Summer Transfer Window 2023

[aintforever]

Would only be worth selling him if we have a decent replacement lined up. 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, egg said:

That makes no sense on any level. 

We've wasted a fortune and recouped some of it. We're stuck with the wages on big Paul and other players we won't play, plus money due on our multiple failed signings. To ditch our deadwood, we'll doubtless have to put our hands in our pockets. 

As a fan I'd like to keep him. As a business person, I can see that any sensible business owner would take the money and reinvest. 

So if we end up keeping Alcaraz, what would be the business case for that? Surely you'd offer him around and get rid to make some cash? 

[hypochondriac]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

That makes no sense on any level. 

We've wasted a fortune and recouped some of it. We're stuck with the wages on big Paul and other players we won't play, plus money due on our multiple failed signings. To ditch our deadwood, we'll doubtless have to put our hands in our pockets. 

As a fan I'd like to keep him. As a business person, I can see that any sensible business owner would take the money and reinvest. 

It's unclear that Martin wants him other than the multiple quotes of him literally saying "I really want to keep him" 

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

when many of the championship talents have been sold or been made otherwise unavailable. 

who are you talking about?

Do you not think there are any decent strikers out there somewhere that we could buy? I know our track record ain't good.

[egg]

6 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

So if we end up keeping Alcaraz, what would be the business case for that? Surely you'd offer him around and get rid to make some cash? 

That post makes little sense either. Selling Che or letting him walk for nothing has nothing to do with Alcaraz. 

[egg]

6 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It's unclear that Martin wants him other than the multiple quotes of him literally saying "I really want to keep him" 

Yet he starts him in 1 game from 3. Hardly a sign that he's RM's chosen man is it. 

[Chez]

6 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

So if we end up keeping Alcaraz, what would be the business case for that? Surely you'd offer him around and get rid to make some cash? 

Who says we are offering players we want around?

The business case is very different compared to Che, as Alcarez has a long contract - he ain't walking for free next summer. If someone comes in with a £40m bid tomorrow morning, which is perhaps what we think he might become, we'd sell. 

[hypochondriac]

3 minutes ago, Chez said:

who are you talking about?

Do you not think there are any decent strikers out there somewhere that we could buy? I know our track record ain't good.

I think there probably are. I'm not sure as we get closer to the end of the window that there are many who would want to sign for us, are better than Adams, have a proven record in the championship and are good value. Maybe I'll be proven wrong but I called it as I saw it last year about the lack of a striker and that was ultimately correct. 

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, Chez said:

Who says we are offering players we want around?

The business case is very different compared to Che, as Alcarez has a long contract - he ain't walking for free next summer. If someone comes in with a £40m bid tomorrow morning, which is perhaps what we think he might become, we'd sell. 

You could easily make a business case for keeping Adams based upon him being wildly successful this year and getting us promotion. 

[hypochondriac]

5 minutes ago, egg said:

Yet he starts him in 1 game from 3. Hardly a sign that he's RM's chosen man is it. 

He said earlier that the reason he didn't start the season is because it was expected that he would have been sold (some speculation that he was possibly being sold to Bournemouth.) I assume he was working on the assumption that he wouldn't be here and so set up early in the season as if he wouldn't be. Makes perfect sense and doesn't mean he doesn't want him. 

[Ralph Fastenbüttl]

Imagine having a Summer Transfers thread that is actually about transfer news/rumours and isn't just pages and pages and pages of the same half dozen bawbags endlessly passively-aggressively 'well actually-ing' everyone to death (sorry, I mean "having conversations with people") and then whining like little babies when they're called out for their utterly tedious behaviour? The dream.

[JRM]

55 minutes ago, Chez said:

You can't let £15m players walk for free in this league. Financial suicide for championship clubs. Sell, reinvest and hopefully improve. 

 

Financial suicide is pissing away money in deadline day panic signings like Tall Paul , not selling a player capable of getting the goals for promotion that would return much more in income, tell me total transfer fees received already ?  its more likely we'd waste money on replacement and Everton won't be paying it all up front either . 

 

 

Edited 20 August, 2023 by JRM

[Baird of the land]

6 minutes ago, Chez said:

Who says we are offering players we want around?

The business case is very different compared to Che, as Alcarez has a long contract - he ain't walking for free next summer. If someone comes in with a £40m bid tomorrow morning, which is perhaps what we think he might become, we'd sell. 

I’m curious about this business case mantra. So saints were completely wrong to keep Morgan for an extra year for the sake of squad stability.

