Bad Wolf Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 13 hours ago, JRM said: Theo Walcott has been a big disappointment hasn't he. I disagree. He was signed on a free as a squad player and in his loan season did okay. Granted last season he was pretty poor but what did anyone actually expect? A positive influence on the kids as well (though admittedly that doesn't justify his wages). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltonaggro Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 10 hours ago, The Kraken said: Just had a quick google of that as I wondered where they were with it, looks like planning permission got stalled and they’re still waiting for a green light. The whole development includes a hotel and an apartment block on the site, I’m wondering if Leicesters cash situation has anything go with that (probably not but the owners could be holding off I suppose). Leicester always an interesting comparator to us on and off the park, particularly with an identical flat pack Barr stadium. Interesting to see what you can do in terms of a small extension and an robust architectural makeover - when we are transformed into the English Borussia Dortmund under Sports Republic we will probably have a red version of this - https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/buildings/in-pictures-leicester-city-unveils-stadium-expansion-12-08-2021/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 16 minutes ago, Miltonaggro said: Leicester always an interesting comparator to us on and off the park, particularly with an identical flat pack Barr stadium. Interesting to see what you can do in terms of a small extension and an robust architectural makeover - when we are transformed into the English Borussia Dortmund under Sports Republic we will probably have a red version of this - https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/buildings/in-pictures-leicester-city-unveils-stadium-expansion-12-08-2021/ If we were to expand like that we could give that bit to the away fans and turn the Northam into a Kop end. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 (edited) 17 hours ago, Toussaint said: It is human nature, but at the higher levels of management in any business of life you do have to put personality to one side, often the greatest talents are much more difficult to manage and control. So it should be about best for the "business" otherwise you end up with a load of agreeable less talented "yes men". Lawrie Mac and Starchan were two examples of managers who got this right, I think maybe also Poch, and players were in awe of Ronald, I don't get that vibe from Ralph. Don't think I would have selected Lawrie, WGS or Poch to back up this point (and I won't have a word said against Lawrie or WGS). Lawrie and WGS were renowned for not suffering fools. Hypos point is not well made and doesn't stand up to scrutiny in the real world. Edited 2 August, 2022 by VectisSaint Poch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint86 Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 (edited) 47 minutes ago, VectisSaint said: Don't think I would have selected Lawrie, WGS or Porch to back up this point (and I won't have a word said against Lawrie or WGS). Lawrie and WGS were renowned for not suffering fools. Hypos point is not well made and doesn't stand up to scrutiny in the real world. I agree. SAF hit his mercurial talents in the face with boots, and I doubt Clough was very accommodating either - and we all know Jose has had a particular management style throughout his career. Similary Pep and Klopp get what they want with their players, and if they don't play ball they get moved on. As for accommodating special talents, just look at the long list of managers that have failed at PSG because they prioritise accommodating players over the manager's wishes, and United have been plagued by that as well in recent years. I've personally always had the impression that the best managers are tactically astute/successful, and have a disciplined respectful no nonsense man management style, the type that set-out how it is and don't tolerate players stepping out of line, but that also praise and look after players that deliver. End of the day its a job and is about putting a professional framework in place that lets the team, manger, coaches etc. all work together to deliver. Second you start giving someone special treatment within that you're on a slippery slope. Edited 2 August, 2022 by Saint86 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaus Schwab Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 hour ago, Turkish said: If we were to expand like that we could give that bit to the away fans and turn the Northam into a Kop end. Not to mention that it would attract fans from as far away as Plymouth and Bristol etc 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 21 minutes ago, Saint86 said: I agree. SAF hit his mercurial talents in the face with boots, and I doubt Clough was very accommodating either - and we all know Jose has had a particular management style throughout his career. Similary Pep and Klopp get what they want with their players, and if they don't play ball they get moved on. As for accommodating special talents, just look at the long list of managers that have failed at PSG because they prioritise accommodating players over the manager's wishes, and United have been plagued by that as well in recent years. I've personally always had the impression that the best managers are tactically astute/successful, and have a disciplined respectful no nonsense man management style, the type that set-out how it is and don't tolerate players stepping out of line, but that also praise and look after players that deliver. End of the day its a job and is about putting a professional framework in place that lets the team, manger, coaches etc. all work together to deliver. Second you start giving someone special treatment within that you're on a slippery slope. Yeah Ferguson was a famously crap man manager. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSAINT Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 😭 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Also interesting to hear from my brother in law who is an ex professional footballer. He said the best managers are the ones who have a hard man disciplinarian reputation in front of the cameras and then are the complete opposite behind the scenes. There are many examples. