Summer 2022 Transfer Window

[Matthew Le God]

1 minute ago, DT said:

Bit worried that Ralph doesn't really have a clue about what he's doing, what with this and moving 'free-scoring' Romeu into a position up with the forwards. Is anyone else concerned? 

He hasn't done that. We've been playing three central midfielders, Lavia as the deepest, with two in front. That doesn't mean Romeu is playing 'up with the forwards'.

[Matthew Le God]

26 minutes ago, Kermitzasaint said:

While your point is fair about incoming players,  I always had faith in Koemans ability to improve inexperienced players. I don't have any faith in Ralph whatsoever. 

Who?

[Le Timmier]

32 minutes ago, Kermitzasaint said:

I always had faith in Koemans ability to improve inexperienced players.

Arguably Matt Targett may have improved under Koeman but other than that, who are you basing this on?

[wild-saint]

10 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Who?

Ronald Koeman out former manager. Surely you remember him? 

[miserableoldgit]

1 minute ago, Le Timmier said:

Arguably Matt Targett may have improved under Koeman but other than that, who are you basing this on?

He is "mis-remembering" due to his dislike of Ralph.....

[Saint Fan CaM]

1 hour ago, Smirking_Saint said:

So much guff gets spouted at times, we’ve had comfortably one of the most conclusive transfer windows since possibly the Koeman years, yet we’re still just gripped with this negativity.

That’s a lot of hope stashed away there!  I don’t agree with your description of this transfer window - it’s hardly conclusive until we see results on the pitch. These youngsters may be really great and we all hope they are, however they need to prove (a) they have the ability to deliver Ralph’s instructions on the pitch and (b) flex those instructions if things are not working out to impact the game. Too many in the squad have not been doing these basics very well.

And the strategy of growing the squad with several £10m players (that are equally at risk of attempting Ralphball and failing)  does have an alternative - i.e. just buy a £25m+ CB and £25m+ striker who are more competent than the current incumbents. Not saying that’s the right mway to go necessarily, especially if you’re looking to turn a profit, but it’s an alternative.

Edited 27 July, 2022 by Saint Fan CaM
Typo

[Matthew Le God]

Just now, wild-saint said:

Ronald Koeman out former manager. Surely you remember him? 

I was asking which inexperienced players he improved, as you well know!

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

2 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

Lets look at that much lauded transfer window;

Tadic / Pellè / Alderweireld (L) / Forster / Manè/ Bertrand (L)

At the time, outside of possibly Bertrand none of these had any obvious premier league quality, and even since that point from memory only Austin/Ings had any clear pedigree at this level abd even then they had potential issues around injuries etc

We’ve never operated in the ‘established’ market. And since have moved into signing some of the brightest young talent from the brightest academies

Tadic - Playing really well and scoring a lot of goals for Twente in the Eredivisie

Pelle - scoring goals for fun in the Eredivisie for Feyenoord

Alderwiereld - playing in the Atletico team that won La Liga

Forster - established for Celtic and playing in the CL rounds

Mane - won the domestic double with RB Salzburg, scoring two hatricks, was their stand out player by a mile

Bertrand - although he won a CL final, was probably the biggest punt of them all

So - you're correct to say none of these were tried and tested in the Prem, they were however, all established players with good experience of playing in some of the top leagues of Europe. It wasn't like buying Harry Kane for example, but we were getting established professionals who had achieved things with their clubs. I'll give you Joe Aribo fits that profile though.

 

[Bobbyboy]

34 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

I was asking which inexperienced players he improved, as you well know!

He didn't say that, he said "I always had faith in Koemans ability to improve inexperienced players."

Hebrews 1:1 "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen."

[saintant]

49 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

He hasn't done that. We've been playing three central midfielders, Lavia as the deepest, with two in front. That doesn't mean Romeu is playing 'up with the forwards'.

I might be wrong but wasn't Ralph quoted as saying this about Romeu playing up with the forwards and knowing how to score goals after one of the friendlies?

