Nathan Jones

[Lallana's Left Peg]

1 minute ago, saintant said:

I was more than prepared to give him a fair crack of the whip until I saw what he produced after spending 6 weeks working with the squad. Sorry but I expected to see a lot more and it looked more like NJ had arrived the day before the Brighton match and been forced to throw a side together with zero preparation. I admit it's only one game but there were more alarms ringing than when Chernobyl went up.

 

Based on what JWP and Jones said after the game, the players weren't brave enough and weren't good enough to implement what they had worked on.  That's worse than not working on anything at all, because it shows how awful the situation is.  They don't have the mental bottle or the technical ability to follow instructions - and that's automatic relegation in most cases.

[saintant]

1 minute ago, Lallana's Left Peg said:

 

Based on what JWP and Jones said after the game, the players weren't brave enough and weren't good enough to implement what they had worked on.  That's worse than not working on anything at all, because it shows how awful the situation is.  They don't have the mental bottle or the technical ability to follow instructions - and that's automatic relegation in most cases.

I think the after match comments were a bit of a cop-out. Six weeks of intense work should be enough to drill the players in what is required of each and every one of them. If not the coach is clearly either not capable of getting his ideas across or, his ides are bat shit crazy

[Mr X]

Not sure if discussed already sorry can't be bothered to go back through the pages but any truth in this article that the players aren't buying into Jones formation choice or just the usual media stirring up crap when we are at our lowest? 

https://www.footballinsider247.com/sources-nathan-jones-at-odds-with-southampton-stars-over-formation-change/

[InvictaSaint]

1 minute ago, Mr X said:

Not sure if discussed already sorry can't be bothered to go back through the pages but any truth in this article that the players aren't buying into Jones formation choice or just the usual media stirring up crap when we are at our lowest? 

https://www.footballinsider247.com/sources-nathan-jones-at-odds-with-southampton-stars-over-formation-change/

If there is any truth in the rumour, it won’t be Football Insider getting the scoop. Awful site. And to be honest, not one Saints player currently has earned the right not to buy into what the manager wants of them. 

[Toon Saint]

Still have absolutely no idea how Jones wants us to play. Keeps saying he wants buy-in from the players to play the way he wants, but haven’t heard him articulate what that actually means in practice other than being ‘aggressive’. Not a good sign and fear he is well out of his depth. The likes of De Zerbi came in to Brighton and you could his approach immediately, albeit working with a more capable group of players. Signing a decent striker for Ralph was our best chance of staying up and we’ve probably now blown that with this non-entity in charge. 

[LGTL]

5 minutes ago, Toon Saint said:

Still have absolutely no idea how Jones wants us to play. Keeps saying he wants buy-in from the players to play the way he wants, but haven’t heard him articulate what that actually means in practice other than being ‘aggressive’. Not a good sign and fear he is well out of his depth. The likes of De Zerbi came in to Brighton and you could his approach immediately, albeit working with a more capable group of players. Signing a decent striker for Ralph was our best chance of staying up and we’ve probably now blown that with this non-entity in charge. 

It’s because he doesn’t have a clue himself. He’s probably star struck by half our squad FFS. Nathan Jones - I still can’t believe it. 

[DonnieD]

7 hours ago, Crab Lungs said:

Lol.

as much as I have my reservations about NJ, those players can f**k off. What right do they have to dictate? Absolute bunch of losers if true. 

And if NJ can’t take charge and decide even such a thing, he won’t last long.

[saintscottofthenortham]

2 hours ago, Lallana's Left Peg said:

 

Based on what JWP and Jones said after the game, the players weren't brave enough and weren't good enough to implement what they had worked on.  That's worse than not working on anything at all, because it shows how awful the situation is.  They don't have the mental bottle or the technical ability to follow instructions - and that's automatic relegation in most cases.

This was my take from it. JWP's comments after the Brighton game were, somehow, more alarming than the performance itself.

