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Aston Villa 1-0 Saints - Match Thread


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3 minutes ago, Kingsbridge Saint said:

First game thats been on at a decent time for the early risers in Australia. So for many will be the first full game they’ve watched. Might be the last for a while too. We look lost. No shot on target all game that I can recall? 

There was one "shot" that was counted, a harmless blooped header that went up into the air and into Martinez's hands.

Thrilling!

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12 minutes ago, Yozzman said:

I don't like the sound of this, he was good enough for the bench against Wolves. Surely it would have been better to say he was injured  or ill. Got to be better than Diallo.

And it’s been 2 weeks since our last game so it’s impossible for him to learn the system in that time? Surely not

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8 minutes ago, MAY-Z said:

Well he has certainly broken mine

Mine too. Feels like it will never change, dross every week, fluking just enough points to stay up. A decent coach could really ignite the EPL with this exciting team.

Edited by OttawaSaint
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I was there and everyone could see the issues except our clueless manager.

People blaming Moussa he was playing left back now starts on right wing why?

Adam Armstrong is a forward yet Ralph has him covering Perraud in spaces on left nowhere near their box!

why take off your one target and focal point?

KWP was terrible JWP offered nothing , who did Diallo have to pass to going forward Adams marked by 3. Elynoussi has no pace, no talent wanders about nearly making a pass, nearly making a tackle, nearly doing something in 75 minutes but I have no idea what!!!

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AMN getting chucked under the bus by the manager here.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/21895156.hasenhuttl-explains-exclusion-arsenals-maitland-niles-southampton-squad/

“We have with Ainsley a lot of work to do also because he has to adapt to our game and this is something that takes time a little bit,” Hasenhuttl said, speaking after the match.

“We see also during the week what we ask him to do and especially in the midfield position it takes a little bit to understand how we want to do it.

“It doesn’t make sense to throw someone in who isn’t ready for what we want to do. When he is ready and on the level we think he has to be then he will help us for sure.”

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Yet he plays Ely who does what? Please Ralph just resign you clueless twat. I felt a bit for Diallo he had absolutely no-one to pass forward too and tried to run it through middle as not one player ahead offered anything.

Yes Ralph needs to play your way….no positive contributions forwards go for a 0-0 when we never keep clean sheets

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8 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

AMN getting chucked under the bus by the manager here.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/21895156.hasenhuttl-explains-exclusion-arsenals-maitland-niles-southampton-squad/

“We have with Ainsley a lot of work to do also because he has to adapt to our game and this is something that takes time a little bit,” Hasenhuttl said, speaking after the match.

“We see also during the week what we ask him to do and especially in the midfield position it takes a little bit to understand how we want to do it.

“It doesn’t make sense to throw someone in who isn’t ready for what we want to do. When he is ready and on the level we think he has to be then he will help us for sure.”

Maybe that would make sense if the rest of our team played like a well oiled machine. But I’ve got news for you Ralph, they don’t and a big reason for that is the system you play they in so maybe AMN is better off not learning this garbage 

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7 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

AMN getting chucked under the bus by the manager here.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/21895156.hasenhuttl-explains-exclusion-arsenals-maitland-niles-southampton-squad/

“We have with Ainsley a lot of work to do also because he has to adapt to our game and this is something that takes time a little bit,” Hasenhuttl said, speaking after the match.

“We see also during the week what we ask him to do and especially in the midfield position it takes a little bit to understand how we want to do it.

“It doesn’t make sense to throw someone in who isn’t ready for what we want to do. When he is ready and on the level we think he has to be then he will help us for sure.”

What doesn’t fucking make sense is to leave 1 man to do a 2 man job you fucking clown. Villa made it a niggly, shit, street fight of a match and we had no answer to it. 

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1 minute ago, MAY-Z said:

Maybe that would make sense if the rest of our team played like a well oiled machine. But I’ve got news for you Ralph, they don’t and a big reason for that is the system you play they in so maybe AMN is better off not learning this garbage 

Indeed learn our game that has failed for basically the whole of this year. Probably best for everyone he doesn’t 

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What are our expectations here honestly ? We’ve bought a lot of talented inexperienced kids, lost a talented cf  so we only have one extremely limited cf option , and lost a def mid who with JWP could control a midfield. This season was always going to be tough, we are going to get some highs and many lows. We have issues - JWP and Diallo cannot play together - we knew this from previous seasons, they both seem to make each other worse. We don’t have many goals in this team - Che is good for 8 goals a season, JWP will weigh in with similar. Nobody else contributes. That is a huge issue.

on the positive side our defence looks much improved. In the last two games I’d argue that if you swapped keepers in each, both would have ended 0-0. We have to hope Bazuna realises his potential and learns quickly.

