Aston Villa 4-0 Saints - Match Thread

[saint1977]

7 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

That was horrible viewing, but we were kind of overdue that really. I had a funny feeling about today, I just felt they'd have way too much for us in the number 10 roles and so it proved. Couldn't handle the movement of Coutinho at all, the CM's and CB's were getting pulled all over the midlands. Watkins and Ings were very sharp as well.

It did show up a couple of areas in our squad we need to evolve if we really want to challenge the Villas/Wolves etc - better CB without doubt, we can't really go on with one top 10 centre back (Salisu). Better number 10 with pace as well, we really lack that. As good as Elyonoussi and Armstrong have been, we do lack pace when they play.

One of them days, always going to happen for a mid-table side. Hope we can still finish top 10, that's got to be our aim.

Yep, I had that sense as well. You can see why Coutinho has gone for the fees he has and Watkins was on form which hasn’t always been the case this season. Don’t understand Ings getting booed - we got £30m for a quality player turning 30 but with a very patchy injury record. But for his goals would be in a dreadful place and no Dragan. 

Salisu badly missed - Stephens and Bednarek are decent PL squad options that you can one of but can’t afford two. With the takeover, imperative now to be selling one of them, probably Jan for £12-15m and breaking our record to get a first choice partner for Salisu. Crossing my fingers Salisu will see he needs more development time over a couple of years to be first choice for a regular CL side as VVD became and signs a new deal, probably with a release clause. 

KWP coming in for Livra if fit on Thursday, another of the best players missed today. Che’s worst game for a while, not an easy ground for an ex Birmingham player to go to. Broja will have up and down days. Agree that whilst Moi improved, we lack that change of pace in the 10 areas. Like Jan, probably time for both parties to move on with Redmond. He’ll want more games than he is getting and probably raise £15m or so there as well towards rebuilding the squad. The recent great form didn’t change the urgent buys needed at first choice GK, CB, 10 and striker.

[Chez]

 

1 minute ago, Sheaf Saint said:

You mean apart from having our only shot on target that forced a good save from Martinez? 

I must have missed that.  Should he have scored?

I thought in general his touch was tidy enough, he didn't hold it up and he didn't really do anything. Adams has been very decent in recent weeks, but he is not a world beater and it showed today.  He will have better days. They all will.

[S-Clarke]

1 minute ago, saint1977 said:

Yep, I had that sense as well. You can see why Coutinho has gone for the fees he has and Watkins was on form which hasn’t always been the case this season. Don’t understand Ings getting booed - we got £30m for a quality player turning 30 but with a very patchy injury record. But for his goals would be in a dreadful place and no Dragan. 

Salisu badly missed - Stephens and Bednarek are decent PL squad options that you can one of but can’t afford two. With the takeover, imperative now to be selling one of them, probably Jan for £12-15m and breaking our record to get a first choice partner for Salisu. Crossing my fingers Salisu will see he needs more development time over a couple of years to be first choice for a regular CL side as VVD became and signs a new deal, probably with a release clause. 

KWP coming in for Livra if fit on Thursday, another of the best players missed today. Che’s worst game for a while, not an easy ground for an ex Birmingham player to go to. Broja will have up and down days. Agree that whilst Moi improved, we lack that change of pace in the 10 areas. Like Jan, probably time for both parties to move on with Redmond. He’ll want more games than he is getting and probably raise £15m or so there as well towards rebuilding the squad. The recent great form didn’t change the urgent buys needed at first choice GK, CB, 10 and striker.

This summer definitely needs to be the summer we focus on two area's that have really been left to fester for years - GK and wide/number 10's.

We have a lot of players in both positions, but most of that is real average. If we can shift some of that average on and find some Tinos, Broja's etc in those area's then we'll be laughing. 

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, saint1977 said:

 

Salisu badly missed - Stephens and Bednarek are decent PL squad options that you can one of but can’t afford two. With the takeover, imperative now to be selling one of them, probably Jan for £12-15m and breaking our record to get a first choice partner for Salisu. Crossing my fingers Salisu will see he needs more development time over a couple of years to be first choice for a regular CL side as VVD became and signs a new deal, probably with a release clause. 

Stephens got a new contract I think and I don't get the feeling Bednerek will be sold. Like you, I fear Salisu will depart. If he doesn't sign a new contract this summer, it will be this summer.

[OttawaSaint]

3 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

This summer definitely needs to be the summer we focus on two area's that have really been left to fester for years - GK and wide/number 10's.

