James Ward-Prowse

[Batman]

He got himself into a very good position and hit the target which led a goal which in turn led to us getting 3 points. What exactly is the problem here?

 

Tell that to Koeman who was going mental at him for his sloppy play.

[Lallana's Left Peg]

I am still to see JWP forge his identity on the pitch which does hinder him however he has a lot of ability and considering he has 66 Premier League appearances to his name and he isn't 21 until November I think we will reap the rewards that this early experience is giving him.

[Dellman]

I want to be big fan of JWP because he's one of ours and I love seeing the young ones come through. but he is disappointing at the moment, he doesn't seem to be any better now than two years ago. He should have scored half a dozen this season but his shooting is powder puff strength. He runs and runs, must be super fi,t but he doesn't control in midfield he always seems to be running trying to catch up. I wonder if he has been used in too many different positions, he seems capable of filling in anywhere. He just hasn't made one position his own

[beatlesaint]

I want to be big fan of JWP because he's one of ours and I love seeing the young ones come through. but he is disappointing at the moment, he doesn't seem to be any better now than two years ago. He should have scored half a dozen this season but his shooting is powder puff strength. He runs and runs, must be super fi,t but he doesn't control in midfield he always seems to be running trying to catch up. I wonder if he has been used in too many different positions, he seems capable of filling in anywhere. He just hasn't made one position his own

 

exactly this. He is 20, he has made over 60 appearances in the Premier League yet you would be hard pushed to say what his best attributes are. Forget the dead ball stuff for a minute. Is he an attacking midfielder, a holding or defensive midfielder, is he better in the middle or out wide ?

 

He needs an identity, a position he can focus on and learn what strengths he needs for that position. Either work on his attacking play or work on his defensive play, let the versatile stuff come later if need be. But for now give the boy a definite role and see how he gets on.

[Smirking_Saint]

He got himself into a very good position and hit the target which led a goal which in turn led to us getting 3 points. What exactly is the problem here?

 

No idea, wasnt even a particularly bad strike. And he had to get to the ball and strike it with his weak foot under pressure. Poor lad is damned if he does and damned if he doesnt.

[Rasiak-9-]

He got himself into a very good position and hit the target which led a goal which in turn led to us getting 3 points. What exactly is the problem here?

 

It happens incredibly rarely, largely because he shots would only trouble a goalkeeper if he makes a huge mistake, which happily enough Speroni did.

 

Isnt that the point though? He made errors and I am sure others players did too which COULD have led to goals against but didn't. But his movement and shot led to the winning goal. We have been screaming for players to shot. He did and still gets slagged off because it was a "poor" shot.

 

...er...yeah.

[OldNick]

He set himself up well for the shot and helped create the goal fantastic.

he did make 2 terrible errors that could have cost us, it looked as though he was very nervous due to the importance of the win. Hopefully he will gain experience and learn from both the good and bad

[Smirking_Saint]

He set himself up well for the shot and helped create the goal fantastic.

he did make 2 terrible errors that could have cost us, it looked as though he was very nervous due to the importance of the win. Hopefully he will gain experience and learn from both the good and bad

 

Looking through the side I think confidence is just shot. Fonte who is pretty much mr consistant made two big errors, clyne isnt hitting the heights he was. Pellè is struggling, elia and tadic arent as troublesome as before.

 

I like JWP a lot, dont understand the criticism tbh, pre injury he looked v good. And technically he is excellent. But he looks a bit out of sorts to me. Hopefully last nights win acts to galvanise the squad

[david in sweden]

He got himself into a very good position and hit the target which led to a goal which in turn led to us getting 3 points.

What exactly is the problem here?

 

......if we consider that as some sort of an assist?...... then he's contributing to the team's success.

[sadoldgit]

Why not? He had a shot which was spilt and led to the goal.

[sadoldgit]

Tell that to Koeman who was going mental at him for his sloppy play.

 

Koeman was going mental because he had a shot which led to our winning goal?

[david in sweden]

exactly this. He is 20, he has made over 60 appearances in the Premier League yet you would be hard pushed to say what his best attributes are. Forget the dead ball stuff for a minute. Is he an attacking midfielder, a holding or defensive midfielder, is he better in the middle or out wide ?

