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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

Posted
Posted

He was at his best when he was further forward in midfield, closing down and getting stuck in and playing passes from higher up/getting long shots in. 

With Romeu leaving and Lavia getting injured he's had to drop deep again which doesn't suit him. 

I'd like to see a new formation for us under whoever comes in, a 4-3-3 in the style of Chelsea with two CMs sitting deeper, JWP further forward and then two of our attacking miss/quick strikers playing wide of Adams. Would still allow the fullbacks to get forward with the cover from two deeper CMs without needing them to expose themselves too much.

As to who those CMs are, who knows as Diallo is better further forward too. We'd need to sign someone really. Romeu and Lavia together would have been an incredible combo, sadly.

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skintsaint

skintsaint

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Mosin said:

So even though JWP is the one who is the only one closing down, the only one trying to apply pressure, its his fault Kotchap misses a tackle Lavia does not move  more than 5 yards  ( Like 20 yards between Lavia and JWP at one point ) and Salisu and Carr dont get in front of him ( Ill be fair, it was a wonderfully struck goal though ) But JWP is the one who is ball watching and not staying with his man......

All Newcastle players were marked, as soon as JWP lost his man then it all opened up. Why did JWP run towards the guy receiving the ball? Should of just stayed with his man and make sure he has a difficult time getting it back. Or just check him once he first passed it. Might have given a foul away but still a better result. 

Lavia was on no 36, if he was coming across early to cover then 36 would have been free for a hit at goal. 

And again..for the second time, Kotchap wasn't even on the pitch at this stage. Think we will agree to disagree on the whole thing but its no coincidence its happened twice in the last few games.

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted

Personally I think we need three quick forward players who can score goals more than we need JWP.  We need to finance that and letting JWP go will cover a lump of that and to top up I feel we should also unload Adams, A.Armstrong and Elyounoussi. Up to date each have fallen well short of a goal threat. Besides if the new manager believes in going direct and dispensing with sideways and backward sterile going nowhere possession JWP doesn't fit.

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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Saint IQ said:

He has already been picked for the world cup or is at least on the standby list but think he's been picked.

Chuffed for him.

 

I can only assume he’s an injury replacement for Dawid Malan because there’s no way he’s getting into our football team.

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Mosin

Mosin

Posted
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, skintsaint said:

All Newcastle players were marked, as soon as JWP lost his man then it all opened up. Why did JWP run towards the guy receiving the ball? Should of just stayed with his man and make sure he has a difficult time getting it back. Or just check him once he first passed it. Might have given a foul away but still a better result. 

Lavia was on no 36, if he was coming across early to cover then 36 would have been free for a hit at goal. 

And again..for the second time, Kotchap wasn't even on the pitch at this stage. Think we will agree to disagree on the whole thing but its no coincidence its happened twice in the last few games.

Aribo whos stood in the semi circle marking no body was free to cover Longstaff should the ball have come further in field, Amiron was being covered by Tella and Perraud, Salisu and Car was in the box marking newcastles only attacker in the box ( wood ), who ever misses the ( i cant tell who it is. think its Niles?.. ) tackle on Maximins assist, Lavias failure to read the danger why was the goal happened, not because Saint Maximin and Guimarães played a 1 2 around JWP..... Lavia was 2 - 3 yard short of Guimarães when he struck the ball, if he was 2 secs quicker on closing him down he is in front of him with Guimarães unable to take the shot on..... Its a team game we had 9 of 10 out field players back, they had 6 forward. dont tell me we was all busy marking, we wasnt. JWP closing down Guimarães on the free kick restart left a hole Lavia failed to fill / cover leaving space for the one two, if Lavia moved over even by 2 - 3 yards, the one two isnt even on.......

