James Ward-Prowse

[Kermitzasaint]

On 11/05/2023 at 03:58, Saint86 said:

Its obvious that jwp is class for us. I swear, the guy gets lynched for not being the perfect all in one midfielder by some... He isn't part kante, part kdb, and running the midfield of every Premier league game singlehandedly - and therefore he's seemingly utter shit... 🤔).

Meanwhile he's been in demand by numerous Premier league clubs and consistently played by all our Premier league mananger from being a kid under adkins / poch / koeman, to being the main man under Ralph... Its not by fluke that be is our record Premier league appearance holder and still only 28. Let alone the fact he basically hasn't missed a minute in 4 seasons... 

I personally hope jwp stays to lead us back up - doubt it will happen obviously - but it would send a very important signal and he remains easily one of our best players. 

How many teams have put in a serious bid for him?

[Kermitzasaint]

Personally I think he will stay as he is too much of a coward to move teams. I also think he will struggle in the Championship as he is too soft. He would need a midfield enforcer type player to protect him. His free kicks would be useful there as the teams are of a lower standard. I also don't think he should be captain. 

[Wade Garrett]

Listened to his interviews after the game.

Might be looking for something that’s not there, but he said ‘it (the club) will be back’.  Not WE will be back.

Reckon he’s gone.

[Sheaf Saint]

11 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

You will be sorely dissappointed.

Anyway, his comments after the game today are laughable from a captain. "The way we’ve done it this year, that’s the disappointing thing. We didn’t really go down with a fight and given everything we can. That’s the disappointing thing.” 

Media trained cliché comments are not ideal from a captain and this doesn't smack of someone who was ever going to sort out the issues inside the dressing room. 

Absolutely this. His post match interview was pathetic. For all his plus points, he shows no leadership whatsoever. To come out snd say he doesn't think we did everything we could, and that standards have been dropping since day one of pre-season is such a cop out. It's his job as captain to make sure that doesn't happen.

I wouldn't want him to stick around now after that. It's clear he is a massive part of the problem. He is undoubtedly talented but he simply doesn't have the necessary winning mentality, and he's far too lightweight and cowardly for what we will need in the Cshp next session.

Thanks for some memorable goals James, but I really think it's best for everyone that we part ways and cash in. We really don't need that weak mindset stinking the place out if we're serious about trying to get back up next season.

[East Kent Saint]

11 hours ago, harvey said:

And that's coming from the 'captain!'......Jesus H Christ 🙄

Who else in the team would be a good captain ?  or is the percieved role of a captain out of date in modern football ? Not sure a hear any mention of captain during match commentry , apart from may be interaction with the ref as spokesman but any player nstill gets in the refs ear !

[East Kent Saint]

Just now, East Kent Saint said:

Who else in the team would be a good captain ?  or is the percieved role of a captain out of date in modern football ? Not sure a hear any mention of captain during match commentry , apart from may be interaction with the ref as spokesman but any player still gets in the refs ear !

 

[Verbal Kint]

6 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

To come out snd say he doesn't think we did everything we could, and that standards have been dropping since day one of pre-season is such a cop out. It's his job as captain to make sure that doesn't happen

This. Good captains and leaders don't allow standards to slip in the way he's suggesting they have

[Weston Super Saint]

2 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

Who else in the team would be a good captain ?  or is the percieved role of a captain out of date in modern football ? Not sure a hear any mention of captain during match commentry , apart from may be interaction with the ref as spokesman but any player nstill gets in the refs ear !

Lyanco.

[East Kent Saint]

4 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Lyanco.

and get picked every match ?

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

Who else in the team would be a good captain ?  or is the percieved role of a captain out of date in modern football ? Not sure a hear any mention of captain during match commentry , apart from may be interaction with the ref as spokesman but any player nstill gets in the refs ear !

Messi captained Argentina to world cup victory. He doesn't say boo to a goose on the field. You need guys that lead by example on and off the field. A club captain sort, off the field. You need some vocal players, but the captain doesn't organise or change anything on the pitch. We have the ring master managers doing that these days.

