Summer Transfer Window 2023

[Whitey Grandad]

16 minutes ago, DT said:

£35m feels like a good price for JWP to go with our blessing but only if it translates to getting someone like Downes or Grimes, plus Piroe, plus a decent CB,. And maybe a keeper to get rid of McCarthy. Otherwise I'd always prefer a player to the money in. Not sure West Ham is a great move for him, but feels about his level.

Take £30m provided McCarthy goes with him?

[Saint Scott]

30 minutes ago, Turkish said:

it really isn't

It is when we are fully aware West Ham have over £100m in their pocket for Rice still.

Their fanbase is getting increasingly frustrated and the panic buying will set in soon to appease that. We should be taking them to the cleaners.

[Turkish]

2 minutes ago, Saint Scott said:

It is when we are fully aware West Ham have over £100m in their pocket for Rice still.

Their fanbase is getting increasingly frustrated and the panic buying will set in soon to appease that. We should be taking them to the cleaners.

Why does that matter? £35m is a fair price for Ward-Prowse.

We will soon have £80m in our pocket for the sale of Livramento and Lavia. Does this mean we should pay £20m for Matt Grimes now?

[Saint Scott]

1 minute ago, Turkish said:

Why does that matter? £35m is a fair price for Ward-Prowse.

We will soon have £80m in our pocket for the sale of Livramento and Lavia. Does this mean we should pay £20m for Matt Grimes now?

I disagree. Is rice three times the player of JWP?

A model professional that barely misses a minute, covers the most ground and arguably the best set piece taker in the world. Add to that the English player tax it adds up to a lot more despite his age.

Granted, the club may have a gentleman's agreement with him, but given how stubborn Wilcox has been with prices so far this summer I think our agreed valuation is likely closer to £50m

[Fabrice29]

9 minutes ago, Saint Scott said:

It is when we are fully aware West Ham have over £100m in their pocket for Rice still.

Their fanbase is getting increasingly frustrated and the panic buying will set in soon to appease that. We should be taking them to the cleaners.

You’d be going mental if we were interested in spending 30 plus million on a relegated 28 year old midfielder with a good free kick last season. 

[benali-shorts]

What are the net prices to us for Lavia and Tino? There was talk of Tino being c£24m of the £40m sale (and presumably part of that is add-ons). I assume Lavia is less 20% of the profit - if we paid ?£14m and sell for £40m guaranteed plus add-ons, we'd be paying City c£5m so £35m to us? Maybe £55-60m for them both?

[Turkish]

Just now, Saint Scott said:

I disagree. Is rice three times the player of JWP?

A model professional that barely misses a minute, covers the most ground and arguably the best set piece taker in the world. Add to that the English player tax it adds up to a lot more despite his age.

Granted, the club may have a gentleman's agreement with him, but given how stubborn Wilcox has been with prices so far this summer I think our agreed valuation is likely closer to £50m

£50m 

 

 

[Fabrice29]

7 minutes ago, Saint Scott said:

I disagree. Is rice three times the player of JWP?

A model professional that barely misses a minute, covers the most ground and arguably the best set piece taker in the world. Add to that the English player tax it adds up to a lot more despite his age.

Granted, the club may have a gentleman's agreement with him, but given how stubborn Wilcox has been with prices so far this summer I think our agreed valuation is likely closer to £50m

Yes he’s three times the player and given his age and potential to prove he more than justifies the price. However that’s not the way it works anyway.

Reliability is a good trait yes.

Covers the most ground - who are you comparing him to? 

Best set piece taker in the world? His corners are pump so let’s call it what it is, he’s possibly the best free kick taker in the world.

 

 

 

[Lighthouse]

3 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

You’d be going mental if we were interested in spending 30 plus million on a relegated 28 year old midfielder with a good free kick last season. 

Relegated means nothing if you’re financially stable, as we are and 28 is usually just hitting the peak of the average playing career. We wouldn’t be buying proven, fit, English players in the prime of their career because we wouldn’t be able to afford them at all.

[Smirking_Saint]

13 minutes ago, Saint Scott said:

I disagree. Is rice three times the player of JWP?

A model professional that barely misses a minute, covers the most ground and arguably the best set piece taker in the world. Add to that the English player tax it adds up to a lot more despite his age.