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Convict Colony Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 34 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Also interesting to hear from my brother in law who is an ex professional footballer. He said the best managers are the ones who have a hard man disciplinarian reputation in front of the cameras and then are the complete opposite behind the scenes. There are many examples. Conte normally fits this - gets his players dying for him 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coalman Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 26 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Also interesting to hear from my brother in law who is an ex professional footballer. He said the best managers are the ones who have a hard man disciplinarian reputation in front of the cameras and then are the complete opposite behind the scenes. There are many examples. Successful management is about lots of things including: - Showing empathy and compassion to the people you're leading - Setting clear boundaries and expectations - Being perceived as fair - Being consistent Without compassion and empathy you can't have difficult conversations without resorting to being an a$$hole. The downside is that when someone doesn't believe their situation is fair then none of the rest really matters. But, making people happy isn't your job. If people are making progress and they feel they are treated fairly then they'll perform for you. If you bend over backwards to appease people then they won't. Once people lose themselves to their own hype and become entitled then you have similar problems. With premiership footballers then a large part of your job is also going to be keeping people grounded because no 20 year old is going to turn into a functioning and responsible adult if they're earning millions (or even 100s of thousands) a year without the right support. Particularly with social and agent pressure. I think Ferguson was good at empathy - he gave a shit about his players. Mourinho clearly is not and only cares about his players for what they bring him.. Which is one of the reasons Mourinho has a shelf life wherever he goes and Ferguson had such a long career at Man Utd.. What both have/had is a burning will to win and intolerance of low standards. But without that connection will to win only gets you so far. And without that will to win and intolerance of low standards then empathy only gets you so far too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSAINT Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 #ColwillWatch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Wayman Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 17 hours ago, FarehamSaintJames said: And in the classic Southampton Way it wouldn't surprise me if we offered two year extensions to the likes of Romeu, Redmond, Elyounoussi and Valery. 🙄 As a club we need to be more ruthless when it comes to contract expiries and signing new players to replace ones that aren't good enough. Someone touched on Lyanco signing last summer for example, weird all round and in no way an upgrade on Vestergaard. Someone else also touched on how weak we look as a starting eleven and how bloated we look as a squad and I wouldn't disagree with that. If you're any opposing striker looking at our defence you must be proper excited to play us, even now, knowing that these signings are young and less experienced (whether that be in the Prem or in general). And (😉) why not in his case, Romeu is still a class act and a stalwart of our team. He has by far the best work ethic at the club and is nowhere near the end of his career. He deserves a new contract on merit and because without him we will struggle. Players of Romeu's calibre don't come to St Mary's too often these days and certainly don't hang around long even if they do. We can argue all day long about the merits of the other's that you've cited, as for being ruthless, what on earth does that mean? Releasing players doesn't need to be an aggressive or confrontational act. When a contract is up, it is up. If players have no role to play in the club's future they will be released, not as discarded under-performing adversaries but as departing friends, as in the case of Shane Long. We pride ourselves on being an inclusive, happy family club - let's keep it that way. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Wayman Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 45 minutes ago, hypochondriac said: Also interesting to hear from my brother in law who is an ex professional footballer. He said the best managers are the ones who have a hard man disciplinarian reputation in front of the cameras and then are the complete opposite behind the scenes. There are many examples. Generalisations are never a very good idea and this one is ludicrous. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltonaggro Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 2 hours ago, Turkish said: If we were to expand like that we could give that bit to the away fans and turn the Northam into a Kop end. Yes, shouldn't really mention this but as soon as we win the league Dragan has this pencilled in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 33 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said: Generalisations are never a very good idea and this one is ludicrous. Does that apply to this one too? 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 3 minutes ago, Miltonaggro said: Yes, shouldn't really mention this but as soon as we win the league Dragan has this pencilled in. When is our first fans forum with Dragon and Rasmus? I'd like to ask Rasmus what they are going to do about rewarding away fans for their loyalty, i see Bolton gave all their fans a free pint on saturday, when will saints start reward us, i've been going away since 1986 and never fot a free pint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltonaggro Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 3 minutes ago, Turkish said: When is our first fans forum with Dragon and Rasmus? I'd like to ask Rasmus what they are going to do about rewarding away fans for their loyalty, i see Bolton gave all their fans a free pint on saturday, when will saints start reward us, i've been going away since 1986 and never fot a free pint. Again, shouldn't really say but they are going with free tickets for Saints ladies and a discounted kebab for everyone who attends ten away matches... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 hour ago, hypochondriac said: Also interesting to hear from my brother in law who is an ex professional footballer. He said the best managers are the ones who have a hard man disciplinarian reputation in front of the cameras and then are the complete opposite behind the scenes. There are many examples. I know an ex pro as well and he's echo'd very similar thoughts. Said Cloughy was actually warm, down to Earth, humble man away from the cameras and was never scared to admit when he was wrong. On a side note, this ex-pro is good mates with our old boy Terry Curran who apparently holds us in very high esteem despite not playing for us for that long. