Che Adams what was that?

[Roger]

What was his performance about today? He arguably was partly responsible for Ralph getting sacked and has been saying how good jones is in the press but my word he was awful today.

[Lord Duckhunter]

He wasn’t awful. He was awful against Forest, he was ok today. 

Edited 21 January, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[SotonianWill]

I don’t think anyone was particularly bad today, just fully mediocre, which when you end up losing makes it even worse.

[woodsaint1]

He has been poor most of the season, but hes not the only one and its not his fault that we're relying so much on him. We should have a better striker starting ahead of him and it also doesnt help that the likes of Edozie, Moi, AA, Mara etc dont look like chipping in with many goals themselves

[Micky]

I think you have to appreciate the ability level of some of our players, which in a lot of cases is very low.  Che's performance today was probably around par for him, don't forget he'll miss at least one sitter per game. He's playing to the best of his ability, it's just that he's not very good. If you think Che's not good though, don't get me started on Adam Armstrong - complete fraud of a player. 

[Stud mark of doom]

Weird decision to start a thread on this - I thought he did pretty well today. Most of the team played well and he did too. 

[Roger]

7 minutes ago, Stud mark of doom said:

Weird decision to start a thread on this - I thought he did pretty well today. Most of the team played well and he did too. 

Don’t know what game you were watching? 

[Sheaf Saint]

His overall performance today was pretty poor, but the thing that really stood out for me was just how crap he was for the first disallowed goal.

There is no excuse for him being offside for starters. It's not like me mistimed his run, he was just stood in an offside position waiting for the ball in to him. Schoolboy stuff really.

Then when it did come to him, I have no idea what exactly he was trying to do with it. There was no clear effort to strike the ball, more a general lurch of his whole body towards it in the hope that he made some sort of contact. Was like he had total brain freeze.

Everything about the incident from his aspect was just utter turd.

[niceandfriendly]

Thread title had me thinking this thread was going to be about his finish for his offside goal 😅 Unconventional.

[saintscottofthenortham]

1 hour ago, Sheaf Saint said:

His overall performance today was pretty poor, but the thing that really stood out for me was just how crap he was for the first disallowed goal.

There is no excuse for him being offside for starters. It's not like me mistimed his run, he was just stood in an offside position waiting for the ball in to him. Schoolboy stuff really.

Then when it did come to him, I have no idea what exactly he was trying to do with it. There was no clear effort to strike the ball, more a general lurch of his whole body towards it in the hope that he made some sort of contact. Was like he had total brain freeze.

Everything about the incident from his aspect was just utter turd.

This just summed him up as a forward. He just, very naturally, isn't one. No instinct in him and give him anything to think about, he'll make a balls of it. A one off you forgive, but he does it time and time again and it has cost us god knows how many points.

[Saint-Michael]

Wacthing him today to me was just more proof we need to sign a decent clinical striker.

[John Boy Saint]

Whilst he put in a shift, have to say me and the chap sat next door were just asking - what are you doing there Che?

[OttawaSaint]

We don't make too many chances so it was fucking shit of him to not be onside for the first disallowed goal. Schoolboy stuff.

Edited 22 January, 2023 by OttawaSaint

[Saint Garrett]

4 hours ago, Roger said:

What was his performance about today? He arguably was partly responsible for Ralph getting sacked and has been saying how good jones is in the press but my word he was awful today.

He wasn’t. 

[verlaine1979]

He's utter gash. The KWP offside goal demonstrated all of his worst qualities: terrible awareness, no anticipation, no technique. Trundles around at 5mph, always on his heels. Che is where our attacking intent goes to die.

[wild-saint]

38 minutes ago, verlaine1979 said:

He's utter gash. The KWP offside goal demonstrated all of his worst qualities: terrible awareness, no anticipation, no technique. Trundles around at 5mph, always on his heels. Che is where our attacking intent goes to die.

Totally agree, Che Adams is the reason saints are going down. Fucking terrible finisher, how many really good chances has he now missed this season?

[SotonianWill]

7 hours ago, OttawaSaint said:

We don't make too many chances so it was fucking shit of him to not be onside for the first disallowed goal. Schoolboy stuff.

worst offsides we’re I think mara and orsic (?) in the dying minutes, could be our last chance to get the ball forward and have a shot and save ourselves a point. offside. how shit do you have to be, it was from the side as well in full view of their defence. 