 

He needs an identity, a position he can focus on and learn what strengths he needs for that position. Either work on his attacking play or work on his defensive play, let the versatile stuff come later if need be. But for now give the boy a definite role and see how he gets on.

 

 

agree with both you an Dellman

 

..problem is we have a lot of midfield talent and unless you see him replacing Schneiderlin or Davis in the next year or so, it's going to be hard to give him a regular spot.

I think JWP's best role is an attacker. Defensive midfielders need more muscle (type Wanyama) and despite lack of height, someone like Harrison Reed....given time.

 

VERY few 20 year olds come into a Prem. side and become permanent straight away, whilst some others take longer to mature.

JWP is a great prospect, but it will take a major change of personnel in the side for him to nail down a permanent role at the moment.

 

" Versatile " footballers are often underated by fans who only think of a player in one position, and see others as "second-best" - when asked to play somewhere else.

Those fans with long memories...will recall Jimmy Gabriel (who moved from Everton with Scots caps, League and Cup Winners medals to his credit) and played 200+ games for Saints in the late 60's- early 70's.

Jimmy could play anywhere, and was used in 5 different positions one season, including CF and "emergency goalie" (before 7 subs era), and never let the team down once.

 

Sometimes your position is obvious and " nailed down " (ala Luke Shaw), but it can take time for a versatile player to find his best role.

 

Wherever that is ?....JWP has " future team captain " written all over him. Meanwhile ..he'll learn and progress.

Edited 5 March, 2015 by david in sweden

[RedFear]

i hope in all this people are keeping in mind just how young he is.

 

its incredible that he is this big a part, of a premier league midfield at his age. he could play for 3-4 more season and still be considered young to be in central midfield. the guy has immense potential.

 

for what its worth i thought we suddently looked to be getting the ball forward quicker and with more purpose when he came on, and ok he may have mis-hit his shot, but we simply wouldnt have scored it at all if he hadnt been on the pitch, and wasnt it exactly the type of goal our captain said we would take just to get us going

[OldNick]

Koeman was going mental because he had a shot which led to our winning goal?

No when he did an awful pass that led to Yoshida nearly scoring an OG

[sadoldgit]

No when he did an awful pass that led to Yoshida nearly scoring an OG

 

Must have missed the thread where we all went mental at Yoshida for his poor defensive header that set up West Broms win.

 

I am not saying he had a great game, just that he deserved credit for his part in the goal. I am sure he has a big future with us and we should be supporting our players not knocking them all the time.

[Andy_Porter]

exactly this. He is 20, he has made over 60 appearances in the Premier League yet you would be hard pushed to say what his best attributes are. Forget the dead ball stuff for a minute. Is he an attacking midfielder, a holding or defensive midfielder, is he better in the middle or out wide ?

 

He needs an identity, a position he can focus on and learn what strengths he needs for that position. Either work on his attacking play or work on his defensive play, let the versatile stuff come later if need be. But for now give the boy a definite role and see how he gets on.

 

 

His is best position is part of a three behind a more attacking midfielder and infront of a more defensive players. In our system he plays as the most attacking midfielder, once he adds a few goals to his game he will flourish there IMO. He's not a wide player, not a full back and not a number ten.

 

We we should just let him develop and play his natural game. He is 20 and already as good as Steven Davis.

 

Most young midfielders struggle to find an identity early on, Wilshere is the same and he's a few years older, still doesn't know where he fits in a midfield three.

[austsaint]

His is best position is part of a three behind a more attacking midfielder and infront of a more defensive players. In our system he plays as the most attacking midfielder, once he adds a few goals to his game he will flourish there IMO. He's not a wide player, not a full back and not a number ten.

 

We we should just let him develop and play his natural game. He is 20 and already as good as Steven Davis.

 

Most young midfielders struggle to find an identity early on, Wilshere is the same and he's a few years older, still doesn't know where he fits in a midfield three.

 

I would argue that Barkley, Wilshire, Ramsey etc are light years ahead of Ward-Prowse and were so when they were aged 20. Harry Reed after 3-4 games shows greater all round skill and quality than JWP after 70 appearances. I can see this lad still being hyped up after a hundred appearances and still demonstrating the same limitations.

[shurlock]

He took on and beat a defender on Tuesday. Don't think I've ever seen him do that.