[Lord Duckhunter]

2 hours ago, saintant said:

I think the after match comments were a bit of a cop-out. Six weeks of intense work should be enough to drill the players in what is required of each and every one of them. If not the coach is clearly either not capable of getting his ideas across or, his ides are bat shit crazy

have you seen our record in the first game of the season the past 20 fucking years? All after the managers had weeks to “get their ideas across”.

Ralph had weeks to “get his ideas over” in the summer and the 2nd half  performance at Spurs was easily as bad as Brighton. And that was 3 years into his spell, not 3 games. 
 

Some of the posts on here are pathetic. We were going down with Ralph, we’re probably going down with this bloke, but it’s been 3 games FFS (1 of those he only had a couple of days and most modern managers would have sat that one out). Let’s see the structure and performances of his side after the window “slams shut” before piling in on him. 

[Dr. Kucho]

4 hours ago, aintforever said:

The difference with him though is he has played and managed at the top level, in six weeks he could easily work out who his best team was. Nath probably spent six weeks watching our lot train thinking they are all brilliant.

Not having played at top level doesn’t make you a bad manager, Van Gaal, Nagelsmann, Mourinho and Tuchel all didn’t have a spectacular football career. However have been good managers.

That said, after 6 weeks of training I expected more last Saturday. Don’t mind losing, but you want to see improvement and that a certain tactic is being implemented. When Pochettino arrived we lost to Man Utd in our second game, but we could all see a change of play and remember most getting excited by what we saw on the pitch. 
 

Let’s hope we see improvements soon, but I have my doubts and don’t think Jones is the right man for the job, sadly. 

[Chez]

Seems a little early to write him off. I know many were not happy with the appointment, but I did think he'd get a little more chance to turn this sinking ship around.

Have people forgot just how fucking shit the side was under RH.  Boxing day was bad, really bad, but was it any worse than at Burnley or Brentford towards the back end of last season?

Thought we played pretty well in the second half at Anfield. Far better than the absolute shit show up there the previous season with RH at the helm. 

[StrangelyBrown]

8 hours ago, Saintscummer said:

I didn’t say he is getting personal ( although people have been taking the piss out of his religious beliefs - which I couldn’t give a monkeys about ). 
 

is there not a NJ out thread ?? After two proper games. One win and a loss against a form team. 
 

he needs months. Every manager does 

To be fair it is NJ that time and again brings religion into the conversation... Football is no place for religion (or politics for that matter).

Sometimes an appointment is clearly wrong on day one; it was wrong with Branfoot, wrong with Wigley, wrong with Gray, wrong with Pellegrino... Are fans not entitled to recognise the signs and call it out for what they think it is?

[The Cat]

11 minutes ago, StrangelyBrown said:

Football is no place for religion

Are you aware our club was formed in a church?

[StrangelyBrown]

7 minutes ago, The Cat said:

Are you aware our club was formed in a church?

Yes, but fortunately the club has become part of fabric of something much bigger irrespective of religion, race, sexuality, ... So I'm not sure what point you are trying to make?

[The Cat]

5 minutes ago, StrangelyBrown said:

Yes, but fortunately the club has become part of fabric of something much bigger irrespective of religion, race, sexuality, ... So I'm not sure what point you are trying to make?

That our club intrinsically linked with religion and always will be.

Not religious myself but have no problem with people mentioning their faith in relation to their job.

[Turkish]

11 minutes ago, StrangelyBrown said:

Yes, but fortunately the club has become part of fabric of something much bigger irrespective of religion, race, sexuality, ... So I'm not sure what point you are trying to make?

I hope you never sing oh when the saints go marching in, or refer to them as the saints, never refer the stadium as St Mary’s. 

[wild-saint]

44 minutes ago, Chez said:

Seems a little early to write him off. I know many were not happy with the appointment, but I did think he'd get a little more chance to turn this sinking ship around.

