Saints 1-1 Brighton - Match Thread

[Lighthouse]

14 minutes ago, Kingsland Codger said:

Was this a wise substitution? A like-for-like substitution when we are 1-0 up with 10 minutes to play? Why not shore up the midfield or defence? Diablo maybe?

Everyone would then say he was ridiculously negative against a team as poor as Brighton and that we were just sitting back and inviting them on to us. They would be right. We didn't need to change anything, Brighton were barely troubling us and we were easily posing as much of a (minimal) threat as they were.

This wasn't like other games where things needed changing or mixing up. Our game plan was working fine. It may not have been pretty but look at what we have on the bench to change things. Long, Walcott, Armstrong and Elyounoussi. I'll be kind and say that the jury is out on Armstrong but the other three are Championship players at best.

[Dr Who?]

Excuses, excuses, excuses. Everyone needs to stop pointing the finger and have a little respect for each other and a little more team spirit. Fed up of it. 

[woodsaint1]

13 minutes ago, MAY-Z said:

McCarthy couldnt move sideways so if it had gone over the wall it’s in, unfortunately JWP couldn’t wait to see if it cleared the wall before moving back

JWP took it upon himself to do that. Given the high line that everybody else kept, that wasnt instructions he was acting on. If they whip it over the wall and into the far corner then fair dues, but dropping back to play everybody on (after gifting the free kick in the first place) is just a massive brainfart.

Havent been this annoyed about stoppage time decision making since Bertand tried to play for a throw-in in our corner that led to Everton equalising at Goodison in the near relegation season under Hughes.

We could be sitting on 21/22 points if it wasnt for poor decison making/defensive mistakes. Instead we're only 6 above Newcastle who've managed just their first win of the season. So frustrating when you see the performances we've put in for 45-60 minutes of games

[Whitey Grandad]

27 minutes ago, Teddeer said:

Watching Brighton's goal again the decision by JWP to go back towards the goal line looks more ridiculous than ever even if McCarthy was carrying an injury. The wall did its job and Maupay would have been caught offside but for that stupid action. What on earth did JWP hope to achieve? Schoolboy error.

Yep. As soon as the ball is cleared race to the edge of the area and put them all offside.

[Teddeer]

4 minutes ago, woodsaint1 said:

JWP took it upon himself to do that. Given the high line that everybody else kept, that wasnt instructions he was acting on. If they whip it over the wall and into the far corner then fair dues, but dropping back to play everybody on (after gifting the free kick in the first place) is just a massive brainfart.

Havent been this annoyed about stoppage time decision making since Bertand tried to play for a throw-in in our corner that led to Everton equalising at Goodison in the near relegation season under Hughes.

We could be sitting on 21/22 points if it wasnt for poor decison making/defensive mistakes. Instead we're only 6 above Newcastle who've managed just their first win of the season. So frustrating when you see the performances we've put in for 45-60 minutes of games

Agree with this. No way was JWP going back towards his goal going to help McCarthy. If the Brighton player takes a good free kick that is over the wall then fair play to him and little JWP isn't leaping like a salmon to head it clear. It was a completely futile action that only served to leave Maupay in an onside position and able to smash the ball home. Thanks for nothing James, you should know better with your experience.

[woodsaint1]

On a slight positive, another goal for Broja and means our current striking options (Adams, Armstrong, Broja) have chipped in with 8 goals in 15 games this season. Doesnt sound inspiring but checked the first 15 games of last season and our options at the time (Ings, Adams, Obafemi, N'Lundulu) had 10 goals in the same period. Worry is that JWP, Walcott, Vestergaard had all scored a couple each. We really have a lack of goals outside our strikers, especially if JWP isnt scoring free kicks. 

[Kingsland Codger]

22 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Everyone would then say he was ridiculously negative against a team as poor as Brighton and that we were just sitting back and inviting them on to us. They would be right. We didn't need to change anything, Brighton were barely troubling us and we were easily posing as much of a (minimal) threat as they were.

This wasn't like other games where things needed changing or mixing up. Our game plan was working fine. It may not have been pretty but look at what we have on the bench to change things. Long, Walcott, Armstrong and Elyounoussi. I'll be kind and say that the jury is out on Armstrong but the other three are Championship players at best.

The suggestion (Diallo instead of AA) was discussed on the ferry south and the conclusion was the same as yours above - us fans would have expected to continue to seek a second goal rather than take the negative route and play out for a 1-0 win.  But since that didn’t work out, perhaps we might try the more negative approach next time.

