Kamaldeen Sulemana

[The Cat]

Such a funny player. Breezes past people at will but then also amusingly naive at times.

If he could shoot it would make a big difference.

[RedWillie]

+ if he could stay upright a bit more it would help. Fell over 3 times in 2 minutes today 

[stknowle]

All the skills, strength snd speed you’d think would inevitably result in a superb footballer but it just isn’t happening. Weird.

[beatlesaint]

All fart, no shit. 
Really fail to see anything in him at all.

[West end Saints]

Would be surprised if he didn't end up at a much higher level than us.

I enjoy watching him - in the opponents half. From where I sit you could clearly see their right back face when he was one on one, it was a picture and he was beating him so easily.

However why he runs across our own box doing I have no idea.

[pimpin4rizeal]

56 minutes ago, stknowle said:

All the skills, strength snd speed you’d think would inevitably result in a superb footballer but it just isn’t happening. Weird.

He has indeed got all the skills and pace which is exactly why people should have patience with him .. even players like Raheem sterling even though quick can be wasteful or make wrong decisions a lot .. and if all your getting is little cameos off the bench that’s not always gonna happen .. 

The raw attributes are there for him to be s awesome player we need to devolop him not fuck him off as early as this 

[Tommy Mulgrew]

48 minutes ago, West end Saints said:

Would be surprised if he didn't end up at a much higher level than us.

I enjoy watching him - in the opponents half. From where I sit you could clearly see their right back face when he was one on one, it was a picture and he was beating him so easily.

However why he runs across our own box doing I have no idea.

Because Manning fucked up a chance to clear the ball, which fell to Sully, who had two opposition players in close attendance and did not have much of an alternative to trying to cut inside and clear the danger.  He did not succeed but imo it is harsh to blame him for the goal.  Other than kicking the ball all the way across the pitch and out into row z, he did not have many choices available to him.

[stknowle]

1 hour ago, beatlesaint said:

All fart, no shit. 
Really fail to see anything in him at all.

Well, there’s the fart bit for starters….

[Whitey Grandad]

9 hours ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

Because Manning fucked up a chance to clear the ball, which fell to Sully, who had two opposition players in close attendance and did not have much of an alternative to trying to cut inside and clear the danger.  He did not succeed but imo it is harsh to blame him for the goal.  Other than kicking the ball all the way across the pitch and out into row z, he did not have many choices available to him.

There are times when that is the best option.

[FarehamSaintJames]

He had an opportunity to knuckle down after the summer window closed (a bit like Leeds and some of their stars, I doubt Rutter and Gnonto wanted to stick around).

He didn’t grasp the opportunity though. His valuation must’ve dropped considerably.

[coalman]

He's solidly 4th out of our wingers in terms of end product.

Ryan Fraser        1238 mins         6 goals              2 assists

Sam Edozie        1204 mins         6 goals              3 assists

Kalmadeen Sulemana                824 mins                0 goals                3 assists

David Brooks        385 mins            2 goals             3 assists

Brooks is out front though has played less so his numbers might be skewed however is creating more for others (2 key passes per game which puts him out in front). Almost nothing between Edozie and Fraser. Then back in the distance is Sulemana.

Due to his pace and close control he may become the next Mane but right now we have more effective options. 

[AlexLaw76]

Bit like Alcaraz, his style is not something suited to Martin's football set up

Edited March 10 by AlexLaw76

[S-Clarke]

You need subs to make an impact and I don't see it.

Aribo and Rothwell both impacted the game when they came on, Fraser did when he was used as a sub. Sulemana's impact was getting dispossessed for 2-1 and having Bednarek screaming at him. Sulemana just plays on the periphery of the game, he can beat a man ends up but there's just no product to that - so it's null and void really.

I know people say he'll come good, we've got to let him mature etc - but there's no point, because he won't be maturing or coming good with us - he's off in the summer whatever happens with us, guaranteed. So from a here and now point of view I don't see any point in persevering with someone who won't be here after July, it feels like he's just passing through.

