New Manager Thread v3

[Dusic]

30 minutes ago, Convict Colony said:

Yeah am with you, 1 season is not enough to form an opinion on a manager IF you need a performance straight away from them, we've got no more learning time in the champsionship.

And, as proven with Jones, surely we want someone who has shown they can be successful at more than one club?

We will be a big fish at Championship level, at least for a season or two. 

No time for experiments.

[CB Fry]

8 hours ago, Pamplemousse said:

Kompany was an up and coming manager and look at Burnley.

Meanwhile Norwich and Watford failed with experienced managers

It's almost like there is no magic formula.

[CB Fry]

7 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

I think most fans would rather we paid out for your Graham Potter’s than your Nathan Jones’.

Equally a club that wants to push for promotion immediately needs players to do this.
With a culling and rebuild of an entire squad you need a calibre and level of player to do this.

You will attract a better player, whether it be a promising Championship player or a decent Premier League player dropping down by having a Graham Potter rather than a Nathan Jones.

🤷🏻‍♂️

It's a nonsensical idea that the only thing stopping us getting Graham Potter is us "paying out" enough and somehow the club will "choose" between paying out for Potter and paying less for someone else. You realise Potter himself has a say in these things, right?

He is not going to be our manager, get used to it.

Honestly if he did take the job I would seriously question his sanity and judgement because it would be a pretty mental thing for him to do at this point in his career.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by CB Fry

[FarehamSaintJames]

We aren’t an unattractive prospect. I know everyone is frustrated or numb that today is the day of going down, unless we do the Saintsy thing of winning and prolonging it for another week. 
But the club could get most managers of a good calibre if they pay the right money. Money talks ultimately.

But going for a lower EFL manager doesn’t strike me as the way forward. It strikes me as nonsensical as the Nathan Jones appointment or people that were chiming for Nigel Adkins to come back. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I’m sure we have a shortlist, but we need to show ambition, not “risk and hope it pays off and we look geniuses” - that didn’t work out with Nathan Jones or Ruben Selles.
It just strikes of risking the same thing over and over again. Insanity.

As an EFL club with a reset coming, this is the most glamorous an opportunity we will be. If we get a League One manager and we’re fifteenth in mid February, no one is coming in to change that.

I don’t think anything I’ve said is outrageous. A risk is good, but when it hasn’t worked on the previous two occasions why risk it a third time when you already don’t have the fans onside?

[Hodgey]

I’d have thought both Dean Smith and Chris Wilder would be on the list. The reality is that Potter or Cooper aside there are no obvious candidates  (of course we’ve gifted Forest 6 pts to stop any chance of the latter). It’s going to be a risk with someone with success and no experience, or someone who had success at that level followed by failure.

I think it’s dawning on everyone what a monumental task we have ahead of us. Expectations will be interesting - we’ll talk up winning it but I think play offs and a strong end to the season is more realistic (wouldn’t surprise me if we do a Coventry).

on the plus side you’d hope Ankerson will not underestimate this league given he talks it up all the time. 

[FarehamSaintJames]

Ankersen thought buying Football Manager wonderkids would see Saints propel to the top six. Did anyone tell him in real life you can’t quit and start again if we lose a match?

[CB Fry]

33 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

We aren’t an unattractive prospect. I know everyone is frustrated or numb that today is the day of going down, unless we do the Saintsy thing of winning and prolonging it for another week. 
But the club could get most managers of a good calibre if they pay the right money. Money talks ultimately.

But going for a lower EFL manager doesn’t strike me as the way forward. It strikes me as nonsensical as the Nathan Jones appointment or people that were chiming for Nigel Adkins to come back. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I’m sure we have a shortlist, but we need to show ambition, not “risk and hope it pays off and we look geniuses” - that didn’t work out with Nathan Jones or Ruben Selles.
It just strikes of risking the same thing over and over again. Insanity.

As an EFL club with a reset coming, this is the most glamorous an opportunity we will be. If we get a League One manager and we’re fifteenth in mid February, no one is coming in to change that.

I don’t think anything I’ve said is outrageous. A risk is good, but when it hasn’t worked on the previous two occasions why risk it a third time when you already don’t have the fans onside?