I think we have enough to avoid a relegation dogfight - just, and that is my expectation. Of course if we keep losing to the likes of Villa and Wolves then we may not meet that expectation. Everton is looking like a crucial game for Ralph

 

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Moi, AA9, Diallo - useless, wouldn't get into any other side in the Premier League. Fact.

JWP chasing shadows out there - has he really got it in him to be the fucker that Romeu was?

AMN thrown under the bus - just the latest to suffer that fate.

Bazunu performances are troubling.

At least we looked semi-solid? ABK is such an upgrade on Bednarek it isn't true.

As above, Everton feels like a big game. I think he'll be gone during the WC break.

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Ralph - Continues with absolute ridiculous team selections. Cries out for investment, gets it and plays the usual non existent players he’s had for years. Doesn’t keep selecting players that play well in certain positions and has favourites !!!

He is basically shit! 
Hopefully this ownership will ship him out … It’s just more and more of the same …. 
 

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Its probably a good job the Brentford game was postponed. I always thought these three games would tell us what we need to know. We lost two of them to teams who themselves aren't at the races. if we'd lost all 3,  I suspect Ralph may have got his P45.

I fear were starting one our dismal runs early. Loosing is one thing, but the manner is another. Need a new manager with new ideas to get the nest out of the new players alongside our established better ones.

I don't get the AMN comment from Ralph, what does that do for the lad's confidence? Can't get in a team that's woeful ... 

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33 minutes ago, Hodgey said:

What are our expectations here honestly ? We’ve bought a lot of talented inexperienced kids, lost a talented cf  so we only have one extremely limited cf option , and lost a def mid who with JWP could control a midfield. This season was always going to be tough, we are going to get some highs and many lows. We have issues - JWP and Diallo cannot play together - we knew this from previous seasons, they both seem to make each other worse. We don’t have many goals in this team - Che is good for 8 goals a season, JWP will weigh in with similar. Nobody else contributes. That is a huge issue.

on the positive side our defence looks much improved. In the last two games I’d argue that if you swapped keepers in each, both would have ended 0-0. We have to hope Bazuna realises his potential and learns quickly.

I think we have enough to avoid a relegation dogfight - just, and that is my expectation. Of course if we keep losing to the likes of Villa and Wolves then we may not meet that expectation. Everton is looking like a crucial game for Ralph

 

I expect us to have a fucking good go at the other team! I'm ok with losing 3-2 if we've had a good go because it means that not every game will be a 3-2 loss, we'll win and draw some with that attitude.

Ralph's strategy seems to be to rope a dope the opposition but they invariably get in the knockout punch anyway.

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1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

AMN getting chucked under the bus by the manager here.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/21895156.hasenhuttl-explains-exclusion-arsenals-maitland-niles-southampton-squad/

“We have with Ainsley a lot of work to do also because he has to adapt to our game and this is something that takes time a little bit,” Hasenhuttl said, speaking after the match.

“We see also during the week what we ask him to do and especially in the midfield position it takes a little bit to understand how we want to do it.

“It doesn’t make sense to throw someone in who isn’t ready for what we want to do. When he is ready and on the level we think he has to be then he will help us for sure.”

Translation:

This joker had the audacity to pass forward, try shots and move in a way as to open up opportunities for the forwards. We can't have that, we need to retain the ball pass it back and then give them the ball so we can win it back. As soon as the league moves away from this "goals" gimmick and awards points for fanniying around and achieving tge square root of fuck all...well be champions *sob sob sob*

Edited by OttawaSaint
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2 hours ago, trousers said:

I said I'd reserve judgement until the end of the game you buffoon (no offence). As things stand, my verdict is likely to align with your pre-emptive half time judgement. If I had any medals left one would be winging its way to you in a few minutes. Maybe pat yourself on the back instead by way of compensation ;)

I get that you’re as peeved with that performance as the rest of us, but you’ve completely got the wrong end of the stick here. How can my review of the first half of the game, at half-time, be pre-emptive? I think you’re taking yourself a bit too seriously if you’ve taken offence because I’ve asked you to comment on whether the second half was any better. Very MLG! 😉

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1 hour ago, OttawaSaint said:

Surely someone else could get a decent tune out of these young lads?

He coaches the enthusiasm and creativity out of them.