[Rebel]

Romeu is definitely not a No. 10 - I think we are all agreed on that.

But I don't think he is a goal scoring box-to-box midfielder No.8 either.  He doesn't have the pace or the engine to get up and down the pitch.   

His best position is as a deep lying defensive of holding midfielder No.6 protecting the defence.  His best seasons for Saints were as the deep lying midfielder at the base of a midfield 3.

He should be competing with Romeo Lavia for the No.6 position unless we are going to play them alongside each other with 2 No 6s.

JWP and Diallo are the box-to-box No.8's surely.

Maybe the issue is Romeu is past his best as the DM/No.6 and Diallo isn't good enough for the No.6 or No.8 positions - and we need to replace both of them.

 

 

 

 

 

[Chez]

2 hours ago, SuperSAINT said:

Really tidy footballer. I wonder though what his best position is. As a wide player does he deliver enough? Could he transition to CM like JWP did perhaps. 

He's a little like Moi. He's one of those footballer that could play for a top side and look right at home as his first touch is quality, but if you want him to really impact a game, grab it by the scruff of the neck, I am not sure he does that. Would he improve a shit side like us? Does he make things happen? 

Wonder how much the fee and wages are.

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

36 minutes ago, saintant said:

I might be wrong but wasn't Ralph quoted as saying this about Romeu playing up with the forwards and knowing how to score goals after one of the friendlies?

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

[Chez]

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/ruben-vinagre-everton-latest-breaking-24590502

Not sure what our left back status is with KWP providing cover, but when I saw Vinagre for Wolves I was massively impressed and really surprised he didn't get more games and then was allowed to leave. Big yes for me, especially if he is available as a loan, which would suit us I think?

[Chez]

26 minutes ago, Rebel said:

Romeu is definitely not a No. 10 - I think we are all agreed on that.

But I don't think he is a goal scoring box-to-box midfielder No.8 either.  He doesn't have the pace or the engine to get up and down the pitch.   

His best position is as a deep lying defensive of holding midfielder No.6 protecting the defence.  His best seasons for Saints were as the deep lying midfielder at the base of a midfield 3.

He should be competing with Romeo Lavia for the No.6 position unless we are going to play them alongside each other with 2 No 6s.

JWP and Diallo are the box-to-box No.8's surely.

Maybe the issue is Romeu is past his best as the DM/No.6 and Diallo isn't good enough for the No.6 or No.8 positions - and we need to replace both of them.

Pretty fair assessment. If Romeu can rediscover his form of the first half of last season then he starts, simple as, but if we get more of the second half fare, then we need Lavia to step in and be immediately brilliant. Tough ask.

Diallo needs to work out how to play in midfield. He seems to have forgotten what to do and where to be. He was terrible as a three man midfield and pretty poor as a two man. He needs to rediscover what made us sign him in the first place. A dynamic DM that broke up play and burst out from deep to get breaks started quickly.

[Saint Matty 76]

10 minutes ago, Chez said:

Really tidy footballer. I wonder though what his best position is. As a wide player does he deliver enough? Could he transition to CM like JWP did perhaps. 

He's a little like Moi. He's one of those footballer that could play for a top side and look right at home as his first touch is quality, but if you want him to really impact a game, grab it by the scruff of the neck, I am not sure he does that. Would he improve a shit side like us? Does he make things happen? 

Wonder how much the fee and wages are.

He's costing £20m and has an output which even our wide players put to shame.

If he's their replacement for Richarlison then they're in serious trouble.

[beatlesaint]

10 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

I haven’t got a clue what Ralph is talking about here. Absolute bollocks.

[skintsaint]

13 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

Look forward to Oriol and S.Armstrong up front against Spurs first game.

[woodsaint1]

12 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

Wow. Hope we're not seriously considering a more advanced Romeu. He may not be such a holding midfielder according to Ralph, but the defensive side of his game is by far and away his best attribute. Scored a few decent goals, but ballooned many more high and wide

[Lee On Solent Saint]

4 minutes ago, beatlesaint said:

I haven’t got a clue what Ralph is talking about here. Absolute bollocks.