[Appy]

Utterly bizarre from Ralph to purely blame McCarthy for not going off, you’d think he might twig if Lyanco is taking our goal kicks. 
 

I’ll blame McCarthy for a lot recently, but Ralph is passing the buck massively, he should look at his captain or Salisu, who both had a shocker at the end. 

[ant]

9 minutes ago, Appy said:

Utterly bizarre from Ralph to purely blame McCarthy for not going off, you’d think he might twig if Lyanco is taking our goal kicks. 
 

I’ll blame McCarthy for a lot recently, but Ralph is passing the buck massively, he should look at his captain or Salisu, who both had a shocker at the end. 

Agreed. Ralph really starting to grasp, in my opinion.

Watching Lyanco take the goal kicks gave flashbacks to Sunday League. Even if he wasn't injured it made for uncomfortable viewing.

Management-wise I don't know what the answer is, going forward. But I think whatever ideas were once there are rapidly drying up.

Edited 4 December, 2021 by ant

[Lighthouse]

21 minutes ago, Kingsland Codger said:

The suggestion (Diallo instead of AA) was discussed on the ferry south and the conclusion was the same as yours above - us fans would have expected to continue to seek a second goal rather than take the negative route and play out for a 1-0 win.  But since that didn’t work out, perhaps we might try the more negative approach next time.

In what way would that, or any other tactic, have worked out in a way which didn’t today? The way we played kept a clean sheet right up to the point someone made a woeful individual error, followed by another. Having Diallo on doesn’t change anything that happened, so it’s a completely moot point. The result basically ends up the same.

[Saint Billy]

What a shit show of a season this is turning out to be. 

 

[beatlesaint]

Danny Murphy basically calling out Ralph as a bloody liar re not knowing about the McCarthy injury when you’ve got your bloody centre backs taking goal kicks for him.

Dont often agree with Murphy but I think he’s right on this. Ralph once again trying to be Teflon.

[whelk]

JWP is a fucking pathetic captain. We are so inept and led by a choirboy who has no mental strength and cannot lead others. Been on the piss since game ended and still fuming although we all agreed talking about game was off limits.  That pass in field when closing game out against 10 men was beyond belief. Captain my arse the annoying little cunt. And don’t get me started on the manager

[Convict Colony]

If we could of scored from the loads of chances we had we wouldn't be too fussed about conceding.

Id love to see chances to goals ratio it must be like 8:1 or something over the last 4 games.

We batter teams in first halves and either draw or 1-0 up at half time when it should be more.

[Sarisbury Saint]

29 minutes ago, Convict Colony said:

If we could of scored from the loads of chances we had we wouldn't be too fussed about conceding.

Id love to see chances to goals ratio it must be like 8:1 or something over the last 4 games.

We batter teams in first halves and either draw or 1-0 up at half time when it should be more.

Question is, why aren’t we creating chances or scoring in the second half.

Its like they’ve all been given sedatives at halftime.

Either that or the team talk/tactics are uninspiring.

If Ralph could sort this out, then he’d win me over.

We can all see what a good team we are, so you can’t say players aren’t good enough if they can play so well for 45 minutes. Something else is wrong, and that has to be down to Ralph.

[Give it to Ron]

9 hours ago, Kingsland Codger said:

Was this a wise substitution? A like-for-like substitution when we are 1-0 up with 10 minutes to play? Why not shore up the midfield or defence? Diablo maybe?

Exactly it’s what good managers do not ours though! I was ranting about that for ages.

Our middle two played 3 games in a week cover more ground than expected due to his naive tactics yet he didn’t freshen it up and see game out.

On the manager as much as players yesterday 

[Saint_Tony]

still raging, it's become so be predictable. Wednesday night at half time, you just know we wont win the game, same again yesterday. It's such fine lines, we were a few minutes from a big three points and mid table, now we look relegation candidates. This side is incapable of scoring enough goals when on top, it is so frustrating.

[LiberalCommunist]

20 hours ago, LiberalCommunist said:

I'm worried about today. Think we'll play well, and suffer from the same old problems. Can't pull myself away from 1-1. 

 

Even when kinda expecting it to pan out like that, it's still a stinker of a result. I'm struggling to shake it this morning. Fucking horrible result. 

I'm hoping the F1 can offer up something great this afternoon, as I can't even be bothered to wish ill on our relegation rivals. 

