Saints 1-1 Man City - Match Thread

[OttawaSaint]

3 minutes ago, Teddeer said:

Thinking back, although City obviously dominated possession, we carved out some decent chances - Bednarek had a good header saved from a corner,  Diallo made space for a shot which he could have done better with, Broja hit the post with a header, Broja forced a last ditch block just after half time and he also had two close offside calls in the first half, one where he put the ball in the net and another where there was a penalty shout. Fine margins and, on another day we might have bagged more than KWP's excellent goal.  Ok, they had chances too so I think a draw was a fair result overall.

That Diallo shot could have gone anywhere with the deflection. We had a run of games last season (or the season before)  where we got scored on by big deflections. Too bad that one couldn't fall for us for a change.

[Chez]

1 minute ago, OttawaSaint said:

That Diallo shot could have gone anywhere with the deflection. We had a run of games last season (or the season before)  where we got scored on by big deflections. Too bad that one couldn't fall for us for a change.

to be fair, they had a lot of shots and crosses that didn't fall their way. We fought hard, but we rode our luck too.  I was pretty happy with how the ball fell for us.

[Dr Who?]

First goals for clubs you say, well no competition Dixon at Anfield in 92. 😆 

[OttawaSaint]

Was Berkovic's first that beauty he got vs Utd in the 6-3?

[John Boy Saint]

In the stadium that was an intense game - it has to be said Manchester City are an impressive team to watch they are like a Tsunami in that they just keep coming at you relentlessly. With that in mind, all us Saints fans want is to see is our players pull on the stripes and bloody fight, and boy did they do that tonight.
Frasers point blank save and Salisu snuffing out KDB drawing a deserved standing ovation from many summed up the appreciation of the effort before our eyes.

 

 

[trousers]

1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

For me, this is a massive fault of the offside rule. I think that goal should be disallowed. Simply because, when the ball comes in, as far as Forster in concerned, all of those players are in play and active. The keeper doesn’t know exactly where it will drop so has to take into account all players. I’m not saying that what’s caused the goal in this case, but as far as I’m concerned, that offside player is interfering with play as he causes the keeper to think about him as an potential attacking threat.

The current rule expects the keeper to judge who is onside and who isn’t, which he obviously can’t do. I think it’s a bad rule and today shows a little why.

This 100%

[Saint86]

1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

For me, this is a massive fault of the offside rule. I think that goal should be disallowed. Simply because, when the ball comes in, as far as Forster in concerned, all of those players are in play and active. The keeper doesn’t know exactly where it will drop so has to take into account all players. I’m not saying that what’s caused the goal in this case, but as far as I’m concerned, that offside player is interfering with play as he causes the keeper to think about him as an potential attacking threat.

The current rule expects the keeper to judge who is onside and who isn’t, which he obviously can’t do. I think it’s a bad rule and today shows a little why.

yup also agreed 100%

[Saint86]

1 hour ago, angelman said:

Cuco Martina

Tadanari Lee as well 🎯

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

For me, this is a massive fault of the offside rule. I think that goal should be disallowed. Simply because, when the ball comes in, as far as Forster in concerned, all of those players are in play and active. The keeper doesn’t know exactly where it will drop so has to take into account all players. I’m not saying that what’s caused the goal in this case, but as far as I’m concerned, that offside player is interfering with play as he causes the keeper to think about him as an potential attacking threat.

The current rule expects the keeper to judge who is onside and who isn’t, which he obviously can’t do. I think it’s a bad rule and today shows a little why.

That’s how things used to be and that’s how I think things should be. Offside is offside.

[Maya's Dad]

WHAT A GOAL

fantastic from the team

[trousers]

Just now, Maya's Dad said:

WHAT A GOAL

I thought you were watching a worse time delayed stream than me there for a minute!

[austsaint]

55 minutes ago, John Boy Saint said:

In the stadium that was an intense game - it has to be said Manchester City are an impressive team to watch they are like a Tsunami in that they just keep coming at you relentlessly. With that in mind, all us Saints fans want is to see is our players pull on the stripes and bloody fight, and boy did they do that tonight.
Frasers point blank save and Salisu snuffing out KDB drawing a deserved standing ovation from many summed up the appreciation of the effort before our eyes.

