What Is Happening To Our Country?

[AlexLaw76]

9 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

And along comes Turkish's mini-me, right on cue.

but it is true.  NHS staff are striking, whilst the organisation they work for pay a kings ransom for complete non-jobs

[Turkish]

10 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Congratulations, that may be one in some peoples' eyes. How many Public Sector workers are there ?

Im sure i could google it but i cant be arsed. One Head of Equality, Diversity and Inclusion could pay for two trainee coppers. What would we rather have two people helping to solve crimes or one person making sure enough women and POCs apply for jobs?

[badgerx16]

9 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Im sure i could google it but i cant be arsed. One Head of Equality, Diversity and Inclusion could pay for two trainee coppers. What would we rather have two people helping to solve crimes or one person making sure enough women and POCs apply for jobs?

How about the 22 thousand people helping fight crime that we lost during the first 10 years of this spell of Tory mismanagement, or a properly staffed nursing corps ? 1 Head of Equality pales into insignificance, but you keep banging on about it.

[badgerx16]

14 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

but it is true.  NHS staff are striking, whilst the organisation they work for pay a kings ransom for complete non-jobs

How many 'complete non-jobs' are there actually ? It is easy to highlight the exceptions whilst ignoring the gross staff shortages across the Public Sector.

[The Left Back]

1 minute ago, badgerx16 said:

How about the 22 thousand people helping fight crime that we lost during the first 10 years of this spell of Tory mismanagement, or a properly staffed nursing corps ? 1 Head of Equality pales into insignificance, but you keep banging on about it.

You're wasting your breath.  There are none so blind as those that will not see.

[whelk]

13 minutes ago, The Left Back said:

You're wasting your breath.  There are none so blind as those that will not see.

Yep it’s all the Met office, it’s all the diversity non-jobs, it’s…… there is a a pattern. Doubt will link back to hey it wasn’t always like this and guess what we paid less tax. Dacre’s litttle sheep

[Turkish]

17 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

How about the 22 thousand people helping fight crime that we lost during the first 10 years of this spell of Tory mismanagement, or a properly staffed nursing corps ? 1 Head of Equality pales into insignificance, but you keep banging on about it.

when you say "keep banging on about it" you mean mentioned it once in response to your post about non jobs in the public sector. You brought the subject up, dont get all upset because it's not going your way.

[Turkish]

17 minutes ago, The Left Back said:

You're wasting your breath.  There are none so blind as those that will not see.

oh no i completely agree the cuts to the police are a disgrace, but that wasn't the point he was making, he's trying to backtrack now.

[badgerx16]

27 minutes ago, Turkish said:

oh no i completely agree the cuts to the police are a disgrace, but that wasn't the point he was making, he's trying to backtrack now.

No I am not. I posted in response to Egg's comment about underfunded public services, and my post suggested that somebody would pop up with some ramblings about that archetypal bete-noir, the right wing press' favourite target, the "non job,". Lo and behold, there you were, closely followed by your Poundshop double act sidekick..

Edited 21 December, 2022 by badgerx16

[Turkish]

1 minute ago, badgerx16 said:

No I am not. I posted in response to Egg's comment about underfunded public services, and my post suggested that somebody would pop up with some ramblings about that archetypal bete-noir, the right wing press' favourite target, the "non job,". Lo and behold behold, there you were, closely followed by your Poundshop double act sidekick..

True though isn’t ti. 

[badgerx16]

Just now, Turkish said:

True though isn’t ti. 

Yes, it is true about the underfunded and understaffed, overworked Public Sector. I totally agree with you on that.

[badgerx16]

And whilst we are on the subject

 

[whelk]

Did anyone take the advice and minimise their risks of accidents today? I stayed at home and looked at a computer and mainly talked to people over Teams. I think I have survived but have an hour to go?

Edited 21 December, 2022 by whelk

[Turkish]

16 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Yes, it is true about the underfunded and understaffed, overworked Public Sector. I totally agree with you on that.

I agree. There are also a not insignificant number of non jobs, such as Head of Inclusion and Diversity, which are comparatively very well paid, correct?