[Charlie Wayman]

OK moaners so he's not very good, in fact just mediocre average? A top six team must indeed be very desperate to have to include such an idiot in their side. Maybe he just turned up with his boots on Tuesday evening and Koeman fancied to give the kid a break 'cos we were a bit short of players mid-week.

[Smirking_Saint]

......if we consider that as some sort of an assist?...... then he's contributing to the team's success.

 

Why wouldnt it be ?

[Smirking_Saint]

No when he did an awful pass that led to Yoshida nearly scoring an OG

 

?? So ? Mistakes happen, Fonte nearly cost us a goal and a penalty, Pellè missed the target again, yoshi made a mistake. Schneiderlins poor pass contributed to one of the liverpool goals.

 

It seems some just need a scapegoat and unfortunately its JWP or Forster right now, despite JWPs obvious talents.

 

And btw, despite your question in a past Forster thread questioning whether he had a poor save to shot ratio, which was answered in Forsters favour you've not bothered coming back... I suppose you've found someone else to 'blame'

[Dellman]

?? So ? Mistakes happen, Fonte nearly cost us a goal and a penalty, Pellè missed the target again, yoshi made a mistake. Schneiderlins poor pass contributed to one of the liverpool goals.

 

It seems some just need a scapegoat and unfortunately its JWP or Forster right now, despite JWPs obvious talents.

 

And btw, despite your question in a past Forster thread questioning whether he had a poor save to shot ratio, which was answered in Forsters favour you've not bothered coming back... I suppose you've found someone else to 'blame'

Yes, blame for being fifth in the Premiership!

[ericb]

Well given at the same age a large percentage of Saints fans thought Paul Wooton was better than Morgan i think the answer tends to lie with the lack of knowledge of most of our support base (at least on here) as opposed to the quality of a player who's captain of his country at his level and picked by three different managers (including one whilst we're in the top five/six of the top league).

[shurlock]

Well given at the same age a large percentage of Saints fans thought Paul Wooton was better than Morgan i think the answer tends to lie with the lack of knowledge of most of our support base (at least on here) as opposed to the quality of a player who's captain of his country at his level and picked by three different managers (including one whilst we're in the top five/six of the top league).

 

How do you know they're the same people? Stick to wallowing about the good, old days.

[St Marco]

Well given at the same age a large percentage of Saints fans thought Paul Wooton was better than Morgan i think the answer tends to lie with the lack of knowledge of most of our support base (at least on here) as opposed to the quality of a player who's captain of his country at his level and picked by three different managers (including one whilst we're in the top five/six of the top league).

 

Football is a game of opinions of course but I disagree with this one.

 

As others have alluded to just because he is young does not mean he will be a quality player. How many of our youngsters have we built up and then they turn out to be average? I remember people saying the same thing about James, Patterson, Reeves etc who were all in their national teams and played for our senior team. Their careers didn't quite work out as we thought they might at the time. You can also add a few others into that such as Surman.

 

To play for a national team you have to be pretty damn good. But JWP is amongst these players of his era Kane, Berahino, Shaw, Chambers, Sterling, Barkley, Wickham, Zaha, Ings etc. It is a very talented age group. But has he hit the same heights as players such as Kane, Sterling, Berahino and Barkley? No chance. Those guys are going to be in the main England squad soon enough and some are already there. In my opinion they are a few levels ahead of JWP in regards to current ability.

 

To get into that bracket JWP needs to be more noticeable in games. Have a presence about him. Score goals and create more. He has not scored for us yet in over 60 appearances. As a central midfielder that is pretty bad.

 

Which asks the question again what is his position, what is his job for the team? What does he do that is better then what other players in the team do?

[Matthew Le God]

To get into that bracket JWP needs to be more noticeable in games. Have a presence about him. Score goals and create more. He has not scored for us yet in over 60 appearances. As a central midfielder that is pretty bad.

 

Which asks the question again what is his position, what is his job for the team? What does he do that is better then what other players in the team do?

 

He has a very good assist per minute on the pitch ratio this season. His crossing and set piece delivery is up with the best in the Premier League. He is not going to score a hatful of goals or dribble past a player at pace, thats not his role or skill set and leads him to be unvalued by many even though he is a very talented player.

 

Its also easy to forget he is still only 20, has far more top flight experience than the majority of players at his age and is doing so in a successful team towards the top of the league and also for England under 21's. At Ward-Prowse's age Schneiderlin was in League One and some fans were preferring Wotton over him!