Granted, the club may have a gentleman's agreement with him, but given how stubborn Wilcox has been with prices so far this summer I think our agreed valuation is likely closer to £50m

In his position yes

Rice is pretty much in the top two DMs in the premier league, its either him or Rodri… but considering JWP has an entirely different skillset its a lazy comparison 

35m is a fair price for JWP imo, Id of liked more due to his obvious value to us is probably more than his appropriate market value

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Smirking_Saint

[Winchester Red]

If what he's worth to them is less than what he's worth to us, then he doesn't get sold.  Simple as that.

IF we don't need the money then market value (whatever that is) doesn't really come into it.

[Fabrice29]

1 minute ago, Lighthouse said:

Relegated means nothing if you’re financially stable, as we are and 28 is usually just hitting the peak of the average playing career. We wouldn’t be buying proven, fit, English players in the prime of their career because we wouldn’t be able to afford them at all.

So let’s put our buying heads on and ask ourselves if we’d really be keen on a captain who just led his team to relegation, who is at his peak and has no resale value and if being ‘proven and fit’ but ousted of the national team by the guy we just sold is really enough to justify us spending over 30 million on. 

Saints have every right to demand what they like but I’m not shocked there aren’t many interested and a bit shocked West Ham are still keen (although less shocked when you realise it’s Moyes).

[Lighthouse]

1 minute ago, Fabrice29 said:

So let’s put our buying heads on and ask ourselves if we’d really be keen on a captain who just led his team to relegation, who is at his peak and has no resale value and if being ‘proven and fit’ but ousted of the national team by the guy we just sold is really enough to justify us spending over 30 million on. 

Saints have every right to demand what they like but I’m not shocked there aren’t many interested and a bit shocked West Ham are still keen (although less shocked when you realise it’s Moyes).

Like I said, we wouldn’t be buying him because we wouldn’t be able to afford him. Lots of good players have been relegated, nobody out there believes we went down because of JWP and he has a good five years left, minimum playing at that level. £25m today would buy Elyounoussi or Sully. JWP is clearly a level above that.

[Fabrice29]

8 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Like I said, we wouldn’t be buying him because we wouldn’t be able to afford him. Lots of good players have been relegated, nobody out there believes we went down because of JWP and he has a good five years left, minimum playing at that level. £25m today would buy Elyounoussi or Sully. JWP is clearly a level above that.

We’d be able to afford a 30 million transfer but we’d actively choose not to because it’s a daft decision for a club like us. Even dafter when you consider the player JWP is and the value it would represent. Which is why the daftest and least coherent run PL team of them all are the only ones still interested. 

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Fabrice29

[GDog07]

32 minutes ago, Saint Scott said:

Is rice three times the player of JWP?

Declan Thrice 

[Turkish]

54 minutes ago, Smirking_Saint said:

In his position yes

Rice is pretty much in the top two DMs in the premier league, its either him or Rodri… but considering JWP has an entirely different skillset its a lazy comparison 

35m is a fair price for JWP imo, Id of liked more due to his obvious value to us is probably more than his appropriate market value

yep £35m is fair for Ward-Prowse, i'd actually say £30m is fair and £35m would be a very good deal.

The comparisons to Rice are crazy. Rice is 24 coming into his prime is one of the first names on the England team sheet and was wanted by top clubs in the country. Ward-Prowse is nearly 29, appears to only have one team after him and as much as we like him is at best a midtable player. That's not an insult to him, it still makes him a premier league level player and a very good player but that's the reality,  Rice is a younger, much better player with his best years ahead of him, Ward-Prowse is not far from the age where when your games is based around work rate and fitness those things start to wain, he might be a freak like Milner who is still super fit in their mid thirties but he might not be. And we all know the "is Rice three times better" argument is a load of nonsense.

[gio1saints]

Kasper Schmiechel. Apparently available for £2m. Is that a good idea? Would he be interested? 

[Saint Garrett]

I wouldn’t be selling him for £35m personally if we don’t need the money. He’s worth more than that to us IMO. He’s fantastic and could easily carry on playing into his later 30s given his reliability, his fitness, and the fact he doesn’t rely on pace. 

Just my opinion though, 

[tdmickey3]

1 minute ago, Saint Garrett said:

I wouldn’t be selling him for £35m personally if we don’t need the money. He’s worth more than that to us IMO. He’s fantastic and could easily carry on playing into his later 30s given his reliability, his fitness, and the fact he doesn’t rely on pace. 

