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Ralph out Howe In?

Pilchards

By Pilchards,
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Bstokesaint

Bstokesaint

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Haven’t been able to go to a game for a long time but sat in the Itchen listening to the line up yesterday I was thinking what a truly bang average squad that is. Players like Redmond are the forum whipping boy simply because some still haven’t realised how far we have fallen and don’t want to accept that’s our level now. 17th is a successful season. 
For a team that’s had such a bad 2021 I saw a lot of effort and commitment that doesn’t match up to a squad that’s supposedly had enough and aren’t playing for Ralph. With his style of high press it would be v obvious if this was the case.

im fully aware it was an under strength mid table side we were playing but we played well to a plan that nullified Leeds for most of the game and I think Ralph is still getting the best out of individuals. 
 

Salisu was a beast, Livramento is even better than I thought and Romeo/Diallo bossed the midfield.

For me there is some hope there that we can stay up

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Wurzel

Wurzel

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27 minutes ago, Toadhall Saint said:

I keep reading that Howe has been at everyone of our home games this season. Can someone put the proof up? Would just like to see it for myself.

Was just about to post similar question. And if he has, where, general seats or directors/club issue section. There's a big difference between him wanting to watch PL football in his time off and attending as a guest of the club

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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12 hours ago, aintforever said:

To be fair he took Bournemouth from -10 at the bottom of League 2 to the Prem in six seasons. I don’t think we should sack Ralph but if it happens Howe should definitely be considered. Bournemouth were always going to go down at some point regardless of who their manager was.

Good point.

He did a fucking outstanding job without money and a bloody good one with it. History is littered with examples of clubs who’ve had backing and not achieved promotion or stability in the top flight. Apart from about 10 clubs,  one poor season will lead to relegation and that is what happened. 
 

I don’t want him as manager but respect his achievements. Achievements which rank far higher than anything Nigel Adkins did with us. I have some suspicion that  he maybe a one shot wonder and won’t be able to replicate his success elsewhere. But that doesn’t detract from what he did do, calling him a failed manager is just pathetic and ignorant. 

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Minsk

Minsk

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13 hours ago, Dman said:

I can 100% promise you, that the club have previously spoken and put feelers out to Howe. 

Howe has also been at every home game this season. 

I can’t comment on Pilchards post, but i wouldn’t be surprised (and I’ve previously said I think Howe will be our manager before the end of the year). Of course should Ralph leave the club, we may get interest from another candidate who we prefer to Howe but I know talks have taken place back in the summer. 

So in short, the decision makers at the club are either not switched on, or more switched on than you. 

When did the club speak to him? Where they asking if he would be interested in taking over at that point of time? Or did they ask if he might be interested at some undetermined time in the future? If the latter, who wouldn't say, 'Sure. Come back to me when you are ready to offer me a job?'

Where has Howe been sat in the stadium? Who has he been attending with? Has he been sat taking notes? Did he seem excited when we scored or when Salisu made an an exceptional tackle? 

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Turkish

Turkish

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13 hours ago, Dman said:

I can 100% promise you, that the club have previously spoken and put feelers out to Howe. 

Howe has also been at every home game this season. 

I can’t comment on Pilchards post, but i wouldn’t be surprised (and I’ve previously said I think Howe will be our manager before the end of the year). Of course should Ralph leave the club, we may get interest from another candidate who we prefer to Howe but I know talks have taken place back in the summer. 

So in short, the decision makers at the club are either not switched on, or more switched on than you. 

There does feel like there is an inevitability about Howe coming. He’s the sort of manager we’d go for and he’s probably about our level. I don’t think he’s as bad as some make out on here but the talk a few years back about him being Arsenal and England manager one day was laughable. I don’t think he’s any better than Ralph and the reality is we are going to go down sooner or later whoever the manager is. 

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Minsk

Minsk

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To all those wanting Eddie Howe because they believe Ralph could only ever get us to mid-table (at best): Howe has only ever had one top half finish in the premier league as manager. His Bournemouth finished 9th, behind Saints in 8th on goal difference, the season many on here were baying for Puel's head because of a piss poor season. Not forgetting, of course, that we also reached a cup final that season.

