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Claude Puel

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Charlie Wayman

Charlie Wayman

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Posted
23 hours ago, Turkish said:

boring old useless Claude Puel had a better win % than Super Ralph

 

Managerial statistics[edit]

As of match played 5 December 2021[37]
Managerial record by team and tenure
Team From To Record
P W D L Win %
Monaco 13 January 1999 30 June 2001 113 56 24 33 49.56
Lille 1 July 2002 17 June 2008 299 119 94 86 39.80
Lyon 18 June 2008 20 June 2011 156 76 44 36 48.72
Nice 23 May 2012 24 May 2016 169 69 38 62 40.83
Southampton 30 June 2016 14 June 2017 53 20 13 20 37.74
Leicester City 25 October 2017 24 February 2019 67 23 18 26 34.33
Saint-Étienne 4 October 2019 5 December 2021 88 26 23 39 29.55
Total 945 389 254 302 41.16

I'd rather be bored and win than be bored and lose. If Claude had been given the number of chances that Hasenhüttl has had we'd probably be in the top half of the table regularly by now especially when you consider what happened after his exit.

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Charlie Wayman

Charlie Wayman

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21 hours ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

 

On the whole he did an ok job but there's no way I could have sat through another season of that boredom, football is supposed to be an entertainment business after all.

Bringing it back to Ralph, this is where I'm losing faith in him as earlier in his reign we played some attractive attacking football on the front foot, if not always getting the results. Now in his attempt to shore up the defence we are becoming dull and negative to watch and the results aren't improving, that can't continue for much longer.

Oh really? I assume that you are still a season ticket holder and being right royally entertained by what's being served up week on week now.

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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

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Just now, Dorchester Saint said:

Tadic was a shadow of the player he was under Koeman, VVD was out for ages (after a win v Leicester I think) Fonte was on the wane and Gabbiadini started well, but was a bit of a flash in the pan. 

Ralph was so lucky he had Elyounoussi, Bednarek, Vestergaard and Long to call upon, instead of those wastes of space.

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Turkish

Turkish

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21 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

Tadic, VVD, Fonte, Gabbi

He had VVD and Fonte for half the season, Gabi signed in January played a handful of games then got injured. He only played 11 times! Obviously Tadic was better than anything we've got now. 

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Turkish

Turkish

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18 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Ralph was so lucky he had Elyounoussi, Bednarek, Vestergaard and Long to call upon, instead of those wastes of space.

He doesnt have to pick Elyanoussi, he choses to! Bednarek better than Yoshida, Puel had Long as well. 

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Neef

Neef

Posted
Posted

Puel situation was nuanced.

We had to adapt to the added burden of European football for the first time, so I give him some grace there. He also lost VVD & then Fonte halfway into the season, which hamstrung him in a way (I think it ultimately cost us the final at Wembley). Still think he had a stronger squad than Ralph though - Tadic, Hojbjerg VVD & Fonte for the 1st half of the season, younger versions of Bertrand & Romeu too. 

But the 8th placed finish clouds judgement. We finished on 46 points that year. For context, in his full seasons Ralph has finished on 52, 43 & 40. The difference is marginal, and he's had to contend with extremely limited funds & a weaker squad (until now). So I don't think Puel did a better job, and tbh think we may have actually been relegated if he was managing this side over the past 3 years.

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

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49 minutes ago, Neef said:

Puel situation was nuanced.

We had to adapt to the added burden of European football for the first time, so I give him some grace there. He also lost VVD & then Fonte halfway into the season, which hamstrung him in a way (I think it ultimately cost us the final at Wembley). Still think he had a stronger squad than Ralph though - Tadic, Hojbjerg VVD & Fonte for the 1st half of the season, younger versions of Bertrand & Romeu too. 

But the 8th placed finish clouds judgement. We finished on 46 points that year. For context, in his full seasons Ralph has finished on 52, 43 & 40. The difference is marginal, and he's had to contend with extremely limited funds & a weaker squad (until now). So I don't think Puel did a better job, and tbh think we may have actually been relegated if he was managing this side over the past 3 years.

Second time. The previous season we were under Koeman.

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SaintTex

SaintTex

Posted
Posted (edited)

Puel was compared against Koeman's two years prior. Hasenhuttl was compared against Pellegrino

Puel would have been given way more grace if he has been hired after the Pellegrino debacle.

Instead his team was 17 points worse than the year previous. 

 

Edited by SaintTex
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Turkish

Turkish

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6 hours ago, RedArmy said:

Ralph has done some baffling shit in his time here but at least he’s never compared Nathan Redmond to Thierry Henry. 

Another Myth that has been repeated until it’s become fact. He never said that. What he actually said was like Thierry Henry did Redmond could covert from a winger to a striker because he has the ability to cut in and shoot. He wasn’t comparing him at all, he said they could do a similar role. 