[hypochondriac]

4 minutes ago, Ralph Fastenbüttl said:

Imagine having a Summer Transfers thread that is actually about transfer news/rumours and isn't just pages and pages and pages of the same half dozen bawbags endlessly passively-aggressively 'well actually-ing' everyone to death (sorry, I mean "having conversations with people") and then whining like little babies when they're called out for their utterly tedious behaviour? The dream.

Personally I find the comments moaning about that alleged behaviour to be even more tedious but maybe that's just me. Let's remember you were moaning and filling this board with tedium all of Friday night so it's a bit rich to be moaning about others being boring. 

Edited 20 August, 2023 by hypochondriac

[egg]

2 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

You could easily make a business case for keeping Adams based upon him being wildly successful this year and getting us promotion. 

You'll just have to accept that SR will not let Che walk for nowt next year, however much you'd like them to. To me their decision is perfectly understandable. 

[Colinjb]

We better be beyond busy over the next ten days.

[Chez]

1 minute ago, hypochondriac said:

I think there probably are. I'm not sure as we get closer to the end of the window that there are many who would want to sign for us, are better than Adams, have a proven record in the championship and are good value. Maybe I'll be proven wrong but I called it as I saw it last year about the lack of a striker and that was ultimately correct. 

so what are you calling now, selling Che is an error? Or are you going to wait to see who we do or don't sign first before calling it? 

 

[egg]

1 minute ago, JRM said:

Financial suicide is pissing away money in deadline day signings like Tall Paul , not selling a player capable of getting the goals for promotion that would return much more in income, tell me total transfer fees received already ?  its more likely we'd waste money on replacement and Everton won't be paying it all up front either . 

 

 

The fact that we've wasted money on players is one reason why we cannot and will not let the valuable ones walk away for free. 

I share your concern though that we may not get the replacement right. Fingers crossed. 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, egg said:

You'll just have to accept that SR will not let Che walk for nowt next year, however much you'd like them to. To me their decision is perfectly understandable. 

I accept that that is most likely what they will do. If it costs us promotion though then it's an idiotic decision and underlines the folly of looking at a club purely in those terms (see our analytical approach to taking on Jones last year as an example.)

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, Chez said:

so what are you calling now, selling Che is an error? Or are you going to wait to see who we do or don't sign first before calling it? 

 

Yes I think selling Che Adams is a risk that we don't need to take. I of course hope that that risk pays off but I would rather we didn't do so. 

[S-Clarke]

I think a lot of the pessimism here is our lack of faith in recruitment. It may be that £15m is a good deal, but the faith people have in the clubs ability to replace that player like it's a doddle worries me.

We could quite easily lose Che for £15m, pat ourselves on the back, and end up in a deadline day loop like last year where we fail to get any of our targets. I personally think we're hitting the point where first team sales need to stop, as we simply won't have time to adequately replace.

If we had faith in our setup to find the 'next' Adams or a better Adams I doubt there'd be as much pessimism, but we're heading into a bit of an unknown with no midfield and no proven strikers which is quite a horrific place to be in 3 weeks into the season. 

[Hopper]

This Unuzni lad we've been linked with looks like a baller, crazy work ethic in some of his clips tracking back. Could be the option should Tella go?

[egg]

1 minute ago, hypochondriac said:

I accept that that is most likely what they will do. If it costs us promotion though then it's an idiotic decision and underlines the folly of looking at a club purely in those terms (see our analytical approach to taking on Jones last year as an example.)

It seems that Che has suddenly become irreplaceable, and the difference between promotion and staying down. Personally, I've always liked him and I think he'll score a shit load in this league, but if we can't convince him to sign an extension, we've got to take the money and roll the dice. It's a risk for sure, but this season and under Wilcox, I have faith in SR. What I wouldn't want to see is Tella or Alcaraz sold - we need them, and there's no wisdom in moving either on now. 

[hypochondriac]

Just now, egg said:

It seems that Che has suddenly become irreplaceable, and the difference between promotion and staying down. Personally, I've always liked him and I think he'll score a shit load in this league, but if we can't convince him to sign an extension, we've got to take the money and roll the dice. It's a risk for sure, but this season and under Wilcox, I have faith in SR. What I wouldn't want to see is Tella or Alcaraz sold - we need them, and there's no wisdom in moving either on now. 