We have a lot of players in both positions, but most of that is real average. If we can shift some of that average on and find some Tinos, Broja's etc in those area's then we'll be laughing. 

CB as well. Salisu out and we're a shambles. Our replacements, Bednarek, Stephens, Lyanco, Valery all way too inconsistent. 

Edited 5 March, 2022 by OttawaSaint

[jasonb]

47 minutes ago, Chez said:

likewise. I can never watch MOTD if we lose.

Always an early night for me when Saints lose. Makes tomorrows long run slightly easier. Silver linings and all that. 

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

This summer definitely needs to be the summer we focus on two area's that have really been left to fester for years - GK and wide/number 10's.

We have a lot of players in both positions, but most of that is real average. If we can shift some of that average on and find some Tinos, Broja's etc in those area's then we'll be laughing. 

what a game like this shows, is that no matter how much we like our players (when they are winning), there is always room for improvement.  Not easy finding those world beating attackers on our budget.

[S-Clarke]

Just now, OttawaSaint said:

CB as well. Salisu out and we're a shambles. Our replacements, Bednarek, Stephens, Lyamco, Valery all way too inconsistent. 

Probably not as big a priority as those other two area's, but certainly somewhere we need to look at if someone moves on. Not got a problem with Lyanco, he's well ahead of Stephens for me.

We need a Romeu replacement too, if he's not 'on it' or he's injured then we don't have another Romeu. I hate the way we keep trying to shoehorn Diallo into that role, he's not a Romeu replacement in any way. He's a good little player is Diallo, but he needs to be incorporated further up the pitch not in a defensive deep role - he can't compete at this level.

[The Kraken]

6 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

This summer definitely needs to be the summer we focus on two area's that have really been left to fester for years - GK and wide/number 10's.

We have a lot of players in both positions, but most of that is real average. If we can shift some of that average on and find some Tinos, Broja's etc in those area's then we'll be laughing. 

I’d say centre back is a priority. Salisu is good but nobody else is good enough as a starting CB if we’re aiming to consistently break the top ten.

just watching the Liverpool game and Joe Gomez is nowhere to be seen again, I wonder if someone like him might be available, I liked the look of him but he’s well out of favour.

Edited 5 March, 2022 by The Kraken

[LiberalCommunist]

If Salisu isn't fit by Thursday, I'll be furious if the club don't fake a C19 outbreak.

FURIOUS

[Mr X]

4-0 and I'm looking at it like we got out of jail there, could easily have been  double that (amd that would have been devastating  to morale) certainly a bad day where we didn't turn up at the office but let's see if we can turn it around next game amd proove it was just a blip, onwards and upwards! (Hopefully) 

[OttawaSaint]

1 minute ago, LiberalCommunist said:

If Salisu isn't fit by Thursday, I'll be furious if the club don't fake a C19 outbreak.

FURIOUS

We need to time it to perfection so that Newcastle and their fans are halfway to Southampton by the time it gets called off...

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, OttawaSaint said:

CB as well. Salisu out and we're a shambles. Our replacements, Bednarek, Stephens, Lyanco, Valery all way too inconsistent. 

It's an incredibly tough position to play these days (got to be big, strong, quick, and able to read the game and be good on the ball, pass, decent first touch...) and some of the players don't tick all the boxes. Very hard for a team on our budget to find and keep those that do.

[wadesmith]

On the plus side Broja didn’t score &  Chelsea got four. Basically he’s ours if we want him.

[AlexLaw76]

Awful result. Players not uo to it today (bar Forster)

Howeevr, thought villa git it spot on. Defending in numbers and pretty narrow, denied space for our 10s and hit us early on the counter.

The way we play means if we not at it, this is what happens! 

I hope this is an anomolie l, and not the start of a poor run

[Chez]

4 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

 

We need a Romeu replacement too, if he's not 'on it' or he's injured then we don't have another Romeu. I hate the way we keep trying to shoehorn Diallo into that role, he's not a Romeu replacement in any way. He's a good little player is Diallo, but he needs to be incorporated further up the pitch not in a defensive deep role - he can't compete at this level.

 

Is Diallo actually any good in that more forward role? I don't see him being anything more than a defensive midfielder. If he can't do that, then he needs to be replaced.

