Russell Martin

[Lee On Solent Saint]

38 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

Just watched the Man Utd post-match press conference in full and the very last line was interesting. 

RM was giving an answer about the size of the squad, talking about how they were handling it and how there would need to be a reassessment in January, and at the end he signed off with "I'll have to stay in the job for that long first". He didn't say it with much of a smile either. 

Even if it was just a throwaway line, it shows he's clearly feeling the pressure. There was some talk that the contract extension meant that he may have been given assurances that he'd be allowed to stay in the job if we went down, to bring us back up, but I don't think someone who has had that sort of reassurance makes a comment like that. 

He comes across as quite bolshy sometimes (although, in my opinion, nothing he said in that press conference was particularly aggressive or out of order), but I don't think he's under any illusions as to the expectations and the likely consequences of falling short of them, even this early on. He knows his job's at risk already. 

SR are idiots and pretty naive as owners go, but surely they are that stupid to tell Martin his job is guaranteed even if we do go down.

[Forester]

Per comments on the Manure thread, if we lost to both Ipswich and Born Muff I would expect him to go.  Assuming we would then lose to Arsenal regardless of who was in charge, that would be zero points from seven games.

I hope this doesn’t happen, as I would like him to succeed.  However we cannot simply write the season off, and this would enable a change to be made in the week building up to Arsenal and then use the international break to get the new man in.

I think it unlikely that we would be more than six points adrift of safety and we could attract a manager to have 31 games including the January window on this basis.  As others have said, leave it much longer and the list of applicants gets very thin.

Fingers crossed all of this becomes unnecessary.

[Rebel]

I am not sue if sacking Martin will make any difference if we don't have the players or the squad to survive in the Premier League.  Also its worth remembering it was the players on the pitch that fell apart after the missed penalty and gave 3 goals away. They just don't have the mentality to dig in when things get hard and grind out a result.

I don't think the manager is blameless - he stuck with 3-5-2 against Forest and Brentford when it obviously wasn't working for is.  And the decision to put Archer on penalties was probably a bit naive and optimistic - and in retrospect a wrong decision.

Also KWP is wasted on the left - so he has to either play him or Suga on the right and Taylor on the left.  Plus we are not good enough at the back to play 2 attacking full backs. 

But hopefully he is learning and becomes a bit more pragmatic to get the best out of the squad and players he has.  If we have a terrible run with no signs of improvement then he will need to be sacked before the January transfer window.  But they will need to buy and sell players and spend some money to support the new manager if they can.

 Before that though they need to appoint a proper Director of Football, someone with a background in football that can challenge, push and help Martin - and the need someone who can put together a transfer strategy ahead of the January window.

Looking back at our summer window it looks chaotic and a bit clueless.  We needed to buy a 6ft plus centre forward with some pace and power, get hold of a left back good enough to start and strengthen the centre of defence with a left footed centre back to partner THB or Bednarek - oh and buy a a good winger/10/ attacking midfielder.

I don't think we did any of those things. 

What was the point of buying Sugawara and keeping Bree if we kept KWP?  And we don't have a left back good enough to start as first choice. Instead we are wasting KWP on the left and trying to fit both him and Suga in the team.

Also not sure why we bought Archer and BBD -  who both play off the left when we needed a  a proper centre forward.

Same with Wood and Edwards when we need a starting left footed centre back.

And now it looks like we are stuck with ABK, Sulemana, and Tall Paul until January when it doesn't look like we want to play any of them .  

All in all the squad looks very unbalanced with holes all over the place.

Maybe they tried to sign the players we really needed and just didn't have the money - but even if that was the case there really seemed to be a lack of any plan A - or plan B.

 

 

[Mr X]

2 hours ago, saintant said:

Whatever may have been said in private to RM matters not a jot. If he cannot get some wins on the board it is just a matter of time before the fan base will make their feelings known in no uncertain terms. If it reaches that stage his position will be untenable. This would be the same at any major club in the country.

I hope your right, I'm grateful for what Martin has done he has to get credit for the turnaround from the championship but I just don't see him as the right person to scrape survival at this level he doesn't have either the tactical nous or the capability to coach a defence and is way to inflexible in his style beliefs.

If we are totally honest we could have done with a couple of seasons in the championship and that's looking like what we will be getting 

[qwertyell]

What I would say to the argument that we played United off the park for the opening 35 minutes and therefore have shown we can really compete in the league, is United had 8 shots on target in that first half. Scored 2. Ramsdale made some big saves that stopped us going in 4 or 5 down.

