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egg

egg

Posted
Posted
29 minutes ago, Plastic said:

He’ll be off soon enough. Not a world beater but the best player we have by an order of magnitude, which says it all about this dog turd of a team. 

Not a chance. Average player who takes a decent free ball. I can't think of one other premier league team who'd start him. Not one.

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted (edited)

He's being hung out to dry a bit, but he is clearly good enough. He is playing alongside Diallo, I think the best CM's in the world would struggle to look good alongside that sack of shit.

Central Midfield is such a crucial part of any team, JWP plays well in a pivot but to do that he needs a destructor next to him and someone of a level of ability in the 10's to feed the ball to, he has neither and this season he is caught in no mans land trying to run the midfield, provide physicality and drive forward. He's not an all rounder midfielder like that, never has been, so we're making him look worse as we're trying to get him to make up for our other shortfalls. Stick some better players around him and watch the difference. It doesn't even need to be a world-beater as Romeu showed, but just someone who can pass as a footballer. 

Edited by S-Clarke
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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Saint86 said:

JWP is perfectly fine with a solid CDM next to him. But lavia is injured and we sold Romeu. 

So the reality is that next to him he has either diallo or ANM (both awful in that role), and in front of him he's working with Moi, Adam Armstrong, Che Adams etc.

In the long list of issues Saints have, JWP isn't one or them. 

He’s the club captain, he’s an experienced pro, he’s the one who is meant to be driving this young players on, helping them a la Jimmy Case. Instead of that we get excuses from some posters, he’d be better with better players, it’s the crap players fault he’s poor. He basically sums the club up. Nice boy, good pro, tactically and emotionally intelligent, educated speaks properly, probably nice to his parents, but fucking soft, one paced & not nasty enough to play the role we need. Get rid asap and get a pirate in instead. 

Edited by Lord Duckhunter
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saintant

saintant

Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

He's being hung out to dry a bit, but he is clearly good enough. He is playing alongside Diallo, I think the best CM's in the world would struggle to look good alongside that sack of shit.

Central Midfield is such a crucial part of any team, JWP plays well in a pivot but to do that he needs a destructor next to him and someone of a level of ability in the 10's to feed the ball to, he has neither and this season he is caught in no mans land trying to run the midfield, provide physicality and drive forward. He's not an all rounder midfielder like that, never has been, so we're making him look worse as we're trying to get him to make up for our other shortfalls. Stick some better players around him and watch the difference. It doesn't even need to be a world-beater as Romeu showed, but just someone who can pass as a footballer. 

He can't always rely on having decent players around him. If he's that good then he'd be doing far more than he has for quite some time now. He's been less than ordinary for far too many games. I get that he's missing the likes of Romeu and Lavia but he needs to stand up and be counted. I'd hazard a guess he is not covering anything like the ground he was when playing effectively so he has to look at himself in many respects.

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saint1977

saint1977

Posted
Posted

JWP is off form and I suspect as frustrated as we are by the total shitshow which is Rasmus, Semmens and SR, worsened by the David Brent they just hired. I’d want to be gone as well. As well as not celebrating his goal, you could also see Lallana was thinking ‘what the eff has happened here over the last couple of years and why there is a 12 year old in goal? It used to be good here’. 

JWP should be more vocal as the skipper but even Kante would struggle playing with Diallo who has comfortably broken into my worst ever Saints top flight XI alongside Adam Armstrong and previous legends such as Wesley Hoedt, Olivier Bernard, Steve Baker, David Speedie (AA’s strike partner), David Lee and Callum Davenport. 

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

Posted
Posted
On 27/12/2022 at 11:17, FarehamSaintJames said:

He’s not good enough. He’s a poster about that can take the odd good free kick.

His corners have been poor for years and his leadership is non-existent at best. 

Id take £30m for him now. Go and let him warm up the bench at Spurs.

You are wrong, and you posted yesterday you’ve only been to 4 games in the last x amount of years, he is more than good enough, and he’s a decent leader, but he needs someone alongside him who is half decent. And we need more than 1 leader. 

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

You are wrong, and you posted yesterday you’ve only been to 4 games in the last x amount of years, he is more than good enough, and he’s a decent leader, but he needs someone alongside him who is half decent. And we need more than 1 leader. 

That is exactly it. He's not what I'd call a world beater, so he's not at the level of a Gerrard or even a Rice who can pull a team through on his own, but he is decent in his own right if partnered with better players who allow him to do his role, rather than having to cover 50 different positions. JWP is the least of our worries. CM is a big issue for us, but we need to focus on adding better around him not 'selling him on' - that's not going to help us.

The club have failed him this season more than anything by assuming he could perform that lynchpin role and totally undermining the protection a player such as Romeu actually provided.

Edited by S-Clarke
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Lee On Solent Saint

Lee On Solent Saint

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

You are wrong, and you posted yesterday you’ve only been to 4 games in the last x amount of years, he is more than good enough, and he’s a decent leader, but he needs someone alongside him who is half decent. And we need more than 1 leader. 