[S-Clarke]

5 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

I’d say centre back is a priority. Salisu is good but nobody else is good enough as a starting CB if we’re aiming to consistently break the top ten.

just watching the Liverpool game and Joe Gomez is nowhere to be seen again, I wonder if someone like him might be available, I liked the look of him but he’s well out of favour.

I don't disagree, but I just think our 'chance' to really upgrade the CB area was last summer but we didn't have much scope to do anything bar a cheap and cheerful Lyanco. We've now got him on a decent length contract, along with Bednarek, Stephens and Salisu etc (typically Salisu is the one with the least time left on his deal). 

If we sell Salisu in the summer then obviously it changes things, but I don't think we'll be doing anything in that area unless we get some crazy bids for the existing.

[Nordic Saint]

2 minutes ago, Chez said:

It's an incredibly tough position to play these days (got to be big, strong, quick, and able to read the game and be good on the ball, pass, decent first touch...) and some of the players don't tick all the boxes. Very hard for a team on our budget to find and keep those that do.

Ironically, we let both Chambers and Mings go and they looked far superior to Bednarek and Stephens. But, I'm optimistic that Salisu and Valery will form a good partenrship.

[S-Clarke]

2 minutes ago, Chez said:

 

Is Diallo actually any good in that more forward role? I don't see him being anything more than a defensive midfielder. If he can't do that, then he needs to be replaced.

I like him in an advanced role, I've seen him there a few times. He's quick, agile and has got some good skill on him to beat a man. He was terrific in that role against Brentford, just slightly ahead of the CM and using his pace to burst forward - it really worked.

He's not a sitter in my opinion, he doesn't have the physicality to play that role and he never will have.

He could play alongside a Romeu, but as soon as you have Dialo and JWP as your two then you are physically over-run.

Edited 5 March, 2022 by S-Clarke

[AlexLaw76]

Agree with the CB comments..I feel we need a better CB to partner Salisu, and a better 10. 

Add to replacing Broja if he is not at saints next year 

[hasper57saint]

It’s time for our new owners to start putting their hands into their pockets. We need to strengthen the defence starting with a keeper. Bednarek is way past his prime.Stevens at times is like a cart horse. Today we were brought down to earth by a team who on comparison deserve to be below us but we have to adapt our play to the occasion not the past. Let’s scupper the Magpies next week and come out with our heads held high.

PS. Wipe that bloody smirk off Howes face!

[whelk]

Load of shite today on top of being told our energy bill rising by nearly a grand and Portsmouth won 4-0 so all shit. Oh well at least there is still Mrs Brown’s boys

[S-Clarke]

Just now, hasper57saint said:

It’s time for our new owners to start putting their hands into their pockets. We need to strengthen the defence starting with a keeper. Bednarek is way past his prime.Stevens at times is like a cart horse. Today we were brought down to earth by a team who on comparison deserve to be below us but we have to adapt our play to the occasion not the past. Let’s scupper the Magpies next week and come out with our heads held high.

PS. Wipe that bloody smirk off Howes face!

He's 25 years old to be fair, certainly not past his prime. On paper he's our 2nd best CB, Lyanco third, Stephens 4th. Ideally you'd lose Stephens, drop Lyanco to 4th, Bednarek to third and buy a new 2nd choice CB. I just don't see a possibility of that happening though.

[Nordic Saint]

8 minutes ago, hasper57saint said:

It’s time for our new owners to start putting their hands into their pockets. We need to strengthen the defence starting with a keeper. Bednarek is way past his prime.Stevens at times is like a cart horse. Today we were brought down to earth by a team who on comparison deserve to be below us but we have to adapt our play to the occasion not the past. Let’s scupper the Magpies next week and come out with our heads held high.

PS. Wipe that bloody smirk off Howes face!

Forster has arguably been our best player this season. We could replace McCarthy with David Raya but a new centre back is a  priority. We should buy Dael Fry in the summer but Salisu and Valery might still form a good central defensive partnership.  A deadly finisher would be good. Andrea Belotti will be available on a free in the summer but we'd need to offer him mega wages. It would be worth it though.

Edited 5 March, 2022 by Nordic Saint

[cloggy saint]

2 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

He's 25 years old, certainly not past his prime. On paper he's our 2nd best CB, Lyanco third, Stephens 4th. Ideally you'd lose Stephens, drop Lyanco to 4th, Bednarek to third and buy a new 2nd choice CB. I just don't see a possibility of that happening though.