[Charlie Wayman]

On and on it goes. 

[kitch]

16 hours ago, OttawaSaint said:

Tino looked gassed. One sub left, surely get Perraud on and switch KWP back to the right. Kill a bit of time, kill a bit of momentum. Perraud to come on and say "panique pas mes amis".

RH sits on his hands.

That's what I was screaming for. It was obvious.

[Chez]

A few thoughts.

Broja is the real deal. He offers us so much more than Che and Amstrong. Pace and power. Holds the ball up well, good feet, decent in the air and that little bit of composure and skill. Perhaps should have buried the first chance in the first half, and the one in the second was harder than it looked when watching live.

I thought for once, we didn't come out second half and allow the opponents to dictate. Obviously we didn't retain the lead, but our intensity after the break was good. The much talked about `what does Ralph say at half time' was not a factor here.

McCarthy's injury was a result of saving Maupay's chance. It was obvious he was struggling. He didn't take a goal kick and took a risk with a short pass rather than a long clearance. Player and management (including physio) should be seeing that/communicating. I saw it. 

JWP and Romeu need to be subbed more often towards the end of games. Tiredness caused that pass/decision/foul. They work so hard, they can't possibly be as sharp at 80 minutes as they were at minute 1. Diallo needs to be trusted more.

Lyanco got beaten in the air by Maupay. That (and his diving in) worries me.

I thought we played well overall. We were very sharp, especially in the first half. Brighton were bad, giving the ball away a lot (we forced a lot of their errors mind you) but they still created chances, Maupay's in the second should have been buried. I thought we created more opportunities though and were the better side. 

 

 

Edited 5 December, 2021 by Chez

[Chez]

11 hours ago, woodsaint1 said:

We really have a lack of goals outside our strikers, especially if JWP isnt scoring free kicks. 

Yep. JW, Romeu, Redmond, Djenepo, Walcott, Ely, Diallo and to a lessor extent Tella and Armstrong due to not playing, simply don't offer enough of a goal threat. There's no goals there at all really. I think Tella adds some pace and he trys things,  which may help us from this point. Redmond's deft header helped set up the goal and when on song he is our best option in the creativity department (I'm discounting Armstrong due to his injuries), but when is the last time a wide player cut inside an curled one into the top corner? Got to say that the Djenepo signing has been one of the biggest disappointments. He just has not done it for us. Does anyone think he will come good? He's still young, but we need to see improvement from him.

[S-Clarke]

17 minutes ago, Chez said:

A few thoughts.

Broja is the real deal. He offers us so much more than Che and Amstrong. Pace and power. Holds the ball up well, good feet, decent in the air and that little bit of composure and skill. Perhaps should have buried the first chance in the first half, and the one in the second was harder than it looked when watching live.

I thought for once, we didn't come out second half and allow the opponents to dictate. Obviously we didn't retain the lead, but our intensity after the break was good. The much talked about `what does Ralph say at half time' was not a factor here.

McCarthy's injury was a result of saving Maupay's chance. It was obvious he was struggling. He didn't take a goal kick and took a risk with a short pass rather than a long clearance. Player and management (including physio) should be seeing that/communicating. I saw it. 

JWP and Romeu need to be subbed more often towards the end of games. Tiredness caused that pass/decision/foul. They work so hard, they can't possibly be as sharp at 80 minutes as they were at minute 1. Diallo needs to be trusted more.

Lyanco got beaten in the air by Maupay. That (and his diving in) worries me.

I thought we played well overall. We were very sharp, especially in the first half. Brighton were bad, giving the ball away a lot (we forced a lot of their errors mind you) but they still created chances, Maupay's in the second should have been buried. I thought we created more opportunities though and were the better side. 

 

 

Very fair views, you see the game very much as I do really. I really like Broja but it feels a bit of a fail that our attack and goals are down to a teenage loannee. Need to sort that out. The wide players are as guilty, there's no goals from anywhere else. I know Armstrong is still adjusting etc, but I still expected more from a £15m outlay.

We didn't get pushed back as much 2nd half, but we did drop off a little as the half went on. Probably tiredness like you said. Ralph does sub Romeu from time to time, maybe JWP needs to be the victim of a sub occasionally. 

What worries me is that we are playing well - against Leicester we played well, against Brighton we should have been out of sight after 50 mins. Played well against West Ham at home, Utd at home - Norwich away we should have been out of sight really. At the start of last season in our 'playing well' period we had Ings banging in the goals, now we have no one to score those goals consistently hence why we're only managing the odd win and mainly draws.