We are an attractive proposition. We have money and should go into next season as one of the favourites to go back up.

Graham Potter is not going to be our manager.

Both of those things can be true, and they are.

[Fabrice29]

Just love the idea that we are so attractive and have all the money to attract Potter but without Potter or some other big name that no good player will be wanting to play for us.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by Fabrice29

[tunit]

If three at the back is what Rasmus wants to pin us to then we could do a lot worse than Nuno Espirito Santo. I'm sure he'd happily move back to England from Saudi. 

[bpsaint]

Graham Potter links are pretty far off the mark I think, if he hadn’t played for us nobody would be even talking about him realistically coming here. The fact is he was a Saint for one season and only made 8 appearances, he’s not some club legend that made 100s of appearances.

Id fully expect him despite the Chelsea failure to end up at a club like Palace, or maybe Brentford or villa should their managers get poached.

[goodymatt]

It’s frustrating that we could have had Eddie Howe or De Scerbi but got the timing of sacking Ralph so wrong.

I stand by my earlier comment that is is possible to attract a PL quality manager at championship level. Fulham did it with Marco Silva. Newcastle kept Benitez at this level and Burnley kept Dyche the last time around. All 3 got their teams promoted at the first attempt. 

My opinion is that we need an experienced manager considering the significant amount of change we are about to undergo on both playing and organisational structure levels. The best option is one that had been successful at PL level but then recently had a failure (just as Marco Silva had).

The only recent options I can think of that meet that criteria are:

Brendan Rodgers - did so well for so long at Leicester. Close to title with Liverpool. Great football at Swansea too. For me this is actually the most logical appointment, despite his derisory comments about us being ‘on course to be a CL club’ and is having a ‘choice’ leading to us all pantomime hating on him.

Rafa Benitez - this guy has all the experience in the world, including getting Newcastle promoted. Everton have been a shower and I would afford him a free pass on that.

Patrick Vieira - not as successful as the others, sacked at last 2 clubs. However he did pretty well at rebuilding that palace team with young players and last season I thought they were a great watch. Even if that was down to palace recruiters he made it work until that tough run of fixtures when he was harshly sacked. 

All 3 of these would command more respect and give me more confidence than the ‘up and coming’ options muted. Like others, I see Potters failure at Chelsea being too big a drop to managing us in the championship next, especially with his financial situation post sacking.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by goodymatt

[S-Clarke]

The links to inexperienced managers concern me greatly, as if true it means the powers that be haven't learnt a single thing from this season - and that could spell certain disaster.

I'm not dismissing the quality of 'inexperienced' managers, there is a high probability that some of them will end up going onto greater things - but it's all about timing. No matter what they think inside the corridors of St Mary's, this is an incredibly unstable and dysfunctional club right now. There is change across all levels from directors, coaches, players, managers etc. That level of change requires experience at all levels to manage, in some cases others stepping up to fill temporary voids etc.

There will be a huge player turnover this summer and that is immediately putting a hell of a lot onto an inexperienced manager to come in and manage, he'd have never been in that situation before. If we had a bit more stability and we weren't about to go through wholesale change everywhere then we may be able to take a stab at one of those younger managers, but to do so this summer would be a catastrophic decision and another one in the long-line of SR blunders.

We need someone with experience who the players will respect and look up to, can manage wholesale change and someone who can help attract players - in addition to getting the fan base on side. We've been burnt with a gamble so surely they are not daft enough to try it again, in what will be our most important season in a generation. Get this wrong and we are toast.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by S-Clarke

[goodymatt]

2 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

The links to inexperienced managers concern me greatly, as if true it means the powers that be haven't learnt a single thing from this season - and that could spell certain disaster.

I'm not dismissing the quality of 'inexperienced' managers, there is a high probability that some of them will end up going onto greater things - but it's all about timing. No matter what they think inside the corridors of St Mary's, this is an incredible unstable and dysfunctional club right now. There is change across all levels from directors, coaches, players, managers etc. That level of change requires experience at all levels, including the manager hot seat. 