[Saint Billy]

11 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Lyanco.

To be honest, as crazy as it sounds I think he is captain material.

[Chez]

25 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Absolutely this. His post match interview was pathetic. For all his plus points, he shows no leadership whatsoever. To come out snd say he doesn't think we did everything we could, and that standards have been dropping since day one of pre-season is such a cop out. It's his job as captain to make sure that doesn't happen.

 

 

Rather than saying players were not training hard or giving their all, I interpret that as quality has gone down and we fucked up the season leading to relegation. 

[Hodgey]

I do get some of the comments here - going down is raw and inevitably people look for someone to blame. But JWP the reason we’re down, really ?

I don’t understand the criticism of his interview - he’s right - standards have slipped, but do people really think a captain can sort those problems, he’s not the manager, he’s not the coach, hes not the director of football, he’s not the person who brought these awful players in who are mentally weaker than before (if that’s possible)

Maybe he isn’t the best captain, but as someone else said - who else ? I mean Lyanco has been suggested, I’m not disparaging that suggestion as he clearly cares, but let that sink in as a best alternative, JWP is a shit captain - let’s give it to Lyanco ???. Then think of JWPs job - who in that dressing room would help him, be his deputies ?? . He’s had zero support, everyone around him has made his job as captain harder. Meanwhile, as evident on here, the pressure for him to also be the sole creative and defensive force of the club increased. Expectation on him from some is utterly ridiculous.

I hope when he goes, and when people calm down, he is recognised for what he gave over 20 years and 400 appearances and is given the accolades he deserves. I still remember the ridiculous comments of some happy to see Romeu gone as ‘his legs had gone, he was too slow etc etc’. Turns out he was still a very good player, just being dragged down by the utter circus that saints was starting to become. A circus that got much worse and which somehow now means that a player who we should be at least deeply respectful of, will leave with the legacy of many as a key reason for our demise and a note of ‘good riddance - you won’t be missed’

what a shambles our entire club is
 

 

[Whitey Grandad]

46 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Lyanco.

Please God, no. He’s a terrible footballer. Even if he did get an assist for their first goal yesterday.

[obelisk]

A captain for the Championship? I wonder whether Jack Stephens might want to give it a go. Trouble is it's a team of bottlers with not much captain material in there so I'm having difficulty coming up with ideas.

[whelk]

38 minutes ago, Chez said:

Messi captained Argentina to world cup victory. He doesn't say boo to a goose on the field. You need guys that lead by example on and off the field. A club captain sort, off the field. You need some vocal players, but the captain doesn't organise or change anything on the pitch. We have the ring master managers doing that these days.

International football is completely different to club football. You don’t have inexperienced kids who need encouragement and instruction - none of which JWP  appears to do. Very poor captain IMO

 

[Lighthouse]

I wouldn't want any of the current squad being captain next season, we need someone new who's not a habitual loser. That's not aimed at JWP, it's aimed at the whole squad. We need a player who's only recent experience is not passing sideways and backwards, hoping to get a 0-0 'from now on' when we're already two or three down to some bottom half mediocrity.

 

JWP needs a fresh start too. There're a few clubs he'd do okay at, although I think their fans are going to be surprised at just how 'okay' he actually is, when you take away the free kicks.

[east-stand-nic]

Alcaraz for captain. Great player, seems to want to stay, so this might seal the deal for him. Plus he is South American and they are very passionate.

Next season, build the team around him.

[SaintsFan86]

Just now, east-stand-nic said:

Alcaraz for captain. Great player, seems to want to stay, so this might seal the deal for him. Plus he is South American and they are very passionate.

Next season, build the team around him.

Not for me, He isn't a captain. Let him play his game. We need a dean hammonx type.. Well we need a Roy Keane tbh with the dogshit we've been served this season.

The only player we have I'd even trust in our actual ranks is Stephens and he is leaving for B'mouth.

[Mr Brightside]

34 minutes ago, Hodgey said:

I do get some of the comments here - going down is raw and inevitably people look for someone to blame. But JWP the reason we’re down, really ?