Edited 5 March, 2015 by Matthew Le God

[verlaine1979]

I'm surprised that JWP doesn't yet seem able to apply what is clearly very good technique with a dead ball into striking it in open play, but it's probably just a question of composure, which should improve with time. However, to criticise his lack of goals when the player most of his critics would replace him with hasn't scored in 38 league appearances and counting, seems a tad unfair, especially when JWP's assist record is vastly superior this season. That said, I'd rather see Djuricic at #10 than either SD or JWP right now.

[Bearsy]

Its also easy to forget he is still only 20

 

I hardly know how! (this thread alone)

 

he has not long turned 20

 

Just a quick reminder. ... Hes 20.

 

He's only 20

 

not many 20 year olds (english) are coming on like him in his position

 

what had Steven Davis achieved at 20?

 

20-year-old

 

JWP is 20

 

At the age of 20

 

He is 20

 

20 year olds

 

He is 20

 

aged 20

 

Leave the kid alone! He's only 19!

tokyos

[St Marco]

He has a very good assist per minute on the pitch ratio this season. His crossing and set piece delivery is up with the best in the Premier League. He is not going to score a hatful of goals or dribble past a player at pace, thats not his role or skill set and leads him to be unvalued by many even though he is a very talented player.

 

Its also easy to forget he is still only 20, has far more top flight experience than the majority of players at his age and is doing so in a successful team towards the top of the league.

 

Sorry but that is rubbish. He has not scored from a set piece and we have scored only three goals from corners and two from crosses. Of which he assisted with one. Tadic has more assists from set pieces.

[Matthew Le God]

Sorry but that is rubbish. He has not scored from a set piece and we have scored only three goals from corners and two from crosses. Of which he assisted with one. Tadic has more assists from set pieces.

 

It doesn't need to end in a goal for it to have been a good set piece delivery.

[St Marco]

It doesn't need to end in a goal for it to have been a good set piece delivery.

 

Of course not.

But we are second to bottom in regards to chances and goals created from set pieces

http://www.squawka.com/football-team-rankings#set-piece-goals#team-stats#english-barclays-premier-league|season-2014/2015#0#90#any#any#season#1#all-matches#total#desc#total

 

For someone supposedly an expert you would think he would of scored at least once from a free kick or set up one from our 153 corners?

[Wes Tender]

Football is a game of opinions of course but I disagree with this one.

 

To play for a national team you have to be pretty damn good. But JWP is amongst these players of his era Kane, Berahino, Shaw, Chambers, Sterling, Barkley, Wickham, Zaha, Ings etc. It is a very talented age group. But has he hit the same heights as players such as Kane, Sterling, Berahino and Barkley? No chance. Those guys are going to be in the main England squad soon enough and some are already there. In my opinion they are a few levels ahead of JWP in regards to current ability.

 

Might it be the case that most of those players you have listed are strikers, whereas J W-P is a midfielder?

[sadoldgit]

He took on and beat a defender on Tuesday. Don't think I've ever seen him do that.

 

He did, and he got his shot on target which is exactly what people on here have been asking for. Those that know about these things said that even if a shot gets saved there is still a chance of netting rebound which is precisely what happened the another night. Seems that wasn't good enough though because JWP was criticised for his shot.

[Lets B Avenue]

He did, and he got his shot on target which is exactly what people on here have been asking for. Those that know about these things said that even if a shot gets saved there is still a chance of netting rebound which is precisely what happened the another night. Seems that wasn't good enough though because JWP was criticised for his shot.

 

Are you going to apply your wonderous logic to Pelle's 2nd atrocity at WBA?

[saint_stevo]

he was pathetic when he came on. literally didnt cleanly strike the ball once, gave it away everytime and nearly gifted them a goal with a horrific 'clearance'

 

Not really sure what he offers as a midfielder, he has a good dead ball on him, but his passing is weak, he isn't fast and doesn't have a trick. Average, no matter how old he is.

[richard]

he was pathetic when he came on. literally didnt cleanly strike the ball once, gave it away everytime and nearly gifted them a goal with a horrific 'clearance'

 

Not really sure what he offers as a midfielder, he has a good dead ball on him, but his passing is weak, he isn't fast and doesn't have a trick. Average, no matter how old he is.

 

You missed him making the run that made the goal then?