Have people forgot just how fucking shit the side was under RH.  Boxing day was bad, really bad, but was it any worse than at Burnley or Brentford towards the back end of last season?

Thought we played pretty well in the second half at Anfield. Far better than the absolute shit show up there the previous season with RH at the helm. 

There are some right old wet Fannie’s on this board. NJ wasn’t my first or even 5th choice there is a deep rot set into this club and it’s going to take time to change. Is he capable, who knows but I’m prepared to wait and find out.

Should we go down there are plenty of positives around to build on. We may lose a couple of players but their is a spine there plus some promising academy players and financial backing. As a betting man I could see a swift return by building a team with more heart and fight than we currently see.

Tella, Adams and Armstrong up front would have more than enough goals to mount a challenge. Long term I’m not worried, short term who knows?

 

 

[imadirtyurchin]

38 minutes ago, wild-saint said:

There are some right old wet Fannie’s on this board. NJ wasn’t my first or even 5th choice there is a deep rot set into this club and it’s going to take time to change. Is he capable, who knows but I’m prepared to wait and find out.

Should we go down there are plenty of positives around to build on. We may lose a couple of players but their is a spine there plus some promising academy players and financial backing. As a betting man I could see a swift return by building a team with more heart and fight than we currently see.

Tella, Adams and Armstrong up front would have more than enough goals to mount a challenge. Long term I’m not worried, short term who knows?

 

 

I always wonder about this logic…

 

why is it supposedly easier to build a quality premier league capable team whilst in the championship than when established in the prem? Plus attract prem quality players whilst in the championship? 

the fact that promoted teams often go straight down / or have to make wholesale changes suggests that it isn’t. 

 

[LGTL]

3 minutes ago, imadirtyurchin said:

I always wonder about this logic…

 

why is it supposedly easier to build a quality premier league capable team whilst in the championship than when established in the prem? Plus attract prem quality players whilst in the championship? 

the fact that promoted teams often go straight down / or have to make wholesale changes suggests that it isn’t. 

 

Because everyone remembers the Adkins years (where we actually did it the other way around) with a team containing future european champions. Not to mention being the Man City of the lower leagues. 
 

They seemingly forget the horrendous post PL years last time. If we go down now, we’ll be down for years. 

[Ex Lion Tamer]

1 hour ago, Chez said:

Seems a little early to write him off. I know many were not happy with the appointment, but I did think he'd get a little more chance to turn this sinking ship around.

Have people forgot just how fucking shit the side was under RH.  Boxing day was bad, really bad, but was it any worse than at Burnley or Brentford towards the back end of last season?

Thought we played pretty well in the second half at Anfield. Far better than the absolute shit show up there the previous season with RH at the helm. 

Boxing Day does tend to throw up some bad performances. Not saying I'm totally confident but let's see how we do against Fulham

Edited 29 December, 2022 by Ex Lion Tamer

[DonnieD]

From the next 5 games I’d expect Saints to get at least 5 points, possibly 7 or even 9. Win against Forest, draw w Fulham and Everton (maybe win against one of them), lose to Villa and Brentford. 7 points should be enough to move up to 18th or so.

If NJ can achieve that he should be safe for now.

Edited 29 December, 2022 by DonnieD

[Killers Knee]

Honestly it’s not the fault of Mad Nate.  SFC bought into the delusions of an author and TED speaker.  This person has since been the shot caller, as other gullible individuals fell for the act.  Replacing Nate will not solve the issue.

[Griffo]

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

99% of St Mary’s don’t understand the meaning of the word support. Turn up, expect to be entertained, boo, moan and bitch online.

Roll on midweek away trips to Preston. Clearing out deadwood from our ‘support’ is just as needed as cleaning out deadwood from the club. 

[BotleySaint]

32 minutes ago, Griffo said:

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

I see what you are saying. I haven't given up on NJ yet but the reason we probably won't be in the Premier League next year is not the fans fault and nothing to do with deserving anything.