This is key to my thoughts. We ended last season playing a certain way which resulted in a terrible run of form. We spend big in the summer and yet we’re still playing really shit negative football. This guy is going to relegate us eventually and on tonight’s performance, this is the season. It’s as bad as I can ever recall - even the Pellegrino time.

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I don't think different strikers would improve our game if Ralph continues to play like this. The midfield was blatantly too weak, it was never going to work and put added pressure on our defence. 

Ralph as usual believed his own hype after a few relatively improved results.

Nothing changes as long as Ralph remains at the club

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Bad night by all accounts. 

My take was that we tried to play our physical more direct game against a team that are bigger than us and reasonably solid. We had no effective out or way to break them down, and the game was a turgid dire display severely lacking in quality. 

The lesson here is that we can't try to bully teams that are bigger than us. On Ralph to have realised that and to have transitioned to a more effective style of play. Which we didn't. 

Personally think that was one of the worst games of football I've seen saints ever play at this level. A truly terrible advert for Premier league football from both sides. 

Edited by Saint86
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51 minutes ago, Saint86 said:

Bad night by all accounts. 

My take was that we tried to play our physical more direct game against a team that are bigger than us and reasonably solid. We had no effective out or way to break them down, and the game was a turgid dire display severely lacking in quality. 

The lesson here is that we can't try to bully teams that are bigger than us. On Ralph to have realised that and to have transitioned to a more effective style of play. Which we didn't. 

Personally think that was one of the worst games of football I've seen saints ever play at this level. A truly terrible advert for Premier league football from both sides. 

There have been worse overall Saints performances (the Leicester one as an obvious example), because today we weren't shit defensively. But attacking-wise I can't remember anything this bad, it was beyond appalling.

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8 minutes ago, STEVEADAMS said:

Disappointing we all knew the season would be up and down with these young players. But I thought they just might gel quicker amd prove themselves but that was poor. Always liked Ralph but i honestly think Franck is the answer. 

The answer is if you are playing in the PL you get in PL players not youngsters with little or no top class experience and expect them to perform.

 

The squad as everybody is commenting is poor compared with others in the recent past whereas other teams are improving

 

We were poor last season and have lost Tino Broja Redmond  and Romeu who were possibly four  of the better players but have got better options now at CB.

 

 We are unfortunate with Lavia

 

Our attacking quartet is now dire the worst in my opinion we have ever had in the top division since 1966 so the outlook looks pretty bleak and recruiting decent reinforcements looks very difficult

 

So lets hope however that the youngsters gel and perform well but constantly slagging off players and the manager does not help as they all probably know their short comings.

 

In isolation a 1 0 loss at Aston Villa is not that bad a result but having no meaning ful shots on goal is

 

Hampshire CCC which has invested in top class players and has a top class attack hopefully can win the championship for the first time since 1973 and Saints will not go down in 2023 like they did in 1974

 

 

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The strikers weren’t the problem last night. The midfield was.

Defensively we aren’t actually that bad. Perraud I thought was weak and out of position a lot up to the point he was subbed. Bazunu made an error. It happens, but he needs to learn quickly it costs games.

Midfield is non-existent. We miss Lavia massively. Diallo is not up to it. Elyounoussi can bugger off. Djenepo as much as he had a decent game a few stopovers and several decent matches doesn’t make up for the previous three years of crap. 

We are not a strong team as we head up the pitch. One brilliant attacking wide player or new attacking mid would’ve been perfect, on deadline day we got Edozie who is young, but quite frankly he is still better than the rest of them.

We need to play with our strongest players from the start, Aribo, Stu Armstrong etc. Take the game to the opposition.

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The difference between the average positions of each starting XI tonight. 
 

we had Adams Armstrong and Moi practically all occupying the same space, and MD being tucked in.

I mean Villa were poor too but at least they set up and occupied their own area of the pitch. 

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53 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

The strikers weren’t the problem last night. The midfield was.

Defensively we aren’t actually that bad. Perraud I thought was weak and out of position a lot up to the point he was subbed. Bazunu made an error. It happens, but he needs to learn quickly it costs games.

Midfield is non-existent. We miss Lavia massively. Diallo is not up to it. Elyounoussi can bugger off. Djenepo as much as he had a decent game a few stopovers and several decent matches doesn’t make up for the previous three years of crap. 

We are not a strong team as we head up the pitch. One brilliant attacking wide player or new attacking mid would’ve been perfect, on deadline day we got Edozie who is young, but quite frankly he is still better than the rest of them.