[S-Clarke]

Not sure why he is being singled out, that was a typical Adams performance. If he had an Ings alongside him he'd him we'd have probably won, with Ings scoring, and Adams work would have been lauded. He's a work horse, not a finisher and as a club we are hanging the guy out to dry by pretending he is a lone PL forward.

[Harry_SFC]

Wasn't his best game but he's never as bad as Adam Armstrong. It's criminal how that guy keeps getting picked. Get Orsic in the side ffs. 

[Roo1976]

33 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Wasn't his best game but he's never as bad as Adam Armstrong. It's criminal how that guy keeps getting picked. Get Orsic in the side ffs. 

But how do we know Orsic is any better?,yeah weve just bought him but is he any better?,still didn't get a chance above that useless twat ELY...........i think because we dont create enough chances througout the 90 plus minutes ,the ones we do get seem hurried and our strikers or whoever always seem to powderfuff the shot hit a defender or the keeper. But games we need to put pressure on those that are around us are getting fewer and increasingly more difficult as the season draws closer.

[Archers Road Stand]

Him and Adam Armstrong are the worst strikers in the PL.

Championship standard, the pair of them. 

[Whitey Grandad]

He was dawdling or daydreaming when he got caught offside for our first ‘goal’. Only half a yard but on such small measures are games won or lost.

[derry]

I just think in footballing terms he's thick. He looked ponderous and slow today and if the ball is in the air wins practically nothing. Stood before the ball was played today and froze and his attempt at finishing was indicative of panic that shows on every clear opportunity he spurns. If anybody wants to see good clinical finishing have a look at some of Tella's goals for Burnley. He is a better finisher than anybody we have as an attacker except maybe Orsic. We need to get him back and give him a run in the free role he obviously enjoys at Burnley. I can't see us buying a better finisher than he has become.

[qwertyell]

Didn't think Adams was any better or worse than usual. 

He is what he is: a striker who is a poor finisher, has no left foot, can't head, and doesn't really anticipate chances. It's not a great combination at this level.

He works hard for the team, though, and links up play quite well.

I will say this: not sure if my mind's playing tricks but I could've sworn he had a little bit of pace once upon a time. Never rapid, but he was mobile. Just plods around like a lump these days. Don't know where that pace has gone.

[whelk]

Adams is shit and getting worse. Not for want of trying though but just not the standard required unfortunately. We are not the only side with this issue though

Edited 22 January, 2023 by whelk

[sledger]

i dont blame them,we took a punt on them becoming premier league players but they havent got it in them,we would improve the side by just getting a 6 foot 6 lump in that wins some challenges,che is 5 foot 10 and doesnt win any aerial challenges,ball just comes straight back at us

[derry]

11 hours ago, SotonianWill said:

worst offsides we’re I think mara and orsic (?) in the dying minutes, could be our last chance to get the ball forward and have a shot and save ourselves a point. offside. how shit do you have to be, it was from the side as well in full view of their defence. 

TV looked at the Mara offside after and showed he was onside but the linesman was twenty yards nearer the goal and wasn't level and got it wrong.

[Saint_clark]

His form has dipped recently and I wondered today if it's a confidence issue from all the talk around the club being about needing a striker in order to stay up. 

Quite funny that so many people are criticising his finishing for being scuffed now though when one of the thing I said when we signed him was how most of his championship goals seemed to be scuffed into the net, and I got laughed at for it for a long time.

[Saint_clark]

5 hours ago, qwertyell said:

Didn't think Adams was any better or worse than usual. 

He is what he is: a striker who is a poor finisher, has no left foot, can't head, and doesn't really anticipate chances. It's not a great combination at this level.

He works hard for the team, though, and links up play quite well.

I will say this: not sure if my mind's playing tricks but I could've sworn he had a little bit of pace once upon a time. Never rapid, but he was mobile. Just plods around like a lump these days. Don't know where that pace has gone.

He's not asked to use it. When was the last time you saw him running beyond the defence? He always drops deep or backs into the defence, he's never making runs.

[Singapore Saint]

15 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Not sure why he is being singled out, that was a typical Adams performance. If he had an Ings alongside him he'd him we'd have probably won, with Ings scoring, and Adams work would have been lauded. He's a work horse, not a finisher and as a club we are hanging the guy out to dry by pretending he is a lone PL forward.

Completely agree, he is to us what Emile Heskey was to Liverpool and England, not a finisher but a provider.

Edited 23 January, 2023 by Singapore Saint
Emile, not Emily, damn autocorrect

[Singapore Saint]

6 hours ago, qwertyell said:

He is what he is: a striker who is a poor finisher, has no left foot, can't head, and doesn't really anticipate chances. It's not a great combination at this level.