It's down to SR's bad decision making in the summer. They've shown a total lack of understanding in what it takes to build a Premier League side. Many of us were sceptical at the total lack of experience and verifiable quality of our signings. 

We have to hope they've not used the same bad decision making to appoint the new manager. But so far their record is not sacking Ralph in the summer when it was obviously needed, signing the Man City youth team and .. well, we'll see if they got NJ right or not.

Edited 29 December, 2022 by BotleySaint

[The Kraken]

49 minutes ago, Griffo said:

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

99% of St Mary’s don’t understand the meaning of the word support. Turn up, expect to be entertained, boo, moan and bitch online.

Roll on midweek away trips to Preston. Clearing out deadwood from our ‘support’ is just as needed as cleaning out deadwood from the club. 

Of course I expect to be entertained. Football is an entertainment industry, it’s why many thousands of saints fans pay their money every week. Why do you go if not that? 

Christ.

[Turkish]

On 26/12/2022 at 19:27, Pilchards said:

Currently on a splendid cruise at the moment so I have no idea what’s going on.

To think we offered the job to Eddie Howe but Semmens pulled it because Ralph won two games and drew one. He thought we had turned a corner. Even some of our fans thought Howe was a big step back. Ha ha ha what a fuck up.

Poor manager who can’t spend money 

only doing well because he’s got money 

gets teams relegated 

Will be sacked by Newcastle within six months

just some classics by our experts 🤣🤣

[saintant]

4 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

have you seen our record in the first game of the season the past 20 fucking years? All after the managers had weeks to “get their ideas across”.

Ralph had weeks to “get his ideas over” in the summer and the 2nd half  performance at Spurs was easily as bad as Brighton. And that was 3 years into his spell, not 3 games. 
 

Some of the posts on here are pathetic. We were going down with Ralph, we’re probably going down with this bloke, but it’s been 3 games FFS (1 of those he only had a couple of days and most modern managers would have sat that one out). Let’s see the structure and performances of his side after the window “slams shut” before piling in on him. 

Maybe re-read your post from Tuesday at 13.55.

[LaptopSaint]

Mods, could you make sure you save this as a Golden Thread, please? I’d like to reread at the end of the season. 
 

Give him a chance FFS. If he fails, he fails. We go again. 

[niceandfriendly]

5 hours ago, Griffo said:

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

99% of St Mary’s don’t understand the meaning of the word support. Turn up, expect to be entertained, boo, moan and bitch online.

Roll on midweek away trips to Preston. Clearing out deadwood from our ‘support’ is just as needed as cleaning out deadwood from the club. 

What a mess. 

[Fan The Flames]

22 hours ago, IanCransonsKnees said:

https://oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/thread/294894/jones-back-luton

This is like a visitation from the Ghost of Yet to Come. 

This is how it will play out here. One of Stokes worst managers of all time only slightly better than Chris Kamara, should have been enough of a warning.

[wild-saint]

10 hours ago, imadirtyurchin said:

I always wonder about this logic…

 

why is it supposedly easier to build a quality premier league capable team whilst in the championship than when established in the prem? Plus attract prem quality players whilst in the championship? 

the fact that promoted teams often go straight down / or have to make wholesale changes suggests that it isn’t. 

 

Where did I say it was easy? it’s clearly not. I agree with your sentiments about struggling to  establish, attract players etc.

but here’s the thing, I never said I wanted us to go down I’m merely pointing out this clubs current state  is rotten and needs to be built back from the bottom up (and ideally staying up)

I moved on to point out the positive sides of our club should NJ fail to rebuild quick enough to stop us getting relegated.

So the question is, do I think the best option right now is to stick with NJ and his long term vision or do we fire him now and replace e him with someone else.

Personally I’m happy to let this play out for better or worse but it’s nothing to do with your assumption that I have some warped logic that it’s better that we go down first. I’m do however think if the worst case happens and we go down that we will be in a good place to come back quickly. 
 

happy to debate any reasons why we will be down there for years as some Fannie’s think. 