His best points tally in the prem is the 46 mentioned above. His other seasons reaped 45, 44, 42 and 34 points. So I guess you will all be happy with us narrowly avoiding relegation year after year, at best, should he be appointed?

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AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

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2 minutes ago, Minsk said:

To all those wanting Eddie Howe because they believe Ralph could only ever get us to mid-table (at best): Howe has only ever had one top half finish in the premier league as manager. His Bournemouth finished 9th, behind Saints in 8th on goal difference, the season many on here were baying for Puel's head because of a piss poor season. Not forgetting, of course, that we also reached a cup final that season.

His best points tally in the prem is the 46 mentioned above. His other seasons reaped 45, 44, 42 and 34 points. So I guess you will all be happy with us narrowly avoiding relegation year after year, at best, should he be appointed?

Anyone who wants Howe, probably does so because they believe Ralph will get relegated this season with this team.

As Turkish has said, we will get relegated soon under the current set up, and I (probably others) believe we would fair better in the Championship with Howe at the helm.

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Piran

Piran

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I have always maintained that you 'see' so much more when you are at a game in person, so my following comments should be judged on that basis. I have seen all Saints league games this season, albeit via streams which have sometimes had foreign commentary (often an improvement if the language can't be understood!), and my overall impression has been of a half-decent team, playing for their manager. I know there has been a shortage of goals, I know there have been a few dodgy moments, I realise that everyone sees games differently, but my feeling is that the season is panning out at least as well as hoped for. Regarding "Ralph out - Howe in" it's a big "No, thank you" from me.

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Minsk

Minsk

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6 minutes ago, Piran said:

I have always maintained that you 'see' so much more when you are at a game in person, so my following comments should be judged on that basis. I have seen all Saints league games this season, albeit via streams which have sometimes had foreign commentary (often an improvement if the language can't be understood!), and my overall impression has been of a half-decent team, playing for their manager. I know there has been a shortage of goals, I know there have been a few dodgy moments, I realise that everyone sees games differently, but my feeling is that the season is panning out at least as well as hoped for. Regarding "Ralph out - Howe in" it's a big "No, thank you" from me.

Exactly this.

I also watch almost every match with foreign commentary. The team has been playing well, all apart from the 2nd half at Everton. I believe there is a good feel in the squad. Broja even said as much in his interview yesterday. The team has vastly improved tactically since the tail end of last season. They are starting to gel. More goals and wins will come. Give it time. To change manager now, and especially in a few weeks time even if we do win all matches in between (as claimed in the OP), would be crazy.

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Minsk

Minsk

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18 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Anyone who wants Howe, probably does so because they believe Ralph will get relegated this season with this team.

As Turkish has said, we will get relegated soon under the current set up, and I (probably others) believe we would fair better in the Championship with Howe at the helm.

Turkish didn't say 'we will get relegated soon under this set up'. He said we will 'go down sooner or later whoever the manager is'. That implies that we are just as likely to go down under Howe as under Ralph.

I am well aware that many think we will go down this year. There was a thread asking for predictions before the season started and many predicted us to be in the bottom 3 at the end (many even stating we would be there all season). Guess what? We haven't been in the bottom 3 at all this season, despite only getting our first win yesterday. If they do prove to be correct and we do go down then that would be the time to, maybe, turn to someone like Howe. Personally, I think we will be just fine this season under Ralph. It is inevitable that we will all die one day. That doesn't mean I go around doing things to make that day come any sooner. I feel that sacking Ralph and replacing him with Howe will certainly increase our likelihood of relegation.

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AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

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28 minutes ago, Minsk said:

Turkish didn't say 'we will get relegated soon under this set up'. He said we will 'go down sooner or later whoever the manager is'. That implies that we are just as likely to go down under Howe as under Ralph.

I am well aware that many think we will go down this year. There was a thread asking for predictions before the season started and many predicted us to be in the bottom 3 at the end (many even stating we would be there all season). Guess what? We haven't been in the bottom 3 at all this season, despite only getting our first win yesterday. If they do prove to be correct and we do go down then that would be the time to, maybe, turn to someone like Howe. Personally, I think we will be just fine this season under Ralph. It is inevitable that we will all die one day. That doesn't mean I go around doing things to make that day come any sooner. I feel that sacking Ralph and replacing him with Howe will certainly increase our likelihood of relegation.