 

[stknowle]

3 minutes ago, cloggy saint said:

 

 

[Chez]

11 minutes ago, Nordic Saint said:

Ironically, we let both Chambers and Mings go and they looked far superior to Bednarek and Stephens. But, I'm optimistic that Salisu and Valery will form a good partenrship.

both of them have looked poor on other occasions. I think there are one two top class CBs that can handle one on one situations but the rest rely heavy on the right kind of protection in front and around them. Expose Mings or Bednerak and you see their frailties.

Sorry, but I don't see Valery as the answer. Far too lightweight and not good enough in the air, which is the elementary requirements of a CB. I might be wrong. I often am.

[Chez]

17 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I like him in an advanced role, I've seen him there a few times. He's quick, agile and has got some good skill on him to beat a man. He was terrific in that role against Brentford, just slightly ahead of the CM and using his pace to burst forward - it really worked.

He's not a sitter in my opinion, he doesn't have the physicality to play that role and he never will have.

He could play alongside a Romeu, but as soon as you have Dialo and JWP as your two then you are physically over-run.

Hmm. I don't see enough guile myself. He was bought to be a holding midfielder.  Still young, but his lack of presence and physicality have been an issue to date. 

[gallaghert366@yahoo.com]

Recent suggestions, by a few on here, of a top eight finish and Europe next season may now seem to be optimistic!

Edited 5 March, 2022 by gallaghert366@yahoo.com

[Dorchester Saint]

37 minutes ago, OttawaSaint said:

CB as well. Salisu out and we're a shambles. Our replacements, Bednarek, Stephens, Lyanco, Valery all way too inconsistent. 

Böllocks!! Did you miss the result v West Ham last time out?

We had an off day that’s all, it happens to all clubs. We don’t need knee jerk reactions and knicker wetting. 

[Pilchards]

They packed the midfield to shut down the quick passing game of ours plus they took the risk to play more attacking football to hit us on the break and keep us pegged back.

I could see it was never going to be our day after 20 minutes and I just hope other teams don’t follow the same pattern.

PS Broja is a better option off the bench against tired legs.

[Chez]

1 minute ago, Dorchester Saint said:

Böllocks!! Did you miss the result v West Ham last time out?

We had an off day that’s all, it happens to all clubs. We don’t need knee jerk reactions and knicker wetting. 

I watched it and I didn't come away thinking Bednerek, Valery, Stephens and Lyanco are great CBs. 

I think we got away it in that game to a certain extent. We really should have been two down. We were carved up, not too dissimilar today. The difference was we were not punished. Valery got lots of plaudit on here, but he made a massive balls up later in the game which went completely unpunished. He, like Stephens has a massive rick in him. I don't think our Cbs were put under any great pressure or ever exposed in one on one situations. Lyanco is reckless. He gets away it a lot. Maybe he blossoms, like Fonte did (he was also a bit reckless), but if he's our starting CB next season, I don't think we improve.

[Chez]

4 minutes ago, Pilchards said:

They packed the midfield to shut down the quick passing game of ours plus they took the risk to play more attacking football to hit us on the break and keep us pegged back.

I could see it was never going to be our day after 20 minutes and I just hope other teams don’t follow the same pattern.

PS Broja is a better option off the bench against tired legs.

Agree with that, except personally I think Broja is just fine playing the entire 90.

[OttawaSaint]

6 minutes ago, Dorchester Saint said:

Böllocks!! Did you miss the result v West Ham last time out?

We had an off day that’s all, it happens to all clubs. We don’t need knee jerk reactions and knicker wetting. 

No I didn't miss the West Ham game. It was Stephens and Valery in that. Stephens and Bednarek today were a shambles. No knee jerk. I said bad day at the office. No wet knickers, I know who we are as a team, I know what we have. 

We need to be much better in the next one otherwise an on form Newcastle will take the points.

[Harry_SFC]

Stephens is nowhere near good enough to be a regular starter for a premier league team. He is ok when playing in a low block but when the defence is a bit higher or he comes up against someone with pace he really struggles. Bednarek very similar, they are both last ditch defenders if you know what I mean. 

[Pilchards]

5 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Stephens is nowhere near good enough to be a regular starter for a premier league team. He is ok when playing in a low block but when the defence is a bit higher or he comes up against someone with pace he really struggles. Bednarek very similar, they are both last ditch defenders if you know what I mean. 

Maybe Valery might be a better option as he was class vs West Ham.

