New Manager Thread v3

[Dimplex]

Has to be one of Rafa, Potter or Viera surely. 

[washsaint]

Why this insane lovefest with Benitez?  Defensive in the extreme and an absolute disaster at Everton.

[Roo1976]

2 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Someone who knows what he is doing.

Ralph?.......................................................

[FarehamSaintJames]

Has to be experience.

[trousers]

Given today's reports of players pitching up late for training/meetings, forming cliques, etc, the new manager needs to be a no nonsense disciplinarian. Dare I say it, someone in the same mold as Dyche....?

Edited 13 May, 2023 by trousers

[FarehamSaintJames]

15 minutes ago, trousers said:

Given today's reports of players pitching up late for training/meetings, forming cliques, etc, the new manager needs to be a no nonsense disciplinarian. Dare I say it, someone in the same mold as Dyche....?

Where have all these reports come from? And why have they all come out in the last four hours? Why now and not yesterday, or last week, or last month?

Totally agree someone with maximum authority needs to come in.

[Fabrice29]

1 hour ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

Has to be experience.

I'll bite again because "experience" is an absolute nothing word. 

Experience of what? What's your criteria? What experience must they have had?

And then once you've answered that you can name some actual options.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by Fabrice29

[Wade Garrett]

47 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

I'll bite again because "experience" is an absolute nothing word. 

Experience of what? What's your criteria? What experience must they have had?

And then once you've answered that you can name some actual options.

What experience do you think he means?

Ridiculous post.

[Fabrice29]

11 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

What experience do you think he means?

Ridiculous post.

Go on...enlighten me...what does he mean? Experience of what? Getting someone promoted? Getting someone promoted from the Championship? Getting someone promoted from the Championship at the first go? Top flight experience? How much top flight experience? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, more? How many of those need to be successful?

I'm genuinely intrigued what experience he and others want?

Edited 13 May, 2023 by Fabrice29

[hypochondriac]

2 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

Where have all these reports come from? And why have they all come out in the last four hours? Why now and not yesterday, or last week, or last month?

Totally agree someone with maximum authority needs to come in.

Because people were obviously sitting on them until after relegation was confirmed. 

[Saint86]

6 hours ago, ally_uk said:

Get Rafa in now 

He would expect a top 6 EPl salary... We're a championship club needing to sell players. Totally out of touch if people think this is the sort of thing that could happen. 

[Saint in Paradise]

Whilst it seems almost like the end of the World to you younger supporters I promise you it truly isn't.

When you get as old and doddery as me then that's when many really important, potentially even life

altering, worries happen. They go a long way towards  easing any pain produced by the mere relegation

of a Football team.

[benjii]

6 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

I'll bite again because "experience" is an absolute nothing word. 

Experience of what? What's your criteria? What experience must they have had?

And then once you've answered that you can name some actual options.

Managing a Premier League scale football club, presumably? 

[AlexLaw76]

10 hours ago, manji said:

We can easily afford Potter and joining us would be hugely appealing with our remaining players and by far the highest spending money not including any players we sell.

Yet again the fans scapegoat is going back to overseeing the Sports Republic roster which he will be perfectly suited.

I really don’t think a lot of the fans understand the complicated business model.

Mate, it is obvious you have been suckered in by Sports Republic. 

Ignoring EFL FFP, if we could easily afford the calibre of Graham Potter, what the fuck was Ruben Selles about?

Sod that, Nathan Fucking Jones?

You need to admit, Sports Republic are, and have been, terrible owners, and the comedy will probably continue.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, benjii said:

Managing a Premier League scale football club, presumably? 

Jones has that experience doesn't he?

[Smirking_Saint]

7 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Jones has that experience doesn't he?

Technically he does now…..

[Weston Super Saint]

23 minutes ago, Smirking_Saint said:

Technically he does now…..

So by that criteria he would be the perfect fit - which is clearly nonsense.

Fabrice has asked a pertinent question which some have ridiculed.  Lots of people bandying the word 'experience' around but have failed to quantify what experience they desire in the next manager, because just saying 'experience' is enough, apparently.

Edited 14 May, 2023 by Weston Super Saint

[ErwinK1961]

30 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

So by that criteria he would be the perfect fit - which is clearly nonsense.