Can't head? Did he not score the winner against Spurs in our 3-2 away win with a glorious header from distance, and assist JWP for the first goal with a nice little flick off the head at Everton?

[Saint Fan CaM]

It’s wrong to label a pro player shit…even in the Championship they’ve reached an elite level in relation to the pyramid of the sport. The right question is, are they capable of returning a good performance in the context of (a) the league and opposition they face and (b) the instructions of the Manager they play for. Che (and Armstrong) achieved well in the Championship under those conditions, but moving to Saints changed the context. A change of Manager has not improved their fortunes because NJ has even less off a clue how to utilise a squad lacking in EPL quality than Ralph did. We might have got away with one of Che or Arma…two failing in the same position is a recipe for disaster, as we’ve seen.

[derry]

I ask myself with all the demonstrated faults especially finishing and runs into the goal area on the off chance or staying onside to take through balls etc what the hell have the coaches been doing for the last three years. Tella has improved out of all recognition under Kompany in half a season. His finishing is clinical now, he was a rabbit in the headlights before.

Edited 23 January, 2023 by derry

[sledger]

i dont think tella has improved as much as people like to make out,hes in a team better than the rest in tier 2,che adams would be a 20 + striker in this team (maybe}

[derry]

48 minutes ago, sledger said:

i dont think tella has improved as much as people like to make out,hes in a team better than the rest in tier 2,che adams would be a 20 + striker in this team (maybe}

Have you been watching his games. I've seen every game he has played in the last two months. He has scored some vital game changing goals on the break thanks to his pace and composure.

Edited 23 January, 2023 by derry

[Whitey Grandad]

9 hours ago, Singapore Saint said:

Can't head? Did he not score the winner against Spurs in our 3-2 away win with a glorious header from distance, and assist JWP for the first goal with a nice little flick off the head at Everton?

And Bournemouth.

[derry]

I think people are talking about competing with centre backs when we play high balls from back to front. It says more of the stupidity of the passes because in the centre he is dominated by the big centrebacks attacking the ball. The balls need to be hit out towards the touchline he is nearest to, to give him the chance to compete against a bouncing ball where he has a good chance of winning the ball.

[Charlie Wayman]

On 21/01/2023 at 20:46, Lord Duckhunter said:

He wasn’t awful. He was awful against Forest, he was ok today. 

He wasn't OK on Saturday, he was lazy, disinterested and ball watcher in chief. I kept an eye on him throughout the match, not once was he proactive on the ball or against the ball, he had no understanding or anticipation of the flow of the match, never created chances by making himself available with incisive runs into the box and rarely bothered to chase back when Villa were in possession. Even his attempts to put the Villa goalie under pressure were slow off the mark and half-hearted.

All in all he was a passenger and if Jones-ey had enough bottle he would have hooked him at 30 minutes.

If you were at the match and saw things differently then sobeit.  I have no axe to grind against Adams but how much more patience with him is justified. 

Saint_clark's comment earlier may be relevant. 

Edited 23 January, 2023 by Charlie Wayman

[BERMUDASAINT]

17 hours ago, derry said:

TV looked at the Mara offside after and showed he was onside but the linesman was twenty yards nearer the goal and wasn't level and got it wrong.

I saw that too, replay showed Mara onside, but linesman put up flag instantly? When did they start doing that? Oh yes, SFC are playing, we have our own rules for them.

Seriously, flag strait away for a non offside? When the norm recently has been to let the most obvious offside continue?? Say wahhhhhh?? 

I thought the our goal ruled out by var/ref was weak and the contact was minimal. 

Saints are only going to get out of relegation by beating 11 player, ref , 2 lines persons and var each game. Not an easy challenge.

 

Edited 23 January, 2023 by BERMUDASAINT

[haddock22]

The reality is he is a bit of a plodder and needs a goalscorer alongside him.he may be a nice guy blah blah blah but he doesnt cut it and will be one of the main reasons we go down.At least drop him for a few matches to see the difference

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, BERMUDASAINT said:

I saw that too, replay showed Mara onside, but linesman put up flag instantly? When did they start doing that? Oh yes, SFC are playing, we have our own rules for them.

Seriously, flag strait away for a non offside? When the norm recently has been to let the most obvious offside continue?? Say wahhhhhh?? 

I thought the our goal ruled out by var/ref was weak and the contact was minimal. 