 

 

 

[Fan The Flames]

10 minutes ago, wild-saint said:

Where did I say it was easy? it’s clearly not. I agree with your sentiments about struggling to  establish, attract players etc.

but here’s the thing, I never said I wanted us to go down I’m merely pointing out this clubs current state  is rotten and needs to be built back from the bottom up (and ideally staying up)

I moved on to point out the positive sides of our club should NJ fail to rebuild quick enough to stop us getting relegated.

So the question is, do I think the best option right now is to stick with NJ and his long term vision or do we fire him now and replace e him with someone else.

Personally I’m happy to let this play out for better or worse but it’s nothing to do with your assumption that I have some warped logic that it’s better that we go down first. I’m do however think if the worst case happens and we go down that we will be in a good place to come back quickly. 
 

happy to debate any reasons why we will be down there for years as some Fannie’s think. 

 

Plenty of good clubs, clubs similar to us, have been down for a long time, Ipswich, Blackburn, Charlton, QPR, Sheffield Wednesday, Derby, Coventry, it took Forest and Leeds years to get back up. There is no guarantee, you have to get back quickly otherwise it can take years or decades.

That could have been us last time, we were tumbling until we were bought and had a big cash injection.

[sfc4prem]

3 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Plenty of good clubs, clubs similar to us, have been down for a long time, Ipswich, Blackburn, Charlton, QPR, Sheffield Wednesday, Derby, Coventry, it took Forest and Leeds years to get back up. There is no guarantee, you have to get back quickly otherwise it can take years or decades.

That could have been us last time, we were tumbling until we were bought and had a big cash injection.

Was it a 2-1 loss to Stockport, I seem to remember, on our entry into League One? We certainly were tumbling.

[Chez]

45 minutes ago, sfc4prem said:

Was it a 2-1 loss to Stockport, I seem to remember, on our entry into League One? We certainly were tumbling.

first game was a 1-1 draw at home to Millwall, but we then were tonked 3-1 away at Huddersfield. Sir Ricky scored on is debut, but we were pretty shite.

[Lord Duckhunter]

11 hours ago, Griffo said:

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

99% of St Mary’s don’t understand the meaning of the word support. Turn up, expect to be entertained, boo, moan and bitch online.

Roll on midweek away trips to Preston. Clearing out deadwood from our ‘support’ is just as needed as cleaning out deadwood from the club. 

Ralph wasn’t “hounded out” at all. If anything the majority of supporters gave him too much time. Always making excuses for him, the strangest being it “wasn’t his team”. 
 

You’re right about the rest though. Writing off the new manager so early is pathetic , particularly as this clearly isn’t “his team”.
 

The “I want to be entertained” nods, didn’t want Claude, a guy who knew how to set up a side based on its limitations. The fact some still bang on about entertainment, some leave early, and some sit there like “customers” sums up a large minority of our support. 

[Fan The Flames]

58 minutes ago, sfc4prem said:

Was it a 2-1 loss to Stockport, I seem to remember, on our entry into League One? We certainly were tumbling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009–10_Southampton_F.C._season

A draw with Millwall and then a 3-1 loss to Huddersfield, eight games before we got a win and in the relegation zone until December.

[Fan The Flames]

4 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Ralph wasn’t “hounded out” at all. If anything the majority of supporters gave him too much time. Always making excuses for him, the strangest being it “wasn’t his team”. 
 

You’re right about the rest though. Writing off the new manager so early is pathetic , particularly as this clearly isn’t “his team”.
 

The “I want to be entertained” nods, didn’t want Claude, a guy who knew how to set up a side based on its limitations. The fact some still bang on about entertainment, some leave early, and some sit there like “customers” sums up a large minority of our support. 

You're an old joke.