Fabrice has asked a pertinent question which some have ridiculed.  Lots of people bandying the word 'experience' around but have failed to quantify what experience they desire in the next manager, because just saying 'experience' is enough, apparently.

Indeed..

 

 

[Fabrice29]

3 hours ago, benjii said:

Managing a Premier League scale football club, presumably? 

In that case the shortlist is both long and worse than I imagined.

[aintforever]

8 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

Go on...enlighten me...what does he mean? Experience of what? Getting someone promoted? Getting someone promoted from the Championship? Getting someone promoted from the Championship at the first go? Top flight experience? How much top flight experience? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, more? How many of those need to be successful?

I'm genuinely intrigued what experience he and others want?

I wouldn’t go for anyone unless they have had some sort of success at the league we are in or higher. No bright upcoming managers from League One or below. 

[Fabrice29]

3 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I wouldn’t go for anyone unless they have had some sort of success at the league we are in or higher. No bright upcoming managers from League One or below. 

Fair enough. So what does success look like? Does that criteria rule Potter for example in or out? 

[Whitey Grandad]

3 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I wouldn’t go for anyone unless they have had some sort of success at the league we are in or higher. No bright upcoming managers from League One or below. 

The trouble with trying to identify anyone who is ‘upcoming’ is that they are unproven until they’ve proved themselves.

[CB Fry]

8 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

Go on...enlighten me...what does he mean? Experience of what? Getting someone promoted? Getting someone promoted from the Championship? Getting someone promoted from the Championship at the first go? Top flight experience? How much top flight experience? 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, more? How many of those need to be successful?

I'm genuinely intrigued what experience he and others want?

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

[aintforever]

Just now, Fabrice29 said:

Fair enough. So what does success look like? Does that criteria rule Potter for example in or out? 

He’s got experience of playing at the top level, some promotions on his cv, experience in the championship and did a good job managing in the Premier League so obviously he would be a good candidate.

[Raging Bull]

5 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Fair enough. So what does success look like? Does that criteria rule Potter for example in or out? 

Are you related to MLG? 

[Whitey Grandad]

1 minute ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

Well said. 
 

There is a saying about a captain running ‘a tight ship’ and that’s what we need now.

[CB Fry]

8 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Fair enough. So what does success look like? Does that criteria rule Potter for example in or out? 

What planet are you living on that the people saying they want someone with "experience" would also reject Graham Potter? 

I think you are getting carried away with how clever you think your shitty little question is.

[egg]

1 minute ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

Having read that athletic article, and witnessed the mess that was this season, I think you're right to highlight that we need someone with all the attributes tiu mention, but with perhaps an emphasis on gravitas and authority. Those things come from experience for sure, but not necessarily from experience of managing in this country, and not necessarily from managing for long. Fabrice asked a good question imo - there's experience and there's experience. Jones had experience, but the wrong sort, and he definitely had the wrong characteristics as a person and leader. Elsewhere, you've got the likes of Arteta who had zero experience as a manager and was widely sniffed at. However, his experience and credentials as a player (and his brief coaching career) gave him knowledge, gravitas and all sorts of great traits, but he didn't have the management experience that people assume is a pre requisite to succeed. 

[aintforever]

6 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

 

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

This.

[Delmary]

One of our rumoured targets

 

[Miltonaggro]

10 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

This. Essentially it needs to be a credible appointment, with gravitas and authority - presence. Attributes you look for in the focal figurehead in any complex organisation that’s serious about being / remaining competitive. Hopefully Wilcox is more adept at talent spotting than the mediocrity collective on the Board. 

[The Cat]

6 minutes ago, Delmary said:

One of our rumoured targets

 

Haven't watched it all but what I saw was really interesting. Shows how much planning goes into different aspects of the game. He comes across well too.

Seems like quite a lot of clubs in the Championship use 3 at the back, so we'll see quite a few teams line up like that next season.

[Give it to Ron]

26 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

Bang on for me, if what came out last night is even half true then we will need someone who can control all areas and to do that needs respect at start. 

[Yorkshire Saint]

Reading everything above and considering what we have seen of SR, Viera with his links to Wilcox would be the obvious appointment and I can see that happening. If a former player with Gravitas is the approach then I'd prefer Rooney or Gerrard (as much as I detest them) .....begrudgingly as that is the kind of gravity that potentially keeps some of the younger players. Dare I say it even JWP.