I fear as to what happens when we have a dip in form and performances, as there is nothing in this team which will ever enable us to 'win when playing badly' - we can't even win when playing well.

Edited 5 December, 2021 by S-Clarke

[Saint Billy]

I hoping Semmens and Co are not blinded by the fact that Ralph is a nice guy. After 3 years of his reign we are not moving forward at all. 

We are full of a team of underperforming regulars with our better players playing out of position or left on the bench. An 18 year old with great promise being played game after game and in obvious need of a break. Playing a keeper who costs us points on a regular basis and ignoring the fact that every 2nd half of games we capitulate. Ralph is regularly out witted by the opposition manager and with an inability to turn things around. 

This is undoubtedly relegation form. Other teams around us are starting to pick up points when we are throwing them away. 

Nice guy, bad manager Semmens. 

[Chez]

4 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

 

I fear as to what happens when we have a dip in form and performances, as there is nothing in this team which will ever enable us to 'win when playing badly' - we can't even win when playing well.

 

Maybe Broja. The winner in the Leeds game, when we had lost our way a bit and the goal yesterday, that little touch of class to go past the defender (kind of like Ings used to do) give me hope that we can maybe score against the run of play at least. He caused Liverpool defenders a few issues too, so we could perhaps be a little more compact at the back and in midfield (more reserved possibly) and use him Tella and Redmond to hit teams on the break.

[DT]

37 minutes ago, Chez said:

A few thoughts.

Broja is the real deal. He offers us so much more than Che and Amstrong. Pace and power. Holds the ball up well, good feet, decent in the air and that little bit of composure and skill. Perhaps should have buried the first chance in the first half, and the one in the second was harder than it looked when watching live.

I thought for once, we didn't come out second half and allow the opponents to dictate. Obviously we didn't retain the lead, but our intensity after the break was good. The much talked about `what does Ralph say at half time' was not a factor here.

McCarthy's injury was a result of saving Maupay's chance. It was obvious he was struggling. He didn't take a goal kick and took a risk with a short pass rather than a long clearance. Player and management (including physio) should be seeing that/communicating. I saw it. 

JWP and Romeu need to be subbed more often towards the end of games. Tiredness caused that pass/decision/foul. They work so hard, they can't possibly be as sharp at 80 minutes as they were at minute 1. Diallo needs to be trusted more.

Lyanco got beaten in the air by Maupay. That (and his diving in) worries me.

I thought we played well overall. We were very sharp, especially in the first half. Brighton were bad, giving the ball away a lot (we forced a lot of their errors mind you) but they still created chances, Maupay's in the second should have been buried. I thought we created more opportunities though and were the better side. 

 

 

Agree with all of this. On the keeper thing, though, maybe management did see it but felt that without Forster (I think) we weren’t blessed with replacements? Very good point about midfield. I was crying out for Diallo to come on, not least for his energy at a crucial point. Surely these are basic points for a decent manager?

[Wade Garrett]

We couldn’t beat a Brighton side that was peppered with injuries and only had 10 men at the end of the game.

We are a better side than that, but won’t be under Ralph.

[nta786]

34 minutes ago, Saint Billy said:

I hoping Semmens and Co are not blinded by the fact that Ralph is a nice guy. After 3 years of his reign we are not moving forward at all. 

We are full of a team of underperforming regulars with our better players playing out of position or left on the bench. An 18 year old with great promise being played game after game and in obvious need of a break. Playing a keeper who costs us points on a regular basis and ignoring the fact that every 2nd half of games we capitulate. Ralph is regularly out witted by the opposition manager and with an inability to turn things around. 

This is undoubtedly relegation form. Other teams around us are starting to pick up points when we are throwing them away. 

Nice guy, bad manager Semmens. 

In this league it is difficult to move forward when your net spend is practically nil.

The results are somewhat disappointing, but for as long as we are above the drop zone comfortably, Ralph's job won't come under any pressure at all.

I think we just need to get used to this.

I don't think he is a bad manager, just a slightly above average one who has found his level with us. I don't think he will ever manage the PL top 6, but I can see him doing well for a Leipzig/Frankfurt or something after a stint with us, and I can see him taking a German team into the top 4.

Ultimately, he is here because a PL manager salary is still higher than the majority of clubs in other domestic leagues. 