[saintant]

He's completely the wrong fit for an RM side. You see him running freely with the ball then suddenly he stops and looks confused because he knows the mantra is pass, pass and pass again. Doubt he'll ever fit the current set-up or even contribute much as a sub. If we get any decent offers in the summer it's probably time to cash-in.

[Chez]

13 hours ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

Because Manning fucked up a chance to clear the ball, which fell to Sully, who had two opposition players in close attendance and did not have much of an alternative to trying to cut inside and clear the danger.  He did not succeed but imo it is harsh to blame him for the goal.  Other than kicking the ball all the way across the pitch and out into row z, he did not have many choices available to him.

spot on. Rewind the tape a few seconds further and you will see a pretty woeful clearance come pass from Bednarek that started the whole process. Zero blame for him though.  All three players are attempting to get the ball down and play out of trouble, which is our footballing philosophy. On another day those attempts turn into a break and possibly a chance to score. Yesterday it didn't.  

[Chez]

24 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

he's off in the summer whatever happens with us, guaranteed.

Is there no chance he stays if we go up?

[Mr X]

16 hours ago, ErwinK1961 said:

It’s all well and good having pace and tricks, but if you don’t have a football brain it doesn’t really matter. 

Exactly this, original comment = #sarcasm 

Edited March 10 by Mr X

[HKsaint]

He is an expensive Djenepo

[S-Clarke]

1 hour ago, Chez said:

Is there no chance he stays if we go up?

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

I always have the feeling with him that he see's himself as better than us, might just be my mind playing tricks on that, but that's how I see him. I've always found it hard to warm to him and feel like we should be prioritising the development of Edozie, SAA, Dibling etc over someone who will be off at the first chance.

I know there's talk of him not being an RM style player, but Aribo, Edozie, Fraser, Armstrong, S Armstrong, SAA, Mara have all contributed more than him this year - and if he's not an RM style player he's in the minority. I'm all for wingers who attack with pace, but you need something at the end of it. Our team, given that we play high and exploit spaces out wide, should be absolutely perfect for quick wide players (As shown with Fraser, Edozie and Armstrong when he's played there). But for some reason, Sulemana, as a quick wide player, can't seem to produce the same levels.

[AlexLaw76]

1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

I always have the feeling with him that he see's himself as better than us, might just be my mind playing tricks on that, but that's how I see him. I've always found it hard to warm to him and feel like we should be prioritising the development of Edozie, SAA, Dibling etc over someone who will be off at the first chance.

I know there's talk of him not being an RM style player, but Aribo, Edozie, Fraser, Armstrong, S Armstrong, SAA, Mara have all contributed more than him this year - and if he's not an RM style player he's in the minority. I'm all for wingers who attack with pace, but you need something at the end of it. Our team, given that we play high and exploit spaces out wide, should be absolutely perfect for quick wide players (As shown with Fraser, Edozie and Armstrong when he's played there). But for some reason, Sulemana, as a quick wide player, can't seem to produce the same levels.

I agree with you. I am sure Sully will have a very good career, just not suited to our style at the moment, and as you say, he probably sees himself a premier league level player. In the right team, he might well be.

I think if we swapped Piroe with Sully, both Leeds and Saints (given the styles) would benefit

[Charlie Wayman]

17 hours ago, beatlesaint said:

All fart, no shit. 
Really fail to see anything in him at all.

Take off your blinkers, you are missing a treat.

[Charlie Wayman]

28 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

I always have the feeling with him that he see's himself as better than us, might just be my mind playing tricks on that, but that's how I see him. I've always found it hard to warm to him and feel like we should be prioritising the development of Edozie, SAA, Dibling etc over someone who will be off at the first chance.

I know there's talk of him not being an RM style player, but Aribo, Edozie, Fraser, Armstrong, S Armstrong, SAA, Mara have all contributed more than him this year - and if he's not an RM style player he's in the minority. I'm all for wingers who attack with pace, but you need something at the end of it. Our team, given that we play high and exploit spaces out wide, should be absolutely perfect for quick wide players (As shown with Fraser, Edozie and Armstrong when he's played there). But for some reason, Sulemana, as a quick wide player, can't seem to produce the same levels.

He is much better than Martin thinks he is. Give him 6 x 90mins and he'll have chance to show what he can do.