The same thing.  Hence why I went on to say I believe we would fair better in the championship with Howe than Ralph (who would no longer be our manager in such a scenario anyway)

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Minsk

Minsk

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2 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

The same thing.  Hence why I went on to say I believe we would fair better in the championship with Howe than Ralph (who would no longer be our manager in such a scenario anyway)

It's not the same thing at all. What you wrote implies he said we will be relegated under Ralph. What Turkish actually said was we will get relegated one day, it is inevitable, no matter who the manager is. Read his post in full again.

And again, I say, if we were to be relegated then perhaps I would agree that someone with experience of gaining promotion from the Championship would be better than someone who has never managed a team in that division. But, again, maybe that person shouldn't be Howe. He only managed to do it once with Bournemouth. He failed more times than that with the same team, as well as twice with Burnley. Parker is doing far better this season than Howe did after their relegation, and look at how he faired in the prem last season...... 

I reiterate, I feel that appointing Howe now would increase our chance of relegation this season not decrease it. His record in the premier league is really not very good. 46 the best points tally he has ever amassed. Is that what the posters calling for him to replace Ralph really want for us?

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Turkish

Turkish

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Anyone who wants Howe, probably does so because they believe Ralph will get relegated this season with this team.

As Turkish has said, we will get relegated soon under the current set up, and I (probably others) believe we would fair better in the Championship with Howe at the helm.

Exactly. We could have Guardiola as manager but when you’ve not got a pot to piss in and have to sell players to survive despite having hundreds of millions of tv revenue coming in then it only ends up one way. Can’t think of many clubs who have stayed up for any length of time constantly selling their best players. I actually feel a bit sorry for Ralph in some ways. he joined us with a great reputation and when he inevitably leaves probably with us in or close to being in the championship his reputation will have taken a massive hit. 

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BERMUDASAINT

BERMUDASAINT

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No to Eddie, I will stick with the big man!

Well played Ralf and team, it is getting better each game, players are getting the system Ralf has employed and executing it much more effectively.  He may be my favorite coach of all time. Why you say dat...many of the none Ralf fans cry out....because of the Man has a plan! A bloody playbook! A style that is exciting, brave, energetic and full of automism :) , I am learning Ralfy.

He has employed the press better than any manager has, ( yes, better than Poch) but it took awhile,  alot of triggers needed to be learned, pressing as a team, covering the spaces left by the pressure, etc. Ralf is so committed to his style he will not change his plans even when we are getting thumped, keep pressing, stretching, learn it as we loose, because we have to get it right!

Tella's preseason interview confirmed that Ralf was drilling the press into them, so much that Tella thought we are much better at it and "any team that can defeat our press has done very well". I see it for myself, and it looks alot more solid, our defensive record is improving as we get better at the system. This is a very difficult system, even the master, Beliesa was shown how it is done!

Ralf's passion to do better is infectious, he is totally living the game as it goes on. The recruiting since he has been here is excellent for the budget we have. Even the so called usless players (moi, redder, dj) are now being seen as good players, that is good coaching. 

Ralf may not be everyones cup of tea, but for me I would have no one else, a big man, big character,  big ideas, big results and I big up my coach. Thank you for making Saints exciting again, win or loss, it is usually exciting ball.

Ps. Found it very amusing watching Manu trying to press when they were loosing, not a  CLUE! with the intro of Ronaldo this season, they will never be able to press a team effectively again. If it is a half hearted press it will fail and leave you more exposed.

BIG UP THE TEAM,  THEY ALL PLAYED VERY WELL!

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TWar

TWar

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Posted (edited)

Eddie Howe spent a fortune at Bournemouth after coming up and it never came to anything. He over double the money in one summer (17/18...net £62m) than Ralph has in his entire saints tenure  (£25m) and had other summers with net spends of £18m, £30m, £15m and £50m. They spent a fortune and never cracked 50 points (a task Ralph managed on the first time of asking). He is the definition of a lower league manager, did well with massive bankrolling to cruise past lower league opposition but no where near prem level. I have no idea honestly why people are so positive about him.

Edited by TWar
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miserableoldgit

miserableoldgit

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16 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

The way he celebrated the win over us at St Marys springs to mind. Setting aside the perceived rivalry, it was like they had won the league.