We need to play with our strongest players from the start, Aribo, Stu Armstrong etc. Take the game to the opposition.

Should never have sold Romeu

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It summed it up when their DM went off injured and they replaced him with a DM that they turned down a £30m bid from Arsenal for. 

Our DM goes off and we don't even have a replacement on the bench. Who'd have thought at the start of the season that Lavia would become one of our most important players. But we shouldn't be relying so heavily on an 18 year old. 

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The fact is Ralph has served up ridiculously inconsistent form pretty much since he's been here, one run of form aside (a false dawn of many, which after we went on our worst run of losing ever) he has also overseen our heaviest defeat twice.

The owners know this and are happy as the only target is to stay in this league... To us that's success.

However last night was in some ways worse than the 9-0's, we simply didn't look like a football team full stop, couldn't put more than two passes together, players looking totally lost, noone even wanting the ball at one point, noone even rallying the team, no grit, no urgency to even get a point.... Like we didn't want to be there and couldn't be bothered... In short a shambles! 

it's hard to argue that Ralph deserves the job but some will & that's fine.  I don't see how a new manager with fresh ideas and talented youngsters available is not the way forward , Ralph seems so stale and stubborn his inability to recognise his own failings even will be our downfall.

 

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7 hours ago, The Kraken said:

AMN getting chucked under the bus by the manager here.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/21895156.hasenhuttl-explains-exclusion-arsenals-maitland-niles-southampton-squad/

“We have with Ainsley a lot of work to do also because he has to adapt to our game and this is something that takes time a little bit,” Hasenhuttl said, speaking after the match.

“We see also during the week what we ask him to do and especially in the midfield position it takes a little bit to understand how we want to do it.

“It doesn’t make sense to throw someone in who isn’t ready for what we want to do. When he is ready and on the level we think he has to be then he will help us for sure.”

“Ainsley, whenever you get the ball it must go sideways or backwards”.

”You don’t want me to go forward boss?”

”You’re not ready.  Stay at home on Friday”.

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3 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

“Ainsley, whenever you get the ball it must go sideways or backwards”.

”You don’t want me to go forward boss?”

”You’re not ready.  Stay at home on Friday”.

It’s bullshit, isn’t it. 
Playing a “not ready” AMN, even if it is from the bench, is better than leaving JWP up shit creek in a midfield battle. 
Leaving Diallo on would have been better too. 
 

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9 hours ago, Fabrice Fernandes no.1 fan said:

To be positive and move forward we need to give JWP more support

Or alternatively drop him. Doesn't seem to be in anyone's thinking as apparently "he's our best player".

Made me laugh when the commentator said "Villa can't afford to be giving Ward Prowse corners and free kicks". Surely clubs have worked out that a nicely hit cross that lands straight on a defender's head isn't the worst thing in the world.

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2 minutes ago, jabei said:

Or alternatively drop him. Doesn't seem to be in anyone's thinking as apparently "he's our best player".

Made me laugh when the commentator said "Villa can't afford to be giving Ward Prowse corners and free kicks". Surely clubs have worked out that a nicely hit cross that lands straight on a defender's head isn't the worst thing in the world.

He cant be dropped.  He is literally the only leader we have (having sold others)

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We knew we had to be patient with these new (young) players, so up and down games are no surprise.

However that was beyond down, 2 weeks prep, no game next week, they should have been a lot better than that.

Ralph got the set up and team selection wrong. Villa were terrible and that defeat may come back to haunt us next year.

Negatives first. Elyounoussi had a poor game aa did Diallo and JWP. Does that make them bad players? Of course not, Opposition managers  know that our game ticks through JWP, so they ensure he is swamped, harried and pushed back. He needs a minder, in the absence of Romeu and Lavia, I would have put Lyanco on in that role. Not perfect obviously, but it would have at least sorted out McGinn. That would have at least given a chance of the ball going forward.

Positives .... well the defence looked way better. Villa pushed for that goal and got lucky.

I thought Djenepo looked good, put in a real shift as did Adam Armstrong, but both were defensively minded. Moussa lost his way in the 2nd half a bit but that is what subs are for.

Lariosl ooked handy  raw but talented.

The attack didn't stand a chance without the ball so can't be judged imo.

Even I, a uber don't sack the manager merchant, am starting to think Ralph's time is done. If he would just give us a chance it would help.

Everton will fancy their chances now. Let's hope they push at Saints more than Villa. That will help our counter attack setup.

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8 hours ago, Hodgey said:

 

on the positive side our defence looks much improved.