OR would have had Guimarães covered and would have seen the danger

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hasper57saint

hasper57saint

Posted
Posted

My major criticism of JWP is  that he plays far too much sideways and back, Crab Football. So many times this season he has almost stopped play by using these tactics. Why doesn't he keep the ball and go forward. We saw it many times against Newcastle on Sunday and it just leads to their defence getting back into position which means any forward progress is nullified. If and when we get our new Manager I hope he knocks this out of him. We just don't seem to attack any more.  

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the saint in winchester

the saint in winchester

Posted
Posted

Yeah, he's not had a great season, so maybe that accounts for being passed over. However, seeing Philips get included after 10 minutes football last night must be sickening. Sadly this only reinforces the perspective that top 6 sides provide the players, whereas no matter how good you are for Saints, Brighton et al you won't get included.

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Dragon_man

Dragon_man

Posted
Posted

His loyalty has cost him. Should have moved to a bigger club when he had chance. A better manager and better places around him would have raised his game.

Listening to mad Nate this morning, he alluded to that fact that its not about results, more about the eco-system (developing young players for a profit), against that its hard to see what JWP gets from hanging around. No real chance of silverware and unlikely to really develop further.

His value is likely to start decreasing unless he has some form of rebirth.

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

He's not been in great form, but then Maguire is there, Phillips is there, Henderson is there, so that argument goes out the window IMO.  Those players are out of form and/or unfit. 

Phillips is not fit and is injury prone, and then when fit wasn't playing anyway. The guy has played a consistent run of games for about 18 months, so is going to be useless in a tight schedule mid season World Cup where the games come every few days. 

He did the same last year taking an unfit Henderson and he was a complete waste of space in the squad, he couldn't play the full rotation games needed and looked completely off the pace when he came on.

Gallagher is also questionable considering again he's not a regular. 

At least one thing you can guarantee with JWP is fitness and availability, he plays every game, works hard and his set pieces would offer something different. 

Tomori is also a hilarious omission, he is probably the best English centre-back right now, consistently playing well for a top Milan side who won the league last year and playing Champions league football. Stones is a back up to Dias and Laporte when they are both fit, White has lost his centre-back place and fills in at right back, Eric Dier is well Eric Dier and then there is Harry Maguire who has been a liability for about 2 years now. 

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

Posted
Posted

JWP offers more than Gallagher and Henderson IMO. Phillips cannot be match fit, though Southgate basically said JWP wasn't competing with Phillips in the squad. 

I think, despite him not having a great season, should still be in there.  If we're chasing a game last 10 mins, I'd want him in the pitch swinging in crosses.

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted (edited)

Sad for him, but truthfully he is too safe, His creativity with through balls and setting up chances is poor. The hype about his free kicks got to him a bit. I was also alarmed when he said in an interview he rarely practised them!!

As with Redmond, perhaps he has lost his game a bit after following RH orders and his pattern of play. I hopeNJ releases him a bit to play a bit more freely

Edited by OldNick
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Micky

Micky

Posted
Posted

I think it's just indicative of where we are as a club at the moment.  Absolutely no bright spots in the season - no outstanding performances, just struggling to keep our heads above water.  How are you meant to force your way into the England squad working in that environment.  Sad that he didn't make it, but not unexpected at all.

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Holmes_and_Watson

Holmes_and_Watson

Posted
Posted

Southgate was asked directly about JWP. Southgate said that "frankly" be was just behind the ones he picked there. Not in the same role as Phillips, as Garrett posted.

Gallagher singled out as being a forward moving midfielder, something Southgate though there weren't many of. You could read that as a JWP related comment. Southgate also made sure to mention Madison's set pieces.

Being part of a nose diving team at the end of last season, and not much better in this, won't have helped. Ralph's defensive approach this season, won't have done much to show off JWP's strengths either.

JWP doesn't offer a clear advantage over the others to claim a place. Henderson is probably the exception, but I can see why Southgate would want that experience, and big game mentality in the squad.

 

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Convict Colony

Convict Colony

Posted
Posted

Sometimes you might be good but your not in the best group for your country.