Phew! Thought it was just me! I have no idea what Ralph sees in games. He just tries so hard to massively over complicate things.

[Toussaint]

13 minutes ago, skintsaint said:

Look forward to Oriol and S.Armstrong up front against Spurs first game.

With Jack Stephens at no 10 that's the attack sorted. Just required a bit of blue sky thinking 

[OttawaSaint]

32 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

The guy is fucking trolling us. Legend!

[Bad Wolf]

2 hours ago, tajjuk said:

Really? I think Koeman has proved after he left us that he was a thoroughly average manager, good recruitment built that team and he got lucky with it IMO. 

This. Koeman was vastly overrated. Everyone always remembers the good parts but no one likes to talk about those dismal November - February runs we went on, the fact that his two league cup games ended in a 6-1 home defeat by Liverpool reserves and a 1-0 defeat at Sheff Utd who were two divisions below us and as for the "We finished 6th" thing - That was the season Leicester won the league, Spurs finished third in a two horse race, the worst Arsenal team in history finished second, Chelsea were not far from the bottom half, Liverpool were conceding 6 against Stoke on the last day and United were in freefall.

With the squad we had that season (Mane, Pelle, Tadic, VVD, Fonte, Wanyama, Morgan), we should have absolutely finished in the top 4 and there's no reason why we couldn't have won the league since Leicester did. I'm not convinced their squad, man for man, was that much better than ours. Koeman's flopped since leaving us and had a few questionable jobs before us as well.

[Smirking_Saint]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

That’s a lot of hope stashed away there!  I don’t agree with your description of this transfer window - it’s hardly conclusive until we see results on the pitch. These youngsters may be really great and we all hope they are, however they need to prove (a) they have the ability to deliver Ralph’s instructions on the pitch and (b) flex those instructions if things are not working out to impact the game. Too many in the squad have not been doing these basics very well.

And the strategy of growing the squad with several £10m players (that are equally at risk of attempting Ralphball and failing)  does have an alternative - i.e. just buy a £25m+ CB and £25m+ striker who are more competent than the current incumbents. Not saying that’s the right mway to go necessarily, especially if you’re looking to turn a profit, but it’s an alternative.

What 25m strikers and CBs are out there ready to go that don’t pose similar risks to those we have bought out of interest ?

I keep hearing ‘we should be looking for experience not Delap’ then get quoted the likes of Broja, does he really pose enough experience to be comfortable?

We dropped 15m on AA who in theory should have the required merits to hit the ground running and effectively flopped, Villa bought Ings for 30m and he proceeded to be average, nothing is guaranteed here

[Saint86]

17 minutes ago, OttawaSaint said:

The guy is fucking trolling us. Legend!

I actually think he is as well 🤣

[tajjuk]

1 hour ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

Tadic - Playing really well and scoring a lot of goals for Twente in the Eredivisie

Pelle - scoring goals for fun in the Eredivisie for Feyenoord

Alderwiereld - playing in the Atletico team that won La Liga

Forster - established for Celtic and playing in the CL rounds

Mane - won the domestic double with RB Salzburg, scoring two hatricks, was their stand out player by a mile

Bertrand - although he won a CL final, was probably the biggest punt of them all

So - you're correct to say none of these were tried and tested in the Prem, they were however, all established players with good experience of playing in some of the top leagues of Europe. It wasn't like buying Harry Kane for example, but we were getting established professionals who had achieved things with their clubs. I'll give you Joe Aribo fits that profile though.

 

Er Austria, the Eredivisie and Scotland are not 'top leagues in Europe' and arguably all were worse then than they are now.  You are talking about like 8-10th level leagues in Europe, teams in a Eredivisie, some of them have lower budgets than league 1 clubs. The average salary is about £5k a week and that average is pushed up Ajax who in 2020 had 10 of the 12 highest paid players in the league.  People free scoring in that league are often free scoring against League 1/League 2 level defenders in some cases. 

