.

We still have to play WBA, Ipswich, Leeds and Leicester away.  We have been garbage away to anyone half decent so far, let alone throw in the pressure of the playoffs

[Badger]

16 hours ago, HKsaint said:

I am sure that has happened many many times. Having good attacking football in the first half, we came out as another team in the second half. I thought they were told by RM during the half time to restore his famous possession football, not to attack, and to minimize any risk of goal conceded. That is his core value, his strategy but that doesn’t work in my view. 

Don't know if your post was written with yesterday in mind, but it seems a little generous to describe our first half showing as good attacking football. Even though we controlled possession (82% at HT) it seemed to fizzle out in the final third, and from where we were sat the only real attempts at their goal came towards the end of the half, Armstrong hitting a post, Smallbone trying from outside the penalty area, then the goal itself.

Totally agree about the second half though.

[Dark Munster]

RM blamed the players for the appalling second half. But that ponderous, pedestrian, plodding, passive play is a hallmark of teams from his previous clubs as well. Occam's Razor suggest it's not the players, Russell, but you.

Unless it's Manning's fault.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

RM needs to rethink his half time team talks. We were leading 1-0 against Huddersfield & Rotherham, sat back and drew. We were leading against Preston and almost lost it. You could argue we were leading against W.Brom and that could so easily have turned in to a loss. Then Leeds and Birmingham were buried at half time but had a mini revival in the second half. 

Is it other managers making adjustments which we're not coping with or is there too much back slapping at half time thinking the job is done?

[Lord Duckhunter]

48 minutes ago, Dark Munster said:

RM blamed the players for the appalling second half. 

Of course he did. Sums him up…

[tdmickey3]

1 hour ago, Dark Munster said:

RM blamed the players for the appalling second half. But that ponderous, pedestrian, plodding, passive play is a hallmark of teams from his previous clubs as well. Occam's Razor suggest it's not the players, Russell, but you.

Unless it's Manning's fault.

Yep, this is why it’s playoffs at best

What a waste, next season it will be more of the same with lesser players just like Swansea

 

[Whitey Grandad]

3 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

RM blamed the players for the appalling second half.

Bad workmen always blame their tools.

[austsaint]

11 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Bad workmen always blame their tools.

They do.   What concerned me about the second half on Saturday was the lack of change in style of play when Huddersfield abandoned their first half tactic of defending deep and employing the occasional counter attack to a higher up the field press.     We seemed to adopt the same play out from the back, slow build up which was largely overpowered by their press.    If RM was unhappy with the players, where was his tactical change to counter, or earlier substitutions?

 

[Yorkshire Saint]

He certainly spends a lot of time on LinkedIn... more active than Koeman was on Twitter but less entertaining 

[wild-saint]

12 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Bad workmen always blame their tools.

Personally ive never heard a bad workman blame anyone or anything. Typically they don't even know or admit they are bad workman.

[VectisSaint]

On 25/11/2023 at 19:12, Barsiem said:

He would have been allowed in the dressing room at HT, it's only during the game he's confined to the stands.

So why was he in the stands before the game, as I pointed out?

It is actually very difficult to find information on exactly what is and isn't allowed during a touchline ban. One thing I read says that managers are not allowed any contact with players for the duration of a match (which would suggest not allowed in the Dressing Room at HT). But also they are allowed to participate in team talks, so how does that work, that would suggest they can be in the Dressing Room before kick-off but not at half-time. So why was RM in the stands before kick off?  

Edited 27 November, 2023 by VectisSaint

[woodsaint1]

16 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Of course he did. Sums him up…

Well he could have came out and praised the players for what was really a pish poor second half like some previous managers. He was brutally honest which is needed at times. Also I don't know many managers who openly admit to the media that what went wrong was their fault.....its all about self preservation in the cut throat world of football management

[Lord Duckhunter]

1 hour ago, woodsaint1 said:

He was brutally honest which is needed at times. 

Is he ever brutally honest about his part in any poor performance? 
 

 

[notnowcato]

2 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Is he ever brutally honest about his part in any poor performance? 
 

 

IIRC he has openly blamed himself for the September mess, saying he pushed team before they were ready, that was on him.