I don’t understand the criticism of his interview - he’s right - standards have slipped, but do people really think a captain can sort those problems, he’s not the manager, he’s not the coach, hes not the director of football, he’s not the person who brought these awful players in who are mentally weaker than before (if that’s possible)

Maybe he isn’t the best captain, but as someone else said - who else ? I mean Lyanco has been suggested, I’m not disparaging that suggestion as he clearly cares, but let that sink in as a best alternative, JWP is a shit captain - let’s give it to Lyanco ???. Then think of JWPs job - who in that dressing room would help him, be his deputies ?? . He’s had zero support, everyone around him has made his job as captain harder. Meanwhile, as evident on here, the pressure for him to also be the sole creative and defensive force of the club increased. Expectation on him from some is utterly ridiculous.

I hope when he goes, and when people calm down, he is recognised for what he gave over 20 years and 400 appearances and is given the accolades he deserves. I still remember the ridiculous comments of some happy to see Romeu gone as ‘his legs had gone, he was too slow etc etc’. Turns out he was still a very good player, just being dragged down by the utter circus that saints was starting to become. A circus that got much worse and which somehow now means that a player who we should be at least deeply respectful of, will leave with the legacy of many as a key reason for our demise and a note of ‘good riddance - you won’t be missed’

what a shambles our entire club is
 

 

Saved me a lot of typing. 

[alehouseboys]

11 minutes ago, east-stand-nic said:

Alcaraz for captain. Great player, seems to want to stay, so this might seal the deal for him. Plus he is South American and they are very passionate.

Next season, build the team around him.

JWP would be at his best without the captain's armband (and playing further forward), he's an ideal ambassador for this club but I've never felt he's captain material. But I certainly wouldn't burden Alcaraz with it, too young and South American passion certainly wouldn't be enough to gain the respect he'd need. Agree with the bit in bold though.

A deeper-voiced Alan Ball-type wouldn't go amiss!

[Sussex_saint]

Ward Prowse was is the only properly experienced player of the club right now. Since we got rid of Romeu etc, it's inevitable that he would step up. I think many judge him by his personality. He's not a chest beating, foul mouthed footballer, he's a more restrained one. It seems people here would rather a more aggressive captain - but that's just not his character. Also, with this bunch of fuckwits what else can he do? He's one man.

Yes, I will admit he hasn't shown much grit on the field as captain, but he's put in effort every match he's played. I don't think anyone can fault his playing this year - from his free kick goals to the penalties to the likes of his last minute block against arsenal, he's tried with all his heart to keep the club up. I would love him to stay - really love him to stay, and the only way I can see he will is with a decent, long term manager who can play to his strengths, much like NJ did ( playing him more forward, something which Selles is allergic to). Other wise, I think we have lost him. I hope he's remembered as the guy who proudly played for saints since 2012, the guy who was the best set peice taker in the prem.

Edited 14 May, 2023 by Sussex_saint

[Dan Johnson]

We’ve built a team around Ward Prowse and that’s one of the reasons we’re so passive.

He’ll be a better player when he moves into a team where not everything has to flow through him like it does for us.

his worst 2 asset are his inability to pick a pass that unlocks defences or running at defenders with the ball, as a result the ball always goes back or sideways when he’s in possession and our attack and build up play is pedestrian as a result.

in a team where you have a more creative player who can get on the ball and make those passes he’ll flourish because his biggest asset (work rate) will be better utilised 

we need him to move on, he needs to move on. I’m not going to lose any sleep over it 

[Mosin]

22 hours ago, Nemi said:

Thing is stats never tell the full story.

He takes all the free-kicks, corners and penalties. That immediately inflates his stats. He also by far plays the most. I'm not saying these are bad things, but it hides his open-play deficiencies. 