[Turkish]

15 minutes ago, whelk said:

Did anyone take the advice and minimise their risks of accidents today? I stayed at home and looked at a computer and mainly talked to people over Teams. I think I have survived but have an hour to go?

In my old job we had to do six month risk assessments for home working, which included sending pictures of your home office or work area, details of the height of your screen, temperature etc. Pathetic.

[badgerx16]

Just now, Turkish said:

I agree. There are also a not insignificant number of non jobs, such as Head of Inclusion and Diversity, which are comparatively very well paid, correct?

How do you define a 'non-job' ? Where they are claimed to exist there is generally a linked requirement to have such a post laid on the public body, whether legislative or linked to funding. Very few are randomly created simply for poops and giggles.

[badgerx16]

3 minutes ago, Turkish said:

In my old job we had to do six month risk assessments for home working, which included sending pictures of your home office or work area, details of the height of your screen, temperature etc. Pathetic.

Complain about the legal requirement to do it, not the process itself.

Edited 21 December, 2022 by badgerx16

[egg]

5 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

Or maybe it would suggest that you want to put the record straight for other readers who might actually fall for his guff? Obviously if I don’t see his posts I don’t worry about whether I should respond or not. If I see one of his posts quoted in another’s posters comment, I can ignore its content but it is harder not to read it. Does that make sense to you or do you want to continue to give the forum troll more support? Just so that we are clear, TUI inside became a much nicer environment to post in once he was banned and I am sure the same could be said for here. One of the reasons I don’t cough up £5 is posters like him, but if you want to believe that I have some kind of morbid fascination with him and need to interact with a strange individual who stalks people on the internet, knock yourself out Egg.

That presupposes that people are interested in your response to Turkish's posts about you. I doubt anyone is and I get that you can see his posts, but you ain't gotta reply. 

I support nobody. Seems to me that your choice is to either fight with the bloke and stop moaning about it, or actually ignore him. Seems simple enough. 

[egg]

3 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

But, you are forgetting about all the non-jobs across the Public Sector, and the appalling lack of productivity  as they all sit on their fat arses counting the days to their massive pensions.

( For those who fail to spot it, this is an IRONIC post ).

There is no irony on the pension point. I deal with public sector pensions daily. The cost to the public is eye watering, and will only increase after the McCloud judgement. Those complaining often overlook the significant value of their pensions. 

[whelk]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

That presupposes that people are interested in your response to Turkish's posts about you. I doubt anyone is and I get that you can see his posts, but you ain't gotta reply. 

I support nobody. Seems to me that your choice is to either fight with the bloke and stop moaning about it, or actually ignore him. Seems simple enough. 

Could we make the fight like a celebrity boxing match? Turkish would have advantage so we could allow SOG to have a horseshoe in his left boxing glove

[whelk]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

There is no irony on the pension point. I deal with public sector pensions daily. The cost to the public is eye watering, and will only increase after the McCloud judgement. Those complaining often overlook the significant value of their pensions. 

So tell me how much does a nurse with 30 years service retire on? 

[egg]

3 minutes ago, whelk said:

Could we make the fight like a celebrity boxing match? Turkish would have advantage so we could allow SOG to have a horseshoe in his left boxing glove

Sounds ideal! But underestimate SoG at your peril I reckon. 

[egg]

2 minutes ago, whelk said:

So tell me how much does a nurse with 30 years service retire on? 

Leave that with me tomorrow Whelk and I'll give you actual figures for that sort of scenario. I'll also give you the fair actuarial value, ie what it would cost someone in the private sector to buy the equivalent. Armed forces and police similar. Pension values of 7 figures are very common. 

[whelk]

Ok I googled my nurses question. Say £35k salary then 30/54 equals about £20k annuity. 
assumed paid 7% contribution so over 30 year contributed say £75k to get that. Not too bad I guess

[whelk]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

Leave that with me tomorrow Whelk and I'll give you actual figures for that sort of scenario. I'll also give you the fair actuarial value, ie what it would cost someone in the private sector to buy the equivalent. Armed forces and police similar. Pension values of 7 figures are very common. 