Martin persists with donkeys like Adams, Manning and Stephens yet largely ignores his pacy youngsters who could develop into a first class team in a year to two. He will lose a lot of this talent in the summer by pissing them off if he's not careful. I guess as a journeyman himself that is the only style of play that Martin feels comfortable with.

[Tommy Mulgrew]

7 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

There are times when that is the best option.

I agree with you, WG, but that is not the way that our manager wants the team to do it.  KM’s first instinct is to control the ball and run with it but he did not even manage to get full control of it because two opponents were on him so quickly.  Perhaps he would have yanked it had he done so, perhaps not.

[Chez]

5 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

so, basically it just a feeling you have. You don't know for sure and therefore there is a chance that he stays, just as he did last summer when no one made an offer good enough for us to accept. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

On 09/03/2024 at 17:12, Mr X said:

It's clear he's going to be some player 

It’s clear he’s fucking pony. Pound shop Allan Saint-Maximin. 

Edited March 10 by Lord Duckhunter

[woodsaint1]

For close to £25m, he should be tearing it up in the EFL. Instead hes yet to score in 21 games and has only 3 assists. Dibling, Edozie and SAA would all offer more

[S-Clarke]

24 minutes ago, Chez said:

so, basically it just a feeling you have. You don't know for sure and therefore there is a chance that he stays, just as he did last summer when no one made an offer good enough for us to accept. 

Oh i'm not ITK on it or anything, I just feel he's waiting to up sticks and go. Count me surprised if he's still here in September.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

5 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

I always have the feeling with him that he see's himself as better than us, might just be my mind playing tricks on that, but that's how I see him. I've always found it hard to warm to him and feel like we should be prioritising the development of Edozie, SAA, Dibling etc over someone who will be off at the first chance.

I know there's talk of him not being an RM style player, but Aribo, Edozie, Fraser, Armstrong, S Armstrong, SAA, Mara have all contributed more than him this year - and if he's not an RM style player he's in the minority. I'm all for wingers who attack with pace, but you need something at the end of it. Our team, given that we play high and exploit spaces out wide, should be absolutely perfect for quick wide players (As shown with Fraser, Edozie and Armstrong when he's played there). But for some reason, Sulemana, as a quick wide player, can't seem to produce the same levels.

That's how I see him too. Bit like Maitland-Niles last year in that their persona gives off this "I'm too good for this, you're lucky to have me" attitude. That may be totally wrong, but you see Sam Edozie, Sam AA, Fraser busting a gut playing for Saints but Sule seems to not care. And I certainly haven't seen anything that says he can kick a ball hard and straight at goal.

[Harry_SFC]

41 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Oh i'm not ITK on it or anything, I just feel he's waiting to up sticks and go. Count me surprised if he's still here in September.

Yeah I think it's pretty clear to see tbh. He's the kinda guy that plays for himself. He looked gutted after the game yesterday (probably because he failed to score), despite us winning 4-2

Edited March 10 by Harry_SFC

[pimpin4rizeal]

1 hour ago, woodsaint1 said:

For close to £25m, he should be tearing it up in the EFL. Instead hes yet to score in 21 games and has only 3 assists. Dibling, Edozie and SAA would all offer more

I don’t know why people keep using his transfer fee as a stick to beat him with.. it’s not his fault we paid 22 million for him 

also it’s a bit small fry to even think 22 million or whatever it was is a big fee anyway .. for a premier league club like we where at the time 20 million doesn’t guarantee you shit .. clubs like united and Chelsea struggle spending 4 to 5 times that..

also we sign a bunch of players at different fees some values will go up some will go down it’s literally impossible for every players value to increase as the ones on the bench values will drop .. its not worth worrying about fees  

Im just excited that we have a youngster here that  if it clicks could be absolutely terrifying 

[woodsaint1]

1 hour ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I don’t know why people keep using his transfer fee as a stick to beat him with.. it’s not his fault we paid 22 million for him 

also it’s a bit small fry to even think 22 million or whatever it was is a big fee anyway .. for a premier league club like we where at the time 20 million doesn’t guarantee you shit .. clubs like united and Chelsea struggle spending 4 to 5 times that..