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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1 hour ago, Turkish said:

Another Myth that has been repeated until it’s become fact. He never said that. What he actually said was like Thierry Henry did Redmond could covert from a winger to a striker because he has the ability to cut in and shoot. He wasn’t comparing him at all, he said they could do a similar role. 

sToP sAyiNg hE iS pEp gUaRdiOLa

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whelk

whelk

Posted
Posted

Must be international break and time for a Puel discussion. 
I don’t recall us ever getting in the opposition half and every game I attended I fell asleep after 10 minutes. How he survived when we didn’t score one goal is beyond me?

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Piran

Piran

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Posted
14 hours ago, whelk said:

Must be international break and time for a Puel discussion. 
I don’t recall us ever getting in the opposition half and every game I attended I fell asleep after 10 minutes. How he survived when we didn’t score one goal is beyond me?

Blimey, Whelk, I do believe you should see your doctor. Amnesia and narcolepsy...

On another note - and I'm pretty ambivalent about the merits of Puel as Saints manager - it is interesting to read in Arsene Wenger's autobiography, (My life in Red and White) how highly he rated Claude Puel as a player for him at Monaco in the late Eighties and early Nineties, referring to his desire to win, his clever reading of the game, and so on. Wenger also speaks fondly of another ex-Saints manager, Glen Hoddle, at Monaco, but of course these references are to them as players.

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aintforever

aintforever

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Posted
On 22/09/2022 at 10:38, Charlie Wayman said:

Tosh!

I dunno, I would say this is probably stronger than what we have now:

KEEPERS: Forster, McCarthy

DEF: Van Dijk, Yoshida, Cédric, Bertrand, Stephens, Targett, Martina

MID: Højbjerg, Tadić, Romeu, Ward-Prowse, Clasie, Davis, Reed, Boufal 

UP FRONT: Redmond, Long, Austin, Gabbiadini, Rodriguez

 

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notnowcato

notnowcato

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Posted
15 minutes ago, aintforever said:

I dunno, I would say this is probably stronger than what we have now:

KEEPERS: Forster, McCarthy

DEF: Van Dijk, Yoshida, Cédric, Bertrand, Stephens, Targett, Martina

MID: Højbjerg, Tadić, Romeu, Ward-Prowse, Clasie, Davis, Reed, Boufal 

UP FRONT: Redmond, Long, Austin, Gabbiadini, Rodriguez

 

😂.

Can't think why Puel saw our strengths in defence

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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17 hours ago, Turkish said:

Another Myth that has been repeated until it’s become fact. He never said that. What he actually said was like Thierry Henry did Redmond could covert from a winger to a striker because he has the ability to cut in and shoot. He wasn’t comparing him at all, he said they could do a similar role. 

This is the ridiculous stick that the anti Puel people use all the time. 
 

It’s interesting to see what the great player himself thought of Puel.

9B128C22-115D-4B2C-AAA5-CD3F2F2CC468.jpeg

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

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Posted
1 hour ago, notnowcato said:

😂.

Can't think why Puel saw our strengths in defence

TBF, he played like he did because of the opposite.  We had to play deep and compact to not let goals in, because individuals were not great, and at that time Fonte was awol.  But the football from an attacking perspective was some of the worst I've ever watched.

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aintforever

aintforever

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Posted
35 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

This is the ridiculous stick that the anti Puel people use all the time. 
 

It’s interesting to see what the great player himself thought of Puel.

9B128C22-115D-4B2C-AAA5-CD3F2F2CC468.jpeg

To be fair it didn't work out too well for Redders.

Maybe it should read "If you want to work and you’re are willing to listen, and you are Thierry Henry you’re going to improve with Claude Puel, or anyone." 

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

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34 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

TBF, he played like he did because of the opposite.  We had to play deep and compact to not let goals in, because individuals were not great, and at that time Fonte was awol.  But the football from an attacking perspective was some of the worst I've ever watched.

Fonte had signed and was playing for West Ham for half the season, but we've discussed this further above.

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OldNick

OldNick

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On 22/09/2022 at 15:07, once_bitterne said:

In his one year here, Puel managed less home wins than one of the teams who were relegated.

I don't think we lost many of those games but drew 0-0. We missed at least one penalty late in the game that perhaps would have given us victory.

I recall many occasions when I read, 'how did he miss that?' on match threads. He got a rough deal with some fans as he couldn't speak good English and didn't come out with funny soundbites.

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Turkish

Turkish

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8 hours ago, aintforever said:

To be fair it didn't work out too well for Redders.

Maybe it should read "If you want to work and you’re are willing to listen, and you are Thierry Henry you’re going to improve with Claude Puel, or anyone." 

Yet super Ralph played redmond as a striker and he’s some sort of tactical genius yet when Puel suggests he can play as a striker everyone takes the piss out of boring usless Claude 

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once_bitterne

once_bitterne

Posted
Posted
On 23/09/2022 at 15:21, OldNick said:

I don't think we lost many of those games but drew 0-0. We missed at least one penalty late in the game that perhaps would have given us victory.