[saintscottofthenortham]

37 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009–10_Southampton_F.C._season

A draw with Millwall and then a 3-1 loss to Huddersfield, eight games before we got a win and in the relegation zone until December.

Didn't we then get beat at Swindon? Went away to both Hudders and Swindon and it really was a baptism of fire to League One. Swindon felt worse, as that really felt like a tin pot. Seem to remember Pardew refusing to make a sub until the 85th minute too, despite being utterly shite from the off. 

[JRM]

14 hours ago, The Cat said:

Are you aware our club was formed in a church?

Amen 

[Turkish]

1 minute ago, saintscottofthenortham said:

Didn't we then get beat at Swindon? Went away to both Hudders and Swindon and it really was a baptism of fire to League One. Swindon felt worse, as that really felt like a tin pot. Seem to remember Pardew refusing to make a sub until the 85th minute too, despite being utterly shite from the off. 

Yes we did. Swindon away was dreadful. The whole away end singing "make a sub" to Pardew. We were so bad that day.

[saintscottofthenortham]

1 minute ago, Turkish said:

Yes we did. Swindon away was dreadful. The whole away end singing "make a sub" to Pardew. We were so bad that day.

That's the one! "SUB SUB SUB SUB SUB SUB SUB SUB" with the hands rolling, all 3,000 saints in both stands, then we celebrated liked we'd scored when he finally made a change. 🤣 F*** me what is it with us and gaffers.

[derry]

I believe that we have to stop this NJ out rubbish and give the bloke a chance or we are just shooting ourselves in the foot. However if there is any truth in the rumour that the players are in conflict with Jones over how they set up he has to go. I say that because five at the back has been an absolute failure with the current squad and they are right to object. Secondly if Jones doesn't listen and imposes his system there isn't a hope in hell of winning matches. Neither will playing only those that agree with him as most of them are those that were so abysmal v Brighton.

We aren't going to get in enough players to do it his way and the only way we are going to get results is if the players believe in the manager, Conversely the manager needs to convince the players. We know the three centrebacks has been a failure in the recent past, we are worse playing it. The players know that and because of that it won't work without the players being happy with it. To get a team better than the sum of the parts which we need desperately won't happen unless there is a coming together. 

If there is the slightest confliction he has to go because the players aren't going anywhere unless we are relegated. With 22 matches left we don't need dogma and egos we need a united effort from within the club to pull away from the threat of relegation.

[egg]

2 minutes ago, derry said:

I believe that we have to stop this NJ out rubbish and give the bloke a chance or we are just shooting ourselves in the foot. However if there is any truth in the rumour that the players are in conflict with Jones over how they set up he has to go. I say that because five at the back has been an absolute failure with the current squad and they are right to object. Secondly if Jones doesn't listen and imposes his system there isn't a hope in hell of winning matches. Neither will playing only those that agree with him as most of them are those that were so abysmal v Brighton.

We aren't going to get in enough players to do it his way and the only way we are going to get results is if the players believe in the manager, Conversely the manager needs to convince the players. We know the three centrebacks has been a failure in the recent past, we are worse playing it. The players know that and because of that it won't work without the players being happy with it. To get a team better than the sum of the parts which we need desperately won't happen unless there is a coming together. 

If there is the slightest confliction he has to go because the players aren't going anywhere unless we are relegated. With 22 matches left we don't need dogma and egos we need a united effort from within the club to pull away from the threat of relegation.

I'm struggling to reconcile "We don't need dogma and egos" but to sack Jones if the players won't do as they're told. Isn't that giving way to players ego's? 

[Crab Lungs]

4 minutes ago, derry said:

I believe that we have to stop this NJ out rubbish and give the bloke a chance or we are just shooting ourselves in the foot. However if there is any truth in the rumour that the players are in conflict with Jones over how they set up he has to go. I say that because five at the back has been an absolute failure with the current squad and they are right to object. Secondly if Jones doesn't listen and imposes his system there isn't a hope in hell of winning matches. Neither will playing only those that agree with him as most of them are those that were so abysmal v Brighton.