He gets 100k pw with us based on his recent seasons, but this season he's performed poorly not just in open play his set pieces have been poorer this year as well, whilst it isnt always the case that eng choose on merit JWP doesnt deserve to go to the WC, he performed in the season it didnt matter.

Southgate has players who have played and been successful in tournament football, injured our not he is trusting phillips over JWP.

The biggest issue i have is that Eng are a terrible terrible team to watch, its like watching tottenham, they try not to lose rather than play.

this is really for the 1st time in my life do not care about this world cup, due to location, how the team play and there is 0 buzz about it, fans arent going there is no excitement about it anywhere.

Most people couldn't find qatar on a map let alone what the capital is.

 

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted (edited)

Not surprised, on form alone he is nowhere near international level this season. He's never really done anything for England either, so you can somewhat understand why Phillips has gone as he was a proven success in the Euro's.

I'd say that JWP's chance of establishing himself as an England regular is now gone, so he should just focus on his club career, get his head down and get those PL records he craves. I'm sure he'll get picked for the odd squad every now and then in the future, but I don't expect much more than that.

Edited by S-Clarke
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egg

egg

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Posted

You've gotta feel for the lad, but it's not an unfair decision. At his best he doesn't offer as much defensively as Rice, Henderson or Philips; as much offensively as Gallagher, Bellingham Mount, or Maddison. This season he's been way below his best, his passing has become negative, and he's just lost his mojo. 

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Holmes_and_Watson

Holmes_and_Watson

Posted
Posted
46 minutes ago, egg said:

You've gotta feel for the lad, but it's not an unfair decision. At his best he doesn't offer as much defensively as Rice, Henderson or Philips; as much offensively as Gallagher, Bellingham Mount, or Maddison. This season he's been way below his best, his passing has become negative, and he's just lost his mojo. 

That's exactly what I was trying to say. Can I just copy and paste your post into mine? 🙂

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obelisk

obelisk

Posted
Posted

I'd have thought that JWP's indifferent displays this season would have been just fine for this England side. Backwards, sidewards, slow, slower build up.

I'll not be watching any of the Qatar corrupt circus anyway but have to feel a bit sorry for the lad not to have made it. His poor form made Southgate's big boy team players preferences just a bit easier though. I suspect JWP will be off to pastures new before long.

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Noodles34

Noodles34

Posted
Posted (edited)

I think people need to wake up and smell the coffee. JWP hasn’t become shit overnight. The stagnation of Ralphies tactics and the loss of Rom and Latvia has made his game completely different. I’m not saying that he hasn’t been totally blameless, some his passes are nothing to do with nothing but overall, he’s in a shit side and it’s affecting his game, just like KWP as well. Bad timing for the WC, if he had anything about him, he’d be moving on. 

Edited by Noodles34
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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

Still even if you debate the merits of JWPs form, at least he is fit and playing regularly. 

I am pretty sure I read that Phillips hasn't completed a full 90 mins since December last year, so he's basically hasn't played a full match in a year. Neither Gallagher nor Henderson are playing regularly either.  Also I think all of Gallaghers last 5 starts for Chelsea have come in defeats. 

There is no logical argument for most of the people he is supposedly competing with to be there aside Bellingham and Rice, and even Rice hasn't been at his best.  If Phillips was like a Gerrard level player then you might understand the gamble, but he's just a fairly decent PL level centre mid. 

Also as I said the Tomori thing is absurd and just shows Southgate does not know what he is going. To pick Coady and Maguire ahead of a guy regularly playing for AC Milan, who won the league last year and is getting help with his game from Maldini is just bonkers IMO. 