We had 4 shots on target in that period (and none thereafter). And 2 of them were the weak penalty and weak follow up header.

It's hard to take much comfort from supposedly playing brilliantly for a short period yet still conceding twice as many chances as we created. If that's us dominating the play, then things look pretty bleak for the numerous times coming up when we won't be.

The squad is the squad. It's incumbent on any manager to squeeze the absolute maximum out of his resources and find a way to be effective. I don't think anyone can seriously claim that he's doing that at present. Hasenhuttl was able to keep a few clean sheets with Bednarek, Stephens and Walker-Peters in the defence. Burnley kept some clean sheets with Charlie Taylor. Pochettino even won at least one game with Sam Gallagher as our starting centre forward. You can grind out results even with some pretty average players if you're properly organised and tactically astute. Does that sound like us?

Style over substance might soothe Russell's fragile ego, but it's not going to do us as a club any favours I'm afraid.

[tdmickey3]

How ridiculous is it going to look at end of season, a huge amount of possession over the season and a pathetically low points total

Laughing stock of unwanted records

[CB Fry]

STOP GIVING IT BACK TO THE KEEPER OVER AND OVER AGAIN

[Suhari]

First class purveyor of boring football.

[East Kent Saint]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cr75n1y13nvo

can be done !

[trousers]

😂

 

 

[Orkney Saint]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

😂

 

 

Wow! Has RM turned the tactical corner?

 

🤭

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, East Kent Saint said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cr75n1y13nvo

can be done !

CHDAJFU ?

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

😂

 

 

Is this for real?

He’s I charge. It’s up to chip to stop it. If he can’t then get someone in who can.

[SaintsBarry74]

Got to admire having so much possession and 0 points.

I imagine we'd be the first club to concede 9 goals in a game with 70% of the ball.

 

[Dark Munster]

3 hours ago, East Kent Saint said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cr75n1y13nvo

can be done !

Sacked after 3 draws and one loss. De Boer had 4 losses after his famous sacking by Palace.

It took 7 defeats out of 8 for Rasmus and SR to finally pull the trigger on mad Nate, even though everyone else and their dog knew well before that that he was out of his depth. If we keep on losing I fear it’ll take even longer for them to admit their mistake this time. 😕

[stknowle]

5 hours ago, SaintsBarry74 said:

Got to admire having so much possession and 0 points.

I imagine we'd be the first club to concede 9 goals in a game with 70% of the ball.

 

Yeah but none of those 9 goals would’ve been scored during the 70% of the match in  which we had the ball so our tactics would’ve been proven to have worked for the significant majority of the match. Definitely on the right path here.

[skintsaint]

19 minutes ago, stknowle said:

Yeah but none of those 9 goals would’ve been scored during the 70% of the match in  which we had the ball so our tactics would’ve been proven to have worked for the significant majority of the match. Definitely on the right path here.

Just need to get it to 100%. We probably would still concede with 99% possession.

[gio1saints]

4 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

Sacked after 3 draws and one loss. De Boer had 4 losses after his famous sacking by Palace.

It took 7 defeats out of 8 for Rasmus and SR to finally pull the trigger on mad Nate, even though everyone else and their dog knew well before that that he was out of his depth. If we keep on losing I fear it’ll take even longer for them to admit their mistake this time. 😕

Fairly wetting yer pants in joyous anticipation aren’t you, traitor. 

[CB Fry]

7 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Fairly wetting yer pants in joyous anticipation aren’t you, traitor. 

Guarantee he was supporting Southampton Football Club long before Russell Martin turned up. And will be supporting them long after Russell Martin leaves, either through the sack or being poached by Barcelona.

[The Kraken]

1 hour ago, gio1saints said:

Fairly wetting yer pants in joyous anticipation aren’t you, traitor. 

Do you have to be like this all the time?

[Ball boy]

He learnt from the GW3 lineup disaster. Picked a pretty good line up against utd and has allowed the players to deviate slightly from his principles….. I think he’ll be fine and we won’t need a mid season poch/ adkins reset. COYS! ⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️

[austsaint]

8 minutes ago, Ball boy said:

He learnt from the GW3 lineup disaster. Picked a pretty good line up against utd and has allowed the players to deviate slightly from his principles….. I think he’ll be fine and we won’t need a mid season poch/ adkins reset. COYS! ⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️

He did pick a good line up v Utd.    I think the deviation from principles you talk about has as much to do with Ramsdale's presence and the replacing of Smallbone than RM actually sanctioning a change.    Ramsdale's distribution is more accomplished than AMs and  promotes a variety of ways to play out from the back or be more direct.     Fair to say Smallbone was/is the biggest culprit in the ping back/brick wall pass and the introduction of Fernandes, and Les Ugo, (even Dibling) has resulted in more half turns and progressive passes than we saw previously.    The prospect of not needing a mid season (or earlier) manager reset has a lot to do with the improvement which Ramsdale and the new midfielders have brought.