There will be a huge turn over this summer in players and that is asking a lot for an inexperienced manager to come in and manage, he'd have never been in that situation before. If we had a bit more stability and we weren't about to go through wholesale change everywhere then we may be able to take a stab at one of those younger managers, but to do so this summer would be a catastrophic decision and another one in the long-line of SR blunders.

We need someone with experience who the players will respect and look up to, someone who can help attract players but most importantly get the fan base on side. We've been burnt with a gamble so surely they are not daft enough to try it again, in what will be our most important season in a generation. Get this wrong and we are toast.

Couldn’t agree more. 

[Whitey Grandad]

To me, “inexperienced” means “don’t know what they’re doing”

[FarehamSaintJames]

The same people arguing that “we won’t get someone like Potter therefore it isn’t worth pursuing” are the same people that will be moaning about the lack of ambition if we went and got, say, the Plymouth manager. 🤦🏻‍♂️

 

[FarehamSaintJames]

18 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

The links to inexperienced managers concern me greatly, as if true it means the powers that be haven't learnt a single thing from this season - and that could spell certain disaster.

I'm not dismissing the quality of 'inexperienced' managers, there is a high probability that some of them will end up going onto greater things - but it's all about timing. No matter what they think inside the corridors of St Mary's, this is an incredibly unstable and dysfunctional club right now. There is change across all levels from directors, coaches, players, managers etc. That level of change requires experience at all levels to manage, in some cases others stepping up to fill temporary voids etc.

There will be a huge player turnover this summer and that is immediately putting a hell of a lot onto an inexperienced manager to come in and manage, he'd have never been in that situation before. If we had a bit more stability and we weren't about to go through wholesale change everywhere then we may be able to take a stab at one of those younger managers, but to do so this summer would be a catastrophic decision and another one in the long-line of SR blunders.

We need someone with experience who the players will respect and look up to, can manage wholesale change and someone who can help attract players - in addition to getting the fan base on side. We've been burnt with a gamble so surely they are not daft enough to try it again, in what will be our most important season in a generation. Get this wrong and we are toast.

Pretty much the points I’ve been thinking earlier on.

Big club in the Championship at the start of the season - we’re attractive with the prospect of a rebuild for any manager of any calibre.

Big club in the Championship that is sixteenth in February having employed an untried or inexperienced manager with little to no authority/respect (something we tried with Jones and Selles), we are not.

[ErwinK1961]

28 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

The links to inexperienced managers concern me greatly, as if true it means the powers that be haven't learnt a single thing from this season - and that could spell certain disaster.

I'm not dismissing the quality of 'inexperienced' managers, there is a high probability that some of them will end up going onto greater things - but it's all about timing. No matter what they think inside the corridors of St Mary's, this is an incredibly unstable and dysfunctional club right now. There is change across all levels from directors, coaches, players, managers etc. That level of change requires experience at all levels to manage, in some cases others stepping up to fill temporary voids etc.

There will be a huge player turnover this summer and that is immediately putting a hell of a lot onto an inexperienced manager to come in and manage, he'd have never been in that situation before. If we had a bit more stability and we weren't about to go through wholesale change everywhere then we may be able to take a stab at one of those younger managers, but to do so this summer would be a catastrophic decision and another one in the long-line of SR blunders.

We need someone with experience who the players will respect and look up to, can manage wholesale change and someone who can help attract players - in addition to getting the fan base on side. We've been burnt with a gamble so surely they are not daft enough to try it again, in what will be our most important season in a generation. Get this wrong and we are toast.

The big question then.. who is this manager that fits all of that criteria? I’ve seen a lot of talk about this, but no mention of any actual realistic names.

Potter for example (who isn’t realistic) meets 1 or 2 of that criteria. 

I don’t think we should be dismissing up and coming younger EFL managers, just because of Nathan Jones. 

[S-Clarke]

9 minutes ago, ErwinK1961 said:

The big question then.. who is this manager that fits all of that criteria? I’ve seen a lot of talk about this, but no mention of any actual realistic names.

Potter for example (who isn’t realistic) meets 1 or 2 of that criteria. 

I don’t think we should be dismissing up and coming younger EFL managers, just because of Nathan Jones. 

Steve Cooper is number 1 on my very short list. I don't think he stays at Forest next season no matter what happens with them, I think we should be all over that.