Stats can't measure his positioning - my biggest complaint of him (how many of his passes come from the times he drops into the backline and we spend the next five minutes passing it across the sideways not going anywhere?). Stats don't measure composure on the ball - he panics under pressure and that reflects across our whole team in the number of points we've chucked away from winning positions. Stats don't measure how quickly he moves the ball - we all know how slow our build-up play is. Stats don't measure how a midfielder dictates the play - can you name me the last time we've truly controlled the game, even against the lower league teams (and I'm not talking about loads of possession but not going anywhere).

Personally, I don't care how many goals our midfielder gets, I just want someone who can control the game, manage the tempo,  play the ball quickly with one touch when needed, and for me JWP doesn't do that. It's definitely nowhere near all his fault, and with better players I'm sure he'd also be better. But the best midfielders raise the level of the whole team: on the rare occasion JWP hasn't played it really hasn't made much difference (though I know its a choice between terrible or awful). And there is a reason why no other teams (apart from Villa when they were chucking silly money at anyone) have really made a big push for to get him. He'll be a decent squad player for someone I'm sure - but given the importance of having a midfielder who can break the lines in today's game, I can't see him displacing many of the current PL starters.

https://www.football365.com/news/premier-league-most-chances-created-feature

Bruno is top, Takes all Uniteds corners and free kicks.
Trippeir 2nd, Takes all newcastles free kicks and corners.
KDB 3rd, Takes all Citys free kicks and corners.
JWP 4th, takes all Saints free kicks and corners

Not doing to bad and what good company he is in whilst playing at the worst team in the in the league, If only JWP had a Halland / Gundogan / Mayraz / Foden and co next to him......... He cant do it on his own....

[Chez]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

International football is completely different to club football. You don’t have inexperienced kids who need encouragement and instruction - none of which JWP  appears to do. Very poor captain IMO

 

that is what a manager is there for. 

[ooh it's a corner]

I think the recent pages on this thread sum up the difference in opinion that Saints fans have with JWP and the outside world has with JWP.

He is a decent enough footballer, well worthy of a place in an established premier league team. He has a wonderful free kick technique which has earned him many goals and assists. Undoubtedly he would have more goals and assists with better forwards in front of him.

But, for all his qualities there are some flaws and these tend not to make the MOTD highlights reel. He is not a fast runner, he does tend to slow the transition from defense to attack down, he naturally looks sideways rather than forward, which means he never finds that killer through-ball and he frequently hits the first defender when taking a corner. 

He seems a thoroughly likeable young man, and we can only thank him for his time at Southampton. I hope his new club treats him as well as he has been treated here and I hope we spend any transfer fee more wisely than we have done

[david in sweden]

2 hours ago, Chez said:

Rather than saying players were not training hard or giving their all, I interpret that as quality has gone down and we fucked up the season leading to relegation. 

For those people who say they can't hear Prowsey's voice when they are sitting in Row D,  should note that he covers more ground than any other Prem. player,

in part because he gets around the entire pitch covering everyone else's " absence " from their designated positions. 

I watched him yesterday and he played everywhere and - even late as the sole striker.   In one spell when we couldn't penetrate Fulham's wall, everyone

consistently passed back to him - wherever he was - and however he tried to bring others into play, he still ended up getting the ball back. 

Goodness knows what we will do when he isn't there any longer ! 

 

When we buy players we concentrate too much on their ability with their feet,  and seldom on that in their brain.  There are very few "brains " in the

current squad - especially amongst those young players who were still playing " boy's football " last season.

Prowsey has been with the club - man and boy - for the best part of 20 years, whatever else you may think, he deserves better than we can provide. 

[S-Clarke]

My issue with JWP's statement, outside the generic media coached nature of it, was the acceptance that standards dropped, we haven't done it right since the first day of pre-season etc. Well James, you're the captain, why the fuck have you not be tearing shit up to raise those standards? As club captain he sets the standards for others to follow, if they're not following those then he needs to call them out. But he won't as he's too meek, he sums up our entire team and fan base.

I can't criticise him for the effort he's given us over the years, the free kicks and such, but as a leader - in my opinion - he has been our worst ever PL captain and has been captain of our WORST ever team (going by defeats in a league season). 