In the same way that Ralph did after his first victory over a Jurgen Klopp team? Not sure that that means that he hates Klopp.

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Verbal

Verbal

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35 minutes ago, TWar said:

Eddie Howe spent a fortune at Bournemouth after coming up and it never came to anything. He over double the money in one summer (17/18...net £62m) than Ralph has in his entire saints tenure  (£25m) and had other summers with net spends of £18m, £30m, £15m and £50m. They spent a fortune and never cracked 50 points (a task Ralph managed on the first time of asking). He is the definition of a lower league manager, did well with massive bankrolling to cruise past lower league opposition but no where near prem level. I have no idea honestly why people are so positive about him.

Quite.  If Howe is the answer, fuck only knows what the question is.

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Dellman

Dellman

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2 hours ago, Turkish said:

Exactly. We could have Guardiola as manager but when you’ve not got a pot to piss in and have to sell players to survive despite having hundreds of millions of tv revenue coming in then it only ends up one way. Can’t think of many clubs who have stayed up for any length of time constantly selling their best players. I actually feel a bit sorry for Ralph in some ways. he joined us with a great reputation and when he inevitably leaves probably with us in or close to being in the championship his reputation will have taken a massive hit. 

Yes, we have to sell to buy, but look how much stronger we are for recent buys...Salisu, Livramento, Perraud, Diallo are big upgrades on what we had. It is only Ings who hasn't been upgraded--yet. Great credit to manager and Board to improve the squad without money. Compare how much Eddie Howe spent--and got relegated. Why do some want him? maybe he wants us, but that's a different story.

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AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Minsk said:

It's not the same thing at all. What you wrote implies he said we will be relegated under Ralph. What Turkish actually said was we will get relegated one day, it is inevitable, no matter who the manager is. Read his post in full again.

And again, I say, if we were to be relegated then perhaps I would agree that someone with experience of gaining promotion from the Championship would be better than someone who has never managed a team in that division. But, again, maybe that person shouldn't be Howe. He only managed to do it once with Bournemouth. He failed more times than that with the same team, as well as twice with Burnley. Parker is doing far better this season than Howe did after their relegation, and look at how he faired in the prem last season...... 

I reiterate, I feel that appointing Howe now would increase our chance of relegation this season not decrease it. His record in the premier league is really not very good. 46 the best points tally he has ever amassed. Is that what the posters calling for him to replace Ralph really want for us?

If you Think I meant it that way, that is your view/issue.

I didn't

 

 

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Manuel

Manuel

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2 hours ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

The way he celebrated the win over us at St Marys springs to mind. Setting aside the perceived rivalry, it was like they had won the league.

The way a little brother celebrates when he finally get's one over his big brother.  That's how I saw it.

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woodsaint1

woodsaint1

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19 hours ago, aintforever said:

To be fair he took Bournemouth from -10 at the bottom of League 2 to the Prem in six seasons. I don’t think we should sack Ralph but if it happens Howe should definitely be considered. Bournemouth were always going to go down at some point regardless of who their manager was.

Done a great job when he had little financial resource. But was heavily backed in his last few seasons and likely played a big role in the signings of Ibe, Solanke, Brooks, Mepham etc who were all failures. 

Maybe hes happy to take on a job where he'll have bugger all to spend. Cant see it myself and I think Ralphs here for the forseeable

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aintforever

aintforever

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29 minutes ago, woodsaint1 said:

Done a great job when he had little financial resource. But was heavily backed in his last few seasons and likely played a big role in the signings of Ibe, Solanke, Brooks, Mepham etc who were all failures. 

Maybe hes happy to take on a job where he'll have bugger all to spend. Cant see it myself and I think Ralphs here for the forseeable

His record of signings is mixed like every other club, some flops but he also signed players in League one that went on to do a job in the Prem, plus the likes of Ake, Wilson, Mings, Fraser who were a success. Even with money there is only a certain type of player who Bournemouth can attract so anyone managing them would have a mixed record.

We would be nuts to sack Ralph at the moment anyway, when you look at the fixtures we’ve had we’re not underperforming at all.