Also Toby was not playing for Atletico, hence why we got him on loan, he had only played 12 games in La Liga, before that it was only Eredivisie. He wanted game time. Really he was a squad player for a big European club, so basically no different from Lemina or Hoedt and look how they turned out. Elynoussi was playing for Basel and had put some very good performances in the Champs league, so that is pretty similar to Mane (Austrian and Swiss league are a similar level) but he wasn't successful either. 

Pelle had struggled in SERIE B before going to Feyenoord and there is whole host of high scoring Eredivisie players who have flopped like van Wolfswinkel or Afonso Alves

None of these players were proven in top European leagues at all and all of them were clearly gambles, like most signings are. 

I'd also point to someone like Vestergaard who had 180 ish games in the Bundesliga when we signed him, a good 15+ national caps, and had played in the Champions League as well. WAY WAY more 'big league' experience than anyone you mentioned, but turned out a lot worse. 

 

[Smirking_Saint]

1 hour ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

Tadic - Playing really well and scoring a lot of goals for Twente in the Eredivisie

Pelle - scoring goals for fun in the Eredivisie for Feyenoord

Alderwiereld - playing in the Atletico team that won La Liga

Forster - established for Celtic and playing in the CL rounds

Mane - won the domestic double with RB Salzburg, scoring two hatricks, was their stand out player by a mile

Bertrand - although he won a CL final, was probably the biggest punt of them all

So - you're correct to say none of these were tried and tested in the Prem, they were however, all established players with good experience of playing in some of the top leagues of Europe. It wasn't like buying Harry Kane for example, but we were getting established professionals who had achieved things with their clubs. I'll give you Joe Aribo fits that profile though.

 

Tadic and Pelle were very good in the Eiredivisie, we’ve seen plenty of dutch imports unable to take the step up from DVB to Bergwijn… Pelle had also flopped everywhere else in his career, he only showed any promise in two seasons at Feyenoord

Alderweireld played 12 games in 2 years for AM

Forster - Difficult one as again ultimately its a poor division but we have done well out of Scotland overall

Mane - Good stats again in a poor league in a team expected to win the division was also an expensive signing overall

Bertrand - I disagree, was a good player being kept out of the Chelsea side by good players, was also a loan which reduced our risk significantly 

Im not convinced that these are any less of a risk then say ABK who has had a goid season in Germany, Aribo who had a fantastic campaign for Rangers or Lavia who was the PL2 POTS… of all of our incomings probably only Mara is the one Im looking at wondering if he can integrate effectively due to his apparant struggles in ball retention (stats wise) but Im comfortable that the fee is a good one

My overall point was that we aren’t in a position to make relatively risk free signings, that is generally for the likes of City/Liverpool and (should be) Utd…. Unfortunately, and as Ralph has already said, ‘experience’ costs extra and wants long expensive contracts that arguably makes us more exposed if the gamble fails (Barkley/Alli/Drinkwater etc etc)

[verlaine1979]

2 hours ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

 

And the strategy of growing the squad with several £10m players (that are equally at risk of attempting Ralphball and failing)  does have an alternative - i.e. just buy a £25m+ CB and £25m+ striker who are more competent than the current incumbents. Not saying that’s the right mway to go necessarily, especially if you’re looking to turn a profit, but it’s an alternative.

A 25m CB and a 25m striker would probably be older and have less potential financial upside when sold (since the likes of Broja and Scamacca appear to have their sights set higher than us already). Like it or not, stockpiling youth and hoping to sell them on for profit is the business model of the club. If we spend 50m on two players and only get 50m or less back, the club is in trouble.

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

8 minutes ago, tajjuk said:

Er Austria, the Eredivisie and Scotland are not 'top leagues in Europe' and arguably all were worse then than they are now.  You are talking about like 8-10th level leagues in Europe, teams in a Eredivisie, some of them have lower budgets than league 1 clubs. The average salary is about £5k a week and that average is pushed up Ajax who in 2020 had 10 of the 12 highest paid players in the league.  People free scoring in that league are often free scoring against League 1/League 2 level defenders in some cases. 