Potter would be a good call if he bought in yo the long term vision but I cant see it tbh. Especially when you see some of the clubs in the championship.. it is not going to be easy!!

Jones on Sky yesterday...he is learnt nothing.

[Fabrice29]

31 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

I’m sorry for thinking experience meant an objective thing that someone had done. 
 

I didn’t realise it just meant someone with good human and leadership qualities. 

[Smirking_Saint]

Just now, Fabrice29 said:

I’m sorry for thinking experience meant an objective thing that someone had done. 
 

I didn’t realise it just meant someone with good human and leadership qualities. 

Tbf it seemed like you’re just nitpicking and trying to prove some form of point when everyone, including yourself knew exactly what it meant after sitting through the shitshow of Jones and Selles

[CB Fry]

6 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

I’m sorry for thinking experience meant an objective thing that someone had done. 
 

I didn’t realise it just meant someone with good human and leadership qualities. 

It doesn't just mean that and I haven't said anything remotely like that. 

You don't get gravitas walking into a new club with zero relevant experience.

Honestly you need to do a bit more work on the meanings of words. It's a a teeny bit more than the first line of a dictionary definition.

Keep trying, you'll get there.

Edited 14 May, 2023 by CB Fry

[Fabrice29]

2 minutes ago, Smirking_Saint said:

Tbf it seemed like you’re just nitpicking and trying to prove some form of point when everyone, including yourself knew exactly what it meant after sitting through the shitshow of Jones and Selles

Yeah probably. Or just that in wondering what people mean when they say experience because it’s a nothing word and has resulted in already 3 different responses. But yeah I’m just nitpicking and knew exactly what it meant.

[SNSUN]

On 12/05/2023 at 19:33, EBS1980 said:

https://twitter.com/alex_crook/status/1657088425604915200?s=46&t=OQrvtqxdga34G9SV_nKtNQ

Martin & Schumacher being considered…

I heard this on TalkSport this morning and couldn't believe my ears. I don't care how promising these managers are, we need experience and we need someone that can unite the fanbase. Or most of it anyway. We need someone with authority that the players we have left after sales respect. Farting about with inexperience is what got us relegated in the first place. I know they're only on a "shortlist" and we don't know how long that is, but it worries me. Whoever we appoint will get my support but we need to go up next season or be close enough that we've built a core of players good enough to go up the season after or we could stagnate in the Championship or worse.

[CB Fry]

5 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Yeah probably. Or just that in wondering what people mean when they say experience because it’s a nothing word and has resulted in already 3 different responses. But yeah I’m just nitpicking and knew exactly what it meant.

List out the "three different responses" and how they are different.

[alehouseboys]

I'm beginning to think Fabrice29 and CB Fry are 2 'characters' of the same poster just enjoying the argument and 'putting everyone right' all the time.

[Fabrice29]

4 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

It doesn't just mean that and I haven't said anything remotely like that. 

You don't get gravitas walking into a new club with zero relevant experience.

Honestly you need to do a bit more work on words meaning a teeny bit more than the first line of a dictionary definition.

Keep trying, you'll get there.

Relevant experience. What does relevant experience entail? Does Russel Martin have relevant experience? He’s managed in the Championship just like Potter has but didn’t manage above yet so maybe not? Someone said before Potter experience of PL is relevant experience, so maybe Martin does have the gravitas needed because he played more at the top level than Potter? Schumacher has delivered a promotion? Is that relevant experience or is there not enough gravitas? 
 

We might get there but in reality the word experience means different things to different people so maybe we won’t. 

[AlexLaw76]

Gerrard, Rooney, Veira, Potter, Cooper (if Forest bin him) for me

[Miltonaggro]

My basic preference in terms of advice on experience, presence, and gravitas (in case Marty or Ras are keeping tabs from the Green Mile) is to not go for a person that sounds and looks like they would sell you a hotdog at a travelling funfair which causes food poisoning whilst short-changing you. Also, avoid promoting the fashionista head of the post room to CEO because he’s liked by the typing pool and reception staff. 

[Give it to Ron]

7 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Relevant experience. What does relevant experience entail? Does Russel Martin have relevant experience? He’s managed in the Championship just like Potter has but didn’t manage above yet so maybe not? Someone said before Potter experience of PL is relevant experience, so maybe Martin does have the gravitas needed because he played more at the top level than Potter? Schumacher has delivered a promotion? Is that relevant experience or is there not enough gravitas? 
 