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HarvSFC

HarvSFC

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The main question marks over Hassenhutl's management are his defensive organisation, which he isn't doing too badly with this season and his tactical inflexibility regarding the 4-2-2-2 formation. With that in mind, we haven't had a genuine relegation scare since Gabbiadini saved us against Swansea, which was pre-Hassenhutl.

Now, if you think back to Howe's management of Bournemouth, he couldn't get his defence to work and he was called naive/stubborn plenty of times throughout his Premier League tenure, because his Bournemouth side attacked every week, which left them exposed on numerous occasions and ultimately relegated.

So, we'd be replacing a manager with a similar skillset and a relegation on their record. Nothing that I've seen based on performances of the players this season makes me think that we need a managerial change. We've played 8 games with 5 of those coming against the league's current top 8. 6 in the top 10. It's been a difficult start, but we're four points above Burnley in 17th. We experienced far worse under Pellegrino and Hughes, where it was clear throughout that we were being outclassed every week.

Additionally, many put yesterday's victory down to playing a depleted Leeds side due to injuries. But, they won't put our defeats at the back end of last season down to missing the likes of Ings, Vestergaard, Romeu and Bertrand for large spells and having a bench consisting of Ramsay, Ferry, Jankewitz, Obafemi and N'Lundulu each week, who all are nowhere near Premier League football in just a matter of months.

Howe reportedly turned us down in 2010, and if the stories are true, as he's apparently turning down Newcastle and Celtic as well these days, then I hope that he does it again, as we're a bit too close to blame any failings on homesickness. 

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Dellman

Dellman

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Good job the Board has more faith in Ralph than fans on this forum, perhaps it is because they understand the restraints he is working under, not a pot to piss in as the saying goes! Well done Ralph, we are getting better every match. Only one bad performance (Wolves) this season.Keep up the good work!

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Piran

Piran

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On 16/10/2021 at 12:26, Pilchards said:

I will put my head on the line here and say that Howe is replacing Ralph at the end of October.

Even if we win the next 3 games it won’t make a difference as the camp is not healthy at the moment and whoever the guys are that make those decisions are now taking action.

Why it’s not being done now I don’t know but the source who has radio links with the club said something is being planned.

 

Pilchards? Any comment on the discussion you generated? I guess we'll have to wait another week or two for the end of October, but it may be time to question the source with the radio links...

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Suhari

Suhari

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50 minutes ago, Minsk said:

Oh, yes please. That would be hilarious.

Will make all the difference to their signing of Kylian Mbappé in January.

I believe their is an interview from him somewhere, stating his admiration of Eddie.

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Minsk

Minsk

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Posted
12 minutes ago, Suhari said:

Will make all the difference to their signing of Kylian Mbappé in January.

I believe their is an interview from him somewhere, stating his admiration of Eddie.

 

11 minutes ago, stevy777_x said:

Those who know fuck all about football

 

10 minutes ago, Saint_Jonny said:

This thread is dumb. The only performance that has been gash this season so far has been the Wolves game, apart from that we are ahead of last season point for point.

All very good points. (Although I would add that we were piss poor in the 2nd half at Everton and, whilst we were terrible in front of goal, we did dominate much of the match against Wolves.)

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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2 hours ago, Minsk said:

Oh, yes please. That would be hilarious.

Just feels like an appalling appointment to me. Doesn't feel like a good fit, and could be argued that the team he took down was better than the team he will inherit. He's got history of not coping with pressure. Everything about it feels wrong. So fingers crossed it happens.

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dronskisaint

dronskisaint

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Posted
On 16/10/2021 at 12:26, Pilchards said:

I will put my head on the line here and say that Howe is replacing Ralph at the end of October.

Even if we win the next 3 games it won’t make a difference as the camp is not healthy at the moment and whoever the guys are that make those decisions are now taking action.

Why it’s not being done now I don’t know but the source who has radio links with the club said something is being planned.

 

I'm sure you're a nice chap but I hope you are headless by November!

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Minsk

Minsk

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Posted
12 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Just feels like an appalling appointment to me. Doesn't feel like a good fit, and could be argued that the team he took down was better than the team he will inherit. He's got history of not coping with pressure. Everything about it feels wrong. So fingers crossed it happens.

My sentiments exactly. He also has a great track record of spunking large sums of money on gash players.

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