Also Toby was not playing for Atletico, hence why we got him on loan, he had only played 12 games in La Liga, before that it was only Eredivisie. He wanted game time. Really he was a squad player for a big European club, so basically no different from Lemina or Hoedt and look how they turned out. Elynoussi was playing for Basel and had put some very good performances in the Champs league, so that is pretty similar to Mane (Austrian and Swiss league are a similar level) but he wasn't successful either. 

Pelle had struggled in SERIE B before going to Feyenoord and there is whole host of high scoring Eredivisie players who have flopped like van Wolfswinkel or Afonso Alves

None of these players were proven in top European leagues at all and all of them were clearly gambles, like most signings are. 

I'd also point to someone like Vestergaard who had 180 ish games in the Bundesliga when we signed him, a good 15+ national caps, and had played in the Champions League as well. WAY WAY more 'big league' experience than anyone you mentioned, but turned out a lot worse. 

 

Not going to argue with you. The point I was making is they were all doing well in some of the top leagues in Europe (not sure how you rate the Dutch league as 8-10th level btw) as opposed to basically doing well in youth leagues.

[tajjuk]

13 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

Not going to argue with you. The point I was making is they were all doing well in some of the top leagues in Europe (not sure how you rate the Dutch league as 8-10th level btw) as opposed to basically doing well in youth leagues.

It's currently ranked 7th by UEFA, mainly because of Ajax doing well recently in the Champs league, back in 16/17 it was ranked 13th, in 15/16 it was ranked 10th.

It just not a very good league and is not very strong. It's why there has been talk of a combined Dutch/Belgian league. 

The top league in Europe are the PL, La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A and Ligue 1, then pretty much consistently the The Primeira Liga, and the strength of the latter two are already dubious. Players from outside those leagues, you are talking about people playing against lowly paid professional footballers, certainly overall less strong than say our own Championship.  

Someone like Lavia training with world class players and playing against the reserves teams of Liverpool, Utd, Chelsea, etc. is probably facing harder opponents than facing VV Venlo or the like.  

[SuperSAINT]

 

[Saint Matty 76]

First bit of money they've spent! Weird one.

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

42 minutes ago, Smirking_Saint said:

Tadic and Pelle were very good in the Eiredivisie, we’ve seen plenty of dutch imports unable to take the step up from DVB to Bergwijn… Pelle had also flopped everywhere else in his career, he only showed any promise in two seasons at Feyenoord

Alderweireld played 12 games in 2 years for AM

Forster - Difficult one as again ultimately its a poor division but we have done well out of Scotland overall

Mane - Good stats again in a poor league in a team expected to win the division was also an expensive signing overall

Bertrand - I disagree, was a good player being kept out of the Chelsea side by good players, was also a loan which reduced our risk significantly 

Im not convinced that these are any less of a risk then say ABK who has had a goid season in Germany, Aribo who had a fantastic campaign for Rangers or Lavia who was the PL2 POTS… of all of our incomings probably only Mara is the one Im looking at wondering if he can integrate effectively due to his apparant struggles in ball retention (stats wise) but Im comfortable that the fee is a good one

My overall point was that we aren’t in a position to make relatively risk free signings, that is generally for the likes of City/Liverpool and (should be) Utd…. Unfortunately, and as Ralph has already said, ‘experience’ costs extra and wants long expensive contracts that arguably makes us more exposed if the gamble fails (Barkley/Alli/Drinkwater etc etc)

I agree with your overall point that we will never be in a position to make risk free signings, if there even is such a thing. Still think signing youth team players is a higher risk than signing the players being discussed above. It is the way of things: The rich teams get richer, more successful, more dominant. The rest of the league need to come up with a strategy that gives them some sort of edge and I'm happy that our owners and management have one and are going to give it a go, so no complaints - just hope it will pay off.