Viera/Henry combo at 2nd - So much experience as players, they've experienced all personalities, they know the standards, they're strong enough to manage change and implement their views. They won't be yes men.

Rafa - old school, but knows what he's doing. Might not totally fit with a long-term view though, which is my only question mark. But he certainly knows football at the highest level to help navigate us through choppy waters.

Marsch - Still on my list but my last choice, has experience at the top level, has a style that potentially suits. Positive character etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not dismissing young mangers because I think they'll be another Jones, it's just that we can't underestimate how big a job this is. It needs someone strong at the head of it, not someone else learning on the job.

Edited 13 May, 2023 by S-Clarke

[saint1977]

4 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Steve Cooper is number 1 on my very short list. I don't think he stays at Forest next season no matter what happens with them, I think we should be all over that.

Viera/Henry combo at 2nd - So much experience as players, they've experienced all personalities, they know the standards, they're strong enough to manage change and implement their views. They won't be yes men.

Rafa - old school, but knows what he's doing. Might not totally fit with a long-term view though, which is my only question mark. But he certainly knows football at the highest level to help navigate us through choppy waters.

Marsch - Still on my list but my last choice, has experience at the top level, has a style that potentially suits. Positive character etc.

This is exactly who should on the shortlist. Cooper #1, Benitez #2, Vieira/Henry #3, Marsch decent option but club fucked that up I suspect. Instead, the shortlist is probably the 30 year old at Reims, a 34 year old from the Belgian League, John Mousinho, Steven Schumacher (just for retro effect eg Sturrock) or the Cowley Bros.

[Osvaldorama]

30 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Steve Cooper is number 1 on my very short list. I don't think he stays at Forest next season no matter what happens with them, I think we should be all over that.

Viera/Henry combo at 2nd - So much experience as players, they've experienced all personalities, they know the standards, they're strong enough to manage change and implement their views. They won't be yes men.

Rafa - old school, but knows what he's doing. Might not totally fit with a long-term view though, which is my only question mark. But he certainly knows football at the highest level to help navigate us through choppy waters.

Marsch - Still on my list but my last choice, has experience at the top level, has a style that potentially suits. Positive character etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not dismissing young mangers because I think they'll be another Jones, it's just that we can't underestimate how big a job this is. It needs someone strong at the head of it, not someone else learning on the job.

Very sensible list, completely agree with this. We need a name, a presence and some experience to steady the ship. 

We will probably gamble on an unknown entity though knowing ankersen 

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, Whitey Grandad said:

To me, “inexperienced” means “don’t know what they’re doing”

Pep and Jurgen were 'inexperienced' once....

[miserableoldgit]

Nothing we didn't know....but a decent summing up. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/how-arrogance-dithering-and-flawed-policy-led-to-southampton-disaster-znvt99v57

[trousers]

3 minutes ago, miserableoldgit said:

Nothing we didn't know....but a decent summing up. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/how-arrogance-dithering-and-flawed-policy-led-to-southampton-disaster-znvt99v57

 

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Pep and Jurgen were 'inexperienced' once....

And so am I but that doesn't mean that I could do a good job of managing Southampton. 

It's survivability bias of course.  We never hear about the inexperienced ones who never make it. 

[LegalEagle]

There better not be any thought or suggestion that Selles stays in charge after this gutless end to this miserable campaign. No fight, no effort, no spirit, no desire. Truly pathetic. JWP is also the captain of this shower. Take a good look at yourself Mr Ward-Prowse. You’re not blameless. 

[manji]

7 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

Ankersen thought buying Football Manager wonderkids would see Saints propel to the top six. Did anyone tell him in real life you can’t quit and start again if we lose a match?

Rasmus is not responsible for recruitment anymore FFS

[AlexLaw76]

4 minutes ago, manji said:

Rasmus is not responsible for recruitment anymore FFS

He has done enough damage to the club......yet he will still have influence, sadly

[Dr. Kucho]

13 minutes ago, manji said:

Rasmus is not responsible for recruitment anymore FFS

He was in January whilst he could have just let one of the senior scouts take care of the transfers. The guy is full of shit and nothing more than a fraud. 