I did hear that worth just under 20% of salary so £50k in public with pension is worth £60k in private sector. Might not be true of course

[whelk]

5 minutes ago, egg said:

Leave that with me tomorrow Whelk and I'll give you actual figures for that sort of scenario. I'll also give you the fair actuarial value, ie what it would cost someone in the private sector to buy the equivalent. Armed forces and police similar. Pension values of 7 figures are very common. 

Do police get them at something like at 55? What with all the bribes and and skimming off the drug dealers it is a decent job

[egg]

4 minutes ago, whelk said:

I did hear that worth just under 20% of salary so £50k in public with pension is worth £60k in private sector. Might not be true of course

All schemes are different, but the values are huge. The 1995 NHS scheme falls in at age 60 with no deferment incentive. For someone retiring then on say £30k pension, that scheme has a value of north of a million. Not shabby. The police schemes fall in earlier (ditto firemen and forces) so have a much higher value as they're secure for a longer period. The McCloud decision, essentially, will restore people shifted from final salary to lesser defined benefit schemes to where they were. The total cost will be eye watering. 

[Turkish]

28 minutes ago, whelk said:

Could we make the fight like a celebrity boxing match? Turkish would have advantage so we could allow SOG to have a horseshoe in his left boxing glove

Just get him to talk, he'd bore me into submission.

[egg]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

Did anyone take the advice and minimise their risks of accidents today? I stayed at home and looked at a computer and mainly talked to people over Teams. I think I have survived but have an hour to go?

No, I ventured outside. I saw a man climbing a ladder, another jogging on a wet pavement, and even saw someone ride a bike. I've never seen such risky behaviour in my life. 

[Weston Super Saint]

2 hours ago, whelk said:

Did anyone take the advice and minimise their risks of accidents today? I stayed at home and looked at a computer and mainly talked to people over Teams. I think I have survived but have an hour to go?

Yep. I planned a bike ride but decided not to risk it because of the shit weather - that and I just couldn't be arsed with the rain today.

Went to the gym instead where they have their own defibrillators 😉

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

Do police get them at something like at 55? What with all the bribes and and skimming off the drug dealers it is a decent job

And free parking 🙂

[Plastic]

No fucking water. On top of no trains, no post, no ambulances and no nurses.

This country’s a fucking mess. 

[moonraker]

9 hours ago, egg said:

Leave that with me tomorrow Whelk and I'll give you actual figures for that sort of scenario. I'll also give you the fair actuarial value, ie what it would cost someone in the private sector to buy the equivalent. Armed forces and police similar. Pension values of 7 figures are very common. 

No they are not, while your “researching” the nurses pension please also ascertain the % of publicly funded pensions that are over 7 figures.  

[moonraker]

8 hours ago, egg said:

All schemes are different, but the values are huge. The 1995 NHS scheme falls in at age 60 with no deferment incentive. For someone retiring then on say £30k pension, that scheme has a value of north of a million. Not shabby. The police schemes fall in earlier (ditto firemen and forces) so have a much higher value as they're secure for a longer period. The McCloud decision, essentially, will restore people shifted from final salary to lesser defined benefit schemes to where they were. The total cost will be eye watering. 

Defined benefits schemes are final salary, I think you mean “lesser defined contributions scheme”.  The value of a DB scheme is arbitrary, a multiplier of the annual pension set , currently at 25 times I believe, this is purely for calculating a figure for your lifetime allowance. DC schemes are simply based on each £1 contributed, by both the individual and their employer.  Most good private sector employers contribute between 5 and 10% to staff pensions so to be totally accurate when comparing the value of the benefit of public sector pensions this should be added to in to the value of private sector renumeration.

[egg]

2 hours ago, moonraker said:

No they are not, while your “researching” the nurses pension please also ascertain the % of publicly funded pensions that are over 7 figures.  

When I talk about values, I refer to the actuarial fav not the artificially low cev issued by the prpa.  it's the fav that more accurately represents the cost of that pension to the taxpayer, or what it cost to buy a replacement or equivalent.