[trousers]

 

 

[Whitey Grandad]

28 minutes ago, austsaint said:

He did pick a good line up v Utd.    I think the deviation from principles you talk about has as much to do with Ramsdale's presence and the replacing of Smallbone than RM actually sanctioning a change.    Ramsdale's distribution is more accomplished than AMs and  promotes a variety of ways to play out from the back or be more direct.     Fair to say Smallbone was/is the biggest culprit in the ping back/brick wall pass and the introduction of Fernandes, and Les Ugo, (even Dibling) has resulted in more half turns and progressive passes than we saw previously.    The prospect of not needing a mid season (or earlier) manager reset has a lot to do with the improvement which Ramsdale and the new midfielders have brought.

One that included Stephens.

[austsaint]

1 minute ago, Whitey Grandad said:

One that included Stephens.

Outside of Stephens I should have said, although I do get the argument that THB has taken a while to get up to speed in the Prem.   It's always been my feeling that we've seen enough of Stephens over the years to know about the errors, the ball watching and the positional mistakes, whereas THB, in his young career, shows every sign he is going to establish himself as a Prem CB.     I would have played THB or ABK last Saturday.

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, austsaint said:

Outside of Stephens I should have said, although I do get the argument that THB has taken a while to get up to speed in the Prem.   It's always been my feeling that we've seen enough of Stephens over the years to know about the errors, the ball watching and the positional mistakes, whereas THB, in his young career, shows every sign he is going to establish himself as a Prem CB.     I would have played THB or ABK last Saturday.

Fair enough.

[tdmickey3]

10 hours ago, gio1saints said:

Fairly wetting yer pants in joyous anticipation aren’t you, traitor. 

Do you scream and cry like a 8 year old at a boyband concert when you see Martin

[manji]

14 hours ago, gio1saints said:

Fairly wetting yer pants in joyous anticipation aren’t you, traitor. 

Yeah there’s seems to be a small but vocal group that want us to fuck up to prove themselves right. I used to go with this twat . He had a pathological hatred of Ralph . The opposition would score which would actually make me feel sick for a while and then he loudly tell everyone “ I told you this was going to happen “ .

What motivates these cunts ?
I pissed off with the start but we’ve only just started. I’ve got no idea how we are going to do. But we’ve got a good squad. If they start to get going we can be fine in the league. 
relagation would be dreadful but we go down and back up again. 
totally convinced SR will stick with us . As Phil Parsons said it’s a 10 year project. It’s not a computer game. 
 

 

[farawaysaint]

12 minutes ago, manji said:

Yeah there’s seems to be a small but vocal group that want us to fuck up to prove themselves right. I used to go with this twat . He had a pathological hatred of Ralph . The opposition would score which would actually make me feel sick for a while and then he loudly tell everyone “ I told you this was going to happen “ .

What motivates these cunts ?
I pissed off with the start but we’ve only just started. I’ve got no idea how we are going to do. But we’ve got a good squad. If they start to get going we can be fine in the league. 
relagation would be dreadful but we go down and back up again. 
totally convinced SR will stick with us . As Phil Parsons said it’s a 10 year project. It’s not a computer game. 
 

 

I think if there is something we have learned from the last few years is going straight back up after going down is far from guaranteed. 

[AlexLaw76]

41 minutes ago, manji said:

Yeah there’s seems to be a small but vocal group that want us to fuck up to prove themselves right. I used to go with this twat . He had a pathological hatred of Ralph . The opposition would score which would actually make me feel sick for a while and then he loudly tell everyone “ I told you this was going to happen “ .

What motivates these cunts ?
I pissed off with the start but we’ve only just started. I’ve got no idea how we are going to do. But we’ve got a good squad. If they start to get going we can be fine in the league. 
relagation would be dreadful but we go down and back up again. 
totally convinced SR will stick with us . As Phil Parsons said it’s a 10 year project. It’s not a computer game. 
 

 

Greatest era in our history?