also we sign a bunch of players at different fees some values will go up some will go down it’s literally impossible for every players value to increase as the ones on the bench values will drop .. its not worth worrying about fees  

Im just excited that we have a youngster here that  if it clicks could be absolutely terrifying 

Fair enough. But assume we leave the fee aside, his performances have been very poor. Sam Edozie has shown him up and looks the better prospect

[AlexLaw76]

9 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I don’t know why people keep using his transfer fee as a stick to beat him with.. it’s not his fault we paid 22 million for him 

also it’s a bit small fry to even think 22 million or whatever it was is a big fee anyway .. for a premier league club like we where at the time 20 million doesn’t guarantee you shit .. clubs like united and Chelsea struggle spending 4 to 5 times that..

also we sign a bunch of players at different fees some values will go up some will go down it’s literally impossible for every players value to increase as the ones on the bench values will drop .. its not worth worrying about fees  

Im just excited that we have a youngster here that  if it clicks could be absolutely terrifying 

Transfer fee is relevant. I should imagine he commands a relative salary for a fee attached. 
 

 

[coalman]

11 hours ago, pimpin4rizeal said:

I don’t know why people keep using his transfer fee as a stick to beat him with.. it’s not his fault we paid 22 million for him 

also it’s a bit small fry to even think 22 million or whatever it was is a big fee anyway .. for a premier league club like we where at the time 20 million doesn’t guarantee you shit .. clubs like united and Chelsea struggle spending 4 to 5 times that..

also we sign a bunch of players at different fees some values will go up some will go down it’s literally impossible for every players value to increase as the ones on the bench values will drop .. its not worth worrying about fees  

Im just excited that we have a youngster here that  if it clicks could be absolutely terrifying 

The thing that bothers me is that we've dropped to the Championship and he's not absolutely terrifying considering his attributes.

Last season I couldn't believe we barely played him after signing him. This season I've yet to see him show up and be the difference. What I have seen is him flatter to deceive and make some really poor decisions.

If we didn't have Brooks, Edozie and Fraser playing well I'd say give him a run. But right now, Adam Armstrong is preferred in one of our wide roles, Brooks is our most creative player and Edozie is fulfilling his potential. If Fraser wasn't injured I wouldn't even have him on the bench. And that's before even talking about Sam Ame-Ameyaw who is a serious prospect.

Edited March 11 by coalman

[Daft Kerplunk]

I wonder how many people are burned by seeing Mane turn into a world class player after slating him early on. The big difference with Mane for me was that he was still very capable, and showed it sporadically early on, and contributed in the Premier League. At the time, people wanted the finished article straight away. With Kamaldeen, people are being more patient but he should really be tearing it up in the Championship by now. He isn’t yet and that’s not a sign that he will one day be a world beater. Fingers crossed he does though but that’s out of hope, not expectation. 

[Turkish]

15 minutes ago, Daft Kerplunk said:

I wonder how many people are burned by seeing Mane turn into a world class player after slating him early on. The big difference with Mane for me was that he was still very capable, and showed it sporadically early on, and contributed in the Premier League. At the time, people wanted the finished article straight away. With Kamaldeen, people are being more patient but he should really be tearing it up in the Championship by now. He isn’t yet and that’s not a sign that he will one day be a world beater. Fingers crossed he does though but that’s out of hope, not expectation. 

To me he looks like one of the many players who when they're young look like the world is at their feet. Quick, skillful, fans love them because they think they're exciting. The reality is for every Sadio Mane there are 50 who never get anywhere close to fulfilling their potential and end up bumbling around the lower leagues wondering why they never became a superstar. He might go on to be a superstar, the facts tell us he probably wont.

[revolution saint]

44 minutes ago, Daft Kerplunk said:

I wonder how many people are burned by seeing Mane turn into a world class player after slating him early on. The big difference with Mane for me was that he was still very capable, and showed it sporadically early on, and contributed in the Premier League. At the time, people wanted the finished article straight away. With Kamaldeen, people are being more patient but he should really be tearing it up in the Championship by now. He isn’t yet and that’s not a sign that he will one day be a world beater. Fingers crossed he does though but that’s out of hope, not expectation. 