Saints are only going to get out of relegation by beating 11 player, ref , 2 lines persons and var each game. Not an easy challenge.

 

Strange that. At the time I said that Mara was miles offside so  wasn't surprised by the offside flag. I haven't been able to see any replays of it.

[derry]

3 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Strange that. At the time I said that Mara was miles offside so  wasn't surprised by the offside flag. I haven't been able to see any replays of it.

The program I was watching did highlights at the end of the match and reviewed it along with the goals, allowed and disallowed. It showed several angles level, then showed the linesman with his flag up twenty yards further forward. The TV showed onside and the commentators confirmed the linesman had got it wrong. It was pretty obvious he was a good yard onside and the linesman was way offline..

[BERMUDASAINT]

1 hour ago, derry said:

The program I was watching did highlights at the end of the match and reviewed it along with the goals, allowed and disallowed. It showed several angles level, then showed the linesman with his flag up twenty yards further forward. The TV showed onside and the commentators confirmed the linesman had got it wrong. It was pretty obvious he was a good yard onside and the linesman was way offline..

I guess that line ref will get a promotion soon, showing great promiss that he can affect the game to his/their liking. Will be a VAR ref one day.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, derry said:

The program I was watching did highlights at the end of the match and reviewed it along with the goals, allowed and disallowed. It showed several angles level, then showed the linesman with his flag up twenty yards further forward. The TV showed onside and the commentators confirmed the linesman had got it wrong. It was pretty obvious he was a good yard onside and the linesman was way offline..

I find that very hard to believe. The assistant will always position himself/herself so as to be level with the second-last defender. He will raise his flag at the position where the attacker was offside and the angle of the flag will indicate the position across the pitch. If he does the swingy arm motion that means that the attacker has come back from an offside position to receive the ball. 

No chance of a link or reference I suppose?

[The Kraken]

1 hour ago, derry said:

The program I was watching did highlights at the end of the match and reviewed it along with the goals, allowed and disallowed. It showed several angles level, then showed the linesman with his flag up twenty yards further forward. The TV showed onside and the commentators confirmed the linesman had got it wrong. It was pretty obvious he was a good yard onside and the linesman was way offline..

That’s not what happened from how I saw it. The linesman was fairly level with with play when the ball was passed, but he carried on running back towards the goal as Mara chased it. As soon as Mara took a touch of the ball the linesman stopped there and raised his flag. 

They showed a replay during the game which made it look like it was definitely onside. I don’t think the Lino was massively out of position, they just made a poor call.

Edited 23 January, 2023 by The Kraken

[derry]

That may well have been because the picture angle of the linesman was showing him in advance of the offside position not how he got there immediately after showing Mara onside.

[Whitey Grandad]

43 minutes ago, derry said:

That may well have been because the picture angle of the linesman was showing him in advance of the offside position not how he got there immediately after showing Mara onside.

He shouldn’t be level with the offside player at the time the ball is kicking. Once he has determined that the player is offside he should then run to the position where he will raise his flag.

[Osvaldorama]

Was it just me, or does he look a bit unfit? 
 

Seems to be carrying a bit of timber at the mo. Maybe that’s why his form has dropped off. 

[BERMUDASAINT]

19 hours ago, The Kraken said:

That’s not what happened from how I saw it. The linesman was fairly level with with play when the ball was passed, but he carried on running back towards the goal as Mara chased it. As soon as Mara took a touch of the ball the linesman stopped there and raised his flag. 

They showed a replay during the game which made it look like it was definitely onside. I don’t think the Lino was massively out of position, they just made a poor call.

You all have missed my point, when have we seen the flag raised instantly? We have seen time and time again the offside flag not raised for an obvious offside, the play will continue on. Why?  That little twat could not wait to stop the play, even though he was wrong.

[Saint86]

20 hours ago, The Kraken said:

That’s not what happened from how I saw it. The linesman was fairly level with with play when the ball was passed, but he carried on running back towards the goal as Mara chased it. As soon as Mara took a touch of the ball the linesman stopped there and raised his flag. 

They showed a replay during the game which made it look like it was definitely onside. I don’t think the Lino was massively out of position, they just made a poor call.

I was sat in the chapel with my mate (villa fan fwiw) and we both agreed that it was notable officiating against saints in the game. This was the last decision of real note i think, and it was clear that the lino should not have raised his flag and instead allowed the play to continue. Mara looked like he was in line when he ran through. If we had scored then var could have checked. As it was the referee and linesman chose to abandon the rules and deny us another attacking chance.