I think that getting his replacement wrong coukd very well be the difference between promotion or failure. I don't think we have to roll the dice, it's a decision we are deciding to make and one which I do understand to be fair I just don't agree with the decision if we make it. The post above from S-Clarke sums up my thoughts rather well. I simply don't have enough faith in the club to adequately replace the players we may now lose in the small amount of time we have available and being able to convince clubs to sell for reasonable prices in the final days of the transfer window. 

[maysie]

Literally the same people slagging Che off last year for being one of the reasons we were relegated are now having major breakdowns that we are selling him. You couldn’t write it.

Also, the setup in terms of recruitment with Wilcox and Mowbray is totally different to the Jan transfer window, so I don’t know why people are comparing two totally different situations in every way possible as  a yardstick to measure our track record.

Some of you need to calm down a fair bit your emotions are like teenage girls (apologies if you are in fact all teenage girls).

[Maggie May]

10 minutes ago, Hopper said:

This Unuzni lad we've been linked with looks like a baller, crazy work ethic in some of his clips tracking back. Could be the option should Tella go?

12 years ago this would’ve been the same description for Steve de Ridder.

[Chez]

 

4 minutes ago, Baird of the land said:

I’m curious about this business case mantra. So saints were completely wrong to keep Morgan for an extra year for the sake of squad stability.

what a good question, and (just as I am about to retire for evening) I will concede to your better judgement that keeping Che perhaps makes total sense, although I will leave you with: sell him in 2014 and we perhaps get £40m and sign a top class replacement. Sell him in 2015 for £25m and we only have enough to buy Jordy fucking Clasie. 

 

[S-Clarke]

3 minutes ago, maysie said:

Literally the same people slagging Che off last year for being one of the reasons we were relegated are now having major breakdowns that we are selling him. You couldn’t write it.

Also, the setup in terms of recruitment with Wilcox and Mowbray is totally different to the Jan transfer window, so I don’t know why people are comparing two totally different situations in every way possible as  a yardstick to measure our track record.

Some of you need to calm down a fair bit your emotions are like teenage girls (apologies if you are in fact all teenage girls).

I've always liked Che, I don't think it was fair how we hung him out without a main striker though - we kind of set him up to fail, as in the PL he's a very capable support man - but cannot be relied on for goals.

At this level I think he'll find he has more time and he'll get more goals, so that's why I'd be keen to keep him.

And I hope more than anything that you a re right about the recruitment, but it's a little bit of blind faith at the moment. A hell of a lot needs to happen in just over a week and all we're seeing are links out, which is the worrying aspect.

[Chez]

14 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I think a lot of the pessimism here is our lack of faith in recruitment. It may be that £15m is a good deal, but the faith people have in the clubs ability to replace that player like it's a doddle worries me.

We could quite easily lose Che for £15m, pat ourselves on the back, and end up in a deadline day loop like last year where we fail to get any of our targets. I personally think we're hitting the point where first team sales need to stop, as we simply won't have time to adequately replace.

If we had faith in our setup to find the 'next' Adams or a better Adams I doubt there'd be as much pessimism, but we're heading into a bit of an unknown with no midfield and no proven strikers which is quite a horrific place to be in 3 weeks into the season. 

lets hope we sign an Ings not an Onuachu.

[maysie]

Just now, S-Clarke said:

I've always liked Che, I don't think it was fair how we hung him out without a main striker though - we kind of set him up to fail, as in the PL he's a very capable support man - but cannot be relied on for goals.

At this level I think he'll find he has more time and he'll get more goals, so that's why I'd be keen to keep him.

And I hope more than anything that you a re right about the recruitment, but it's a little bit of blind faith at the moment. A hell of a lot needs to happen in just over a week and all we're seeing are links out, which is the worrying aspect.

I agree with most of what you say but Martin and Wilcox seems decent authentic people and hasn’t Martin said we have replacements already lined up? If they go back on their word I’ll be the first to slag off the club. For everything I’ve seen from the pair so far, I’m inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt at the moment.

[egg]

17 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I think a lot of the pessimism here is our lack of faith in recruitment. It may be that £15m is a good deal, but the faith people have in the clubs ability to replace that player like it's a doddle worries me.

We could quite easily lose Che for £15m, pat ourselves on the back, and end up in a deadline day loop like last year where we fail to get any of our targets. I personally think we're hitting the point where first team sales need to stop, as we simply won't have time to adequately replace.

If we had faith in our setup to find the 'next' Adams or a better Adams I doubt there'd be as much pessimism, but we're heading into a bit of an unknown with no midfield and no proven strikers which is quite a horrific place to be in 3 weeks into the season. 