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally_uk Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Any rumours of in-comings? seems a bit quiet i'm not feeling optimistic with current squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 4 minutes ago, ally_uk said: Any rumours of in-comings? seems a bit quiet i'm not feeling optimistic with current squad. Ralph's already said there's another striker coming in. He didn't say hopefully or possibly, he categorically said it would happen. No manager is going to say stuff like that if they wern't absolutely sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally_uk Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Really I thought I saw Andy Carroll in IKEA earlier.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarehamSaintJames Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 hour ago, SuperSAINT said: 😭 Have I missed the hype around Cucurella? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Convict Colony Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 minute ago, FarehamSaintJames said: Have I missed the hype around Cucurella? Nope there wasnt any until it turned out city wanted him then the media goes into overdrive. He was rated the 12th best left back last year of players who played 10 games or more - KWP was rated 5th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee On Solent Saint Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 2 minutes ago, Convict Colony said: Nope there wasnt any until it turned out city wanted him then the media goes into overdrive. He was rated the 12th best left back last year of players who played 10 games or more - KWP was rated 5th. Sssssh! Don't tell anyone about KWP!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gio1saints Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 11 minutes ago, Turkish said: When is our first fans forum with Dragon and Rasmus? I'd like to ask Rasmus what they are going to do about rewarding away fans for their loyalty, i see Bolton gave all their fans a free pint on saturday, when will saints start reward us, i've been going away since 1986 and never fot a free pint. Your response, albeit half tongue in cheek, does raise the bigger old chestnut question though - which is that of saint ticket pricing in general. We cannot afford new players without changing more to watch. Everybody who posts that we need new players should also post a disclaimer stating they know this likely means the ticket prices will probably need to go up- and that's ok. Everybody knows Saints have to max commercial revenue any way it can to offset wages and stay FFP compliant. But we all conveniently forget when it comes to how much we want club to spend. Not may clubs have found the "sweet spot" between "fair" matchday ticket revenues and the transfer fees + wages that are seemingly required to deliver a moderately winning team that stays in the EPL and gets that TV money. SR have spent a lot on new players - and their wages. We currently have very few outgoing to reduce the wage bill or even able to bring in a transfer fee. Be under no illusions. The prospect of subsidised away trips for hardy loyalists and so forth are not good. A simple example was two recent home friendlies- children and concessions should have been free. The goal should have been a full house. Perhaps everyone paying £5 or £10 and a charity donation to Hants underprivileged children and families in need. Would be a Sell Out. And we know with a family crowd there's the merch and consumables on top. Plus the prospect of a loyal customer for life. Plus teh excellent PR and community goodwill uplift. Instead we get the unimaginative unambitious uncreative take take not give give approach same as what happens every year : very low mediocre attendance for supposedly glamour fixtures and a lunar atmosphere. No owner dares take that chance. Every season its the same. Its only a couple of matches so I am still perplexed that they don't think the maths add up. We cannot afford £40m Broja but we can afford to do this. And if it does end up that we can afford a £40M Broja why on earth could we not afford do the right thing on the support for the friendlies, and indeed with deference to Turkish, do something to help the away fan? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 45 minutes ago, Turkish said: When is our first fans forum with Dragon and Rasmus? I'd like to ask Rasmus what they are going to do about rewarding away fans for their loyalty, i see Bolton gave all their fans a free pint on saturday, when will saints start reward us, i've been going away since 1986 and never fot a free pint. Fans Forum Wednesday 10th August 2022. To be held in the Mick Channon Lounge between 7-8pm. From Main Site. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 (edited) Edited 2 August, 2022 by Matthew Le God 2 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DT Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Not content with raiding us for terrible players, Leicester are after McCarthy! hahahahahahahahahahahaha Starting my car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DT Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Just now, Matthew Le God said: How much do they want us to pay them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 minute ago, DT said: How much do they want us to pay them? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNSUN Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Nice one Leicester, always good for a laugh. I'd arrange a taxi for him but he'd probably miss it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 The original source... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNSUN Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 2 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said: The original source... I do know Leicester aren't after a first or second choice (Ward/Iversen, Iversen a potential Kasper replacement for the Dennark team) but I can't see Alex going there to be third choice when he's fighting it out to be first choice here. Unless Ward or Iversen start the season badly and they panic buy. But Foxes fans must be pissed to (apparently) not be bringing in a first choice replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notnowcato Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 hour ago, FarehamSaintJames said: Have I missed the hype around Cucurella? Do you want hype or evidence of talent be that subjective or objective? I've no idea what the table Convict posted showed. Having watched Cucurella a lot it is fair to say he's had an excellent first season in the premier league, predominately played as a LWB and when needed a LCB. To adapt so well and improve as the season went on shows he's clearly going to be one of the best in the league. £50m is too much at this stage but I suspect that is driven more by Brighton having already sold Bissouma, the length of contract Cucurella has left and the "unknown" of how good he could be. Feels like a classic, he's not for sale unless you pay way beyond our valuation. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 hour ago, Turkish said: When is our first fans forum with Dragon and Rasmus? I'd like to ask Rasmus what they are going to do about rewarding away fans for their loyalty, i see Bolton gave all their fans a free pint on saturday, when will saints start reward us, i've been going away since 1986 and never got a free pint. I have a recollection of us getting a free a pint/drink at one away game. Maybe my mind is playing tricks on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 20 minutes ago, notnowcato said: Do you want hype or evidence of talent be that subjective or objective? I've no idea what the table Convict posted showed. Having watched Cucurella a lot it is fair to say he's had an excellent first season in the premier league, predominately played as a LWB and when needed a LCB. To adapt so well and improve as the season went on shows he's clearly going to be one of the best in the league. £50m is too much at this stage but I suspect that is driven more by Brighton having already sold Bissouma, the length of contract Cucurella has left and the "unknown" of how good he could be. Feels like a classic, he's not for sale unless you pay way beyond our valuation. Brighton will be saying to themselves that if he's good enough to get into City's side, which is full of players of costing and worth £50m+, then he's also worth/costing £50m+. In addition, City sold a left back they didn't rate for £30m, so they ain't getting ours that they do rate for anywhere near the same money. How on earth are sides like us meant to compete with these CL behemoths? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 44 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said: on a sightly separate note, why do we have four senior keepers? Is Lis still expected to be loaned out? What's the score there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eborsaint Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 I too recall a free drink. Away at Swansea I think but not sure when Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 3 minutes ago, Eborsaint said: I too recall a free drink. Away at Swansea I think but not sure when Last away game of the season under Koeman I think, a few years ago. Cardboard cut outs of the players, and scarfs included. And free travel. Didn’t we get hats at Huddersfield and Everton too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 minute ago, Saint Garrett said: Last away game of the season under Koeman I think, a few years ago. Cardboard cut outs of the players, and scarfs included. And free travel. Didn’t we get hats at Huddersfield and Everton too? Was Poch’s last away game, was an awful game, Lambert scored a very weird winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckenham Saint Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Got free Christmas hats away at Palace in Koemans first season. There were free scarfs at the Cup Final vs United and I'm pretty sure there were free pints for everyone at Hasenhüttl's first home game? 2 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said: Last away game of the season under Koeman I think, a few years ago. Cardboard cut outs of the players, and scarfs included. And free travel. Didn’t we get hats at Huddersfield and Everton too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Just now, Saint Garrett said: Last away game of the season under Koeman I think, a few years ago. Cardboard cut outs of the players, and scarfs included. And free travel. Didn’t we get hats at Huddersfield and Everton too? yeah Santa hats at Huddersfield for a pretty warm December afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 1 minute ago, Appy said: Was Poch’s last away game, was an awful game, Lambert scored a very weird winner. Was that the one like Kenwyne’s almost hat trick against Birmingham, except it actually went in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Just now, Lighthouse said: Was that the one like Kenwyne’s almost hat trick against Birmingham, except it actually went in? sort of looped up and hit him on the line didnt it? I went to the Swansea game, mentioned, still got Jack Stephens' cutout and the scarf somewhere, but don't remember the free drink. May have been driving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 41 minutes ago, Chez said: I have a recollection of us getting a free a pint/drink at one away game. Maybe my mind is playing tricks on me. I remember Cortese promised us one at Plymouth away but those nasty people down there stopped him 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warriorsaint Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Any transfer rumours? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris cooper Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 Just now, Warriorsaint said: Any transfer rumours? Nope ..sift through the drivel .. month to go no proven striker .. but we have Ralph so don’t panic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Chris cooper said: Nope ..sift through the drivel .. month to go no proven striker .. but we have Ralph so don’t panic What counts as 'proven'? Che Adams scored a similar number of PL goals as the following last season... Gabriel Jesus 8 Kai Havertz 8 Leandro Trossard 8 Neal Maupay 8 Romelu Lukaku 8 Danny Ings 7 Che Adams 7 Edited 2 August, 2022 by Matthew Le God 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 2 August, 2022 Share Posted 2 August, 2022 2 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said: What counts as 'proven'? Che Adams scored a similar number of PL goals as the following last season... Gabriel Jesus 8 Kai Havertz 8 Leandro Trossard 8 Neal Maupay 8 Romelu Lukaku 8 Danny Ings 7 Che Adams 7 Two of those players who scored more aren’t strikers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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