 

[JRM]

Couple more points; 

Just like Wednesday v Leicester there were lots of empty seats. Pricing is wrong in my opinion. 

Gutted a fan didn't manage to get on and take out Maupay with a clothesline wrestling move at the end,  what a prick celebrating like that 

[CamSaint]

35 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

At the start of last season in our 'playing well' period we had Ings banging in the goals, now we have no one to score those goals consistently hence why we're only managing the odd win and mainly draws.

 

Just from a goals scored perspective, Ings got 5 goals in our first 15 games last season & his replacements, Broja & Armstrong have also got 5 between them this season. Adams had 4 last season and 3 this season.

 

37 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

there's no goals from anywhere else

That's the real problem. After 15 matches last season, JWP had 4, Vestergaard 3, S Armstrong 2, Walcott 2, and Djenopo, Romeu, Bednarek & Redmond 1 each. This year, JWP has 2, Livramento, Elyounoussi, & Bednarek 1 each, plus an OG. 10 fewer goals overall. Of course, Vestergaard has gone & SA has barely played, but I wonder whether Ings all-round play contributed more than we appreciate in creating opportunities for others to score?

[Chez]

got to ask, could a new manager get more out of the players available to him and could a new manager identify and bring better players to the club using the same budget available. 

Are players actually underperforming or this is their level? Are tactics undermining results or covering up a lack of quality? 

Has the manager been responsible for bringing any of the players in? How much input from him? Where are the hidden gems from Germany?

[Chez]

2 minutes ago, JRM said:

Couple more points; 

Just like Wednesday v Leicester there were lots of empty seats. Pricing is wrong in my opinion. 

 

 

Hell yes. £46 for my match day ticket. Jesus that feels a lot to watch Saints vs Brighton.  This, along with results, is why they don't sell out. Fans come and go, but a hell of a lot of regular fans have given up simply because the price is too high. 

[Saint Pete]

1 hour ago, Chez said:

A few thoughts.

Broja is the real deal. He offers us so much more than Che and Amstrong. Pace and power. Holds the ball up well, good feet, decent in the air and that little bit of composure and skill. Perhaps should have buried the first chance in the first half, and the one in the second was harder than it looked when watching live.

I thought for once, we didn't come out second half and allow the opponents to dictate. Obviously we didn't retain the lead, but our intensity after the break was good. The much talked about `what does Ralph say at half time' was not a factor here.

McCarthy's injury was a result of saving Maupay's chance. It was obvious he was struggling. He didn't take a goal kick and took a risk with a short pass rather than a long clearance. Player and management (including physio) should be seeing that/communicating. I saw it. 

JWP and Romeu need to be subbed more often towards the end of games. Tiredness caused that pass/decision/foul. They work so hard, they can't possibly be as sharp at 80 minutes as they were at minute 1. Diallo needs to be trusted more.

Lyanco got beaten in the air by Maupay. That (and his diving in) worries me.

I thought we played well overall. We were very sharp, especially in the first half. Brighton were bad, giving the ball away a lot (we forced a lot of their errors mind you) but they still created chances, Maupay's in the second should have been buried. I thought we created more opportunities though and were the better side. 

Agree with all the above especially the need to sub JWP or Romeu in second halves. With the formation and high intensity style Ralph uses, it seems obvious that it requires huge energy from the centre mids and that they will tire and make more mistakes late in games. Even more so in periods like this with lots of games.

Given that Ralph has spoken out in favour of 5 subs being allowed in the prem it's baffling that he is so slow to use the 3 he is allowed in games like this. He needs to trust the likes of Diallo much more.

[Chez]

1 minute ago, Saint Pete said:

Agree with all the above especially the need to sub JWP or Romeu in second halves. With the formation and high intensity style Ralph uses, it seems obvious that it requires huge energy from the centre mids and that they will tire and make more mistakes late in games. Even more so in periods like this with lots of games.

Given that Ralph has spoken out in favour of 5 subs being allowed in the prem it's baffling that he is so slow to use the 3 he is allowed in games like this. He needs to trust the likes of Diallo much more.

the obvious alternative is to change formation and play three in the middle. Whether that improves results I don't know, but it would mean less space for JWP and Romeu to cover, so maybe less tiredness.

[rallyboy]

I love those club emails - 'Tell us about your matchday experience'.... 😨

Mate, you don't really want us to tell you what we thought.