I think he is a good leader for the dressing room, not necessarily a good leader on the pitch though. I think there is a difference.

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Wade Garrett

Wade Garrett

Posted
Posted

I was very frustrated with him on Boxing Day.  He is playing like the proverbial wall.  Just gives the ball back the way he’s facing all the time.  This adds nothing to the team and makes us predictable and easier to play against.

His contribution is simply not enough at the moment.  He needs to play on the half turn more and move the ball forward.

He is a million miles away from the England squad and needs to show a lot more ambition in his play.  He has the talent, but is just too safe.

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

Posted
Posted
Just now, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I think he is a good leader for the dressing room, not necessarily a good leader on the pitch though. I think there is a difference.

Historically we’ve had multiple leaders, VVD, Fonte, Alderweireld, Tadic, Romeu, Bertrand, Lallana, Ings, Davis, Lambert, and the list goes on.

Look at the team now….JWP….? Who else? Adams? Lyanco?

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Lee On Solent Saint

Lee On Solent Saint

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

Historically we’ve had multiple leaders, VVD, Fonte, Alderweireld, Tadic, Romeu, Bertrand, Lallana, Ings, Davis, Lambert, and the list goes on.

Look at the team now….JWP….? Who else? Adams? Lyanco?

Totally agree. There is nothing after JWP. I thought Caleta Carr might have been a bit vocal, but I guess he's not really played enough to find out

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The Cat

The Cat

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, SotonianWill said:

I love how the fans still celebrate when we win a free kick in a good area despite him not scoring one for a while 

We've barely had any this season so it's not like he's missing chances in that respect.

Teams have worked out that we're so shit in other areas that our best scoring opportunity is via a free kick so they don't foul on the edge of the box anymore.

Probably better for their defence to stand aside and let one of our players casually run through them than give away a free kick. Chances are whoever the striker is will bungle the shot anyway.

 

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Hodgey

Hodgey

Posted
Posted

It’s Jones job to get the likes of KWP, JWP, Tino etc back to their best, we know the first two have a higher ceiling than they are showing. Diallo and JWP will never work together, we know that, Jones is new but Selles knew so should not have been tried again. Some will say who else, my response - Armstrong or play 3 cms (of course this should have been fixed in the summer when they sold OR, along with a striker)
I think an on form JWP is pretty much our ceiling - I think this debate will be moot come season end, we’ll be down and he will be off, he’ll have plenty of suitors. Guess we will find out then how good he really is and if we can do better.

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madge

madge

Posted
Posted
On 27/12/2022 at 11:37, Lord Duckhunter said:

He’s the club captain, he’s an experienced pro, he’s the one who is meant to be driving this young players on, helping them a la Jimmy Case. Instead of that we get excuses from some posters, he’d be better with better players, it’s the crap players fault he’s poor. He basically sums the club up. Nice boy, good pro, tactically and emotionally intelligent, educated speaks properly, probably nice to his parents, but fucking soft, one paced & not nasty enough to play the role we need. Get rid asap and get a pirate in instead. 

Not nasty enough… do you watch games, especially last season, he’s got an edge to his game, zaha knows about that. He’s miles better technically than anything else we have, he’ll go to a top 6side and do well. If you’re surrounded by crap then you’ll sink down to that level. I think those slagging him off are way off the mark.. he needs a enforcer beside him, JWP makes the play tick, keeps the ball moving.

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St Louis

St Louis

Posted
Posted

I think we (and in particular JWP) are missing Romeu big time. We have no bite or aggression in the team anymore, and its so vital in the middle of the park. Brighton ran straight through our midfield so many times, it was a breeze for them. Romeu's presence and positioning also allowed JWP to get forward more, where I think he is far more effective. I dont think its a coincidence that JWP doesnt look the same player this season.

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Dark Munster

Dark Munster

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, SotonianWill said:

I love how the fans still celebrate when we win a free kick in a good area despite him not scoring one for a while 

How many free kicks around the box have Saints had this season? The one in the last match is the first I can remember for a long time, and his effort wasn't far off. Other teams have sussed out not to give them away against us. It's hard to score from a free kick if you don't have one within 30 yards of goal.

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It's There

It's There

Posted
Posted

JWP is not the issue. He is an excellent committed player. The issue is that he can’t do it all. He needs support and the team need a quality striker. Get two good players in and confidence will rise. 
it must be so frustrating for JWP , and Adam’s, that we missed out on a target striker like Broja. We have to win the midfield and put pressure on opposition defenders…done with a clinical finisher.

roll on Jan 1st and let’s hope at least two players come into the club early.

 

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Ed Rooney

Ed Rooney

Posted
Posted

Works hard but always second to the ball

Doesn’t pass with any pace, doesn’t pass forward - hence why he rarely has any effect from open play, his assist record from open play must be shocking.