Just my opinion though, 

Spot on Saint Garrett, fully agree.... worth much, much more to us

Rice is not worth over 3 times more than JWP, they play different roles in any case

[Winchester Red]

3 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

Kasper Schmiechel. Apparently available for £2m. Is that a good idea? Would he be interested? 

Interesting one.  A replacement for Willy and probably AM too?

Could graduate into a goalkeeping coach role and could certainly help GB from the off.

Does he still have it though.  He's already 36.

His leaving Leicester definitely coincided with their demise. 

[gio1saints]

One of the factors that we ( as supporters) take into account but the Club (as a business) do not is that of some supporters being incurable romantics. 
 

“ we love southampton, we do, we love southampton we do” etc “ I can’t read and I can’t write but that don’t really matter..” owtsgmi, and so on. 
 

Only love struck fools or normally sensible people temporarily struck incurable softies by being huddled together with others same, would chant such abject cringy nonsense. 
 

Yet we do. 
 

And that is at the heart ( deliberate pun) of issues like the transfer of JWP. NO standard swooning saints fanboy/ girl/man/woman/they, wants JWP to EVER leave SFC, however when and if we’re far removed from the hypnotic draw and compulsions of the crowd it is possible to unashamedly state that one thinks that £35m is a good price. 

I am personally not going to say that. I just cannot say that about JWP. Because I’m probably an emo fool of the above category.  I want him to stay forever and guide us to World Club Champions Intercontinental cup glory in 2026.😍.
 I don’t want revolving door players at Saints. I like and want the most loyal of the loyal, like our long term fans, to be out on the pitch representing me. And I don’t even care if he’s not as good as he was. I don’t care. He’s ultra loyal.
 

Sometimes it’s not about winning or losing but representing stuff that you value in your life. I value loyalty. I want our skipper, JWP to stay. 

 

 

Edited 7 August, 2023 by gio1saints
SP

[Turkish]

15 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Spot on Saint Garrett, fully agree.... worth much, much more to us

Rice is not worth over 3 times more than JWP, they play different roles in any case

Rice is worth it because Arsenal were prepared to pay it and he’s a youngish player wanted by the top clubs in the world all of which have lots of cash. JWP is worth what he’s worth because there seems to only be one club interested and he’s only going to be attractive to mid to bottom half level clubs. It really isn’t tough to work out. 

[Saint Scott]

56 minutes ago, Turkish said:

yep £35m is fair for Ward-Prowse, i'd actually say £30m is fair and £35m would be a very good deal.

The comparisons to Rice are crazy. Rice is 24 coming into his prime is one of the first names on the England team sheet and was wanted by top clubs in the country. Ward-Prowse is nearly 29, appears to only have one team after him and as much as we like him is at best a midtable player. That's not an insult to him, it still makes him a premier league level player and a very good player but that's the reality,  Rice is a younger, much better player with his best years ahead of him, Ward-Prowse is not far from the age where when your games is based around work rate and fitness those things start to wain, he might be a freak like Milner who is still super fit in their mid thirties but he might not be. And we all know the "is Rice three times better" argument is a load of nonsense.

The three times the price is relevant in that West Ham are the interested club. I never mentioned they played the same position. 

As others have mentioned he is worth a lot more to us and could prove the difference in bouncing straight back up, which in itself is worth £100m.

I personally think he will go, and likely for a fee of £40m with achievable add ons up to the £45m mark. 

I'd of though the CoT (Circle of Tits) would know the price Wilcox has placed on JWP anyway, or are you all too busy sniggering at memes back and forth over DM

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Saint Scott

[Lighthouse]

Ings went for £30m and he was 30, in the last year of his deal and had serious fitness issues. Daka and Scamacca were both over £30m and completely unproven at this level (and ended up being flops). Kalvin Phillips was £45m, he’s better than JWP overall but really £35m is the absolute minimum I’d be considering.

[Osvaldorama]

^ agree. As usual, a load of people here seriously undervaluing JWP. 

In the right system he could easily play for a champions league level side and do well. 

[once_bitterne]

2 hours ago, Saint Scott said:

I disagree. Is rice three times the player of JWP?

A model professional that barely misses a minute, covers the most ground and arguably the best set piece taker in the world. Add to that the English player tax it adds up to a lot more despite his age.

Granted, the club may have a gentleman's agreement with him, but given how stubborn Wilcox has been with prices so far this summer I think our agreed valuation is likely closer to £50m

I always think setpiece is over egging it a bit.  He's one of the best free kick takers but his corners never amount to much and he was just about the worst regular penalty taker in the PL.