I know Mane gets dragged up a lot but my recollection isn't that of Mane being universally slated.  Obviously there will be some but it didn't feel like overwhelming negative - maybe that's memory playing tricks on me.
With regard to KS - he needs to be better, simple as that.  His output is way behind Fraser and Edozie even on a minutes per goal/assist basis.  He may have more pace and a few more tricks but he's not making them count and is why he's second or third choice.  The ball is in his court - every time he comes on he has a tremendous opportunity and he's not going to get much better than playing in the championship in this team.  I've defended him in the past but he can't complain; if he thinks he's that good then he needs to deliver.

[Wade Garrett]

No end product at the moment.  Get that right and he could be a class player.

[gio1saints]

He hardly ever gets picked to start. His confidence must be low. 

He is a last 20 minutes impact sub. Not somebody trusted to start. 

His job is to take risks and attack flanks.  He can dribble past anyone but final product has not been there _ BUT - I feel he’s often too far ahead of his fellow teammates who are not on his speed wavelength. He’s a maverick player in a team of reliable know what they are going to do Stepford wives type players. 
 

He gets bollocked every match he plays by RM and his teammates for it. Yet persists. He is still a kid so it looks like he’s a sulker. And he does sulk. But he does keep trying over and over again to beat his man and cause danger despite the grief he gets. 
The lad must have sone inner strength to carry on that for sure. If he does not make it at Saints I think he either folds or goes full Sadio Mane mode elsewhere. Just hope it’s with us. He’s worth persisting with imo. I rate him as having an exceptional talent but not yet refined enough. 

Edited March 11 by gio1saints

[chownie20]

I wonder if he would benefit from some starts.  Looked good against Liverpool aside from poor finishing.  Trouble is we dont have time for experiments and need reliable performers!  He did very well when we beat Leeds in the Autumn.  But would you trust him ahead of Fraser/Armstrong/Brooks....possibly not!

[Osvaldorama]

37 minutes ago, revolution saint said:

I know Mane gets dragged up a lot but my recollection isn't that of Mane being universally slated.  Obviously there will be some but it didn't feel like overwhelming negative - maybe that's memory playing tricks on me.
With regard to KS - he needs to be better, simple as that.  His output is way behind Fraser and Edozie even on a minutes per goal/assist basis.  He may have more pace and a few more tricks but he's not making them count and is why he's second or third choice.  The ball is in his court - every time he comes on he has a tremendous opportunity and he's not going to get much better than playing in the championship in this team.  I've defended him in the past but he can't complain; if he thinks he's that good then he needs to deliver.

Spot on, couldn’t agree more. Loads of us saw massive potential in mane. The idea he was slated by all the fans is a fantasy. 
 

He was leagues ahead of Sulemana from day one. 
 

Sulemana has been very very poor so far, but still worth persisting with. If he can find his shooting boots he can be an amazing player. All up to him & his mindset. 

[SaintNewForest]

52 minutes ago, chownie20 said:

I wonder if he would benefit from some starts.  Looked good against Liverpool aside from poor finishing.  Trouble is we dont have time for experiments and need reliable performers!  He did very well when we beat Leeds in the Autumn.  But would you trust him ahead of Fraser/Armstrong/Brooks....possibly not!

He might benefit from starts. But he has to earn them. Have some game-changing appearances off the bench etc. 

At the moment, he's not deserving of starting over the names you've mentioned. I'd even have Edozie starting over him right now.

[Whitey Grandad]

28 minutes ago, SaintNewForest said:

He might benefit from starts. But he has to earn them. Have some game-changing appearances off the bench etc. 

At the moment, he's not deserving of starting over the names you've mentioned. I'd even have Edozie starting over him right now.

He might benefit but what about the rest of us?

[Lord Duckhunter]

37 minutes ago, SaintNewForest said:

He might benefit from starts. But he has to earn them. Have some game-changing appearances off the bench etc. 