[S-Clarke]

52 minutes ago, manji said:

Rasmus is not responsible for recruitment anymore FFS

I don't think we're naive enough to think he has no influence, maybe not full influence, but his fingers are still all over this no matter what anyone says.

[Viking Saint]

8 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

We aren’t an unattractive prospect. I know everyone is frustrated or numb that today is the day of going down, unless we do the Saintsy thing of winning and prolonging it for another week. 
But the club could get most managers of a good calibre if they pay the right money. Money talks ultimately.

But going for a lower EFL manager doesn’t strike me as the way forward. It strikes me as nonsensical as the Nathan Jones appointment or people that were chiming for Nigel Adkins to come back. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I’m sure we have a shortlist, but we need to show ambition, not “risk and hope it pays off and we look geniuses” - that didn’t work out with Nathan Jones or Ruben Selles.
It just strikes of risking the same thing over and over again. Insanity.

As an EFL club with a reset coming, this is the most glamorous an opportunity we will be. If we get a League One manager and we’re fifteenth in mid February, no one is coming in to change that.

I don’t think anything I’ve said is outrageous. A risk is good, but when it hasn’t worked on the previous two occasions why risk it a third time when you already don’t have the fans onside?

Bang on and complete sense. 

Don't bother applying for a job at St Mary's

[Viking Saint]

5 hours ago, goodymatt said:

It’s frustrating that we could have had Eddie Howe or De Scerbi but got the timing of sacking Ralph so wrong.

I stand by my earlier comment that is is possible to attract a PL quality manager at championship level. Fulham did it with Marco Silva. Newcastle kept Benitez at this level and Burnley kept Dyche the last time around. All 3 got their teams promoted at the first attempt. 

My opinion is that we need an experienced manager considering the significant amount of change we are about to undergo on both playing and organisational structure levels. The best option is one that had been successful at PL level but then recently had a failure (just as Marco Silva had).

The only recent options I can think of that meet that criteria are:

Brendan Rodgers - did so well for so long at Leicester. Close to title with Liverpool. Great football at Swansea too. For me this is actually the most logical appointment, despite his derisory comments about us being ‘on course to be a CL club’ and is having a ‘choice’ leading to us all pantomime hating on him.

Rafa Benitez - this guy has all the experience in the world, including getting Newcastle promoted. Everton have been a shower and I would afford him a free pass on that.

Patrick Vieira - not as successful as the others, sacked at last 2 clubs. However he did pretty well at rebuilding that palace team with young players and last season I thought they were a great watch. Even if that was down to palace recruiters he made it work until that tough run of fixtures when he was harshly sacked. 

All 3 of these would command more respect and give me more confidence than the ‘up and coming’ options muted. Like others, I see Potters failure at Chelsea being too big a drop to managing us in the championship next, especially with his financial situation post sacking.

Rodgers can fuck off. He has zero respect for our club. Benitez, yes but wouldn't get him. Vieira, men.

[gammon cheeks]

Worst Saints team ever ! 150 million spent on shit players and managers fn crazy 

[harvey]

Just someone who knows what they're doing would be nice 🤷‍♂️

[Fan The Flames]

Living in Kent I know a few Palace fans and the stuff coming out about Vieira wasn't great. I know this stuff gets said when a manager gets sacked, but a couple of the guys I know are quite level headed. 

Vieira apparently lost the dressing room this season and there was a lot of bad feeling between him and a lot of the players. I thought he was treated harshly but a lot of Palace fans thought he had to go in the end.

[david in sweden]

On 12/05/2023 at 10:26, Charlie Wayman said:

It's all very well recruiting players that know what it takes to do well in the Championship but surely the plan must be to build a squad that can return us to the PL and stay there. The sort of players you have in mind will not be able to compete at the higher level so we'd end up back where we started. Futile.

Agreed Charlie,  but I don't see us making an immediate return to Prem. - after the sale of our "star internationals " and then releasing those who have failed

to come upto standard, we are left with a group of battered one-season starlets who have struggled to make the grade, and are clearly out of their depth.    