There's a lot to agree with there. The issue though is the expectation that SR will let Che walk for nothing. It just won't happen. Beyond that, I wouldn't sell any other players that RM wants for the first team. I'd find a way of shifting those he doesn't want though. 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, Chez said:

lets hope we sign an Ings not an Onuachu.

The point is that with Adams we know he is going to get us goals and almost certainly throughout the season. With whoever else we get in we don't really know what they will give us. Given our history and given the huge amount of positions we already need to recruit for in a week or so, I can see why a number of people are voicing concerns. Also bringing in a striker who is less successful will really piss me off in a way that a misfiring full back just wouldn't. 

[Hopper]

4 minutes ago, Maggie May said:

12 years ago this would’ve been the same description for Steve de Ridder.

This is why we as fans don't make the transfer decisions 💀😂

Still remember his goal against Reading mind!

[Whitey Grandad]

2 hours ago, Chez said:

Is Che Adams better than Piroe?

Can I be greedy and want both?

[EBS1980]

How I see it with Che is as it stands he obviously doesn’t want to sign a new contract. 
We are then faced with the decision, do we sell him now and get a decent fee for him still and enable us to buy a replacement forward or do ee gamble, keep him and hope he continues to be fully focused and up for the fight. We might get promoted and hopes he then stays or we risk him moving on for free. The other risk is he stays and we don’t get promoted and we have missed out on a decent fee and promotion and still need to buy a replacement.

He was average in the PL so I think we have to take the cash and reinvest. 

[hypochondriac]

3 minutes ago, EBS1980 said:

How I see it with Che is as it stands he obviously doesn’t want to sign a new contract. 
We are then faced with the decision, do we sell him now and get a decent fee for him still and enable us to buy a replacement forward or do ee gamble, keep him and hope he continues to be fully focused and up for the fight. We might get promoted and hopes he then stays or we risk him moving on for free. The other risk is he stays and we don’t get promoted and we have missed out on a decent fee and promotion and still need to buy a replacement.

He was average in the PL so I think we have to take the cash and reinvest. 

Both of those options are gambles. 

[St. Neil]

Keep Adams until January if he bangs in a load between now and then his price won't go down. In fact Everton will be even more desperate in January even with only 6 months left on his contract....................................well that's how it works in football manager.

[SNSUN]

3 minutes ago, Chez said:

lets hope we sign an Ings not an Onuachu.

I think our concern, as fans, is this. It's not so much that we're desperate to keep Adams because he's very good at this level but that we doubt the club can replace him adequately. Our striker signings since Ings have been crap and even the Ings signing seemed like a bit of a punt (with his injury record) that happened to pay off. We've had strikers like Mara, Onuachu, Long, Mayuka, Walcott, Gabbiadini, Juanmi, etc etc since we went up to the Prem and really the only hits were Ings, Pelle and to a much lesser extent Broja and Austin. A good striker is hard to find and the worry is we'll end up starting the season with AA, Mara, Onuachu and a new striker who also ends up being crap. Better the devil you know. That said I think £15 million+ would be decent money for a striker in the last year of his contract who probably wants to continue playing in the Prem, so we have to hope the replacement comes in and hits the mark. I think Piroe has proved he could do that at this level, but if it isn't him then we just have to hope Wilcox et al have another good striker target lined up.

 

Or hope Mara or Onuachu come good...

[Saint IQ]

Linked with Duk from Aberdeen and Piroe.

If we sold Adams and bought 2 in I'd be happy.

Also hoping Ballard will break through and contribute this season.

Surprised we haven't got many Centre Mid links. Would have thought we will get at least 1 in, maybe 2?

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

1 minute ago, St. Neil said:

Keep Adams until January if he bangs in a load between now and then his price won't go down. In fact Everton will be even more desperate in January even with only 6 months left on his contract....................................well that's how it works in football manager.

In January Che will be able to negotiate his own deals

[Lee On Solent Saint]

Has the possibility of Che agreeing to stay come into the equation? Maybe he has told the club he wants to stay, hence first start of the season.

[SaintsFan86]

 

 

[Roboze]

The Problem with letting anyone go now, is that most teams are bedding in their sides fir the season ahead, and we will mainly get the cast offs to pick over..... not a good position to be in! batten down the hatches and lets get on with it.

 

[notnowcato]

4 hours ago, Challenger said:

SR had absolutely no idea what was required to keep the club in the Prem last season, and I am seeing no evidence so far that they have any idea what's required to get back there.

I'm quite happy to be proved wrong, but I'm not convinced.