[Ashby Saint]

3 minutes ago, once_bitterne said:

I always think setpiece is over egging it a bit.  He's one of the best free kick takers but his corners never amount to much and he was just about the worst regular penalty taker in the PL.

I don't think he shoulders all the blame for the corners when you are aiming at AA in the middle.

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

1 hour ago, Fabrice29 said:

Which is why the daftest and least coherent run PL team of them all are the only ones still interested. 

They're not that daft. They got a brand new stadium for free that we all paid for, held out...and held out...until they rinsed Arsenal of over £100m for one of their players (he's very good, mind) and one of their players won us the World Cup once, don't you know.

And Prowsey could very well be one of those players that just keeps going and going with his dedication and fitness, certainly to well into his 30s if he wants it.

Edited 7 August, 2023 by TheAlehouseBrawlers

[once_bitterne]

2 minutes ago, TheAlehouseBrawlers said:

They're not that daft. They got a brand new stadium for free that we all paid for, held out...and held out...until they rinsed Arsenal of over £100m for one of their players (he's very good, mind) and one of their players won us the World Cup once, don't you know.

And Prowsey could very well be one of those players that just keeps going and going with his dedication and fitness, certainly to well into his 30s if he wants it.

Well he's certainly not going to lose his pace I guess...

[Miltonaggro]

11 minutes ago, Ashby Saint said:

I don't think he shoulders all the blame for the corners when you are aiming at AA in the middle.

If we signed Warwick Davis he'd be a better target man!

[Lord Duckhunter]

55 minutes ago, Winchester Red said:

Interesting one.  A replacement for Willy and probably AM too?

Could graduate into a goalkeeping coach role and could certainly help GB from the off.

Does he still have it though.  He's already 36.

His leaving Leicester definitely coincided with their demise. 

Are you taking the piss? 
 

He’s far far better than any keeper we’ve got. “Replacement for AM”, replacement for the clown who currently masquerades as our number 1 more like. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

18 minutes ago, Osvaldorama said:

 

In the right system he could easily play for a champions league level side and do well. 

Celtic? 

[Mattio]

Watching the highlights of the Plymouth vs Huddersfield game and I'd love Bali Mumba in our team, probably not a priority position to fill but him with a great striker would set the league alight.
 

 

[Miltonaggro]

1 hour ago, gio1saints said:

Kasper Schmiechel. Apparently available for £2m. Is that a good idea? Would he be interested? 

Just what we need to be honest, top pro, something like 450 PL games and 100 caps - zero risk at £2m.  Perfect player to take the pressure off Bazunu and improve his game this season.

[Dr. Kucho]

1 hour ago, gio1saints said:

Kasper Schmiechel. Apparently available for £2m. Is that a good idea? Would he be interested? 

Don’t know if he would be interested, but if we were to sign him I would want him to be our new nr 1 goalkeeper. Or at least challenge Bazunu for the nr 1 spot. 

[goodymatt]

We were linked last summer too.

[hypochondriac]

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

[BARCELONASAINT]

2 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

i totally agree with you and have had a feeling since the end of last season that he would stay, but then like you i'm biased and think his legendary status with us is more important than Premier league football and European football.

I hate to admit it but i think he is off. 

[St Louis]

9 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

Whilst I'd love him to stay, I do think we often view these decisions with our rose tinted specs on. As well as the guarantee of Premier League and European Football, I would imagine he could add £50k - £75k a week extra onto his wages and a signing on fee of between £3m - £5m.
He would also have a much bigger chance of making the Euro's if he has a strong season in Prem/Europe, where as he knows he has zero chance if he stays.
There is also a much bigger chance that West Ham will be in the Premier League next season than Southampton.
And he's also a Skate deep down.

Edited 7 August, 2023 by St Louis

[Saint86]

24 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

I don't think he will be going to West Ham, and certainly not for less than we want. We've sold Tino, we're selling Lavia, the pressure will be entirely on West Ham on this one and we'll be pulling their pants down if we do sell him. Its also entirely irrelevant whether people think £35M is a good price for west ham... We aren't desperate to sell so it comes down to how desperate they are for him (by all accounts they aren't) and whether we're happy with what we can milk them for re making a sale attractive to us.