Although we may admit those teenagers bought last summer have some skill,  it's also clear that 10 stone weaklings, who lack muscle will not be able to take care of

themselves in the tough environment of the Championship, and won't last a 46 game season. 

The game time lost through injury has accounted for much of this season's problems and our goal tally is nothing to even discuss, and despite their

Championship success I don't see the likes of Adam. A or Che Adams  suddenly finding form just because we drop a division. 

 

I'm enthusiastic about our youngsters, but don't see them taking the Championship title any season soon without the benefit of more experienced types

to guide and advise,  both on and off the pitch .   

[ally_uk]

Get Rafa in now 

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

Appointing an inexperienced manager (which I've no doubt Saints will) will result in one thing. A mid-table finish. 

Unless we get some experience in and someone who can attract some experienced players then I don't see us finishing in the top half. 

[FarehamSaintJames]

Has Selles buggered off yet?

[Miltonaggro]

2 hours ago, manji said:

Rasmus is not responsible for recruitment anymore FFS

Rather like saying Rolf Harris is not on TV anymore. 

[EBS1980]

I can see the appeal of an experienced manager of an ex pro who had a successful career. You want someone who the players will respect and see what it takes to make it. 
 

something the last two managers haven’t instilled in the players. 

[davefizzy14]

An experienced manager it has to be. 

[Whitey Grandad]

Just now, davefizzy14 said:

An experienced manager it has to be. 

Someone who knows what he is doing.

[S-Clarke]

2 minutes ago, EBS1980 said:

I can see the appeal of an experienced manager of an ex pro who had a successful career. You want someone who the players will respect and see what it takes to make it. 
 

something the last two managers haven’t instilled in the players. 

I look at it similar to the Koeman season, that could have been a really, really messy season had we had an inexperienced/young manager overseeing that level of change. But we had someone with the reputation and presence of Koeman to steady everyone, and demand instant respect and high standards. We recruited well, but I think having someone of his ilk drove standards massively.

An inexperienced young coach, no matter how much potential they have, will not do that - and in a summer where we will go through substantial change, we need a figure head who knows football at the top of it all.

[Dellman]

2 minutes ago, davefizzy14 said:

An experienced manager it has to be. 

Experienced in what? Playing, like Lampard and Rooney? No thanks. Experienced as managers---Rafa, Poch etc yes please, but why would they take a step down, that's the problem. I believe Sport Republic are well intentioned and have had a big shock. They will reorganise themselves, come to their senses and repair the damage they have done. That's our hope,

 

 

 

r

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, Dellman said:

Experienced in what? Playing, like Lampard and Rooney? No thanks. Experienced as managers---Rafa, Poch etc yes please, but why would they take a step down, that's the problem. I believe Sport Republic are well intentioned and have had a big shock. They will reorganise themselves, come to their senses and repair the damage they have done. That's our hope,

 

 

 

r

They should not be shocked. Wasn't Ankerson around Brentford when they were fighting for promotion 

[Dusic]

Wonder if MLT and Lambert fancy a jab at taking us back up?

Imagine the data-science led recruitment policy wouldn't be to their liking but otherwise a good chance for them to unmask the clubs potential.

[Fabrice29]

On the back of todays performance I can't handle the thought of having to watch anymore clueless in possession play at home. If Russel Martin is the most extreme possession based manager we can find and promises to really focus on hammering it into a group of players then I would very much welcome that. 

[manji]

8 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

The same people arguing that “we won’t get someone like Potter therefore it isn’t worth pursuing” are the same people that will be moaning about the lack of ambition if we went and got, say, the Plymouth manager. 🤦🏻‍♂️

 

We can easily afford Potter and joining us would be hugely appealing with our remaining players and by far the highest spending money not including any players we sell.

Yet again the fans scapegoat is going back to overseeing the Sports Republic roster which he will be perfectly suited.

I really don’t think a lot of the fans understand the complicated business model.

[whelk]

Get Potter…….please

[Sheaf Saint]

1 hour ago, Dusic said:

Wonder if MLT and Lambert fancy a jab at taking us back up?

Imagine the data-science led recruitment policy wouldn't be to their liking but otherwise a good chance for them to unmask the clubs potential.

Could be just the shot in the arm the club needs.