Quite happy to be proven wrong- fuck off

[Saint86]

3 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Wow! 

You can have any opinion you want, simply talking about the risks involved in selling all our best players and trying to replace the all in the last week or two of the window as opposed to maybe keeping one or two, isn't "bedwetting" or some other type of unacceptable opinion. It's a perfectly legitimate view to hold. Of course I will pass comment when inevitably we bring replacements in which we clearly will but I'm perfectly entitled to view that as a risk and question why we wouldn't look to keep the likes of Adams and Tella. I'll be giving my opinion about the wisdom of selling at this point of the window and also passing comment about the replacements and our subsequent performances. Shockingly you can do both and you can also have an opinion that develops as things change. You should try it some time. 

Anyone who thinks it's a good idea to sell Che is saying it on blind hope (that we'll not miss him) imo. But equally we are extremely unlikely to replace him with a player of the same quality; whilst at the same time, he is our best striker. So we'd be weakening the team for minimal financial gain in the short term and certainly damage our promotion expectations in the long term. 

If we got promoted and we use him as a key player within the campaign then it is likely he'd stay, if that isn't the case then he'll leave for free. It's a gamble either way from a financial perspective, but the risk reward is certainly in favour of keeping him at the £12-15M price point. 

Also, as I've said previously, if the club in question is Everton then we shouldn't deal with them on principle.... And we should charge them a premium. But even better would be to keep them along for the ride and reject shortly before the window closes. I think they're going down regardless this year and they have just lost their key striker and need to replace him without a pot to piss in - another reason we should charge them a premium 😈

Edited 21 August, 2023 by Saint86

[SNSUN]

41 minutes ago, Saint86 said:

Anyone who thinks it's a good idea to sell Che is saying it on blind hope (that we'll not miss him) imo. But equally we are extremely unlikely to replace him with a player of the same quality; whilst at the same time, he is our best striker. So we'd be weakening the team for minimal financial gain in the short term and certainly damage our promotion expectations in the long term. 

If we got promoted and we use him as a key player within the campaign then it is likely he'd stay, if that isn't the case then he'll leave for free. It's a gamble either way from a financial perspective, but the risk reward is certainly in favour of keeping him at the £12-15M price point. 

Also, as I've said previously, if the club in question is Everton then we shouldn't deal with them on principle.... And we should charge them a premium. But even better would be to keep them along for the ride and reject shortly before the window closes. I think they're going down regardless this year and they have just lost their key striker and need to replace him without a pot to piss in - another reason we should charge them a premium 😈

They also want Sulemana - that would be a £40 million odd outlay on 2 players which I don't believe Everton have. Ok Sulemana has been linked with a loan there but personally I don't see why we should be doing them any favours.

[Dark Munster]

4 hours ago, egg said:

It seems that Che has suddenly become irreplaceable, and the difference between promotion and staying down. Personally, I've always liked him and I think he'll score a shit load in this league, but if we can't convince him to sign an extension, we've got to take the money and roll the dice. It's a risk for sure, but this season and under Wilcox, I have faith in SR. What I wouldn't want to see is Tella or Alcaraz sold - we need them, and there's no wisdom in moving either on now. 

After last season's shit show I certainly don't.

[Long Shot]

4 hours ago, SaintsFan86 said:

 

 

We’ve already got enough Ghanaians who don’t want to be here. 

[Pilchards]

Wilcox probably sat through all the matches from January onwards and thought this Adams bloke has got to go. Slap 15m on his head as he’s on a one year contract.

Turning out that he’s good in the championship but your options are limited because he wont sign a new contract.

Just make sure the striker coming in is proven and will hit the ground running otherwise you may of pissed this seasons promotion opportunity away.

[dankiz15]

Downes finally in will be a great way to start week alongside offloading a couple from deadwood pile. 7 points from 9 especially having played Norwich who look a tidy outfit, a decent return too, encouraging through the chaos. In two minds re Che, If he won't sign a new contract, I guess £15m represents good business especially if club have a replacement in mind. I like Che, he is the perfect championship player, strong, bullying defender type, but he does miss sitters too. Arma looking like he is revelling under Martin, if he goes on a run, could be a golden asset. 10 days to go, I am strangely calm, it maybe wrong, but I just get the impression if we sell any of the 4 attracting bids, we have a readymade replacement in line. That might be the wrong opinion, but we look like a side who are having fun this season, so hopefully will be an attractive option for a player looking to have a successful season with promotion as the massive prize.