[tdmickey3]

38 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

IIRC he has openly blamed himself for the September mess, saying he pushed team before they were ready, that was on him.

It's all on him Mrs Martin.

His instructions are to keep the ball at whatever the cost as quoted by one of his (poor) disciples, Ryan Manning 

Slow, and turgid is his Trademark 

 

 

Edited 27 November, 2023 by tdmickey3

[West end Saints]

Of course the manager should take the blame for bad form, he took personal responsibility when we had 4 defeats, spoke about things he got wrong. 

 

Just as he should take credit for 9 games unbeaten and top of the current form table. 

I suspect that those slagging him off would not have predicted we would get 31 points from first 17, and if that was suggested at the start of the season would have thought that was a good start and beyond him! 

 

 

[Lord Duckhunter]

4 hours ago, West end Saints said:

Of course the manager should take the blame for bad form, he took personal responsibility when we had 4 defeats, spoke about things he got wrong. 

 

 

 

 

Oh, I didn’t realise it was his “scar tissue” from last season.

 

He doesn’t take responsibility at all. He comes out with management pony, that basically boils down to how wonderful he is and how his football is too complicated for players to comprehend without working under him for longer. It’s basically the same as someone asked at interview what their biggest weakness is, replies “I work too hard”. 

Edited 27 November, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[Ex Lion Tamer]

4 hours ago, West end Saints said:

I suspect that those slagging him off would not have predicted we would get 31 points from first 17, and if that was suggested at the start of the season would have thought that was a good start and beyond him!

And would be calling him soft if he didn't call out the players for their poor 2nd half peformance

Edited 27 November, 2023 by Ex Lion Tamer

[Whitey Grandad]

7 minutes ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

And would be calling him soft if he didn't call out the players for their poor 2nd half peformance

It’s bad management to ball out your workers in public. By all means have a go at them behind the scenes but you should always support them publicly.

[Lord Duckhunter]

4 hours ago, West end Saints said:

 

I suspect that those slagging him off would not have predicted we would get 31 points from first 17,

 

 

At the start of the season, Id want us nearer the top 2 than 8 points and I’d have wanted a better GD than with a +1. I’d also be worried if you told me that we’d only kept 2 clean sheets and would be dumped out of the cup by a lower league team. He’s done the absolute bare minimum with our squad, with worrying signs he’s learnt absolutely nothing from his mediocre career so far. He’s playing the same shite, with the same weaknesses, he’s higher up the league than he’s ever been, only because he’s got better players. Fuck all to do with RussBall. 

[West end Saints]

Last year after 17 games

Burnley had 32

Sheff Uni 29

Luton 25

So, know how shit we were last season, players that left, complete overall of style, the manager being given Ryan Fraser (unfit) Fraser downs ill) Sulemana (injured) 3 injured / unfit CBS, Steward injured etc etc, players leaving late.  

 

Any, absolutely anyone would have said, when asked how Martin was doing after 17, that he would be 1 point of burnelys great season, unbeaten in 9, and top of current form, everyone would say impressive start, without fail. 

 

Some are enjoying changing their expectations to have a moan and look edgy

 

 

 

 

Edited 27 November, 2023 by West end Saints

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Oh, I didn’t realise it was his “scar tissue” from last season.

 

He doesn’t take responsibility at all. He comes out with management pony, that basically boils down to how wonderful he is and how his football is too complicated for players to comprehend without working under him for longer. It’s basically the same as someone asked at interview what their biggest weakness is, replies “I work too hard”. 

What a load of pony

[West end Saints]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

At the start of the season, Id want us nearer the top 2 than 8 points and I’d have wanted a better GD than with a +1. I’d also be worried if you told me that we’d only kept 2 clean sheets and would be dumped out of the cup by a lower league team. He’s done the absolute bare minimum with our squad, with worrying signs he’s learnt absolutely nothing from his mediocre career so far. He’s playing the same shite, with the same weaknesses, he’s higher up the league than he’s ever been, only because he’s got better players. . 

Of course it is. You stick with your early writing off as it looks more and more short sighted 

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

It’s bad management to ball out your workers in public. By all means have a go at them behind the scenes but you should always support them publicly.