 

 

Indeed.  I found the studio commentator's belief that Man City were "below their best" quite insulting to the quality of Saints performance because to my eye Man City played some sparkling Football.  The game was fast and intense - Saints midfield and defence disciplined and resolute.  The performance of Salisu was quite astonishing, with his great reading of the game, interceptions, tackles, headers and sweet passing.  On that display he is already in the top bracket of centre-backs.     The goal from Walker-Peters was sublime, and his general game excellent, underlining that despite the precocious skills of Livramento, KWP is among the best RB's going around and should be maintaining that spot upon Tino's return.    A call out to Perraud, apart from that gaff in the penalty box he showed a tenacity and commitment all afternoon; Forster could be criticised for not contesting the KDB free kick leading to the goal but he made some good saves, "made himself big" and has been a presence in the last month or so.

I thought Stuart Armstrong's return to form was telling, with his direct running a threat, which led to several attacking phases for Saints meaning that the Man City defenders could never completely have a quiet afternoon or push too high up the pitch.

One of my favourite moments was the petulant push by Grealish on Romeu.....leading to Romeu, turning his back and returning to position; it made the Grealish "aggression" look even more foolish given that in a test of physical strength you'd back Romeu every day of the week!

Superb performance.

[cambsaint]

A magnificent team performance every player can be proud of.

The comments on the current offside rule are very apt.

It was quite obviously a tactical decision to have two or three players running in offside with no intent to attempt to play the ball while a couple of players time their runs to defined areas where the ball is aimed and take advantage of the confusion the "off side but not offside " players have caused.

Very clever. I expect it to be widely copied and hopefully law will be amended to bring some sense back to the offside law

[austsaint]

3 hours ago, CanadaSaint said:

Superb performance all around, with - unbelievably - chances to win it. Salisu was imperious throughout, but tremendous character and endeavour all around him. 

I feared red right away on the Armstrong tackle and I think we dodged a bullet there.

I never have been, and never will be, comfortable with Ralph's high line. It counts on three things - a poor delivery (10% chance with DeBruyne standing over the ball), an offside call (50%), and a keeper intervention (20% with Forster or McCarthy). I'd much rather take our chances with a deeper line and reliance on Salisu, Bednarek, Broja and Adams.

With another keeper we could have won the last two, and yes, I did see Forster's knee save from Sterling.

We had five players today who would not have looked out of place in a Top 6 side. I don't care if we don't splash big money on incoming players, as long as we make a solid effort to keep the ones we've got.

Yes, your last sentence points up what Saints have lacked since the Koeman days.   Salisu, KWP, JWP, Livramento, Broja...even Romeu and Adams are all players who could (or could soon) hold their own in a top 6 side.   Just a tweak needed with a quality attacking midfielder and goalkeeper.  Perhaps a CB too.

[Nordic Saint]

39 minutes ago, austsaint said:

Yes, your last sentence points up what Saints have lacked since the Koeman days.   Salisu, KWP, JWP, Livramento, Broja...even Romeu and Adams are all players who could (or could soon) hold their own in a top 6 side.   Just a tweak needed with a quality attacking midfielder and goalkeeper.  Perhaps a CB too.

Forster was our goalkeeper when we were a top 6 side in the Koeman days.

[CanadaSaint]

My immediate reaction when Armstrong ‘tackled’ Laporte was that a red was inevitable, such is the game today. I still feel it should have been.

Then I remember Dennis Hollywood launching Mike Summerbee into the crowd under the West Stand at The Dell, and think Armstrong’s tackle wasn’t so bad after all. 😂

[Dman]

9 hours ago, The Cat said:

Bit weird our fans were booing Laporte. He was obviously caught and it must have bloody hurt, you could tell that from his reaction.

To be fair, Laporte was being a wanker all game. There was a point in the first half where he tried getting adams (I think it was) sent off for an arm in the neck whilst competing for a header.
 

naturally, the 6 foot prick went down clutching his face like he’d face a haymaker from Tyson Fury. 

[Dman]

12 hours ago, TWar said:

Seemed to work ok

Being at the game, Looked more like a standard 442 to me. Wide midfielders were playing very deep without the ball at some points in the second half more of a 622 they were that deep. 
 

The pressing was mainly coming from the front 2 whilst we played 2 banks of 4 making it hard to break down. Very different from the overally attacking 4222 where the wingers press very high and are out of position. 

[Dman]

11 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Shout to Lyanco running down the right wing and keeping  the ball in the corner by getting the throw 

 

🤣

I was worried when he came on and we kept a back 4 but I thought he done very well. 
 