[Bobsmith]

In reality RM has 2-3 games left to show that he can adapt the premier league and get the team consistently performing for 90 minutes. We were fantastic in the first 30 against united, but were pretty dire against Brentford and Forest. He made mistakes with formations and selections that have contributed to that, but there have been enough green shoots to show that he's learning and can turn things around. Fingers crossed it happens

[Give it to Ron]

30 minutes ago, farawaysaint said:

I think if there is something we have learned from the last few years is going straight back up after going down is far from guaranteed. 

Very true but I just want to see us win and compete, last year was brilliant.

Away games were fun and could go believing we could win, The prem is the holy grail for money but it’s now rich man’s play thing not for fans.

My mate is a Brummie fan and loving it in league 1 after years of struggling.

A fan just wants to see team play good football and win.

[Wade Garrett]

4 hours ago, manji said:

Yeah there’s seems to be a small but vocal group that want us to fuck up to prove themselves right. I used to go with this twat . He had a pathological hatred of Ralph . The opposition would score which would actually make me feel sick for a while and then he loudly tell everyone “ I told you this was going to happen “ .

What motivates these cunts ?
I pissed off with the start but we’ve only just started. I’ve got no idea how we are going to do. But we’ve got a good squad. If they start to get going we can be fine in the league. 
relagation would be dreadful but we go down and back up again. 
totally convinced SR will stick with us . As Phil Parsons said it’s a 10 year project. It’s not a computer game. 
 

 

What motivates me is wanting the best for the team I’ve supported for 50 years.  

And that makes me a cunt?

 

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

4 hours ago, Bobsmith said:

In reality RM has 2-3 games left to show that he can adapt the premier league and get the team consistently performing for 90 minutes. We were fantastic in the first 30 against united, but were pretty dire against Brentford and Forest. He made mistakes with formations and selections that have contributed to that, but there have been enough green shoots to show that he's learning and can turn things around. Fingers crossed it happens

Not so sure about that. 

RM seems to stumble in to things. He stumbled in to playing wing backs and he stumbled in to using Mac in goal and as a result we got promoted. Now Jack S is missing for a couple of games, I'm hoping he's going to stumble in to a new 1st XI that is more forward thinking. 

Of concern was the way we played out the last 20 minutes against Everton. That had RM's signature written all over it and I was waiting for the cock up at the back that threatened but never came. With Ramsdale and Fernandes (plus Suguwara, KWP) all looking for the early release, here's hoping for more ambitious football against Ipswich.  

[Daft Kerplunk]

1 hour ago, Wade Garrett said:

What motivates me is wanting the best for the team I’ve supported for 50 years.  

And that makes me a cunt?

 

Sums it up for me. I want to see the team I’ve supported for 40+ years win the title, be Champions of Europe etc. That doesn’t mean I don’t understand that we will be shit some/most of the time. I still want the best though and I’m not sure it makes me less of Saints fan because I don’t accept mediocrity. Delusional yes, optimistic that it may one day happen, yes. Expectant, no. Comfortable with calling the team and manager out for being pricks. Yes. But always a Saints fan. Absofuckinglutely. COYR

[CB Fry]

1 hour ago, Wade Garrett said:

What motivates me is wanting the best for the team I’ve supported for 50 years.  

And that makes me a cunt?

 

Manji moaned like fuck (some would say "like a cunt") throughout the ownership and leadership of others in the history of SFC.

It's only recently he has flipped to a fully paid up SR disciple.

But already he has changed his tune from "SR will deliver the greatest era in our history" to "we might go down and the come back up again". Wow, what a time to be a Saints fan.

 

[hypochondriac]

1 hour ago, CB Fry said:

Manji moaned like fuck (some would say "like a cunt") throughout the ownership and leadership of others in the history of SFC.

It's only recently he has flipped to a fully paid up SR disciple.

But already he has changed his tune from "SR will deliver the greatest era in our history" to "we might go down and the come back up again". Wow, what a time to be a Saints fan.

 

I love the managing of expectations. As if we should just accept that if we did get relegated again that would just be alright and expected in some way. If we go straight back down then that's shit and it's because we've cocked up again. This is particularly true if we finish bottom and get a seeing to every week. It's not acceptable and the fans shouldn't just be happy to go along with it. 

[Mr X]

I wonder what the club saw that convinced them to get Martin to sign for another three years? I would have thought promotion through the playoffs was the minimum the owners would have wanted and they'd seen nothing to suggest he could cut it at premier league level when we barely got through the playoffs.  I guess they want stability etc that old chestnut.

Pretty sure we aren't going to afford to pay off three years of compensation so maybe there's a performance get out clause in his contract? 