 

The only reason Villa only scored 1, wasn’t because of improvement in our defence. It was because they are fucking pony, if we play like that we’ll get done 5 or 6 against any half decent side. Whilst our centre half pairing appear to be  better, there’s absolutely no improvement in our defensive structure or mentality. When was the last time we kept a clean sheet in a league game? 
 

Our centre halves are being hung out to dry by a piss weak midfield. 

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9 hours ago, WestMidSaint said:

I’m worried about Bazunu. He’s not dropping terrible clangers and throwing them in, but I keep feeling he could’ve done better. I don’t rate his long kicking either. 
 

Obviously he’s very young so should improve, but for now he looks like he has a long way to go. 

His long kicking looks alright, its just his long kicking to a team mate that looks shit......

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9 hours ago, OttawaSaint said:

Surely someone else could get a decent tune out of these young lads?

He coaches the enthusiasm and creativity out of them.

100% nailed on. This is why I said at the start of the season, we will go down unless there is a change in manager before New Year. 

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11 minutes ago, stknowle said:

His long kicking looks alright, its just his long kicking to a team mate that looks shit......

Bazunu is an inexperienced keeper who has played for Rochdale and lowly league one Portsmouth, we shouldn't expect him to be a Premier league standard keeper straight away unfortunately 

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Just woken up in Birmingham following that game. 
Atmosphere was okay, silence and respect was observed impeccably by all which was good to see. 
 

Onto the game, it was dire, and whilst the performance/result isn’t worse than say the 9-0s, the 6-0 to Chelsea, Brentford away, WBA away, Newcastle away against 9 men, last night was really not good viewing.

I want to say not getting in a striker would bite us down the line later, but equally I think if we did get Gakpo then Ralph would probably have coached the life out of him. 
 

I don’t think last night was as a result of not trying, but attacking play gone completely wrong. We seem to be playing direct without having that 6ft+ player to do so. 

Adam Armstrong was so far away from Che who was isolated, it was a wonder how we would ever muster a chance. Elyounoussi is not suitable for a game against non top-6 opposition, has no raw pace as a winger and felt like he lost it every time.

We look so much more deeper on the pitch like a League 2 team playing a PL team. I suppose Ralph did mention in the press conference how great Villa Park is, must have been overawed by the occasion.

Villa didn’t look any better but when you have that £30m quality of Bailey or £150k+ wages of Coutinho, they can muster up one good cross to get goal from nowhere.

However, that is no excuse, as clubs with similar resources are managing too, and Gerrard is a relative rookie in manager terms.
 

Nothing worse than losing on a Friday night before international break, ruined my weekend and now have to mope for 2 weeks.

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9 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

Elyounoussi has played 6 games in an advanced midfield position contributing 0 goals, 0 assists and his pass completion rate is one of the worst in the squad. Mara and Edozie have both shown they have something about them but he is taking their game time and putting in poor performances.

His supposed work against the ball isn't anything to rave about (certainly not enough to justify keeping him in the starting 11) and a large contributor towards why we can't keep clean sheets is because our defense has no outlet. He is the worst player in our team for giving the ball away and inviting pressure back onto our defense. If Ralph insists on a player that has extensive experience in the position, I'd prefer him to give Stuart Armstrong the opportunity who this season has had a significantly better pass completion rate, made more key passes and he's much more mobile.

A midfield paring of JWP and Diallo has never worked either. His options may have been limited but Ralph could have done more to mitigate that clear weakness. It doesn't appear we can play this system without a Lavia/Romeu type player cleaning up. That has been proven consistently. We only had one new outfield player starting today. This isn't a case of a team not gelling, it was tactical ineptness and don't even get me started on the in-game management.

Elyounoussi - Completely agree. He is not, has never been, and never will be a Premier League standard player. The fact he looks a bit less shit than he did when he first arrived does not mask that glaringly obvious fact. As you say no goals, no assists. I'll add no attempts and no chances created that others missed. He's slow, he can't beat a man, he can't tackle. He tries hard but so would I and that sure as feck wouldn't be enough either. If he looks better in training than the players he's picked ahead of then we have massive problems.

Midfield - The last few seasons we've been understocked. Its basically JWP, Romeu, Diallo and occassionally try and shoehorn an Armstrong in there, maybe try an kid like Jankovic (that went well!). Romeu got injured we were fucked as no-one else could perform his role. Transparently obvious that it wasn't enough. We're still in the same place it's just that we're fucked if Romeo gets injured instead of Romeu. We remain a player light in midfield.

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