Made a great tackle at one point, might have been just before that run. 

[Saint Billy]

That was like watching a pack of lions hunting down an antelope and the antelope escaping. Watching it was very uncomfortable but at the same I applaud our players for the guts and hard work they showed.

Salisu is immense and as tough as old boots and I’ll be gutted when he is stolen from us eventually. KWP back in his rightful position and scoring a goal that will be up there being considered for goal of the season.

A great backs to the wall performance played with alot of pride.

[saintwbu]

That Salisu tackle on De Bruyne should make any highlights reel at the end of the season, it was absolutely superb and a perfect summary of his performance.

[Jimmy_D]

51 minutes ago, Saint Billy said:

That was like watching a pack of lions hunting down an antelope and the antelope escaping. Watching it was very uncomfortable but at the same I applaud our players for the guts and hard work they showed.

Salisu is immense and as tough as old boots and I’ll be gutted when he is stolen from us eventually. KWP back in his rightful position and scoring a goal that will be up there being considered for goal of the season.

A great backs to the wall performance played with alot of pride.

Only if it beats JWP’s free kick for goal of the month!

Two ridiculously good goals in two games we’ve seen.

[saintadjg]

People complaining about our high line for free kicks, it has only failed a couple of times. Concede loads but almost always offside. I really can't think of many that stood. For me last nights should've been offside as the players who were offside were clearly going for the ball and if laporte hadn't got it one of them would. Same as I was surprised Ches goal didn't get ruled out the other day as Broja was off and nearly got the ball. I genuinely have no idea what the offside rules are these days.

Great team effort last night. City really bring out the best in us. Great 1st goal for KWP . My most special 1st goal has to be Franny's.

Would pay to see Grealish v Romeu.

[AlexLaw76]

12 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Pep is such a bitch when they don't win.. 

"By far" 🤣

here it is

 

[Jimmy_D]

4 minutes ago, saintadjg said:

People complaining about our high line for free kicks, it has only failed a couple of times. Concede loads but almost always offside. I really can't think of many that stood. For me last nights should've been offside as the players who were offside were clearly going for the ball and if laporte hadn't got it one of them would. Same as I was surprised Ches goal didn't get ruled out the other day as Broja was off and nearly got the ball. I genuinely have no idea what the offside rules are these days.

Great team effort last night. City really bring out the best in us. Great 1st goal for KWP . My most special 1st goal has to be Franny's.

Would pay to see Grealish v Romeu.

The free kick tactic has worked really well for us, but City’s tactic of sending runners offside while the target of the free kick runs from deeper is very repeatable, feels like that offside tactic will quickly become less effective now.

[The Cat]

1 hour ago, Dman said:

To be fair, Laporte was being a wanker all game. There was a point in the first half where he tried getting adams (I think it was) sent off for an arm in the neck whilst competing for a header.
 

naturally, the 6 foot prick went down clutching his face like he’d face a haymaker from Tyson Fury. 

Oh was that the one when he went down and then the ref basically told him to get up and he was fine? At the time I wasn't sure which of their players it was.

[Jimmy_D]

16 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

here it is

 

Quite the effort by Saints then, to have faced that and come away with a deserved point!

[OldNick]

45 minutes ago, saintwbu said:

That Salisu tackle on De Bruyne should make any highlights reel at the end of the season, it was absolutely superb and a perfect summary of his performance.

Bobby  Moore v Pele in the 1970 WC was slightly better but this was class

[OldNick]

8 hours ago, cambsaint said:

A magnificent team performance every player can be proud of.

The comments on the current offside rule are very apt.

It was quite obviously a tactical decision to have two or three players running in offside with no intent to attempt to play the ball while a couple of players time their runs to defined areas where the ball is aimed and take advantage of the confusion the "off side but not offside " players have caused.

Very clever. I expect it to be widely copied and hopefully law will be amended to bring some sense back to the offside law

what went wrong was that KWP should have blocked Le Portes run, he didnt and so he broke through the lines. As for Souness and his tirade was ridiculous, a player who breaks the line makes the whole strategy fall down. They are disaplined and if done correctly very effective

[OldNick]

11 hours ago, John Boy Saint said:

But it’s not 3 times in a games - in a one on one skirmish on the pitch you can put your house on him coming 2nd 99 times out of 100.