[ErwinK1961]

19 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I love the managing of expectations. As if we should just accept that if we did get relegated again that would just be alright and expected in some way. If we go straight back down then that's shit and it's because we've cocked up again. This is particularly true if we finish bottom and get a seeing to every week. It's not acceptable and the fans shouldn't just be happy to go along with it. 

I agree finishing bottom and getting towsed most weeks isn’t good enough, want to see us giving it a good go.

But getting relegated is a very likely expectation and always has been. The gap between Prem and Championship is just getting bigger and bigger. To stay up you’re relying on points deductions and one of the established teams having an absolute shocker.

[notnowcato]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

I love the managing of expectations. As if we should just accept that if we did get relegated again that would just be alright and expected in some way. If we go straight back down then that's shit and it's because we've cocked up again. This is particularly true if we finish bottom and get a seeing to every week. It's not acceptable and the fans shouldn't just be happy to go along with it. 

Except the betting markets had us as favourites to go straight back down. Of course it would be disappointing but not exactly unexpected. 

[danjosaint]

13 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Except the betting markets had us as favourites to go straight back down. Of course it would be disappointing but not exactly unexpected. 

But I think this is realistically where every saints fan is , it's just the manner in what it happens and a fair few including myself don't believe RM is simply not good enough coupled with his unwavering plan A and his penchant for certain players, I believe we've enough to stay up..... just,  it needs a manager to set us up in the best way to suit our squad

[hypochondriac]

30 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Except the betting markets had us as favourites to go straight back down. Of course it would be disappointing but not exactly unexpected. 

It depends how we go down to be honest. If it continues like this it simply isn't good enough. We aren't hard to beat which is the minimum I would be expecting. 

[Dusic]

2 hours ago, Mr X said:

I wonder what the club saw that convinced them to get Martin to sign for another three years? I would have thought promotion through the playoffs was the minimum the owners would have wanted and they'd seen nothing to suggest he could cut it at premier league level when we barely got through the playoffs.  

Ok.

[saintant]

3 hours ago, Mr X said:

I wonder what the club saw that convinced them to get Martin to sign for another three years? I would have thought promotion through the playoffs was the minimum the owners would have wanted and they'd seen nothing to suggest he could cut it at premier league level when we barely got through the playoffs.  I guess they want stability etc that old chestnut.

Pretty sure we aren't going to afford to pay off three years of compensation so maybe there's a performance get out clause in his contract? 

It's the easiest thing in the world to spend other people's money ie Dragan's. Seems to me he needs to get more of a hands-on grip of things rather than letting a bunch of chancers keep pouring his hard earned down the drain for some ego trip of their own.

[Andrew Watson]

Spot on saintant, I said the same thing a couple of weeks ago, that Mr Solak is having his pants pulled down by a load of chancers.

[Dark Munster]

29 minutes ago, Andrew Watson said:

Spot on saintant, I said the same thing a couple of weeks ago, that Mr Solak is having his pants pulled down by a load of chancers.

Me too, I've also been saying this for a long time now.

He clearly has, and seemingly continues, to be fooled by Ankersen's bullshit. I know he doesn't know much about football, but as a successful businessman it surprises (and frustrates) me that he hasn't seen through it by now.

[notnowcato]

11 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

It depends how we go down to be honest. If it continues like this it simply isn't good enough. We aren't hard to beat which is the minimum I would be expecting. 

We desperately need to stick the ball in the net, it go in off Archer’s arse for all I care. We’re a bit fragile and a bit unsure of ourselves, that’s a collective thing, a confidence boost will do the lads a world of good. 

[hypochondriac]

3 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

We desperately need to stick the ball in the net, it go in off Archer’s arse for all I care. We’re a bit fragile and a bit unsure of ourselves, that’s a collective thing, a confidence boost will do the lads a world of good. 

Will be very interesting to see where we're at in another 7 or 8 games. 

[notnowcato]

10 hours ago, saintant said:

It's the easiest thing in the world to spend other people's money ie Dragan's. Seems to me he needs to get more of a hands-on grip of things rather than letting a bunch of chancers keep pouring his hard earned down the drain for some ego trip of their own.

Er no. 

 

9 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

Me too, I've also been saying this for a long time now.

He clearly has, and seemingly continues, to be fooled by Ankersen's bullshit. I know he doesn't know much about football, but as a successful businessman it surprises (and frustrates) me that he hasn't seen through it by now.

Inside word is that promotion last season really pissed Dragan off. “Fuming” is how one Staplewood source described Dragan’s mood. 

[notnowcato]

Just now, hypochondriac said:

Will be very interesting to see where we're at in another 7 or 8 games. 

Indeed, one game at a time.