We might get there but in reality the word experience means different things to different people so maybe we won’t. 

But isn’t that exactly what it is or what we are looking for? Look at the Jones replacement list that came out you couldn’t have 3 more different ‘managers’.

 

[CB Fry]

7 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Relevant experience. What does relevant experience entail? Does Russel Martin have relevant experience? He’s managed in the Championship just like Potter has but didn’t manage above yet so maybe not? Someone said before Potter experience of PL is relevant experience, so maybe Martin does have the gravitas needed because he played more at the top level than Potter? Schumacher has delivered a promotion? Is that relevant experience or is there not enough gravitas? 
 

We might get there but in reality the word experience means different things to different people so maybe we won’t. 

I can't see "three different responses" on this thread.

Just you pointlessly nitpicking and you trying to pretend Saints fans would reject Graham bloody Potter because he wasn't "experienced". Abject nonsense.

Just looking at every possible candidate through the prism of your very narrow interpretation of one single word seems utterly futile, even for this forum.

[Fabrice29]

4 hours ago, benjii said:

Managing a Premier League scale football club, presumably? 

 

58 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I wouldn’t go for anyone unless they have had some sort of success at the league we are in or higher. No bright upcoming managers from League One or below. 

 

50 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Why are you asking this question like it is some genius killer question?

All the candidates will be slightly different on all metrics.

But I think "experience" is a good phrase for someone to walk in to the club with significant gravitas, knowledge, know-how, authority who can inspire the fanbase and the playing staff.

So yep, someone with experience please.

 

5 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

List out the "three different responses" and how they are different.

As above. We have managing in the PL, someone who has had success in the Championship or higher, or your own definition of experience which includes knowledge, know how, inspiring and gravitas.

There are many who have managed in the PL who haven’t delivered success in the Championship or higher. They also wouldn’t inspire. But there may be some who would inspire that haven’t managed at the PL or delivered success in the Championship or higher. Is Potters experience of a mid table finish in the Championship in one season and some decent work in the PL enough to be considered a success? It would certainly inspire. Pochettino didn’t have any success as a coach before us, but he certainly inspired and had know how. 
 

Different people, different needs.

[Give it to Ron]

9 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Gerrard, Rooney, Veira, Potter, Cooper (if Forest bin him) for me

Interesting list people right off Gerrard and admittedly at Villa was atrocious but people forget his time at Rangers he stopped Celtic winning it 10 times that’s no mean feat despite 2 horse race.

I don’t think we will get him and it maybe too late but think Brendan could pull us round if he fancies the challenge away from spotlight and chance it.

 

[Fabrice29]

5 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

I can't see "three different responses" on this thread.

Just you pointlessly nitpicking and you trying to pretend Saints fans would reject Graham bloody Potter because he wasn't "experienced". Abject nonsense.

Just looking at every possible candidate through the prism of your very narrow interpretation of one single word seems utterly futile, even for this forum.

I didn’t say that. I asked if that persons definition of success included Potters body of work. It was a question because again, ‘success’ is a nothing word if it’s not defined. 
 

You can add loads of names to this btw. Gerrard, Viera, Lampard, Rooney are all mentioned on here. Do they inspire? Have they delivered success in the Championship or higher? 

Edited 14 May, 2023 by Fabrice29

[CB Fry]

38 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

 

 

 

As above. We have managing in the PL, someone who has had success in the Championship or higher, or your own definition of experience which includes knowledge, know how, inspiring and gravitas.

There are many who have managed in the PL who haven’t delivered success in the Championship or higher. They also wouldn’t inspire. But there may be some who would inspire that haven’t managed at the PL or delivered success in the Championship or higher. Is Potters experience of a mid table finish in the Championship in one season and some decent work in the PL enough to be considered a success? It would certainly inspire. Pochettino didn’t have any success as a coach before us, but he certainly inspired and had know how. 
 

Different people, different needs.

They're not three different responses, they are pretty much identical.

The first response doesn't say "managing in the Premier League" specifically, it talks about scale of club. For someone desperate to hammer people on specific word use it is strange you have ignored that.

Those three answers are not different, they are saying the same thing.

 

Edited 14 May, 2023 by CB Fry