Not a leader 

We don’t score from his corners much - except when vestergaard was here 

He rarely has any major influence on the game if not scoring a free kick.

In reality he is showing this season what an average midfielder he is compared to the rest of the Prem.

If he hadn’t come through the academy there wouldn’t be this much patience shown to him by many. 

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Roo1976

Roo1976

Posted
Posted
23 hours ago, Saint Garrett said:

You are wrong, and you posted yesterday you’ve only been to 4 games in the last x amount of years, he is more than good enough, and he’s a decent leader, but he needs someone alongside him who is half decent. And we need more than 1 leader. 

what about Slattery at Motherwell?..........seemed to be one for the future as i recall or has that now turned into a permanent move?.He seemed robust enough but didnt really get given the chance.Oh whilst im on a revival of past players Ross Barkley anyone?..............dosent seem to be on anyones play list? loan deal maybe....................(and wake).Shit must ave been dream posting....lol.

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egg

egg

Posted
Posted
21 hours ago, madge said:

Not nasty enough… do you watch games, especially last season, he’s got an edge to his game, zaha knows about that. He’s miles better technically than anything else we have, he’ll go to a top 6side and do well. If you’re surrounded by crap then you’ll sink down to that level. I think those slagging him off are way off the mark.. he needs a enforcer beside him, JWP makes the play tick, keeps the ball moving.

Which top 6 side would sign him, and play him? I honestly can't think of one. The issue I have with him is that he needs a bit more time than top players need, thus he tends to slow the game. 

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niceandfriendly

niceandfriendly

Posted
Posted

Yeah there’s no way a top 6 side will be signing him. If we go down one of the newly promoted sides would take him without question. But JWP isn’t our biggest problem. It’s sad that he’s probably our best player as he’s really not that good, but just imagine how much trouble we’d be in now if he got injured. We’d be stuck with a pairing of Diallo and Niles. 😕

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Plastic

Plastic

Posted
Posted
On 29/12/2022 at 13:15, egg said:

Which top 6 side would sign him, and play him? I honestly can't think of one. The issue I have with him is that he needs a bit more time than top players need, thus he tends to slow the game. 

Still shit & unsellable?

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egg

egg

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Plastic said:

Still shit & unsellable?

As a DM he's been shite. Where he's played the last couple of games, he's been decent. 

That said, I didn't say he was shit and unsellable. I asked which top 6 side would buy him and play him. 

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egg

egg

Posted
Posted
Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

That was a proper captains performance...looks very good operating more in the final 3rd

Yep. Huge credit to Jones for playing him where he can be most effective, and having other players around him to help do the heavy lifting. 

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, egg said:

As a DM he's been shite. Where he's played the last couple of games, he's been decent. 

That said, I didn't say he was shit and unsellable. I asked which top 6 side would buy him and play him. 

This is the big thing for me, we're getting the best out of JWP by removing the shackles from him. He had to do way too much when Lavia was out and he was part of a 2, it muted his game. But now we're getting the best of both, he still provides cover and bite in CM but has the licence to push forward and pop up anywhere across the front. This will give us much more of a threat, as he can pick a pass as well.

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woodsaint1

woodsaint1

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Chez said:

Buy Alcaraz to play in the attacking central midfield role and then discover JWP is perfect to play there. I guess we now have depth?

Ideally we get to the stage where we can rely on Lavia playing the holding role alone which would allow JWP and Alcaraz more freedom and we can play both

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ErwinK1961

ErwinK1961

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I’ll tell you what… I bet Prowse wishes Jonesy had arrived in the club in the summer instead of Ralph letting him mince around in Aug/Sept/Oct. This new aggressive forward thinking Prowse would have been in Qatar . The Ralph cult should think on that…

Hard to disagree with that. 

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

The freekick was good, but pretty standard for him he's that good at them. The other goal was much more promising, deep run into the box, great feet and composure. 

He's got the technical ability striking a ball to score more goals, just need to let him get further forward and it seems the change is letting him do that. 

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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

Posted
Posted
42 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I’ll tell you what… I bet Prowse wishes Jonesy had arrived in the club in the summer instead of Ralph letting him mince around in Aug/Sept/Oct. This new aggressive forward thinking Prowse would have been in Qatar . The Ralph cult should think on that…

Actually he probably wishes Lavia hadn’t been injured for the majority of the season, meaning he had to do much more defensive work covering for the inadequacies of AMN and Diallo. All but 8 minutes of JWP’s England career have come under ‘the cult of Ralph’ so I doubt he holds that much resentment towards him.

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Actually he probably wishes Lavia hadn’t been injured for the majority of the season, meaning he had to do much more defensive work covering for the inadequacies of AMN and Diallo. 

He was still mincing about when Lavia did play. Lavia came off Weds and again today, Jonesy didn’t change Prowse role. I know you’re the President of the Cult, but Ralph was clearly holding him back this season. 

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