[HarvSFC]

Remember every summer of the “unsellables”, who were handicapping the club in the market due to previous mistakes. Forster, Lemina, Hoedt, Boufal, Elyounoussi and Carrillo. All players, who weren’t playing very much, but wanted to see out their well paid contracts and who we could only loan out before eventually letting them go for free, or pennies. 
 

Now, this summer, say if Mara flops and isn’t playing, do we reckon he’s going to want to sit around on his contract, or will he try to reignite his career elsewhere. I’d go with the latter. These are all players who have came to us for first team Premier League football, not to put in half arsed performances every other week while cashing in and posting on Instagram about their life of luxury (Hoedt/Lemina). Additionally, all of these signings will be on a fraction of what the aforementioned six were on, meaning that as long as we don’t get relegated, some of them can be affordable mistakes, as there isn’t a single club in world football who gets every transfer right.

It just makes a lot of long term sense at the moment as long as we don’t get relegated. This is only the start of the new era, the first transfer window and when/if we do sell a player for a large profit then we may start looking to spend on a higher calibre of player, because we can afford to, which we can’t now.

West Ham’s new signing of £30m+, there’s every possibility he becomes another Haller, as he’s only hit double figures once in his career, which was last season. He’ll be on big wages too for that fee. So, it’s either a £15m relatively low wage risk, or a £30m+ high wage risk, who we potentially can’t get rid of because of that. We’d also make a bigger profit on the former due to the initial outlay.

[Bad Wolf]

1 hour ago, Saint86 said:

I actually think he is as well 🤣

Wouldn't blame him tbf. Our fanbase are such a bunch of Karen's.

[beatlesaint]

48 minutes ago, SuperSAINT said:

 

Have they signed anyone who wasn’t in the Championship last season? 
 

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Tic toc tic toc

slow news day 

[Colinjb]

1 hour ago, Saint Matty 76 said:

First bit of money they've spent! Weird one.

Had wondered if the sanctions on Russia have effected old Maxim Denim at all.

[Disco Stu]

2 hours ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

"For Oriol playing as a six is a little difficult because he’s not such a holding midfielder, he likes to go everywhere," Hasenhuttl said, speaking after Southampton's goalless draw with Watford on Saturday. "This is the reason why I tried to bring in more up front. I know he’s not the quickest one in this position but he knows how to score goals in this area and it’s one of the things that we’ve tried and it worked quite well."

Eh? I thought that was exactly what he was. Shows what I know!

[S-Clarke]

6 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

So much guff gets spouted at times, we’ve had comfortably one of the most conclusive transfer windows since possibly the Koeman years, yet we’re still just gripped with this negativity

Lets look at that much lauded transfer window;

Tadic / Pellè / Alderweireld (L) / Forster / Manè/ Bertrand (L)

At the time, outside of possibly Bertrand none of these had any obvious premier league quality, and even since that point from memory only Austin/Ings had any clear pedigree at this level abd even then they had potential issues around injuries etc

We’ve never operated in the ‘established’ market. And since have moved into signing some of the brightest young talent from the brightest academies

I much prefer this to signing ‘known quality’ the risks are still there, but generally they have no real upside, often in high wages or high fee’s and are they any less of a risk ? See the likes of Dele Alli or Ross Barkley for instance

Profile wise our new strategy is backed now by the overseeing eyes of the much lauded Joe Shields, and will almost certainly lead to us eventually losing our brightest talent but aslong as we make the correct signings in replacement then I’m comfortable here

We are currently a lower premier league side, with a likely ceiling of maybe top6 at our absolute maximum, we simply cannot/ do not operate in the Coutinho/Botman even Tarkowski markets that many of us want to

Of course I would like to see us sign a real known entity in attack.. but its unlikely, look at Graziano.. arguably one of our more positive signings in recent history… he was a risk, he’d done very little before Feyenoord yet the risk worked out… this is the sort of signing Id expect us to see over the next couple of weeks, a well scouted forward appointment that fits our system and will likely have potential downsides

Lets give the side time, we have a month of the window left and so far look very promising.. if this was a Gao window we’d be staring down the EFL right now but I feel SR have given us a real chance here

Really, really good post and I'm glad I'm not alone in my thoughts. I kind of see us as starting from a zero base and having to build ourselves back up again, because we've been on somewhat of a downward spiral since Gao took over.