Most in stadium don’t frequent this domain so have their own opinions.  It was very notable when his name was said in the line ups how muted the cheer was from the crowd even audible groans both on the concourse and then in the bowl. 

i doubt you can hear it as  i suspect you start the booing. 5 assists for goals, add to that there would be other chances that were not taken.

Thank god you are not picking the team

[Lee On Solent Saint]

10 hours ago, Chez said:

to be fair, they had a lot of shots and crosses that didn't fall their way. We fought hard, but we rode our luck too.  I was pretty happy with how the ball fell for us.

I can't understand the way City play at times. The amount of crosses they put in, you'd think they had Harry Kane up top. If they had a Kane/Lewdonski they'd score evermore than they do already. 

[macca155]

2 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I can't understand the way City play at times. The amount of crosses they put in, you'd think they had Harry Kane up top. If they had a Kane/Lewdonski they'd score evermore than they do already. 

They are relentless and expect every player to score. 

Beautiful football team to watch when they click. At times yesterday it looked like we would be overrun, but Saints managed to regain a foothold in the game.

Somehow Ralph has the measure of Pep and don't we love it.

Salisu will be bought soon, we'll never hold on to a player of that quality. Enjoy him for the time we have him.

[Chez]

I was very interested in KWP's interview on MOTD. He said:

"This club has given me a really great opportunity, taking me from Tottenham two years ago now, so I'm just grateful for everything and every opportunity I get." 

...and sounded extremely happy and genuine. If he is actually unhappy and angling for a move due to being dropped, as was mentioned on here during the week, it certainly didn't sound like it. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

14 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Pep is such a bitch when they don't win.. 

"By far" 🤣

Last season (after they stuck 5 past us) he was blowing smoke up our arses and some were lapping it up. Much prefer sulking grumpy Pep after we’ve done a number on them. 

Proper team performance, defended properly, stopped them playing but with Broja up top we always look like we’ve got an outlet. From where I was sat maybe Forster should have come for the goal, and I thought Mo struggled, but other than that an excellent performance. The most obvious MoTM for years, but I thought both full backs were superb as well. 

[richardc]

 

This reminds me of Salisu

[The Cat]

Away fan perspective on the pitch invasions and stewarding at the end. Interesting thread if you read it all.

 

 

 

[Toadhall Saint]

17 minutes ago, The Cat said:

Away fan perspective on the pitch invasions and stewarding at the end. Interesting thread if you read it all.

 

 

 

Read it - stewards in over the top use of force shocker. But if you don’t go on the pitch none of it happens and it’s illegal to enter the field of play - that will be the response of the club. Me? Sounds as if there was an over the top reaction from the stewards been happening for more years than I care to remember 

[for_heaven's_Saint]

3 hours ago, Dman said:

To be fair, Laporte was being a wanker all game. There was a point in the first half where he tried getting adams (I think it was) sent off for an arm in the neck whilst competing for a header.
 

naturally, the 6 foot prick went down clutching his face like he’d face a haymaker from Tyson Fury. 

He also chose to run to the Northam/Kingsland corner and celebrate when he scored, rather than do it in front of the city fans. Prick. 

[The Left Back]

Pretty much everything has been said.  Fantastic game, fantastic atmosphere, fantastic goal, fantastic team spirit. Shame we couldn't hang on, particularly with such a soft goal, but otherwise a magical late afternoon/evening. 

One thing I'd like to add regarding the formation and the Redmond topics.

I'd say we were clearly 4222 for the first 30/35 minutes - there's no doubt about that in my mind.  Then we went to 451, Armstrong moved inside (from the left where he'd unusually been) Redmond swapped to wide left and Broja to right midfield.  It was a change that didn't work, Broja looked totally lost and Redmond had a bit of a mare on his more usual side.  During this period there was a lot shouting and arm waving between Redomnd and Bednarek, with Ralph joining in from the far side.  It looked like a few of the team were having a right go at Redmond for not tracking back for the Sterling chance, and later giving the ball away in a dangerous position.  So my reading is that Redmond was hooked at half time for that last 10/15 minutes indiscipline.  Him and Armstrong had both been excellent prior to that in the 4222.  Second half we looked much more like 442, mostly because we had so little of the ball.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Proper team performance, defended properly, stopped them playing but with Broja up top we always look like we’ve got an outlet. From where I was sat maybe Forster should have come for the goal, and I thought Mo struggled, but other than that an excellent performance. The most obvious MoTM for years, but I thought both full backs were superb as well. 