I’ve not seen the post match interview. Did he name players or speak about them as a group?

[Lord Duckhunter]

10 hours ago, West end Saints said:

Of course it is. You stick with your early writing off as it looks more and more short sighted 

Fucking hell, it was bad enough when some of our supporters were “grateful” we were in the top flight. Now we’ve got some that think being in the play off places 8 points behind Ipswich is some sort of achievement. 

[Osvaldorama]

He’s doing OK, but it’s justified to think he could be doing better. 
 

As stated, goal difference is bad & we have lost or drew with some absolute dross. 

Very difficult to say whether we are winning because of him or in spite of him at this point considering our strong squad. 
 

I think there are fair arguments either way. 

Edited 28 November, 2023 by Osvaldorama

[Ex Lion Tamer]

12 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

It’s bad management to ball out your workers in public. By all means have a go at them behind the scenes but you should always support them publicly.

I agree

[Ex Lion Tamer]

10 hours ago, notnowcato said:

I’ve not seen the post match interview. Did he name players or speak about them as a group?

I think he said Sulemana got taken off because he didn't do what was asked of him at half time

[Ex Lion Tamer]

39 minutes ago, Osvaldorama said:

He’s doing OK, but it’s justified to think he could be doing better. 
 

As stated, goal difference is bad & we have lost or drew with some absolute dross. 

Very difficult to say whether we are winning because of him or in spite of him at this point considering our strong squad. 
 

I think there are fair arguments either way. 

Worth saying that last season Burnley lost to QPR and drew with Birmingham, Stoke, Blackpool (twice), Cardiff and Hull. You can't always just pick off the lesser teams

[Charlie Wayman]

7 minutes ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

I think he said Sulemana got taken off because he didn't do what was asked of him at half time

What a load of crap! Players like Suly are there for their flair and unpredictability, stifle that and you may as well not play him. 

No player on this planet is capable of following a coach's plan for even 45 minutes let alone a whole game.

Now that KWP has been given the freedom of the park he has become twice the player he was before. He has been given a very long rope so do the same for Suly.

[notnowcato]

3 hours ago, Charlie Wayman said:

What a load of crap! Players like Suly are there for their flair and unpredictability, stifle that and you may as well not play him. 

No player on this planet is capable of following a coach's plan for even 45 minutes let alone a whole game.

Now that KWP has been given the freedom of the park he has become twice the player he was before. He has been given a very long rope so do the same for Suly.

What did RM say to Sulemana?  How do you know you disagree with something when you don't know what was said?

[Badger]

3 hours ago, Charlie Wayman said:

What a load of crap! Players like Suly are there for their flair and unpredictability, stifle that and you may as well not play him. 

No player on this planet is capable of following a coach's plan for even 45 minutes let alone a whole game.

Now that KWP has been given the freedom of the park he has become twice the player he was before. He has been given a very long rope so do the same for Suly.

Very few players are given a licence to roam and do their own thing. MLT was the obvious exception but I don’t think Sulemana has shown enough to be given the same freedom.

MLT prospered under Alan Ball, due in part to the fact others upped the work rate to cover for his other duties. Questionable how our current bunch would adapt to a bit extra required of them, or whether KS would rise to the challenge either.

Edited 28 November, 2023 by Badger

[notnowcato]

3 hours ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

Worth saying that last season Burnley lost to QPR and drew with Birmingham, Stoke, Blackpool (twice), Cardiff and Hull. You can't always just pick off the lesser teams

And this season Ipswich have drawn with Rotherham and Huddersfield.  I guess the Ipswich manager is hailed a genius by some on here because they played us when we were having our month long brain fart in September.  I'm confident we'll finish above Ipswich, less confident that we'll be us in a top 2 position but hopeful.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

Very few players are given a licence to roam and do their own thing. MLT was the obvious exception but I don’t think Sulemana has shown enough to be given the same freedom.

MLT prospered under Alan Ball, due in part to the fact others upped the work rate to cover for his other duties. Questionable how our current bunch would adapt to a bit extra required of them, or whether KS would rise to the challenge either.

A few more passes sideways? 🙂