If the approach we are adopting is correct, time will tell on that, then we will lift ourselves back up the league and thus open the market to more 'named' players in future windows, and maybe the more 'sought' after young players that we can't obtain at the moment.

I think the approach we are taking requires patience from everyone, it's not an overnight thing and the signings we're making this window aren't going to make us a top 6 team tomorrow, but it's a case of taking the steps in the right direction and building that base to grow from.

[SaintJackoInHurworth]

2 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

Tadic and Pelle were very good in the Eiredivisie, we’ve seen plenty of dutch imports unable to take the step up from DVB to Bergwijn… Pelle had also flopped everywhere else in his career, he only showed any promise in two seasons at Feyenoord

Alderweireld played 12 games in 2 years for AM

Forster - Difficult one as again ultimately its a poor division but we have done well out of Scotland overall

Mane - Good stats again in a poor league in a team expected to win the division was also an expensive signing overall

Bertrand - I disagree, was a good player being kept out of the Chelsea side by good players, was also a loan which reduced our risk significantly 

Im not convinced that these are any less of a risk then say ABK who has had a goid season in Germany, Aribo who had a fantastic campaign for Rangers or Lavia who was the PL2 POTS… of all of our incomings probably only Mara is the one Im looking at wondering if he can integrate effectively due to his apparant struggles in ball retention (stats wise) but Im comfortable that the fee is a good one

My overall point was that we aren’t in a position to make relatively risk free signings, that is generally for the likes of City/Liverpool and (should be) Utd…. Unfortunately, and as Ralph has already said, ‘experience’ costs extra and wants long expensive contracts that arguably makes us more exposed if the gamble fails (Barkley/Alli/Drinkwater etc etc)

 

13 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Really, really good post and I'm glad I'm not alone in my thoughts. I kind of see us as starting from a zero base and having to build ourselves back up again, because we've been on somewhat of a downward spiral since Gao took over.

If the approach we are adopting is correct, time will tell on that, then we will lift ourselves back up the league and thus open the market to more 'named' players in future windows, and maybe the more 'sought' after young players that we can't obtain at the moment.

I think the approach we are taking requires patience from everyone, it's not an overnight thing and the signings we're making this window aren't going to make us a top 6 team tomorrow, but it's a case of taking the steps in the right direction and building that base to grow from.

There is a lot of sense in these posts. Any element of gamble is no greater than the gamble of trying to repeat the (failed) policies of recent years. The fact is that the quality-at-an-affordable-price players that we have bought in the past are not available to us at present, as we are not seen as a club with any hope of European qualification any time soon.

It is also worth saying that not all of these players are necessarily expected to be a success this season. It is more than conceivable that some of these purchases are part of a longer term policy of developing the next batch of players - for next season or the season after that or even after that. As such, we must be patient.

Having said all that, there remains a slight concern that at present we may, possibly, be weaker in attack this season with the current crop of players due to the loss of Broja. I certainly hope that we will in the coming weeks address that concern.

[Saint86]

25 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Really, really good post and I'm glad I'm not alone in my thoughts. I kind of see us as starting from a zero base and having to build ourselves back up again, because we've been on somewhat of a downward spiral since Gao took over.

If the approach we are adopting is correct, time will tell on that, then we will lift ourselves back up the league and thus open the market to more 'named' players in future windows, and maybe the more 'sought' after young players that we can't obtain at the moment.

I think the approach we are taking requires patience from everyone, it's not an overnight thing and the signings we're making this window aren't going to make us a top 6 team tomorrow, but it's a case of taking the steps in the right direction and building that base to grow from.

Agree with this.