We aren't going to get in enough players to do it his way and the only way we are going to get results is if the players believe in the manager, Conversely the manager needs to convince the players. We know the three centrebacks has been a failure in the recent past, we are worse playing it. The players know that and because of that it won't work without the players being happy with it. To get a team better than the sum of the parts which we need desperately won't happen unless there is a coming together. 

If there is the slightest confliction he has to go because the players aren't going anywhere unless we are relegated. With 22 matches left we don't need dogma and egos we need a united effort from within the club to pull away from the threat of relegation.

Never, ever let the tail wag the dog.

Fkkk those players if it’s true. 

 

[egg]

1 minute ago, Crab Lungs said:

Never, ever let the tail wag the dog.

Fkkk those players if it’s true. 

 

You put it better than me!! 

[derry]

Employing a manager that doesn't convince the players will end in relegation for us and the sack for Jones. The players will still be here.

[niceandfriendly]

..

Edited 30 December, 2022 by niceandfriendly

[saint1977]

13 hours ago, Griffo said:

We don’t deserve premier league football. Hounded out our last manager, written off our new one straight away.

99% of St Mary’s don’t understand the meaning of the word support. Turn up, expect to be entertained, boo, moan and bitch online.

Roll on midweek away trips to Preston. Clearing out deadwood from our ‘support’ is just as needed as cleaning out deadwood from the club. 

Yes, I ‘loved’ being in the away end in 2007 when we lost 5-1 up there as a total shambles http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_div_1/7019679.stm

I also ‘loved’ when PNE scored an injury time winner in the return game at Christmas in front of our ‘proper support’. Did laugh when someone in the Kingsland North shouted ‘Merry Christmas Saints’ as the goal went in. 

[S-Clarke]

24 minutes ago, derry said:

I believe that we have to stop this NJ out rubbish and give the bloke a chance or we are just shooting ourselves in the foot. However if there is any truth in the rumour that the players are in conflict with Jones over how they set up he has to go. I say that because five at the back has been an absolute failure with the current squad and they are right to object. Secondly if Jones doesn't listen and imposes his system there isn't a hope in hell of winning matches. Neither will playing only those that agree with him as most of them are those that were so abysmal v Brighton.

We aren't going to get in enough players to do it his way and the only way we are going to get results is if the players believe in the manager, Conversely the manager needs to convince the players. We know the three centrebacks has been a failure in the recent past, we are worse playing it. The players know that and because of that it won't work without the players being happy with it. To get a team better than the sum of the parts which we need desperately won't happen unless there is a coming together. 

If there is the slightest confliction he has to go because the players aren't going anywhere unless we are relegated. With 22 matches left we don't need dogma and egos we need a united effort from within the club to pull away from the threat of relegation.

I agree in what you say ''stop the NJ out rubbish' as we're shooting ourselves in the foot, but you can't then say if the players are in conflict he needs to go!

As I said before, a lot of these players have been failures in whatever position we put them in. We should have the power to sack a lot of them for poor performance over a prolonged period of time, but that'll never happen as the players always manage to get their way.

In an extreme example, Man Utd players have done the same. That club have let the players dictate who they want the manager to be, or who they don't want him to be. Yet none of those players have pulled up any trees themselves.

[saintant]

SR have brought this on themselves. They would have been well aware that NJ would not be a popular choice among the fan base so he will not get much of a honeymoon period. He's had six weeks with the squad and I can't find anyone who thinks he's improved much at all in that time. If SR think he's the right man for the job why have we not seen any evidence after six weeks? If you opt for someone two divisions below with no proven rack record at a higher level you better be sure what you're doing because the fans are going to be scratching their heads and making their feelings known if there is no rapid signs of improvement. Whichever way you cut it this smacks of a bad appointment from people who talk a good game but are maybe not as sharp as many of us thought.