[saint_stevo]

You missed him making the run that made the goal then?

 

no, i saw it. and i saw the scuffer that followed it. JWP didn't make the goal, Speroni's mistake did.

[richard]

no, i saw it. and i saw the scuffer that followed it. JWP didn't make the goal, Speroni's mistake did.

 

So, just to recap:

 

The team has been struggling to score goals. One of the most senior midfielders says they need to make more driving runs, and the captain says we need to be willing to take a shot from distance because hey, you never know. JWP does both of those things, and the upshot is that we score at home for the first time since NYD. Your conclusion is that he doesn't deserve any credit for helping to make the goal.

 

I'm sure that everyone involved with the club really appreciates your support, thanks.

[saint_stevo]

So, just to recap:

 

The team has been struggling to score goals. One of the most senior midfielders says they need to make more driving runs, and the captain says we need to be willing to take a shot from distance because hey, you never know. JWP does both of those things, and the upshot is that we score at home for the first time since NYD. Your conclusion is that he doesn't deserve any credit for helping to make the goal.

 

I'm sure that everyone involved with the club really appreciates your support, thanks.

 

hey, i was happy we scored. But it wasnt made by JWP. And he then went on to invite pressure for the rest of the game with poor passing and sloppy clearances. I reckon he had a few quid on the draw.

 

i support the team, but i am also realistic about performances. JWP was awful on tuesday night.

[Dig Dig]

hey, i was happy we scored. But it wasnt made by JWP. And he then went on to invite pressure for the rest of the game with poor passing and sloppy clearances. I reckon he had a few quid on the draw.

 

i support the team, but i am also realistic about performances. JWP was awful on tuesday night.

 

How was it not made by JWP? If he wasn't on pitch we may not have scored

[sadoldgit]

hey, i was happy we scored. But it wasnt made by JWP. And he then went on to invite pressure for the rest of the game with poor passing and sloppy clearances. I reckon he had a few quid on the draw.

 

i support the team, but i am also realistic about performances. JWP was awful on tuesday night.

 

I didn't see the whole game so cant comment on his overall performance but he took up a good position, beat a defender, kept the ball down and on target which then rebounded to Mane to score. I am not sure what more you can do to be involved in a goal?

[sadoldgit]

Are you going to apply your wonderous logic to Pelle's 2nd atrocity at WBA?

 

We can spend all day if we want to highlight the mistakes various players have made this season but isn't that the point? Every player has made mistakes but some get a free pass when others get slagged off. The management obviously consider JWP to be worth investing in as they offered him a new contract. I think they have proved they know what they are doing.

 

Without JWPs input we would not have won that game.

[Lets B Avenue]

I didn't see the whole game so cant comment on his overall performance but he took up a good position, beat a defender, kept the ball down and on target which then rebounded to Mane to score. I am not sure what more you can do to be involved in a goal?

 

How about scoring it himself?

[trousers]

 

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/16261/9890053/james-ward-prowse-england-u21-star-has-the-confidence-to-shine

[beatlesaint]

 

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/16261/9890053/james-ward-prowse-england-u21-star-has-the-confidence-to-shine

 

Wasnt he dropped from the U21 side last night ?

[Mosin]

Wasnt he dropped from the U21 side last night ?

 

was rested, dont think they will do it again though they where lucky to win the game.. missed JWP a lot during game against Sweden, his composure on the ball, his passing, can go as far as to say he holds the under 21 team together and keeps it ticking over tbh

[Dig Dig]

The trouble with JWP is off the ball really. He lacks physicality, aggression and runs like a toddler. The Portugal midfield went past him like a knife through butter the other night.

[Mosin]

The trouble with JWP is off the ball really. He lacks physicality, aggression and runs like a toddler. The Portugal midfield went past him like a knife through butter the other night.

 

Got to give credit to the Portugal players though, some of them would step into are first team tbh.. some very very talented players in that team!

[Saints foreva]

 

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/16261/9890053/james-ward-prowse-england-u21-star-has-the-confidence-to-shine

 

Lol.

[saint-crinny]

Not sure Frank Lampard is the best comparison!

 

A guy who made a career scoring goals from midfield, to a guy who, despite having some good qualities and being technically excellent, literally cannot stick the ball in the net no matter how easy it seems.

 

Biggest area of his game to work on for me