I don't have much time for him saying standards dropped after the event, where the fuck was he in September and October? Where the fuck was he galvanising the group when we were 3-1 up against Arsenal on 88 mins? Where was he against Wolves when we were 1-0 up, against 10 min, on 77 mins? Where was he when we lost 9-0 - not once, but twice.

And where the fuck was he yesterday?

[Weston Super Saint]

3 hours ago, East Kent Saint said:

and get picked every match ?

In the Championship, where his lack of skill won't be so obvious, yes.  

[tunit]

Most obvious candidate for skipper should JWP leave is Bednarek for me (if he stays). Which is absolutely mental considering how myself and others viewed him just 3 months ago.

[Weston Super Saint]

Just now, tunit said:

Most obvious candidate for skipper should JWP leave is Bednarek for me (if he stays). Which is absolutely mental considering how myself and others viewed him just 3 months ago.

Surely this is a joke?

Every single time something goes wrong (whether it's his fault or not), he throws his hands in the air and looks around for someone to blame.  Not exactly the greatest leadership trait!

[Hodgey]

15 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

My issue with JWP's statement, outside the generic media coached nature of it, was the acceptance that standards dropped, we haven't done it right since the first day of pre-season etc. Well James, you're the captain, why the fuck have you not be tearing shit up to raise those standards? As club captain he sets the standards for others to follow, if they're not following those then he needs to call them out. But he won't as he's too meek, he sums up our entire team and fan base.

I can't criticise him for the effort he's given us over the years, the free kicks and such, but as a leader - in my opinion - he has been our worst ever PL captain and has been captain of our WORST ever team (going by defeats in a league season). 

I don't have much time for him saying standards dropped after the event, where the fuck was he in September and October? Where the fuck was he galvanising the group when we were 3-1 up against Arsenal on 88 mins? Where was he against Wolves when we were 1-0 up, against 10 min, on 77 mins? Where was he when we lost 9-0 - not once, but twice.

And where the fuck was he yesterday?

This is fair question, but how do you know ? How do you know what he has or hasn’t done to try and raise standards ? Who in our squad would you have replaced him with as captain to do these things you talk of ?, do you honestly believe if we had a different captain we would have performed any better ? Again who ? I’m looking at the other 10 players who have played every week - just because they are not captain doesn’t mean they can’t call others out etc, why was it just JWPs job ?.

He cannot be the manager, coach, psychologist. Motivator, creator, organiser, Captain, mentor etc. I agree JWP has failed miserably if his job is to do all these things for the 30 odd useless lumps we have.

Is he really any worse than Hoijberg was as captain ? And this is what is making me angry - his legacy to some is the worst captain playing in the worst team in our PL history who could only play the ball backwards and sideways. Never mind the context, never mind all the fantastic moments he provided, never mind the 400 appearances where he gave it his all, never mind the c 50 goals scored, never mind all the chances created, never mind all the stats which put him as one of the most effective midfielders in the top flight, never mind the fact he pretty much single handedly kept us up last year.

Like I say - emotions are raw, but does JWP really deserve all this criticism in the cold light of day ?.

 

 

 

 

[Verbal Kint]

13 minutes ago, tunit said:

Most obvious candidate for skipper should JWP leave is Bednarek for me (if he stays). Which is absolutely mental considering how myself and others viewed him just 3 months ago.

He should be one of the first out the door this summer. The thought of him being made captain makes me want to vomit.

Awful, awful player

Edited 14 May, 2023 by Verbal Kint

[tunit]

10 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Surely this is a joke?

Every single time something goes wrong (whether it's his fault or not), he throws his hands in the air and looks around for someone to blame.  Not exactly the greatest leadership trait!

So people don't think JWP isn't a good captain because he doesn't show passion enough and he isn't a loud enough leader. But Bednarek is also not good for captain because he shows passion, is loud and is visibly frustrated when something goes wrong. Got it.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, tunit said:

So people don't think JWP isn't a good captain because he doesn't show passion enough and he isn't a loud enough leader. But Bednarek is also not good for captain because he shows passion, is loud and is visibly frustrated when something goes wrong. Got it.