 

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted

I heard Southgate on the radio this morning and interestingly he said 'some havent progressed as he though they would'

You could point at all the ones left out in that, but truthfully JWP is the same player he was 5 plus years ago. He has been unlucky playing in poor sides with fairly negative tactics, if Henderson was at Saints and JWP at Liverpool we know who would be picked

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Toussaint

Toussaint

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Noodles34 said:

I think people need to wake up and smell the coffee. JWP hasn’t become shit overnight. The stagnation of Ralphies tactics and the loss of Rom and Latvia has made his game completely different. I’m not saying that he hasn’t been totally blameless, some his passes are nothing to do with nothing but overall, he’s in a shit side and it’s affecting his game, just like KWP as well. Bad timing for the WC, if he had anything about him, he’d be moving on. 

I 100% agree with your assessment.  If NP can sort out Ralph's shambolic and dysfunctional midfield midfield we'll be halfway there.

I also  think JWP would have left in Jan had Ralph stayed, I noticed at the end of the Bournemouth game Ralph (who only ever appeared on the pitch after a rare victory) , tried to give JWP an embrace and JWP literally turned away and shrugged him off. No love lost tere I think.

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

I think he needs to be involved further forward and he's never really had that chance often playing in a two.  He's got good technical ability, we know he can score goals as well he just doesn't often get close enough to the box and we have also seen he can put good crosses in. I think he has the potential if freed up a little to play more like a De Bruyne role, ok nowhere near as good but still working that inside right channel with his good passes, crosses and getting onto the odd cut back for shots I think would be a better use of his abilities.  

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danjosaint

danjosaint

Posted
Posted

Pissed me off today whem he come over to take a corner and so many people clapped him, he was fucking atrocious today and has been for a while a main part of our problems with slow sideways turgid performance, in the 1st half Edozie made a run in behind, wouldve been 1v1, ball at Jwp's feet uncontested, all it needed was a 25yd chip over the top, but no, hit it to low and short straight into cb's chest, piss poor effort

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  • Lighthouse changed the title to James Ward-Prowse
DrunkenSaint

DrunkenSaint

Posted
Posted

Was again very poor today, never should be captain. Almost threw my beer at the tv when he got the ball in the first half was a massive gap for him to run into to get the team going fwd but no, he passed it sidewards to a player that was marked by 2 players so he lost it. That folks is your captain, clueless!

I even called the miss before he took the pen, lucky on the rebound though.

We really miss Romeu and we need someone to replace him and play alongside lavia and have someone else in midfield other than jwp who is more creative and can get the team moving fwds, sorry for all the WP lovers on here, if we are to survive we need to sort out our midfield, jwp shouldnt be in there on his current form.

 

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Disco Stu

Disco Stu

Posted
Posted (edited)

Who the f**** gave him a leadership rating of 18/20 on football manager? 😂 There are players on the pitch not putting a shift in and I haven't seen him tear into a teammate once. He's too quiet to be a true leader on the pitch.

Edited by Disco Stu
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Turkish

Turkish

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

Who the f**** gave him a leadership rating of 18/20 on football manager? 😂 There are players on the pitch not putting a shift in and I haven't seen him tear into a teammate once. He's too quiet to be a true leader on the pitch.

 

EF210C21-B764-4107-ABF6-99844289AE14.jpeg

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Saint86

Saint86

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, DrunkenSaint said:

Was again very poor today, never should be captain. Almost threw my beer at the tv when he got the ball in the first half was a massive gap for him to run into to get the team going fwd but no, he passed it sidewards to a player that was marked by 2 players so he lost it. That folks is your captain, clueless!

I even called the miss before he took the pen, lucky on the rebound though.

We really miss Romeu and we need someone to replace him and play alongside lavia and have someone else in midfield other than jwp who is more creative and can get the team moving fwds, sorry for all the WP lovers on here, if we are to survive we need to sort out our midfield, jwp shouldnt be in there on his current form.

 

JWP is perfectly fine with a solid CDM next to him. But lavia is injured and we sold Romeu. 

So the reality is that next to him he has either diallo or ANM (both awful in that role), and in front of him he's working with Moi, Adam Armstrong, Che Adams etc.

In the long list of issues Saints have, JWP isn't one or them. 

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