I recall many occasions when I read, 'how did he miss that?' on match threads. He got a rough deal with some fans as he couldn't speak good English and didn't come out with funny soundbites.

What game?  Have you quoted the wrong post?  I was stating the fact that in Puel's amazing year of 8th place (46 points) we managed fewer home wins than one of the teams who were relegated (Hull).

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OldNick

OldNick

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1 hour ago, once_bitterne said:

What game?  Have you quoted the wrong post?  I was stating the fact that in Puel's amazing year of 8th place (46 points) we managed fewer home wins than one of the teams who were relegated (Hull).

No doubt the case, the last 5 or 6 home games were disappointing where game after game we missed siters that piled the pressure on. Tadic missed a penalty to brak that run which would have eased things. Watch a re-run of the Cup final against United and see the quality of football we played. To win both games against Liverpool in the semis as well as some other good football. He didn't get the chance as he only had a season. It was a remarkable thng that we finished comfortably had an amazing cuprunbut still didnt get a chance. IMO it was a shame, many others were happy to bin him. A mistake, but we have marched on

 

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, OldNick said:

No doubt the case, the last 5 or 6 home games were disappointing where game after game we missed siters that piled the pressure on. Tadic missed a penalty to brak that run which would have eased things. Watch a re-run of the Cup final against United and see the quality of football we played. To win both games against Liverpool in the semis as well as some other good football. He didn't get the chance as he only had a season. It was a remarkable thng that we finished comfortably had an amazing cuprunbut still didnt get a chance. IMO it was a shame, many others were happy to bin him. A mistake, but we have marched on

We wouldn’t have finished anywhere near 8th in the next season and if the end of season trend had continued we might well have been relegated.


Analysis from the BBC,


“They only scored 17 goals in 19 home games and didn't score in six of their last seven home matches.“

 

20 minutes ago, OldNick said:

Comment posted by S4Ever, at 10:42 15 Jun 2017S4Ever

10:42 15 Jun 2017

As a saints fan I can see why people might be shocked. 8th and a cup final. But what people don't realise is that we were 20 points down on last season. Our home record was the 4th worst. We didn't score in our last 5 games. We bombed in Europe in an easy group. We had one of the lowest goals for records. His type of football was anti football. Set up not to lose rather than to win. It was boring.

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Bad Wolf

Bad Wolf

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9 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

We wouldn’t have finished anywhere near 8th in the next season and if the end of season trend had continued we might well have been relegated.


Analysis from the BBC,


“They only scored 17 goals in 19 home games and didn't score in six of their last seven home matches.“

 

You can't judge a manager based on what they may or may not have done in the future...

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warwicksaint

warwicksaint

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Posted
7 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

We wouldn’t have finished anywhere near 8th in the next season and if the end of season trend had continued we might well have been relegated.


Analysis from the BBC,


“They only scored 17 goals in 19 home games and didn't score in six of their last seven home matches.“

 

With that logic Ralph shouldn’t be in charge this season given how bad he was the back end of last season. Think point he is making is in one season Puel achieved more than Ralph has in his time here (granted he had a slightly better squad)

Over our last 19 league games since Feb 25th, we’ve W3 D3 L16, GF 16, GA 41. That is as bad a run as you’re likely to see and we’re relegation fodder as things stand

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Bad Wolf

Bad Wolf

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Ex Lion Tamer said:

Isn't that what you have to do if you're trying to decide if a manager should stay on?

Not really, I'd imagine you judge them on what they've done? I was in favour of keeping Puel because he'd got us to a cup final and finished 8th. Those who were in favour of getting rid I'd imagine felt this way because of the awful football and the poor end to the season. Both sides were retrospective.

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

Posted
Posted
29 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

Not really, I'd imagine you judge them on what they've done? I was in favour of keeping Puel because he'd got us to a cup final and finished 8th. Those who were in favour of getting rid I'd imagine felt this way because of the awful football and the poor end to the season. Both sides were retrospective.

And Ralph got us to an FA Cup semi final which is equivalent. 8th on 46 points is a fluke and if anybody wants to look at what the 8th placed team has achieved over the last twenty years it would be a useful comparison. Last season it would have given us 13th position.

We were on a downward heading.

This does not mean that I am in favour of Ralph staying.

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Dman

Dman

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Whitey Grandad said:

As they say at school, please explain your reasoning.

I mean, I was not a huge fan of Puel and don’t really see getting to a final (and losing) as an achievement, but clearly a final and semi final aren’t equivalent. 

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Dman

Dman

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, Whitey Grandad said:

Same number of rounds albeit one is two-legged but in terms of the achievement of actually getting there.

Yes okay, if you say so. Clearly a pointless debate. 

Edited by Dman
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Lighthouse

Lighthouse

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Posted
2 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

“They only scored 17 goals in 19 home games and didn't score in six of their last seven home matches.“

Nine of those came in three games against Burnley, Palace and Leicester. Puel’s brand of anti-football led to us scoring 4 goals from open play in 16 home games.

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