The fav (and to a lesser extent the cev) of a huge number of public sector schemes is north of a million. I've got PODE reports sat on my desk for a variety of public sector schemes at that level (service personnel, doctors, police officers) and lots for more junior employees  (nurses, pc's, lower level service personnel) at £650k or more. 

Edited 22 December, 2022 by egg

[egg]

2 hours ago, moonraker said:

Defined benefits schemes are final salary, I think you mean “lesser defined contributions scheme”.  The value of a DB scheme is arbitrary, a multiplier of the annual pension set , currently at 25 times I believe, this is purely for calculating a figure for your lifetime allowance. DC schemes are simply based on each £1 contributed, by both the individual and their employer.  Most good private sector employers contribute between 5 and 10% to staff pensions so to be totally accurate when comparing the value of the benefit of public sector pensions this should be added to in to the value of private sector renumeration.

Defined benefits are where the pension benefits are defined. That could be linked to final salary, or something else, ie a career average salary. The NHS 1995 scheme was final. The later schemes aren't. I've touched upon values in my previous post. Yes the cev is arbitrary, but that's not the true value, or the cost to the public purse. What happens in the private sector isn't really relevant to the discussion and very few private employers have pensions that match the state schemes. ExxonMobil, BAT, NATS, the uni scheme, and a few others, are superb though. 

[whelk]

13 hours ago, Turkish said:

Just get him to talk, he'd bore me into submission.

If I was his coach I would be advising to start asking you about your far right meetings then hit him with the bolo

[AlexLaw76]

14 hours ago, egg said:

All schemes are different, but the values are huge. The 1995 NHS scheme falls in at age 60 with no deferment incentive. For someone retiring then on say £30k pension, that scheme has a value of north of a million. Not shabby. The police schemes fall in earlier (ditto firemen and forces) so have a much higher value as they're secure for a longer period. The McCloud decision, essentially, will restore people shifted from final salary to lesser defined benefit schemes to where they were. The total cost will be eye watering. 

Implementing the McCloud thing is taking longer than anticipated.  end of 2023 in some cases

[egg]

4 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Implementing the McCloud thing is taking longer than anticipated.  end of 2023 in some cases.

It's variable. I haven't seen number for the total cost but it'll be vast. On a linked ish theme, when discussing public sector pay rises, people never consider the consequential pension cost linked to that pay, especially in schemes that will revert to final salary post McCloud.  

[sadoldgit]

17 hours ago, egg said:

That presupposes that people are interested in your response to Turkish's posts about you. I doubt anyone is and I get that you can see his posts, but you ain't gotta reply. 

I support nobody. Seems to me that your choice is to either fight with the bloke and stop moaning about it, or actually ignore him. Seems simple enough. 

I doubt very much if they are Egg, but some might be. That isn’t my point. How would you feel if you had a stalker intent on posting mostly made up bollocks about you on an almost daily basis? I do mostly ignore him but occasionally I see something and bite. He has a small band of followers who repeat his BS and as I am sure you know, it doesn’t take much for BS to become “fact” on places like these. I’m sure people who have been reading here for years know exactly what his game is, but relatively new posters won’t. If he was to follow me about the streets calling me a “cock” he would get arrested, yet that behaviour is fine on an internet forum? You call me out for responding to my stalker but doesn’t it occur to you to call him out for his antisocial behaviour? You say you don’t take sides. Seems to me that you do.

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

I doubt very much if they are Egg, but some might be. That isn’t my point. How would you feel if you had a stalker intent on posting mostly made up bollocks about you on an almost daily basis? I do mostly ignore him but occasionally I see something and bite. He has a small band of followers who repeat his BS and as I am sure you know, it doesn’t take much for BS to become “fact” on places like these. I’m sure people who have been reading here for years know exactly what his game is, but relatively new posters won’t. If he was to follow me about the streets calling me a “cock” he would get arrested, yet that behaviour is fine on an internet forum? You call me out for responding to my stalker but doesn’t it occur to you to call him out for his antisocial behaviour? You say you don’t take sides. Seems to me that you do.