Not sure you have 'got it' to be fair.  Leaders don't instantly look to apportion blame when something goes wrong.  That's not 'passion' that's 'passing the buck'.

[Appy]

1 hour ago, tunit said:

Most obvious candidate for skipper should JWP leave is Bednarek for me (if he stays). Which is absolutely mental considering how myself and others viewed him just 3 months ago.

Are you fucking serious? 

[whelk]

3 hours ago, Chez said:

that is what a manager is there for. 

Take it you have never captained a side?

[david in sweden]

Prowsey... Like him or not, we had the privilege,( previously granted only to Man Utd. fans) of seeing so many excellent free-kicks from one player 

along with a number of well-taken penalties.     A player who really has given service to our club over a period of 20 years, he deserves better. 

It is also seemed somewhat ironic, that JWP played in our first Prem. game after promotion back in 2012, and will now leave after our last, before 

we return to the Championship.    We may not see his like again in the near future.  

Edited 15 May, 2023 by david in sweden

[skintsaint]

Will probably stay with us till the Jan transfer window. If we are struggling I think that's when he will jump ship.

[AlexLaw76]

2 hours ago, skintsaint said:

Will probably stay with us till the Jan transfer window. If we are struggling I think that's when he will jump ship.

You mad?

Edited 15 May, 2023 by AlexLaw76

[niceandfriendly]

On 14/05/2023 at 16:36, east-stand-nic said:

Alcaraz for captain. Great player, seems to want to stay, so this might seal the deal for him. Plus he is South American and they are very passionate.

Next season, build the team around him.

Has he indicated somewhere that he’d like to stay? I haven’t seen that but would like to. Cheers

[S-Clarke]

3 minutes ago, niceandfriendly said:

Has he indicated somewhere that he’d like to stay? I haven’t seen that but would like to. Cheers

Yeah, came out a few weeks ago. He's settled here after uprooting in January and isn't looking to move this summer.

[niceandfriendly]

He’ll be very handy in the Championship that’s for sure. Good lad

[Dusic]

1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

Yeah, came out a few weeks ago. He's settled here after uprooting in January and isn't looking to move this summer.

Not sure it was anywhere near that certain. Seemed more of a case of him recognising that moving again may not be ideal so he may not push to leave like some will.

If he were to get an offer from a PL side on PL wages he is hardly going to say no, same as all the squad.

[thornhill_saints]

1 hour ago, niceandfriendly said:

He’ll be very handy in the Championship that’s for sure. Good lad

Just not the fecking Captain 

[bangkoksaint]

Maybe I’m way off the mark with this. I think sentiment needs to be taken out of all these who stays and who goes guesses. The bottom line is that if the club believe it’s for the best for them (the club not the player) and it makes financial sense, then they’ll go. We may wish to keep Elly, Walcott, Diallo, AA and AMN etc but if the big boys come in then they’ll go 😉

[ErwinK1961]

4 hours ago, Dusic said:

Not sure it was anywhere near that certain. Seemed more of a case of him recognising that moving again may not be ideal so he may not push to leave like some will.

If he were to get an offer from a PL side on PL wages he is hardly going to say no, same as all the squad.

He may get an offer, but we don’t have to accept it. Not every saleable asset gets sold by every relegated club - Joao Pedro, Sarr, Mitrovic, Berge etc. 

[The Kraken]

4 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Yeah, came out a few weeks ago. He's settled here after uprooting in January and isn't looking to move this summer.

He’s a professional footballer. He basically doesn’t lift a finger in terms of moving house, his agency will sort it all out. He may not be looking to move but offers will come in, and having to move around England is going to be the very least of his troubles. I hope he stays but him being ‘settled’ is hardly any sort of factor.

[harvey]

So this afternoon, and I admit the game is lost.......in the last minute of extra time he passes back when we had the opportunity to go forwards. I really can't wait to see the back of this loser.

[aintforever]

He does pass sideways and backwards too much. It will be interesting to see what clubs come in for him.