I thought that too at the time but I can understand his uncertainty. Laporte may have been onside but he was supported by a vanguard of offside colleagues who would have made his attempt at claiming the ball more difficult. Technically they were not ‘interfering with an opponent’ under the modern interpretations but they were a distraction and were blocking his possible approach to the ball.

Laporte had it easy because his flanks were protected.

[Sheaf Saint]

20 minutes ago, for_heaven's_Saint said:

He also chose to run to the Northam/Kingsland corner and celebrate when he scored, rather than do it in front of the city fans. Prick. 

He can whinge all he likes about the dangerous tackle from Stu, but he should consider himself very lucky he got the ball earlier on when he went flying in to block Broja with both feet off the ground. 

Stu's may have been a painful one, but this could have been a leg breaker if he had got his timing wrong. 

Edited 23 January, 2022 by Sheaf Saint

[Tank]

13 hours ago, John Boy Saint said:

Sorry but that is truly papering over the cracks - he does far more snuffing out our own attacks in nearly every game than 5 bloody assists - when Moi was warming up intensely at half time it was easy to guess who was being pulled of at half time.

you are right his 2nd half performace was pretty negligible ... 😉

....when Redders is good he's good, it's just that way

Edited 23 January, 2022 by Tank

[Sarisbury Saint]

3 hours ago, Dman said:

Being at the game, Looked more like a standard 442 to me. Wide midfielders were playing very deep without the ball at some points in the second half more of a 622 they were that deep. 
 

The pressing was mainly coming from the front 2 whilst we played 2 banks of 4 making it hard to break down. Very different from the overally attacking 4222 where the wingers press very high and are out of position. 

That’s the game I saw aswell. Most of the game there were two banks of four.

[Charlie Wayman]

Not a good watch but a good result. Thumbs up to Salisu. Excellent goal from KWP.

[St Steve]

 

 

 

Edited 23 January, 2022 by St Steve

[manji]

3 hours ago, Jimmy_D said:

The free kick tactic has worked really well for us, but City’s tactic of sending runners offside while the target of the free kick runs from deeper is very repeatable, feels like that offside tactic will quickly become less effective now.

City had done their homework and completely owned us on the free kick. But the only bad bit of the game. I sure Ralph and the lads will learn from it.

[Chez]

26 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

He can whinge all he likes about the dangerous tackle from Stu, but he should consider himself very lucky he got the ball earlier on when he went flying in to block Broja with both feet off the ground. 

Stu's may have been a painful one, but this could have been a leg breaker if he had got his timing wrong. 

I was kind of thinking the same, slightly reckless, but to be fair it's a two footed block, not a two footed challenge and he didn't really endanger Broja

[Chez]

3 hours ago, saintadjg said:

People complaining about our high line for free kicks, it has only failed a couple of times. Concede loads but almost always offside. I really can't think of many that stood.

It's a fair point, but it's much more down to luck than judgement that we haven't been punished far more. Sometimes the offside trap has been beaten and teams have missed the chance when it looked easier to score, others its been down to cm's and under the new VAR methodology wouldn't be offside.

Two goals in two games conceded from similar free kicks because of the ploy. Is it a busted flush?

I'm interested to know why we decided to use it. Is it used because our players simply can't or wont track runners?  did we concede goals when defenders did their jobs?  Are other teams conceding from this type/angle of long range free kick? I always thought that it's hard to score from that angle of cross. 

 

[John Boy Saint]

3 minutes ago, Chez said:

I was kind of thinking the same, slightly reckless, but to be fair it's a two footed block, not a two footed challenge and he didn't really endanger Broja

One thing that has been omitted from the highlights is when Broja broke into the box and got strongly cleaned out by Ederson in the box, stadium shouts for a penalty, only to see the Lino waving his flag like he’s in a hurricane then signalling for offside, someone really is going to get broken under the current rule of keeping the flag down. 

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, John Boy Saint said:

One thing that has been omitted from the highlights is when Broja broke into the box and got strongly cleaned out by Ederson in the box, stadium shouts for a penalty, only to see the Lino waving his flag like he’s in a hurricane then signalling for offside, someone really is going to get broken under the current rule of keeping the flag down. 

They can't win in this instance.  get it wrong (and it will go wrong) and fans/pundits/managers will be going apocalyptic on them for giving a wrong offside.