[S-Clarke]

18 minutes ago, CamSaint said:

Just from a goals scored perspective, Ings got 5 goals in our first 15 games last season & his replacements, Broja & Armstrong have also got 5 between them this season. Adams had 4 last season and 3 this season.

 

That's the real problem. After 15 matches last season, JWP had 4, Vestergaard 3, S Armstrong 2, Walcott 2, and Djenopo, Romeu, Bednarek & Redmond 1 each. This year, JWP has 2, Livramento, Elyounoussi, & Bednarek 1 each, plus an OG. 10 fewer goals overall. Of course, Vestergaard has gone & SA has barely played, but I wonder whether Ings all-round play contributed more than we appreciate in creating opportunities for others to score?

I don't this to turn into an Ings Love-in! but...he was critical to our attack and how it functioned, more than just a goal scorer. He popped up with assists as well, his genuine running and ability on the ball did open things up for us.

Vestgaard is prob a bit of a freak though, he was massive so we had an enormous advantage at set pieces. That tailed off once teams figured out how to defend against him though.

I'd also add to the argument that we have improved defensively this season, we're not committing as high up as we did last year (so we're not getting caught like we were). This will likely contribute to less attacking clear cut chances, but more defensive stability - which is kind of what we've seen. The damage to our attack is being felt because we haven't got that '1 chance, 1 goal' type of player up there, as we do still create chances.....better striker up top and this setup would be being lauded imo.

[Chez]

16 hours ago, steveo said:

Just back from the game, and have not read any posts so far. All I can say is thank you JWP for costing us 2 pts. WTF were you doing with 2 mins left? Meant to be an international and can not clear a ball. 2 pts thrown away thanks to our dead ball specialist. Nuff said

terrible ball. Terrible decision. Can see what he was thinking, (and trying to keep the ball is no bad thing) but it was an error. I put that down to tiredness. 

Still bloody annoying though. Killed us.

[JRM]

22 minutes ago, Chez said:

Hell yes. £46 for my match day ticket. Jesus that feels a lot to watch Saints vs Brighton.  This, along with results, is why they don't sell out. Fans come and go, but a hell of a lot of regular fans have given up simply because the price is too high. 

A mate of mine through the kids school was going to buy tickets morning of the game last min decision and messaged me to ask is it really £20 for a kid in the Chapel? They decided against it. 

[Billy the Kidd]

27 minutes ago, Chez said:

the obvious alternative is to change formation and play three in the middle. Whether that improves results I don't know, but it would mean less space for JWP and Romeu to cover, so maybe less tiredness.

Good point, also it doesn’t remove much goal threat by swapping an additional midfielder for an attacker, as our tens don’t score anyway. Could be worth trying. 

[Whitey Grandad]

15 minutes ago, Chez said:

terrible ball. Terrible decision. Can see what he was thinking, (and trying to keep the ball is no bad thing) but it was an error. I put that down to tiredness. 

Still bloody annoying though. Killed us.

He didn’t even need to try to pass it. He was not under pressure and could have taken it forward a few more yards.

[Chez]

7 minutes ago, Billy the Kidd said:

Good point, also it doesn’t remove much goal threat by swapping an additional midfielder for an attacker, as our tens don’t score anyway. Could be worth trying. 

Broja can play up top on his own, and maybe Tella and Redmond out wide. 4-3-3 with flying fullbacks. Diallo or S Armstrong in that middle. It's an option and Ralph has been willing to move away from 4-2-2-2 (I still have no idea how this works in practice - its a 4-4-2 isn't it?), so might happen.

[Billy the Kidd]

Just now, Chez said:

Broja can play up top on his own, and maybe Tella and Redmond out wide. 4-3-3 with flying fullbacks. Diallo or S Armstrong in that middle. It's an option and Ralph has been willing to move away from 4-2-2-2 (I still have no idea how this works in practice - its a 4-4-2 isn't it?), so might happen.

Yep like that a lot, was what I was thinking, SA would be my preference but Diallo if not fit. 

If we survive this season, which we should, we must be looking at our advanced midfielders in the summer. 

Good point re flying fullbacks, we have great strength there and some of the best talent in the league. 

[Chez]

4 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

He didn’t even need to try to pass it. He was not under pressure and could have taken it forward a few more yards.

I should point out, he wasn't alone in making poor decisions near the end of the game. Livramento allowed the ball to run across him, thinking he had the pace to outrun his opponent, he didn't and fouled the guy giving them a great chance to cross int the box. Ely left with nowhere to go or pass to (Lyanco didnt help him- he was the closest man for some reason) when headed to the corner flag, losing the ball and leaving us exposed to the break. Lyanco shanking a hacked clearance... 