We've survived with no funding and a cripplingly bad financial position - in itself, that is a good job to all those involved and who got us the takeover and the opportunity to be in the position we are now in.

SR have come in, have a clear plan, and i think have made the right decisions to put a solid foundation for growth into place - signing young players with potential as squad players and to supplement the first team, revamping the coaching setup, and targeting quality recruitment and a clear strategy. But now the actions they've taken will require patience and hard work to develop - and a big part of that is on the fans and a need to back and support what is a very young squad lacking confidence and perhaps that final bit of quality to be really effective on the attack. Fortunately, as fans, we always do well backing young players - but we also need to not get on the teams back with what is a tough set of early fixtures.

[Ralph Fastenbüttl]

Quite a downbeat assessment of our chances this season here:

https://www.football365.com/news/predicting-positions-other-14-premier-league-clubs

14) Southampton: Over the course of their last 12 games of the 2021/22 season. Southampton won just one match and scored nine goals, while conceding 30, dropping from 9th place in the table to 15th in the process. It’s now been five years since Southampton finished above midway in the Premier League, and they finished 15th or lower in four of those five seasons.

Southampton may well be preparing for spending another season with one eye looking over their shoulders at those below them in the table.

The arrivals of Gavin Bazunu and Romeo Lavia from Manchester City for £27m are certainly adventurous. These are young players with considerable potential. And Southampton have retained the services of James Ward-Prowse for at least another year, which gives them one of the greatest goalscoring threats in the division from set-pieces.

But there have been times since his appointment at St Mary’s when it’s looked as though Ralph Hassenhuttl was living on borrowed time and it’s not particularly surprising to see him near the top of betting lists for the Premier League’s 2022/23 Sack Race. Southampton only finished five points above the relegation places last season, and it’s difficult to see where substantial improvement upon their 15th-placed finish last season will come from.

Edited 27 July, 2022 by Ralph Fastenbüttl
Added additional detail

[hypochondriac]

6 minutes ago, Ralph Fastenbüttl said:

Quite a downbeat assessment of our chances this season here:

https://www.football365.com/news/predicting-positions-other-14-premier-league-clubs

14) Southampton: Over the course of their last 12 games of the 2021/22 season. Southampton won just one match and scored nine goals, while conceding 30, dropping from 9th place in the table to 15th in the process. It’s now been five years since Southampton finished above midway in the Premier League, and they finished 15th or lower in four of those five seasons.

Southampton may well be preparing for spending another season with one eye looking over their shoulders at those below them in the table.

The arrivals of Gavin Bazunu and Romeo Lavia from Manchester City for £27m are certainly adventurous. These are young players with considerable potential. And Southampton have retained the services of James Ward-Prowse for at least another year, which gives them one of the greatest goalscoring threats in the division from set-pieces.

But there have been times since his appointment at St Mary’s when it’s looked as though Ralph Hassenhuttl was living on borrowed time and it’s not particularly surprising to see him near the top of betting lists for the Premier League’s 2022/23 Sack Race. Southampton only finished five points above the relegation places last season, and it’s difficult to see where substantial improvement upon their 15th-placed finish last season will come from.

14th would be alright considering our end to the season last year. 

[SuperSAINT]

#ColwillWatch

 

[SNSUN]

1 minute ago, hypochondriac said:

14th would be alright considering our end to the season last year. 

I’d take that with bells on. Then keep improving the squad.

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, SNSUN said:

I’d take that with bells on. Then keep improving the squad.

I think that article is quite accurate apart from predicting Leicester at 19th which seems too pessimistic. 

[CB Fry]

10 minutes ago, SuperSAINT said:

#ColwillWatch

 

Is that the actual Palace kit?

[djharvey]

Just now, CB Fry said:

Is that the actual Palace kit?

Yep! almost exact same as Hadjuk Split away kit 21/22

[Saint Garrett]

42 minutes ago, djharvey said:

Yep! almost exact same as Hadjuk Split away kit 21/22

Shocking really