[JRM]

1 hour ago, gallaghert366@yahoo.com said:

Recent suggestions, by a few on here, of a top eight finish and Europe next season may now seem to be optimistic!

Missed out on our chance to make up points on Wolves and West Ham today, now looking over our shoulders in the table at Villa, Palace, Leicester, Brighton all just a couple of points behind. 

Disappointing result and Newcastle up next suddenly looks a really tricky game with the form they are on. 

 

[Harry_SFC]

49 minutes ago, Pilchards said:

Maybe Valery might be a better option as he was class vs West Ham.

Valery is an odd one, looks so poor at RB but when he's played at CB this season he's been very solid. If Salisu is out for a few games I'd give him a run in the team. 

[Norm]

I’ve just watched the goals on Sky, oh my, what shocking defending 🙄

[vectraman]

We have been on a great run, today was just one of those days where nothing worked out. Missed Salisu for sure, Bednarek and Jack are not a good enough combo at the back - both too slow and don’t read the game as well as Salisu.  
Hey ho, onto Newcastle and back to winning ways 🤞🤞

[CB Fry]

2 hours ago, gallaghert366@yahoo.com said:

Recent suggestions, by a few on here, of a top eight finish and Europe next season may now seem to be optimistic!

Top 8 and Europe is not an optimistic suggestion.

[Saint Matty 76]

6 hours ago, Saint Matty 76 said:

I'm a little bit scared about a "minor" Salisu injury after his first year.

"Doesn't know how long he'll be out for" doesn't ease these fears. Hopefully it's just playing a guessing game for Newcastle.

[John Boy Saint]

Looks like my day out playing golf in the wind rain and mud - was far better than festering at home watching a dodgy stream too piss me off more than my golf.

Ralph calling some of us out for questioning his selection for the cup game - here we are after a nice little run being served up the normal gruel we are use to. Hey-Ho 

[Harry_SFC]

27 minutes ago, Saint Matty 76 said:

"Doesn't know how long he'll be out for" doesn't ease these fears. Hopefully it's just playing a guessing game for Newcastle.

St Maximin up against Stephens and Bednarek *shudders* 

[JRM]

1 hour ago, Saint Matty 76 said:

"Doesn't know how long he'll be out for" doesn't ease these fears. Hopefully it's just playing a guessing game for Newcastle.

If it is his hamstring might be a while longer , got to have him in for Man City Cup game at least 

[Turkish]

50 minutes ago, John Boy Saint said:

Looks like my day out playing golf in the wind rain and mud - was far better than festering at home watching a dodgy stream too piss me off more than my golf.

Ralph calling some of us out for questioning his selection for the cup game - here we are after a nice little run being served up the normal gruel we are use to. Hey-Ho 

You’re lucky to get a round in mate. My club has been shut pretty much the since the end of February. Amazing course from April-October, awful in the winter. This was the 10th a week ago 

[Whitey Grandad]

14 minutes ago, JRM said:

If it is his hamstring might be a while longer , got to have him in for Man City Cup game at least 

Hamstrings are normally six weeks or longer.

[Dr Who?]

Now. We had a winning team, they were basically dropped (rested) for a big FA Cup game and brought back for today. In hindsight perhaps we should have just kept playing as much as the winning team as possible. Whatever it was something was off, but once I heard we had the 2 at the back out I lost a lot of confidence. 

I would like to think we will bounce back and take 4 points in the next 8 days. But still take the quarter final win for no points in these games. It’s all about the Cup for me now. 

 

[nta786]

Just back from the game today - I think it can be summed up as a very day at the office. It could have been 6-1 if Villa took all their chances but it was a shame how brittle we looked.

Unfortunately missing Salisu/KWP hurt but that isn’t fair on Villa who also had Konsa/Digne missing. Something just wasn’t quite right today, all very laboured. I think I could have stomached a result like today had all these players played midweek for 90 + minutes, but alas it wasn’t to be.

I also think this sort of humbling was partially needed - I didn’t like Ralph saying before the game that “Gerrard has lots to learn” because on today’s showing it didn’t seem like it. No need to panic, we need to do the analysis and move on.

On a final note, not that I’m complaining about the free scarf - I have to admit that it must be the thinnest material I’ve ever seen for a scarf!!!

 

[OttawaSaint]

47 minutes ago, Turkish said:

You’re lucky to get a round in mate. My club has been shut pretty much the since the end of February. Amazing course from April-October, awful in the winter. This was the 10th a week ago 

*cries in Canadian*