[Teddeer]

16 minutes ago, Chez said:

I should point out, he wasn't alone in making poor decisions near the end of the game. Livramento allowed the ball to run across him, thinking he had the pace to outrun his opponent, he didn't and fouled the guy giving them a great chance to cross int the box. Ely left with nowhere to go or pass to (Lyanco didnt help him- he was the closest man for some reason) when headed to the corner flag, losing the ball and leaving us exposed to the break. Lyanco shanking a hacked clearance... 

These continuous stream of errors from all the players is why we make life so difficult for ourselves. As you point out, there was a string of panic induced schoolboy errors as the game wore on which put more and more pressure on us. Such errors need to be kept to a bare minimum.

[Whitey Grandad]

Agreed. It was panic football in the last few minutes which is where the game management should step in. Engineer a stoppage for any reason and have a team talk to calm things down. 

[DT]

Other teams make subs in the dying moments just to kill time and break momentum. They play keep ball. They win fouls and run down the clock. We just offer more opportunities to our opponents to score. Again, Ralph’s inability to game manage I’m afraid. 

[Chez]

14 minutes ago, DT said:

Other teams make subs in the dying moments just to kill time and break momentum. They play keep ball. They win fouls and run down the clock. We just offer more opportunities to our opponents to score. Again, Ralph’s inability to game manage I’m afraid. 

other than subs, not sure any manager can dictate what happens in the dying moments. By and large, a managers power to dictate what happens on the pitch is overestimated. All the handwaving and shouting is a load of bollocks, it's just pantomime that has given TV companies something extra to put on screen and help earn managers parity with player wages. 

[Chez]

1 minute ago, Chez said:

other than subs, not sure any manager can dictate what happens in the dying moments. By and large, a managers power to dictate what happens on the pitch is overestimated. All the handwaving and shouting is a load of bollocks, it's just pantomime that has given TV companies something extra to put on screen and help earn managers parity with player wages. 

I should add that our players know how to time waste, earn cheap fouls, take the ball the corner flag etc. What they don't seem to be able to do at the death is keep the ball and go nowhere like they seem more than capable of at all other times during a game.

[Tank]

5 minutes ago, adriansfc said:

I find it odd how many fans (across most clubs) says can't blame the manager for that, can't legislate for a player doing that etc. It seems pointless to focus on isolated incidents with someone who has been at the club 3 years. 

We'll get lucky or defend well and win 1-0 sometimes. But more often as proven time and again, we'll lose leads. We aren't set up to last 90 mins. Ralph saying you can't expect to dominate 90 mins is not an answer to always going from great to dogshit over halftime. In our ten years back in the premier League we've had plenty of games where we've put in decent performances over the full game. I don't remember such a first half second half contrast in all my time supporting saints. 

Its shit to watch as you can't get that excited about taking a lead or first half performance. We all know what's coming. Players aren't unfit but the tactics don't help them. Our lack of clinical finishing doesn't help them. Our rubbish goalkeeper doesn't help them. Is it too much to ask that just once we might be 2-0 up in a match? Switch to a 433 to help the central midfield a bit? 

I like Ralph in many ways but I find watching us fairly miserable now. Under Pellegrino/Hughes we were just rubbish, so we've improved, but we've never been more predictable. Most excitement and football memories come from late drama. We haven't scored from open play in the final 30. We rarely look like scoring second half. So fans know there's no hope as the game goes on. Our one late goal was a penalty at St James part to save a draw when we should have had the win wrapped up. Have we scored many late goals under Ralph at all? I don't remember many last season. 

I hope this match is a massive wake up call to him. It'd be great to think he could learn from mistakes and improve as a manager. Especially if he can ever be given some funds for a proper keeper and half decent no10. But it does seem hard to imagine it being any different now. This isn't a possession side that can manage the game and save energy. So any wins are going to be painfully clinging on. 

 

I was furious, everyone who knows the saints knew that goal was coming.

[East Kent Saint]

It was obviously disappointing losing 2 points at the death but to heap blame on McCarthy and JWP for what happened is over the top , the ball could have gone anywhere after it hit the wall , Mc C or JWP could have kept it out and been the hero ! or the reserve keeper could have faced the free kick and let it in etc We seem to getting a bit desparate as fans ....