I personally think he'll still be here come the end of the window. I suspect he's done a bit of a mental juggle and decided that there is little point joining a club like Fulham vs staying until at least January with saints and potentially taking us up, probably a similar equation for West Ham tbh as they are not in a great place and have the demands of Europe as well (although they would be far more attractive than Fulham re prestige and opportunity). He will still be on a decent wage with saints, if we're on for promotion he knows he's got a good chance of returning to whatever he was on previously, and he has his rumoured highest earner clause. As a few footballing people have said, he might also enjoy winning week in and out and fancy his own "promotion moment" like Lambert and co before him. He is a Southampton man through and through, and his stated aim 2 years ago was for his son to see him lifting a trophy for saints. However, if a club like Spurs comes knocking he'll be very keen to take it obviously. There was an interesting comment that came out of the club that implied we may need to encourage people out of the club for the club's benefit, but i can't believe that was JWP related as opposed to numerous others. But who knows i guess.

There is also no way he is making the euro's squad lets be honest. Philips played about 8min last season and still went ahead of him. He'll be behind the likes of Gallagher as well this year. His time in an England shirt is sadly finished barring a move to a top 7 side.

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Saint86

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

7 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

Biased but spot on. I really do not buy into this leaving to win things. Being a local legend outweighs medals.

[waylander]

I don't think JWP will go to WH. The recently appointed director of football doesn't want him, and if the owners are unlikely to overrule him.

[Chez]

1 hour ago, Winchester Red said:

Interesting one.  A replacement for Willy and probably AM too?

Could graduate into a goalkeeping coach role and could certainly help GB from the off.

Does he still have it though.  He's already 36.

His leaving Leicester definitely coincided with their demise. 

He was turd the season before they were relegated. Made a shed load of mistakes that he'd be crucified for on here. Personally, I think he has been massively overrated and Leicester should have upgraded a few years back. Not to say he's not better than AM, but I don't think he's coming to the championship this summer.

[revolution saint]

26 minutes ago, goodymatt said:

We were linked last summer too.

I had no idea he was related to Alan Ball (great uncle apparently).  Can't see any way we would get him though - apparently City have turned down a bid of 30M for him and Sheff Utd have asked for him back on loan again.  

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, Sergei Gotsmanov said:

Biased but spot on. I really do not buy into this leaving to win things. Being a local legend outweighs medals.

I don't know. I can see the attraction but I don't see West ham as particularly likely to win anything. As an example, Mark noble stayed for West Ham when they went down and is now a local hero. 

[Chez]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

We’d be able to afford a 30 million transfer but we’d actively choose not to because it’s a daft decision for a club like us. Even dafter when you consider the player JWP is and the value it would represent. Which is why the daftest and least coherent run PL team of them all are the only ones still interested. 

There's me thinking it was us not West Ham that went down.

[Chez]

51 minutes ago, Mattio said:

Watching the highlights of the Plymouth vs Huddersfield game and I'd love Bali Mumba in our team, probably not a priority position to fill but him with a great striker would set the league alight.
 

 

He was suggested earlier on this thread by one or two of us. One of the best players in League 1 last season. Norwich sold him for £1m this summer. Record signing for Plymouth, but seems a bargain. No idea why Norwich did that, but money is very tight, so maybe they had to.

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Chez

[Toussaint]

24 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I do think jwp will leave and there is a part of me - however irrational it is- that will be a bit miffed at him. If he stays and we go up this year that just burnishes his reputation and makes him more of a legend. If he goes now he just becomes like many other players who were great. He could take a small risk this year and reap the rewards in years to come. I know what I'd do bit I'm biased! 

I'd prefer him to stay, even if he reviewed the situation in January if we are not heading in the right direction.

Edited 7 August, 2023 by Toussaint

[Chez]

20 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

i totally agree with you and have had a feeling since the end of last season that he would stay, but then like you i'm biased and think his legendary status with us is more important than Premier league football and European football.

I hate to admit it but i think he is off. 

I'd be extremely surprised if he didn't leave. 

[once_bitterne]

3 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Relegated means nothing if you’re financially stable, as we are and 28 is usually just hitting the peak of the average playing career. We wouldn’t be buying proven, fit, English players in the prime of their career because we wouldn’t be able to afford them at all.

How on earth do you know that we are 'financially stable'?  We were running at a multi-million pound loss under Gao with small net spend but last season spent over £160m on transfer fees alone to get relegated and are now in a league with massively less revenue (even with parachute payments).

Our owner really isn't rich or stupid enough to fund this so we have to sell a lot of players to survive.