And now the victim card comes out 🤣

I’ve never made up anything I’ve said about you. Shall we check the Geoff Boycott thread to see what you had to say about someone convicted of domestic violence for example? Or more recently calling “them” coconuts. unlike yourself who has regularly called me and others racists, Tommy robinson/trump/Katy price supports and your recent go to “insult” narcissist you should expect to get it back. Remember your attack on me a while back because I vouched for another poster as being a good source, a poster I know personally and you went off on one saying I was arrogantly giving them my stamp of approval? You made yourself look a proper tit and that’s just one of many examples do your weird behaviour across multiple forums. 
 

The stuff you’ve said, It’s all on here for people to find if they want to and despite me supposedly making stuff up im not the only one who knows about your comments regarding a whole host of topics which I am not surprised to want to deny. The look at me threads, the lies, the insults, the endless whinging and the pious nature of your posts, you bring everything on yourself and it’s no surprise it’s not just me who thinks it. 

And i dont follow you around calling you a cock so it isn't the same behaviour on here, i call you out for your bullshit and arrogance. You've been the one who made all the initial accusations, you first came onto my radar during on the BLM stuff when you called everyone who didn't agree with you a Trump supporting racist. you made some grand proclamation the other day I dont like you because you call me out, again congratulating yourself on something. I don’t like you because you postion yourself as some sort of pious voice of the forum, congratulate yourself on “speaking out” and have regularly made false and nasty accusations against me and others posters whilst holding some questionable views yourself, then when you get it back play the victim, like you are now. 

 

Edited 22 December, 2022 by Turkish

[Turkish]

4 hours ago, whelk said:

If I was his coach I would be advising to start asking you about your far right meetings then hit him with the bolo

He strikes me as the sort of bloke that would get in the ring then moan he got punched.

[egg]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

I doubt very much if they are Egg, but some might be. That isn’t my point. How would you feel if you had a stalker intent on posting mostly made up bollocks about you on an almost daily basis? I do mostly ignore him but occasionally I see something and bite. He has a small band of followers who repeat his BS and as I am sure you know, it doesn’t take much for BS to become “fact” on places like these. I’m sure people who have been reading here for years know exactly what his game is, but relatively new posters won’t. If he was to follow me about the streets calling me a “cock” he would get arrested, yet that behaviour is fine on an internet forum? You call me out for responding to my stalker but doesn’t it occur to you to call him out for his antisocial behaviour? You say you don’t take sides. Seems to me that you do.

Jesus wept. I couldn't give a monkeys what you and Turkish say about each other. If you want to tangle with him, crack on, but perhaps stop whining about it.

[egg]

12 hours ago, Plastic said:

No fucking water. On top of no trains, no post, no ambulances and no nurses.

This country’s a fucking mess. 

The water thing is crazy. I've been told to go 12 miles away to Winchester for bottled water. Not much good when I need to flush the loo and wash my hands. Not sure those without transport are supposed to get on - no offer to deliver. 

[Whitey Grandad]

5 minutes ago, egg said:

The water thing is crazy. I've been told to go 12 miles away to Winchester for bottled water. Not much good when I need to flush the loo and wash my hands. Not sure those without transport are supposed to get on - no offer to deliver. 

Our daughter has no water and cam around to our house this morning to have a shower. She lives 200 yards away.

[ecuk268]

22 hours ago, egg said:

Sounds ideal! But underestimate SoG at your peril I reckon. 

How about the St Mary's car park before the Brighton game?

Might be more entertaining than the match.

 

[whelk]

27 minutes ago, ecuk268 said:

How about the St Mary's car park before the Brighton game?

Might be more entertaining than the match.

 

SOG needs to rebrand to just be The Git. More marketable 

[Turkish]

13 minutes ago, whelk said:

SOG needs to rebrand to just be The Git. More marketable 

the Romney marsh git v the Northern Narcissist

I win the pre fight mind games.

Edited 22 December, 2022 by Turkish

[RedArmy]

 

Another own goal from the resident bigot.  

[sadoldgit]

On 22/12/2022 at 13:22, egg said:

Jesus wept. I couldn't give a monkeys what you and Turkish say about each other. If you want to tangle with him, crack on, but perhaps stop whining about it.

Thanks for your opinion. If you don’t give a monkeys though, why bother to comment?