 

Exactly

Ryan Frazier did more in his first performance off the bench than this bloke has all season. Every day of the week he can impress the boss. If he’s tearing it up in training day in day out, adding something off the bench, then he’ll earn a start. Instead he gets what he deserves, a few minutes here and there. He can’t even get in our side in the second division, so don’t know why people have any hope he’ll be a game changer. He can run fast, so fucking what, it’s pointless if it leads nowhere. He’s like a headless friggin chicken, an African Forest Gump. Prefer Djennpo over him, and he was pony. 

Edited March 11 by Lord Duckhunter

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Osvaldorama said:

Spot on, couldn’t agree more. Loads of us saw massive potential in mane. The idea he was slated by all the fans is a fantasy. 
 

He was leagues ahead of Sulemana from day one. 
 

Sulemana has been very very poor so far, but still worth persisting with. If he can find his shooting boots he can be an amazing player. All up to him & his mindset. 

it comes from the Sheffield United away game in the league cup when we lost 1-0. He was part of a shite team performance but he was no worse than anyone else but there were a few posts on here about wanting him to fuck off and being useless etc. 

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, SaintNewForest said:

He might benefit from starts. But he has to earn them. Have some game-changing appearances off the bench etc. 

At the moment, he's not deserving of starting over the names you've mentioned. I'd even have Edozie starting over him right now.

how many game changing apperances off the bench has he had so far?

If we are serious about promotion we need to be playing our best team every week not giving underperformers a chance to prove themselves. He is behind Edozie, Frazer, Brooks, Armstrong in the wide positions at the moment and rightly so.

[HKsaint]

I would rather have Onuachu than him.

[lambtiss]

On 10/03/2024 at 13:01, S-Clarke said:

Nah, I think he's off either way. His agent is working over time at the moment I imagine.

I always have the feeling with him that he see's himself as better than us, might just be my mind playing tricks on that, but that's how I see him. I've always found it hard to warm to him and feel like we should be prioritising the development of Edozie, SAA, Dibling etc over someone who will be off at the first chance.

I know there's talk of him not being an RM style player, but Aribo, Edozie, Fraser, Armstrong, S Armstrong, SAA, Mara have all contributed more than him this year - and if he's not an RM style player he's in the minority. I'm all for wingers who attack with pace, but you need something at the end of it. Our team, given that we play high and exploit spaces out wide, should be absolutely perfect for quick wide players (As shown with Fraser, Edozie and Armstrong when he's played there). But for some reason, Sulemana, as a quick wide player, can't seem to produce the same levels.

This is just how I feel. It always  feels as though he is playing for himself rather than the team. Edozie was also precociously skilled with no end product when he arrived but he has learnt whereas Sulemana hasn't. 

[Chez]

18 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Oh i'm not ITK on it or anything, I just feel he's waiting to up sticks and go. Count me surprised if he's still here in September.

You are probably right. I was certainly surprised he was here in September 2023. The league we are in, our ffp situation and importantly the offers we receive will all be factors.   

[Chez]

25 minutes ago, Turkish said:

it comes from the Sheffield United away game in the league cup when we lost 1-0. He was part of a shite team performance but he was no worse than anyone else but there were a few posts on here about wanting him to fuck off and being useless etc. 

he was absolutely fucking abysmal in that game.  Sill better than Lloyd Isgrove (when he came on) though. Not sure he'd been terribly impressive in games before that one, but I think almost immediately after that game he seemed to find his stride and started to score some goals too. And that's what's missing here with Sulemena. Goals. Fraser has scored goals and that sure has helped ingratiate him to the fans. What we need from Sulemana is two or three goals, especially a winning goal.  

[Turkish]

he was but then so was everyone else. Away at a league one club that had two midfielders playing at centre back and we barely created a chance.

He had a few decent games before that though, Arsenal away in the previous round he was good and scored, plus a few other half decent games but it was like say shortly after that Sheffield United game he started to kick on a bit. However he was still inconsistent, people think he was brilliant every week but his time here has rose tinted glasses due to the fact for the second half of his last season here he was magnificent, he scored 8 of his 11 goals that season in the last 8 games. When we sold him it was for a lot of money at the time and most people were happy with the price. It was only a year or so later after a great season at Liverpool and transfer fees went through the roof people started whinging we'd sold him too cheaply.